# The new babies have arrived!!! Pictures/Questions.



## Missy (Aug 2, 2011)

We went over to a dairy farm today and got our two little buckling pets. There was lots to choose from, But in the end I chose these two:

Worf is the brown one. He is Toggenburg x Oberhasli. Yoda is the black and white one. He is Toggenburg x Nubian(I didn't know they had Nubian crosses until I got there.) Well those are the alleged crosses if anyone thinks other wise let me know Also maybe I am crazy, or just don't remember the size of the kids when I worked on a goat farm over 10 years ago, but do these look skinny to you?


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## freemotion (Aug 2, 2011)

They look very, very young....if so, that is normal for dairy kids.  

Very cute!


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## Missy (Aug 2, 2011)

They are young, about 3-3/1/2 weeks. I am thinking Yoda is a bit younger than Worf. He is much less equipt and his little horns are not as big, he is also a bit shorter. 


I don't want to do it too early, when is a good time to band them? I see no point of keeping two bucks with no does. They would probably go mad. So off will come the jewels.

Thank you. Most off the others were just plain colors(black/brown). Warf was the only one with waffles which I adore and Yoda was the only one any flop to their ears(except a few doelings that were 3-4 days old), I am currious to see if they stay like that.


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## Goatmasta (Aug 2, 2011)

I personally would not band them until they are at least 8 wks old..  Have they been disbudded?  If not I would be getting it done.


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## 20kidsonhill (Aug 2, 2011)

You are better to wait 12 weeks to 4 or 5 months for castration. If you don't mind taking them to the vet to be castrated. they can be surgically done closer to the 4 or 5 months, if you are planning on banding them, then you would need to be closer to the 12 weeks. 

Since you are planning on keeping them as long term pets. Research Urinary Calculi and learn about the do's and dont's of raising whethers to prevent UC. 

They are so cute. 

Congratulations.


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## Missy (Aug 2, 2011)

They have not been debudded yet. I have been going back and forth on that one. Trying to decide yes or no. As for neutering, I plan to band them. I have been reading up on UC, I never realized it was a problem before reading here.


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## Goatmasta (Aug 2, 2011)

It isn't a big deal if you are aware of it and feed properly.  You will get a dozen and one opinions on what "proper feeding" is,  You can read my blog for my ideas on the matter(UC and proper feeding).


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## DonnaBelle (Aug 2, 2011)

They are a little old to try to disbud them now.  It should be done at 5-7 days old for bucklings.

It can be done, and if you know a good goat vet, someone who is familar with disbudding, I'd call him out to do it.

They can be banded at 8 weeks of age.  Pretty simple and easy procedure.  You do need a pair of banding grips and the bands, you can order those or pick them up at a TSC or local feed store. 

They look a little thin to me too.  Put them out some feed, a little goat developer, but most of all some hay.  Are you bottle feeding them?  They should be on some milk.  Most people on here use whole milk.  If you can get some goat milk, use that.  You need a pop bottle and a small nipple for lambs or goats.  Look at Hoegger's Supply online.  I order from them a lot.  If you need to switch them over from goat milk to whole cow's milk, do it slowly.  Start with l/4 cow's milk, 3/4 goat milk for a couple of days and then increase it in increments over about a week's time.  If you switch them cold turkey, they will get scours, (runny poop) 

DonnaBelle


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## Emmetts Dairy (Aug 2, 2011)

Missy said:
			
		

> They are young, about 3-3/1/2 weeks. I am thinking Yoda is a bit younger than Worf. He is much less equipt and his little horns are not as big, he is also a bit shorter.
> 
> 
> I don't want to do it too early, when is a good time to band them? I see no point of keeping two bucks with no does. They would probably go mad. So off will come the jewels.
> ...


Congrats!! Very cute babies.   Are you bottle feeding them??? I dont recomend wethering them til they are at least 11-12 wks either.  And for Urinary Calculi protection you should get a grain that has Amonium Chloride in it.  Very Very important for bucklings and bucks.  If you are keeping these guys as pets...I HIGHLY recomend you wether them and disbuded them.  It is very hard for some expirenced herdmans to keep bucks on the property.  They are dairy bucks and will go into a seasonal rutt..which is their breeding season and can really be obnoxious.  Believe me..I own breeding bucks. They can be unruling and very hard to deal with.  Sometimes Im pouring grain from the fenceline into grain buckets.  Just an FYI...they will not be the warm cuddley goats they are now...they will be insane lunatics but if you wether them they will be fine and dandy pets!!!

