# Getting a Pyrenees Pup



## Tiss (Jan 4, 2013)

We are going to look at and hopefully get a great pyrenees pup this afternoon. I'm more nervous than I was when I gave birth to my human children. 

He is from working stock and has been raised with goats and chickens. I plan for him to live inside our 2 acre fence with the goats and chickens. Any last minute tips I need to know about raising/ training him?


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## Southern by choice (Jan 4, 2013)

Do you know what you are looking at to assess a LGD pup? That would be my first question. Many people are under the impression that because the pup is coming from working stock all the pups are going to be great LGD's. That is not true. The breeder should be showing you the dogs in the field and showing you the strengths of each pup. The breeder should be able to see at 8-9 weeks which pups may not be as suited to LGD work. Pup should have at least 1st worming and at least one puppy shot. Check eyes, and teeth. Proper bite is important. 

The better the pup to start with the less training the pup needs as far as a LGD goes.

GOOD LUCK on your puppy find!  LGD's are awesome! and pics please!!!


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## Tiss (Jan 4, 2013)

Thanks for the tips. They've had shots and been wormed. The mama dog will be there so I'll be sure to see how she works. 

I'm not sure exactly what to be looking for. One site I read said to go for the pup who is laid back and watching. Any tips are appreciated.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 4, 2013)

I prefer to go for the watcher. The watcher WILL WATCH. They are attentive, usually sitting, observing...YOU. The dogs that come up and want a bunch of attention... nah not for me. If you move across the field I am watching the pup that will trail and still watch the stranger in the field, the one who is attentive to all that is happening. The pup that will remain within 10 ft at all times with the master watching what you are doing.  If a pup is more interested in playing with the other pups than sitting back, I do not want that pup. Shy pups that are timid are a no go. Of course this is hard to describe over the internet.  If the watcher pup comes up checks you out, lets you say hi, then walks away and returns to watch mode ...this is a good dog. Patrollers will be very different, they will stand alert, looking every which way, usually, and often will travel the perimeter and then return. Gauge the pecking order if possible. Pups that spend all their time playing with or trying to dominate the other pups tend to be harder to manage on a small farm/property.

Hope this helps a bit.  Do not be surprised if the breeder does not know how to assess a pup, many don't ... that's okay it *doesn't* mean the dogs are not good! 

The Great Pyrenees is a breed that will steal your heart! You will want to take them all home!!!!!!!!!


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## Tiss (Jan 4, 2013)

I've really liked all the GP's I've met. I've only had one dog in my adult life (we adopted a mutt) and it didn't work out so well so I am really nervous about this. 

I just have too much invested in these goats to lose any of them! I will keep your tips in mind as I check the pups out.  They are about 8 weeks. Will it be okay to move it right into the barn? I can fix up a little bed or doghouse for it in a stall. I want it to learn that the barn is its home and the goats are its family. We are in Georgia so we're not talking arctic temps.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 4, 2013)

A place in the barn is best. What kind of goats do you have?
You will probably want a divider for goats and dog so they can see each other. The pup won't hurt the dog but the goats can hurt an 8 week old pup! If the goats have never been raised with a LGD than you need to get the goats acclimated. Supervised time with goats/pup together so the goats understand it is not a predator. Goats will butt usually at first...this is okay as long as they are not trying to pummel the pup. You want the animals to be able to see each other. 

I always wash a pup and dry it thoroughly before bringing it to the farm area. Bio-security reasons.


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## Tiss (Jan 4, 2013)

Good tip. We'll bathe it. 

I have 2 lamancha does, a minimancha doe, a Dwarf Nigerian buck on lease here and 2 Alpine does that will be here in a couple weeks when we get their positive pregnancy test. All of the goats have been raised on farms with dogs before. I can put a bit of fencing across a stall door and let the pup live in there until they all get to know each other. 

The goats are all disbudded too so at least they won't be able to hurt the little guy too badly butting.


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## Tiss (Jan 4, 2013)

We brought one home and I just made the mistake of going up to the barn to check on him. Now he's crying. Poor little guy.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 4, 2013)

He will be fine.... will you?  I'm sure you are already lovin' him!  ...and that's it...your not gonna tell us anything else? 

Ok, so when will you give us our fix for pics???

BTW- I just saw it ...


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## Tiss (Jan 4, 2013)

No, I'm not going to be okay  . Can't stand the thought of him crying all night. I know he'll get over it and I'll only make things worse by going back out there. But it's hard. 

