Just got some skinny goats

[Latestarter]

Babs had mentioned before her thoughts of considering AI... Once she has the straws (collected, then frozen semen), she can try the AI route before eliminating the buck(s)... If it does work, she's all set... if it doesn't, she'll know which does it won't work with/on. Then she can determine if those does should/could be replaced with offspring of the does it does work on.

Follow the lead of the cattle/pork industry... or at least some facets of it. AI also gives the ability to import and use straws from really elite bucks/breeding lines at a substantial cost savings over buying/raising and supporting/feeding a buck from those same lines. Just a thought...

 

[NH homesteader]

I won't elaborate here but I don't agree that we should go the route of the Cattle industry and I have no interest in AI. But, to each his/her own and it would eliminate the buck issue for sure!

 

[Goat Whisperer]

So how could you tell he would be a fence jumper? And what would you look for in a buck?

For the potential fence jumper- I could just tell by his movements, how he acted when scared, and how he acted when he saw the does. Hard to really explain, but I can "read" goats the same way you read dogs, horses etc. I could just tell, sorry not great at explaining it. It's hard to put into words.

Oh boy… what I look for in a buck? This is going to be "short story version" because it would take hours to explain every detail.
Because I'm breeding registered dairy/show goats I would need to be more picky than someone who is breeding pet grade goats.

I look at the conformation, topline, legs, placement, width between legs/hocks, brisket, escutcheon, the list goes on.

Before I even look at the goat I look at the pedigree. What lines does he have? What are the Linear Appraisal scored, Milk test info, stars, SG's, CH's, etc. etc.
I look at the udders of all the does in the 5 generation pedigree (or all that I can find). I look at siblings and half siblings.

Most anything I look at I am already familiar with the genetics.

Is the herd tested for CAE, CL, & Johne's?

I never look at coat colors or eye color, with the breed I have color doesn't matter. I'm not a huge fan of overly flashy/spotted goats because it takes away from a true dairy animal.

I also look at temperament. All of my bucks (MANY) are all well mannered and respectful. Not one will paw, blubber, or mount. We had two young mini's that started blubbering at people when they were around 7 months. Got that taken care of right away and they don't try anything

Even my bottle babies are respectful.

 

[Goat Whisperer]

Babs had mentioned before her thoughts of considering AI... Once she has the straws (collected, then frozen semen), she can try the AI route before eliminating the buck(s)... If it does work, she's all set... if it doesn't, she'll know which does it won't work with/on. Then she can determine if those does should/could be replaced with offspring of the does it does work on.

Follow the lead of the cattle/pork industry... or at least some facets of it. AI also gives the ability to import and use straws from really elite bucks/breeding lines at a substantial cost savings over buying/raising and supporting/feeding a buck from those same lines. Just a thought...

I have no qualms with AI.
A doe may settle with AI this year but not next year.

I know the benefits of AI, I'm hoping on getting a tank in 2017 for that reason. AI still isn't as cheap as some think.

With 40+ does to breed, I would think it would be difficult for Babs to AI each one.
I have heard from fellow goat breeders that success rates are lower when you have to synchronize does to go into heat.
The most common % I have heard for conception via AI is 60%. Those with smaller herds have said they are a little better.

I can't imagine constantly checking a doe internally to get her at the right time- multiply that by 40

I've bugged Babs about AI, I told her a long, long time ago that she should look into it. I just don't see it being possible with 40+ does a season (unless she had a professional do it). Especially when her goal is having a dairy- if she has 10 goats that end up kidding 2+ months later than needed it could really mess her up production/business wise.

 

[Hens and Roos]

For the potential fence jumper- I could just tell by his movements, how he acted when scared, and how he acted when he saw the does. Hard to really explain, but I can "read" goats the same way you read dogs, horses etc. I could just tell, sorry not great at explaining it. It's hard to put into words.

Oh boy… what I look for in a buck? This is going to be "short story version" because it would take hours to explain every detail.
Because I'm breeding registered dairy/show goats I would need to be more picky than someone who is breeding pet grade goats.

I look at the conformation, topline, legs, placement, width between legs/hocks, brisket, escutcheon, the list goes on.

Before I even look at the goat I look at the pedigree. What lines does he have? What are the Linear Appraisal scored, Milk test info, stars, SG's, CH's, etc. etc.
I look at the udders of all the does in the 5 generation pedigree (or all that I can find). I look at siblings and half siblings.

