Hi from Central Texas with Dexters! (and still getting my setup in place)

thatannagirl

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Hi, my name is Anna. I'm in Central Texas, and am really just getting started with livestock.

When I was in East Texas, I tried my hand at goats - and will not be revisiting that experience, lol! Also Chickens, which were fine and I intend to revisit that - though it didn't work out at the time for reasons I completely understand.

Right now I have roughly 30 acres and 3 (unregistered but full bred) red Dexter females - a cow and her calf, and a heifer around 2 years old. Their names are Mama, Baby, and Auntie... or just "The Ladies" or "Hay Ladies!" which is how I call to them when I want to let them I'm heading out to see them. I picked up the two adults last May, and haven't mowed my front or back yard since! No more traveler-sticker-burrs, because they love to eat the cow parsley my husband thought was "pretty white flowers to keep around because surely the wife likes it!" and that our dogs (with long hair, not fur - 2 Old English Sheepdogs and 1 ShihTzu) loved to roll in. I guess it smells roll-able to them.

When we got them, mama was pregnant, and they were both quite stand-off-ish. But judicious use of cattle cubes, some uncomfortable halter-training, and a lot of brushing later - they're almost bothersome wanting pets and attention anytime I'm in the yard. (Except the baby - I'm just getting started on forcing her to become accustomed to my proximity and learn to enjoy my presence.) They've gotten used to the dogs, and there's an acquaintance-type relationship where the dogs see them as possible playmates, and the cows want to mostly be left alone, but don't see the dogs as threats. If the mama (the only one with horns) goes to chase off a dog, and 'catches' it, she doesn't touch it, just huffs and walks away, like she's telling the dog: "You're annoying, and I'm not happy with your proximity, but not really willing to do anything impactful about it."

Keeping the dogs - mostly the OESes - in the same space as the cattle is intentional as a deterrent to coyotes, since the Dexter breed is small and there are only 3 of them. (2 large dogs is a threat to coyotes, 1 is a temptation.) We've had the dog breed for years. They're great as a breed that is defensive without being aggressive. Their presence even before the cattle was partly intentional to keep coyotes at a distance since we had/have young children.

I intend to work my way toward a low-maintenance quasi-homesteading setup, paired with some productivity required for the farm registration and agricultural tax impacts. I don't think that a fully-self-sufficient-homestead and all the work that comes with it is something that we will find satisfying. We want a measure of independence, the prospect of being able to transition to self-sufficiency if things go sideways, but mostly the satisfaction of working together on projects and enjoying the rewards of our labors.
Perhaps we will eventually get to a point where things bring in more money than they cost, but fully fencing the property and getting started with everything is a large expense of time and money, and having only 2 adults (each working 40+ hrs/week at a desk job) and elementary-aged kids means that projects are usually relegated to weekends, take longer, and frequently get put off.
For right now our fenced areas are: front yard (.75 acres), back yard (1 acre), side yard (.75 acres), and a small barn-yard space in front of a small barn. I frequently will put the mama cow on a long rope attached to her collar with a ground-stake and a water tough at the end of her reach to keep her in an area outside the fences. Baby and Auntie won't wander far from her, so it's as good as keeping them all fenced. And they can eat down other parts of the property.

As far as the herd goes, we will likely transition to registered Dexters to improve profitability (or just reduce losses). And we'll need more of them. But only at a good price, you know? With our existing little herd, our kids have declared these specific ones are off-limits for the market (sigh), but we may look at cross-breeding to improve the value of calves/offspring that WILL go to market - mostly. They aren't registered, so there's not really a point in ensuring they're bred back to a registered Dexter as far as I can tell. But when it's time to stock our freezer, why wouldn't I want a Dexter/Wagyu cross for the price of renting a Wagyu bull for a little bit? I may also include a Jersey or other dairy-specific breed in the mix just to help ensure milk availability in the event one of the cows isn't a great mama. Plus, Jersey/Dexter crosses are called Belfairs, and have their own niche.

