# Why do so many kids die?



## Jackson62 (Oct 8, 2011)

I'm hanging out here trying to learn as much as I can before deciding to get goats.  It just seems like kids are either very fragile or it is "Operator Error".   What is the best age to bring home kids from a breeder for a first time owner?


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## elevan (Oct 8, 2011)

Due to the nature of the forum there are a lot of stories of bad situations...trust me those are the minority.  Most kids don't die - they live and thrive.


In my opinion...
If you're a first time goat owner, do a lot of homework and find a breeder who will teach you some things before you ever bring your first goat home.
Then don't make your first goat a baby on the bottle...start with a weaned kid (at least 8 wks old)....better yet, go a little older like 9-12 months if you can.


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## Jackson62 (Oct 8, 2011)

Thanks for your reply.  I think I will go for the older goats. I only want them for pets.  Maybe down the road I would get milk goats after I learn as much as I can. 

So if you buy from an experienced breeder and ask for help you will lose less kids.


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## redtailgal (Oct 8, 2011)

We all post our troubles on here.  For every sick or injured goat that you read about on here, there are 10 healthy happy ones running around, lol.

Starting with older goats and learning is a good way to start.  The most important thing to remember is when you get new goats you have to post a pic on here............lol


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## ksalvagno (Oct 8, 2011)

A lot depends on husbandry for death of kids. Not to mention what time of year and having proper housing. I would make sure your pet goats are friendly no matter what the age. A young goat like 8 weeks old would be easier to make friendly if not. An adult would either take a long time or maybe never. What state are you in?


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## freemotion (Oct 8, 2011)

Yup, start with older goats.

And yup, lots of panic here, but it really is the minority.  I've posted my share of "HELP!!!" thread, all of the emergency panic ones were about the baby kids.  In the past 3-4 years, I've had 15 goat kids here.  Only one died.  That one came to me when I rescued a doe who was very neglected and was later in her pregnancy and I didn't have this forum to come to.  I'd probably have had all 15 survive if I'd known about byh then....if it existed then.

The biggest thing you need is to be able to recognize when there is trouble coming and get help immediately.  It was reading up on things here that taught me what books didn't.  You often have to act very quickly and that is one of the wonderful things about this site....people tend to respond rather quickly to help.


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## Jackson62 (Oct 8, 2011)

I am in Wisconsin.  I now live in crazy Madison but will be moving to far northern Wi in April of 2012.  
So 8 week olds will bond better with us and make nicer pets?  Would you suggest 2 does or 1 doe and a wether, or 2 wethers. I am thinking about Nubain or mininubian.


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## elevan (Oct 8, 2011)

If they're just for pets to start, I'd go with 2 wethers.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 8, 2011)

If the goats are already friendly, then it doesn't matter what age. If they are not friendly, then younger goats are the better ones to go with. If there is a rescue group in your area, that may be the way to go to get pets. I know the one in my area would be very honest about their animals and would make sure that the match is a good one.


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## Beekissed (Oct 9, 2011)

As with any livestock, I'd recommend only buying from breeders who have hardy animals to start with and then I'd plan to do a lot of preventative health management, use chemical interventions sparingly, research your livestock and its breed thoroughly, plan your husbandry tactics, have all shelters, fences, pens in place before you need them...._then_ get some goats.


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## 77Herford (Oct 9, 2011)

redtailgal said:
			
		

> We all post our troubles on here.  For every sick or injured goat that you read about on here, there are 10 healthy happy ones running around, lol.
> 
> Starting with older goats and learning is a good way to start.  The most important thing to remember is when you get new goats you have to post a pic on here............lol


No you don't.  These ladies are just picture obsessed.  If you describe the goat, I'm sure they can use their imagination.  Don't let the ladies win, fight, fight, fight on my brothers, lol.


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## kstaven (Oct 9, 2011)

For pets I would get wethers. No seasonal hormones to deal with.


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## freemotion (Oct 9, 2011)

77Herford said:
			
		

> No you don't.  These ladies are just picture obsessed.  If you describe the goat, I'm sure they can use their imagination.  Don't let the ladies win, fight, fight, fight on my brothers, lol.




Don't listen...pics are required!!!


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## lilhill (Oct 9, 2011)

kstaven said:
			
		

> For pets I would get wethers. No seasonal hormones to deal with.


