Running a ram with ewes, NEW dumb questions!

[Cornish Heritage]

I'm just overwhelmed by having three pregnant ewes because after reading up on it it sounds like there is so much management involved, and so many things that can go wrong.

Not really! AND I don't mean that in a big headed way. How much work & worry you put into your sheep depends on you. When we had our first breeding pair of Large Black pigs we were told to stay with the sow right through the birthing time just in case anything went wrong. Well Penny decided to farrow on a night that was -20F! The barn was FRIGID as were we even though we had a space heater on & the piglets had a heat lamp. We took it in turns to keep watch over her for 24 hours. NEVER AGAIN! She did everything without our help & that was the last time we ever kept watch over an animal giving birth unless it was through the day & we just wanted to watch.

Now we may go & check on animals before heading to bed & obviously if we see a problem we will be extra watchful but no more getting up in the night here unless absolutely necessary. The girls do the job themselves with no intervention from us. The ewes give birth outside, no barn necessary. We lambed out 36 ewes in February & only one did we have to pull. Michelle, our daughter, heard her making a funny noise in the night so came to get me. Between us we pulled out one VERY large ewe lamb that did live. I will admit that we did lose a couple lambs - big singles BUT IF the same ewes do the same thing this year they will be culled. I am not interested in having pets here - all our animals need to do the job they were created to do without me losing sleep. May sound heartless but it really is not - having to pull any animal can be a genetic/hereditary trait which we do not want.

As for the advice from the seller, I hope you have had him tested for Johnes etc before you bring him on to your farm. Bringing a new animal onto your farm without quarantining them can be asking for trouble. It can infect your whole herd & in some cases be deadly serious. Our sheep herd is closed due to all the disease that is around. Be wise! Offer to pay for the testing - if he is clear, then that is great but if he is not then you have just saved yourself a HUGE headache. Even if you are buying from a friend be wise. We just purchased a milk cow from a friend of a friend - none of us thought she would have anything but we tested her for Johnes & BLV (Bovine Leukosis Virus) on our way home along with signing an agreement that she would be returned should she have either one of these. She had BLV! We had her in quarantine & thankfully BLV is only contagious through blood (some say milk also) so she was not going to pass it on. It has been an inconvenience as we had to look for another cow but you can be sure that no other cow will be coming on here before being tested. In fact today we just found two more cows & they are being tested before we even go see them.

Even if the ram is clear he needs to be quarantined for a period of time to make sure he is OK. That is why it is prudent to always purchase more than one animal at a time. Can you not buy a wether from the same place to keep him company? We sell a LOT of animals here & we are always recommending folks to purchase more than one, not because we want to make sales but because it is SO much less stress on them.

Not trying to put a downer on your purchase as I know you are looking forward to growing your herd.

Liz

 

[Alice Acres]

(So here's her email in a nutshell~
That we cannot breed the ram to our one ewe because he is her father. This contradicts what I've read about line breeding and certain breeds. Although the whole topic of line breeding makes my brain leak.
That since the ram has been housed with another ram for the last two years that they will "miss each other".
She says, "You don't want the ram left in with the ewes especially when they are pregnant. The rams will push the ewes around and hog the food. Ewe's need extra nutrition when pregnant and nursing especially if they are still growing." We planned on running them all together all winter and then removing him in March before lambing happens.
That the ram will be aggressive with people if kept with the ewes.)

We don't usually line breed. Sometimes we do, but it's by accident (ram breeds a daughter). And truly, nothing bad has happened.
Any animal moved or sold will miss the animal(s) they have been living with.
We have not had any issues with leaving our rams in over the winter. During the breeding season, most rams lose lots of weight - they are working hard and also get too fixated to eat properly. So most of them actually benefit from eating more. And most ewes don't need significantly more food until the last month when they are pregnant. They need good quality food all along, but the volume is not really increased by large amts until the end, and then really increased when lactating. As far as the rams pushing the ewes around for food - our ewes are usually plenty bossy. We get a new ram every 2 yrs , and with decades of doing this can not think of one ram who was a food bully any more than what the rest of the sheep were.
Rams - we have had many that were human pushy and aggressive. That actually is the number one reason we move them out from the ewes - so we can be out with the ewes and not always needing to be on guard and looking over our shoulders. :/ But I feel they were that way anyway, not from living with the ewes. The bad ones were bad no matter who they were with!
The last ram we just sold was a gorgeous Dorper...but he'd been allowed to be too much of a pesty pet by the well meaning people who raised him...and he was so bad they actually GAVE him to us just to get rid of him. We used him for the 2 yrs and got great lambs, but neither Todd nor I were sad to see him go.

