Warning, more feed questions from newbie, long post.

[Our7Wonders]

My goats are finally here! Just yesterday we brought home two nubian does from a holistic dairy goat farm. These goats, to my novice eye, appear very healthy. I can't help but wonder, however, about their grain feed. They are not on a commercial grain feed, but instead are given a grain mix in the milking stand. The mix is 2/3 oats and 1/3 BOSS. They have a little less than a cup in the morning and the same again in the evening at milking time. They have always had good quality hay free choice at all times. They are given occasional minerals, though not free choice.

From what I've gathered from here and from FiascoFarm this doesn't seem near enough for milkers. I will be drying these girls up over the next month as they are both expecting (one at the end of Feb, the other at the beginning of Mar). I've helped milk these does at the dairy for several months now and I really don't think they give as much milk as their capable of and my gut tells me it's likely due to their feedings. With 13 does she gets 2.5 gallons at each milking 5 gallons seems rather low from what I've read is typical for Nubians.

So they're here with me now and I would like to make changes, though I don't know where to start and quite honestly I'm rather intimidated at the thought of changing things on them. I know being taken from their herd and transporting were likely very stressful for them. I bought oats and BOSS just so that I'd have their exact grain mix to start with so I didn't stress them further by changing things right off the bat. I have, what appears to me, to be quality alfalfa/grass mix hay (75/25 ration). They seem to be happy with it and are content to munch it on and off all day. I have been adding a tsp of probios to their 1 cup of oats at each milking as a preventative due to the stress of moving. I'd like to start upping their grain, and at the very least, adding more nutrients any suggestions on how I should do this? I have an organic dairy feed on order, should arrive on Friday, my plan is to start mixing some of this in. I know there are no set rules for how much grain a dairy goat should get, but is their a base-line that I should start working towards?

Are the recommendations from FiascoFarm a good starting point? The grain recommended almost seemed sort of high to me. Can't too much grain cause acidosis? And even when I dry them up for the last two months of gestation, I continue to grain them, right?

I have MannaPro minerals for them is it ok to start offering that free choice immediately or does that need to be worked in over time as well? And I've read good things about kelp granules how are those generally offered? Can kelp be started immediately as well, or should that come later, after my other changes?

One more, if you don't mind. I'm very worried about ketosis (sometimes reading on the internet can cause more concern instead of alleviating it the way I had hoped). If I understand it right, a glucose source can prevent that. Can I add molasses to their water as a preventative? If so, would I add it daily or just occasionally and how much? I added a Tbsp to their water this evening just to encourage them to drink (again, worried about them due to transport and I haven't seen them drink much) and after all day long of hardly a sip of their water they sucked down all but the last little bit within 15 minutes or so. I certainly don't want to spoil them so that they won't drink water without molasses, but healthy does that make it through pregnancy and postpartum with healthy kids would be great!

Lots of questions, I know. Sorry, I'm a complete newbie! If you made it through my entire post I thank you very much for your time and patience!


Debbi

 

[helmstead]

Congrats!

As far as the minerals, you can go ahead and offer those free choice right away.

With my milkers, they get as much grain as they want while they're on the stanchion. For my Nubians...that can come out to a full standard scoop! I feed my milkers a mix of goat pellet, alfalfa pellet and Calf Manna. Then they get a quality alfalfa/clover/orchard mix hay. In my opinion, you get out what you put in.

You might have to play with the feed while you're drying them off. Some does will dry off no issue, some need to be taken off all grain in order to dry off. With high production does, you can use a teat infusion to help things along...especially since they're bred - you don't want to short change their babies.

As long as you make all changes slowly, acidosis shouldn't be a problem. Make sure your goat feed has a low corn content - that will help avoid it. I agree, oats and BOSS isn't a very complete diet...I'm sure changing them over to a complete feed will help tremendously with their next lactation.

 

[ChksontheRun]

Hey Debbie, I know what it is like to have so many questions with a new mini herd and not really know where to turn. I am sure there will be lots of people chiming in that have much more knowledge about goats than me as I have had mine for only 4 months. I will say that if your goats seem to be in good condition... I mean nice round rumens, hip bones showing but not sinking in, able to feel their spinal processes, but not sticking out, then their caloric intake has exceeded their output. It will be difficult to increase their milk production by upping their food intake at this point and you mentioned drying them off anyway, so now is not the time to up their caloric intake, but keep it about the same.

Each herd and each goat is different in the amount of food it takes to stay in good condition it seems, you will have to experiment on that one. I think you are wise to make the change in their diets slowly, but they really are pretty hardy animals so I think they will do fine. Remember, at this point, the most important thing for them is a constant source of good hay.

Hope you get some more complete answers from some more knowledgable goat owners.

I wish you well with your goaties. We really love ours and I know you will too!!!!!!!

