# Norseofcourse's lambing thread - 2015 - over, or not?



## norseofcourse (Feb 25, 2015)

Less than 3 weeks away from my first possible lambing date (March 16), so I thought I'd start a lambing thread (we need some balance to all those kidding threads   ) !!

I got a few pictures today.  First up is Number 3, this is her first lambing.  She is a nicely built, chunky little girl.




 

Her mother is Rose.  This will be Rose's third lambing.  This is Number 3 and Rose together:



 

And finally, we have Gracie.  This will also be Gracie's third lambing.  She is the only one so far who has had more than a single.  Last year she had twins.  Here she is sampling hay out of the cart, as Elding, my ram, looks on:



 

I didn't get a good full-body shot of Elding today, but there are pics of him on my BYH journal.  He is the sire of all of this year's lambs.  He's also the sire of Number 3.

Here are all the sheep at the hay feeder.  It was a bit dark in the barn.  From the left they are:  Number 3; Brosa (who aborted her lamb a couple weeks ago); Rose; Gracie; and Elding.  Brosa and Gracie have longer wool because they were not sheared this past fall.  Once the weather starts to warm up, I'll be starting to shear them.



 

I've been checking udders every Friday for over a month.  Rose has the most udder development, but by the looks of their vulvas, they look within a couple weeks of each other.  Rose has lambed first of everyone the last two years, and I suspect she'll repeat that this year.

March 1 is supposed to be the beginning of a warmup - finally!!  I sure hope they are right.  We need some nice days to melt all this snow and ice before lambs get here.

And so the waiting begins


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## bonbean01 (Feb 25, 2015)

Love lambing threads!!!!  Just one thing....Number 3 is beautiful and really needs a good NAME before she lambs!!!! 

And good for you checking udders only every Friday...LOL...my poor girls got their privates and udders checked every feeding for a good month and they didn't appreciate it 

Looking forward to # 3's naming and for your lambs


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## luvmypets (Feb 25, 2015)

Beautiful! 

Im thinking number 3 has a betsy kind of look. You could also do Molly or if you want her name to be like her mom try Daisy.


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## SheepGirl (Feb 26, 2015)

Please remind me... these are Icelandic or shetlands? I can only tell them a part when I see them side by side, lol. I'm thinking they're Icelandic since you milk them.


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## BrownSheep (Feb 26, 2015)

Icelandics (shetlands have buggy pygmy goat eyes....in my experience)


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## norseofcourse (Feb 27, 2015)

Thanks everyone!  I keep trying to think of a good name for Number 3!  Except for my first two, Rose and Gracie, I've been going with Icelandic names.  So far nothing has felt right.

@bonbean01 - lol you don't know how hard it's been to check udders only once a week!  This is my third lambing season, and I'm trying to be somewhat less obsessive, and trust what I've learned from the signs I've seen before.  I'm probably just delaying the inevitable, though!  

@SheepGirl - yep, BrownSheep is right, Icelandics.  And I"ll be milking them again this year, I'm looking forward to it.

Tonight was my weekly udder check.  All 3 pregnant ewes are doing well, udders are still gradually increasing.  Rose still has the most udder development.  Her daughter appears to be following in her mom's footsteps, with an udder and teats that seem decently sized.

Just 17 days till the first possible lambing date!  I have been gradually increasing their grain, checking their body condition score now and then to make sure they're not getting too fat or too thin.  Keeping their minerals filled.  Gathering stuff for my lambing kit.  And hoping for an end to this super cold weather we've been having!


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## goats&moregoats (Feb 27, 2015)

couple of name suggestions for #3             Gróa is pronounced like "gro-a". Eydís is pronounced like "eighties". There is also Anna and Hanna.


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## Fireflyfarms (Mar 4, 2015)

Good luck! i have been driving myself nuts checking utters but that was wrong, the other ewe that was less bagged up went first, i think they do this on purpose to just drive us crazy...


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## norseofcourse (Mar 4, 2015)

goats&moregoats said:


> couple of name suggestions for #3 Gróa is pronounced like "gro-a". Eydís is pronounced like "eighties". There is also Anna and Hanna.



Thanks - I've worked my way down to a 'short list' and now down to Birta (brightness) or Lukka (luck).  I'm leaning towards Lukka.



Fireflyfarms said:


> Good luck! i have been driving myself nuts checking utters but that was wrong, the other ewe that was less bagged up went first, i think they do this on purpose to just drive us crazy...



lol - yes, they know how to drive us crazy!  The one that drove me craziest last year was Brosa - she lambed six weeks after the others, and I swore she was going to lamb 'any minute now' for about a month!  This year, I am expecting Rose and Gracie to lamb within a week or so of March 16.  Number 3 is a first-timer, but judging by how her vulva looks compared to Rose and Gracie, and Brosa's vulva last year (I have plenty of pictures, lol), she should lamb in about the same time frame.  Just watch her prove me wrong and wait a month - LOL

I've been reading my notes from last year, and I noted that Rose 'dropped' (the lamb shifted lower, giving her that hollowed-out look in front of her hipbones) five days before she gave birth.  I wish I had noted when I noticed Gracie or Brosa had dropped.  Another thing to obsess over... *ahem* take note of this year.


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## norseofcourse (Mar 7, 2015)

Yesterday was another Friday night udder check     All 3 sheep have nicely developing udders.  The ewes are also getting wider, and I'm sure I saw some movement on Rose's right side (tried to feel, but it was hard to feel through all her wool).

Then, this morning, I finally caved, and checked their udders again!  I told myself it was just to see if there was any difference between morning and evening.  I didn't feel much if any difference, so I'm going to try very hard not to check again, till next Friday evening.

