# Anyone here have St Croix?  Update > > St Croix ram lamb pix.



## rockdoveranch

I was searching craigslist for White Dorper and came upon a listing for St Croix sheep.  They look very interesting, especially the rams.

Does anyone here have them, and/or what do you think of having them as meat sheep and easy keepers


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## Beekissed

My girls were St. Croix mixed and bred back to St. Croix rams.  Love the breed, easy keepers, hardy to the max and the cross gives some legs to the ewes but the breed is not as meaty and compact as Katahdins or Dorpers.  They are supposed to also provide more milkiness in the cross.  

I love their manes and the black markings they sometimes throw.


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## aggieterpkatie

They look neat with the manes. I just read on the St. Croix Hair Sheep International Association that body spots larger than a quarter disqualify them.  Bee, were the St. Croix yours were bred to spotted?  If not, that probably came from the Katahdins?


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## rockdoveranch

Thanks Bee and Aggie!

I am having a fit over the manes on the rams!

I have also found someone selling Dorper/Croix mixes and am now having at total cow over them!  I called the seller and someone is supposed to be getting them on Sunday.  He asked for my phone number just in case they are a no show.

Even if they are sold I want to ask him if we can drive out to visit his ranch.  He processes his own sheep and rabbits and I think I could learn a lot from him if he is open to the idea.


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## Beekissed

aggieterpkatie said:
			
		

> They look neat with the manes. I just read on the St. Croix Hair Sheep International Association that body spots larger than a quarter disqualify them.  Bee, were the St. Croix yours were bred to spotted?  If not, that probably came from the Katahdins?


Disqualify them from _what_?    Actually, the farmer I got my gals from loves the spots and high color in his herd and has selected St. Croix rams for just that trait.  Most of his rams are mainly white, tall and with those regal, flowing manes.  

He has stated he will keep my Black Betty's lamb ram for breeding because he has a lot of black facial coloring and black inside his ears.  

The Katahdins he has seem to have more brown spots and ticks~like a roan~ than actual colors...but most of the St. Croixs he has seems to have only white with the occasional black on knees and inside the ears.


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## aggieterpkatie

Beekissed said:
			
		

> aggieterpkatie said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They look neat with the manes. I just read on the St. Croix Hair Sheep International Association that body spots larger than a quarter disqualify them.  Bee, were the St. Croix yours were bred to spotted?  If not, that probably came from the Katahdins?
> 
> 
> 
> Disqualify them from _what_?    .
Click to expand...

It disqualifies them from meeting the breed standard!  Not a big deal if you want meat, but it could be a big deal if you want to show or sell breeding stock.


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## Beekissed

Gotcha!  Out in these parts most folks are just breeding for meat to sell.  I can't even begin to tell you where they would have a sheep show unless it is at the local fairs....and they don't even _have_ a hair breed class!


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## rockdoveranch

Gotta tell you, I am still having a fit over the St Croix and the St Croix/Dorper mixes.

I emailed the seller about visiting on Friday, but have not heard back from him.  There are a few breeders here in Texas and I may have to start looking around for available rams and ewe lambs either St Croix or the mixes!


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## rockdoveranch

Okay . . . I am having a cow over Dorper/St Croix mixes born March of this year!

The gentleman who had the craigslist Dorper/St Croix mixes sold the lambs he had listed, but he just called and emailed pictures of these lambs that he will be selling.  I have first dibs.

What do ya'll think?  The black is a ram lamb.  The white is a ewe lamb.

I am having a cow!


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## carolinagirl

personally, I would hold out for pure ones. Are you familiar with the genetics behind Katahdins?  they are St. Croix crossed with many other varieties.  So basically those sheep aren't too far off from Katahdin mixes.  St. Croix are supposed to be pure white, no other color at all.  If you cross those on what you have, you will dilute the St. Croix even more.  That's my opinion....I would wait on the real thing.


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## Beekissed

I think they are beautiful!!!  They have good confirmation and good coloring and you can't go wrong with that cross, though I must admit I like the Kat/St. Croix mix the best.  The ram is absolutely beautiful and should get his mane later on...can't wait to see it grow in!


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## carolinagirl

But if the ram is the black one and only half St. Croix, there is no guarantee that he will ever get a mane, is there? They ARE beautiful....but they also look exactly like my Katahdins.


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## Beekissed

Nope, no guarantees...depends on how much Dorper genetics he's taken on.  They look like my St. Croix/Kat mix gals but they have that wonderful legginess of the SC.  I hope he does come into his mane...he would look so incredibly regal with a black mane hanging down.


