Calf with scours

[Angus&Andy]

I am looking for some help. I have a two week old Angus (also his name(Angus)) bottle calf that has scours. I have tried everything I can think of or have read, I am now looking for anything else that I may have missed or should try. So far I have:

1. Stopped milk replacer for 24 hours
2. Begun electrolytes fed for 24 hours
3. Treated with Duramycin 72-200 3 MG
4. Treated with Probiotics once (second tonight) 10 MG
5. Treated with Kaolin Pectin
6. Fed 1/4 milk replacement 3/4 electrolytes

That is where I am at now, still has scours that is orange (that is the closest) in color. He is a taking everything we feed him with some struggle but still has intake. I am looking for anything that may help that someone with more knowledge may have. We did have a cold snap this weekend with rain, I don't know if that had any affect but it didn't help I'm sure. Sense then they have remained in a heated stall protected from everything.

 

[Cricket]

What are you feeding him for amounts? I've had calves (but these are Jerseys) that I can only tweak at a pint a feeding for days at a time--drives you nuts! Did you look at Red Tail's protocol for treating scours? Her recommendations get my vote.

(I just looked for it and can't access that page so am reporting it)

 

[redtailgal]

Have you treated for coccidia?

My page is down for the moment. I'll be putting it back up soon, I hope.

 

[Angus&Andy]

Cricket,
We are following the amounts on the bags. Electrolytes is 3 scoops per 2 quarts of water and milk replacer is one cup (10 ounce cup provided in bag) per two quarts. We did electrolytes only for 24 hours and then tried a two quart bottle that was 3/4 electrolytes and 1/4 milk replacer, back. He was looking like he was regular before that. maybe a little loose, but not bad at all. I am worried if we don't start getting milk in him soon, he's going to take a turn. He doesn't moo, but he does get up and walks around. We keep him penned up quite a bit until today because it was cool and rainy, today is nicer so I open the pen and let him roam. He even plays a little bit. His stomach isn't bloated, he actually looks a little sunken in just behind his belly, so I know we need to get some real nutrition in him.

Redtailgal,
We have not yet treated for coccoidia (sp), I read the incubation period is three weeks, so I thought since he is only 2 weeks, that even if exposed, he couldn't have them yet. Am I wrong? I can get the meds this afternoon if he could have it already. We read your scours treatment before we got our calves, and that is mostly what we have used in treating our little guy. If you could put it back up, I would love to be able to reread it in case I forgot anything.

Thank you both for the input and great advice. Anything else you have to offer is greatly appreciated. This is our first go a raising calves and are worried to no end about this guy. I was this close (holds fingers a millimeter apart) to sleeping outside with him because I didn't want to leave him and find he had taken a turn.

Tara

P.S. This is an account my husband set up and he posted the first post, but I'm sure it will usually be me on here. We read so much useful info on here, we knew we had to join.

 

[redtailgal]

I am still having trouble with getting my pages to show in the correct form for other browsers.

Heres is the info on the page:

