# Fainting Goats



## Verndawg (Nov 14, 2012)

Im very new at this and not sure what to do.  Im hoping that I can get some guidance and help from others that are experienced.  I have three fainting goats in one stall.  Its a very large stall so I know that they have plenty of room.  I have a doe, buck and a wether.  They are all pretty close in age and I bought all three of them from the same person.  So my first question is: 

1.	Should I separate them?  I know that they will get lonely if they dont have a friend.
2.	I believe that my female is pregnant, and not sure when it happened.  I need to know what to look for so I know about when he is getting ready to deliver her kid.  
3.	Is there anything special that I should do for my female before the kid comes besides give her a CD/T shot about a month before?  

Your help is very much appreciated!!!


----------



## Southern by choice (Nov 14, 2012)

What are the ages of your goats?
Do they stay in the stall or do they have access to pasture?
What is the vaccination history of the goats?
What are you feeding them?

and...


----------



## Verndawg (Nov 14, 2012)

The goats are right at a year old.  I have not fenced in a pasture for them yet.  I have wormed them and gave them CD/T.  Is there something else that they need?  I am feeding them pellet goat food that I purchase at Tractor Supply.  I also give them some cracked corn, a little grain and grass hay.


----------



## Southern by choice (Nov 15, 2012)

They are fine together IMO, however if your doe is pregnant you are going to need to separate her before kidding. You will also need to keep her separate  from your buck after kidding too. She could go back into heat and get pregnant right away again and this would not be good for her. 
Getting outdoor fencing up asap would be good. As far as the worming, did you get a fecal done? This is important because  wormers are effective only on certain worms. You could have wormed with one kind of wormer that may not be effective on worm type "A" but is on "B & C".  Everyone thinks of barberpole but what if the goat is loaded with liver flukes or tapes etc. 
For the CDT, is this their first ever CDT?
I would not feed cracked corn. Stick with a good goat food, hay (24hour a day access) , alfalfa and loose minerals.
Check their hooves, do they need trimmed? any smell? 
Check their ears, are they clean? Check for lice/mites. Search through their coat with a flea comb, or fine tooth comb.

Hope this helps. 

oh yeah we will also need pictures when you get a chance, because we are a bunch of crazy goat addicts!


----------



## Verndawg (Nov 15, 2012)

The lady that I bought my goats from said that she has never given any of her goats shots.  Of course, this was after I purchased my goats.  I got three the first trip and 1 died about 10 days later.  I was crushed!!!  She ended up giving me another one because she felt bad.  After the one died I had Iowa State come down to Des Moines and had the other two checked out.  They both got a clean bill of health and was wormed and also given their first CDT.  Then 4 weeks later I gave them another one.  They said that it only has to be given once a year now.  Is that correct?  I know about a  month before my doe gives birth I need to give her a shot so protect the kid. 
I do need to trim their hooves, but they don't smell.
I'm not sure if I am feeding them enough either.  I give them 6 cups of NatureWise goat feed by Nutrena in the moring with a flake of grass hay.  Then repeat that in the evening.  Is that enought food for all three?  I was told that alfalfa was bad for bucks an wethers.  Is that not true?  What kind of loose minerals should I feed my goats?
I have never checked their ears.  I will tonight tho.  How and what do I use to clean them?  I do check them for lice/mites every two weeks.
I want my goats to be healthy, but as I said I'm new to this whole farm thing.  I want to do the right thing.  Thank you so much for leading me down the right path!!!!


----------



## Southern by choice (Nov 15, 2012)

It is good they got the 2nd CDT! and yes your right about the pregnant doe. Problem is... when is she due? Has she always been in with the buck? I think the best way to tell about the pregnancy is to look at the goat, belly and udder. I don't think the "pooch test" is worth anything, BUT that's just my opinion. IF you take pics of her udder and over the top of her and submit them over time you'll get LOTS of people offering advice! 

They should have hay available 24 hours a day, they need this for their rumens. They can have alfalfa esp the doe, it has more to do with UC, which is more about the calcium to phosphorus ratio.

I'm going to ask my farm partner to chime in here... he's the goat guy on our farm. I'm more the poultry/canines/parasite Queen 
We have Meat goats and dairy goats.

His name is Straw Hat Kikos. He will be much more helpful. He's a crazy goat guy.


----------



## Straw Hat Kikos (Nov 15, 2012)

If the doe is already pregnant then you don't have to separate her but once she gets close to kidding I would for sure separate them. If she were not pregnant then it would be best to separate them but she is already pregnant so they can stay for a bit. As for getting lonely, yeah goats get lonely but honestly if the buck or the does had to be by themselves it would be fine. For the doe, does the previous owner have any idea when she was bred? If you could get a picture of the doe (and the rest if you can) that would be great. That way we can see them and hopefully be able to tell or estimate how far along she is. Pictures also help to see the general health and size of the goat. Right now I don't think you need to worry about what you need to do for kidding. She should start to bag up anywhere from 30 days out. Sometimes they bag up within just days but most of the time it's a little ways away. Does she have any bag yet? Does she look really wide and 'fat'? As for anything special for the doe before kidding, not too much. Pregnant does MUST have good, clean water at all times. It's very important to them. Several days before kidding she should be put into a kidding stall and you should have alot of straw down for her. Yes, a CDT 30 days before her due date is ideal but not a must. If you don't know and miss it you can give it to the kid(s) after birth.