I've been re-reading my notes from last year.  There are two signs that may be good indicators for mine.  First is the ewe looking like the lamb(s) have 'dropped', several days before lambing.  Second is looseness of the vulva lips, that seems to happen within a day or so of lambing.  So those are the two things I'm going to watch for the most.

Size, heat and appearance of udder doesn't seem to help me tell how close they are to lambing.  Neither does behavior - or, rather, I read way too much into their behavior for it to be a useful predictor.  Goat people talk about the 'doe code' - let me tell you, sheep have their own version that drives you just as crazy     Various kinds of discharge seem to come and go at random for weeks before they lamb.  And I haven't had much luck with checking ligaments.

Only 9 days till the first possible lambing date!!  And thankfully, the weather is finally starting to moderate, with daytime temperatures above freezing all next week.  Great timing for getting things ready for the little ones.

Horray for spring and lambing season!!!!


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## norseofcourse (Mar 10, 2015)

I got some updated pictures today, we're now 6 days till the first possible lambing date.  The snow is melting, but there's still lots of it.  And most of the ground is still frozen, so there's lot of standing water.  Where it's thawed, there's mud...

I can tell the sheep's water intake has increased, and I've been increasing their grain.  No one appears to have 'dropped' yet.

Number 3, who is now Lukka, doesn't look all that big, but she's likely to have just a single.  She's a bit shy, but will come up and sniff my fingers.






Her mom, Rose, is starting to 'waddle' when she walks   .  She was huge last year, and only had a single (as she did her first lambing).  I've been told that if a sheep hasn't twinned by her second lambing, she's likely to continue just having singles.  I won't mind a single from her, that'll just mean plenty of milk for me, too!





And finally, Gracie is looking bigger than she was last year, but since she wasn't sheared in the fall, some of it is wool.  Last year Gracie was smaller than Rose, and Gracie had twins.  If Gracie starts getting really big this year, who knows - twins again, or maybe even triplets?  Only Gracie knows for sure, and she's not telling.


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## norseofcourse (Mar 13, 2015)

Tonight was the regular Friday night udder check     My first possible lambing date is only 3 days away, so I may have lambs very soon!

Rose still has the biggest udder, with Lukka and Gracie about the same size, half of what Rose has.  I realize that udder size doesn't seem to be an indicator of how close they are to lambing, but it's gotten to be habit and it's interesting to see how their udders progress.

I also checked their vulvas.  From my notes and pictures the last two years, a somewhat reliable sign of lambing was a 'looseness' to the lips of the vulva, one to two days before they lambed.  I didn't see any looseness yet.

I did see a bit of discharge from Rose and Gracie, but unless it's excessive or a bad color, I'm not going to keep track of it.  Two years of noting color, amount, and appearance of various discharges from pregnant sheep taught me that the primary purpose of the discharges was to drive the shepherd crazy.  I think the sheep were also secretly laughing at me for being so obsessed about it ("Did you see?  I got her to take a picture of my butt again today!")   

I do think Rose has dropped a little bit.  I thought Lukka had dropped a little the other day, but now she doesn't look like it.  'Dropping' may be a somewhat reliable sign for mine, about 5 days or so from lambing.  I'll be keeping track of it to see if there is a pattern.

Things are warming up!  We have less snow, and more boot-sucking mud.  I will start trimming some wool off the girls this weekend.  I'm especially looking forward to trimming Gracie and Brosa, since their wool is super long, and it will be interesting to work with it.  Sunday may be sunny enough to get more pictures.


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## AriesX (Mar 14, 2015)

They definitely like to drive us crazy!!  As far as I can tell, udders just confirm pregnancy but not delivery date.   Last year, we drove ourselves crazy trying to guess.  This year, we used a marking crayon and know due dates.  It is much easier.


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## norseofcourse (Mar 15, 2015)

Aries - I like a challenge  

I may someday get a marking harness, but for now it's a learning process.  At least I only have 3 this year!

Tomorrow is day 142, so it's getting very close!!!  Icelandics have a gestation period of 142 to 144 days, and I have a feeling all the ewes got bred not too long after Elding went in with them.  I've been seeing and feeling baby movement.  Water intake has increased.

First up is Lukka, she is looking wider than she was just a few days ago.



 

Next is Rose, Lukka's mom.  My gosh, is she wide enough for two??  Of course, she was really wide last year and only had one, so I'm not making any guesses.  I am fairly sure she dropped the other day, so she may be the first to lamb.



 

And finally Gracie.  Her extra-long wool makes it hard to tell much.  I didn't get anything trimmed off today, so that's on my list for tomorrow.



 

I've been doing pretty good for the most part, since I knew there wasn't much reason to get too excited till at least day 142.  But that's tomorrow, and I can feel the excitement and obsessing start to kick in      I don't care how many, but I'm hoping for boys.  It's too tempting to want to keep the girls, and I don't need more sheep!  I'm also looking forward to seeing what colors I get.  I know Gracie carries brown, and so does Lukka.  All the ewes carry spotting.  Looking forward to lambs soon!!!


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## bonbean01 (Mar 15, 2015)

Everything I read said the same thing...if they don't have twins come the second lambing, you won't ever get any from that ewe....WRONG!!!!  Dolly our oldest ewe, now 8 years old and always a single lamb and a puny one to boot....had twins last year and twins this year...she didn't read the books and your girls may not have either...don't rule it out!   Not all sheep read the manuals   Good luck and hoping for a good lambing season for you!!!


