Research Part Two -- the hay questions

[CESpeed]

I live in Central Arkansas. I think for my farm I'd like to have two acres to produce hay (what kind is yet another question - I've read that Orchardgrass or Ryegrass with Oats would be good) and three to four acres to pasture my cattle and pigs on.

I was told that hay can be kept for a long time and only loses 1-2% of nutritin per year.

Is this a good idea? Also how much hay per acre can I expect to get per cut?

Million $$$ question can cows and pigs be pastured together? I'm also thinking about having a donkey as an LSG.

All thoughts and information are greatly appreciated.

 

[Ms. Research]

Good Luck with your Research from a Fellow Researcher. Got that Nerd on a Mission cap on?

Regarding your questions, the only one I can give an opinion on is that I really don't think it wise to have pigs and cows in the same pasture. Pigs need a place all to their own. Regarding the Donkey, I think they are great to train for a LGD. Maybe for the cattle, but the pigs?

And also my vote for the orchardgrass only because bunnies love to eat it.

Good Luck and have fun figuring out what you want. Hopefully the REAL farmers will give their experienced opinions to help in your research.

 

[Bossroo]

Keeping pigs with cattle together will soon result in a moon crater landscape. Not very conducing to a productive pasture. Orchard grass grows in clumps, therefore one will find it is hard on one's ankles when one walks the land, also lower tonage yields. Depending on growing conditions where one lives , timothy for a grass hay or alfalfa would be my best choices. For best hay crop tonnage yield, nutrition, and palatability of hay using cerial grains... plant wheat, oats, and barley together. Cut the crop at daugh stage. Horses and cattle really LOVE the hay.

 

[WildRoseBeef]

I live in Central Arkansas. I think for my farm I'd like to have two acres to produce hay (what kind is yet another question - I've read that Orchardgrass or Ryegrass with Oats would be good) and three to four acres to pasture my cattle and pigs on.

You will have to do some researching of your own on what hay grasses and legumes are best grown for your area. Each area and each member on here have different likes and dislikes for what they like to use for hay. For my area, we like using timothy, smooth brome grass and alfalfa as a good grass-legume hay. I don't care for orchardgrass because of the short lifespan and the fact you have to reseed every few years. It's fine for pasture as long as you know when the right time to graze it and how.

I was told that hay can be kept for a long time and only loses 1-2% of nutrition per year.

My question is what form was the hay in that the person had who told you this? Small square, large round, large square? I could see the above applying to small squares because they're kept under the shed all the time or are covered. The nutritional losses would be more significant if those same bales were either not covered or, in the case of large round bales that hardly ever get covered, not stacked properly. With large round bales, you will get higher nutritional losses stacking them in a pyramid shape than you would stacking them in a mushroom shape.

Is this a good idea? Also how much hay per acre can I expect to get per cut?

You will need hay regardless if you're buying or making your own. I can't tell you how much per acre as that depends on the soil, forage biomass, moisture levels and when you cut.

Million $$$ question can cows and pigs be pastured together? I'm also thinking about having a donkey as an LSG.

Absolutely not! As a coupe others mentioned, you'll be in for a massive train-wreck and no pasture if you pasture your hogs and cattle together. Hogs love to dig, not graze, so you need to give them an area to dig for tubers and such and leave the pasture for your cattle only. A donkey may be okay as a livestock guard, but if your cattle are great mothers like RP's typically are, then they're most likely going to be able to defend themselves quite well even without an LSG. Cows that are selected for having good mothering ability will not hesitate to defend themselves or their calves from predators. Aside from the aggressive cows part of the article, read the part in this article about what Wayne Ray's cows did when they encountered a hungry black bear. You'll see that Ray didn't need an LSG to look after his cows and calves.

All thoughts and information are greatly appreciated.

Remember that too much moisture can also degrade hay quality. Hay left out in the swaths for too long or that get rained on soon after getting cut also loose nutrient quality.

 

[greybeard]

I've always had a health related concern when it comes to raising swine and cattle in close proximity, but evidently, that cocern is ill founded. Cattle are fairly instinctive animals. Ever notice a pasture where there a re lots of little green mounds of grass that are untouched while the rest of the grass is eaten down? That's where a cow has 'poohed' and fertilized the grass. Cows won't touch that grass under most circumstances for quite awhile. I don't know the scientific explanation for it, but I much suspect it's their own instinctive way of not contracting parasites feces that are borne. Pigs OTOH, won't bat an eye at rooting around in a cow patty--tho they do seem to stay away from their own dung. The pigs really like fresh cow dung--(nasty sounding ain't it?), but that ends the parasite chain for cattle and some ranchers in Texas have found they no longer have to even worm their cattle when running hogs in the same pasture.

As far as pasture destruction, nose rings are the answer. Some may find it somewhat cruel, but that is what is reccommended. 2 rings per nose if you use the regular nose rings or just one ring if you use the pointed ones. I'm new here and not sure if I am allowed to link to outside sources but i can provide a link to an article from The Stockman grass Farmer if you need it.