I shouldn't have done this but I didn't know

[OHMYKIDS]

I've been trying to break my goats from being spoiled with pure alfalfa. Now I'm giving them grass/alfalfa hay. They normally don't like it so the buck yells (BAAAAs really loud) because he wants pure alfalfa. Well, today I decided I was going to win. Well, at one time today, I hear him BAAAA really loud. I go out there to tell him no and he's got his legs in the air and rolling. I thought something was wrong, so I run up to see what happened. I'm about 5 feet from him and he gets up like nothing. I got so mad for him freaking me out, I scolded him (yes like a child) Well, doing some research, I guess they are not suppose to be on their backs and he was probably yelling for help. He is my fattest goat, major hay belly going on. So I really feel bad for scolding him. Gotta give him lots of hugs tomorrow, even though he'll stink me up.

 

[lilhill]

Those stinkers always keep us on our toes. And some are real drama queens/kings. But one thing is certain, when you hear them yell, it's always good to see what's going on just in case they aren't crying wolf.

 

[kimmyh]

They look silly when they are on their backs, and it can lead to bloat and death in a pretty short time. The scary one are the ones who never call for help, they just lay there. Glad your boy is alright. Why are you determined to get them on mixed hay?

 

[OHMYKIDS]

They look silly when they are on their backs, and it can lead to bloat and death in a pretty short time. The scary one are the ones who never call for help, they just lay there. Glad your boy is alright. Why are you determined to get them on mixed hay?

Don't want to have them on pure alfalfa, heard bad stuff about that and they also don't fill up on it. They eat all the flowers and then cry for more. The mixed hay, they search for the alfalfa, eat it then fill up on the rest and they are not hungry.

 

[kimmyh]

Ahh, the fussy goat syndrome. Mine do that as well, so I turn the hay, and leave it for a day, then throw out the stems.

 

[mully]

Mine drove me so crazy the other day I was thinking about having that BAAAAAAAAA removed by the vet. I have one that is a real screamer and most of the time it is because i did not come to play with her. I think they stay babies from the day they are born. I tell them that their cuteness saves their life. More food please!!!!

 

[Griffin's Ark]

They look silly when they are on their backs, and it can lead to bloat and death in a pretty short time. The scary one are the ones who never call for help, they just lay there. Glad your boy is alright. Why are you determined to get them on mixed hay?

Pure alfalfa is not good for bucks since it is high in calcium and can lead to urinary calculi. It is ok for does, but they need other things to keep going. We feed our milkers alf. cubes as a treat and it seems to help out with milk production. Bucks being grained can lead to UC also, but if given alfalfa along with the grain it is said that you lower the chance of UC.

Chris

 

[kimmyh]

Straight alfalfa if you are feeding grain is the best way to keep bucks free of UC. I have tried the other hays, and I have researched, and talked to one of the best ruminant vets in the USA, the bottom line, is alfalfa is the ONLY hay I would ever feed to a buck who is getting grain. If he is not getting grain, it still has the most nutrition for the dollar of all of the hays. UC is caused by having the cal to phos out of balance, and alfalfa is the best source of cal, while grain is generally the highest feed that has phos.

 

[OHMYKIDS]

They are not getting any grain and I think finally they broke the habit of the alfalfa. Saw them munching on grass hay today. I guess when there is nothing else, they have to eat

 

[cmjust0]

Pure alfalfa is not good for bucks since it is high in calcium and can lead to urinary calculi. It is ok for does, but they need other things to keep going. We feed our milkers alf. cubes as a treat and it seems to help out with milk production.

The stones of urinary calculi are most often struvites, or "MAP" stones -- magnesium ammonium phosphate.

I'm not entirely sure how this all works as I'm not an animal nutritionist, but I've read time and again that in order for phosphorus to be pulled from the diet into the bloodstream, it must be accompanied by an equal amount of calcium.. If there isn't enough calcium in the diet, then A) the body will pull some calcium from the bones in order to absorb phosphorus and B) some phosphorus will be eliminated through the urine instead of being absorbed.

Unfortunately, what happens sometimes is that the levels of phosphorus become high enough in the urine that it crystalizes and, tada...urinary calculi.

I know it seems odd because of the name, but calcium really does help prevent calculi.. Personally, instead of calling it "urinary calculi," I think they (whoever they are) would have done the goat community a HUGE service by having called it something like "obstructive crystalline hyperphosphaturia" -- which is really what it is.

Anyway...that's why almost any feed labelled for goats contains a 2:1, Calciumhosphorus ratio, just to be sure that as much phosphorus as possible is being absorbed into the bloodstream instead of being eliminated through the urine.

Bucks being grained can lead to UC also, but if given alfalfa along with the grain it is said that you lower the chance of UC.
Chris

Yep...because the extra calcium helps offset the high phosphate content of most grains.

There's also some speculation that the action of chewing and digesting long fibers reduced the amount of phosphorus in the body through saliva, but don't hold me to that.