You said they are at a year. Is that all their ages? Are they related to each other at all? I'm hoping that doe is not near kidding because if she was then she was bred too early. 8 months or 80% of their mature body weight is the earliest time you should breed a doe. What kind of wormer did you use? Just wondering.  What kind of feed exactly? Do not feed them the corn. I am not into feeding straight grain and it can be very bad and dangerous to both bucks and wethers. No more corn. Hay is good, and I would also get them some loose mineral. 

Do you have any idea why that other goat died? Yes you are right, only once a year for the CDT now. How about those hooves? Have you done hooves before and do you know how to trim them? 

Feeding completely depends on the individual goat. Some need more food than others. You said they are in a stall so they don't get any browse, forage, or pasture I assume. You do give them hay, which is good. I would give them unlimited hay just because of where they are and that it's winter. If they are getting 4 cups per goat per day, with hay, that may be enough right there. I picture would help for sure so I can see their size. You have Myotonic goats and Myotonics can be small to huge goats so I'm not sure to their sizes. Alfalfa is, imo, the BEST hay for goats. Buck and does. Anyone that says it's bad for them is off their meds. Go ahead and give it to them and that is very good for your doe. 

I would say to get yourself a bag of Manna Pro Goat Mineral. That's what I use and I really like it. There are others that are good too but going into the science of minerals is a pain. So go ahead and get this for now. It has good levels of everything. Check for mites by looking thru their hair. You should be able to see most mites and lice if they have any. You have to llok hard because they can be hard to find sometimes. 

Here's a link to a page on how I feed my goats. This is just how I feed mine and it doesn't mean yours need to be fed the same. 

Click here


----------



## Verndawg (Nov 16, 2012)

Thank you both for the great advice!!!  The breeder is from Titanka, IA and she told me that three goats are not related.  I did ask her that when I got the last one.  They all have different mothers and fathers.  My doe was born 1/1/12, my wether was born 1/2/12 and the buck was born 2/18/12.

The wormer that the vet used was called IVOMEC.  I feed my goats NatureWise goat feed by Nutrena.  I hope that's good stuff because they love it.  I will stop feeding them cracked corn since you say that it's not good for them.  I'm also in need of purchasing some food this weekend so if there is something that you think is better then what I am feeding them please let me know.

I have no clue to why the goat died.  I flipped out and called Iowa State University.  One of their vets along with 4 vet techs come out to the farm and checks the others.  I was afraid the others would die.  The others goat a clean bill of health.  They did do a fecal and it came back clean.  The goat that died was way smaller then the other two and it was born the same time.  Maybe it was what I would call the runt.

I have never cut the hooves, but I did get directions on the internet on how to do it.  I need to do it now because they are looking bad.  Can I cut the doe's right now or should I wait till she kids?  Is it not the right time of year to do it?  Do they need a shot or anything before I do it?  I got a bottle of Kopertox and some blood stop powder just incase I make them bleed.  Would you recommend that I take them somewhere the first time?

I do have another problem.....  When my husband got divorced the lovely judge gave his ex-wife access to the barn and the pasture for her 6 horses as long as he lives there.  So, there are also horses on our property that don't get taken care of IMO.  There are two horses that have been in stalls for the past 5 years.  I don't think that she de-wormes them or gives them their shots either.  So I need to make sure that my goats are taken care of so they don't get sick from her horses.  Not sure if that can happen or not, but I want to make sure that they don't.  Any advice? 

I sure hope that I got all your questions answered.  I do want to do what's best for my goats!!

PS - I will take some pictures this weekend.


----------



## Southern by choice (Nov 16, 2012)

I pulled up your feed but couldn't find the nutritional values. I don't understand the "limited copper" thing either. Are you raising these guys for meat/slaughter or pets? It kind of sounds like this is a feed to raise kids up for market. 

You don't need a shot to do their hooves, it kind of like trimming your nails. If you want to try the hooves by internet videos go ahead but most of the time your first try your nervous and it's awkward. Do you have a stanchion? That's the easiest if your alone. If you have help then you don't really need one unless it's an ornery goat! If you can find some one in your area, or your county extension office can send someone out that would be great! 



> There are two horses that have been in stalls for the past 5 years.


  no pasture? 

Sorry , know nothing about horses. Many of your worms are species specific though.

Can't wait for the pictures!

Maybe I missed it, but what kind of goats do you have?


----------



## Straw Hat Kikos (Nov 16, 2012)

That's good they aren't related. Sorry if you have already answered this but di the buck you have now breed the does you have or are you not sure who the sire is? btw you're do is the same age as my Kiko buck. Same DOB haha.

