# Help!



## FarmerBoy24 (Feb 7, 2011)

I have a 2 yr old Nubian doe who has 3 kids. they are 4-6 months old. Well we were told we can milk her a little bit, so I noticed yesterday morning while I was milking her she like sucked in A lot! around her hips, it seemed like when we suck in a lot of air and we get skinner, yea thats what it looked like, but she's ok today. What was this? Why?

Thanks


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## freemotion (Feb 7, 2011)

Just while you were milking?  Maybe she was going, "OOO!  Not another kid!!!  That feels strange!"  Is she still supporting the kids?  She may have been at a point in the day when she needed to fill up her rumen again, too.  Sometimes my does, especially the Alpine who is lactating and produces a lot, will suddenly look thin and then a few hours later, as wide as a tank.  The rumen will do that throughout the day as the gasses come and go and the food level goes up and down.  It is more pronounced on the knobbier dairy types.  I don't see it as much on my pygmies or Boer crosses.


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## FarmerBoy24 (Feb 7, 2011)

Yea shes PERFECTLY fine with the kids.

When will the stop nursing from her?


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## freemotion (Feb 7, 2011)

As long as she lets them.  If you want to milk her, you might pen them up (or her) in a stall after evening feed, then milk her first thing before letting her back out with them for the day.  That will start the weaning process and also give you some milk.  I do this at three weeks of age.  Some start at two weeks old.  Once they are eating some hay they can go without milk for a few hours.  Yours will be just fine.

She is likely getting a bit thin, nursing three big kids.  Some does just won't wean and you need to take over and take care of business.  But unless she is pregnant, that doesn't have to happen tomorrow.  Try the night separation and enjoy the morning milking until you get used to it, then you can just keep them separate and continue to milk her once a day, or go to twice a day if you prefer.


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## FarmerBoy24 (Feb 7, 2011)

I am separating them at night. Then the next morning I milk her. I have been milking her like that for about 1-2 months. I want to know how old do they have to be until there weaned? Like can I milk her as much as I can? The babies are 4-6 months old.


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## freemotion (Feb 7, 2011)

They are old enough by four months, although many people wean by two months, I prefer to go a bit longer.  So I bet everyone here would agree that you are good to go....wean them without worry!

Um....not to be rude or anything....are there boys and are they "fixed?"  Just asking because lots of people don't realize how early they can actually breed, although it is not good for the girls at all, the boys can be quite precocious.  They will breed their moms and their sisters.

Meanwhile, enjoy the flood of milk you should be getting once they are fully separated!


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## 20kidsonhill (Feb 8, 2011)

I was wondering about boys also, If there are boys, I would either whether them, or get them seperated by 12 weeks.  We wean ours at 6 to 8 weeks, and put them on a creep feed, Two feedings a day all they will eat in around a 20 minute feeding, plus free-choice good quality mixed grass hay.  Creep feed needs to have Ammonia Chloride in it if you have males.


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## FarmerBoy24 (Feb 8, 2011)

No it's a triplet of girls!!  When will the be ready to breed?





			
				freemotion said:
			
		

> They are old enough by four months, although many people wean by two months, I prefer to go a bit longer.  So I bet everyone here would agree that you are good to go....wean them without worry!
> 
> Um....not to be rude or anything....are there boys and are they "fixed?"  Just asking because lots of people don't realize how early they can actually breed, although it is not good for the girls at all, the boys can be quite precocious.  They will breed their moms and their sisters.
> 
> Meanwhile, enjoy the flood of milk you should be getting once they are fully separated!


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## glenolam (Feb 8, 2011)

Tell me this wasn't her first freshening!

ETA - most people wait until the doelings are about a year of age.  Some go by the 70-80lb rule; once they hit that mark they're good to breed.  If they're all 4-6 mos old, I'd say they'd definitely be old enough to breed this coming fall - assuming they're all in good condition.


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## Emmetts Dairy (Feb 8, 2011)

All girls!!! Thats awesome!!!!!  Good for you!!!

I would'nt worry about her belly sucking in too much...as stated..she probally needs to fill her rumen with hay/feed.  They also suck in with breathing in heavy...so if it did not stay in...I wouldnt worry too much about it!

And I personally would consider weaning them at this age..but thats up to you..they are "of age" !! 

Are they eating grain and hay on their own regularly?  If so..then I would wean...IMO


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## 20kidsonhill (Feb 8, 2011)

I like to have 15 months on the girls, but I have bred as early as 12, but I don't like over feeding during their gestation and I hate taking young does off of grain.  We don't feed grain to our pregnant does until they are 30 days from due date.


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## Ariel301 (Feb 8, 2011)

We wean at 2-3 months old. 

I usually try to have my kids all born in January/February and breed those doelings in December. It costs too much for me to feed a goat for two years before I can milk her, so I breed earlier than many on here like to do. But if a doeling is not really mature looking and a good size for her age and breed, I won't breed her and risk complications.


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## FarmerBoy24 (Feb 8, 2011)

Emmetts Dairy said:
			
		

> All girls!!! Thats awesome!!!!!  Good for you!!!
> 
> I would'nt worry about her belly sucking in too much...as stated..she probally needs to fill her rumen with hay/feed.  They also suck in with breathing in heavy...so if it did not stay in...I wouldnt worry too much about it!
> 
> ...


Yea they are eating hay and grain. How do you guys wean your kids?   lol baby goats.


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## Emmetts Dairy (Feb 8, 2011)

What is it that you wanna do?...cuz it depends on what you plan is for you doe as well.  Are you gonna continue to milk???  Then I would start as you are...separate at night and milk in the am.

If that one milking a day is good for you then let her wean them herself (which can go up to 6mos) and keep doing what your doing....but if you want all the milk..then separate them.

