To Disbud or Not

[marlowmanor]

I know my father has a herd that has both horned and disbudded goats in it and he hasn't had problems with it as far as I know.

 

[Livinwright Farm]

LWF - Just because the NPGA says that horns are permissible for show doesn't mean that local shows allow them on pygmies. In my area only boers and angoras are allowed to show with horns.



I answered your question on BYC and asked you to come join us here. I'm glad you took me up on the offer to join

I'll answer again for everyone here:
I personally prefer horns but my herd is a 50/50 mix of horned and disbudded. I have never had a goat get caught in the fence. My "meanest" goat is disbudded and she could do a lot more damage without horns than any with horns imo. With or without horns harm can come to any handler who isn't properly paying attention. Horns very rarely break if the goat is getting proper nutrients. And you're right most shows have a no horn policy for NDs.

It's a personal choice on your part. If you wanna show, you'll have to disbud. All other reasons to go one way or the other come down to what you believe.

Around here it is weird, adults can show pygmy goats horns intact, but 4-h will not allow horns intact. Why not let kids have experience with the breed in their natural state? Thankfully, with our farm(and apparently your's too), kids have the opportunity to gain hands on experience with horns intact goats, so they won't grow up to fear them IMO, the show circuits should treat them like the oxen or long horn cows... just cap the horns so no one could accidentally get jabbed. I think the choice ought to be up to the owner, not a registry/show circuit.

A herd doesn't have to be disbudded/dehorned in order to be show quality. I have 3 registered goats, all have horns, their pedigrees are beautiful, and I am VERY confident that their offspring will be just beautiful, have nice capacious udders on the girls & have over all wonderful conformation for showing. I also have no doubt that said offspring will all be sold long before kiddings occur. If the right pedigrees are there, and the conformation is there, then people will buy the kids. The parents having or not having horns has no basis on the kids sell-ability... People look at the pedigrees, udders, and lines.... at least, around here.

 

[kstaven]

So if any of you are on BYC, you'll likely have seen this post already in the livestock subforum! I notice that a LOT of people here have goats who still have their horns (at least from what I am seeing in pictures, so this is a great place to ask.

I am having a really hard time ultimately deciding on whether I should get the pair of Dwarf Nigerian doelings I am getting this spring disbudded (already put the deposit down w/the breeder). I have surfed far and wide over the 'net, but still after all that reading, I'm not sure still!

Pros about horns:
Natural cooling system
Can be used for defense
Disbudding is painful
Scurs from improper disbudding

Cons about horns:
Dangerous to handler/herdmates
Can get caught in fences - death of goat if not caught quick enough
Most shows have "no horn policy" (I think I'd want to show, sounds like fun!)
Broken horn = massive blood loss

These will be bottle babies (breeder does this for all kids) and I can essentially pick them up as soon as they are doing well and taking the bottle without trouble. I asked the breeder, and she will do the disbudding if it can be done (said that sometimes doelings buds aren't ready until they are two weeks old, sometimes) before they come to me. So at least that removes the having find a mentor who is willing to help me disbud. But I still have to make the disbudding decision.

The getting caught in fences is more times than not a matter od people not researching and setting up proper fences for the breed.

Horns are at there worst with very young animals. From there most issues come down to the experience and knowledge of the owner/handler/TRAINER. No head butting or rubbing as kids eliminates many issues.

Weak horns and resultant breakage is most common with goats fed an improper diet along the way.

Horn scurs can cut you to bits and inflict as much if not more damage than horns because of their deformed nature that of brings them to an edge.

In the end it is a personal decision and if you are willing to put in the training time you can safely keep horned goats.

We are rare in that we run a mostly horned dairy herd. All kids kept here are horned and the only disbudded ones are goats we have brought in from other sources.

 

[DKRabbitry]

I have both horned and disbudded goats as well. One lamancha I have, I thank the heavens for her horns. She isn't the friendliest girl, in fact she is just downright scared of us and doesn't want anything to do with people... and those handholds make dealing with her a LOT easier when we have to catch her. Trying to hold onto/catch/move the spooky disbudded goats is a pain LOL

But, since your babies will be bottle raised and friendly, that really shouldn't be an issue. I guess I will just go ahead an reiterate what everyone else has pretty much already said... If you are entertaining ideas of maybe wanting to show, you will need them hornless. I do not like showing very much, but more than once I have looked at a couple of my better conformed goats and though I could probably clean house at the local shows, but alas, they have horns. You will be horribly dissapointed if you leave them horned and then down the line are in a position where you want to show, and you are unable to take your best goat just because it has horns. In fact, it really annoys me because it is my choice and I think they still fit the breed standard so I should be able to show them. But that really is neither here nor there...

Not to mention, you don't have to do the deed I am still on the fence whether or not I want to get my own iron and actually learn how to do it, or if I want to hire someone else to do it, or if I just want to leave my kids horned. I think, around here, they will sell better disbudded... something else to keep in mind. Resale if it ever comes to it.

 

[Stacykins]

Thank you SO much all, this really helped. I am pretty sure now that even though I do like the look of horns, I will disbud. Since I want to do some showing, it really seems that breed needs to be free of horns in the show ring.

 

[kstaven]

That's what great about this forum. Ask a question and get multiple perspectives to help you out that go well beyond the do it or don't do it answers you see in other places.

 

[Queen Mum]

I don't use tennis balls. I use these:

Handlebar grips! From a bike shop. Push them on, pull them off. They stick like glue. They come in different colors. They work great! Some of them glow in the dark.

Sara
Queen Mum

 

[RareBreedFancier]

Oh my! That's hilarious! I had glow in the dark ones on an old bike.

It is however a very good idea, I think I might outfit my buck with a pair to try, if he can't get them off they will all get a set. They also look less silly than tennis balls. I might even go for the glow in the dark ones, then if he gets them off in the paddock they will be easy to find at night!

 

[Stacykins]

Sara, that is absolutely brilliant, oh my gosh! And hilarious looking too! I love the thought of glow in the dark goat horns.

 

[Livinwright Farm]

that idea!!!