# I just doubled my herd -- UPDATE:  Now with PHOTOS!!!



## SkyWarrior (Sep 20, 2012)

Today was a long car ride to pick up four purebred Nigerians.  It's a long, long, story but basically I got three wethers and a doe.  All except one wether still have their horns.

The woman I got them from were given these goats from someone else who moved a great distance where it was impractical to bring the goats.  Three of the goats are shy and don't want to be touched.  To make matters worse, their eyelids are WHITE and their skin isn't pink, but white.  This woman had them for several months and believed in keeping everything organic.  No vaccinations and no wormings either.  While I am a big proponent of organic, their coats are rough, they stink (my buck smells better), and I'm going to guess I'll have to vaccinate and worm them and then probably worm all my guys for good measure.  Do Nigerians smell differently than other goats?

The one female has such tiny teats -- will they get bigger if she's bred?

She told me the original owners were in the health care profession who were Nigerian breeders who got tired of goats.  These were registered animals at one time, so I'm thinking they probably come CAE/CL free and were vaccinated and wormed.

I feel really angry that these goats are in this rough of shape.  I know she didn't know much about goats, but somehow, I feel   

I guess I'm just going to tackle their vaccinations and wormings tomorrow.


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## Queen Mum (Sep 20, 2012)

The teats will get bigger if bred, when she kids.  

Worm them all.  Vaccinate them all.   

Ignorance is bliss for the owner and misery for the animals.   Feed them up good and they will probably be OK.  

Never assume they are CAE/CL free. Get them tested.

You need to quaranteen them from your goats.


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## SkyWarrior (Sep 21, 2012)

Queen Mum said:
			
		

> The teats will get bigger if bred, when she kids.
> 
> Worm them all.  Vaccinate them all.
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Sadly I have no place to quarantine them.  I will have to test them all anyway; two of my herd goats are not tested.  Most people just don't test out here.  A CAE/CL tested herd is a rarity but usually happens with registered animals.


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## Pearce Pastures (Sep 21, 2012)

Now ya know we need some pictures!  

I agree with QM.  If there is any way to separate them for 30 days, even with temporary fencing (some scrap wood and a $15 roll of wire fencing from Menards would do it), it would be best.  Registered doesn't mean disease free and having a disease doesn't mean someone can't register them.  I know registered animals that are CAE.  But that aside, I'd be worried about them spreading parasites to my goats and I am sure they are loaded with them.


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## SkyWarrior (Sep 21, 2012)

Pearce Pastures said:
			
		

> Now ya know we need some pictures!
> 
> I agree with QM.  If there is any way to separate them for 30 days, even with temporary fencing (some scrap wood and a $15 roll of wire fencing from Menards would do it), it would be best.  Registered doesn't mean disease free and having a disease doesn't mean someone can't register them.  I know registered animals that are CAE.  But that aside, I'd be worried about them spreading parasites to my goats and I am sure they are loaded with them.


Well, I guess I can try.  Won't work well, though.  I'll talk to DH tonight and see if we can cobble something up.

I'll be worming EVERYONE in a month as well as these guys.  BTW, they're fat compared to my LaManchas and my mixed goat Annie, and they stink -- normal?


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## ksalvagno (Sep 21, 2012)

They really shouldn't stink. I think there is more going on there and I'm sure you will find out soon enough.


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## SkyWarrior (Sep 21, 2012)

ksalvagno said:
			
		

> They really shouldn't stink. I think there is more going on there and I'm sure you will find out soon enough.


Lovely.


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## SkyWarrior (Sep 21, 2012)

Spent some time wrangling the goats, vaccinating, worming and trimming their hooves.

Their hooves looked like someone who didn't understand goat hooves trimmed them some time ago.  The end got trimmed, but nothing else-- so I had to trim the sides back.  It's going to take several trimmings to get them right.  Sigh.

I spoke with the former owner.  She said the goats had been wormed some 3 months ago and had their hooves trimmed by a sheep person.  I finally got a good look at their eyelids.  The wether who was most friendly with the disbudded horns had pale eyelids.  The rest look about average.  Go figure.