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## aggieterpkatie

Well to be honest I'm not crazy about that ram. I dont' think he's got very good conformation for a breeding ram. Sorry.  :/  He's very slopey. Maybe it's just the pics...but I think if you're looking for a good ram you want to get the very best you can afford.  Yeah, his markings are cool, but I personally don't think I would buy him.  


  JMO


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## rockdoveranch

Okay folks.  I woke up at 9:30am after a horrible HORRIBE night of nightmares.  Not about sheep thought, thank goodness . . . I guess, but about dying and then county and a stranger encroaching on our land.  Then I woke up with asthma, and feeling sick all over and wondering if I can get Pertussis again after having it last year.  

So, I must say, after last night and sitting here on the nebuilizer the posts have sort of put a smile on my face.

You all have given me something to think about.  

To back up a bit, we first got our Barbado to keep an old Ag discount on one track of our land and then eventually get it on the other tracks.  Had no idea at the time our venture would become profitable.  I also had no idea what that weird looking large herd of sheep/goat looking animals were along one of the roads we traveled often.  5 of those weird animals turned out to be our future Barbado starter herd.  They were about 8 months old when we got them.  The elderly gentleman we bought them from put them all in a pen, about 300 of them, and had his son grab a few, however, he made sure we got a ram that looked like would grow a nice set of horns.  He turned out to be the ram in my avatar and has thrown off some very desirable rams, some with variegated horns, some pied.  I would not trust the Old Man for a second, but he is majestic.  We paid $20 a lamb and brought them home in dog crates we borrowed from the gentleman.

After 3 droughts in 3 years, this being our worse, we decided last year that we should get sheep for our freezer although we are told Barbado lamb meat is mild and better than store bought lamb.

So, we ventured out and bought 1 White Dorper ram and 2 White Dorper ewes last June.  With the exception of the one ewe and her lamb, I think we got screwed, but maybe not had the ram survived.  The breeder did recommend him over the other ram lambs he had.

I am going to do some more research on the web and we will go to see the lambs this Saturday.   Money is an issue right now.  Everything seems to be breaking on us, but we do need a ram.  I am not about to put The Old man in with the Dorper ewes.

The shepherd with the available lambs has only Dorper/St Croix crosses, although he said he will be looking for a Dorper ram in the future.  I have not asked yet, but maybe he likes to lean more towards the Dorper genetics.  He is Australian with a GREAT Australian accent.  He had Dorper/St Crcoix crosses in Australia and missed them, so started up a herd here.

Thank you all SO much for your input!    Just kidding!


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## rockdoveranch

Here is a picture of the lambs he sold last weekend.  The dark one is also a ram lamb.


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## Bossroo

The white ewe looks decent enough for producing meat lambs if bred to a Dorper, Suffolk, Hampshire, or Southdown. For economic reasons... Since today's sheering costs far exceed the wool prices, I wouldn't keep any of her non Dorper bred female offspring for breeding, only eating. That black ram has poor conformation for a meat type ram and as for the mane... one can't eat it. Also, I don't see even a hint of testicles on it in those photos. So, if I were to buy it ( I would pass), I would only pay butcher price for it, then invite it to freezer camp.  Good  luck !


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## carolinagirl

I am not so sure putting the Old man in with the dorpers is such a bad idea.  You would have kids that have hardiness of the barbado but an increased carcass size.  I am putting my Barbados Blackbelly ram on one of my katahdin ewes and breeding the other 3 katahdins to the katahdin ram.  I want to monitor carcass size among the offspring of the various breedings.  I will put the BB ram on all 4 BB ewe lambs along with the one Katahdin.

Oh, I LOVE that spotted lamb!!


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## rockdoveranch

I will DEFINITELY check out the testicles.  He is a month older than our ram lambs and I know what to look for and feel for.  I also want to make sure I feel no signs on horns coming in.  

I would have liked to have gotten my hands on the spotted ones.  

Carolinagal, I have never seen the Old Man injure a ewe as he is "in love" with all of them, but I have seen him take down lambs for what looks like no apparent ram reason other than to make sure they knew he IS THE Old Man.  He does not injury them, but I have seem them knocked into fences and trees.  For years he was always allowed to roam free with the ewes.  No longer though. 

Our Dorper ewes are in the Barbado herd now and like all ewes they challenge each other with head butts and pawing, but I just worry about the Old Man with the Dorper ewes.  Plus we need a ram that is not Barbado to breed with our Barbado ewes.  Thanks for the suggestion though.


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## Beekissed

The SC rams my farmer had were "slopey" also...I think that is just how SC rams look, lean and angular.  They don't have the nice, wide haunches one would see in the Kats or Dorpers or woolly breeds.  