 

[NachoFarm]

Thanks guys! This basically reaffirms my belief that there is no real way to learn and grow in farming without doing it, experiencing it, winging it and messing it up! We don't have the perfect situation because we don't have unlimited time and money but we're doing the best we can with what we have. We can't purchase another ram because we don't have the funds or space yet, and apparently the testing for Johnes is very expensive. We can't keep a closed herd because we don't have a herd yet so we will just have to hope for the best and learn as we go.

 

[Alice Acres]

I also forgot to mention - they are all individuals.
What one animal or group does does not always mean they all do. So in the case of rams - you will see a wide range of personality and behavior, and you just need to be able to adapt to it.
Having a spare pen or section of pasture is a good thing, so animals can be moved as needed. Also good if you have someone sick, or just want to separate them for some reason. Even if you have limited space, try and make a spot that can be quickly used to make an isolated area (gates, temporary fence sections all work).

There are individual personalities, and then also a group (flock) mentality.
When you are adding animals, the flock characteristics change. Sometimes for the good, sometimes for the bad.
That is one reason we have kept old ewes who are calm and well behaved, even when they are not part of the reproductive cycle anymore. Some of them are the anchors and good influences in the flock and it was worth it to keep them around just for that purpose.

Also - if you have just a few ewes - check into renting or paying a breeding fee for your ewes. You don't have to own your own ram and deal with him year round.
For many years when I was a kid - we brought our ewes to a ram and they ran with the ram's flock (harem ) for about a month and a half...and always came home bred. We also did that for my daughter's show Cheviot ewe - we wanted Cheviot babies from her, and took her back to the farm she came from to be bred.

 

[NachoFarm]

We got into the buying a ram mess because we chose Gotlands as the breed we wanted to deal with. There's only three people in Canada that we know of who have them and that includes us! We want to keep upbreeding but in order to do so we have to get higher percentage rams from somewhere. This breeder is a three hour drive but she imports them from the US which sounds like a nightmare. I just hope she keeps bringing them up for me! I just had to pick the complicated breed!!

 

[Alice Acres]

How do you like them (breed)? Have you had them long?

I have heard of them, but never met one in person. I looked up the breed club site, and see there are 2 breeders about 2- 2.5 hours from me.

Are you getting them to go the fiber route?

 

[Cornish Heritage]

This basically reaffirms my belief that there is no real way to learn and grow in farming without doing it, experiencing it, winging it and messing it up!

LOL! You got that right And when you do mess up, don't feel bad, just learn from it, smile & move on. I can't count how many times we have "messed" up!

testing for Johnes is very expensive.

May be different up in Canada but here in the USA it is not. We have been testing our cows for BLV & Johnes for only $24 via a blood test. You can also test the milk which is even cheaper - $6 per cow.

You mentioned that your sheep were originally imported from the USA? If that is the case then I would suspect they were tested for all sorts of "nasties" before they were even allowed across the border. You may want to ask the breeder.

Liz

 

[NachoFarm]

How do you like them (breed)? Have you had them long?

I have heard of them, but never met one in person. I looked up the breed club site, and see there are 2 breeders about 2- 2.5 hours from me.

Are you getting them to go the fiber route?

They're the first sheep we've ever owned so I just think they're the sweetest and cutest! Much sweeter than my ornery, obnoxious goats.
We got them mainly for fibre but since we can't keep every lamb that's born we will probably do meat as well..not sure how I'll deal with that.

Yes, the ram was brought in from New Jersey I believe so I'll ask her about any testing he's had. He's a big strapping boy! We're very excited.

If we don't witness the act then how will we know? Has anyone used the marker harness before?

 

[Alice Acres]

They look like nice sheep

Years (decades) ago we used a marker harness, but we got away from that pretty quick. It was more work than we got benefit from it.
Our sheep all cycle within 2 months (most all at once) and get bred. We use 1 ram, so we knew who bred who. And with leaving the ram in with the ewes, if someone is slow for any reason, they do eventually get bred.

We mark on our calendar when we put the ram in w/ the ewes, and then count out and mark on the calendar when the 1st lambs could be due. If my husband or I see some action or serious interest, we add that on the calendar; but other than that it just happens

 

[bonbean01]

Don't be overwhelmed with lambing time...it is a wonderful time!!!! Yes, sometimes they need help, but in 5 years we've only had to help one and I read my refresher lambing sites with photos each year, and have a well stocked birthing kit and if you feel ready for whatever comes along, chances are you'll have to do nothing but witness the miracle of birth .... well..we do strip teats just to be sure there is no plug, and we do a clean up bedding after each and bag it and move it out to not only keep things clean in there, but also to remove any scents because of coyotes. You'll do fine and look forward to it each year!!!!!

As for seeing your ewes getting bred...our first ram Brisket must have bred only at night and we didn't see any, but then came the lambs! Now our present ram Watson does not care what time of day or who is around...he isn't shy about it...gets the job done and I mark it on the calendar.

Good luck and you are in for a super great adventure