I always recomend disbudding them.  All my herd is disbudded for saftey purposes.  I would consider it for sure.  If you do want to disbudd...I would do ASAP.  They should be done in the 1st week of birth.  And bucks are always harder to do.

Good luck with your new boys!! They are very pretty boys!!


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## fmizula (Aug 2, 2011)

i feel that disbudding is kind of cruel, not in nessesarily the hurting way (althought im sure it hurts) But because i feel it takes away the natural instincts that goats have. goats use their horns as a natural way to cool off in summers heats and myn also contantly use the horms to pull down small trees to eat the leaves and also to scrape and eat the bark off as well. although, one of my does constantly gets her head stuck in the fencing and i have to get her out, also, my buck loves to ram things (walls of barn, fencing, trees, salt lick etc) i feel the positive outweighs the negetive. i also have seen some gruesome pictures of banded horns. 

please do your reserch at least and weight the possitives and negitives for your situation before deciding.


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## aggieterpkatie (Aug 2, 2011)

I don't know about you all, but I waited until 14 weeks to band my buckling and my bander would absolutely not fit over his testicles.  If I wait again, I'll do it by 9/10 weeks at the very latest.


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## Missy (Aug 2, 2011)

I have been trying to weigh the positives against the negatives. In my opinion, the positives for keeping the horns out weigh the negatives of keeping them.  The neutering is not in question. It will be done.

They had the bucklings on whole cows milk and I got some to bring home with me. Yoda is content to drink the milk from a dish. Worf, not so much. bottles were the one thing I did not get however her has been doing very well with a sports bottle licking it as I gently squeeze, or sucking it from a dish as long as my finger is in place and he can attempt to latch onto it


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## Roll farms (Aug 2, 2011)

I will never have another goat w/ horns - if I can help it.  The damage they do to eachother and our barns / gates / fencing far outweighs the 'joy' of letting them keep them.
Not to mention, dehorning makes them much safer to be around.


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## Mossy Stone Farm (Aug 3, 2011)

oh i agree i have a NO horn policy here.... I have seen the damage to fences, barns and each other.... 

 With that said i have not been able to do the deed myself.. Thank goodness i have a friend who can , she does an awsome job and the kids are back to playing  and jumping in no time... 

I however take a few days to get over it LOL!!!!!

your boys are beautiful, i love those crosses.... cuties for sure..congrats!


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## 20kidsonhill (Aug 3, 2011)

All our goats have horns and we have several children around them. I haven't had an issue with it. perhaps it depends on the breeds, the type of horns they have. LIke the nigerians' horns go straight up, that maybe would bother me more than the boers that curl around some.


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## freemotion (Aug 3, 2011)

Missy said:
			
		

> I have been trying to weigh the positives against the negatives. In my opinion, the positives for keeping the horns out weigh the negatives of keeping them.  The neutering is not in question. It will be done.
> 
> They had the bucklings on whole cows milk and I got some to bring home with me. Yoda is content to drink the milk from a dish. Worf, not so much. bottles were the one thing I did not get however her has been doing very well with a sports bottle licking it as I gently squeeze, or sucking it from a dish as long as my finger is in place and he can attempt to latch onto it


You can get regular baby bottles for humans at the grocery store or WalMart and cut an x in the nipple and use that.  Or you can usually find nipples that fit on soda bottles at the feed store.  I read something.....no idea where, it was a few years ago....that said that head position while drinking milk was important for goats/sheep  and bucket feeding was not recommended....I think it had to do with which stomach compartment the milk went into and also future rumen development.  Bottle feeding will also really bond them to you.  It is so sweet when they gaze into your eyes while taking the bottle.

I thought they looked a bit younger than 3 weeks in those photos.


