Considering a calf...need a refresher...

[GrowURown]

Hi all!

Been gone a while...kinda...mostly lurking from my cell and staying busy on the home front!

An update for those familiar with me...our goats I guess are doing well...I have decided to turn their care over all to the wife and follow a "don't worry be happy" with them...for some reason, maybe it's the cute factor, goats drive me NUTS with STRESS! My wife however...well...she banded all the baby boys sold as pet whethers, handled the sale of each one, and has deemed it necessary for me to find something else to focus on...she says MY stress causes her stress...go figure....how can you not stress when the darn things live right outside your bedroom window and you can hear every bleat, snort and fart they make? Anyways, I digress....

I have decided the thing I need is to raise a cow for BEEF...yes, beef...I think my stress with the goats is the fact that they are MEANT to live forever as milking pets...when I know something like our pigs has a shorter lifespan via a date with the processor...well...I care, don't get me wrong, but I also have a certain amount of detachment I feel is needed. You shouldn't fall in love with something scheduled for a dinner date - not when it is going to be ON the table versus AT the table. So I know I can handle a calf MUCH better than those silly goats!

Here's my question...or multiple questions...mostly this...can someone bring me up to date on current practices where raising calves are concerned? Things like vaccine schedules and worming and keep in mind we are located in Texas...the arm pit part of Texas just north of Houston as I know geographically it can matter in a lot of areas where worms and such are concerned.

Also, when we raised beef steers as a kid...well...it's sad, and I have to admit it, but my dad was the "know how" and I was the brawn...he said, I did, the end. I did not take the notes I should have. Plus, we generally stuck to buying older weaned calves...fancy ones too...I won a reserve grand championship twice showing. Right now the wife and I are pouring through the internet and considering something more reasonable...no shows here...just good eats. A LOT HAS CHANGED SINCE THE MID 80'S...that's when I raised my last calf - dad stuck with it for a while into the 90's...but I was gone on deployment in the Navy and back a year after he took his last steer to the processor. Even worse, part of what has changed is the passing of my father 4 years ago...with him went all my "cattle knowledge" and while he was totally old school cowboy about it and I don't know that we will be using the horses to rope anything...well...I kind of miss out on his know how from time to time in sticky situations.

We are talking about one, POSSIBLY 2, calves...probably little bull calves needing castration and dehorning...and maybe even bottle babies...never did bottle baby cows....so let me see if I can sum it up...

1) What's a good current vaccine schedule and worming program used in the south?
2) Dehorning and castration...I'm assuming this can be done just like the goats with an iron for the head and bands for the balls as long as the timing is right and all the junk fits where it needs to?
3) Feed...SO MANY NEW THINGS HAVE COME ON THE MARKET! Oh my lordy my goodness! What is a good, easy method to follow when feeding out a calf to slaughter?
4) If we end up going bottle baby...what the heck? A schedule? when to wean? and I'm guessing here that store bought cows milk is A-OK....but could we supplement with goat milk too? My GRIEF I say! We have that a plenty to at least supplement....
5) Anyone know any good places to find cheaper (but not so cheap they are gonna die) calves in South East texas? Or a recommendation for a good hardy breed for the region besides the longhorn...because it seems sacrilegious to me to have a longhorn...with no horns...and things here have no horns..them's the rules!

Thanks so much guys and gals! Any and all input is welcomed...call me nuts even...it's becoming a positive affirmation around here

 

[herfrds]

1 Stay away from the bottle baby alot of problems there.
2 Vaccine's I have been told is to use an injectable in the spring and a pout on in the fall.
3 Yep band the nuts, but the horns depending upon the size will have to taken care of a different way.
4 Feeding is different in all areas. I am finishing out a steer right now for slaughter next month. He is getting 8#'s of bull developer and 10#'s of ground barley plus out on pasture. But what feed situation do you have set up? Corral? Pasture?

Look for brangus/hereford cross been hearing some good things with them.
They are doing a lot of cross breeding with the braham down there sine they are so heat tolerant.

