# doe is kindling on the wire



## Ebers (Feb 24, 2016)

My big gray doe is kindling on the wire & a baby fell out on the floor... as far as I can tell it's the 1st one so I put it in the nest box & she jumps in the nest box & starts digging through the hay very aggressively. She hasn't pulled any fur & she's very nervous acting so I turned off the light & left her alone. She is a nz cross & the guy I got her from said she'd had 2 previous litters she lost the 1st litter but raised the whole 2nd litter which was 12 kits. Any advice would be appreciated thanks in advance


----------



## Latestarter (Feb 24, 2016)

@Bunnylady @Samantha drawz @Pastor Dave @Pearce Pastures @frustratedearthmother ?


----------



## samssimonsays (Feb 24, 2016)

Take baby away until she is done. It could potentially kill it if she digs on it. Just keep it warm somewhere on your body, heating pads have never worked for me. And hopefully when she is all done and the nest is made, when you check on the littles in there to count for dead ones slip it back in. This has usually worked for me but I had a very close relationship with all my does.


----------



## samssimonsays (Feb 24, 2016)

It may have just come too quick and she panicked, she may have had a brain fart or she may not want it. Many things could be in play but I would keep it somewhere safe and warm until the kidding is over with and then attempt to slip it back in.


----------



## frustratedearthmother (Feb 24, 2016)

I don't know nothing about birthing rabbits....  

Sounds like Samantha has been there and done that before.  Seems like good advice.  

Hope it goes well!


----------



## Ebers (Feb 24, 2016)

Ok I'll do that... she's the most tame doe I have, I try to pet them several times a day to keep them used to me & my scent as well as using it as a way to check their physical condition she's always waiting at the door of her cage for me


----------



## samssimonsays (Feb 24, 2016)

That is great that she is so friendly. She knows your smell and I would just pet her back before you grab the kit to put back in the nest to be safe. With mine, it didn't matter. As long as my smell was on them when they went back in, she was fine. I could foster kits without worrying about their smells. Every doe is so different though. Good luck!


----------



## Ebers (Feb 24, 2016)

What did you do to get em so used to you?


----------



## samssimonsays (Feb 24, 2016)

I handled them often, gave treats, was able to cradle them on their backs and they were "trained" so that they did not kick or scratch and were very mild mannered. I raised French and Mini Lops so there is a difference but I also had a NZ White doe I could do anything to.


----------



## Pastor Dave (Feb 24, 2016)

I agree with Samantha. The kit needs to stay warm until able to return to the nest box. If she truly had 12 in a previous kindle and raised them, she will surely pull hair for her nest(and know a little bit of what she is doing). I collect and store some in a crushed lime sack to use in case they don't line the nest. 
I have a doe I purchased and had the breeder go ahead and have her bred for me because I didn't have a mature buck at the time. She was probably stressed with the move, learning the new environment, new feed, and me, etc. She had a reduced sized litter, but did raise them. The next time she had adjusted and had a larger litter and is doing fine now.
I also breed my does in pairs in case one has a large litter and another a small, I will try to add in some to the mother with the smaller litter and use her as a foster mother if she has proven well in the past.
Instinct should help your doe to do better in the future.


----------



## Ebers (Feb 24, 2016)

Ok I just checked on her & she's got a squirming lil pile of babies in there now & she's pulled a good amount of fur so I put the 1st baby back in with her. I think samantha was right I think it caught her off guard & surprised her when she had the 1st one


----------



## samssimonsays (Feb 24, 2016)

I am glad she had the rest in her nest and did what she was supposed to! I know that instant feeling of panic all too well when they do something wrong like that. Congrats on the new little members  I hope all goes smoothly from now on.


----------



## Ebers (Feb 24, 2016)

It was crazy I ran in the house & told my wife to come out & help me then met her at the door & said no nevermind stay here cause the doe's real nervous actn it was crazy for a second but I sat down & posted the issue & had time to calm down.... I'm sure me bein excited wasn't helping my doe any either but I was shook up when I found the kit in the floor under her cage


----------



## Ebers (Feb 24, 2016)

Ok well as far as I can tell she had 11... 1 died in the nest box but the kit that I found on the floor is doin great & apparently she ate 1 cause all I found was the head, if she raises the 9 I'll definitely consider it a successful experience


----------



## samssimonsays (Feb 24, 2016)

That's a pretty good litter!


----------



## BlessedWithGoats (Feb 24, 2016)

Aww! Congratulations!! Good job helping the little one!
Sorry about the two that didn't make it.


----------



## Ebers (Feb 24, 2016)

I know ppl that cull down to a litter of 8 but I just can't do that if they have the will or ability to survive they get to live...


----------



## Latestarter (Feb 24, 2016)

Right up till the time you "off" them, skin them, gut them, cook them and EAT them! Yum!


----------



## Ebers (Feb 24, 2016)

Latestarter said:


> Right up till the time you "off" them, skin them, gut them, cook them and EAT them! Yum!


