# 4h for 5 year old?



## marlowmanor (Feb 27, 2012)

I got to thinking about 4H again and possibly getting Logan (he is 5) into it. From what I am seeing on the 4H site for our county it looks like they have to show meat goats. So now I have a few questions.
1) Do you think a 5 year old could handle showmanship of a meat goat?
2) Would it be better to get a bottle fed goat to help with bonding? Or would a dam raised goat be fine?
3) What age would you suggest? Does gender matter?
4) Would a meat goat get along fine with our 2 pygerian wethers? I know the size difference will be significant.
5) What should I look for in a 4H goat? Conformation, breed, etc.
Of course I have to broach the subject to DH and see if Logan is interested in doing it. I just noticed on the website that there is a 4H show 3/12 nearby. Would it be a good idea to see if we could make it to that show and let Logan see how things work and see if he is interested in participating? I would love for my boys to get into 4H. It would get them more involved with the goats (other than chasing them around!) and it gives us an excuse to have goats!

Is there a better option for a 5 year old to show? I just figured goats because we already have the set up for them. 

I know 20kids has children in 4H, hopefully she will share her opinion and be able to answer some of my questions. RPC would know about 4H too.


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## RPC (Feb 27, 2012)

1) Do you think a 5 year old could handle showmanship of a meat goat?
*Yes, as long as you work really hard with him and the goat to make sure the goat is properly trained. They are really strong and if they are not comfortable they could drag him threw the ring and he may never want to show again. Getting in the ring for the first time, with any goat, you never know what to expect. Some of our best trained ones freak out and our wildest ones have been perfect in the ring. Each one is different.*
2) Would it be better to get a bottle fed goat to help with bonding? Or would a dam raised goat be fine?
*Again it all depends on the goat. We have had bottle babies that are awesome pets but stubborn when it comes to walking. But as long as you are active with the baby when it is born a dam raised kid can be just as friendly as a bottle baby. I spend time every day with our dam raised kids. I think atleast for the first year, since you are trying it out, Get a bottle kid so you can bond. If he does well and enjoys showing, maybe start raising your own so he can see them from born to market it is a great lesson.*
3) What age would you suggest? Does gender matter?
*We try to have ours be around 6-8 months old when they are shown. I think that puts them in the best market classes. But for a 5 year old I would probably go a little younger so it is more his size. Kerigan's market wether last year was 7 months and 96 pounds. She is 10 and he was huge for her. I will include a picture so you can see size wise what I am talking about. Wethers will usually grow a little faster but I have found are also a little more docile at that age. My does normally start to get a little attitude at that age. Kind of like the teenage girls showing them LOL. *





4) Would a meat goat get along fine with our 2 pygerian wethers? I know the size difference will be significant.
*I think as long as you introduce them when they are close to the same size they will be fine. Feeding time is when I would be worried about your pygerian's getting pushed to the side. Other then that I would think all should be well.*
5) What should I look for in a 4H goat? Conformation, breed, etc.
*Good conformation, overall muscle but that will be a little hard on a baby, width (chest, top, and rear), length, depth of body, and rack shape. Got all that LOL. Also a nice straight top line. I personally like a boer cross market goat, usually crossed with a nubian.*
Of course I have to broach the subject to DH and see if Logan is interested in doing it. I just noticed on the website that there is a 4H show 3/12 nearby. Would it be a good idea to see if we could make it to that show and let Logan see how things work and see if he is interested in participating? I would love for my boys to get into 4H. It would get them more involved with the goats (other than chasing them around!) and it gives us an excuse to have goats!
*I would definitely go to the show so both you and him can see what he will have to work on and do with his goat. That will also tell you if he is interested. Even if DH is not keen on the idea it would be a fun day for you guys and something different. Maybe when it is over, take him to look around in the barn and hopefully there may be a really nice breeder you can briefly talk to about showing. It is better after the show once they are done getting everyone ready and aren't as stressed.*
*
Well I hope that answers your questions if you have anymore I will answer them as best as I can. Your state I think shows differently then we do. Our kids have to be in 3rd grade in order to show animals and you can only show at 1 county fair a year, unless it is an open show.*


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## marlowmanor (Feb 27, 2012)

Thank you for answering my questions. If DH is okay with us trying it I will be calling the county extension and finding out more information. I did figure out that the 5-6 class is just showmanshi, they don't have to know the parts of the goat and all that like the older kids. I also looked at the date on the open show I mentioned. It is actually the 3/17-3/18 which is a weekend that DH works. So if he okays us trying it with Logan I would have to figure out someone to go with us, or have DH try to get one of those days off work. I'm thinking I could arrange for my dad to go with us to the show maybe, which woudn't be a bad thing since he is a goat man and could help with questions and talking to breeders. 

