Anemic doe

[OneFineAcre]

Ok first let me say yes, a researcher with a PhD is certainly more qualified than a layman.
There is a bit of a disconnect here though. Which I will get to.

I do appreciate your post because I did go back to my veterinarian parasitology book and I am wrong. Which is GOOD! Why because it this is what this forum is for.
Education and helping one another. My response is based on working with different vets that see this subject a bit different. I am also not too proud to admit an error.
I have all my parasitology books but haven't really read or relied on them in so many years- I didn't even know this was there.

In the animal sciences there are Veterinarians, researches, and layman. Since we are talking about goats/sheep here I will restrict this to the first two.
Veterinarians and researchers do not always see eye to eye. I lean toward the researches more often then the vet side... the biggest issue is vets work in the field with seeing all the issues and the two don't always agree. Research is also ever evolving and old ways replaced with new info etc.. on and on it goes. This is not new, but rather old info.

Now attached are pages discussing this... I would however like to comment on what I see as a problem within the subject.
If it has to do with viability... how can it be said that in winter parasites go dormant and no need to deworm..
Do all parasites go dormant?
If an EPG is high in winter still don't deworm?
What about regions such as the SE where it was 70 degrees 2 weeks ago and will get back into the 50's possibly 60 soon.
What about Florida?
Winter is winter.

I am not contending the data or info but application of use of that data.
Is it responsible to say no one needs to deworm in the winter?

I have seen over the years on others farms where the vet said it is January, not the season for coccidia... yet a goat kid had diarrhea and blood. Fortunately that person felt the vet was wrong and took the fecal to Rollins lab. Loaded. Goat was treated by another vet from there on out. Another goat vet said goat is fine goat is fine... goat died- necropsy showed Barberpole.
When a goat is sick & anemic the simplest way to determine if there is a strong load is a fecal. The goat is ill. If they are in a dormant phase the results my not be great.
A poster here on BYH lost half their herd to Liver flukes- in the winter in a very cold region.

Personally I am not into deworming anything without an EPG. And if I had a sick goat that was thin and anemic, winter or not, I'd run a fecal second to taking the temp. Basic husbandry.
Continuing with my vet's advice and care protocol.




When you lost a kid to cocci would you have wanted someone to say that to you?


Below is some of the info mentioned above there are several more pages but this was the main portion....
(Parasitology for Veterinarians- Georgi)
View attachment 42050
View attachment 42052

You spent way more time putting this together than you needed too,
I read the first paragraph.
I just past along something that I had heard from someone with some real knowledge, not internet based knowledge.
If you don't agree with that, then that's fine.
I could have misunderstood her
But, you really need to think about why you needed to spend this much time disputing what I said.
You really do

 

[OneFineAcre]

You spent way more time putting this together than you needed too,
I read the first paragraph.
I just past along something that I had heard from someone with some real knowledge, not internet based knowledge.
If you don't agree with that, then that's fine.
I could have misunderstood her
But, you really need to think about why you needed to spend this much time disputing what I said.
You really do

It reminds me of something actually
A few years ago there was a thread just like this one
The OP was going to take their goat to the Vet and someone told them that after they took the goat to the vet they should let them know what the vet said to make sure it was really OK
The OP didn't know the advice was coming from a teenaged boy

 

[Southern by choice]

But, you really need to think about why you needed to spend this much time disputing what I said.
You really do

Actually, I was sharing that I was wrong and was giving added info to what you had provided.
If it benefits the community what is wrong with that?

Learning is asking questions.
I know, that "real knowledge" when never questioned can have serious consequences.
Some people ask, some people follow, some people challenge, some explore...

 

[babsbag]

@Southern by choice So I read through that stuff from the book, quickly. Does it ever say what the "killing outside temperature" is and for how long that temp has to be maintained to kill them?

 

[Southern by choice]

@Southern by choice So I read through that stuff from the book, quickly. Does it ever say what the "killing outside temperature" is and for how long that temp has to be maintained to kill them?

No. I looked in several other books as well.
It appears that it really isn't a killing stage but just a dormancy. I don't know.

 

[babsbag]

So if your pastures have a high load before winter they will have high load in the Spring, too bad it doesn't kill them. Dry summers have their benefits but I am going to get a fecal done on the goat that has the lousy coat, but I don't expect to find anything more than tape.

 

[appaloosa 239]

I have a 7 year old doe. She kidded in May of 2017. She was in perfect condition before birthing. After birthing she was good. Around the end of October she started going down hill. Weight wise. Had our vet come out and check her. She checked her from head to toe. Did blood work and a fecal. A little worms so she wormed her. Blood work came back and she was anemic. Fed her what the vet recommended. 2 cups in the evening and 1\2 cup in the morning. She seemed to be doing better. But is now going down hill again. Her symptoms then and know if important is if someone bumps her she falls over and can not get back up until I help her. I have started giving her because of the cold here warm water all day with molasses in it. Vitamin B Complex Plus shot 1 time a day and 6cc's of Red Cell. She is down to 100 pounds. Also adding shredded beet pulp to her feed. She always has fresh water and hay. Her temp is good and she is eating and chewing her cud. Anyone have any suggestions on what else I can do to help her? Thank you.

Have you considered top dressing the doe's feed with a quarter cup apple cider vinegar? ACV is very beneficial to humans, horses and goats. A very good source of ready potassium which may be what your doe is lacking. I choose Bragg's ACV because it is non GMO and organic. Hope this helps. You may also try a tablespoon of dolomite that you can purchase from a health food store. Start with a tablespoon and decrease to half after around 7 days. Dolomite is the perfect ratio of calcium and magnesium.

 

[terrilhb]

Update on my girl Sara. Sorry not sooner. Flu stuff going on. She seems to be on them mend. I am blanketing her in the evening because here in Ga the last few nights have been in the 20's and she has been shivering. She has a barn with hay to sleep in. But still shivers some because of her being thin. She is much more alert and vocal. I thank you all for your help. Southern by choice thank you so much. I will keep you all updated. This group rocks. And I can not tell you all how much all of your help has meant to me. I love this girl so much. Here is a picture of her. The blanket is a little small but is working. The top is her with her blanket and the bottom is her without it. Neither shows really well how thin she is. Thank you all again.

 

[Southern by choice]

Thank you, thank you thank you.

Everyday I have checked and was worried when I had not seen you post.
I wanted to message but honestly I was a bit afraid.

Goodness, I have tears! This one was so close to home. Sara has a special place with me for sure.
Dang goats, grab your heart and can even the strongest person to just mush!

oops, almost let that go by... sorry you all are dealing with the flu stuff. Lots of respiratory in our region too but not the flu, just a nasty bug going round.

 

[kuwaiti-90]

@terrilhb

you are welcome ,,



We do not need to thank you. This is a duty for us. We help you, we are your friends in this site, and we help everyone who needs help from me or from the existing members, and every time we are also possible we need help from you and some good members like you ..

I hope it is in the best cases and good health.