Jumping the Moon Dairy - the next chapter

[babsbag]

It certainly can seem that way. When I first started pursuing this they were all smiles and roses and every question I asked was answered with "yes" we can work that out. I asked about using trailers, now they are balking at that. I asked about a bathroom that is required and that I had a problem as the dairy is located below our septic tank so they suggested using an RV; now they are complaining about that and it was their idea. I am very thorough when it comes to asking questions and following through with research so I find this very maddening and tiring.

On another note...I have been eyeing 8 acres next to us for a few years. The land went up for sale after the mobile home and its residents were lost in a fire. The brother that inherited the land then died and left the land to a former boss. Anyways it was a mixed up will and it has been for sell for over a year. At one point the current owner was going to carry papers for us and then a realtor convinced him to raise the price and told me that is was just too complicated and that I should walk away...so I did.

A neighbor has taken over half of the land with his horses and claims that it is his, but we know that it isn't. Every time I drive by the land I think "I need to own this"; and I drive by it daily so I think that a lot. The thing is, I don't have the money and I can't get financing for it until the dairy is up and running for at least a year and two would be better. The asking price is a little over the top and half of the land is in a seasonal stream bed across the road. But the stream is ok with me if we can agree on a price as I would just turn the stream area into bee forage. (I raise bees too). The owner doesn't live here, he doesn't know what he has or doesn't have and the realtor has really led him astray as far as pricing.

The land is perfect for me. It is downhill from my land which would allow me a place to discharge the dairy wash water to and to irrigate at the same time. It is mostly level and mine is NOT so level land would be awesome. It has a lot of trees and brush that my goats would make short work of and open pasture. It would really be a perfect addition to our land, plus it would insure that I have never have neighbors that complain about the goats and the LGDs. There is about 4 acres that is very usable and 4 acres in the stream bed across the road.

But the really good news...he said that he would consider leasing it to me with an option to buy in two years. We are going to talk more tomorrow. So now to figure out a price and a monthly payment. I would have it surveyed to get rid of the horse owner once and for all and two of the corners are already marked as they are my corners as well. The property is mostly fenced and we would finish the rest and also tear down an old building that is literally falling apart. There is a well on the land but the controller has been stolen and a company says that it needs a new pump, even though it was in use when the fire happened. I don't always believe everything these companies say, the well may be fine. The county won't let us have power back on the land until we take out a building permit which we will never do, but we have a generator all ready to run that well.

I have no idea what to offer for a monthly lease and no idea what to offer for a purchase price down the road. Does my monthly payment go towards the purchase? Who pays the taxes? Who insures it? So many questions.

It is exciting to think about...I will update as I know more.

 

[misfitmorgan]

It certainly can seem that way. When I first started pursuing this they were all smiles and roses and every question I asked was answered with "yes" we can work that out. I asked about using trailers, now they are balking at that. I asked about a bathroom that is required and that I had a problem as the dairy is located below our septic tank so they suggested using an RV; now they are complaining about that and it was their idea. I am very thorough when it comes to asking questions and following through with research so I find this very maddening and tiring.

On another note...I have been eyeing 8 acres next to us for a few years. The land went up for sale after the mobile home and its residents were lost in a fire. The brother that inherited the land then died and left the land to a former boss. Anyways it was a mixed up will and it has been for sell for over a year. At one point the current owner was going to carry papers for us and then a realtor convinced him to raise the price and told me that is was just too complicated and that I should walk away...so I did.

A neighbor has taken over half of the land with his horses and claims that it is his, but we know that it isn't. Every time I drive by the land I think "I need to own this"; and I drive by it daily so I think that a lot. The thing is, I don't have the money and I can't get financing for it until the dairy is up and running for at least a year and two would be better. The asking price is a little over the top and half of the land is in a seasonal stream bed across the road. But the stream is ok with me if we can agree on a price as I would just turn the stream area into bee forage. (I raise bees too). The owner doesn't live here, he doesn't know what he has or doesn't have and the realtor has really led him astray as far as pricing.

