Is it ok to have our sheep forage and browse in our Eucalyptus forest?

[soarwitheagles]

Hi again everyone!

Total newbie here. Never had sheep or goats ever before.

I have so many questions about feeding sheep. I am posting here in the hopes of learning more.

Presently we have 10 very pregnant American Blackbelly ewes, one American Blackbelly ram, and two young Dorper female lambs. I have planted a few acres of a seed mixture of perennial rye/crimson clover/nitro persian clover/ blando brom/white clover/antas subterranean clover/chicory/ and birdsfoot trefoil.

Planted most of this pasture mixture in November, but now, a lot of it is already over 6" high! When would be a good time to let the sheep graze these areas? Should I mow the fields a few times before allowing the sheep out to graze?

Not so sure the mixture is correct. I sure wish I had found this forum BEFORE we planted!

And I now kinda wish I had included a greater percentage of clover....

Well, here are some more of the questions racing through my mind...

What would be a good sheep pasture mix to use here in Central Valley area of California?

The back 10 acres have massive amounts of grass growing under the Eucalyptus trees. Would it be ok to permit the sheep to graze the forested areas? Side note: there are massive amounts of eucalyptus leaves, branches, etc. on the floor of the forest too. My neighbors have grazed goats under their Eucalyptus trees for years with no problems at all.

Also, there were small numbers of both large and small eucalyptus trees in the sheep pen we recently built and the sheep stripped the eucalyptus trees of the bark, ate all the leaves they could reach, and appear to be happy as ever!

But to release the sheep into the forest area would grant them access to massive amounts of eucalyptus trees, bark, branches, dead leaves, etc.

This specific forest I am speaking of has never had any livestock grazing upon it, so it is literally loaded.

I thought about letting the flock or a few sheep out for an hour at a time and see if it works...but not so sure that is a good idea!

Oh, I read somewhere that both American Blackbelly and the Dorpers not only graze, but unlike a lot of other sheep, they also browse....is it true? It would be so nice to have the forested areas all cleaned up and all for free!

Open to any and all ideas!

Thank you!

Soar

 

[soarwitheagles]

Wow,

No replies! Should I rephrase my questions or have you any other suggestions?

 

[norseofcourse]

My sheep love to browse, too - but we don't have any eucalyptus here so I don't know about it. If it's something they can eat, I think limiting their time till their systems are used to it sounds good.

 

[babsbag]

I think that Eucalyptus in a rare tree in most parts of the US. Koalas eat them but they aren't even mammals so no comparison. A quick Google says this

"The short answer is that yes, there are toxic chemicals in eucalyptus, but the animal has to eat a lot in order to experience toxicity. I’ve known a few goats who’ve spent most of their lives grazing the fallen leaves of the eucalyptus with no discernible ill-effects"

"From www.scionresearch.com (forestry research co in Rotorua):

Foliage for stock fodder
Sheep, cattle and deer readily eat the leaves of a number of eucalypt species. Eucalypts offer an advantage over willows and poplars because they are less vulnerable to seasonal moisture deficiency.
The following points have been noted in Southland:
Leaves, bark and small twigs of E. gunnii are palatable and at times they are more attractive than grass.
Any eucalypt that is palatable to rabbits, hares and possums will be readily eaten by livestock. Possums do not browse E. glaucescens or E. neglecta and sheep and cattle will rarely eat leaves of these species even if fodder is scarce.
There is considerable scope for research into the establishment of eucalypt fodder banks, particularly the identification of suitable varieties and management techniques. The ability of eucalypts to withstand periodic drought, together with their rapidity of growth, suggests that they have real potential as an option for supplementary fodder.
Note that the foliage of E. cladocalyx (Sugar Gum, yellow-orange mottled bark) is palatable but can be toxic to stock when eaten in any quantity."

I think that your idea of letting them out for a few hours at a time is a good one but it looks like it will be ok for them. But I would take any new food slow.

I have no pasture, no sheep, and no experience on planting pasture.

