# What to file goats horns with?



## Moody (Jan 25, 2015)

9 month old dis budded buck has a scur growing forward toward his head. I can fit a finger between his head and the horn. What do you use to file it? I have read that I can cut about 1/2 inch off without too much blood bug I think, I would rather file for now.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 25, 2015)

Actually taking enough off so that it doesn't dig into his head but not taking it all the way down is better done with a gigli wire. It is fast ... a few seconds and its off....

I have an article I wrote and there are pics towards the bottom that shows the wire and the results.

http://www.backyardherds.com/resources/horns-dis-bud-polled.31/


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## OneFineAcre (Jan 25, 2015)

I saw Dr. Brenda use the gigli wire on a couple of goats on the "Incredible Dr. Pol".  It was very fast.


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## Moody (Jan 26, 2015)

I saw one on amazon for $15  

Hopefully I can youtube a demonstration. I have the milkstand and a husband to help. I wonder about him moving. Can one safely remove an inch without hitting the blood vessel?


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## Southern by choice (Jan 26, 2015)

That is where you need to be careful. How long is the scur can you get a pic?


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## Moody (Jan 26, 2015)




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## Moody (Jan 26, 2015)

My husband thinks it will go past his face but I think we should take care of it before we lose valuable space to maneuver.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 26, 2015)

You should be able to take an inch off. If the scur is wiggly and loose it could easily knock off (like if he banged it on a fence or tree)and you may get some blood but no big deal. This kind is easy. The ones that are hard and like real horns... as in my bucks case... do not wiggle and are hard as can be are the ones that can have a major blood vein. If cut to low you may need to cauterize.

This first time you may want to run him to your vet and watch how the vet does the gigli and where a safe place on the scur is then you can continue this as long as you need too.

Dr Brenda from the Dr Pol show should have sedated that goat there was way too much blood and that was IMO ridiculous to put the goat through that. I love the Dr Pol show but they don't know much about goats. Goats aren't cattle. They lanced a CL lump and contaminated everything.


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## treeclimber233 (Jan 26, 2015)

Why not just band the scur? That is what I do with my goats. I have tried to cut a horn and the goat was fighting and screaming and I was not getting anywhere with cutting.  Banding is easy. Just make sure the band is as close to the skull as possible. Do it once and it is done. Not like having to cut over and over again.


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## Moody (Jan 26, 2015)

treeclimber233 said:


> Why not just band the scur? That is what I do with my goats. I have tried to cut a horn and the goat was fighting and screaming and I was not getting anywhere with cutting.  Banding is easy. Just make sure the band is as close to the skull as possible. Do it once and it is done. Not like having to cut over and over again.



This works well? I have seen that mentioned when I was googling but I also saw some say that it didn't work.


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## frustratedearthmother (Jan 26, 2015)

I recently banded a scur on a doe and it worked great!   Her scur was about 4 inches long, kind of scaly, curved and very, very loose.  It came off in about a week and there was only a pink spot under it.  I don't think I would try it on a larger more secure scur.

I had tried it once before and it didn't work because the band rolled up.  The next time I got it as close to the skull as I could and wrapped some duct tape around it.  Worked like a charm!


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## Southern by choice (Jan 26, 2015)

I have only ever heard how painful the banding is.

What did you observe? Were the scurs stubby "horns" or wiggly ?


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## treeclimber233 (Jan 26, 2015)

The one I banded was being a real meanie in the herd.  He was ramming everybody for no reason. just because he could. He was the only one with horns and took advantage. I don't know how anybody can rate the pain caused by the band. How do they know it hurts? His horn fell off after a while with little blood. Just make sure the band is as close to his skull as possible.


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## Moody (Jan 27, 2015)

I don't have the tools required for banding at this moment. I keep hoping my doe has all girl kids because I haven't thought much about weathering the boys, lol. They probably should be wethered since they are a alpine nubian mix. I can't imagine too many want a mixed buck. 

Anyway, I think I will try the gigli saw first. Just about 1/2-3/4 inch. If that proves to be impossible or annoying since I already have lots of hoof trimming I do, I will try banding. He has trees around. I was hoping he would rub them on a tree and it would fall off or break off some to keep them small and out of the way. 


