University of Florida study on Papaya seeds for Goat worms.

[Bossroo]

Where did you get that information from?

I was just sharing something I had read, you seem to have more information, perhaps you could share it?

You seem to be implying that the research is a waste of time, but maybe I'm misinterpreting what you wrote.

Based on the percentages removed (78% of adult parasites and 72% of eggs), Bossroo came up with the amount of adults and eggs left over. He's saying because they didn't die, they could be resistant to it. Just like when you use a chemical anthelmintic, not all adults and eggs die...some are left and they become resistant to it.

It was a rhetorical question.

I knew how Bossroo came up with the numbers.

I was just sharing an interesting article I had read.

Fortunately, in academic research you wouldn't make the assumption that Bossroo is making. If you did there wouldn't be any reason to continue with the research.

I'll tell you one reason I found the article interesting. On this forum, people often ask about herbal or natural worming products. I've seen a number of replies that there has never been a single piece of research indicating that they are effective. Well, that's true because there has been very little to no research on the subject.

Sheep girl I found a very interesting article recently from the USDA on Lespedeza reducing coccidia in sheep. The are actually now starting to make a lespedeza pellet because of this.

I think this is good stuff

As for assumptions... I have worked at a major University Veterinary Teaching Hospital for a number of years. I have been involved in quite a few original research projects there. When one comes up with trends indicated by this type of study, one will start to see that one would create more future problems than solutions as well as loose one's credibility , and research grant money, therefore one will turn in a new direction. I have also been to a very large publicly traded animal and plant research/ development corporation. They start research samples ( hundreds per day) on the atomic and cell level,in incubaters and analized with very powerful microscopes, then use very high speed computers to determine what effects are seen . Those samples that show promice are further studied , while those that do not show promise are discarded as it would be of no or very minor significance to the public as they would be wasting time and money ,not to mention lawsuits. It takes a minimum of 7 years and up to 20 years of further research in larger numbers at laboratories, Uniersities, research farms, as well as farm field studies for any item that shows a promise of being potentially effective before being reviewed , then approved/ rejected by USDA before being sold to the public. Research costs money ... like in MILLIONS ( in PhD researchers and support personel , facilities, equipment, research grants to Uniersities, etc )of dollars and TIME. Companies and Universities are willing to invest this type of money and time in research in the hopes of making a profit in the future if the product is viable. I have 7 friends with Phd's. that have spent their entire carriers in University and private business and only 2 of them have actually had a product that have successfuly and profitably whent to market. I hope that this helps in someones understanding of research .

 

[OneFineAcre]

Based on the percentages removed (78% of adult parasites and 72% of eggs), Bossroo came up with the amount of adults and eggs left over. He's saying because they didn't die, they could be resistant to it. Just like when you use a chemical anthelmintic, not all adults and eggs die...some are left and they become resistant to it.

It was a rhetorical question.

I knew how Bossroo came up with the numbers.

I was just sharing an interesting article I had read.

Fortunately, in academic research you wouldn't make the assumption that Bossroo is making. If you did there wouldn't be any reason to continue with the research.

I'll tell you one reason I found the article interesting. On this forum, people often ask about herbal or natural worming products. I've seen a number of replies that there has never been a single piece of research indicating that they are effective. Well, that's true because there has been very little to no research on the subject.

Sheep girl I found a very interesting article recently from the USDA on Lespedeza reducing coccidia in sheep. The are actually now starting to make a lespedeza pellet because of this.

I think this is good stuff

As for assumptions... I have worked at a major University Veterinary Teaching Hospital for a number of years. I have been involved in quite a few original research projects there. When one comes up with trends indicated by this type of study, one will start to see that one would create more future problems than solutions as well as loose one's credibility , and research grant money, therefore one will turn in a new direction. I have also been to a very large publicly traded animal and plant research/ development corporation. They start research samples ( hundreds per day) on the atomic and cell level,in incubaters and analized with very powerful microscopes, then use very high speed computers to determine what effects are seen . Those samples that show promice are further studied , while those that do not show promise are discarded as it would be of no or very minor significance to the public as they would be wasting time and money ,not to mention lawsuits. It takes a minimum of 7 years and up to 20 years of further research in larger numbers at laboratories, Uniersities, research farms, as well as farm field studies for any item that shows a promise of being potentially effective before being reviewed , then approved/ rejected by USDA before being sold to the public. Research costs money ... like in MILLIONS ( in PhD researchers and support personel , facilities, equipment, research grants to Uniersities, etc )of dollars and TIME. Companies and Universities are willing to invest this type of money and time in research in the hopes of making a profit in the future if the product is viable. I have 7 friends with Phd's. that have spent their entire carriers in University and private business and only 2 of them have actually had a product that have successfuly and profitably whent to market. I hope that this helps in someones understanding of research .

Bossroo,
First of all, let me say that my wife is a toxicologist who has worked in research in the NC State University animal science department and currently for a private contract research organization in Research Triangle Park. I have a masters degree. And while it is not in the biological sciences it does give me some insight into how research works. I did have to write a thesis. And I had to defend it in front of a panel of Phd's. So, while I appreciate you taking the time to explain to me how research works, I think I've got I've got a pretty good understanding.

If I count how many Phd's we know will that make my post more relevant because I don't think the number you know is relevant or gives your arguments more weight.

Research is all about asking questions. You are always questiong, always postulating what might happen. When you stop doing that you will never have a ground breaking discovery.

Your last post actually makes my point although I don't think that was your intention.

Research takes years. In your first post you made an assumption. If worms and eggs survived then they would be resistant to the treatment in the future. That may be true. I'm not saying it isn't.

Have you even read the University of Florida study? I did say it was preliminary. Have you read the USDA report on Lespedeza reducing coccidia in Sheep? A researcher at N.C. State has shown that lespedeza hay reduced barberpole's in goats although in all fairness, the counts went back up after they went back onto pasture.

You might find this interesting, or maybe not. We actually just participated in a study with the Vet school at N.C. State. There have been a couple of incidents of e-coli at the N.C. State Fair over the last few years that have made some folks sick. The last was traced to the goat barn during the dairy goat show. We had a researcher visit our farm and take milk and fecal samples to test for the particularly virulent strain that had caused the illnesses. All animals over 6 months old participated. 17 samples all negative.

Your first post just seemed dismissive. Even your choice of emoticon. I didn't sell it as some definitive miracle. I just said it was an interesting article. And like Bonebean said, if you have no interest in natural or organic approaches, why do you even bother clicking on the link? I wasn't peddling snake oil over here.

 

[Southern by choice]

Love the post ONE FINE!

 

[nmred]

This is excellent! I just got a case of papaya from our local food pantry and was thinking of giving the seeds to the goats. Now I definitely will!