Scours in a calf
Scours can and will kill a calf, and will do it quickly. Be alert for scours, and be prepared to react quickly.
Signs to watch for:
dirty rear end, tails, hooves, bedding, etc.
puddles of poop
excessive gas
fatigue
lack of appetite
swollen belly
treating scours:
YOU MUST USE ELCTROLYTES. WATER ALONE WILL NOT SAVE A SCOURING CALF.
First notice the bowel movement. Is it very thin and watery? what color is it?
What sort of odor does it have?
A dietary scour can be green from having too much pasture time on new or wet grass. This scour may have a slight odor. Yellow or white scours often are the result of getting too much milk, or being introduced to milk too quickly. The white or yellow scours may have a sour milk smell to them.
A black or brown scour can be due to worms, coccidia, poisoning and a wide array of other things. An immediate fecal check is in order if the bowel movement is overly foul smelling, bloody, has visible worms or undigested grass.
There are many types of scours treatments available. I dont tend to use them unless it is absolutely needed. If needed, I will used a product called "Scourstop" or just plain pepto (bovine formula from the farm store) and electrolytes. I will not use any type of treatment other than a Sulfa tablet and electrolytes until I am certain of the reason for scouring.
I will use a Sulfa tablet, twice a day for 7 days in most cases. You can find these at your local farm store, and use the package for guidance on dosages.
For electrolytes, you can use a powderded electrolyte replacer, or a gelling electrolyte, both from your local farm store. You can also use pedialyte (the kind for humans) as an electrolyte replacer.
So how do I use all this stuff?
At the first sign of Diarrhea, stop feeding milk completely. Follow this schedule:
day 1: all bottles with electrolytes for 24 hours. offer 1 quart of pedialyte in the am, at noon, and in the pm.
day 2: make your normal mix of powered milk. Use only half of what you would normaly feed in one ration, and add an equal part of electrolytes (for example, if you normaly feed a 2 quart bottle, mix 1 quart of your milk with 1 quart of electrolytes).
continue with this mixture until poops are "puddiny" (literally looks like pudding).
After poops are puddiny ....give one quart of full milk (no electolytes) in the am and in the pm.
If the poops are still good, bump the feedings up to a quart and a half in the am and pm.
Then go on up to two full quarts in the am and pm.
If at anytime the poops return, go back to day one or two , depending on the severity of the situation.
Take your time in building them back up to full ration, if the calf is very poor or the bowels very loose, I will often take two days for each step.
Use the sulfa for the full recommended time, even if the symtoms are gone.
Keep the scouring calf off of the grass if possible. Once everything is back to normal, reintroduce them to grass a little at a time.
Let the poop on their rear dry and then brush it off. Dont get it wet......you will be in a really gross and ooey gooey stinky mess. Do watch that your calf doesnt end up with poop drying and "sealing off" their butthole, making it impossible for them to poop.
Keep the calf warm, dry and calm.

 

[redtailgal]

and basic info of bottle raising:

