# I know nothing about cows!....Should that stop me from getting one? :(



## Celina (Jun 4, 2010)

Hi all! 

I've always wanted a family milk cow, but know nothing about what it actually takes to keep one. I've looked around online this morning and I think I want a Jersey (smaller, beter milk)

Heres the kicker. I don't want a milk cow just for milk. I wanna love her and hug her and kiss her and squeeze her too   In other words I want a family who pet who gives me milk, therefore I want to raise her from a baby then have her bred later. Is this insane? 

We just bought 10 1/2 fenced acres that we're preparing to move to. How many acres of pasture is needed per cow? 

Any and all advice/info that I could get from people with experience would be wonderful!


Ps (I wanna name her Petunia) lol I'm so excited


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## glenolam (Jun 4, 2010)

This is the exciting part!

I know nothing of cows, either, but luckily my husband grew up on his grandfather's farm and knows a little bit (not to mention his grandfather lives next door to us!).

We have three Hereford beef cows, all supposedly bred and should calve in July or August.  I have goats for milking.

Our three beef cows are currently pastured in about 3 acres of land, but we're expanding to add a front field we have and so their pasture would end up horshoeing around our house and yard, if that makes sense!  We don't have any open fields besides two in the front to hay, and don't have any hay equipment, so we plan to block off one side at a time to let the grass grow and help our hay bill.  It's more in the winter that it gets expensive.

I would think that buying a calf and raising her would be a good idea.  That way she has time to get to know and trust you, not to mention calves are usually less expensive than adults.

She, of course, could always use a friend!


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## ksalvagno (Jun 4, 2010)

I would probably start with going to dairy farms in your area and really talking to the farmers. See what is involved in keeping a cow. Find out what kind of feed and hay you need to feed. I would actually look for the farm that doesn't have a lot of cows because what they probably do to take care of their cows is different than a major dairy farm. Good luck with your search.


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## apdan (Jun 4, 2010)

ok.. I grew up on a medium sized dairy so I am gonna see if I can help a little  A cow is kind of like having a horse, they eat the same type of hay, they get grain, need water (obviously) and they do need some type of shelter. If you plan on milking her you would want a barn where you can tie her up inside to milk during the winter months so both of you aren't freezing your butts off! I would personally recommend a Jersey, they are nice little milkers and tend to be more docile then your beef and holstein cows. I have a cousin that owns a jersey and they just carry the pail out and milk her where she stands in the pasture!  If you raise one from a calf you would have more of a bond with her but then you have to look into getting her bred so she can become a mama and you can get your milk  If you get just one though I would recommend either raising her with a steer or with a goat of some sort so she dosen't get lonely. Hope this helps you a little bit!  If you have any other questions let me know I can try and answer them for you!


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## apdan (Jun 4, 2010)

ohhhh and another thing to seriously consider!!! Cows don't take vacations, holidays, or weekends! Once you start milking they milk at the same time EVERY DAY  not matter what until you dry them off or until the dry up themselves!  just another thing to consider!


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## WildRoseBeef (Jun 4, 2010)

Celina said:
			
		

> Hi all!
> 
> I've always wanted a family milk cow, but know nothing about what it actually takes to keep one. I've looked around online this morning and I think I want a Jersey (smaller, beter milk)
> 
> ...


Welcome.

The thing with cows that you and every beginner MUST understand is that they are not meant to be alone.  If you buy a cow that has come from a herd of other cows that she has been in contact with and socialized with and take her away from that social group, you will have a very depressed and ill cow on your hands.  With that I say this: if you want a milk cow, get another pal for her, preferably from the same herd or the same farm.  A weaned heifer is fine, but NOT a bull.  A steer is okay if you want to grow him and then slaughter him for beef.  But a heifer is better because she will be able to grow into a mature cow that both you and your "new" cow will bond with.  

I say NO BULLS because putting an inexperienced cow person with a bull could end up in a devastating train-wreck waiting for a place to happen.  Bulls are dangerous, period.  Coddle a bull and you will be ending up being rushed to hospital with broken bones when he gets older and his testosterone levels start to sky-rocket.  Should your cow give birth to a bull calf (if you buy a pregnant cow or have her bred and calve her out on your farm), band it ASAP. If you wish to have your cow bred in order for you to start producing milk, DO NOT BUY A BULL!!! If I were you, I'd send those two cows to a farm where they can be bred to a calving-ease bull (a bull that has the genetics for low birth-weight calves), or have them AI'd (artificially inseminated).  

