# Is she really a chamoisee alpine?



## meme (Dec 9, 2012)

Heidi is registered as a pure breed light chamoisee alpine. However, people have told me they don't think her coloring really is correct. Plus, pictures of chamoisee's online look much darker. Is she some other color all together? I know her parents are registered pure breeds, but her color just seems 'off'.

As a baby( 1 week): 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





In August of this year: 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





What do you think?




edited for typo


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## pdpo222 (Dec 9, 2012)

Wish I could help.  I know my pygmy buck who is a light carmel is almost white in the summer.  He darkens in the winter though and you can see the carmel than.


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## Southern by choice (Dec 9, 2012)

Queen Mum has a page on goat colors.  Its at the bottom of the page... you could find her journal and look at the bottom of one of her posts.

I knew someone had a color chart and was looking around then the light came on...Queen Mum!


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## Catahoula (Dec 9, 2012)

I think she is.


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## Pearce Pastures (Dec 9, 2012)

http://www.ansi.okstate.edu/breeds/goats/

Check the link for pics and descriptions...she looked Alpine to me.

Edited to add, she has a hint of the Toggenburg look though too.  

http://www.ansi.okstate.edu/breeds/goats/


Okay edited once more---her coloring(the face marking, light hindquarters) does look more Togg than Alpine and what I did not in looking on a few dairy sites is that Togg coloring or marking on an Alpine is "discriminated against".  Not sure exactly what all that means for you but she could stil be an Alpine but just have Togg colors.


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## meme (Dec 9, 2012)

Thanks for the links guys! As far as I know, she is a pure breed Alpine. She comes from mostly Redwood Hills lines. 

The third picture down on this page is listed as a two-tone chamoisee. You can see that her belly is a little darker than her front and back though. 

http://olentangyalpines.com/junior_does.shtml


On this thread, the goat has the same pattern, but is darker with a white belly:

http://www.thegoatspot.net/forum/f217/what-color-alpine-doe-125055/


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## Catahoula (Dec 9, 2012)

Mine is registered as two tone Chamoisee, tan and Black, half white belly






In certain lighting, her belly area is darker and her neck is tan color.


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## pdpo222 (Dec 9, 2012)

Don't you just love all the colors and combo's.  Especially when you're trying to find one??


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## Queen Mum (Dec 9, 2012)

Alpine dairy goat website said:
			
		

> Chamoisee (shamwahzay) - brown or bay characteristic markings are black face, dorsal stripe, feet and legs, and sometimes a martingale running over the withers and down to the chest. Spelling for male is chamoise.
> 
> Two-tone Chamoisee - light front quarters with brown or gray hindquarters. This is not a cou blanc or cou clair as these terms are reserved for animals with black hindquarters.
> 
> Broken Chamoisee - a solid chamoisee broken with another color by being banded or splashed, etc.


In other words it is a darker color of brown.   

The baby you have is a lighter shade of golden or buckskin.  With dark legs.   Not a true chamoisee.   

I always called that coloration dark buckskin.    Nigerian Dwarf goat colors are named slightly differently than Alpines and your baby looks alpine to me.


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## meme (Dec 9, 2012)

That helps a lot queen mum! I have never heard an someone call an Alpine that before. I forget, can you register an alpine as a 'dark buckskin', or does it have to be a standard color? I wonder why her coloration doesn't really fit any of the standard descriptions. Very interesting!


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## Queen Mum (Dec 10, 2012)

Personally, I don't think there are particularly standard descriptions for buckskin, but it's hard to tell these days.  You would have to ask the breeders association if they have a specific color description they will accept when registering.


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## HB Sheep & Goat Farm (Dec 10, 2012)

There are only certain colors that you can register an alpine under. She is a Chamoise in my opinion. Here is a list of colors and descriptions for alpines. 

Cou Blanc (coo blanc) - literally "white neck" white front quarters and black hindquarters with black or gray markings on the head.
Cou Clair (coo clair) - literally "clear neck" front quarters are tan, saffron, off-white, or shading to gray with black hindquarters.
Cou Noir (coo nwah) - literally "black neck" black front quarters and white hindquarters
Sundgau (sundgow) - black with white markings such as underbody, facial stripes, etc.
Pied - spotted or mottled.
Chamoisee (shamwahzay) - brown or bay characteristic markings are black face, dorsal stripe, feet and legs, and sometimes a martingale running over the withers and down to the chest. Spelling for male is chamoise.
Two-tone Chamoisee - light front quarters with brown or gray hindquarters. This is not a cou blanc or cou clair as these terms are reserved for animals with black hindquarters.
Broken Chamoisee - a solid chamoisee broken with another color by being banded or splashed, etc.

I think someone has already posted this color chart- sorry for the re post


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## meme (Dec 11, 2012)

Well, I guess it may just be a matter of opinion more than anything. It seems like people are never too sure about their Alpines. I think she has nice coloring though, and she is such a sweet girl.


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