Some of the more humorous lessons I've learned since getting the cattle are:
1) You can't keep the cardboard boxes you intend to burn in the burn pit anymore while waiting for a good day to burn them. The cows apparently love to eat the cardboard, choosing it over standing grass. And as awful as them eating cardboard is, they won't even eat it all - they'll leave their leftovers strewn across your yard and trampled into the grass.
2) When you start keeping your boxes (waiting to be burned) on your porch or deck, you need to immediately have a gate in place to prevent the cows from getting up on the deck or porch to get to the boxes. Cleaning up your deck or porch from muddy, trampled, shredded cardboard covered in 'fertilizer' is not something to be looked forward to. And not something you want any visitors or guests to witness. Not even delivery drivers.
The sound of hooves on the porch will quickly become a trigger when settling in for the night. As good as a doorbell. Get ready to run out to chase a cow off the porch while dressed in a towel.
3) When eating cardboard waiting to be disposed of, they may encounter the other packaging - styrofoam, plastic bags, etc. Congratulations, now they'll want to eat that too, and they'll seek it out. They'll associate it with the cardboard.
4) If the cows learn that 'cardboard candy' is a thing - they'll look for it anywhere they can get it, like cardboard (or plastic bags) that blows into your yard during wind storms, and their specialty: delivery boxes and boxes staged on the porch to be moved into the garage or delivered to donation, etc. The contents will be ignored, walked on, or scattered about the yard while the box is ripped apart.
5)Now that the cows know the porch is a place that 'candy' will be found, they WILL check out those galvanized trashcans on your porch that house the cattle cubes. Things have just gotten a lot more real. You will never be left alone if they see you on your porch (in proximity to the cattle-cube-containers). Make sure those lids are on all the way.

To summarize, learn from me, and start by ensuring any backyard cattle can't get on your porch from the very beginning. And immediately keep cardboard inaccessible. If you have dogs/dog doors, make sure your cow-blocking porch-gates don't limit your dogs. Luckily, calves will quickly be larger than your dogs, and then unable to get through your dog-sized gate-holes, so you'll only have to chase them off your porch a few times. Hopefully not at all if the grown cows never teach the calves that treats can be found there.
 
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Baymule

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Welcome to the forum from East Texas. I’m in Trinity county between Crockett and Lufkin. I raise Katahdin hair sheep.

Getting good fence up is a hard job. I have 2 fields fenced in sheep and goat wire, next is the back field. I bought part of a rundown cattle ranch, the fences are practically nonexistent and grown up in years worth of trees, yaupon and green briars. I just started clearing the back fence. It’s horrible.

Best advice I can give you is to buy a little each month. When you get enough to put up a span of fence, make it the weekend project for several weeks.

Is your property surveyed corner to corner or staked between the corners?
 

Mini Horses

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tried my hand at goats - and will not be revisiting that experience, lol!
Really ? :lol: :lol: :thimagine that!!
I own 40+. Understand it well. :old:hugs
Perhaps we will eventually get to a point where things bring in more money than they cost, but
o_O:he:th:hit:duc:lol::lol::lol: dream on.
Maybe offset some costs...freezer fill...just fun.

Dexters are dual. Not as much milk as straight dairy but, how much do you want for home use? Yeah I want Jersey milk but, goat milk was my result. 😁

Welcome to the group.
 

Ridgetop

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Welcome to BYH. Livestock is a lot of fun and craziness. You have elementary school age chidren which will be a big help in your farming endeavors. (Unpaid ranch farmhands) :gigKids and animals will keep you young or at least so busy laughing that you won't notice the time go by! If there is a 4-H club in your area, join it - the kids will get a lot out of it.

Perhaps we will eventually get to a point where things bring in more money than they cost,
:gig:gig:gig:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::gig:gig:gig:lol::lol::lol:💰💰💰💰😦:hit:hit
Been raising livestock for years. The only thng we made money on was raising our rabbits. Between breeding stock and meat they paid the feed bill for the rest. Until alfalfa (so CA) got too high and the 4 kids stole DH's barn for their dairy goat and sheep flocks. But we had the best time raising our kids with the livestock! :love Just enjoy it!

fully fencing the property and getting started with everything is a large expense of time and money,
Fencing is a major cost. we ended up fencing 15 acres with 6' fencing (for the Anatolians that guard the sheep) and kept the rest for hay production. Equipment will suck the 💰money out in truckloads so look for used if possible. Luckily we brought 40+ years worth of equipment with us from California when we relocated to northeast Texas.. Non-livestock people suggested we leave it behind and just "buy new". :thWe made at least a dozen trips over the couple years we owned ur place to get it all out here before having the sheep flock and horses shipped out. Even with the gas and time, we still saved money on having to replace all our equipment, corrals, and portable pens.