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## PattySh (Aug 3, 2011)

oops double post


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## PattySh (Aug 3, 2011)

They are adorable. I agree they look younger than 3 weeks. Do they have horns popping out yet? I'd call the goat farm and see what kind of nipples the boys are used to and buy the same.  Personally I would not allow horned goats around young children. I banded my one goat with horns after I got poked in the arm several times while putting her grain on the milk stand. Even tho she is very gentle I was worried about the grandchildren getting hurt. I have banded very big testicles on goat kids. I did a 6 month old nigerian recently, had to slip each side in at a time but it worked. If they are going to be pets, don't do them too soon. Also get their overeating/tetanus shots into them, bottle babies are delicate creatures.


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## Pearce Pastures (Aug 3, 2011)

Very cute   Congrats!


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## MysticScorpio82 (Aug 3, 2011)

They are both cuties!  I have to say, Worf looks like such a tyke!  Lol!!  Congratulations!


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## Missy (Aug 3, 2011)

Yoda is a little more active than Worf, which is funny since the day I brought them home it was the opposite. Yoda loves to chase the kids around where as Worf always wants me to hold him. I am not sure what kind of socialization they had before me, but they really want attention now. I am contimplating going and getting a couple more. Trying to decide if I want to pay the 25 dollars for a couple of doelings, or the 10 dollars for a couple more bucklings.....

Worf has bigger horn nubs then Yoda does. but they both have bumps.


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## kstaven (Aug 4, 2011)

Missy said:
			
		

> I have been trying to weigh the positives against the negatives. In my opinion, the positives for keeping the horns out weigh the negatives of keeping them.  The neutering is not in question. It will be done.
> 
> They had the bucklings on whole cows milk and I got some to bring home with me. Yoda is content to drink the milk from a dish. Worf, not so much. bottles were the one thing I did not get however her has been doing very well with a sports bottle licking it as I gently squeeze, or sucking it from a dish as long as my finger is in place and he can attempt to latch onto it


Band them at 10 weeks or you may not be able to.

As far as horns go ... We run a dairy and don't remove horns. But having said this we live in a mountain region where they have lots of opportunities to rub, and run. Personally I don't feel it is a safety issue as much as convenience for dairies that really pushed the disbudding routine. 99 times out of 100 you find bored goats or those in confined quarters are the problem children when it comes to horns. All our buildings including the house are cedar sided and you will not find a mark on them from the goats. But you will find many marks on some of the trees up the hill.


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## Roll farms (Aug 4, 2011)

I have a mixed meat / dairy herd.  
A 200# horned boer doe hitting a 100# Ob doe over a scuffle at the feeder isn't pretty.  And a 250# boer buck hitting a doe he doesn't like can be fatal.

We had a kiko buck that destroyed anything and everything he could...if it'd dent / bust / bend on his horns, he did it for fun.  Didn't matter that he had 3/4 acre pasture to himself...he just liked to tear stuff up.

Last year a horned boer buck (the same one who killed a doe) decided that he wanted his neighbor buck's does.  He destroyed a welded wire gate (rammed it repeatedly) until it buckled so that he could get into the other pen.  It's a gate meant to hold cattle...he turned it into scrap metal.

Great for those who have horned goats and no problems.  I'm just not that lucky.


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## Ms. Research (Aug 4, 2011)

Roll farms said:
			
		

> I have a mixed meat / dairy herd.
> A 200# horned boer doe hitting a 100# Ob doe over a scuffle at the feeder isn't pretty.  And a 250# boer buck hitting a doe he doesn't like can be fatal.
> 
> We had a kiko buck that destroyed anything and everything he could...if it'd dent / bust / bend on his horns, he did it for fun.  Didn't matter that he had 3/4 acre pasture to himself...he just liked to tear stuff up.
> ...


I've been reading this thread regarding the Horns vs Debudding, and I have to agree with Rolls.  Glad some don't have problems, but sometimes luck runs out and now you have an animal that might hurt (intentionally or unintentionally).  I'd rather be safe than sorry.  Though you might think it cruel, or believe you are taking away the Natural instinct of a goat, you can find ways to help with that natural instinct without the horns (might be a little extra work on your part), and you will be able to safely take care of your animals.  


Just my opinion.


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## Goatherd (Aug 4, 2011)

> I'd rather be safe than sorry.  Though you might think it cruel, or believe you are taking away the Natural instinct of a goat, you can find ways to help with that natural instinct without the horns (might be a little extra work on your part), and you will be able to safely take care of your animals.