Ivermectin is a good wormer. I prefer that wormer to most, for the more serious worms. I'm sure the food is ok. I've never used it and don't know anything about it. If you really want to (and don't mind doing it) you could post here the nutrition stats on it. You don't have to, I'm just wondering.

That is strange that the goat just dies. That's great all the others got a clean pass. When starting out with goats healthy ones are a must!! I hate to see people start with bad goats then something happens and they get turned off of goats. That's great for the fecal. Sounds like they may be pretty healthy little goat you have there.

You can do hooves at any time. If they are bad I would do them sooner than later. I do recommend waiting two days after a CDT before you trim hooves. That way that is thru their system and they have no chance of tetanus. So they do not need a shot, you can do them anytime, pregnant or not. 

As for taking them somewhere...Naa. It's very easy and it can be scary the first time but in a time or two you'll be a pro. btw bleeding is ok. Don't freak out. hah if it's just a little blood you don't need to do anything at all. Even a steady drip will be fine, just keep and eye on them if that does happen. 

As for the horses. I have no idea. I don't have horses.

I'm glad you've taken such an interest in your goats and I can tell you that goats are wonderful creatures. They are some of the smartest animals out there and very funny. Oh and baby goats are a gift from heaven. All baby goats are adorable and you will NEVER see a sad baby goat. They are the happiest creatures in the world!!


----------



## currycomb (Nov 16, 2012)

horses in a stall for 5yrs, never taken out? stall never cleaned? how are they fed? if they are taken out and exercised daily, no problem, but if locked up and never outside, this is a case of cruelty. horses must exercise, good for their body and mind. pics of the horses would be interesting too.


----------



## Verndawg (Nov 16, 2012)

I have had my goats since they were 8 week old.  So I have been able to see them grow up.  I was also told that the goats would not breed till they were at least a year.  Stupid me, I trusted what the women told me!!!!  That will never happen again.  The one that died was only 9 1/2 weeks old so he might have had pneumonia, SIDS or something.  She replaced the one that died at the end of March with another buck.  So my replacement buck is what got my doe pregnant.  He is beautiful though!!

No the horses have not been out!!  She has her 14 year old feed them once a day.  I'm always talking to them when I am in the barn taking care of my goats twice a day.  Clean stalls what the heck is that!!!  She doesnt even put down sawdust or wood shavings!!!    Yes I do put down pine shavings in my stall!!  There are mats down, but that's it in hers.  In the summer months it's absolutely disgusting!!  We have told her many many time to put down saw dust, wood shavings and she won't do it.  She might clean out the stalls every 6 months or so.  I just feel terrible for those animals!!    Animal Control has been out a few times and they come after my husband and I because they are on our property.  She won't sign a lease, I think for that reason.  They actually don't look skinny they do look healthy, but I know that they aren't.  The five years that I've been around, know body has ridden them.  When I first came around she had 16.


----------



## Verndawg (Nov 19, 2012)

Ok I have put some pictures of my goats out there.  I'm new at this and not sure how to put them just on my post.  If you can't see them please let me know and any info on how to do it would be great also.

Thanks!!


----------



## Straw Hat Kikos (Nov 19, 2012)

Verndawg said:
			
		

> Ok I have put some pictures of my goats out there.  I'm new at this and not sure how to put them just on my post.  If you can't see them please let me know and any info on how to do it would be great also.
> 
> Thanks!!


I have not seen them yet. Could you put the link here so I can see them?


----------



## Verndawg (Nov 20, 2012)

Ok well call me dumb because I can't figure out how to post pics on this website.  I thought that you could go to my uploads and see them.  I guess you can't.  So I need more help...  How do I post pics????


----------



## Southern by choice (Nov 20, 2012)

How to post pics 
http://www.backyardherds.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=97


----------



## Mamaboid (Nov 25, 2012)

I haven't been on much lately, so I am late to the party, but would like to give you some info and ask some questions.  Since you headed your posts Fainting Goats, I have a couple questions. 

1.  Are they pure and do they faint? stiffen up? hesitate? do you know the 1-6 fainting scale? if so, where do they fall?

2.  Good news is....Fainters are extremely good on being worm and parasite resistant.  

3. I raise Fainters, and I keep the pelleted and grain foods down to a minimum.  During times when they are not bred, or the bucks are not in rut, I do not feed grains or pellets, only hay and graze/browse.  We have found they do the best with unlimited hay.  Ours is not a great quality hay that we use because we use what we can get and afford easily.  It works out so that each goat eats about a sheet of hay a day, with extra at night.  We keep loose minerals out for them at all times, but they do not use much of it.  The Bucks do use more minerals than the does.

4.  If your doe is just now a year old and is near to kidding, be sure you keep her grain and pelleted feed down to absolute minimum, because you DO NOT want what is probably going to be a single baby to get too big.  Give her unlimited hay, lots of fresh water, make sure she gets exercise and watch her closely.  She should do fine.  Fainters are a very hardy breed and do well under all kinds of conditions.

5.  I do give my goats corn, but only a handful at a time for treats.  

Please feel free to PM me or post any questions that I can help with.  

Good luck and keep us posted.

BJ


----------