I did a supervised introduction between him and the goats. He shows no interest at all in the chickens which is good and the goats are more interested in him than he is in them. Kat, the herd matriarch, managed to give him a head butt a little harder than I would have liked, but he took it in stride. He's in a stall now with a thick hay bed. I'll do another round of supervised introductions in the morning.


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## terrilhb (Jan 4, 2013)

Oh how adorable. Just to cute.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 4, 2013)

can't get the grin any bigger. DH is peering (no pun intended  over my shoulder AWWING! Just said... boy do they steal your heart!

  and this is worthy of the.... :bun :bun :bun :bun :bun :bun :bun :bun 

I'm in    all over again!! Now I'm going to have to go back and look at all my baby pics! 

Well, he did all the right things. The chicken issues don't show up til usually after 5 months. The way you have described the interaction...that is good! 

I know it's hard to leave him but remember you can do house time eventually. Leave him where he is, even if he is whining. Was he the first to go from the litter? 

Just a hint... weigh him every week, track his normal weight gain for awhile. Don't forget to continue his worming. 

So, what is his name...or do you not know yet??

See the puppy at the top of your screen? That is "Pearce Pastures" dog she just picked up at Christmas!!!! He is Charlie...we all watched the story of her braving a snowstorm to pick him up... from another BYH member! "Poorboys"

We love LGD's here!!!


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## Tiss (Jan 4, 2013)

So sweet! The breeder was down to 3 boys when I got there. He had people drive in from Louisiana and get 2 last night! 

They were all friendly and very well adjusted as was the dam. When the breeder let them all out of the pen, this guy sniffed us out with his mama, tail wagging, then went exploring the perimeter. He'd check back in with us, then go on his way again. I hope we made the right choice. He sure is sweet!








He's probably destined to look peach-colored not white for the rest of his life with our red clay. We haven't agreed on a name yet. The boys and I think Stone/Stoney but DH is not sold on it.


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## bonbean01 (Jan 4, 2013)

Awwwwwwwwwwwww....totally adorable!!!!


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## Southern by choice (Jan 4, 2013)

I need more land...so I can get more dogs!   He is too cute! 


Bon.... NoNoNo!


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## bonbean01 (Jan 4, 2013)

Since I'm allergic to shedding dogs, and my property and flock are not big enough to warrant LGDs, I won't get to have any...but...I love them, and love reading about them...the training, etc...

So...I am living my desire to have them through you all 

I thought of what I'd read on here about an LGD pup and noticed that the big pup we rescued off the road was showing some real possibilty in the LGD area...sigh...he was so sweet.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 4, 2013)

Tiss- your pup is so sweet looking! Love the boys! and I'm a female dog person normally! I like your name pick!...for what it's worth.

I know what you mean by the permanent stain...my F pyr tends to roll in the clay.   Take a look at what 2 of mine did, they don't even look like pyrs, they even have it on there noses. one of my two pups... orange  He is actually embarrassed, he gets that way when he goes in the duck hole and comes out muddy too. Silly dog! This is "Badger" 







Now I' gonna look at my "D"'s baby pics. Your boy reminds me of my "D"! I love badger markings!


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## bonbean01 (Jan 4, 2013)

poor thing...really does look embarrased...but still so cute


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## Tiss (Jan 5, 2013)

He looks so sheepish!


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## Southern by choice (Jan 5, 2013)

So.. have you loved on your baby today?  Let him see your routine with your goats...take him out with you.


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## Pearce Pastures (Jan 5, 2013)




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## Tiss (Jan 5, 2013)

So far so good. He escaped under the wall of his stall last night into the open stall next to him. It ended up being okay. He's not dead and he and the goats seem to have worked out many of their issues. 

In fact while I was milking this morning, he decided to take a nap in their breakfast. 







Then I started to walk the fenceline with him. He (and all the goats of course) followed along. We made it down one side then he turned back, started crying and tried to figure his way back into the barn. I helped him find his way into the closed stall. He promptly crawled under the wall and plopped down for a nap right in the open stall.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 5, 2013)

So sweet! Great picture.  Kiss him lots and lots...it will not ruin him!


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## GLENMAR (Jan 5, 2013)

Awwww.  Reminds me of when mine was that size.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 5, 2013)

Tiss- some of my babies... taken awhile back...

http://www.backyardherds.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=11707&p=15  starting at post 146

here he is as 8wk pup i think post 14?   http://www.backyardherds.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=23482&p=2


"D" is my favorite pyr ...in the WHOLE WORLD!