Really?


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## LittleDarlings (Aug 4, 2011)

Both of my little ones came with horns intact.  I have a ND buck and a Pygmy doe.  I still haven't decided if any of their kids will be disbudded.  It is definitely great to get both sides of the fence with all the info.  Thanks!!


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## LittleDarlings (Aug 4, 2011)

Ooops!  To the OP, your babies are adorable!!


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## Becky (Aug 4, 2011)

Those kids are adorable!!!


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## Missy (Aug 4, 2011)

It was a very very bad day here. I came home from work to find little worf looking a bit lethargic. I fed him and he perked up a bit. So I thought nothing of it. I went back to VT and got 2 little doelings-I just couldn't help it Anyways, I got back home and noticed that Worf looked worse. He was laying on his side and would not get up. Within a couple hours and about 5 dozen phone calls, he had raspy breathing. I packed him up and brought him to an old friend of mine who raised goats for 40 years before retiring. She said he was either malnutrioned(sp) and dehydrated(he had runny stools when I got him, I when I asked about it, I was told it was from stress and change of food), or he had pneumonia. I brought him home, within an hour he died. 

Then I received a phone call from the lady who breeds the goats notifying me that she noticed some yellow/green soft stools from some of her kids and they had a bacteria infection. I am going down tommorrow morning first thing to get some medication for it to treat the 3 kids I have left. She said when it is all cleared up with her kids, she will replace any that I lost. Very depressing for the kids.


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## Ms. Research (Aug 4, 2011)

Goatherd said:
			
		

> > I'd rather be safe than sorry.  Though you might think it cruel, or believe you are taking away the Natural instinct of a goat, you can find ways to help with that natural instinct without the horns (might be a little extra work on your part), and you will be able to safely take care of your animals.
> 
> 
> Really?


Yes really.  I think it's cruel to dock a dog's tail or ears just because someone thinks it's the way a dog should look.  Doesn't affect his natural instinct.  So why if you remove a goat's horns, not to make it look good, but to make it safe for both you and the goat, would it remove their natural instinct?  They still like to rub their heads and play fight.   They still like to run and jump.   To help with their natural instincts, you give them things to climb, place to graze, etc.   I've read so much that shows how you can make your goat's life comfortable and complete.  Not one person, in any article I've read, said if you remove the horns, the goat will lose everything and all natural instincts will complete go away.

Livestock is completely different than a dog or cat, domestic animals.  Livestock CAN hurt you worse than some domestic animals.     Maybe I recognize this.  Maybe I think that I am being responsible raising a goat without horns.  I know they can hurt in other ways, because I'm not naive, but taking away that one weapon would help my odds on not getting hurt.  

Maybe one day, after some hands-on experience, I'll consider my thought on horns.  Still won't dock a dog's tail or ears.  

For those who live with horns, good for you, they are magnificent looking animals.    For those who don't, I'm right there with you.  Either way, no one should take owning any livestock lightly. 

Just my opinion.


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## BriteChicken (Aug 5, 2011)

Oh Missy! I'm soo sorry about Worf... Hopefully all your other little ones pull through the infection and the breeder gives you another baby it won't replace Worf but it might cushion the loss  So sorry


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## Missy (Aug 5, 2011)

I now have 2 more sick kids, and one healthy kid. I gave a penicillin injection this morning and they babies are now holding their heads up, they were laying flat out before and had green/yellow oozing poo. I have I also giving electrolite solution as well. Poor Yoda feels dehydrated,He is drinking very very well and holding his head up. Both are laying normally now and not on their sides.



 Nora however has picked up a bit. You you help her up she will stand but can't walk. She crawls around though. I see it as an improvement as she wasn't doing that earlier.

What else can I do?

My healthy one with the solid poo is in the people house, The others are in their goat house I am doing 15 minute checks on them, and I am cleaning and decontaminating every few hours trying not to spread this if it is come kind of bacteria. 

I want Mable to stay healthy, I am treating her the same as the others incase she has the bacteria and is just not showing it yet.

Anyone else have this problem ever?


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## 20kidsonhill (Aug 5, 2011)

So sorry, that is very frustrating for you and the children.  It is not normal for kids to go to their new home and get sick and die, but it is not that unheard of either. 


