# mucoid enteritis?



## rebecca100 (Apr 26, 2010)

I just had a rash of sudden baby rabbit deaths.  All of the babies were around 3 weeks and were constipated.    Has anyone else dealt with this?  If so then what did you do to treat it?  I have lost an entire litter within just a couple of days.  I tried to treat them with yogurt and terramycin, but apparently it was too late.  If I start them on it beforehand will it prevent this from happening?


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## rebecca100 (Apr 26, 2010)

I would like to add that the constipation was not from their diet, they are kept with grass and hay.  I believe it was from mucoid enteritis.


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## dbunni (Apr 27, 2010)

ME will not be the cause of death.  ME is the body's way of stopping another problem.  The body produces the Muc to try an prevent the damage that is being done by another organism..often a bacteria.  You need to look a little further.  Cocci?  Did you change anything in the feed or a new feed bag?  Little ones are so susceptable to changes.  I am sorry for your loss.  But, ME will not kill an animal (I have a buck that produces muc all the time and he is healthy, just when the hay bale is new his intestine upsets.)

Best of luck ...


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## chinbunny1 (Apr 29, 2010)

ME will kill a rabbit. its when their digestive system shuts completely down and bothing goes through it. then rabbit then dies from bloat shortly after.

I would suggest checking for corn in your feed. If has it, switch to another brand that doesn't. Purina makes a show brand now that is corn free. Get them on some acid pack 4 way asap. That will help deal with the bloat. You can buy it from most rabbit cage dealers, and from bunnyrabbit.com. The shipping may be expensive, but it is worth buying and may help save your rabbits.It is the best pro biotic you can buy. 

Get them off the grass hay and feed them straight alflalfa for two weeks. Then slowly switch them back to grass. That will help clean out their digestive systems. also check the hay for dust and mold.

Don't feed anymore antibiotics for now. They will only make things worse. Sometimes the bacteria like e coli can cause ME is opportunistic and can will only get worse if you try to treat it. The terramcin and yogurt probably made things worse. What strength is the terramcin? Maybe they got a little strong of a dose. I use the one where you can only give 1/4rth of a teaspoon because its too strong. 

feed any sick babies and rabbits fresh fecals from another healthy rabbit. This will also help their digestive system kick in. use cecetropes if you can find them. They will be softer poos then the others. Do it a couple of times a day until the rabbits is eating on its own,and pooping. 

Also wouldn't hurt to have your vet do a fecal sample on one of them to rule out coccidia and worms. 

We had this problem last year where there were corn toxins found in the feeds. It killed a lot of rabbits. And the ARBA vet just chaulked the whole thing up to the weather. Sorry, but weather doesn't kill that many rabbits! I lost 30to it myself. I had to put down what didn't die until I figured out what was causing the problem.


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## dbunni (Apr 29, 2010)

Working with Ohio State, we have had several rabbits Nec'd.  In all cases, the ME was not the cause of death.  The deaths were caused by ruptures in various parts of the gastrointestional/digestive tract relating to the different bacteria (one rabbit had over 7 different things going on!) and corresponding scarring/weakening that was there.  When ME related deaths surfaced over 2 years ago at the rabbit shows, we started working with a fantastic rabbit team down there and 2 vets here (along with being in the field myself and another bunny barn owner).  The rabbits we took down were from various show barns throughout ohio who were experiencing similar problems.

The one thing we have learned, it can be reversed ... but not with anything taken via the mouth.  All meds are injected according to the prescribed doses.  Along with fluids under the skin (up to 50cc per injection 3 x day) to help keep the system "softened".  And Hay!  If the bun will eat, fiber is best to get things moving.  We hardly ever check for cocci since all rabbits have it and all rabbits that are sick will show increased percentages.  it's just a given in rabbits (and poultry).  The trick is catching the signs early and treating.  If caught within 2 days, the rabbit can turn around...and be shown again!  I have a library that I wish was not here because of this problem and the rabbit industry.  We have experimented with drugs, and for now, hopefully, have found what works.  But, what I did learn is it is regional (in Indy they had a different bacteria set).

If it goes any further than your little ones, and I hope it doesn't, you can have a nec done ... but the best results are on a "fresh" body (one they put down).

Good luck ...


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## chinbunny1 (Apr 29, 2010)

dbunni said:
			
		

> Working with Ohio State, we have had several rabbits Nec'd.  In all cases, the ME was not the cause of death.  The deaths were caused by ruptures in various parts of the gastrointestional/digestive tract relating to the different bacteria (one rabbit had over 7 different things going on!) and corresponding scarring/weakening that was there.  When ME related deaths surfaced over 2 years ago at the rabbit shows, we started working with a fantastic rabbit team down there and 2 vets here (along with being in the field myself and another bunny barn owner).  The rabbits we took down were from various show barns throughout ohio who were experiencing similar problems.
> 
> The one thing we have learned, it can be reversed ... but not with anything taken via the mouth.  All meds are injected according to the prescribed doses.  Along with fluids under the skin (up to 50cc per injection 3 x day) to help keep the system "softened".  And Hay!  If the bun will eat, fiber is best to get things moving.  We hardly ever check for cocci since all rabbits have it and all rabbits that are sick will show increased percentages.  it's just a given in rabbits (and poultry).  The trick is catching the signs early and treating.  If caught within 2 days, the rabbit can turn around...and be shown again!  I have a library that I wish was not here because of this problem and the rabbit industry.  We have experimented with drugs, and for now, hopefully, have found what works.  But, what I did learn is it is regional (in Indy they had a different bacteria set).
> 
> ...


Well I guess we arust going tohave to disagree because everything I have ever learned and read about it says the ME does kill and fast. rabbits that get it tend to go down very fast. Sometimes its a feed issue. Some times its not. I didn't hear anything about it two years ago. But I know a lot of people lost a lot of rabbits to it last year, and most of the cases were feed related and had nothing to do with bacteria. I had neocropsies done on mine too, and never found anything. Save for a few focals on th eliver and heart, and lungs on one rabbit. And traces of e coli on the second. but never foujnd what was killing them. Shortly after someoe out east found black corn mold in their feed. And they were losing rabbits to the same problem. 

You can also reverse rabbits in the later stages of it by feeding them the fecals from a healthy rabbit. I managed to do that with my last two that got sick with it. they were literally near death, had had the impaction, and jelly like stools for over a week. Fed them the fecals and they were eating on their own within two days.

I live in michigan. So i am curious to know what type of bacteria you guys found in the indy and ohio rabbits?

I switched to a non corn based feed since then and haven't had a problem since.


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## currycomb (May 1, 2010)

i posted eairlier about my dying rabbits. took 2 to lab for necropsy, initialally was mucoid enteopathy(enteritis) upon growing the bacteria, it was an imbalance of chlostridial(sp) bacteria overwhelming the good bacteria, causing mucous stools and bloating. rabbits were on hay and pellets with fresh grass picked daily. does with 3 week old kits were hardest hit, then the young weaners, and some older ones. this latest batch of weaners get terrimyacin in their water, free choice hay, limited pellets in the evening only. still loosing one here and there, but not the numbers we were. did switch to purina professional pellets, more nutrition for the does and babies. the corn free just didn't have the protein i was wanting. even had the water tested as we are on a well. so wish us luck


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