I would get a 6-8 month old weaned calf directly from the breeder. Find out if they kept records on everything they did from vaccines to implants.

 

[GrowURown]

Is a bottle baby cow worse than a bottle baby goat? Seriously, not playing here...how can ANYTHING be harder than a baby goat to bottle feed except maybe puppies and kittens? And I am being very serious...the goats have given us a hard time in the bottle department...we gave up and moved on to dam raised because we had the option with most of our babies born here (HAD to feed a few we initially ended up with not born here), but I would think a 3-4 week old bottle baby cow would be easier as the older goats WERE easier...just the brand new ones really drove me nuts with worry...just wondering why maybe is a younger cow harder?

Horns can't be disbudded using the Rhinehart...the cow one? We have access to the big cow one through friends...could probably just get him to come out and do it...so in all sincerity again...not good to do a cows horns with the electric disbudding iron?

We have a pasture...used to grow some lovely weeds, never had any luck with grass even in the front where nothing lives but people (though we had QUITE the stunning dandelion patch last summer, best one in four counties I think!)...then it quite raining in Texas...so now we have a beach with no ocean...lots of sand and dirt...I'm actually awaiting a hay delivery today, yeah, the stuff is pricey, but the horses and goats need it and to me their health and the happiness and joy they bring the family is irreplaceable...not to mention the responsibility they have taught the kids...PRICELESS!

So anything that comes here is going to have a hay based diet and horse quality at that...this is a given as I don't want to be dealing with multiple kinds of hay. LORD FORBID I feed a horse something intended for a goat or vice versa, you should see the wife go off! And for feed, well...back when I was showing mine, they all got Purina brand everything....dad used generic feed store brand all stock for everything else..but MAN! How the feed options seem to have grown! There's SO MANY brands and types and supplements....it overwhelms me trying to figure out what is meant for what...we eventually settled on something for the horses that seems to fit them...but REALLY...have you ever looked at all the options available? IT'S LUNACY! Would it be safe to stick with all stock for a cow? Just simple and easy and supplement with a mineral block/salt lick? Or should I go fancy cow specific?

 

[Bossroo]

As the old Scottish saying goes... " The eye of the master fattens the cattle." It applies to all classes of livestock. All of the fancy new stuff is fine and dandy and expensive. If it works better than the old reliable stuff, use it. If not, use your eye. As for advise, what works for livestock in one area, may not work as well in another environment. So, ask your neighbors that professionally raise their animals with an open mind and consistantly make a profit.

 

[elevan]

GrowURown - Oh, how I've missed your posts!!! They are so fun to read Welcome back!

I second the call to get a weaned calf. Golly I brought home 2 bottle baby calves myself in May...my first ones. Lost one within a week and was nursing the other with I.V. fluids. IMO they are definitely harder than goats.

 

[GrowURown]

Elevan...I've been trying to avoid all things BYH if only so I am NOT constantly paranoid about those goats! (I just sneak occassional PM's in to my goat gurus for advice and leave it be...no lurking on the goat diseases, nothing....trying to stay away from the temptation of worry really....)NONE of them have food names....see my issue? E M O T I O N A L A T T A C H M E N T .....it's an ugly thing for me!

A nice steer calf named BartleBEEF....that would work just fine

And really....I'm still trying to picture something like a calf being harder than a goat to deal with as a bottle baby...I guess maybe because I am SO paranoid over how fast goats can go downhill....and because wwe lost our first goat EVER that was a bottle baby so fast...he was never quite right though...

I think I found a nice HEALTHY WEANED ZEBU calf not too far from the house...small yes, but good for the wife and kids since they have never really raised one...I think what do ya'll think...

really now...What do ya'll think of that idea? I mean, it's not ever going to be a HUGE beef steer to fill multiple walk in freezers or anything....like that I Love Lucy episode where she's selling beef out of a baby buggy in front of the store she bought it at (That was my wife's first thought too.....she voiced it and I had a hard time not laughing too hard).