Keep giving them Penn G shots every 8 to 12 hours,  

spectam scour halt for pigs is very good for bacterial infection. If you have a Tractor supply store nearby or feed store still opened this evening.


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## JusticeFamilyFarm (Aug 5, 2011)

I'm so sorry about your adorable little buckling!  I hope the others are back to normal soon and the healthy one stays that way.  I'm sorry you had to go through this so soon after bringing home your new babies.


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## Ms. Research (Aug 5, 2011)

My heartfelt condolences for your loss.   Hope the others are doing well!


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## maggies.family (Aug 5, 2011)

I am so sorry about Worf!  And I hope the others get better quick!    I am heartbroken for you.  We just got our babies on Wed and am already so attached. I would be so sad.  Big hugs to you!


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## kstaven (Aug 6, 2011)

Ms. Research said:
			
		

> Goatherd said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I don't take animal ownership lightly at all.

And yes you are correct. Some hands on experience with horned and dehorned goats would allow you to speak with first hand knowledge and experience.

For example: As noted earlier about a buck that ripped a gate apart. I can tell you from experience horns or no horns he would have accomplished the same thing.

One thing all animal owners learn with time, experience and hands on is that there is a lot of cookie cutter publication of over sensationalized information out there. 

Horns may bruise but the scurs that often develop on a disbudded goat will rip you like a knife and cut their companion goats to shreds. Have seen a number of bucks along the way do some serious damage. 

What you need to see is there are two sides to this argument to be aware of.


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## Missy (Aug 6, 2011)

I agree. When it comes to horns, there are def. 2 sides to this. It can go either way. 6 of one a 1/2 dozen of another.


On another note, We lost poor Yoda last night. And little Nora about 15 minutes ago. Mable, had runny poo last evening, but she was still very active. I picked up some pepto, yogurt, gatorade and electrolite mix, and am going to continue her treatment. Hopefully all stays well.


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## 20kidsonhill (Aug 6, 2011)




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## Ms. Research (Aug 6, 2011)

kstaven said:
			
		

> Ms. Research said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Have to agree.  And am reading both sides of the argument here.  Respect both sides of the argument.  To each his own.  And yes, looking forward one day to experience both sides of the argument.   I just am looking at safety, for both animal and myself.    Thank you for putting the examples of what could occur also without horns.  The more I read from people "with first hand experience" both sides, the more I will be prepared for when I experience "first hand" experience raising a goat.   I appreciate BOTH views.  

Thanks for your input.


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## Ms. Research (Aug 6, 2011)

Missy said:
			
		

> I agree. When it comes to horns, there are def. 2 sides to this. It can go either way. 6 of one a 1/2 dozen of another.
> 
> 
> On another note, We lost poor Yoda last night. And little Nora about 15 minutes ago. Mable, had runny poo last evening, but she was still very active. I picked up some pepto, yogurt, gatorade and electrolite mix, and am going to continue her treatment. Hopefully all stays well.


My heartfelt condolences for your loss.  Sending well wishes to Mable from New Jersey!


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## Emmetts Dairy (Aug 7, 2011)

Im sooo sorry you lost them.


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## Missy (Aug 7, 2011)

I am hoping this is good, but Mable's poop has turned from yellow/green and watery to a slightly thicker and dark brown (not black, no blood)


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## Roll farms (Aug 7, 2011)

If you said this anywhere and I missed it, I'm sorry....but did you take this lady's word for it that it was bacterial, or were any seen by a vet?

FWIW, for bacterial gut infections in kids, I really like scour-halt or neomycin sulfate.  Treat 2x a day.
If the kids were over 2 wks old, it could also be or also be coccidia, which would require sulfa to treat effectively, and which will more than likely come back at least 1x.
A sick / puny kid is a prime cantidate for an opportunistic infection / bug to take over and make them doubly hard to fix / cure.

If a vet isn't practical or just can't be found nearby, then please consider treating w/ something other than Pen G...for some things it's wonderful, but if you've lost 3 out of 4, it's not working.

Stopping the poops and giving electrolytes is logical, but if the cause isn't addressed, it's like putting a bandage on an infected wound....you won't see the symptoms, but they can fester under the bandage and hide until you have a serious problem.