I really love the looks of that black ram lamb with the long tail!  Beautiful!!!  Wonder why he docks some and keeps some?


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## Julie_A

rockdoveranch said:
			
		

> Okay . . . I am having a cow over Dorper/St Croix mixes born March of this year!
> 
> The gentleman who had the craigslist Dorper/St Croix mixes sold the lambs he had listed, but he just called and emailed pictures of these lambs that he will be selling.  I have first dibs.
> 
> What do ya'll think?  The black is a ram lamb.  The white is a ewe lamb.
> 
> I am having a cow!
> 
> http://www.bencalloft.com/pix/DorperStCroix.jpg


I love the looks of that little ram!!! I had a few Joseph/Katahdin crossed ewe lambs and they were black and white like him.


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## rockdoveranch

Beekissed said:
			
		

> I really love the looks of that black ram lamb with the long tail!  Beautiful!!!  Wonder why he docks some and keeps some?


I asked the seller about the long tail and he said he left it long because he liked the white tip.  He said he docks the tails like like they do in Australia.  Sort of the Boxer dog look.  May have said that earlier.


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## Beekissed

Does he dock so he can get a better price at auction or just because he likes how they look?  _Not_ docking the tails seems like one of the perks of having hair sheep, to me.  After seeing just how much my gals used their tails, I was so glad they didn't have to be docked!  I can't imagine what all those docked sheep are doing about keeping off flies and shooting the field berries off the wool...the tail seems to give them some distance, but it could be just my imagination.


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## rockdoveranch

From what the shepherd said I don't think he takes sheep to auction.  Sounds like he sells just through ads.  When we talked about tails he said he does it the way they do in Australia where he is from and where he had sheep.  I cannot wait to meet him.  He has a great accent!

Thanks to people here,   I am putting a list of questions together to ask him when we get there on Saturday.


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## rockdoveranch

Update.

Last night we got our huge (Great Dane sized) wire dog crate ready in the truck with a tarp zip-tied around the top and 2 sides so we could get an early start to go look at the lambs.

We leave this morning and less than a mile down our horrible dirt, sand, pebble, rock, wash boarded road we hear a bearing (sp?) going out.  Sounds like it is in the alternator.  We had to turn around and go home.  We are waiting to hear back from the Ford dealer so we can make an appointment to bring it in, or hopefully not, have it towed in.  I cannot find a little "smiley" to put here to show how sad I feel at the moment about the truck and not being able to drive the 2 hours each way to at least look at the lambs and talk sheep and rabbits with the seller, and possibly bring lambs home.

I did call the shepherd as soon as we got back to the house to say we are not coming, and had a WONDERFUL conversation with his wife for a couple of hours.  She and I have so many things in common.  What is so interesting is that she would not have been home if we came today, but hopefully will be home when we go next week.


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## aggieterpkatie

What a bummer about the truck having problems!!!  But maybe it is for the best so you can meet the wife!


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## rockdoveranch

Thanks Aggie!


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## rockdoveranch

This is a 4 month old St. Croix ram lamb that is about 2 1/2 miles away.  The breeder told me that all the St. Croix here in Texas are out of one breeder who is relocating to another state.  

You cannot see his testicles in either picture.  I did ask about them and they are there.  I like that it appears his hair is more dog like.

Our truck is in the shop now.  It was the water pump that was going, so it was a good thing we did not try to go look at the other lambs.

So . . . what do ya'll think?


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## aggieterpkatie

I like him better than the black and white one.  I think it looks like he'll shed out (in the future) way better too!


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## carolinagirl

See?  Maybe that's why you couldn't get to see the other ones....this is the one meant for you!  He is gorgeous!!


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## rockdoveranch

Thanks Aggie and Carolina for your input!  

I asked for some pictures of is back side, and poor little ram lamb, he was greatly humiliated as pictures were taken.  I think he is lovely, if you can say that about a ram lamb.  

I am going to try to download the pictures he sent today.  The thumb nails show me what I wanted to see, but if I can open them, I will post them.


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## rockdoveranch

Here is his back end.  







We are buying him.  He is standing next to an Alpine goat.


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## carolinagirl

YAY!! I am glad you are getting your St. Croix ram.  He looks like a nice one too!


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## rockdoveranch

I am excited!  We are headed out in the morning to go take a look at him.

I spoke with the secretary of the St Croix  sheep registry and she gave me some great information and tips for picking a lamb.  She does not know the shepherd who is selling the lamb, but she does know the herd the lamb's parents came from.  SO COOL!  

I cannot wait for tomorrow!


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## WorthItFarms

I envy you. I want St. Croix sheep so badly. None nearby though.


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