Bottle Calf
What to feed:
You will want to use a CALF milk replacer, not kid or lamb or even multi-species, spend the money and get the Calf replacer. I also HIGHLY recommend staying away from any type of Soy product. EVERY SINGLE CALF I have seen on soy based milk end up with scours, and scours BAD. Look for real milk protein, not soy protein. I will only cost you a couple dollars more, but save you quite a bit in trouble and medication costs.
You will need a bottle. I sugggest a 2 quart bottle with a snap on nipple. You can get the screw on nipples, but these will collapse easily, leading to a frustrated calf, sucking air and possibly ending up with bloat. (Bloat=BAD BAD BAD)
Newborn (never been on mother):
If you calf has not had the chance to nurse the mother, you need to get some colostrum ASAP. Get fresh, real colostrum if possible. If you cant get the fresh, then try for frozen. I like to offer a quart every 4 hours for the first day. If all else fails or if you are short on time, get the powdered colostrum and follow the directions on the pack. You NEED to get them this colostrum, so its a good idea to keep some frozen or powdered colostrum on hand, if you have a pregnant cow.
To start a newborn after it has recieved colostrum:
day 1: use the powdered milk at only half strength.(if you "recipe" calls for 1/2 cup of powder for 1 quart water, then you will use 1/4 cup powder and the full one quart of water. Feed one quart of HALF STRENGTH milk, in the am, and again in the PM. I usually offer a water bottle at noon.
Day 2: use milk at half strength. offer 1 quart at am, noon, and pm.
Day 3: use full strength milk. offer 1 quart at am, water bottle at noon, and 1 quart full strength milk at pm (you will use full strength milk from here on out, unless there is runny poop)
Day 4:Offer 1 and 1/2 quarts at the am feeding and 1 quart in the pm
Day 5: offer 1 1/2 quarts at the am and pm feeding
Day 6: same as day 5
Day 7: offer 2 quarts in the am and 1 1/2 in the pm
day 8: same as day 7
day 9: offer 2 quarts in the am and in the pm
day 10: same as day 9
Day 11: continue with 2 quart bottles in the am and pm, start offering calf starter grain (just leave it out for them) and a little hay. You can also put them out a small bucket of water to play in. Your calf may only play with it for now, that is ok. In a week or two, if the poops still look good, start giving more time on pasture. If its spring time, be very careful about pasture. A couple hours of pasture time is enough at first, and it's better to have afternoon turn out than early am turnout. Slowly build them up to being out all day (add an hour as day)
I like to start them on a bucket as soon as possible (I usually do it at day 14). Getting your calf to drink out of a bucket teaches them that a bucket has FOOD and thus, they will begin to eat grain sooner and grower better (plus its sooooo much easier on YOU!). Its easy to train them to a bucket. Pour the milk into the bucket, and let the calf suck your fingers. While the calf is sucking your fingers, drop your hand into the bucket, submerging it into the milk. As it sucks your fingers, the calf will accidently draw some milk into its mouth, and should start drinking readily. If the calf doesnt suck your fingers, try floating the nipple in the bucket.
Older calves:
To make the switch from one replacer to another, mix the two types equally for a day, then 3/4 new mix 1/4 old mix for a day , then go to the full strength of new mix. This method would include taking an older calf off the mother. If you cannot milk the mother and get raw cow's milk, you can buy some regular (not the lowfat) milk at the grocery store to serve as the "old mix".
If you cannot use any of the old mix to switch them over, use the same method as for the newborns (above)
Older calves are harder. Many of them will not want to take the nipple. If they refuse the nipple, I will offer them a bucket first, and if that doesnt work, I will resort to more drastic measures. Position the calf so its rear end is in a corner, and then straddle it, with its ribs between your knees. Now, be prepared, because any healthy calf worth its salt is going to fight you.
Now, once you straddling the cornered calf, and the calf has realized that he is too little to be a rodeo bull, get the bottle and stuff the nipple in its mouth. Hold its little head up, rub the throat, stick your finger in the corner of its mouth and tickle it a little. If after about 5 minutes, the calf doesnt drink, just walk away and leave it alone for about 6 hours. (provided that this is a healthy calf). In six hours, repeat. If the calf still doesnt eat for you, you will need to call for some reinforcements.
Once your calf is drinking the milk:
Be firm! Do not tolerate head butting. Yes, its cute now. But, trust me, 1100 pounds from now, it will not be cute nor will it be easy to stop. If your calf is drinking the bottle or the bucket and headbutts......take the milk away for a few minutes. They will be frustrated at first, but will quickly learn that this instinct must be controled or the food goes away.
Put the halter on your calf as soon as you can. Choose a place to feed your calf, and halter and lead them to this place for each feeding. Let your calf drag a lead rope for a day or two, the stepping on it will help them learn to "give" to pressure.
Mother cows will kick a misbehaving calf. I dont like to kick, but then again I am not a cow. I will however, give a swift and prompt thump on the backside of any calf that moves to kick me. Teach manners now
If you intend to milk your calf, handle her udder area each time you feed her, and do it from day one. Dont wait until she is full grown and already calved to reach down there and yank on her nipples. How would YOU feel about that?
ALWAYS react promptly to any loose bowel movements. Read the page on SCOURS for more information.

 

[Angus&Andy]

Thanks redtailgal. He has white/yellow scours. I will get some sulfa tabs today. I will definitely start back on milk at half strength too. Some nutrient is better than none. I am printing your post so I have it handy. I hope you don't mind. You are a wealth of information. Thanks again. I'll let you know how he's doing as soon as there is any change.

 

[redtailgal]

by all means print it out, I'm glad it's helping you.

 

[california cowgirl]

For sure stay away from the SOY!!! I learned the hard way. Dead babies with bloat and diareah. So sad hope you save the little fella.