I have to caution you on the coddling you'd like to do with your future-pet: don't overdo it.  Cows are not lap dogs nor kitty cats: they are much heavier and stronger than you, and can hurt you even if they don't mean it.  If you coddle them too much when their calves, and don't have any boundries nor limitations nor rules for them as they get older, you may get yourself into trouble.  But I'm not saying to not to coddle her and make a pet out of her.  Just, don't over do it.

Lastly, with your inexperience with cattle and calves and the unknowns of what's involved, I would completely avoid the raising a calf-to-a-cow thing you are dreaming of.  Dairy calves are quite fragile and need a heck of a lot more care than you can imagine.  They can be more prone to scours and pnuemonia and other diseases at their baby-stage of life than older calves (those older than 3 months of age or more) and mature cattle are.  You have a much higher risk of losing your little heifer calf to sickness than you would raising a dairy cow or purchasing a weaned heifer.  So personally, but in all honesty, yes I do think it's insane.  Especially from where you're standing.

The common rule of thumb for cows on pasture is 1 cow per acre.  But since we have no idea where you live, we can only assume that this would be the adequate stocking rate for you.  10.5 acres is enough for a couple cattle for a whole grazing season, but preferably you should only limit that amount of acre to smaller portions that these two can graze on.  It just limits spot-grazing that cattle tend to do when exposed to a large pasture, by eating the good stuff over and over again and leaving the not-so-good stuff to grow and mature.

Cows need water 24/7, as well as salt mineral.  Depending on where you live, and if you get cold winters like I do here up north, good hay for several months of snow and cold is a must.  Unlike beef cows who only produce milk for thier calves for 6 months of the year and need twice the nutrients that they would normally need when dry (not lactating), dairy cows need a high quality diet for most of their lives.  Good quality legume-grass mix hay and supplement feed like oats or cracked corn is just an example of what your dairy cows need.

Shelter is also a must.  You certainly can't milk a cow out in the pouring rain in the mud, or in any other bad weather conditions.  And cows also hate being out in inclement weather.  A barn and/or a small shed big enough for her to and her bud to fit in would suit her just fine.

So with all that, good luck, and don't be afraid to ask questions: no question is a dumb question, remember that!


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## Celina (Jun 5, 2010)

Thanks for answering guys!

I hadn't thought about her needing a friend. It's not a problem to get 2 females just off of mama's milk. (Petunia and Violet  ) We have 8 acres of wooded areas and open pasture (cross fenced) with a spring fed pond, and a 10x12 barn with a huge door that they can have. 

I have a 4 year old and a 3 month old baby (I'm a stay at home mom) I'm not goin anywhere so I can def dedicate the time to the cows. I'll milk in the morning before hubby goes to work and then again at night after supper. That would be about 12 hours in between and he can keep the kiddos while I'm amilkin.

I'll probably milk one one year and the other the next. (whacha think?) Might let my oldest get into 4h or something with them.

When I say I want a pet I don't mean I'll have them sitting beside me on the couch watching tv  I just want them to trust me, come to me when they hear me come home, lick salt from my hand, ect. My family has had horses, I know big animals are big and can do some damage if they take a notion to.

We live in Texas, bout an hour from Dallas. Winters aren't that bad. Summers are quite toasty, but theres plenty of shade and a pond. 

Theres also a feed store close by. I'll have the happiest cows in the county  :bun

I'll def have them bred like mentioned. 

Does any of this sound off? Am I missing anything?

Thanks sooo much!


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## WildRoseBeef (Jun 5, 2010)

Celina said:
			
		

> Thanks for answering guys!
> 
> I hadn't thought about her needing a friend. It's not a problem to get 2 females just off of mama's milk. (Petunia and Violet  ) We have 8 acres of wooded areas and open pasture (cross fenced) with a spring fed pond, and a 10x12 barn with a huge door that they can have.
> 
> ...


Not at all. I think you have it pretty down pat, IMO.