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## norseofcourse (Mar 16, 2015)

Thanks bonbean!  I'm not ruling anything out, but I don't want to count my lambs before they hatch either lol.  It's fun to imagine twins or even triplets bouncing around, but I'm trying not to drive myself crazy - well, *too* crazy!

I got Gracie up on the stand today and trimmed dirty wool and tags away from her back end and udder, and started on the long wool back there.  I didn't do a complete crutching job, but she was nice and patient so I didn't want to overstress her.  I'll get more done over the next few days (I need to find better scissors anyway).

No one looks super close to lambing yet, this will be a test of how good I'm getting to know the signs and my sheep.  Or not! LOL


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## BrownSheep (Mar 16, 2015)

Look at that wool! The lock charcteristics look beautiful!


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## norseofcourse (Mar 18, 2015)

Thanks BrownSheep!  It will be really interesting to work with Gracie and Brosa's wool, I've never let it get this long before.  I've started trimming some off Gracie, plan to get more done tomorrow.  The longest stuff has got to be well over a foot long!  I want to try my hand at separating the thel (soft undercoat) and processing it and the longer coarser tog separately.

No lambs yet!  I'm still thinking Rose will go first.  There's some looseness to her vulva that I don't see in the other two yet.  Rose still has the largest udder, but Gracie's udder has gotten much bigger over the past week, it's now much larger than Lukka's.  This is Gracie's third lambing, so her udder knows what it's supposed to do! lol

I am still thinking Rose is within a few days.  The waiting continues...


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## norseofcourse (Mar 20, 2015)

I was really hoping to have had lambs by now, but it's another Friday night so I checked udders.  Rose still has the biggest udder, but Gracie's is nearly as big.  They all have swollen vulvas, but Rose's is looking really 'loose' today.  And Elding has gone up to her and sniffed her hind end a couple of times.

They all rushed in for their evening feeding like usual, but after I fed the ponies I looked out at the sheep's pasture, and Rose had gone out of the barn and was walking out there by herself.  I looked a little while later and she was laying down.  I watched for awhile, to see if maybe she would get up, paw, lay down again - anything - but she just stayed laying down.  I will be going out to check on her in a bit.  I'm not sure if she'll lamb tonight, but I think she's pretty close.

I can see lamb movement in the other two, but I don't think they're as close as Rose.  I don't think it'll be long though, Gracie appears to have dropped a bit.

Hoping for lambs soon!

Edited to add: 9pm and I just got in from spending some time out with the sheep, I still think Rose is close, but I don't think she'll lamb tonight.  I'm sure I'll be up at first light checking though!


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## OneFineAcre (Mar 20, 2015)

Looks like it will be soon


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## norseofcourse (Mar 21, 2015)

Rose is in early labor!  She probably waited till after I fed - not much keeps them from that food LOL

Had to come back in to get the camera, bbl with pictures - hoping for a boy or boys!


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## luvmypets (Mar 21, 2015)




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## bonbean01 (Mar 21, 2015)

Mine don't go off feed even a little before labor...LOL...several times have had a mama chow down at feeding time, then take herself off to the lambing jugs area and proceed into full labor


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## luvmypets (Mar 21, 2015)

My prediction is rose gives you twins a boy and a girl. Gracie will give you two girls and Lukka will give a boy.


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## norseofcourse (Mar 21, 2015)

One solid black (but undercoat may come in white). I think it's a boy.  I also think there's another one coming... gotta get back out there.


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## luvmypets (Mar 21, 2015)

norseofcourse said:


> One solid black (but undercoat may come in white). I think it's a boy.  I also think there's another one coming... gotta get back out there.


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## Goat Whisperer (Mar 21, 2015)

CONGRATS!!!!! 

Will be waiting for pics! So happy you got a ram lamb!


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## luvmypets (Mar 21, 2015)

We need an update  

If she has a second it will be a girl, and if not Im wrong


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## norseofcourse (Mar 21, 2015)

luvmypets, well you were half right     I am pretty sure they are both boys.






I'll know in a few weeks if their black color is going to turn grey or not.  They're both lively and have nursed, and Rose is taking good care of them.  I think it took her a bit of time to realize 'Hey, I've got two this time!'

Have to get chores done, will write more later.


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## OneFineAcre (Mar 21, 2015)

Awesome
They are beautiful
Congrats


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## luvmypets (Mar 21, 2015)

Yayyyy, they are to die for 

Dont hate me if im jealous


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## norseofcourse (Mar 22, 2015)

Thanks everyone... having a problem.  I think Rose only wants one.  This morning I watched her push the black and white one away several times.  He was the second born.  I did see him nurse yesterday.  Rose licked him off (not as much as her first born).  They seem to call to each other and answer each others calls.  But she seems to be paying much more attention to her firstborn, and wasn't letting the other nurse.

I felt in his mouth and it felt cool compared to the firstborn.  So I put a neckrope on Rose and held her against the wall and he nursed a few times.  Rose was not happy about him nursing, and she was very unhappy about me holding her, and successfully got away several times, luckily I kept ahold of the rope.

I may need to run out and get a nipple in case I need to milk her and bottle feed him - how do I know when it's time to do that?  Hopefully even if it comes to that, he can stay with her - he's cuddling up to his brother and Rose still seems a little bit interested in him... 

How often do I hold Rose and let him nurse?


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## BrownSheep (Mar 22, 2015)

If you have something similar to a milking head catch I would put her in that for a while.


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## purplequeenvt (Mar 22, 2015)

X2 what Brownsheep said. Doesn't sound like she's outright rejecting him so if you work on it now, you may be able to fix the problem. 

