# *Advice needed*Introducing a new goat to the herd



## samssimonsays (Jun 17, 2015)

We brought home our newest baby girl Brooklyn, we will be changing her name when we learn her personality more. She was a bottle baby with her twin sister and we are absolutely in love with her already! She is so sweet, mellow and *QUIET* compared to my two hellians.

*How the others are reacting to her:*
My little doe isn't sure she likes someone else being the center of my attention but she is gentle with her. My Wether though, that's another story! He head butts her all the time. I have stepped in and will stomp at him and sternly say no... I have trained my two to know what no means.... and he will back off. BUT he will do it again. Last night when I was walking her out of the pen to the barn (I have her in a dane dog crate with hay and water in there for safety until the two bigger ones accept her) Ollie came running out of nowhere and plowed her down with his head. I turned around and let him have it. I pushed him until he was against the tree and just firmly held him there until he quit fighting me. When I released him he squared up with me as if to challenge me and head butt me. I stomped at him and said NO. He stood on his back legs and acted like he was trying to challenge me and I stomped again at him and he spun and head butted the tree and proceeded to stomp all four feet and beller. He then stayed facing the fence, back to me. After that, every time he would attempt to head butt her I would stomp and say no and he would head butt the tree, stomp all fours and beller as if throwing a tantrum... I have a feeling he will be a peach to get to adjust to this change... He is the worst one out of the two for needing a schedule and he is the one who is "dominant" in my little bitty herd. I know he is hashing that out but she is not challenging him she just tries to get away from him. Is this a sign of him not accepting her or is this totally "normal" goat behavior? He is slated to go to a different pet home but I was hoping maybe hubby wouldn't mind having three goats and let him stay... I may have gotten a bit attached 

*But anyways, I know y'all are picture hungry people so here are some pics of her!* 

On the way home 


Introducing her to the pen.

Everyone checking her out. (She is so Teeny!!!)


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## BlessedWithGoats (Jun 17, 2015)

Aww! Congrats on the new doeling! I love it when goats have a sweet, quiet personality... my favorite doe is like that! 
@Southern by choice @babsbag @OneFineAcre @Goat Whisperer @goatgurl


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## samssimonsays (Jun 17, 2015)

Thanks Blessed! I do too LOL. Sadly, my wether could HIGHLY benefit from an older doe puttin ghim in his place but Tilda is such a sweet and easy going goat that she just lets him walk all over her and be "The man". This is the down side of starting with babies right? I am not sure if it works the same with goats as with dogs but Ollie knows me as the leader/dominant one of the herd and will submit to me. He bosses anything and everything else around though. Last night was the first time he challenged me EVER and I NEED to put him in his place! Can I lay him down and do a submission hold on a goat like you do with a dog that challenges you?


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## animalmom (Jun 17, 2015)

Oh my word, yes!  If Ollie is not being a gentleman then it is your obligation to remind him.  I do with with my boys, and occasional girls whenever the "glare" doesn't subdue immediately.

Flank the offender:  grab the two legs on the opposite side of the body and drop him to the ground.  Hold him there until he stops squirming.  If he has been really offensive I keep eye contact while he is down and remind him that all good things come from me and I am not the one he wants to upset.  Once he calms down let him up.  He may give you the cold shoulder for a few minutes, but he really wants to get loved on by you to know you are not mad at him.

I've done this at one time or another with probably all my boys, bucks and wethers.  My oldest buck, spoiled to the max as he was my first born, will, every blue moon, get up on his hind legs as though he is going to challenge me.  I look him in the eye and ask him if he really wants to rumble.  He backs down and would rather get scratched under his chin.  He's a love bug.


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## BlessedWithGoats (Jun 17, 2015)

I actually used this method too! Some of our BYH family had mentioned doing this, and I did use it on my buck I believe, I used it on my sister's wether, and I used it on my new doe...  I've used it with my dog as well.


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## samssimonsays (Jun 17, 2015)

Thank you Animalmom! I am glad I wasn't TOO rough with him last night! I wasn't rough enough from the sounds of it. Tonight they will have another opportunity to meet each other so hopefully I will have the chance to correct him and get him to realize that I am the leader and SHE is "my" baby and he needs to respect her. His little tantrums are cute to an extent now that I look back at it all but man do they make my blood boil at the time of the offense! He is a lover and has never challenged me once but he was adamant on head butting the new baby and I won't tolerate that. She will be housed in the barn until I feel they are safe around her without me.


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## samssimonsays (Jun 17, 2015)

BlessedWithGoats said:


> I actually used this method too! Some of our BYH family had mentioned doing this, and I did use it on my buck I believe, I used it on my sister's wether, and I used it on my new doe...  I've used it with my dog as well.


It is so good to know I can use that tactic on him! I was really worried I don't want to be mean to him but I need to put him in his place too ya know?


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## mysunwolf (Jun 17, 2015)

If your current doe is behaving well with your new doe, as I think you've said, you could separate out the badly behaving Ollie to the barn and let the two does bond in the yard. They might gain some friendship and independence, and when you re-introduce Ollie (after plenty of hollering), your does might be a more "united front" and can better fend off his aggressiveness. This has worked for me with sheep before. You'll still have to remind him of his manners, though!