 

[freemotion]

The philosophy of some holistic owners is that feeding the dairy animal to peak capacity is not in the animal's best interest, even though it does increase milk production, often dramatically. You said the goats look healthy...I assume you are referring to their weight as well as their overall condition. So it has been working for that owner.

If you want more milk, yes, gradually increase their grain. But not while you are attempting to dry them off.

I don't feed for peak capacity either, by my Alpine doe gets about double what your Nubians were getting, along with chopped veggies when available and beet pulp and alfalfa pellets when I don't have veggies for her. She gives a gallon a day at peak production, about 2.5-3 quarts right now. I do slightly sprout my small grains to increase the protein for her, since milk has a lot of protein.

My 1/2 Nubian doe (dry now) only got a cup of sprouted grains on the stand, along with veggies/beet pulp/alfalfa pellets, just enough to keep her occupied while I milked. She was in great condition on less grain.

By all means increase their grain for more milk, it will be fine, I just wanted to let you know that there might have been different thinking by the former owner, especially since the does are in good shape.

 

[Our7Wonders]

Thank you for the replies, I appreciate your willingness to make it through my long post!

I should have been more specific - I'm not at all trying to increase their milk supply now. Their grain amounts seemed low and I assume that's at least part of the reason for such a low milk yield from the does at the dairy.

When I milked them both today I ended up with just shy of a quart - combined. From what most people report from their does, that seems low. I'm ok with that for now as I want to work towards drying them up over the next few weeks. I'm hopeful that we might be able to increase it next season. I am wonderiing, though, if I should work towards increasing their grain now for nutritional purposes (not for milk yield). Molly (Fiascofarm.com) feeds her does in milk 2-3 pounds of grain, her bred but dry does get about one pound of grain. My girls are getting no where near those numbers - and because it's only oats and BOSS, there are no additional vitamins added. Is that OK? Should the amounts look more like Molly's? I know I need to learn not to worry so much. They seem in good condition (though I don't know that I'm assessing it correctly). Neither seem fat at all, yet I can't see ribs or spine, though I can feel the spine easily through their coats. They have glossy well formed droppings (did I just use the word glossy to describe poop?) with no signs of clumping and they seem content munching there hay throughout the day.

It's hard to know what is best for the does with no real experience yet. I can read others opinions all day and all night (and I have, LOL) but they're all so different - it's difficult to formulate a solid plan.

I'm going to add the free choice minerals right away. We soak our own grains in buttermilk or whey overnight for our breakfast, so I think I'll soak their grains too - can't hurt, right? Then I'll slowly mix in some of the bagged feed when I get it - I think I'd feel better knowing they were getting some supplemental vitamins, at least until I'm more confident in reading my does and their health. If they weren't preggo I might not worry so much - I want to make sure we're doing all we need to for those little babies!

Thanks,
Debbi

 

[ksalvagno]

If you want to dry off your does, don't increase their grain. Once they are totally dried off, if you want to increase their grain for getting ready to birth, do it then.

 

[Our7Wonders]

Thank you, Karen, I wondered about that. Appreciate the advice!

Debbi

 

[freemotion]

Are they first fresheners? Those milk amounts would make perfect sense if this is their first lactation.

You really need to feed each individual according to their needs. Your hay quality and whatever forage/browse you have available may be very different from Molly's, mine, or the farm you got them from, or even your next door neighbor's. So if they seem to be in good condition....relax! You're doing it right! And rejoice that it takes so little to keep them in such great shape. Just monitor their condition as we go into winter and adjust accordingly.

I like to add variety to all my animal's diets whenever possible....keep your eyes open for opportunities to add something fresh into their daily meals, taking time to get them to adjust to it. I gleaned hundreds of pumpkins from a neighboring farm, and am now harvesting some mangels I planted (fodder beets) and am feeding the green tops a bit at a time as I bring the roots into the cellar. The beets will be chopped and fed as the pumpkins run out. I can usually get through February before I run out of fresh veggies for my girls.

And yes, they will benefit from the increased nutrient availability of the soaked grains, just as you do.

 

[Our7Wonders]

Thank you Freemotion - I appreciate your input, I have read many of your posts as I've lurked over the last few months waiting for my goats to be bred, and very much like your "style" of husbandry.

One of my does has freshened twice and the other three times, so they aren't new to milking by any means. I'm brand-spankin'-new to goats and wouldn't know a good goat if I were staring right at it, but 2.5 gallons combined seemed low to me per milking of 13 does - could be various factors that cause this, I'm not sure if grain alone would increase yield. Hopefully by next season with some TLC and perhaps a little more grain, I can increase that amount. We are a large family (7 kiddos) so we're definately going to need more than the one quart!

I so appreciate eveyone's feedback! I can tell already I'm going to have LOTS of questions in the coming weeks/months. There's a wealth of knowledge on this board, and it's such a relief to have experienced goat owners available for help.

Thank you all!
Debbi

 

[freemotion]

In that case, I'd run a fecal on them. Even with pink inner eyelids....then relax! And see what happens next spring.