The land is perfect for me. It is downhill from my land which would allow me a place to discharge the dairy wash water to and to irrigate at the same time. It is mostly level and mine is NOT so level land would be awesome. It has a lot of trees and brush that my goats would make short work of and open pasture. It would really be a perfect addition to our land, plus it would insure that I have never have neighbors that complain about the goats and the LGDs. There is about 4 acres that is very usable and 4 acres in the stream bed across the road.

But the really good news...he said that he would consider leasing it to me with an option to buy in two years. We are going to talk more tomorrow. So now to figure out a price and a monthly payment. I would have it surveyed to get rid of the horse owner once and for all and two of the corners are already marked as they are my corners as well. The property is mostly fenced and we would finish the rest and also tear down an old building that is literally falling apart. There is a well on the land but the controller has been stolen and a company says that it needs a new pump, even though it was in use when the fire happened. I don't always believe everything these companies say, the well may be fine. The county won't let us have power back on the land until we take out a building permit which we will never do, but we have a generator all ready to run that well.

I have no idea what to offer for a monthly lease and no idea what to offer for a purchase price down the road. Does my monthly payment go towards the purchase? Who pays the taxes? Who insures it? So many questions.

It is exciting to think about...I will update as I know more.

On our farm lease we pay property taxes, insure the place and pay $100/month lease payment...when we are ready to pay the owner is paying our closing costs. So our payments go towards closing costs rather then money off but $100/month is really low even for here.
Typical bare land lease here is $35-55 per acre per year and/or pay property taxes. So if you were doing 10 acres with property tax and rent payment it would be approx $850-1050/yr.
From the sounds of this owner though i would assume they would want far more per month and yeah i would definitely make sure at least the cash money he gets would go towards closing costs and/or money off the loan. If its like $500/month for rent over 2yrs thats $12,000.

Also...before drawing up the contract you can request to see a copy of the property taxes so that will give you an idea of what the "true price" should be, just take the value on the tax paper and double it. ATM i cant remember what its called but up here most real estate companies use that as a base price, then add on for upgrades or luxury stuff.

 

[Ferguson K]

It seems like the closer you get, the more strictly they apply the rules.

 

[babsbag]

It seems like the closer you get, the more strictly they apply the rules.

Or apply rules that are misinterpreted. But you are right and I have heard this about them from other people, I just didn't want to believe it. I am into this for a large chunk of change and a USDA loan, I can't quit now. So now it is my job to build a dairy and read code and make sure it is applied correctly. I should get paid for that.

@misfitmorgan I am not sure what he wants. He didn't want this land or expect this land in the first place. He was left as the beneficiary and the executor of a will from a former employee. The land had been in escrow at one point and then the brother of the fire victim died and sent the land back into probate...that was about 3 years ago. He bought out the victim's daughter's share so he could basically sell it to me and carry papers, then his realtor lost her mind and talked him into cleaning the land and raising the price. I wanted to clean the land as we needed the "sweat equity" but they convinced him that he could get more if he cleaned it up. He doesn't live here, has only seen the property once many many many years ago and was letting a crazy realtor guide him.

He is a farmer himself, owns many large nut orchards in our Central Valley, which is nice as he understands the economics of farming. I like your prices and have no idea what he will expect. I know that the value of the land on the tax roll is based on what it last sold for which was like a century ago so not much can be gleaned from that. That piece of land was part of the original ranch in my area, 100's of acres that was eventually subdivided and the owners stayed on that piece.

I wouldn't mind paying the taxes and insurance if I was getting it for a decent lease price but if I am paying 500.00 a month (I can't) then I would hope he would pay those items. We will see. I want this land but I have to be smart.

 

[misfitmorgan]

Or apply rules that are misinterpreted. But you are right and I have heard this about them from other people, I just didn't want to believe it. I am into this for a large chunk of change and a USDA loan, I can't quit now. So now it is my job to build a dairy and read code and make sure it is applied correctly. I should get paid for that.

@misfitmorgan I am not sure what he wants. He didn't want this land or expect this land in the first place. He was left as the beneficiary and the executor of a will from a former employee. The land had been in escrow at one point and then the brother of the fire victim died and sent the land back into probate...that was about 3 years ago. He bought out the victim's daughter's share so he could basically sell it to me and carry papers, then his realtor lost her mind and talked him into cleaning the land and raising the price. I wanted to clean the land as we needed the "sweat equity" but they convinced him that he could get more if he cleaned it up. He doesn't live here, has only seen the property once many many many years ago and was letting a crazy realtor guide him.