I suspect the stench is because the woman raises hogs.  Aromatic, to say the least.  My guys--even my buck--doesn't smell that bad. 

The goats have named themselves.  The girl is Bonnie.  The boys are Herman, Maynard, and Pogo. 

One positive: my buck, Oreo, has fallen in love with the new doe.  She's quite taken with him too.  The rut has started and the does are all now in full blown heat.  

Bonnie, Herman and Maynard.







Bonnie, Herman and Maynard.






Pogo.


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## Pearce Pastures (Sep 21, 2012)

They are beauts!!  I know it is weird, but I love goat beards!!


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## Straw Hat Kikos (Sep 21, 2012)

I like them. You say they are or were registered Nigerians? Huge horns and beard for Nigerian girls. Their bodies seem deeper than a Nigerians too.


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## SkyWarrior (Sep 21, 2012)

Straw Hat Kikos said:
			
		

> I like them. You say they are or were registered Nigerians? Huge horns and beard for Nigerian girls. Their bodies seem deeper than a Nigerians too.


3 wethers and 1 doe.  The doe is the short white one.

Yes, they were registered, or their parents were and they weren't.  I could get their parents' papers if I wanted to ask the former owner for them.  Seeing as only one is breedable and I have no Nigerians, it seemed pretty pointless.  

To me they seem really fat.  My goats look skinny by comparison, and they are, I assure you, not skinny.


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## Straw Hat Kikos (Sep 21, 2012)

SkyWarrior said:
			
		

> Straw Hat Kikos said:
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Oh no. They do not look fat. They look pretty good. I think weight wise they are good. I was saying that their bellies are deeper than any Nigerian I have seen. And their horns are huge for Nigerians, but you are right, the two with the big beards are the wethers. lol Duh.


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## SkyWarrior (Sep 21, 2012)

Straw Hat Kikos said:
			
		

> Oh no. They do not look fat. They look pretty good. I think weight wise they are good. I was saying that their bellies are deeper than any Nigerian I have seen. And their horns are huge for Nigerians, but you are right, the two with the big beards are the wethers. lol Duh.


Hmmm, I think it's the camera angle.  They're rotund, I assure you, hence the big bellies.  The disbudded one is the thinnest and he looks fine.  The other two have been free feeding.  

Their horns are HUGE.  I mean, GI-NOR-MOUS.  I did have to use those as handles, as much as I dislike to.  It was either that or risk getting hit with them.  I really, really, REALLY dislike horns.


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## Straw Hat Kikos (Sep 21, 2012)

I'll take the horns!! I love horns. My buck's horns should get up to 3 or 4 feet long once fully mature.


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## SkyWarrior (Sep 21, 2012)

Straw Hat Kikos said:
			
		

> I'll take the horns!! I love horns. My buck's horns should get up to 3 or 4 feet long once fully mature.


PER HORN?     No way!  Seriously??


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## Straw Hat Kikos (Sep 21, 2012)

Oh yeah. It should be something like this: 












Moses' might be more like this though:


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## SkyWarrior (Sep 21, 2012)

Moooooooo!!  

(Now, I'm just messin' with ya!)  Seriously?  Their horns are that long?  Don't you feel like they could really hurt?


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## Straw Hat Kikos (Sep 21, 2012)

Oh yeah, they're that long.

Hurt as in grabbing them? No at all. I have many goats with horns and I know MANY people that have goats with horns and none have ever shown any signs of being in pain from grabbing their horns. Ever. If it did hurt do you really think they would play, let alone fight, with them. Mine play all the time be butting heads and horns. I do not think they would do that if it hurt them. And when they fight, the really go at it hard and if it hurt to just touch or pull a goat by it's horns then I promise you they would not fight. I have only had good experiences by holding and talking to a wild goat to calm them down. Just hold them still and talk to them, look them in the eye and tell them something about them. That they're being bad, or that they are pretty or handsome, w/e. Moses used to be so wild you could not get within 50 feet of him. Now he eats out of my hand. He sometimes lets me pet him too. I love horns as I believe the have many benefits to both me and the animal.