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## ksalvagno (Jun 5, 2010)

Is 10x12 enough room for 2 cows for shelter?


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## ohiofarmgirl (Jun 5, 2010)

WildRoseBeef  - GREAT post! thanks for all the wonderful info

Celina -- you might want to "start small" with goats if you arent used to bigger stock. i think i'm a repressed cow person, but i love having my dairy goats. one day there will be cows, oh yes. 

either way, let us know how it goes.


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## mully (Jun 9, 2010)

The best part of what you want to do is your heart is in it. If you care and love your animals they thrive and what they give back to you fills your heart. Do your research and take your time choosing a breed then go find your animals from a good breeder. All the best !!


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## amysflock (Jun 9, 2010)

I commend you for wanting to jump right in with a family cow. I wish I was home more...I'd love to have one.

That said, I'd recommend you do your research before you buy. Dairy cattle - even a family milk cow for your own use - are a lot of work and a huge commitment. I would suggest getting a book or two, sitting down and reading up...I have beef cattle and love Storey's Guide to Beef, so I would imagine their dairy version is also a good resource. Another one full of family-cow specific information is "Keeping a Family Cow" by Joann S. Grohman. (Google it to find the book...you have to order from her.) I found that book both fascinating AND full of lots of excellent cow care information, especially around birthing and lactation and the nutritional needs around that time.

You may want to do more research on breeds, too. Jerseys are gorgeous, but they are HUGE producers. If you only want enough for your own family, maybe a Dexter might be a better fit. Just a thought.

Regardless, enjoy this exciting part of your initial journey into cow ownership!!


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## Celina (Jun 11, 2010)

amysflock said:
			
		

> I commend you for wanting to jump right in with a family cow. I wish I was home more...I'd love to have one.
> 
> That said, I'd recommend you do your research before you buy. Dairy cattle - even a family milk cow for your own use - are a lot of work and a huge commitment. I would suggest getting a book or two, sitting down and reading up...I have beef cattle and love Storey's Guide to Beef, so I would imagine their dairy version is also a good resource. Another one full of family-cow specific information is "Keeping a Family Cow" by Joann S. Grohman. (Google it to find the book...you have to order from her.) I found that book both fascinating AND full of lots of excellent cow care information, especially around birthing and lactation and the nutritional needs around that time.
> 
> ...


Thank you sooo much! I had no idea the Dexter breed of cattle even exsisted! They seem like a better fit for us. I've done nothing but read about cows for a week or two 

Much more to learn, but I def know more than what I did a couple weeks ago. Gotta start somewhere I suppose.

Thanks again to all!


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## Celina (Jun 11, 2010)

ohiofarmgirl said:
			
		

> WildRoseBeef  - GREAT post! thanks for all the wonderful info
> 
> Celina -- you might want to "start small" with goats if you arent used to bigger stock. i think i'm a repressed cow person, but i love having my dairy goats. one day there will be cows, oh yes.
> 
> either way, let us know how it goes.


I would love to get a goat or 4, but that would mean putting up new fence (the fence on the property is new) I don't really want to pen them up.   The property is actually set up for cows. The guy we bought it from has like 150 head of cattle on the adjoining 400 plus acres. He used to open the gate to our property and let the cows graze in there so it's already cow proof.

Maybe someday I'll have a milk goat, I hope.


I'm origionally from Ohio, oh how I miss it


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## goodhors (Jun 11, 2010)

From another recent cow owner, there is a BIG learning curve!  

A friend trying to get her dairy cow to milk, bought a free-martin heifer, spent almost a year owning, raising it, before discovering that she could not be bred or used for milking!  So getting a "used cow" who is already broke for hand milking, has produced calves, been a good mother, might be something to add to your list.

Jersey is a nice breed, older cows from the dairy across the road could be inexpensive, used to being milked, easy to handle.  You might consider using part of her milk, morning or evening time which is handier for you, and leaving her have a calf to nurse the rest off her.  She has cow company, you are not overwhelmed with quantity of rich milk to deal with.  She would need to be stalled or penned away from the calf half the day, so you would get some milk from her too.  