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## samssimonsays (Jun 17, 2015)

That may be an option! I figured it would be easy for the older two babies to gang up on her since they were born and raised together and then went to new homes together. I just didn't anticipate him to act like THIS.


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## BlessedWithGoats (Jun 17, 2015)

Samantha drawz said:


> It is so good to know I can use that tactic on him! I was really worried I don't want to be mean to him but I need to put him in his place too ya know?


 Totally understood Samantha!!


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## SkyWarrior (Jun 17, 2015)

Introductions can be rough as everyone sorts out the pecking order. But it will happen.  Time and enforcing good behavior is all you can do (trust me, they'll do whatever they'll do when you're not watching).


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## SkyWarrior (Jun 17, 2015)

mysunwolf said:


> If your current doe is behaving well with your new doe, as I think you've said, you could separate out the badly behaving Ollie to the barn and let the two does bond in the yard. They might gain some friendship and independence, and when you re-introduce Ollie (after plenty of hollering), your does might be a more "united front" and can better fend off his aggressiveness. This has worked for me with sheep before. You'll still have to remind him of his manners, though!



This is an excellent idea.  It also knocks Ollie down a few notches.


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## samssimonsays (Jun 18, 2015)

Well, last night I was all set to place Ollie in the dog kennel in the barn but with THREE rounds of me knocking him down before his head left the new baby he decided he no longer wanted to rib shot her and bulldoze her over!!!  I left her ALONE in the pen with the two and sat at the kitchen table where I can see them out the window. They are very close to the house . The older two went in to their hut and she wanted in but they didn't let her eventually they did and they did awesome! My doe only butts her when I am around but that has a lot to do with the attention.


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## Ridgetop (Jun 18, 2015)

Congrats on your training and hard work.  in a herd situation the baby's mom would do what you did to Ollie to protect her new baby.  The two older kids would have to accept new kids in the herd.  In the wild, mom (in this case you) would drive them away so she could kid again.  Then she would protect them by butting aggressors. Eventually they will accept the new one in their herd.  If you eventually add another kid to the mix, Brooklyn will probably act like Ollie and his "sister". 

Ollie butting the tree in a tantrum is funny but imagine him doing that as an adult!  You are smart to train him young to respect you as herd leader.  Most people who have problems with behavior let the bad stuff go on too long because the animal was little and cute.  By the time they decide to do some kind of training it is too late.  You and everyone who offered advice are very wise to realize we need to train our young animals to the behaviors we want when they are still small for us to handle safely.  They are a lot more powerful than most people realize.  So glad the 2 older goats finally let Brooklyn into the "clubhouse".  LOL


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## samssimonsays (Jun 18, 2015)

Thank you Ridgetop! It really means a lot! I may baby my guys more than they should be and they are spoiled but I also work very hard to enforce behaviors that are acceptable, reprimand those that are not and praise those that are. They are very well behaved and listen well (MOST times ) I have a rabbit that runs their pen with them often and it was kinda cute to see Brooklyn (now Olive) gently touch her head to her after she would get head butted but I did tell her no and she responded well to it.  

Thank you all for all of the advice! I am soooo happy it has been working!


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## BlessedWithGoats (Jun 18, 2015)

Yay!! Great job Samantha!!!


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## Hens and Roos (Jun 19, 2015)

Good Work!  It is hard to introduce new ones into a herd.  I have noticed that our 1st girl still takes head butting from the 3 does.


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## Goat Whisperer (Jun 20, 2015)

Glad he is behaving himself!!  He has really given you a run for your money  Are you 100% sure he is a wether? LOL I haven't ever had a buck act like that, I'm shocked that a wether is doing this!

Glad you are "learning" him a lesson! I hope whoever you place him with is as strict as you when it comes to his behavior problems, especially if he is going to a home with human kids!


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## samssimonsays (Jun 22, 2015)

Goat Whisperer said:


> Glad he is behaving himself!!  He has really given you a run for your money  Are you 100% sure he is a wether? LOL I haven't ever had a buck act like that, I'm shocked that a wether is doing this!
> 
> Glad you are "learning" him a lesson! I hope whoever you place him with is as strict as you when it comes to his behavior problems, especially if he is going to a home with human kids!


Well, they DO have human kids AND he would be a single goat for 7 months until they get their babies.... I am apprehensive about it because he is still needing reminders on manners BUT I am strict. I love them to death and I do pamper/spoil them as well as shower them with attention BUT I won't tolerate any bad behaviors either. My two still push her around some but they stop when I use my "stern" voice. He certainly has given me a run for my money... his newest thing is to bite my rabbits ears. He pulled one out of my hands while I was posing her checking her over before a show on Friday! 

He is definitely a wether though...    He still had the shriveled up sack when I got him that took FOREVER to fall off. He really does mellow out but when he hits a growth spurt it seems like he gets horrible on me again ! Never mean or nasty towards me or anyone just stubborn and bull headed


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