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## Tiss (Jan 5, 2013)

So cute!


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## ThreeBoysChicks (Jan 5, 2013)

He is awesome.  Looks like you did good.


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## Tiss (Jan 7, 2013)

He's so cute, I just want to be out there with him. It's so hard to leave him to the goats!  We've decided to call him Asher. 

I've been checking on him during milkings (and sometimes once in between). He can still squeeze under the gate to the milking parlor and does when I'm milking. I can't wait for him to get too big to do that- shouldn't be long. 

This morning, he was curled up with the leased buck, Buddy. I wish I could have gotten a picture, but he got up when I tried to get close enough. 

He's doing great I am just scared of ruining him. :/


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## Southern by choice (Jan 7, 2013)

You will not ruin him by loving on him! Leave him with you while you milk. Remember he is a baby and gentle corrections are best. Lots of praise!


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## Tiss (Jan 7, 2013)

He loves to clean out the strip cup! My son's silkies (who also squeeze under the gate) are not happy to be losing their snack. 

I guess I've just read so much about being sure they bond with the goats that I'm afraid to have him bond with us more. He's such a sweet baby.


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## CocoNUT (Jan 7, 2013)

How adorable is he?!


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## Tiss (Jan 8, 2013)

He's doing so great! He hardly even whines when I leave him anymore yet is always happy to see me come visit. The goats are very tolerant of them since they all came from homes with dogs. Kat, the herd queen, is doing a great job keeping him in line. She's gentle but firm with him. 

He chased a couple chickens this morning which didn't make me happy. I laid him on his side and told him to "leave it" then shifted his attention to the end of the rope on the kids' rope swing.  I can't have a chicken killer!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DuFNKjiJo1M


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## Southern by choice (Jan 8, 2013)

Tiss said:
			
		

> He's doing so great! He hardly even whines when I leave him anymore yet is always happy to see me come visit. The goats are very tolerant of them since they all came from homes with dogs. Kat, the herd queen, is doing a great job keeping him in line. She's gentle but firm with him.
> 
> He chased a couple chickens this morning which didn't make me happy. I laid him on his side and told him to "leave it" then shifted his attention to the end of the rope on the kids' rope swing.  I can't have a chicken killer!
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DuFNKjiJo1M


*NOT TRYING TO BE NEGATIVE...... you WILL lose chickens.* How many ??? don't know. Your boy eventually will grow up. Expect chicken issues to start somewhere between 5-7 months and continue til somewhere between 18-24 months! It does not matter how much you introduce him now. I have a poultry business so losing birds is a real serious thing for me! I had to look at the issue long term...we are in a heavy predator area, and I mean unbelievable! I made the decision to accept the loss in the short term so that long term I do not continue losing birds. We have goats, lots of different kinds of poultry and now sheep too!  Utimately I would lose more livestock and poultry to predators than I would having my LGD's snag a few. Yes my LGD's have killed chickens, mostly because they want to play, no fun once its dead. This is pretty rare now and my 2 boys are 13 months, and 1 girl 11 m, 1 girl 9 1/2 months.


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## Tiss (Jan 8, 2013)

I think I'm prepared to accept that. If I start to see him playing as he gets bigger, the hens may have to be confined to their runs. I hate to do that because it means a lot more food for them. 

Will having the chickens confined while he's going through his puppyhood interfere with his acceptance of them in his space (the henhouses are inside the goats' fenced-in acreage)?


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## Tiss (Jan 26, 2013)

I want some advice before I over-analyze this. Asher is 9 weeks old now. He has lived with the goats since we brought him home and they've done a good job keeping him in check. Until I brought home two new Alpines. They are almost a year old, but smaller than my other girls. 

Since the older does would chase the new ones to establish pecking order, they've taught Asher that chasing them is okay. The little girls are finally starting to stand up to him, but he thinks a little bit of rough-housing is fun and will play back instead of backing down right away. I've put a few toys out for him now and he seems to be enjoying them. 

I watch him out the window a lot and honestly, he seems like a perfect angel with them when I'm not out there. He just lays in the pasture while they graze and chews on sticks and stuff. I think he gets excited and tries to show off when I'm out there. 

He is my first LGD and I am a bit paranoid about behavior problems. Does all this sound normal so far?