These scurs seem hard. I know he broke a bit of the other one off when I first got him but it didn't all break off. Just when I try to check out his scur, he pushes against me. Like I am trying to play with him he pushes. I don't play with him. I give him scratches but I don't play. Anyway with his pushes, it is firmly seated. No wiggling.


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## Moody (Jan 27, 2015)




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## Moody (Jan 27, 2015)

Crap. This one had uniform scurs. Was bumped on the way into the feeding area and bam. Blood is pouring out everywhere. I have nothing to stop it. Just paper towels and now she has freaked out.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 27, 2015)

If it were me I would have the does surgically removed. The other pic of the buckling I would gigli, but if you plan on keeping him them maybe just have him done too while it is still cold weather.
It is relatively easy to change dressings and then you are done with it.


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## Moody (Jan 27, 2015)

I've had her for a few months and hers were always the same size. Now she is running amok because I can't catch her. Will she be ok despite all the blood?

I will check on costs for removing her scurs and his too but it is property tax time, and house insurance time and then income tax time. Not much free dough right now.


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## frustratedearthmother (Jan 27, 2015)

The doe that I did seemed to have NO side-effects at all except for a little head shaking the first 10 minutes or so.  After that - nothing.  If she had seemed to be in any real pain, I would have chickened out and cut it off, lol.  But, her scur was very, very loose.   

I've got bucks with bigger, more firmly attached scurs that I would never attempt.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 27, 2015)

frustratedearthmother said:


> The doe that I did seemed to have NO side-effects at all except for a little head shaking the first 10 minutes or so.  After that - nothing.  If she had seemed to be in any real pain, I would have chickened out and cut it off, lol.  But, her scur was very, very loose.
> 
> I've got bucks with bigger, more firmly attached scurs that I would never attempt.


Could you even band the does? they seen too short to be able to keep a band on.


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## Moody (Jan 27, 2015)

I called a local vet to ask about dehorning. $47 I was told. I asked about anesthesia and was told I could have them use it?! No good estimate of price. They were just going to cut off horns. 

For them to come here is $70 (because I need to be shown how to do a blood draw to test for cae). And for a fecal they want $28. I feel the fecal is way overpriced and I am sure the dehorning would be too when all is taken into consideration.


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## mysunwolf (Jan 27, 2015)

About the blood... I had a ram lamb with scurs that we tried to clip the tips off of because they were growing into his head. Well, I got hold of the horn base with the clippers and he jerked back at the last second. The whole horn came off. Went to do the next one, same thing. There was a ton of blood, same as in your photo, and he was definitely in pain, shaking his head quite a bit. We put pressure on the wounds (very sensitive) and then sprinkled with corn starch. I also poured peroxide on the wounds for a few days after that. He hated me for months, but he was just fine. So fine, in fact, that his horns grew back thicker and sturdier and still trying to grow into his head. Sent him to the processor soon after that. 

IMO, if you are planning to keep this goat long-term, you should get her de-horned properly and save yourself the hassle of trimming, banding, and more blood in the future.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 27, 2015)

The goat does need to be sedated for complete removal and the sinus cavity will be open. It is worth it. When the removal is done the iron is used to cauterized.

This is our story... well actually Millies... in  this post I did a "spoiler alert" because photos are graphic, the other photos are up but the graphic ones are hidden.
http://www.backyardherds.com/threads/de-horned-2yr-old-doe-week-3-update.28257/page-2#post-358403


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## Moody (Jan 29, 2015)

That looks like a rough procedure. You made it look easy, though. And I'm sure in the end worth it. 

I wonder about banding working on a horn that is wide but not so thick.....seems like the band would put lots of  pressure on the sides and not enough on the top and bottom? I wish it was him who knocked off the horn instead of the doe.


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## Moody (Feb 2, 2015)

Can you band it if it is wide but thin?


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## Moody (Feb 2, 2015)

Well the man and I went out with a gigli saw and it just broke off about 3/4 way through. Not as much blood as with the doe. We had the blood stop powder. He didn't stop eating his grain, tough guy. They are brittle but didn't feel wobbly b


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