I agree that wethers would be a good place to start out.  We have bred Nigerians for 7 years and have lost only 1 baby and that one was one of quads and tiny, tiny.


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## Ms. Research (Oct 9, 2011)

Beekissed said:
			
		

> As with any livestock, I'd recommend only buying from breeders who have hardy animals to start with and then I'd plan to do a lot of preventative health management, use chemical interventions sparingly, research your livestock and its breed thoroughly, plan your husbandry tactics, have all shelters, fences, pens in place before you need them...._then_ get some goats.


X2 on that completely!  So many make snap decisions without preparation.  These livestock are not dogs and cats or rabbits which you can bring home or return.  This is where the game of "farming" becomes real.  Saves a lot of heartache if you are prepared.  Not saying you will ever be fully prepared, but it helps.


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## doxiemoxie (Oct 9, 2011)

x3 on buying from breeders with healthy herds.  Take time to research them, and their animals.  If they're serious about placing their animals with good owners they'll also want to take the time to get to know you and be willing to help you out.  

In addition to having shelters, fences, etc. in place you also need to decide on how much veterinary intervention you want, and when.  Get familiar with your local vets as well as their fee schedules (emergency calls, etc.)  before you need them.  Experienced owners are usually able to effectively determine what might be wrong and properly treat than a newbie.  Don't depend on this or any internet site; we cannot see the animal.   Determine how much money you're willing to spend on vet care ahead of time too.  You can always change your mind but at least you'll have given it some serious thought.

And pics are TOO required!


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## jmsim93 (Oct 9, 2011)

Avoid Craigslist and go with a breeder...especially if you are a newbie.  Those who are more experienced are able to better judge the animals and would probably be okay.  I have heard and seen too many tragedies on Craigslist.


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## Stacykins (Oct 9, 2011)

It is a bit unnerving for a newbie to read the horror stories with kids. I know they are definitely the minority, and I hope to learn from it too, but still, SCARY! I have until next spring to learn and be as prepared as I can be, but animals don't follow the norm all the time.


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## Jackson62 (Oct 9, 2011)

I have 7 months to plan, build housing and fencing and have an emergency kit ready to go.  I found a local breeder for mininubians and will go with 2 wethers.  How do you check the credentials of a breeder?


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## jmsim93 (Oct 9, 2011)

Jackson62 said:
			
		

> I have 7 months to plan, build housing and fencing and have an emergency kit ready to go.  I found a local breeder for mininubians and will go with 2 wethers.  How do you check the credentials of a breeder?


Visiting the property is a must because you can see the cleanliness, living conditions and the health of the other animals.  You could also ask for references???  If they have happy customers then they should be happy to share them.


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## Beekissed (Oct 9, 2011)

Jackson62 said:
			
		

> I have 7 months to plan, build housing and fencing and have an emergency kit ready to go.  I found a local breeder for mininubians and will go with 2 wethers.  How do you check the credentials of a breeder?


As mentioned, check prior customers.  When I bought my sheep I visited the farmer several times at different times of the day, asked numerous questions about his animals, animal husbandry practices, what traits he bred for in his flocks, what his lamb mortality rate was with this breed and with his husbandry practices.  I literally picked this man's head wide open and then went home each time and compared the info with what I could learn online, through books and through mag articles.  

I checked out two other farmers in the same way and found only this place and his animals to be most consistent with what I was looking for and his breeding/husbandry tactics were the most in line with my own conclusions as the most desirable for my needs/wants.


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## Roll farms (Oct 9, 2011)

We had a fellow come out last month who'd been to another goat farm.  He said, "It only took us 10 minutes to figure out he didn't know what he was talking about."

Apparently he told him you 'have' to deworm monthly and that if you don't use medicated feed your goats will die.  
He was also told "you couldn't afford that kid" when he mentioned that a particular one was nice.  

Even though we knew he hasn't got his barn or fence up (and therefore is nowhere near ready to buy anything), we spent about 2.5 hours w/ this man and his wife, answering their questions and helping w/ suggestions of what works / what doesn't.

Handing someone a goat and expecting them to 'figure it out' is a recipe for disaster.

The better educated a person starts out, then the better off they will do, and the better off the goat industry will be as a whole.


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## elevan (Oct 9, 2011)

Roll farms said:
			
		

> The better educated a person starts out, then the better off they will do, and the better off the goat industry will be as a whole.


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