I had a first time ewe this year that was being stupid about her twins. I don't have a head gate/grafting gate so I put a halter on her and tied her in a corner with one side against a wall. I also took a rope and looped it around her outside back leg and tied that to the wall behind her so that she couldn't kick the babies off. I left her tied pretty tightly for a couple hours until she calmed down. Once she wasn't freaking out whenever they tried to nurse, I loosened the hobble enough to allow her to lay down. By the next day I was able to let her loose.


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## norseofcourse (Mar 22, 2015)

I've held Rose twice more to let the secondborn nurse.  She hates the restraint. She fought the hobbles so much she rubbed some raw spots on her legs, luckily small ones and I put healing lotion on them so hopefully they'll be ok.

This last time I put the neckrope on her and tied it short to the center support of the hay rack/feeder (very sturdy).  I gave her grain to eat which occupied her but not quite enough for her to be still enough for him to nurse.  She didn't have much room to move (I was right beside her blocking her), but she bashed her head into the feeder a few times, hard enough to give herself a bloody lip.  What finally worked was my holding onto a hind leg (since I didn't want to use hobbles again) - she still fought at first, but finally stayed still and he nursed a couple times.

Each session so far has left her panting and stressed.  I don't know if this is going to work.

I ended up putting both lambs in the small milking area, they can see and smell each other through the fencing panel but not get to each other.  I'll go back out in a bit, I'm hoping Rose will be happy to have them both back (or she'll be so happy with her firstborn that she'll stay still long enough for them to both nurse).  I'm running out of options, and I have to work tomorrow...

Oh, and I did check their teeth, and the secondborn had some slightly sharp bottom teeth so I filed them down a bit but that doesn't seemed to have made any difference yet.


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## AriesX (Mar 22, 2015)

We had a ewe last year that didn't seem to want her single lamb to nurse but I went and forced her still so he could eat every few hours during day and once in middle of night.  By the third day or so, they were doing fine on their own.   

Do you have a scale?  We like to weigh our lambs up to three times a day if we are worried about them.  Usually even the ones that seem small and like they aren't eating enough gain weight every few hours so we figure they are OK.


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## AriesX (Mar 22, 2015)

Those lambs are ADORABLE by the way!


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## norseofcourse (Mar 22, 2015)

I've gone out twice so far and more successfully held Rose to let her lambs nurse.  Between times they're in their own pen.  So for now, she either takes both of them or none at all.

She's improving some... this last time she actually stood without being tied or having a foot held and let them both nurse - at least for a little while.  She kept sniffing the second one's butt, how do I describe it... like she was mad at it.  When her firstborn took a break from drinking, she wouldn't stand still for the other one to continue, so I tied her again.  She let him drink a little without my having to hold a hind leg, then again wouldn't stand still, so I held up her leg and she behaved better.  It's still stressing her out but not quite as much now.  They both had nice full tummies when I put them back in their pen again.

It's to get down to 20F tonight.  They are in the barn run-in area, I can pile extra hay in there for bedding for them, will they be ok?  They do snuggle up together.

thank you everyone for the advice and encouragement!  This is so frustrating.  Rose was such an attentive mother with her other lambs, this is very surprising that she's being this way.  It may have been partly my fault - I moved her and her lamb so I could get Elding into his own pasture, and then she had the second one.  I've since read that having the second one in another spot might have contributed to her not bonding with it as well.


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## purplequeenvt (Mar 22, 2015)

You could try smearing a nice thick layer of Vicks on her nose. That way both lambs smell exactly the same. That might work unless she is more visual. Obviously they are easy to tell apart by sight. 

If it's a visual problem, you could make them matching jackets so she can't tell them apart by sight. 

These tricks have worked before for me, but they don't always work. Some ewes can see right through our plots.


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## norseofcourse (Mar 22, 2015)

@purplequeenvt - thanks - she seems pretty visual with it.  I am trying to figure out some kind of jackets because of the cold temps tonight.


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## purplequeenvt (Mar 22, 2015)

I wouldn't worry about them too much in 20 degree weather. As long as they are out of the wind and wet and have full bellies, they should be fine.


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## norseofcourse (Mar 22, 2015)

purplequeenvt said:


> I wouldn't worry about them too much in 20 degree weather. As long as they are out of the wind and wet and have full bellies, they should be fine.



But but but... I can make them cute little jackets out of some CAMO fleece that I have - and then they'll be invisible and Rose won't even notice the second one, right?


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## purplequeenvt (Mar 22, 2015)

IMO, they don't need the coats for warmth....BUT if it makes you feel better than go ahead.  I would do it solely for the potential that she wouldn't be able to tell her babies apart.


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## norseofcourse (Mar 23, 2015)

Just got back from midnight feeding.  Rose is getting *slightly* better, she again let them both nurse at first without me tying her.  But not for very long, so I tied her again and eventually had to hold a back leg to get her to hold still.  She's still angrily nosing at the secondborn's hind end, but I saw a little less head-butting behavior towards him.  As her milk goes through him and he gets more of her scent, I am hoping that will help.

I put their lamb jackets on.  They looked like little kids embarassed about bad Halloween costumes... lol.  Rose didn't seem to like the coats either and kept sniffing them.  I will leave their coats on for the first morning feeding, and see how it goes.  Their heads are very different, but the rest of them looks the same now.

Oh, in other news, Gracie and Lukka still haven't lambed yet.  Lukka's vulva is more swollen - I would not have thought she would lamb first, but that's how it's looking as of now.  Crossing fingers they hold off till Rose accepts both her lambs...


