In search of LGD in Florida

[Ridgetop]

I am sure there are good breeders there. Many people are knowledgeable, honest, and reputable for continuing offering help and guidance to the puppy buyers. Sadly you have to search to find them since there are so many who are advertising and are bad breeders. If you do not know the difference you can be tricked by overly low prices when the reputable breeder has puppies for sale that reflect the money that has gone into their raising.

I am becoming depressed about all the posts we are seeing from people having behavior problems with "livestock guardian dogs" that should never have been breed, much less sold as guardians. These dogs wreak havoc on their owner's lives, livestock, and checkbook.

I believe that when breeding you should only breed for the best and that includes temperament, health, conformation, and ability in the parents. So many people now are jumping on the bandwagon of "Livestock Guardian Dogs" that they are breeding litters to make a quick buck. Anatolians are becoming popular as pets because they are huge, and can be aggressive. The show people are keeping a pet goat so they can advertise their winning dogs as "true working dogs", even though the dogs spends 90% of its time living with the handler on the show circuit. It breaks my heart to see so many dogs whose true purpose is guarding livestock become just a status symbol for people who do not understand the breeds, socialize them, or train them at all. Then they complain about the viciousness of a dog who has been badly bred, improperly trained, and used.

I really want people to have a successful experience with a true Livestock Guardian Dog. They are fantastic partners in ranch life, save us sleep, money, and the tragedy of having to put down or bury a slashed, torn, or half eaten animal that you have spent physical and emotional resources caring for.

 

[Angeliki Manouselis]

Thank you all for the information and feedback!
I am going to pick up two female Great Pyrenees puppies on Sunday! The parents are on site working dogs and the puppies have already been around chickens and goats. I am going to be reading endless threads from here and on “livestock guardian dogs” Facebook group. At night , the puppies will sleep inside the house but in a separate room so they don’t bond too much to me and my boyfriend. During the day they will spend outside with me and the chickens and goats. Until they’re big enough to defend themselves from the pesky bobcat that has been stealing my ducks... I don’t have any really large predators in my area, just bobcats. I saw one lone coyote once a long time ago though. But my 7 acres is between two main roads and not so much in the country. My goats will be kidding very soon, I am kind of glad the puppies will grow up with the kids, that might make it even better for bonding to the goats! Right? This is all so new to me, I am as excited as I am nervous.

 

[B&B Happy goats]

Congratulations on the pups !
Where are the pictures of the pup ?????

 

[Angeliki Manouselis]

Congratulations on the pups !
Where are the pictures of the pup ?????

I was trying to figure out how to put a photo in here lol
I’ll post pups mom and dad
I think they’re very young in the only photo I have. I’m going to text the lady now to send me a couple more photos

 

[Angeliki Manouselis]

I had reached out to a few rescues, they had no working dogs. They told me it was not wise to get two females from the same litter as they don’t get along with the same gender when they get older they will fight, I’ve never heard this before.

 

[Rammy]

I had reached out to a few rescues, they had no working dogs. They told me it was not wise to get two females from the same litter as they don’t get along with the same gender when they get older they will fight, I’ve never heard this before.

I do believe it was mentioned in a post from either @Ridgetop or @Southern by choice. I was going to say something when you mentioned getting two females but thought it had already been posted about females not getting along, especially when they come into heat. There are other threads on here that I do know it was mentioned so you might look those up. Congrats on your puppies.

 

[Angeliki Manouselis]

I do believe it was mentioned in a post from either @Ridgetop or @Southern by choice. I was going to say something when you mentioned getting two females but thought it had already been posted about females not getting along, especially when they come into heat. There are other threads on here that I do know it was mentioned so you might look those up. Congrats on your puppies.

Hmmm... it’s not a guarantee though right, some can get along? My friend has two PYR male brothers they guard their goats and never fight. I mean if it does happen I have separate areas where the chickens are then the goats are that I can seperate if necessary. I need to get two females though because my dad who lives next door, we have joining properties, has an alpha male Doberman who doesn’t get along with males at all.

 

[Baymule]

The Doberman should never be in your dogs working area, ever. So that is a moot point. Your major concern should be your own dogs getting along. I have a pair of GP’s male and female, they work well together. Two females will get along until one day, they don’t. Spaying will help with the hormonal attitude, but wait until they are 2 years old so they can reach full growth and their bones can grow.

I recommend reading The Way of The Pack, by Brenda Negri, available on Amazon. She ran up to 25 dogs at a time. She also raised siblings to work together. It’s a very good read. From what I hear, FB groups may not be the best place to get advice on LGDs

 

[Angeliki Manouselis]

The Doberman should never be in your dogs working area, ever. So that is a moot point. Your major concern should be your own dogs getting along. I have a pair of GP’s male and female, they work well together. Two females will get along until one day, they don’t. Spaying will help with the hormonal attitude, but wait until they are 2 years old so they can reach full growth and their bones can grow.

I recommend reading The Way of The Pack, by Brenda Negri, available on Amazon. She ran up to 25 dogs at a time. She also raised siblings to work together. It’s a very good read. From what I hear, FB groups may not be the best place to get advice on LGDs

They won't be together ever but god forbid the dobe gets in the goat pen or the GP gets out because they want to go at it. I want all the dogs to get along of course. Well, the Facebook group members are all people with farms and LGDs too, just like this site.... I will order the book.

 

[Ridgetop]

Too back you can't get a male and female puppy. They would definitely work well together. Anatolian siblings of the same sex are fine until 2 years or so when they will fight for dominance. I do not know about Pyrenees siblings, but Brenda's book (The Way of the Pack) talks about raising siblings together. There is a lot other good information in it for you too. We space our LGDs by age about 3-4 years so the older ones will help teach the younger ones. Definitely spay them around 2 years or after their 2nd heat cycle. You will have to provide some sort of confinement other than the property fencing while they are in season if the Doberman has access to your property. You will need to get a kennel run (available at Lowe's or Home Depot stores) with a top to keep them in during their cycle. Pyrenees can climb chain link. The top can be solid to keep out rain, or another chain link panel. These kennel panels clip together with butterfly clips that come with the corral package. I suggest you get 2 and put them together in one large run since both your bitches will probably come season together or within a week of each other. Not only are they the same age, but they will bring each other into season. Not sure why, but it happens with 2 or more females kept together - goats and sheep seem to do it too.

Male dogs do not usually attack females, while females will often attack males. On the other hand, male LGDs will have no problem attacking a female dog that goes for his livestock. That said, females and males (other than LGDs) usually can live together amicably. But if you have heard the term bitch fight, it comes from the fights that female dogs (that are not LGDs) have with each other which usually end with one killing the other. At that point one of the bitches has to be removed from the pack since they will never get along together again. However, the more work there is, the easier it seems to be for the dogs to get along. They do have to work together to keep the flocks safe, and the dogs seem to realize it. If you don't have enough work for them, then they may quarrel.

I have read many stories about female Pyrenees siblings guarding together with no trouble. If you fix them, and no male is introduced to their "pack" it may work out. The Canadian government hires large teams of forestry workers who take flocks of 1,000 sheep into the forests to control the understory and keep down the danger of forest fires. These teams use forestry students accompanies by large packs of various LGDs to guard the sheep during the summers. They truck the sheep and dogs to remote locations, stay out in the wilderness all summer walking the sheep through heavy predator areas. Their worst and most common predators are bears and wolves that will attack the flocks in spite of the human presence. The most common breed of LGD they use are Pyrenees. You can read about this program on several Canadian Great Pyrenees information websites. The stories are fascinating.