I am very, very sorry you lost them.     We lost 4 kids our first year breeding and it broke my heart...


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## Goatmasta (Aug 7, 2011)

Several things come to mind on the little guys....  I think it was said they were around 3 wks old, That brings me to cocci right away.   Are they eating?  do they have a temp?   E. coli would be my second guess.  Either of those are probably quickly coupled with pneumonia.  I say pneumonia because they probably are not eating well and you are probably doing the same thing I would....  Force feed them...  Invariably when force feeding they aspirate the smallest amount of milk and hello pneumonia...  If they were here I would be treating for all three cocci, E.coli and pneumonia.


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## Pearce Pastures (Aug 7, 2011)

I am so so sorry about your goats   I agree with Goatmasta on the treating for all 3 possibilities as soon as you can.  I really hope your week gets better.


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## kstaven (Aug 8, 2011)

Melissa said:
			
		

> I am so so sorry about your goats   I agree with Goatmasta on the treating for all 3 possibilities as soon as you can.  I really hope your week gets better.


I agree x 2


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## Missy (Aug 8, 2011)

I woke up this morning to Mable screaming her head off for mommy. She had pooped in her kennel and desperately wanted it out. The poop was brown in color, but still soft, kind of ploppy, not runny. She is very perky, and is currently running about with a little dog diaper on as she wanted to be free in the house and not be in the kennel. She nibbled at some greens when outside and climbed the stone wall(looking quite proud of herself). 

Her temp is normal and has been throughout this the whole time. Her breathing is silent, her yell is strong, her urine is clear, her inner eyelids have color, no nasal discharge, skin bounces back, no signs of dehydration. Can no longer see her ribs, back, or tail bone. Eatting well.

Her current schedule is:
Midnight-Pepto B(5 ml), 4 oz gatorade
4 AM - Pepto B (5 ml),  4 oz gatorade
5 AM - 1 ml penicillin shot, yogurt
8 AM 4 oz milk
12 Noon - Pepto B, yogurt, 4 oz gatorade
4 PM - 4oz gatorade, 2 oz milk
5 PM- 1 ml penicillin
8 PM- 6 oz gatorade, pepto B

Outside to run around every 2-3 hours(it is a good think my other half and I work opposite shifts right now

In your opinions, how is everything looking? Should I change anything?


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## Roll farms (Aug 8, 2011)

I would, at minimum, treat w/ di methox.  
I'd also have a fecal ran...


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## 20kidsonhill (Aug 8, 2011)

I would treat with sulfa-dimethoxine for cocci and add scour-halt to the treatment for bacterial.


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## Missy (Aug 8, 2011)

Her fecal tests(Sorry I thought I posted this) 

Were negative for Coccidiosis, Tape worm, all other internal parasites, and E. Coli.


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## Missy (Aug 11, 2011)

We lost Mable this morning. It was so devastating, I thought for sure she was going to make a full recovery, she was running around playing king of the couch and cat tower(what a site to see- a baby goat climbing a cat tower with a dog diaper on. Thank you all for your thoughts and prayers. My kids are just beside themselves.


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## elevan (Aug 11, 2011)

I just read through this entire thread (don't know how I missed it before).

Missy  - I am deeply sorry for what you've been going through     

You might want to consider having a necropsy done on Mable (if it's not too late to do so).


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## Ms. Research (Aug 11, 2011)

Missy said:
			
		

> We lost Mable this morning. It was so devastating, I thought for sure she was going to make a full recovery, she was running around playing king of the couch and cat tower(what a site to see- a baby goat climbing a cat tower with a dog diaper on. Thank you all for your thoughts and prayers. My kids are just beside themselves.


Heartfelt sadness from New Jersey.  


Just let your children know that all of you did everything to help Mable and Mable, as you posted showed her appreciation with her antics on the cat tower.   Life really sucks sometimes, but it's life.  Don't be sad for long.  Hoping you and your children will hold her memory with happiness and apply that to the future Mables.