But it would be a decent size to work with and tame, if our 12 year old can handle a 3 year old quarter horse mare in heat, I would bet that fiery kid could handle a Zebu steer...also....from what I hear they are pretty hardy...that's a plus...

i don't know...still unsure on vaccines, etc...bought some feed the lady that runs our feed store recommended and she's usually right...says everyone does it that way...so I went with it, and stayed away from TSC and all things "mega farm store" for now...it's too tempting to come home with visions of every disease the stuff on the shelves cures.

OH! I KNOW....I was told when I got him home, no matter what and IF we get him to give him 5cc of CDT vaccine...is that right? Because we have 2 bottles of the stuff...each half used I believe....what's the deal with that (the cdt I mean, not the half usage of 2 bottles, that I attribute to my own blind eye)? He's already had an 8 in 1 (or maybe the guy said 7 or 5 in one...idk at this point)....who knows...NOT GROWUROWN!

I just know if anyone asks "Where's the beef?" I want to say "In my yard!"

 

[GrowURown]

As the old Scottish saying goes... " The eye of the master fattens the cattle." It applies to all classes of livestock. All of the fancy new stuff is fine and dandy and expensive. If it works better than the old reliable stuff, use it. If not, use your eye. As for advise, what works for livestock in one area, may not work as well in another environment. So, ask your neighbors that professionally raise their animals with an open mind and consistantly make a profit.

OH! I was gonna say...."BUT I DON'T THINK I WANT A SCOTTISH Cow! Who asked the Scottish anyways?" (I'm just playing here...get it...because there really ARE scottish cattle...made me laugh ) But yeah, that's kinda what I did, I asked what moves the most and best with least complaints at the feed store and she pointed me the right way...now I gotta remember all the other stuff we used to do...I remember CLEARLY getting my first "very own" calf and a few VERY bad moments where I was too young and dumb to know better....so I'm trying to drum those up and not have any repeats....

I'm also praying the wife enjoys banding him as much as she did the goats....only one goat acted a fool, the rest were so tame they just laid in her lap like they were waiting for her to take the band off and apologize....I've WARNED her this is NOT the norm....but I figure since this time she will at least wait for me to help hold the thing (she was brave enough just to "do the deed" with the goat boys) we should be okay. I mean...I held the hog while she castrated him...she was a little too cautious on the first one and dead on with the second...so she should be okay...but we cannot entrust the 7 year old no matter what she says to this job (and she's my daughter thru and thru...already asking to do the "rubberband gizmo")

And really....for real....I LIKE the electric iron for disbudding...that is NOT that bad at all compared to other things....it won't work on a small cow with tiny horns?

 

[aggieterpkatie]

Bottle babies *can* be ok if you get them from a reputable farm that you know feeds colostrum. Buying one straight off the farm is way different than buying from auction where they're just "throw away" animals.

 

[GrowURown]

Bottle babies *can* be ok if you get them from a reputable farm that you know feeds colostrum. Buying one straight off the farm is way different than buying from auction where they're just "throw away" animals.

Ahhhh....so as with a goat kid, colostrum is key, correct? and initially healthy of course....but the colostrum makes a difference, so say, should I find jersey bull calves 3-4 weeks old at the dairy still and not the auction (I WILL NOT do an auction...too much...no way) then they should...in THEORY...be easier?


ETA...to be specific what I mean it that it is CRUCIAL they get colostrum within an appropriate time frame right? That makes a huge difference...and not being exposed to a million other questionably healthy animals...

 

[elevan]

As to the vaccines and deworming...I'm learning right along with you here.

But as I was on the way home with the calves I called my vet and went to pick up the next day from them:
Vaccines: Vision 7 & Triangle 9 (repeat booster of both in 3-4 wks)
Dewormers: They just recommended a dose of Ivomec (which I already had)

If someone else has a different recommendation - please share I've decided that I'm going to continue the homegrown beef thing myself.

Oh, and I named ours Brisket and T-Bone (We lost Brisket though) And when I talk to him, I'm constantly talking about what kind of marinade I'll be using on what piece of meat or something like that. I have too or I'd drive myself crazy...he's just too cute. I'll probably cry like a baby when it's time to send him in...but it's gonna be a great meal.