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## norseofcourse (Mar 23, 2015)

Rose did better this morning!  I had the neckrope on her, but I didn't have to tie her to the feeder.  I did have to hold her still at one point.  She is better at letting both nurse, and nosing/licking at the secondborn's butt with slightly less anger...  She still tried headbutting him a little so I don't trust her with them quite yet, but I have hope!

Didn't get a chance to get pics of the lambs in their jackets - but have to head back out, Lukka is going into labor.  And a first for any of my ewes - she didn't want to eat when I fed grain this morning!  She must have read that part of the book LOL


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## luvmypets (Mar 23, 2015)

Yay!!!!  

My new prediction is a single girl since Rose gave you boys.


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## norseofcourse (Mar 23, 2015)

@luvmypets - yep, she had a single girl!  It's dark but I think its color is brown, with a lot of white.  Pictures soon...

And Rose let the twins nurse without me putting a neckrope on her!  She is still pushing the secondborn away somewhat, but I think she's coming around, and another session or two might do it.


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## luvmypets (Mar 23, 2015)

pictuuress?


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## norseofcourse (Mar 23, 2015)

LOL I hurried as fast as I could!  

Here are the twins in their little camo jackets:




 

I tried to get a good picture of them standing up in them, but they wouldn't stand still!  I took the jackets off for now.

Here is Lukka and her girl lamb.  That lamb really needs a bath!  Lukka had her in the barn run-in, and dug down to the dirty floor.  Getting a presentable picture was a challenge.  Notice her lighter color eyes?  That means her color is moorit (brown), learned that from purplequeenvt last year.  Lukka is doing great as a first time mom.



 

And I let the twins out to be with Rose again about a half hour ago, without needing to put a neckrope on Rose.  She let them nurse pretty well, but started pushing the secondborn around after they had nursed awhile, so I put them back in their pen.  I think she is really coming around though, and hope I'll soon be able to leave them together.  Here she is, checking out her 'less favorite' as she lets him nurse (you can see a glimpse of his twin on the other side):


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## luvmypets (Mar 23, 2015)

Omggggg!! Im so jealous. I wish I could be there and snuggle them!


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## norseofcourse (Mar 24, 2015)

Another midnight-ish feeding for the twins.  So much better than 24 hours ago.  I don't put the neckrope on Rose anymore and she lets them both nurse, although you can tell the firstborn is still her favorite and she's still not entirely happy about the secondborn but she's definitely much less hostile to him.

Gracie is getting closer, don't think tonight but maybe within a few days to a week at most.


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## norseofcourse (Mar 24, 2015)

Rose is still doing better about accepting her secondborn, but not quite well enough that I feel safe putting them together full-time.  She lets them both nurse for awhile, but then eventually starts some head-butting toward her secondborn.  Not nearly as bad as she was in the beginning, though!  It's a little frustrating, but I have to remind myself it's only been three days, and she's vastly improved from Sunday, when I had to tie her up and she still struggled and fought and absolutely *hated* being made to let him nurse.

I am hoping another day or two of this routine and she'll finally accept them both fully.

I wrote the above earlier this evening.  Just got in from another midnight feeding, and Rose is still doing well with the twins.  Put them back in their pen before she had a chance to get annoyed with the secondborn.  I think I saw her licking at his face through the fence panel - crossing fingers she is actually starting to accept him!

Gracie's vulva is swelling but doesn't look 'loose' yet.  I won't mind if she holds out at least another day or so.


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## AriesX (Mar 25, 2015)

How did your lambs do in the cold?  Is the ewe getting better with them?


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## norseofcourse (Mar 25, 2015)

AriesX said:


> How did your lambs do in the cold?  Is the ewe getting better with them?



The lambs have done fine in the cold so far, I only put the lamb jackets on them for one night.  Rose is getting better with them, but still not where I feel safe putting them with her full time.  They both run to her and nurse when I let them out, and she's ok with them both nursing, or with her firstborn nursing by himself, but generally walks away if the secondborn tries to nurse by himself.  And she still makes the occasional headbutt motion towards the secondborn.  She has come a LONG way from how she was on Sunday, and I am hoping she will eventually (soon!) come around and be good with both of them.


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## norseofcourse (Mar 26, 2015)

Rose is still doing pretty well with accepting both of her lambs, but not quite fully yet.  I let them out of their pen and they go right to her and nurse, and she's good with them for awhile as they follow her around and occasionally nurse.  But after about 15 minutes she starts making little headbutting motions towards the secondborn.

It's been 5 days now and she is much MUCH better than she was in the beginning when I had to tie and hold her to force her to let her secondborn nurse.  I guess I'm just worried - will she eventually fully accept him?  Are there specific signs I should watch for, to tell me she either is - or is not - bonding to both of her twins?

I think I saw/heard her call to her secondborn this evening, when he was about ten feet behind her.  She turned her head and gave that low 'mom ewe' call, and he bleated back and came to her.  She *might* have been calling to her firstborn, who was also behind her but closer, but it seemed that she was calling to the secondborn as he was further away.  If she was indeed calling to her secondborn, that is the first time she has done that (that I know of), and I know that's a good sign.  But ten minutes later is when she headbutted him away.... sigh.

At least the lambs are doing well under this routine, and it's easier than pulling one and bottlefeeding would be.  And I still have hope...


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## SheepGirl (Mar 26, 2015)

My last ewe lambed a week ago. She didnt accept her baby so I would hold her 2x a day so the baby could nurse. I went out one night and baby had a full belly, momma was feeding him on her own. Maybe you will have the same luck.


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## purplequeenvt (Mar 26, 2015)

She may never fully accept him, but as long as she lets him nurse he should be fine. 