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## SkyWarrior (Sep 22, 2012)

No, I meant like you getting gored.


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## Catahoula (Sep 22, 2012)

Wow! Impressive horns and gorgeous animals !!! I will admire them from far.


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## Queen Mum (Sep 22, 2012)

SkyWarrior said:
			
		

> No, I meant like you getting gored.


Well, how are you going to get gored?  The horns point backwards not forwards.  SO you would have to be standing behind them and they would have to back into you forcefully.  By then you can grab the horns and lift the animal off his feet.   Pretty easy to do.  Most of the time the animal will just run away from you.

Most "horn" accidents come from standing over the animal and having him swing around and poke you.  It isn't smart to stand over any animal if  you are not paying attention, whether the animal has horns or not.  This is because they have hard heads and getting bopped with those hard heads can HURT!

Horns are not really much of a problem.  

If you are worried about getting poked, get a short bike handlebar grip and glue it on the tip of the horns.  Problem solved.

The bigger risk with goats is being head butted.  And that risk isn't from the horns, it is from the forehead.  NOW THAT HURTS and can really do some damage.  Just step aside.  That is the solution.

Then get busy correcting the animal for trying in the first place.


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## Pearce Pastures (Sep 22, 2012)

Goats can still gore you even with back-turned horns.  I remember hearing in the news not that long ago about a death due to being gored by a goat.  They are beautiful nevertheless, just require more care on our part.


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## Straw Hat Kikos (Sep 22, 2012)

I personally am not scared of horns. I guess if they impaled me then they could hurt but that I don't see happening. I know someone who took a goat in because it put his horn thru the previous owner's eye, but hat kind of thing doesn't seem to happen alot. I think the odds of being 'gored' are slim at best. Most horns ho back or just aren't in the right place to gore someone. That being said, there are horns that are. The real risk with horns is just getting whacked by them. When that happens there is pretty much no chance you will be impaled, but instead just getting hit with the broad-side of a horn, which can hurt for sure. In all the time that I have had goats (just over a year) and some of mine have some fairly large horns and one with very large horns I think I have been hurt just once. I wasn't paying attentions and one of the goats jumped up onto what I was sitting on and it got me in the teeth. It hurt pretty bad but I was over it in just a minute. As long as you are careful and you MUST KNOW YOUR SURROUNDINGS AT ALL TIMES, such as who is there and make sure you know their horns and how the goat behaves, you will be fine 99.999999999% of the time. I also have not had a goat really try and get me. The only goat that has ever tried to butt me is Alana who has the biggest hors and she does that when you have ahold of her and you are doing something she doesn't like. If you touch her bag, back legs, hindquarters, or anything in her back end then it can get hairy. As long as you have hold of those horns there is no danger. Today I was just doing a general health check on her and I was messing with her bag to see how well it went down and I let go of her horns to get a better look and she whipped that head around and tried to whack me. Thankfully I am quick enough to move out of the way in time, but that could have hurt pretty bad.She is the only goat like that and she is just a different goat, she is not like any of the others and she knows it. She is the only goat that I know that will bite you if she's mad at you. And no, I am not scared of her or her horns. I suppose that they could gore you but in order for that to happen you were not paying attention or that is a dangerous goat that should be on the grill. And when they just give you a butt you really should have been paying attention better and if they do get you most of the time it would do anyhting then give you a bruise and you'll get over it. That is just MHO on the matter. 

The only way that my view on horns will be changes is......well I can't think of anything. Benefits far out way the dangers.


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## Queen Mum (Sep 22, 2012)

I believe the death to which you are referring was a man killed by a mountain goat.  The mountain goats have short straight horns.  That man was a hiker with a group who was picnicing.  The goat was hanging around and the man stayed behind to "chase the goat off".   

The goat killed him.  I beleive the buck in question, probably felt his territory was challenged and probably head butted the man to the ground and then gored him after he was quite unconscious.