Trust me if we ever got the finances to move to somewhere with a few acres that we could raise goats on I'd be jumping on it! Although I like the smaller breeds I wouldn't mind doing the boers even if it was just a small herd for 4H needs.


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## RPC (Feb 27, 2012)

We have 14 and that is including the babies. We just have a small herd for our 4-H needs and that is about it. Each year we grow though because they are just so addictive. Hopefully next year with having 7 does kidding I will be able to sell a couple kids and start to make money. So far the last 5 years have just been throwing money into the fire, but it has been a fun journey and the kids have learned so much so it has all been worth it.


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## Mamaboid (Feb 27, 2012)

.....sticking nose in where it wasn't invited......

Meat goat+ smaller size+ easier to handle for child=Fainter


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## RPC (Feb 27, 2012)

I agree that could be a good breed for him.


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## marlowmanor (Feb 27, 2012)

Well at least boers are easier to find around here.
I did notice that the show in March is an open show where the kids can show female sheep, cows, or goats. It only listed females though which is why I asked if it mattered if you did a wether or a doe for the show.
I'm figuring he would only show at the county fair. I have to find a local 4H group to join if we do it though and I am sure tehy can supply me with tons of information and possibly even guide us towards sellers with good stock. 
I know there is someone with boers just up the road from us and a few others nearby too. There are tons posted on CL too. I've actually been looking at a nice looking black headed white/black one that someone is selling. He is so pretty!


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## marlowmanor (Feb 27, 2012)

Mamaboid said:
			
		

> .....sticking nose in where it wasn't invited......
> 
> Meat goat+ smaller size+ easier to handle for child=Fainter


I'd be fine with a fainter too if it was allowed! Yet another breed that isn't too hard to find around here.
I have no problem with you answering too. I just mentioned 20kids and RPC because I knew those 2 had 4H experience.


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## RPC (Feb 27, 2012)

The hardest part is not looking at the color and looking at the quality. We still get blinded here and there but are getting better at it.


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## marlowmanor (Feb 27, 2012)

I'll have to let Logan choice what he wants since it will be his goat anyway if we do it. I just don't want another predominately black goat! I have enough fun trying to figure out which goat is which on the 2 we have since they are both black!


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## RPC (Feb 27, 2012)

HAHAHA yea and this first year you really want him to have as much fun as possible it is not about winning ever. It is about having fun and learning something at the same time. That's what I tell the girls, now that they are getting older I wonder if they believe me. Taylor is getting really competitive and I let them pick their own. Somehow Kerigan always beats Taylor and she does not like her little sister beating her at all.


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## terri9630 (Feb 27, 2012)

For other animals.....  Check with the extension office. Around here the "cloverbuds" (5-9yr olds) are only allowed to show chickens and rabbits and only in the showman ship classes.  They aren't allowed to make sale until they are in regular 4-H at 9yrs or 3rd grade.


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## marlowmanor (Feb 27, 2012)

RPC said:
			
		

> HAHAHA yea and this first year you really want him to have as much fun as possible it is not about winning ever. It is about having fun and learning something at the same time. That's what I tell the girls, now that they are getting older I wonder if they believe me. Taylor is getting really competitive and I let them pick their own. Somehow Kerigan always beats Taylor and she does not like her little sister beating her at all.


I want him to have fun with it. I would hope that having him in it would peak the interest of his younger brothers too. Then when they are old enough they know what to do and already have the interest in it. I want my kids to have the experiences with livestock. I loved growing up with goats. I never did 4H, but almost wish I had been given the option. I am really thinking that if DH gives approval to try it out I will let my dad know and have him help us find a breeder and pick out a good kid. He raised boers for a hear or 2 but went back to his minis. He's been raising goats for over 20 years so he know what a healthy goat looks like and would be a good resource to have on hand when choosing a goat.