Most anything I look at I am already familiar with the genetics.

Is the herd tested for CAE, CL, & Johne's?

I never look at coat colors or eye color, with the breed I have color doesn't matter. I'm not a huge fan of overly flashy/spotted goats because it takes away from a true dairy animal.

I also look at temperament. All of my bucks (MANY) are all well mannered and respectful. Not one will paw, blubber, or mount. We had two young mini's that started blubbering at people when they were around 7 months. Got that taken care of right away and they don't try anything

Even my bottle babies are respectful.

So how do you work with the bucks to make sure they don't paw, blubber or mount people?

 

[Goat Whisperer]

I treat them like a goat. Bucklings aren't allowed to head butt, jump, paw, or head rub from a very young age. I see so many people let the buck rub it's head all over them. They say it's "sweet" or "cute" but in reality they are marking you OR it leads to marking. If you ever watch a buck around a doe in heat he rubs his head all over her, I'm not a doe so no smelly head rubbing here

I needed to work with our new lamancha buck with the because he wanted to rub his smelly head on my, and didn't like being told no.

When I have bucks like this I show them I'm "boss buck". If you ever watch a field full of bucks you will probably notice there is on buck that all the other bucks (top buck) leave alone. It's because if they try anything the top buck will turn around and give him a good, hard, head butt as a reminder.

Same thing when I'm with them, if I have the occasional young buck that forgets his manners he gets a good yelling and a slap on the rump if needed. *not enough to harm the buck*

During the first rut I'm a little harder on them. If I'm walking through, they need to move. If I'm going to grab them, I'm going to grab them.

I'm very hard on the horned meat bucks during the first rut. They aren't going to crowd me when I feed them. When I pour the grain down, they need to back off I decide to take the grain. If they don't I case them off and do a small slap on the rump to prove my point if needed.

When I say "slap on the rump" it is not hard. If you ever look at two bucks together you will see that hit each other much harder than a human would. My hand is flat and remains flat when it comes in contact with the goat. No damage is done- I don't abuse my goats

 

[Hens and Roos]

I have seen our older buck head butt the younger buck. Go to know, especially with the younger buck(only 7 months old). I will remind my kids to try a not hard slap on the rump. We did teach the buck(got him at 2.5 years old) to respect our space when we enter his area.

 

[babsbag]

I was going to do AI, had the tank all lined up to buy and the lady changed her mind. I have a friend that is doing most of her does AI this year. She waits for them to come into heat and then does the deed the next day. She has had really good success doing them. She is not synchronizing them at all, just waiting for mother nature to do its thing. It really does help that she is good friends when one of the best goat AI people in the nation so she has had a good teacher.

My problem with the bucks right now is basically that I have too many and only one pen. I won't need this many bucks after I decide if the minis are something I am keeping. Right now I have two mini Alpines, two nigis, one LM. and one Alpine...that is a few too many. Up until this year I always had my bucks separate during rut, I will do that again next year.

I just bred a LM doe to a nigi....I am NOT keeping a mini mancha buck. NO NO NO!!!!

 

[Goat Whisperer]

I was going to do AI, had the tank all lined up to buy and the lady changed her mind. I have a friend that is doing most of her does AI this year. She waits for them to come into heat and then does the deed the next day. She has had really good success doing them. She is not synchronizing them at all, just waiting for mother nature to do its thing. It really does help that she is good friends when one of the best goat AI people in the nation so she has had a good teacher.

My problem with the bucks right now is basically that I have too many and only one pen. I won't need this many bucks after I decide if the minis are something I am keeping. Right now I have two mini Alpines, two nigis, one LM. and one Alpine...that is a few too many. Up until this year I always had my bucks separate during rut, I will do that again next year.

I just bred a LM doe to a nigi....I am NOT keeping a mini mancha buck. NO NO NO!!!!

But would you try and do ALL your does in one season?
It seems that you already have a heck of a time figuring out who is in heat…

 

[babsbag]

I think this year has been tough because there are two bucks in pens literally IN the doe pen. Usually the does will go out of the barn and stand at the buck pen but with all the rain they just stand, sleep, and eat near the 2 young bucks and they aren't very demonstrative and the young boys aren't even smelly...at least to me they aren't.

I don't think that it would be wise to never have a buck as a back up plan. I know my LM serviced two does last year for a friend when they wouldn't settle with AI.

I just don't need all the different breeds, that is what is killing me.