He is a farmer himself, owns many large nut orchards in our Central Valley, which is nice as he understands the economics of farming. I like your prices and have no idea what he will expect. I know that the value of the land on the tax roll is based on what it last sold for which was like a century ago so not much can be gleaned from that. That piece of land was part of the original ranch in my area, 100's of acres that was eventually subdivided and the owners stayed on that piece.

I wouldn't mind paying the taxes and insurance if I was getting it for a decent lease price but if I am paying 500.00 a month (I can't) then I would hope he would pay those items. We will see. I want this land but I have to be smart.

oh i misunderstood this is the boss guy that has it now i thought the only guy had it still.

Here it goes on sale price and then appreciates or depreciates depending on the whats on the property and it condition, whats built afterwards, etc.

Hopefully you guys can agree on a reasonably price for buying and lease. I know here atm land is roughly 1k per acre to buy so pretty cheap, you can find it as low as $500/acre and as high as 2k/acre though.

 

[babsbag]

Well in CA the land of all high prices it is closer to 8,000 an acre for small parcels; of course that price per acre drops when you start buy pieces 20 acres +. I am going to get some pictures for him as he lives 6 hours away. I want him to see the junk that is left on the land. I think the realtor really didn't represent his interests well on the cleanup job.

There is an old shack, falling down, windows fell out, roof leaks etc. It is about 20x20. They left it on the land and when I asked why he told me that they told him that someone could come in and remodel it and save on building permit fees. I tried really hard not to laugh. It has no plumbing, the floor is falling in, and it was never permitted to start with. The county would never let it be considered a house to remodel.

They also left the frame work to a lean-to shed that did collapse when the neighbor stole all the tin roofing on it after the fire. Underneath that mess is years and years worth of household garbage in bags. Fortunately I have a tractor and a dump trailer.

This should be an interesting discussion.

 

[Latestarter]

wow... wish you the best.

 

[misfitmorgan]

Well in CA the land of all high prices it is closer to 8,000 an acre for small parcels; of course that price per acre drops when you start buy pieces 20 acres +. I am going to get some pictures for him as he lives 6 hours away. I want him to see the junk that is left on the land. I think the realtor really didn't represent his interests well on the cleanup job.

There is an old shack, falling down, windows fell out, roof leaks etc. It is about 20x20. They left it on the land and when I asked why he told me that they told him that someone could come in and remodel it and save on building permit fees. I tried really hard not to laugh. It has no plumbing, the floor is falling in, and it was never permitted to start with. The county would never let it be considered a house to remodel.

They also left the frame work to a lean-to shed that did collapse when the neighbor stole all the tin roofing on it after the fire. Underneath that mess is years and years worth of household garbage in bags. Fortunately I have a tractor and a dump trailer.

This should be an interesting discussion.

Same here the bigger the parcel the lower the price per acre until you get over 100acres ten it goes up cause it hard to find single parcels that large. Pretty much 20-100 acres your paying $250-500 per acre which is a good deal...market is down here still atm. "Normal" prices here are $2-2,500/acre higher side if its got good woods or tillable.

Good luck with that convo hopefully the pictures get him to realize the realtor is a crackpot.

 

[babsbag]

oh i misunderstood this is the boss guy that has it now i thought the only guy had it still.

No, not the boss guy, it is still the local field inspector. But I have made it a habit to cc the boss on all emails that I send to her. I still have the "discrimination card up my sleeve" and would use it with the director but I have never in my life resorted to that or felt particularly picked on for being a woman so that is a last resort. But I am holding it in reserve for the final if needed. Trust me...this dairy will get licensed. Like the quote from the movie "Tombstone"..."tell 'em I'm coming and I'm bringing hell with me."

 

[Mike CHS]

I know a lot of people that would have given up over what the bureaucrats are doing (or trying to do) to you. You may never know their true motivation but it would be nice to know at some point.