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## 20kidsonhill (Aug 12, 2011)

We sold 4 doelings to a family this summer that had a similar experience last summer with some other goats they had gotten from somewhere else, They have 4 children and were wanting them each to have one goat. they lost all of the goats they started with last summer.  So bravely they tried again. Honestly I was a bit concerned about them buying from me. Terrified something would happen to them. And wouldn't you know it. The day after they bring them home,  they found lice on one of them and she then broke with scours(runny poop).  I looked through all my goats and didnt' see any lice on them after she told me this. I called all my other buyers and none of them had seen or had lice.  We had already sent some coccidiosis medicine home with the goats so she started treating them, but another 24 hours later the same one, who had never had scours prior or any health problems was not looking good. 

So we jumped into our truck with a box full of medicines and drove the 50 minutes to their house.  There was no way I was letting them loose any more goats. They had no experience giving shots, so we taught the mom how to give Penn G shots and vitamin B shots and explained a little better about how to drench a goat. So far so good, it has been a couple months now and the does are all doing well. 

I know this was a tough experience for you and the kids, ,  I would highly recommend trying again. Do you know how many the seller lost? Have you been in contact with them very much?  I don't think I would purchase any of those kids that she has that survived the illness from that group, it may have damaged their stomachs badly enough that they wont do well in the future.  

I am so so sorry for your experience.


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## Roll farms (Aug 12, 2011)

I'm so very sorry.


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## PJisaMom (Aug 12, 2011)

Missy said:
			
		

> We lost Mable this morning. It was so devastating, I thought for sure she was going to make a full recovery, she was running around playing king of the couch and cat tower(what a site to see- a baby goat climbing a cat tower with a dog diaper on. Thank you all for your thoughts and prayers. My kids are just beside themselves.


What a horrible thing to have happen!  I'm so sorry!  

What area of the country are you in?  Someone may be able to point you in the right direction toward a different herd of goats.  Give yourself some time, but consider not giving up.  They really are worth the effort!  

Hang in there...


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## Missy (Aug 12, 2011)

The lady is insistant on replacing my goats which more goats from her, she will not refund my money. I would rather cut my loss than get more from her I think. When this all started, she told me on the phone she had lost quite a few goat kids this year. Also I noticed, but didn't think much of it at the time, that when I went back over to get the doelings, there was at least 20 goat kids less than when I went 2 days earlier, dispite the fact the girl who I talked to on the phone about 2 hours before arriving there, said they had not sold any since I was their last. Last I talked to the breeder, I still had Mable and then she she said she had lost 3 bucklings the night before due to this illness, and was treating the rest of the kids still who all had scours. 


There is a lady in my area who has a pair of Oberhasli kids she is holding for me. They are 3 month old kids. Purebred. They both have their shots, and are debudded, the male is neutered. She is giving me a discount due to the issues I have had with the kids I got from the other lady, and has been extremely helpful to me. She had offered to neuter and debud for free, the kids I had if they survived. SHe is just truely a wonderful person.


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## RPC (Aug 12, 2011)

I am sooooo sorry this happened to you. I just read the whole thread and that is really sad. I would get the 2 obe's and never get anything from that lady again. But first I would clean the goat shed really well and maybe even put some lime down to kill anything on the ground. Good luck and I hope what ever you decide that it works out. I promise this is not what normally happens with kids you just have a bad breeder with a huge problem. Hopefully she can get it fixed and be back to running a good operation.


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## Pearce Pastures (Aug 12, 2011)

I am so so sorry.  I feel just awful for you and your kids.  I hope you'll all be feeling cheery again soon.  I know how hard this is


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## Missy (Aug 13, 2011)

RPC said:
			
		

> I am sooooo sorry this happened to you. I just read the whole thread and that is really sad. I would get the 2 obe's and never get anything from that lady again. But first I would clean the goat shed really well and maybe even put some lime down to kill anything on the ground. Good luck and I hope what ever you decide that it works out. I promise this is not what normally happens with kids you just have a bad breeder with a huge problem. Hopefully she can get it fixed and be back to running a good operation.


Exactly what I am doing, the nice lady said she would hold on to the babies for as long as I needed.


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## RPC (Aug 13, 2011)

She sounds like a really great person to know. Good luck with the new ones when you get them.


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## Missy (Aug 17, 2011)

I am hoping to be able to pick up the two 3 month olds this weekend.  The lady I got the 4 babies from finally agreed to send my money back. Hopefully she does.


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