As far as the herd goes, we will likely transition to registered Dexters to improve profitability
Registered is not necessarily as profitable as you might thnk. Most good registered prices go to known breeders.
I may also include a Jersey or other dairy-specific breed in the mix just to help ensure milk availability in the event one of the cows isn't a great mama. Plus, Jersey/Dexter crosses are called Belfairs, and have their own niche.
Breeding to a good Jersey is a great idea for sales and meat. @farmerjan says that Jersey beef is excellent. She and her son raise beef cattle but she keeps a Jersey as a nurse cow. It can raise a couple calves at a time. Unless you own several freezers a Dexter/Jersey cross will give you plenty of meat for your family.

You are right about the whole homesteading thing. It is a LOT of work, and who really wants to be without electricity, a dishwasher, or washing machine? Even raising a good garden is a lot of work, and then you have to can everything of feel guilty about waste.

One thing, since you have kids, put in a small group of fruit trees NOW. They will be worth it as the kids grow up.

ENJOY LIFE AS A BYHer!
 

thatannagirl

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Welcome to the forum from East Texas. I’m in Trinity county between Crockett and Lufkin. I raise Katahdin hair sheep.

Getting good fence up is a hard job. I have 2 fields fenced in sheep and goat wire, next is the back field. I bought part of a rundown cattle ranch, the fences are practically nonexistent and grown up in years worth of trees, yaupon and green briars. I just started clearing the back fence. It’s horrible.

Best advice I can give you is to buy a little each month. When you get enough to put up a span of fence, make it the weekend project for several weeks.

Is your property surveyed corner to corner or staked between the corners?
corner to corner, mostly. There's this wash type area on one part where there's the ghost of an old barbed wire fence in places... which is great because otherwise being able to tell where the line is by looking from corner to corner would be impossible.
 

thatannagirl

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You have elementary school age chidren which will be a big help in your farming endeavors. (Unpaid ranch farmhands) :gigKids and animals will keep you young or at least so busy laughing that you won't notice the time go by! If there is a 4-H club in your area, join it - the kids will get a lot out of it.
YES! I mean, we actually intend to pay them... because apparently Roth IRAs are age-agnostic. Any kid can have one. But only with actually earned income doing work you would pay someone to do. And if they don't earn enough to have to pay taxes, then it's all going in as post-tax, and will be tax-free retirement income that has grown for forever. It's usable for them for things like college and first house and such.
So the plan is to "pay them", dump all their wages into the Roth IRA, and then give them an allowance. Their first job has been collecting cow-pies and putting them in the raised bed gardens. Then I'm getting them gloves and they're pulling all the deadly nightshade before it fruits.
There are friends in the area that do 4H. They've shown us their set-ups for turkeys, rabbits, and couple sheep and goats. Looks good. I was just wondering last night if the money from selling their animals counts as earned wages that can get dropped in the retirement account for them. research time.
Fencing is a major cost. we ended up fencing 15 acres with 6' fencing (for the Anatolians that guard the sheep) and kept the rest for hay production. Equipment will suck the 💰money out in truckloads so look for used if possible. Luckily we brought 40+ years worth of equipment with us from California when we relocated to northeast Texas.. Non-livestock people suggested we leave it behind and just "buy new".
oh absolutely used all the way. We lurk on equipment auction sites and browse through facebook marketplace. It's not usually difficult to see which things are rust-buckets poorly covered in new paint vs something honestly used and still usable.
Registered is not necessarily as profitable as you might thnk. Most good registered prices go to known breeders.

Breeding to a good Jersey is a great idea for sales and meat. @farmerjan says that Jersey beef is excellent. She and her son raise beef cattle but she keeps a Jersey as a nurse cow. It can raise a couple calves at a time. Unless you own several freezers a Dexter/Jersey cross will give you plenty of meat for your family.
Great to know that Jersey meat is excellent.

One thing, since you have kids, put in a small group of fruit trees NOW. They will be worth it as the kids grow up.