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## Southern by choice (Jan 26, 2013)

*Very observant of you... you also went with your gut that said... not good! Glad you did not just dismiss it.*


If he does this when you are out there you must correct immediately... 1. with a harsh tone 2.with a quick grab and yank him backwards and down  you can also put a long 30 ft lead on him and if he even starts to play with the goats pull hard enough to knock him off his feet.

Yes it may be a pup... but a good LGD with good LGD traits does not do this. When these bad behaviors start do not think of it as "well it's a pup.. it will outgrow it." This is not true... generally it escalates. Correct quickly.


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## Tiss (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks for the tips. I just got back in from working with him. I went out to pet the little Alpines. After a while, he got into a playful mood and tried to engage them. I gave him a stern no and pulled him back. As usual, he gave me his belly when I did that. We did that three times and he gave up on them. 

I stayed out there observing a while longer. One of the Alpines was eating hay and he came up behind her (edit to add: came up just checking things out, not playing). She butted at him twice and he laid right down behind her just like he should. He's a quick learn. 

I will keep an eye on the situation and keep training. I truly don't know how people just throw the dogs out with the goats and ignore them besides giving food.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 26, 2013)

That is the problem Tiss! 

To many people really have not been taught how to raise an LGD.
There are different traits that LGD's will have and some pups born  to working stock still may not be suitable for a working LGD.
There are some pups, that carry certain traits, that literally can go straight in and never a problem. Unfortunately many breeders and buyers are unaware of what traits to look for in a pup. 
That is not breeder bashing either. I love to support our LGD breeders and helping educate them is a pleasure.
There are pups that are more suited for teams, others more suited for large, massive land to patrol, others suited for smaller family farm environments, and some pups are best suited for pets. 
Recognizing these traits at 6-8 weeks...although up to 10 weeks is  better... would help prevent so many issues that arise later.

A common response is "it just needs another dog".  Although I prefer teams and do agree that it is better to have two, that does not correct a problem and can cause even more grief. What happens when you get another pup that also was never evaluated and then end up with two dogs that are incompatable for their environment.

I think one reason you don't see these evaluations is because many LGD breeders are really breeding for their own farms and never go any further than that. Nothing wrong with it, it just makes it difficult for new LGD owners. People tend to give advice based on what they did and what worked which is great, but not the whole picture.

These dogs are eager to please yet distinctly different than non-LGD working dogs. The ridiculous notion that you do not have much contact with them is silly at the least. Some of those philosophies came about when LGD's were rather rare and were used to patrol thousands of acres, these dogs did not have much human interaction and were often in teams of 5-7 dogs at least, forming their own pack order and maintaining order within the pack at all times. Your average LGD owner is not in this kind of setting and therefore needs to select for their environment .

It is good your pup rolled on his back and exposed his belly... sign of submission. Good work!


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## Tiss (Jan 26, 2013)

It's really good to hear that it's okay to do training and it's okay to feel like he needs it and not just leave him to his own devices. Seriously, so much of what I read about LGD's has me wondering when to step in and when not to. Part of my concern with the chasing thing was do I wait for the goats to make him back down or do I step in and make him back off. I'm glad stepping in was the right thing. 

I have young kids here all the time and it's important to me that the dog is submissive and well behaved. He's already trained to sit at our feet before he gets attention, to sit and wait while I'm milking and he'll get the strip cup when I'm done. He's getting pretty good on a leash. I lay him across my lap a few times a day and rub his belly. He loves it and it's got him giving me his belly all the time, even after I correct him. Now I have to get him to quit chewing on my pants legs. He wants to chew everything!

He's already very good with the older does and likes to sleep curled up next to the rent-a-buck, Buddy. 

I'm sure I'll be asking you many more questions. I value your advice.


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## Straw Hat Kikos (Jan 26, 2013)

Sounds to me like you're going to be a good LGD owner.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 26, 2013)

Give him a deer leg.. skin and hair off just give him the whole thing. I forgot how old he is... but if he is starting to teeth at least make it something good. My dogs love deer legs. The marrow is very good for them just make sure it is raw NO COOKED BONES!

You were smart to intervene, it's one thing if the does were putting him in his place but the newbies were already being chased by the other does, and your pup might have also been picking up that "cue" to run them off also.  You would be the better judge if he was trying to "protect" the original herd or play with the newbies. 