I'd let them out together for a while and see what happens.


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## norseofcourse (Mar 26, 2015)

I did a bunch of switching around this evening.

I let Lukka and her lamb out with the rest of the flock, and redid her pen to put the twins in it (one side was kinda juryrigged).  Rose had the twins while I was setting everything up and getting their evening feed ready, so they were out of my sight for most of that time, but they all seemed ok when I was done and brought them all in to eat.

Lukka's lamb stuck right with her mom most of the time.  She did get a bit close to the other sheep and got headbutted a few times, so she's learning who isn't mom.  Then she was bopping around and got her front two legs in the water bucket (it's not a deep one).  She was stuck there for a bit - I decided to let her figure it out, unless she seemed to be in real trouble.  It took her a few tries but she got out.  I hated to leave, I'm such a worrier!  

I put the twins in their new pen for the night.  They now have a lot more room, and they had a blast running and jumping around like they're on pogo sticks!

@SheepGirl  and @purplequeenvt - thanks for the replies.  I'm going to let them out together longer this weekend and see how they do.  That'll give them one more day of 'supervised visitation' and then I'll cross my fingers and see how it goes.

I'm going to go out on a limb and predict Gracie will lamb by Sunday at the latest...


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## AriesX (Mar 26, 2015)

Lambs can be such a pain.  I'm glad she is getting better about accepting both.  cute pics btw.  Hopefully she is done with being a pain by the time the other one lambs.


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## norseofcourse (Mar 29, 2015)

As of yesterday morning, Rose is with her lambs full time     She still clearly favors the firstborn, but she lets them both nurse at the same time, and no longer seems hostile to her secondborn.  I'm so glad she finally accepted him.

Gracie is still holding out, although a bit earlier this afternoon she was near the gate between her pasture and Elding's, and Elding was sniffing her butt.  And she's holding her tail out and making a slight L shape with it, but not consistently.  I have spinners later this afternoon, maybe she wants to make me miss it... lol


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## norseofcourse (Mar 29, 2015)

Gracie may be starting early labor...


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## norseofcourse (Mar 29, 2015)

Either I misread: lying down, bracing with her back feet, grunting, lifting tail every few minutes, the start of a gap in the vulva lips, and even lifting her head and curling her upper lip... or Gracie decided to mess with me and stopped labor.  My money's on Gracie messing with me  

The limb I went out on might have snapped, but I think it'll be soon.  Really.  I think.


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## bonbean01 (Mar 29, 2015)

Either positioning lamb/s or messing with you   Won't be too much longer now


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## norseofcourse (Mar 30, 2015)

Gracie's still messing with me LOL

I do think she's getting real close.  I'm seeing some looseness/openness now to the lips of her vulva, and that's been the most reliable sign for mine so far, anywhere from 1 to 3 days before lambing.  And this evening her vulva was, for lack of a better term, a bit 'jiggly' when she walked, which should also mean she's within a day or so.

I spent some time out there today sitting with them, and Gracie really wanted petted.  Brosa always wants petted, but Gracie usually just wants petted when she's pregnant     She's been getting a lot of petting lately.  Rose wanted space when she lambed, but Gracie is fine with me near her, which is good just in case my help is needed, she won't be as stressed.  See how big she is!




 

Ignore the bad haircut... lol.  I've been shearing off her wool, gradually.  Partly because it's still been getting cold some nights, and partly because I don't want to stress her out standing still for trimming too long.

Rose is doing really well with the twins!  She still clearly favors the firstborn, but I was watching her today, and her secondborn came over when she was lying down, and he was pestering her.  She didn't headbutt him away at all!  And he was getting really annoying! LOL


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## JakeM (Mar 31, 2015)

I'm so glad that the twin is doing good! And the pictures are so adorable.


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## bonbean01 (Mar 31, 2015)

Love all the pics   And with the sheep haircut...looks like you've been taking lessons from me...and I have hair sheep that don't always shed off well...LOLOLOL!!!  Wishing you only good things with Gracie and her birthing!!!   That baby lamb of Rose's is adorable!!!


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## norseofcourse (Apr 1, 2015)

Still waiting on Gracie!!!   

LOL


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## norseofcourse (Apr 5, 2015)

norseofcourse said:


> From my March 29 post:  Gracie may be starting early labor...



Hahahahaha - early labor      well that 'early labor' has now lasted a week - have we set a record???

Gracie is still keeping me waiting.  She occasionally lifts her tail or paws before she lays down, just to keep messing with my mind.  Yesterday afternoon, she did pass some clear/reddish tinged mucous.  That may mean she is getting close, or it may mean she snuck into my house, read my sheepraising book, and decided, "Hey, this could really drive her crazy!".

I was just out with them, and she laid down again and was doing some little pushes, and her vulva lips were opening and it looked like a bit more mucous might have been trying to pass.  Then she got up and went out to graze.

So - maybe today, maybe tonight, maybe tomorrow - maybe next month


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## JakeM (Apr 6, 2015)

I'm going to bet my Wednesday night you shall have some more lambs running around.


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## norseofcourse (Apr 6, 2015)

@JakeM lol thanks I hope so!  I swear I think she's eating for ten.  Or at least trying to      It's amazing how fast a big pregnant sheep can move when there's food involved.  She is also really enjoying being petted.  Not only is she preggers, she's also shedding, so she's itchy.  She loves having me scratch around her neck, down her chest, and under her belly.  She'll lean into me like a big shaggy dog... it's such fun!