 

[Bossroo]

Since I have no experience with pasturing sheep in the euk trees, and since you are close enough to UCD for a phone / personal conversation ... I would cunsult with a faculty member at the Veterinary Pathology Dept. and for your pastures ( you are too heavy on the clovers, I would add endophyte free fescue and other grasses that thrive in your dry environment [ unless irrigated for summer feed]overseed with barley for spring feed should help with the feed bill too . To prevent bloat and too runny feces on your lush pastures ( feces covered behinds will result in fly strike... to acclimate the sheeps' gut flora to the lush pasture ... start by full feeding the sheep some low quality hay such as dry grass hay, then turn them out on the pasture for 15 min. for 3 days, then full feed them poor quality hay and 1/2 hour for 3 more days, then feed hay and turn out to pasture for 1 hour for 3 days then it should be safe to turn them out on pasture for 1/2 day for 3 days , Then they should be fine to pasture for a day.Quality alfalfa hay is the best feed during the HOT summers and fall when the pastures go dormant . I would consult with a faculty member in the Animal Husbandry Dept. , Sheep Dept..

 

[soarwitheagles]

I think that Eucalyptus in a rare tree in most parts of the US. Koalas eat them but they aren't even mammals so no comparison. A quick Google says this

"The short answer is that yes, there are toxic chemicals in eucalyptus, but the animal has to eat a lot in order to experience toxicity. I’ve known a few goats who’ve spent most of their lives grazing the fallen leaves of the eucalyptus with no discernible ill-effects"

"From www.scionresearch.com (forestry research co in Rotorua):

Foliage for stock fodder
Sheep, cattle and deer readily eat the leaves of a number of eucalypt species. Eucalypts offer an advantage over willows and poplars because they are less vulnerable to seasonal moisture deficiency.
The following points have been noted in Southland:
Leaves, bark and small twigs of E. gunnii are palatable and at times they are more attractive than grass.
Any eucalypt that is palatable to rabbits, hares and possums will be readily eaten by livestock. Possums do not browse E. glaucescens or E. neglecta and sheep and cattle will rarely eat leaves of these species even if fodder is scarce.
There is considerable scope for research into the establishment of eucalypt fodder banks, particularly the identification of suitable varieties and management techniques. The ability of eucalypts to withstand periodic drought, together with their rapidity of growth, suggests that they have real potential as an option for supplementary fodder.
Note that the foliage of E. cladocalyx (Sugar Gum, yellow-orange mottled bark) is palatable but can be toxic to stock when eaten in any quantity."

I think that your idea of letting them out for a few hours at a time is a good one but it looks like it will be ok for them. But I would take any new food slow.

I have no pasture, no sheep, and no experience on planting pasture.

babsbag,

Wow, I never realized just how rare these trees are in the USA. Here in California, there are massive groves of Eucalyptus trees in many different areas, so I was under the assumption they were everywhere.

I will let the sheep in the forest a little at a time. Who knows, maybe they will begin to smell real nice!

Since I have no experience with pasturing sheep in the euk trees, and since you are close enough to UCD for a phone / personal conversation ... I would cunsult with a faculty member at the Veterinary Pathology Dept. and for your pastures ( you are too heavy on the clovers, I would add endophyte free fescue and other grasses that thrive in your dry environment [ unless irrigated for summer feed]overseed with barley for spring feed should help with the feed bill too . To prevent bloat and too runny feces on your lush pastures ( feces covered behinds will result in fly strike... to acclimate the sheeps' gut flora to the lush pasture ... start by full feeding the sheep some low quality hay such as dry grass hay, then turn them out on the pasture for 15 min. for 3 days, then full feed them poor quality hay and 1/2 hour for 3 more days, then feed hay and turn out to pasture for 1 hour for 3 days then it should be safe to turn them out on pasture for 1/2 day for 3 days , Then they should be fine to pasture for a day.Quality alfalfa hay is the best feed during the HOT summers and fall when the pastures go dormant . I would consult with a faculty member in the Animal Husbandry Dept. , Sheep Dept..