I am a strong believer in still teaching them some manners... how to walk on lead, sit, down, and   stay! Stay is a general suggestion to a pyr though. 

About the young kids here thing... that can be a bit tricky. It is one thing if you bring him out of his field to see the kids etc it is a whole other thing in his field. Really think this one out. By 4 months of age my 2 male pyrs did not care for outsiders in their field, and when children would run after the geese and laugh and schreech the dogs immediately would start off toward these "outsiders"... NOT TO BITE..but to run them over or "bulldoze". They were not family or "herd" to the dogs and therefore seen as intruders. Outside of the field they are fine with outsiders. Believe me when I say LGD's do take their job seriously. My niece was always able to be in with them because she was always here, but after a sickness and the summer etc and the dogs not seeing her for almost 3 months they no longer recognized her as acceptable. Two of my LGD's I can bring people into the field and they are fine because we are there. My other two LGD's NOPE... NOT happening. These two teams have different personalities and different guarding traits.


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## Tiss (Jan 27, 2013)

Asher was being playful with the Alpines not trying to run them out of the yard. As for deer bones, I happened to have a bunch of leg quarters out in the yard that the chickens pecked the meat off of after we processed. I swear, Asher has rounded most of them up and dragged them to his lair (aka his stall in the barn). 

We had another session training today. First I worked on "leave it" with treats. Then we went to pet the Alpines. He tried only once to play with them and backed down right away when I pulled him back and said "no".  I think he'll get the idea. 

Interesting story last night. We had some friends over and were out in the pasture showing them the animals. Asher was laying down chewing sticks in the middle of the group when DH's friend Steve playfully grasped my 8-year old by the back of the neck and gave him a little shake. Asher went right on alert. He got up, stiffed Steve's leg and parked himself between Steve and my son for the rest of our time out there. I only hope he'll grow up to guard my goats as well!






The little Alpines





Asher enjoying a dirt bath





His Scooby Doo. Way more interesting that jeans cuffs, thank goodness. 





You want me to do what?


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## Southern by choice (Jan 27, 2013)

Very good signs! Attentive, alert, discerning... sounds like you have the makings of a great dog.
Next time you do hooves or something that the goats will make a fuss about see how he reacts.

If this pattern continues you will need to possibly adjust your bringing visitors in. Just a heads up. 
I personally go with the dogs temperament, I do not ever want to over-train or go against their particular strengths.

I love the pictures! Don't ya just    your pyr!!!!


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## Tiss (Jan 28, 2013)

I love love love him but will be so glad when he's out of the chewy puppy stage. He's working some new rawhides now. 

I brought him out on the driveway while we cleaned out the car this afternoon and threw a tennis ball for him. Good boy played for about half an hour and then disappeared.....back up to the barn. I guess he'd been away from the herd too long. 

I love it when he instictively does the right thing like that.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 29, 2013)

he looks like such a "big man" ! Love pyr's! nothing like em.  


BTW- like your open barn!


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## Tiss (Jan 30, 2013)

Thanks.  We don't need much more here in south Georgia. Ventillation in the summer is more important than heat in the winter here.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 30, 2013)

your boy is darlin'  ... before long you will find you might need another! 

with all the mud here I haven't been able to bring mine in the house at all. I really miss my cuddle on the couch with my boy "D".


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## Tiss (Mar 20, 2013)

A picture of Asher and the bucklings just because I haven't posted pictures of him in a while. I was so nervous when I brought the bucklings home since the little one "BOGO" is so tiny, but Asher is great with them! He actually follows them around to make sure they don't run into trouble with the big girls.  

This is kinda gross, but "BOGO" decided to see if Asher was his mommy and started nursing, um, you know. My poor dog stood there looking at me with big eyes like "Mom, a little help here!". He knew better than to be rough with the baby. 






Tuesday, we had a several homeschool families out to the farm instead of going to the park like we usually do on Tuesdays. I can't sing Asher's praises enough! He was so gentle with the children, even letting a 4 year old walk him around on a leash!

Pyr's do make life better!


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## Southern by choice (Mar 21, 2013)

he is really growing up!  It is amazing how at such a young age they will stick with those goats!

Pyrs are like potato chips...can't just have one ya know 


Badger and his bucks... inseparable!
http://www.backyardherds.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=24213&p=1


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## Ranchhandok (Mar 25, 2013)

What a cute baby. I'll be looking for guard dogs this summer. We will be moving our small herd to a larger pasture that isn't as close to home.


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