Lukka's little ewe lamb has been limping for a few days.  Mostly on her right hind.  I think one of the other sheep butted her.  I've checked her twice now for heat or swelling in any of her joints, or a hoof problem, or anything else that feels wrong, and found nothing.  She will put a little weight on it, but not much.  She is otherwise acting normally - nursing, staying with mom, trying to play with the other lambs, pretending to graze.  If it gets worse or lasts for much longer I'll give the vet a call.

It's supposed to rain all week.  I had hoped Gracie would lamb before everything turned to mud again.  They tend to hang out a lot in the run-in area when it's raining.  Not bad when it's all adult sheep, but it gets boring for little lambs.


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## norseofcourse (Apr 7, 2015)

Gracie appears to have gone into labor - I'm pretty sure this time!!!  lol

Heading back out, back later with results, if any....  

Think boys!!


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## Hens and Roos (Apr 7, 2015)




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## Chivoville (Apr 7, 2015)

We'll be waiting for pictures!


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## norseofcourse (Apr 7, 2015)

Twins!  First one a solid white male, second a female, I think brown and white.  Gracie took forever to decide she was finally ready, then the actual births went pretty fast.

Sorry, pictures will have to wait till tomorrow.  I got a few 'moment of birth' pictures so I'd know exactly what time each was born, but by the time they were looking cleaned and cute, I had the gloves and iodine out and was busy dipping navels and making sure they both nursed.  Then I had to rush and feed everyone because a storm was blowing in.

Gracie did really well.  The signs she was getting close, and her behavior, were different this year than the last two.  She was headbutting Lukka and making 'mom ewe' sounds at her.  She also spent a lot more time stretching, so maybe she was trying to get the lambs into position?


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## bonbean01 (Apr 7, 2015)

Congrats!!!!!!!


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## JakeM (Apr 7, 2015)

Yay! Congrats on the twin lambs.


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## norseofcourse (Apr 8, 2015)

Only one picture so far, the other one didn't come out well so I'll get more later today.  This is the little male:


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## Hens and Roos (Apr 8, 2015)

Congrats!


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## norseofcourse (Apr 10, 2015)

Things got a bit hectic for awhile!  Here's Gracie's second lamb, a little moorit (brown) and white girl.



 

The brown on her body will get a lot lighter, as her undercoat comes in white.  The brown on her face and legs will stay the same, since there's no undercoat there.

Gracie's twins are doing very well, and they'll go out with everyone tomorrow.

Rose's twins are growing fast!  I had a muck bucket of hay I was taking to the ponies, and of course the lambs had to knock it over and make a mess     Why do they always think the stuff on the bottom is the best?



 

I'm still waiting to see if their undercoats come in white or not.  They are three weeks old, so I hope to be able to tell soon.

Lukka's little girl isn't growing quite as fast as Rose's twins, but she's heavier than she looks when I pick her up.  Lukka is a first-timer, and her little lamb isn't as serious about eating as Rose's twins are.  But at not quite three weeks, I'm not worried.



 

So, the lambing total for this year is 5.  3 boys, 2 girls.  That's not counting the one Brosa lost (which would have been a boy).  And... I think she came back into heat and got bred again.  That would mean another lamb or lambs in June or July.  Not exactly what I was planning on, but if she is bred I just hope all goes well this time.


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## Hens and Roos (Apr 11, 2015)

Very cute!


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## CochinBrahmaLover=) (Apr 11, 2015)

Those are too adorable. Congrats on the lambs. Sorry about losing one, but you ended up with some very cute babies


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## Chivoville (Apr 20, 2015)

beautiful babies!


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## norseofcourse (Apr 24, 2015)

Thanks everyone - it's so fun to watch all the lambs bouncing around!

When Brosa miscarried a lamb in February, I wasn't sure if she would come back into heat or not.  Icelandics are seasonal breeders, and February may have been too late in the season.

Well, she did - we have baby bump!






She's also getting a tiny bit of udder development.  Estimated lambing date would be sometime in July, most likely.  She's looking pretty decent sized for having nearly three months to go, so I just hope everything goes alright for her lamb or lambs.  And so the waiting begins anew...


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## Goat Whisperer (Apr 24, 2015)

Congrats on all the adorable lambs! 

Waiting on Brosa!


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## OneFineAcre (Apr 24, 2015)

Good luck


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## Hens and Roos (Apr 25, 2015)

to you both!


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## norseofcourse (Jul 3, 2015)

Brosa's current pregnancy is past the point where she miscarried her lamb over the winter.  There's not much I could do but keep an eye on her and watch for signs of anything amiss.  I am feeling a slight bit hopeful that this time she seems to be doing well.



 

I haven't used a marking harness yet, but I keep what notes I can of dates.  She miscarried on Feb. 12 and passed the placenta Feb. 14.  So there's no way she'd have gotten bred before that.  And a friend of mine said she may have taken a couple weeks before she came into heat.  According to my notes, Elding (my ram) was acting particularly stupid on Feb. 18, 19, 20, 22 and 28.  If she was bred on or around one of those dates, that would put her lambing in about 2 or 3 weeks.  I removed Elding from the ewes on 3-21-15, so she won't go too far into August.

From the looks of her udder and vulva, I'm thinking 3 weeks is a good rough estimate.  I'll have a better idea as the days go by.  I've been fortunate to be here for nearly all my lambings so far, and each one tells me a bit more about how my sheep look and act before they lamb.  A lot of it is sheer luck though...

Her wool grows fast - I'm wondering if I should trim her down any?  It hasn't been horribly hot yet, but that can change.


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## norseofcourse (Jul 31, 2015)

Brosa is going to drive me nuts!