Since I have no experience with pasturing sheep in the euk trees, and since you are close enough to UCD for a phone / personal conversation ... I would cunsult with a faculty member at the Veterinary Pathology Dept. and for your pastures ( you are too heavy on the clovers, I would add endophyte free fescue and other grasses that thrive in your dry environment [ unless irrigated for summer feed]overseed with barley for spring feed should help with the feed bill too . To prevent bloat and too runny feces on your lush pastures ( feces covered behinds will result in fly strike... to acclimate the sheeps' gut flora to the lush pasture ... start by full feeding the sheep some low quality hay such as dry grass hay, then turn them out on the pasture for 15 min. for 3 days, then full feed them poor quality hay and 1/2 hour for 3 more days, then feed hay and turn out to pasture for 1 hour for 3 days then it should be safe to turn them out on pasture for 1/2 day for 3 days , Then they should be fine to pasture for a day.Quality alfalfa hay is the best feed during the HOT summers and fall when the pastures go dormant . I would consult with a faculty member in the Animal Husbandry Dept. , Sheep Dept..

Bossroo,

Incredible insights and advice, and I will do exactly as you have suggested.

I am also glad you shared with me how to "introduce" our sheep to the pasture! I would have simply opened the gate and let them go! And may have also had to collect dead super bloated sheep!

BTW, the clover is still very small, very close to the ground where as the rye grass is already 6-8 inches in many areas...I read somewhere that if I let the sheep graze now, they will mostly eat the grass down and then the clover will have more light and grow more...wow, now I am not sure what to do.

I read an article from Cornell Univeristy by Ulf Kintzel where the gentleman is encouraging people to grow pasture with 50%-70% clover! So that is why I began to add more clover seed to our pasture mix. Now I am not sure what to do...anyway, here is his article:

http://smallfarms.cornell.edu/2012/04/02/the-“perfect”-sheep-pasture/

He does live on the opposite coast.

Can you help me find the website for UCD Animal Husbandry Dept. , Sheep Dept?

Thank you!

 

[Baymule]

No Eucalyptus trees here, have zero experience with them. I have what might be a silly question...... so you turn the sheep out on this lush pasture for the specified length of time and then you put them back up. You already stuffed them full with hay, then they had "dessert" and now you want them to leave the candy store and come back home. Just how do you convince them that the dry lot is soooo much better than that nasty ol' lush verdant pasture?

 

[soarwitheagles]

No Eucalyptus trees here, have zero experience with them. I have what might be a silly question...... so you turn the sheep out on this lush pasture for the specified length of time and then you put them back up. You already stuffed them full with hay, then they had "dessert" and now you want them to leave the candy store and come back home. Just how do you convince them that the dry lot is soooo much better than that nasty ol' lush verdant pasture?

Baymule,

Thanks again for your reply. I am not sure if you are asking me or someone else your question...

Remember, I have little to no experience at all raising sheep. I have done lots of reading, but compared to real sheep ranchers, I am sure I have no clue whatsoever what I am doing...

So here is my plan [not sure if it is gonna work]:

Our sheep have never eaten from our pasture yet. I am presently "training" these sheep. Here is what I am doing:

I feed them only hay for some days. Then, I prepare a very nice combo of various grains...Next, I will pick up two aluminum pans and clash them loudly together. Then I will enter the sheep pen and give them the grain.

At first, they ran very swiftly away from me each and every time. Now, after about 3 weeks of this ruse, they run swiftly toward me. In fact, I feel a little afraid entering the sheep pen because they run up to me and get real close...some even let me pet them and I hand feed as many as I can, but provide grain for all of them.

My understanding [please correct me if I am wrong], is, when I would like to bring the sheep in from the pastureland, I will have some grain ready, then, loudly bang the aluminum pans together, and walk to the pen where I normally give them the grain. I am hoping they will gladly run into the pen, see their good shepard, holding the aluminum pans full of good grain, and begin to eat the good grain as I happily lock the good sheep pen gate behind them...

Please tell this is gonna work somebody!

Soar

 

[babsbag]

Hope it works for you, I don't know sheep, but it would work for goats. If not, get a Border Collie.

 

[norseofcourse]

That sounds like a plan!

Do you generally feed them the grain about the same time of day? If so, use that, too. Say for example you feed them at 4pm, and you only want them in the pastureland for 15 minutes - then let them into the pastureland about a quarter till 4 the first day. At 4, do the grain routine. If you vary the time of day you feed the grain, this may not matter as much.

How much grain do you give them? They'll be coming in with their bellies fuller than normal with new food, so if you can decrease it while still giving them just enough to be happy to come in for grain, that might not be a bad thing.

Sheep generally learn routines quickly, especially if they involve food. Think of a backup plan just in case, and good luck!