ENJOY LIFE AS A BYHer!
Yes! we love fruit trees and want some. We have some surviving peach trees we put in ourselves. Haven't really gotten good fruit off them yet. And we have to get some protective fencing around them so the cows don't go to town. But our attempt at putting in the citrus trees was poorly timed before the heavy late freeze of '22 and us all going down for a week or so with the 'rona and not really able to do anything to protect them.
back in a treed area on our property, if you brave the poison ivy, we found some previously planted peach trees. Thanks for reminding me about fruit trees because I think I need a haz-mat suit (I'm just crazy allergic to poison ivy) and some loppers and get all up in that to make sure they have good sunlight - before the wasps get their nests well established in anything I might be messing with.
We're also super lucky to have some well established squirrel populations in our lovely mature pecan trees. (J/K, I'm going to war this year and learning to cook squirrel. I hear it's delicious.)
 

thatannagirl

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Really ? :lol: :lol: :thimagine that!!
I own 40+. Understand it well. :old:hugs
OMG, from sudden onset illness to eating the siding on my house to having to wrestle the really big guy (200+ lbs) who kept taking down the fencing... and decided he hated me enough to ignore the whip I brought with me when I had to fix the fences... and I was pregnant at the time... my god. nothing like facing down a goat who weighs more than you, while you're pregnant (early days, but still), and has decided getting to you is worth getting hit with a serpentine belt.
We had goat BBQ shortly thereafter. My father in law suggested that BBQ sauce would cover the eau-d'goat. He was mistaken. There was much experimenting. I strongly recommend a garlic-wine-brine for intact-male-goat meat. It really takes the BO out of things and tenderizes everything. Basically, just a brine (floats an egg) but with wine instead of water (we used box wine) and add a healthy amount of minced garlic. A couple/few days soaking in the fridge, and it's a very neutral meat.
o_O:he:th:hit:duc:lol::lol::lol: dream on.
Maybe offset some costs...freezer fill...just fun.
yes, I have decided that the reduction in property taxes counts as income - it's not girl math, it's 'farmer math'!
Dexters are dual. Not as much milk as straight dairy but, how much do you want for home use? Yeah I want Jersey milk but, goat milk was my result. 😁

Welcome to the group.
Yes, I'm not sure I want to dedicate time every morning to milking. But, you know, if dairy is the next egg-pocalypse or something, knowing it's a possibility and accessible is peace of mind. And seriously, the cost of a pound of butter right now almost has it there.
I have read they're actually tri-purpose - totally trainable and usable as oxen... but then also that training a bovine to be an ox takes like 4 years... so I'll keep that bit of trivia in my back pocket as a strictly interesting piece of knowledge that I likely do absolutely nothing with.

Thanks for having me! I'm glad I've found the group. It seems lovely!
 

SageHill

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Welcome to BYH from So Cal. Just sheep, a handful of chickens and dogs here. I raise the sheep for freezers and auction. Dorper and dorper crosses (nothing registered). Originally I was teaching herding lessons here (have been doing that since the early 90s at another facility). My dogs and I take the sheep out grazing when it's green and cool. When it gets too warm rattlesnakes are a problem.
You've got OES! They are not guardian dogs, but rather herding (though a lot of the herding has been bred out of them because of the show ring). While they are a deterrent to the coyotes their natural abilities more than likely won't take a coyote down and out.
Sounds like you're on your way to a lot of fun. We're a great group here lots of knowledge and fun in our group!
 

Ridgetop

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I was just wondering last night if the money from selling their animals counts as earned wages that can get dropped in the retirement account for them.
They need to keep records. Your 4-H friends can show you how to do it. Cost of project animal + feed + any incidental expenses (vet, minerals, entry fees equpment, etc.) are deducted from amount realized by sale. HOWEVER, if your fair has "add ons" at the auction sale, and the Junior Auction is run through a 501C3 (usually the Junior Auction Booster Club) you can add a specifc amount on to your child's sale price. It is deductible for you as a donation, and the child can claim it as earned income for the retirement account. They may have to file a tax return but shouldn't have to pay any taxes due to amount being under taxable minimum.
We have some surviving peach trees we put in ourselves. Haven't really gotten good fruit off them yet. And we have to get some protective fencing around them so the cows don't go to town. But our attempt at putting in the citrus trees was poorly timed before the heavy late freeze of '22 and us all going down for a week or so with the 'rona and not really able to do anything to protect them.
You may want to check about planting citrus since citrus doesn't handle freezing well. Any fruit trees should be the kind that can handle freezing temps for several weeks. The San Fernando Valley, CA, was a heavy citrus growing area in my childhood, and I remember that during freezes the news would announce to light the smudge pots in the orchards. Later smudge pots were outlawed (smog control) and the farmers did some kind of sprinkler thing since spraying water would also raise the temps above freezing. Obviously that was before the water shortages. LOL
I think I need a haz-mat suit (I'm just crazy allergic to poison ivy)
Too bad you don't want goats - they will completely eradicate the poison ivy and poison oak. Of course, they may do the number on the peach trees too. LOL
 
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