worried about disbudded goat kid, was it done right?

[becksy]

Got our goat kid disbudded yesterday at 16 days old I know I may have left it a bit late. It took me a while to look up the info, make a decision and then get her in to get it done. This was the only vet willing to do this in my area. I rang up and discussed this with him, he said there were 3 methods, disbudding paste, the heat method and surgery. Which I knew about because I had researched them all. So upon going there I had decided on the heat method, namely the disbudding iron. Then when we got there the vet said he was going to use the paste. Nuh uh! not on your life buddy. I told him then and there that I didnt want that method used. Then his offsider and he had a discussion about getting hold of a heating iron. bloody hell. So they werent prepared and they didnt have the necessary tools it seems.

We were told to leave her there and he would fit her in before lunch. So that's what we did.

When we picked her up the vet explained that he had quarterized them (burnt them) but it looked as if she'd had surgery and that the area wasnt sealed by any burning method at all. Im confused I dont know much about these things, only what I've been reading on the internet. A day later and she's been scratching at her wounds. She has seemed a bit off colour and a hot but it has been a warm day. There was a clear liquid oozing a little from her wounds but since she's been scratching its turned a little more of a yellow colour. I live in Australia and I've found its hard to get information and products here for goats. I want to give her something today to help stop the infection if it's in the process. Is there something I can buy to put on the area? Maybe I might have to go back to the vet and get some penicillan injections. Dont know if I should trust him again...

update: rang the vet and he suggested clean the area with water and put some regular antiseptic on it. Does this sound right?

 

[lilhill]

If you can't visually tell that her buds were burned, then they weren't. I know of no way to conceal that. If they surgically removed the buds, then I would give her antibiotics to help with any infection or at least ward it off. Your feed store probably sells penicillin and I'd start her on that twice a day for 7 to 10 days. Ten days best. I don't think I'd trust that Vet either. Sounds like he isn't being upfront on what he did and that's not good. If you have Furall, you can spray her buds with that, too.

 

[cmjust0]

I'd like to see pictures, if possible.

Sometimes when you burn them, the iron will go completely through the skin and down to the skull which leaves an empty space where the hornbud used to be.. If the goat starts itching and scratching and kicking at the wound and scrapes all the burnt scabby stuff off, I can imagine it looking a bit surgical -- especially if you were already suspicious that the vets might get tricky and not burn them like they said they would.

Not saying that's definitely what happened...just saying I'd like to see pics.

 

[becksy]

When we picked her up from the vets she had 2 solid pink circle areas on her head (one was slightly raised more than the other, they were slightly moist looking with them oozing a bit at the edges in some places, but there was no blood.) it looked to me like he just removed the buds, it seemed suspicious to me because Ive looked at a lot of pictures of kids that have been disbudded and none of them had pink parts or any ooze. From what Ive seen and read it seems that when burning to stop horns growing the area around the bud should be sealed and there should be no discharge if it's done properly, this wasn't the case with our kid. Even if they were to scratch at it, and she is scratching at it. Would it be possible for her to scratch all of those areas off before we picked her up? I did try to take pictures earlier but our camera is playing up and my mobile phone camera pictures aren't clear enough but I will some how try and take some pics, the areas have scabbed up now. She didn't seem too great earlier today and I ended up following the advice of the vet and applying a regular antiseptic.

She has picked up since I first posted and seems to be quite happy for now. She is feeding normally now and is playful. Even if she ends up with no infection then there's still the possibility that she'll end up with scurs if it wasn't done right. As I said we only have 2 vets here and only one was willing to do her, so we had very limited options.

I really hated the idea of putting her through the pain and having the procedure done, I knew there was a possibility of tetanus so she had her tetanus shot also on the same day as having her buds removed (well I hope she did anyway) and I knew if the procedure wasnt done right she could end up with scurs. I'm was thinking today maybe I should have just bought the iron and did it myself to make sure it was done right but I dont think I could stand hurting her myself What do you do when all options have run out? sigh.. He did say if the buds were to grow back to bring her back and he would re-do them.

With the Penicillan what form would they sell it in? Just wondering if it comes in other forms other than injection.

I will look for Fural and see if they sell it here.

thanks so much for the replies

 

[cmjust0]

Without seeing pictures, the fact that her wounds were circles could very well mean they burned completely through the skin, down to the skull, then lifted the encircled horn bud out. That's how some folks do it...a little rougher, IMO, but there's much less risk of a scur that way. And, yeah, if you do it that way, it'll ooze if only from fluid being brough to the area on accout of the burn, then creeping under the skin and out onto the exposed skull.

I've accidentally burnt to the skull before -- it's VERY easy to do, especially with a brand new iron! -- and the wounds do ooze and will almost always bleed a bit, especially after they scratch at them and scrape their heads against things...which they invariably do. I've yet to seen one that didn't go to rubbing its head against scratchy surfaces (OSB or rough-sawn lumber, for instance) after being disbudded..

Even if you get that perfect copper ring with no burn through, they can still scratch the now-dying horn bud and very easily expose whatever blood was left in it before the blood supply was cauterized off. I mean, the skin literally slips right off after being exposed to the heat in the center void of the iron...

 

[lilhill]

I agree. Pictures would help tremendously, but if the copper/pink circle is there, they were probably burned.

 

[kimmyh]

It sounds normal too me. If she was here I would spray the area with Furral and leave it alone. If they numbed the area, she will scratch more, but many goats will scratch their head and make it bloody after disbudding, even though nothing wrong was done in the disbudding process. No matter what has been done, there is really nothing more I would do about the horns/buds for at least 6 weeks.

 

[becksy]

Her wounds seem to be healing well now scabbing up nicely. Im still applying the regular antiseptic it seems to be working well for her so I'll continue with that for now. I've organised for a friend to come over with his camera tomorrow, but wether he gets here or not is another matter. But hopefully I can provide some pics then. The ooze around her wounds has dried also. Will just have to see how things go now, hopefully she doesnt get scurs. I'll upload the pics tomorrow if they're taken.