She's got to be pregnant.  Her vulva is finally swelling, she's getting rounder (although it's hard to tell under her fleece), and she was getting an udder.  Yes, was.  It was about up to the size of a small orange, which had me wondering, since this close to lambing I figured it would be bigger (based on her previous pregnancy at least, plus now she's not a first freshener and her udder should be larger).

I checked her udder last night (I check it maybe a couple times a week, she's fine with it because she's quite friendly with me and used to being handled).  Her udder was... deflated is the best word I can think of.  I checked her again this morning and it was about the same.  I've never had a sheep lamb so late in the summer - could the heat be affecting her udder development?  They have multiple water buckets, free choice loose mineral, hay, pasture.  It has been warm (some days close to 90 and sun) but they do have shade.

Just checked her udder a bit ago when I fed, and it's about the same, very small.  Her last possible due date *should* be about August 10.  She's going to drive me nuts...


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## mikiz (Aug 10, 2015)

Anything??


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## norseofcourse (Aug 10, 2015)

mikiz said:


> Anything??


Nothing definitive - I don't know what to think anymore!

Brosa's vulva is swelling and getting 'loose', as they all have as they get closer to lambing.  But she still has very little udder.  It's hard to tell her body shape under all that wool, but it seemed like she 'dropped' somewhat about two days ago.  Her appetite for grain has intensified, but she was one of the first sheep to quit eating tree leaves day before yesterday, when I was out there bending young trees down for the sheep to eat (they love it).  And I am sure I've seen lamb movement - wish I'd written it down the one time, which was at least a month or two ago.

SO, she may be showing *some* signs of getting close, or I may be imagining it all   

I did recheck my notes, and I did let the sheep in with Elding again later in the spring - mostly in May.  But Icelandics are seasonal breeders, so she should not have come into heat at that time.  Besides, that would make her at least another month or two away - unless he bred her through the pipe gate...

With her first lamb, she was the most vocal of any of my ewes giving birth - I heard her cries a couple hundred feet away.  So I can hope if she does that again, I'm within earshot - if I don't pick up on any other signs of labor.

So all I can do is just watch and wait...


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## mikiz (Aug 11, 2015)

Oh wow you must be pulling your hair out!! I hope she lambs without any problems!


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## norseofcourse (Aug 11, 2015)

mikiz said:


> Oh wow you must be pulling your hair out!! I hope she lambs without any problems!


Thank - I'm a lot calmer than I appear     I'm sure she'll be fine if/when she lambs, it's just that I've been present for nearly all of my lamb births, and I really want to keep up that record!

The first question is, Is she pregnant?  I'm pretty sure...  this morning she again had a bit of udder development.  And there's the vulva swelling, her roundness on her right side, and the lamb movement I was sure I've seen, and some slight personality/behavior changes.  But it could all be something else - weight gain, false pregnancy, hormones, the heat, my imagination...

So this evening when I got home, I took my stethoscope out, to see if I could hear any fetal heartbeats.  Worth a try, right?  She got on the milk stand easily, and first I trimmed some wool and dags away from her back end and udder.  Then I listened for her heartbeat - it was hard to pick out over her breathing, but I heard it.  Then I tried to hear fetal heartbeat.  No luck.  I heard her breathing, and a lot of bubbles, gurgles and odd squeaky sounds, but nothing I could discern as another heartbeat.  But, I am way, way out of practice with that stethoscope.

Then I tried placing my hand against her side, to see if I could feel any movement.  No luck with that, either, but I know feeling movement is a hit-or-miss kind of thing, and you're not always lucky to have the lamb moving when or where you want to feel it.

So, I trimmed a lot of wool off her belly, to help her stay a bit cooler, then let all the sheep into the main pasture.

If Brosa is pregnant, the next question is how far long; how close to lambing.  I'm about 90% sure she's pregnant.  So - how close to lambing?  That's harder.  So far, I've had the best success by how their vulva changes as they get closer.  Brosa's looks swollen, but not enough to be 'within days'.  She may fool me, or I may be able to tell when she gets close - only time will answer that.


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## Goat Whisperer (Aug 11, 2015)

You can send some blood out for a test, she needs to be at least 1 month pregnant with the goats. I would think its the same with sheep.

Have you bumped her? Give her some nurti-drench and wait 5-10 minutes and bump her. You may be able to better answer that way.

She would have me going crazy


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## norseofcourse (Aug 20, 2015)

Goat Whisperer said:


> You can send some blood out for a test, she needs to be at least 1 month pregnant with the goats. I would think its the same with sheep.
> 
> Have you bumped her? Give her some nurti-drench and wait 5-10 minutes and bump her. You may be able to better answer that way.
> 
> She would have me going crazy


Hmmm, interesting about the blood test.  Not sure I'll do it this time, but something to keep in mind.

I have no idea what to feel for when bumping a sheep. I'm sure if it's possible to 'imagine' you feel something, I could do that...  

I'm starting to lean back towards 'not pregnant'.  Her vulva hasn't seemed to have gotten any more swollen, and she does still have a small udder, but it hasn't gotten any larger, either.  I'll still keep an eye on her, but have stopped checking her as often.  She's not the one who drives me crazy - I drive myself crazy!  I would not want her lambing this late in the season anyway, so if she truly isn't pregnant I suppose that's a good thing.


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## Roving Jacobs (Aug 20, 2015)

I've done pregnancy blood tests on my goats before. It's not hard but drawing blood gives me the willies. This year a friend of mine bought a preg-tone portable ultrasound I'm hoping I can borrow late this year since she breeds earlier than me. Between that and a marking harness I'm hoping for no more mysteries and spending weeks staring at back sides


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