Mike CHS
Herd Master
The study that we are experimenting with follows up the bleach application by spraying nitrogen. We won't know the affect on our fields for a couple of months unfortunately since that field is fallow right no.
mysunwolf - four acres and some sheep
- Thread starter
- #402
mysunwolf
Herd Master
@Mike CHS I'll be eagerly following along, we have got to do something about it.
I was thinking of keeping the whole flock on drylot and feeding hay for a year while mowing the fields. But I have had them get barber pole in drylot from eating through the fence! And then we'd have to feed a cocci preventative as they seem to get that every time they're in the lot.
I was thinking of keeping the whole flock on drylot and feeding hay for a year while mowing the fields. But I have had them get barber pole in drylot from eating through the fence! And then we'd have to feed a cocci preventative as they seem to get that every time they're in the lot.
Mike CHS
Herd Master
I'm pasting the info that is also in our Journal to make it easier to find. I lost track of the report and greybeard tracked it down. We have one small paddock that we only sprayed nitrogen on to give us something to compare to with our fecal results but I'm not sure how scientific the result will be since the smaller paddock houses the lambs that have required more worming and will be culled once I'm sure they are clean.
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A bleach solution (10%) should get a 99% kill rate if followed by nitrogen. Nitrogen fertilize alone will get around a 96% kill.
Like almost everything else, both are very short lived in their effects on soil/grass parasites.
Laboratory studies we conducted at North Carolina State University showed that 96.6% L3 barber pole larvae were not moving or dead when immersed in solutions of liquid nitrogen fertilizer (containing 32.7% urea and 42.2% ammonium nitrate (21.1% ammonium and 21.1% nitrate), corresponding to field applications of 30 lb of nitrogen per acre. Another laboratory study showed that a 10% solution of household bleach (5.25% sodium hypochlorite) resulted in 99.1% of L3 larvae not moving or dead. Higher solutions of household bleach caused lysis (disintegration) of the larvae.
https://content.ces.ncsu.edu/decrea...ures-is-liquid-nitrogen-fertilizer-a-viable-a
https://www.tuskegee.edu/Content/Uploads/Tuskegee/files/CAENS/Caprine/alternative methods-min.pdf
============================================================================================
A bleach solution (10%) should get a 99% kill rate if followed by nitrogen. Nitrogen fertilize alone will get around a 96% kill.
Like almost everything else, both are very short lived in their effects on soil/grass parasites.
Laboratory studies we conducted at North Carolina State University showed that 96.6% L3 barber pole larvae were not moving or dead when immersed in solutions of liquid nitrogen fertilizer (containing 32.7% urea and 42.2% ammonium nitrate (21.1% ammonium and 21.1% nitrate), corresponding to field applications of 30 lb of nitrogen per acre. Another laboratory study showed that a 10% solution of household bleach (5.25% sodium hypochlorite) resulted in 99.1% of L3 larvae not moving or dead. Higher solutions of household bleach caused lysis (disintegration) of the larvae.
https://content.ces.ncsu.edu/decrea...ures-is-liquid-nitrogen-fertilizer-a-viable-a
https://www.tuskegee.edu/Content/Uploads/Tuskegee/files/CAENS/Caprine/alternative methods-min.pdf
Bruce
Herd Master
Can the soil be tested for the worms/eggs? That might be better than the variability of individual animals ability to resist them and therefore showing a higher or lower concentration.
Mike CHS
Herd Master
I don't know if there is a soil test or not but it wouldn't be of any use telling me what sheep are better able to tolerate a worm load of x number of eggs and which ones aren't. I think part of the problem that @mysunwolf is having is the size of her acreage so if there is a way to reduce the number of parasites in her pastures, that might help her. Most folks I know are resigned to the fact that you aren't going to get rid of the parasites but you can shoot for sheep that can carry a load and stay healthy. We don't worm most of our sheep if they are staying in condition unless they have an egg count that is in the danger zone.
The 4 ewes that we kept out of original 10 haven't needed worming since we brought them home and none of their lambs have needed worming. Ringo is another that hasn't been wormed in almost two years.
The 4 ewes that we kept out of original 10 haven't needed worming since we brought them home and none of their lambs have needed worming. Ringo is another that hasn't been wormed in almost two years.
- Thread starter
- #406
mysunwolf
Herd Master
Thanks for the numbers on nitrogen and bleach @Mike CHS.
Yes, we only have 3 acres of pasture so even though we only have 4 ewes/acre, the worm load still builds up unreasonably.
Our other issue is we started with sheep that had bad parasite resistance and are working our way up. Much better to start the other way around and maintain. We literally started our current flock lines from two ewes, one who always did well with parasites and one who did not. Now it doesn't seem to matter, they all do poorly, because the wormer is losing efficacy. 10% of poor-doers are culled every year, but in the meantime we have bigger issues.
Yes, we only have 3 acres of pasture so even though we only have 4 ewes/acre, the worm load still builds up unreasonably.
Our other issue is we started with sheep that had bad parasite resistance and are working our way up. Much better to start the other way around and maintain. We literally started our current flock lines from two ewes, one who always did well with parasites and one who did not. Now it doesn't seem to matter, they all do poorly, because the wormer is losing efficacy. 10% of poor-doers are culled every year, but in the meantime we have bigger issues.
Mike CHS
Herd Master
They are hard to beat. We tried Prohibit and then Cydectin on one ewe lamb and she just kept getting worse. We finally wound up giving her Valbazene at double the recommended dosage for three days in a row which seems to have worked. That was on our vets recommendation and he said you're going to lose her one way or the other so it can't hurt. We had him run a fecal on her just to verify we were seeing the correct results. She is a cull but I want to get her clean before sending her off to the market.
Bruce
Herd Master
Doesn't that just leave them to increase the load in the pastures? Seems like though THEY can stay in good condition, they would be "Typhoid Mary" with respect to adding a bazillion eggs to the ground.
True, but it will tell you if your bleach/nitrogen efforts are moving things in the right direction. If you have a count of 1,000 eggs per pasture unit (square foot, square yard, square something else) and it goes down to 100 after the treatment, it is clearly worth doing. If it only goes down to 990, you are wasting your time and money.
Mike CHS
Herd Master
We rotate our paddocks so by the time we get back on a previously grazed paddock, the larva are dead since they had no host to keep the life cycle going.
As far as the egg count I have a year or more of history on all of our sheep and the egg count has been consistent on most of them. Based on the egg counts after the spray treatment there would be an expected decrease in the parasite load in the sheep which is all I am working toward. If it starts getting higher the animal gets wormed. You can only run so many tests before the $200 lambs you sell have cost more than the sale price. The North Carolina tests were run by dozens of people with a budget to go along with that.
As far as the egg count I have a year or more of history on all of our sheep and the egg count has been consistent on most of them. Based on the egg counts after the spray treatment there would be an expected decrease in the parasite load in the sheep which is all I am working toward. If it starts getting higher the animal gets wormed. You can only run so many tests before the $200 lambs you sell have cost more than the sale price. The North Carolina tests were run by dozens of people with a budget to go along with that.
- Thread starter
- #410
mysunwolf
Herd Master
@Mike CHS What about the data that says barber pole worms can live dormant for up to 9 months in the soil? I'll have to find the article. Basically says if it never dries out, they just sit and wait and don't die out. And very few of us can do 9 month rest periods. We aim for 90 days rest and we still rarely succeed, usually only get to 60 days before the grass is out of control.