Exactly lol


----------



## Pastor Dave (Feb 25, 2016)

Just like Hansel & Gretel. Fed well and pampered & then into the oven they go.


----------



## Ebers (Feb 25, 2016)

I read somewhere that they sometimes eat the kits out of nervousness, they said it's  a survival instinct because they know they can always have another litter if they survive or that she possibly confused it with placenta that she was eating but the nervous theory wd make sense to me because she was very vocal & whiny when I checked on her. After talking with the guy I got her from he said "oh yeah I think that's how she lost her 1st litter... she ate them" that was something he conveniently left out when I bought her lol.
He hadn't bred her since last spring because he raises his buns outdoors, I've got em inside in an insulated climate controlled room do you think if I breed her right back say when the kits are 2-4 wks old she'll have a better chance of remembering what to do? It really seemed like she was unsure of what was goin on


----------



## samssimonsays (Feb 25, 2016)

It could have also already been dead. They will usually do that then too. Mine never did until one day I found only a head in the food dish  I could have gone without THAT for sure! That rabbit really liked to play tricks on me


----------



## Ebers (Feb 25, 2016)

That's all I found too was a head it was pretty gross


----------



## Ebers (Feb 25, 2016)

I've raised rabbits off & on all my life but yesterday was the 1st time I'd ever had anything like that happen... my doe seemed super stressed by the whole experience but she's bk to normal as far as I can tell


----------



## samssimonsays (Feb 25, 2016)

Yes, it is pretty gross...

It is funny because I have a pretty strong stomach. Always have. I can handle a lot but the 2 times that I have ever gagged with the rabbits was when I thought she hadn't cleaned up a placenta and when I grabbed the glob, it was hard. I should have never looked but I did.   Was about 5 heads of babies. She had 10 in the nest alive and well. G-R-O-S-S!  Then there was the one who left the head in her food dish. I can handle half eaten babies, dead babies and even legs left but there is something about the head that gets me.  
I am glad the rest are doing well and hopefully she continues to do well


----------



## Pastor Dave (Feb 25, 2016)

Ebers said:


> After talking with the guy I got her from he said "oh yeah I think that's how she lost her 1st litter... she ate them" that was something he conveniently left out when I bought her lol.


Now if you decide to sell a Sr. buck or Sr. doe for whatever the reason, you know to remain reputable you need to be honest and upfront about habits and "defects". If you ever buy off that breeder again, you will question what kind of stock you're getting and what he might be hiding or holding back. That is not a good way to interact with folks getting started or otherwise. Of course if I need to cull a particular rabbit, and no one wants to buy it or even take it, mine go in the crock pot.


----------



## Ebers (Feb 26, 2016)

I appreciate all the help & advice I wanted to post a pic of the kits


----------



## Goatgirl47 (Feb 26, 2016)

Awww, they're cute! 

Sorry about the two you lost...


----------



## Ebers (Feb 26, 2016)

Goatgirl47 said:


> Awww, they're cute!
> 
> Sorry about the two you lost...


It's ok I don't like it but that's just part of raising critters


----------



## Hens and Roos (Feb 26, 2016)

congrats on the kits!


----------



## MMWB (Feb 27, 2016)

Sometimes, I think some die because they just aren't viable.  I'm surprised at the does leaving the heads.  Traditionally many wild prey species eat young that die. It deters the odor of decomposition down to avoid predators snooping around and also decreases the fostering of undesirable bacteria.  As far as I know, most all animals eat the afterbirth.


----------



## Ebers (Feb 27, 2016)

MMWB said:


> Sometimes, I think some die because they just aren't viable.  I'm surprised at the does leaving the heads.  Traditionally many wild prey species eat young that die. It deters the odor of decomposition down to avoid predators snooping around and also decreases the fostering of undesirable bacteria.  As far as I know, most all animals eat the afterbirth.


I don't doubt that she would've eatn the whole thing but the head had gotten pushed back between a gap between the nest box & the cage wall, it makes sense about a prey animal eating dead offspring thanks for the feedback


----------



## Ebers (Feb 29, 2016)

If I wanted to breed my doe right back how long should I wait to rebreed her?


----------



## Pastor Dave (Feb 29, 2016)

The commercial breeders will immediately breed again as soon as the doe kindles. She has the next litter as soon as the last litter is weaned at 4 weeks. If a doe loses her litter, she can be bred immediately. My does get a week off between weaning and being bred again. Others have their own time management methods.


----------



## Ebers (Mar 6, 2016)

Is 22 wks old too young to breed my nz x cali  doe she's big so I was just wonderin what ppl thought


----------



## animalmom (Mar 7, 2016)

I would wait the additional 4 weeks until she is 26 weeks old.  I don't think that gaining 4 weeks on your breeding program is worth the life of the doe.  I'm very conservative when it comes to breeding my does.  I also understand the impatience of wanting to breed a doe and have a litter of kits.  Just my 2 cents worth.


----------



## Ebers (Mar 7, 2016)

A pic of the kits at 11 days old


----------



## Ebers (Mar 20, 2016)

A new pic of the kits


----------