My lessons are that heifers like company.  They should come dehorned, leadable, unless you want to be a cow trainer.  Cattle should be used to being handled, so they don't freak when you want to do things with them.  This starts when they are TINY.  We got our heifer when she was almost a year old, but she was basically unhandled, had never been apart from her herd.  She was not really afraid of people, just untouched since birth.  Loading her and unloading were pretty exciting.  It took two of us with halters to drag her in and out to the field.  She was dragging a 15ft catch rope for a couple months, so we could bring her in each night.  LOTS of work with her, grooming, turns, leading here and there so she was cooperative.  Baths are good for working out kicking issues when being touched in new places.  They finally get tired of kicking and stand pretty well.  She can kick from her shoulder, sweep leg out past her rear end!!  and do it faster than you can snap your fingers!!!

We have a small steer calf, whom she loves, so she will put up with things to go be with him.  Cows need friends who are cattle, some will go thru fences trying to find other cattle.  You need VERY GOOD fences, because cattle are hard on them.  They rub and itch on solid fences, so electric wire inside helps reduce wear and pushing on fences.

Can you break up your pasturage into 3-5 areas with electric fence?  They graze better on small pieces, graze them closer, then you move cow to the next small field to graze, mow the one she just left to keep the tall weeds down.  One small section is your "dry lot" where you keep her if pasture ground is really soft, like a barnyard.  Dry lot keeps her from making deep tracks in soft dirt, tearing up her new spring grasses. All the other pastures open out of this dry lot for easy grazing control.  Water tank is in the dry lot, winter hay feeder for easy refills, close to the barn for milking.

The Dexters are VERY CUTE, can be the small size or tiny sized.  They tend to have a small udder to go with size.  I have heard they have Dairy lines with bigger udders, bony type build over the beefy models of other lines.  You probably will want to have some sort of raised stand, because they are SHORT and probably hard to milk sitting on the ground.  If a cow is 40-42 inches tall, with 2/3 body and 1/3 leg in height, the udder is WAY down.  One guy said he got tired of emptying his small bowl into the large bowl, but it was all that fit under the short cow.  They give less milk than Jerseys, probably a couple gallons twice daily when fresh, then a gallon twice a day until you dry them off, with no calf nursing.  

Calves will probably need dehorning, the polled Dexters  are not widespread in the breed yet.  You do NOT want horned cattle, dangerous to you.  Even small, these are real cattle, have to be treated with respect.  As adults, the cows may run 700-900 pounds.  I suppose the 36" tall ones might go 500 pounds. And while VERY cute, such tinyl ones might be hard to find a local Dexter bull for unless you wanted to do AI, artifical insemination.  You just can't breed small or tiny cows to big animals or calving will not work.  Dwarfed animals like the mini Jerseys, mini Hereford bulls can throw normal sized offspring so those would probably be a bad choice for her too. 

 I like the Dexters, have met a lot of VERY nice ones, but all cattle take some work to keep them tame and nice.  Check on the Dexter Cattle website, maybe there are some local breeders you could go visit just to see some.  

Know that heifers are pretty lively, flighty, over older cows.  Heifers seem to have NO sense at all, can be very reactive to any change in their "normal" schedule or handling.  This seems common no matter WHAT breed of heifer you get, they settle somewhat after getting to be mother cows.

Talking with the local Vet will inform you of diseases they might need vaccinating for protection from.  Fly borne things can travel far distances.  Some areas have problems with certain disease that other areas never see.  And TB testing is needed to insure safety for your family who will be using these  dairy products.   

You also need to make plans for any bull/steer calves you might have from your milking cow.  Can be hard to eat them, maybe selling young would be a better option before you are real attached.

I am having fun with our cattle, but they sure don't think like horses!!  I handle them twice a day, because "the laying on of the hands" keeps them thinking I am in charge!  Unhandled, they would be quite wild in a short time.  Heifer is VERY dominant, out of a dominant cow, so she is quite independent thinking.  Haltering and leading in and out twice a day is real important to her, so she believes I am in control!  Treats of alfalfa pellets help too!!


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## Celina (Jun 18, 2010)

Goodhors. Thank you! Great info!