Hard to answer without knowing what you want from your herd?

Just remember weaning is very stressful on them and stress can bring on health issues for them.  Just keep an eye out.


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## FarmerBoy24 (Feb 8, 2011)

Well I'm wanting all the milk as I can get when I can get it. Will the babies wean themselves? Like dogs and cats, they just kinda forget about it? Do you think this is a good idea so that the will get weaned.. I will let them be together all day, Then around 5:00-5:30 pm, i'll separate them, for bed,Then the next morning I will milk the mother goat. How long will the babies be if I continue doing this.

Feeding Schedule!! Is this good? Do you think? Morning: I give the mother and kids 1 flake of Alfalfa ( working on getting grass hay too) and a bowl of grain. approx. 2 lbs.Afternoon: I'll toss them a little grain, just as a snack. Night: (5:00 5:30pm) I give the mama half a flake and the 3 kids have a flake, and moma gets approx. 1 or 2 lbs of grain and the 3 kids get about 2 lbs of grain. Repeat the next day. Do you think this is good? Any suggestions?

-Thanks


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## freemotion (Feb 8, 2011)

Hay free choice, especially for a doe nursing three huge kids, and for three growing kids.  Then you can give the doe her grain on the milk stand once or twice a day, depending on how often you want to milk her.  Twice a day while she is nursing so many, though, I'd say.  I only grain the ones who need it, so the kids would only get grain if they were too thin on free choice hay.


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## FarmerBoy24 (Feb 8, 2011)

So the mom gets grain twice a day and the kids get how many? None of them are thin. The free choice hay, that goes for all 4? Should I include Alfalfa and Grass hay? Mix it together?


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## freemotion (Feb 8, 2011)

If they are not thin, I'd personally skip the grain for the kids and just give it to the doe on the milk stand or when you are milking if you don't use a stand.  But I am not a big grainer in general.  Others will advise differently.  I think of it as a supplement only, something to give when what is closer to the natural diet (which is not grass or alfalfa, but leafy branches along with some pasture plants) is not enough for whatever reason.

You can mix the hay, certainly.  They may waste more, but if so, you can give alfalfa mornings and leave grass hay in the feeders the rest of the time, letting them get hungry enough to eat it.  The doe will really produce more milk on the alfalfa, so you can experiment with how much you give her.

Remember, wasted hay =  bedding!  

They should all have access to a bin of some sort with loose goat minerals in it, replaced every few days or sooner if scarfed down.  I like the little two-compartment black mineral feeders from TSC that you can just screw into the wall.


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## FarmerBoy24 (Feb 9, 2011)

Do the kids NEED grain? There not thin from my point of view.


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## freemotion (Feb 9, 2011)

I'd skip the grain for the kids, personally.


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## FarmerBoy24 (Feb 9, 2011)

Alright. Any other tips? Advise?


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## cstafford93514@yahoo.com (Feb 9, 2011)

FarmerBoy24,
WEAN THE KIDS! Pen them away from mom and milk mom 2x a day about 12 hours apart.  The kids no longer need the milk and you want it, right?  
Feed her all the hay she can eat and grain her on the milk stand.  The kids need all the hay they can eat but just a little grain.  
They all need vacinations, worming from time to time, hooves trimmed every 6 to 8 weeks, loose minerals and free choice baking soda.  
Enjoy,
Carol


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## Emmetts Dairy (Feb 10, 2011)

cstafford93514@yahoo.com said:
			
		

> FarmerBoy24,
> WEAN THE KIDS! Pen them away from mom and milk mom 2x a day about 12 hours apart.  The kids no longer need the milk and you want it, right?
> Feed her all the hay she can eat and grain her on the milk stand.  The kids need all the hay they can eat but just a little grain.
> They all need vacinations, worming from time to time, hooves trimmed every 6 to 8 weeks, loose minerals and free choice baking soda.
> ...


I take exception with the free choice baking soda...I dont do it.  But this is a interesting thread to read on baking soda free choice.  I feed my kids grain. And milk my doe 1 daily and let her wean her kids. 

http://www.backyardherds.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=6542&p=1


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## FarmerBoy24 (Feb 10, 2011)

What is baking soda for? Stomachaches?


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## cstafford93514@yahoo.com (Feb 10, 2011)

I always keep baking soda out for my does.  They eat it to balance the PH in their rumen.  So, yes, it is for 'stomach aches.'


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## Emmetts Dairy (Feb 10, 2011)

FarmerBoy24 said:
			
		

> What is baking soda for? Stomachaches?


http://www.backyardherds.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=6542&p=1

Read the thread I included.  It will explain why some people including myself dont chose to use it free choice.  

Side note: How much milk you want for yourself and how and when to wean is a personal choice.  It all depends on what you want from your herd.


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## freemotion (Feb 10, 2011)

FarmerBoy24 said:
			
		

> What is baking soda for? Stomachaches?


You will see my comment on copper deficiency....one of my does would not get preggers, in spite of living with the buck.  I'll know soon (blood tests in two weeks) but I'm fairly certain she is pregnant this year....still jet black.  I keep a box of baking soda in the barn and will hand feed it to anyone who looks TOO big after  eating in the pasture, especially early in the spring.  It is very rare, though.  I have also made baking soda balls to dose a sick baby upon the advice of people here and am sure I saved her because of the advice (thanks, everyone!)  But I don't leave it out full-time anymore, either.

But do your own research and make your own decisions.  You can go back and forth, too, and see what works for you.  You will find that there are many topics that people have opposite opinions on, so don't get too overwhelmed.


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## FarmerBoy24 (Feb 10, 2011)

Alright. So Any Other Great Tips?


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