It was a case of man vs. wild animal.  BIG ANGRY WILD ANIMAL.


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## Straw Hat Kikos (Sep 22, 2012)

Queen Mum said:
			
		

> I believe the death to which you are referring was a man killed by a mountain goat.  The mountain goats have short straight horns.  That man was a hiker with a group who was picnicing.  The goat was hanging around and the man stayed behind to "chase the goat off".
> 
> The goat killed him.  I beleive the buck in question, probably felt his territory was challenged and probably head butted the man to the ground and then gored him after he was quite unconscious.
> 
> It was a case of man vs. wild animal.  BIG ANGRY WILD ANIMAL.


Those are the dangerous horns. Small straight one, esp. if they are sharp. They guy who got stabbed in his eye, the goat had host, straight, sharp horns. Those are scary.


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## CochinBrahmaLover=) (Sep 22, 2012)

Pearce Pastures said:
			
		

> They are beauts!!  I know it is weird, but I love goat beards!!


Me too!
Their beauties!


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## CochinBrahmaLover=) (Sep 22, 2012)

Straw Hat Kikos said:
			
		

> I'll take the horns!! I love horns. My buck's horns should get up to 3 or 4 feet long once fully mature.


NO! I want them!

Plus I'm closer, neener neener neener  I think I am at least....


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## CochinBrahmaLover=) (Sep 22, 2012)

Queen Mum said:
			
		

> I believe the death to which you are referring was a man killed by a mountain goat.  The mountain goats have short straight horns.  That man was a hiker with a group who was picnicing.  The goat was hanging around and the man stayed behind to "chase the goat off".
> 
> The goat killed him.  I beleive the buck in question, probably felt his territory was challenged and probably head butted the man to the ground and then gored him after he was quite unconscious.
> 
> It was a case of man vs. wild animal.  BIG ANGRY WILD ANIMAL.


Theres a guy up here dressed as a mountain goat  hes living with them  Hes not doing anything ILLEGAL, but mountain goat hunting season is coming up soon.....


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## Straw Hat Kikos (Sep 22, 2012)

CochinBrahmaLover=) said:
			
		

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Yep, you are. It is approximately 3439 km from NC to Montana and 3049 km from Alaska to Montana. Thing is, once you get over the 3000 km mark it is all the same.


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## CochinBrahmaLover=) (Sep 22, 2012)

Straw Hat Kikos said:
			
		

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 Yeah but 400 KM makes a difference! So their MINE!

But I don't need more wethers....

Give them lady parts (but keep the beard) and I'll take 'em!


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## Pearce Pastures (Sep 22, 2012)

Straw Hat Kikos said:
			
		

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Mountain goats are so amazing-I looked that story up and it does sound like it was random thing but has caused quite an event.  Maybe they need to distribute some tennis balls to them


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## ksalvagno (Sep 22, 2012)

Cute goats! They look healthy in the pictures. You could always band the horns if you feel you don't like them.


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## Straw Hat Kikos (Sep 22, 2012)

X2 they look healthy from here, at least body weight and all.

Mountain goats are cool. I like the Ibex and the plain Mountain Goat the best. And I agree, they should start handing out tennis balls to all wild goats. lol


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## SkyWarrior (Sep 22, 2012)

Well, some updates on the newbies 

They're doing fine.  A bit less skittish, which is good.  I tricked Herman to take a bit of hay from my hand, which he did before he realized it was attached to me.    Not sure about them drinking water.  I've put lower buckets out for them, but the geese muddy the waters, so to speak.  I've been changing them.

Oreo is so taken with Bonnie.  He loves older goats, evidently. She's 5 years old, so he's swooning over her and she is very flattered.


Overall, they seem okay and are getting along with my herd.  Oreo and Heidi are considered top goats, even if Oreo is a little young.


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## Queen Mum (Sep 23, 2012)

I can relate.  I like them younger myself.   More trainable.  Go for it Bonnie.


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## SkyWarrior (Sep 23, 2012)




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