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## Imissmygirls (Jun 18, 2010)

Each breed of cow has a distinct general personality. You know how different dog breeds have basic personality traits?  Cows are the same way. 
Most heifers  can be tamed down with love and firmness. My daughters regularly would tame down yearlings for show, but it's not easy! They need lots of handling and confinement until they realize that they can trust you in the way a cow trusts. Food helps, but so does talking and brushing.
Definitely remove horns as early as possible. That said, it is possible to have a vet dehorn an animal with huge horns and have it heal well and her still learn to love you. It just takes longer to regain trust.
My vote would be to inquire for an older animal, a proven milker. You may be able to get a "three-teater" one which had a problem in one quarter so that it dried up and no longer will produce.  This will decrease the milk for you, but you wouldn't need her regular production amount anyway.
Note: I would not expect to pay more than butcher price for such a cow because many times a cow producing on 3 quarters is culled to butcher anyway.
The drawback to this is that she may not be as tame as you would like.
You might also ask your local county extension agent if he could put the word out that you would like a retired 4H animal. Those would be tame.


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## amysflock (Jun 25, 2010)

Imissmygirls said:
			
		

> Each breed of cow has a distinct general personality. You know how different dog breeds have basic personality traits?  Cows are the same way.


Not only can each breed have its own general personality, but every individual will have its own as well. To save yourself a lot of hard work, frustration and potential injury, you'll want to look for a cow who is gentle and can be worked without incident. Based on my own experience with beef, avoid anyone who looks "high headed," meaning when you or others approach, she stretches her neck up (so her head is high but level) to get a better look...this is the precursor to "fight or flight." The calm animals are much easier to work, especially if you have to get inimate with them like you do in daily milking.


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## clarmayfarm (Jun 26, 2010)

I have a bit different take on the family cow...

I am a dairy farmer, we milk 100 cows on a grass based natural dairy.  I also have worked as an extension dairy specialist with PSU.


First, raising a calf can be a double edged sword, they will be very tame, but can become headstrong or pushy when older. They lack a normal "fear" of humans, and will not hesitate to treat you like "one of the herd", i.e., headbutting, pushing, mounting you when in heat, etc. I would agree with the persons who suggested a "spare" cow from a local dairy farm. 


She does _not_ need a friend, at least at first. One will tame much more easily than two...two cattle will team up and prefer each other over you...they can be happy with horses, goats, sheep, even humans.  

Many good dairy farmers have "favorite" cows who may be older or be "Three quartered" and not as productive...believe me, we HATE to sell them, but with profit margins as they are, we could not keep the dairy going if we kept every older or low producing cow. However, as a family cow they would easily give the milk you need.  A  farmer will often give you an excellent price to make certain their cow has a good home - not the stock market.

Secondly, a cow need not have another cow as a buddy...they can be happy with horses, goats, sheep, even humans.  


As others have mentioned, there are many breeds to consider. 

Jerseys are wonderful, they do give rich milk.  They are not the most gentle cows, however. They have much more personality than many breeds, but can be stubborn and strong willed. Talk to any Jersey dairyman (woman), they will tell you!

Holsteins give the most milk, but a good Holstein cow can give more than one family needs. We milk Holsteins, they are very gentle, and generally calm, but not as much "personality" as a Jersey.

I personally would consider Brown Swiss as a family cow. They are incredibly gentle, soft animals. They usually are not kickers, and are slow, calm, and collected. One drawback...as baby calves, they can be hard to bottle feed, partly because they are so laid back and non aggressive.

If you purchase a cow from a dairy, make certain that the reason they are selling her is not mastitis (udder inflammation), which can be chronic  - you will not want to drink the milk from that cow, it will spoil faster and tend to have off flavors. Also check with them about repro problems, not breeding. 

Good luck!!!


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## LavacaW (Jul 30, 2010)

I am a little late into the thread but I suggest if you are interested in Dexters contact Don Giles at :dg@3arrowsranch.com.  He is president of the Texas Dexter Cattle Breeders Assoc. and can put
you in touch with breeders in your area to talk to.  There are some good ones up your way.  I love mine
and am working to get one ready to be a milk cow.  If you can handle horses, you can handle Dexters.


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## TeamChaos (Jan 3, 2011)

This is a great thread! I realize it's old; I wonder if the OP ever got her milk cow...
Thanks to all who took the time to contribute to it.


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## theawesomefowl (Jan 4, 2011)

I want a cow too. I was considering a Zebu, Jersey, or Dexter.


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