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## marlowmanor (Feb 27, 2012)

terri9630 said:
			
		

> For other animals.....  Check with the extension office. Around here the "cloverbuds" (5-9yr olds) are only allowed to show chickens and rabbits and only in the showman ship classes.  They aren't allowed to make sale until they are in regular 4-H at 9yrs or 3rd grade.


I will be calling the extension office to get details on what can be showed, where a 4H group for him is to join, and all the details if I can get my DH to agree to it. I'm hoping to go to the open show in March too so that Logan can see what goes on in the show and I can see if he is interested in it. Only problem I have run across with the show is that DH works that weekend so I would have to figure out someone else to go with me to the show (I will not go alone with 3 kids!).


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## RPC (Feb 27, 2012)

HAHAHA I don't blame you I would not go alone with 3 boys 5 and under either. Well good luck I hope it all works out for you because I believe 4-H is the best youth organization out there.


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## marlowmanor (Mar 5, 2012)

So I talked to our local 4 H agent today. Found out that he can't show till age 9. Guess I jumped on that wagon a little soon!  He can do some simpler projects though. I will have to talk to DH about it again. The biggest issue we have right now is 1)the closest club is a 30 minute trip away. 2) The meeting days for them are one of the nights DH works which would mean I would be alone with the kids. So now I really don't know if I want to try to see if Logan is interested in pursuing it right now or just wait till he is older. My other thought it that he starts school this year and that is a big change, I really don't want to have too many changes at one time going on with him. I don't know that at this young of an age he could handle that many responsabilities at one time.

By the time he is old enough to show all 3 kids will be old enough to join 4H! That may actually make is easier. Maybe by the time he is old enough to show some animal we will be moved and have more room for critters!

I'll keep y'all updated with what we decide to do.


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## 20kidsonhill (Mar 5, 2012)

Mamaboid said:
			
		

> .....sticking nose in where it wasn't invited......
> 
> Meat goat+ smaller size+ easier to handle for child=Fainter


FAinter may be a great meat goat, but you can't walk into a meat goat class and expect to stand anywhere except at the bottom with a fainter.  Although I don't believe there are any rules against it.


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## 20kidsonhill (Mar 5, 2012)

marlowmanor said:
			
		

> So I talked to our local 4 H agent today. Found out that he can't show till age 9. Guess I jumped on that wagon a little soon!  He can do some simpler projects though. I will have to talk to DH about it again. The biggest issue we have right now is 1)the closest club is a 30 minute trip away. 2) The meeting days for them are one of the nights DH works which would mean I would be alone with the kids. So now I really don't know if I want to try to see if Logan is interested in pursuing it right now or just wait till he is older. My other thought it that he starts school this year and that is a big change, I really don't want to have too many changes at one time going on with him. I don't know that at this young of an age he could handle that many responsabilities at one time.
> 
> By the time he is old enough to show all 3 kids will be old enough to join 4H! That may actually make is easier. Maybe by the time he is old enough to show some animal we will be moved and have more room for critters!
> 
> I'll keep y'all updated with what we decide to do.


I was wondering about the age, because many fairs that I have been to are for ages 8 or 9 and up, ours is age 9. I would wait to join 4H until the year before he can show, then You all can be involved in it for 1 year and start to get a feel for some of it, Go to the fair and spend some time in the barns and go to the shows for a couple years before he is old enough to show. That will be very educational for both you and him.


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## marlowmanor (Mar 5, 2012)

20kidsonhill said:
			
		

> marlowmanor said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That sounds like a good plan. I wanted to go to the 4H show this past year at the fair but DH was working that night. I may have to see if it will work out to see a show this year.

ETA: I'm beginning to wish I had been able to do 4H when I was a kid. I bet I would have loved it. With my love of animals it would have been a great fit for me. Well at least I can give my children that opportunity.


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## aggieterpkatie (Mar 5, 2012)

I would be worried about a fainter fainting at the fair.  So much going on, and it's hard to lead a goat if it's on its side!


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## ksj0225 (Mar 5, 2012)

What county are you in?  My little one is 5, she did cloverbud last year and will be in novice this year.  She will also be starting the circuit this year.  She also showed in the open show at the North Carolina state fair last year and will be doing the youth and the open show at state fair this year.  Our county (Pitt) has a minimum age of 5.  Only 3 shows on the eastern circuit have minimum ages and that is 5 the rest don't have minimum ages and the girl I co-produce with her neice will be showing in the circuit and she is 2.  And she will probably show better than my 5 year old, LOL!!!


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