Bottlefeeding newborn kid and other advice needed

[ldesjardin]

Hi there,
I am new to the forum and to goats in general and need some advice about bottlefeeding and caring for a newborn kid. 2 days (about 36 hours) ago, one of our does had two kids. One was strong and moving about when I got there, while the other was definitely weak and not able to get up. She was cold so I brought her home to warm her up. We got her temp up and fed her some MannaPro milk replacer. We took her back out the next day to see if she would nurse mom. Even though the mama was willing, the little one would not suck at all. She poked around a little, but very half-heartedly. Never nursed even with help. We kept her out there several hours checking on her regularly, feeding her when necessary. Never saw her feeding, even when the other kid was. We continued feeding her the milk replacer when she was hungry, hoping she would get colostrum from mom, but that never happened. If she ever nursed mom we never saw any evidence of it.

We also have a doe that lost her baby very soon after it was born (most likely because of the very cold temps), so last night we got desperate and milked her for the colostrum. Fed that to the baby last night and then again today. Probably will do it again tonight. I know it's not the same as milk from the mama but it's better than nothing, right?

We have not been in this situation before and not sure what we should be doing. The mama is now rejecting her (maybe from feeding her the other does' milk) and she seems to think I am her mama following me around.

So with all that, what do we need to do. Do you think the milk we got from the other doe will help or do we need to do something else? It has now been about 36 hours. She is much smaller than the other kid, but she seems fairly active, wagging her tail, pooping and peeing. She followed me around all morning while I was cooking (yes, in the kitchen) and kept laying down on top of my feet. I would like to put her with the herd, at least part of the time, but I am worried that she will get hurt with the other goats without a mama to protect her. I feel like she needs to be part of the herd.

On a side note, she also suffered an injury last evening when a goat in the next stall broke through a wooden divider. A piece of wood fell on her and tore her eyelid. She is okay, but now she has already had her first vet visit already, complete with stitches and antibiotic for the eye.

 

[Pioneer Chicken]

Baby needs to come inside and stay for a while. She can stay warm better that way. Get her selenium whether by BoSe through your vet or by gel (selenium/vit.E gel). Milking your other doe for milk for the kid sounds great. That's what I'm doing right now for my two bottle babies.

 

[ldesjardin]

Thank you for your reply. She is in the house right now - giving the dog fits. As for the doe we are milking, I am wondering how long the colostrum stays in the milk sack before it is absorbed. I was able to get about 8 ounces from her the first day we milked her. She was not able to nurse her babies at all or very little before she lost them, but there was more than a day that passed before we milked her.So I don't know if what we are getting is colostrum. At this point, it may not matter because it is well over the recommended 24 hours for the baby. The milk is thickish, but only slightly yellow.

I had the thought today that I wondered if she actually may have nursed from mama. She seems to be doing remarkably well for not having had any colostrum that first several hours. I was the first to feed her, so she may not have nursed from mama as long as I was standing there. But maybe she did later when I wasn't standing there?

I am very nervous and worried about this one, because we have brought 2 others home that died. One of them was doing great for a whole day before it died pretty suddenly. I am already very attached to her.

Can I get the selenium/vit.e gel at tsc or a farm supply store?

 

[Pioneer Chicken]

You know, I've wondered about that with the colostrum myself. Just four days ago was my first time milking colostrum from one of my does. Because I wanted to be sure the kids I took in got the required amount, I milked their dam at least four times throughout the day. I noticed by the end of the day, the milk/colostrum was getting pretty thin unlike with how thick it was that morning.

It might be possible she nursed. I'd recommend for future kiddings that you stay with mama and kids till they nurse. It helps when you are there to guide the kids to a teat and it will ease your nerves knowing that they got colostrum.

After you finishing feeding her, rub her tummy and underside to stimulate her. You need to make sure she is going potty. It's fine that's she's doing it herself; just make sure she keeps on doing it.

I've looked at my TSCs and local feed stores and from what I've seen, they don't carry it. I can only order it offline. I'll pm you where you can get it. Does your vet give the BoSe?

One other thing. What breed is she? You'll want to make sure that she is getting a proper balance of how much she's getting.

 

[hilarie]

Trust your instincts, desjardin. It sounds to me like you're doing everything right. No doubt she got at least *some* colostrum, either from mama #1 or mama #2, and despite her size, she's showing pluck and the will to live. Honor it, and keep her in the house for awhile (the dog will get over it, I promise). It's not unheard of at my house for a baby goat (or chicken, or turkey) to live in the kitchen for awhile while they make up some lost road. When it warms a little, she can spend a little (supervised) time with the herd, short at first and then longer.
You've sure had your share of bad luck with babies (the lost pair, then this little girl who started out behind the 8 ball). Remember the ones you bring in the house already have the short straw, so it's not real surprising when they die, although I grant you it's sad and depressing. I think you're due for a change of fortune

 

[ragdollcatlady]

Feeding colostrum from any mom is the best thing you could have done for the kid. Keep her inside, feed her 4 times a day and let her grow a bit. I would use you second does milk, milk her 2 times a day for as long as you need milk for this kid. Freeze any that is truly surplus in case you need more later. I would take the kid with you when you feed and care for the herd so she can get familiar with them. It won't be as traumatic, when she does need to hang out with them for awhile later on. She may not be able to keep herself warm enough so I wouldn't rush her out with the herd yet. Congrats on saving her!

 

[ldesjardin]

Thanks so much for your helpful replies. The little doe seems to be doing very well. She is following me everywhere, and chasing the dog, running, jumping and trying to play. My husband took her with him to spend time with the herd today since it is warm and sunny this afternoon. We will continue milking the other doe as often as possible but she seems to be drying out, last night we only got about 2 ounces from her.

We have decided to transition her to cows milk, because from what I read that seems preferred over the milk replacer.

Pioneer chicken, normally I do try to stay with them until they nurse, but it's not always possible. My husband has a day job and I have to care for my own kids. When we reintroduced her to mama, we showed her the teat and tried to get her to take it to no avail. While we were there she would go up under her mama and poke around like they do, but never really seemed that interested in sucking. She was being very stubborn, even when we put the teat in her mouth she would just do nothing with it. That's why I wonder if my presence was hindering things and maybe making the mama stressed as well. However, she would suck fine from a bottle, suck my finger, pants or whatever else should could find to 'nurse.' So all the elements were there for her to nurse - the intact instinct, a willing and available mother. Mama only rejected her after we fed her from the other doe. I think next time, I need to be a little more patient with the process and not jump to the 'obvious' conclusion.

 

[jodief100]

The cows milk will be just fine for her. Sometimes it is best to do "something" and worry if it was the right thing later. She is alive and thriving. That is what matters, not how you got there.

 

[frustratedearthmother]

Is there any chance of fostering her on to the other doe? It's not always easy - but it can be done. Whatever you do - good luck - and hope your baby stays healthy!