# Picky eater help.



## Lesheffer (Oct 5, 2021)

I have a 2 year old Alpine doe, who is a dairy cull, freshened beginning August. We got her the end of August. She is hand milked twice daily, giving about 3-4 pounds of milk each time. Her temp is normal, good rumen sounds, normal defecation. Fecal is within normal range per vet. Famacha is 4. We are working on fixing her copper deficiency. Has free choice hay and pasture. She eats hay well, but won't eat any grains. We've tried our custom dairy mix from our feed mill, goat feed from another local mill, Prince goat feed, Nutrena 17% dairy goat feed, Empower horse supplement, calf manna, manna pro goat balancer, 12% all stock sweet feed, a 14% horse sweet feed, Nutrena calf starter, BOSS, alfalfa pellets, and timothy pellets. I've tried every different combo of all these feeds, as well as feeding all of them separately (plain and adding molasses) We even soaked her feed thinking she had teeth issues. She barely nibbles at all of them (at best about 4 mouthfuls of plain calf manna). She will only eat soaked beet pulp with Manna Pro goat skin & coat added.  I'm looking into adding either soybean meal with added dyne supplement or prince hog concentrate (a meal form also) to her beet pulp. If she won't eat this, I am out of ideas. She is losing condition. I'm at a loss. I've never encountered a goat who won't eat sweet feed. Does anyone have any suggestions on what other feeds to try? I'm willing to try anything at this point to get her to at least maintain.


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## Alaskan (Oct 5, 2021)

Lesheffer said:


> I have a 2 year old Alpine doe, who is a dairy cull, freshened beginning August. We got her the end of August. She is hand milked twice daily, giving about 3-4 pounds of milk each time. Her temp is normal, good rumen sounds, normal defecation. Fecal is within normal range per vet. Famacha is 4. We are working on fixing her copper deficiency. Has free choice hay and pasture. She eats hay well, but won't eat any grains. We've tried our custom dairy mix from our feed mill, goat feed from another local mill, Prince goat feed, Nutrena 17% dairy goat feed, Empower horse supplement, calf manna, manna pro goat balancer, 12% all stock sweet feed, a 14% horse sweet feed, Nutrena calf starter, BOSS, alfalfa pellets, and timothy pellets. I've tried every different combo of all these feeds, as well as feeding all of them separately (plain and adding molasses) We even soaked her feed thinking she had teeth issues. She barely nibbles at all of them (at best about 4 mouthfuls of plain calf manna). She will only eat soaked beet pulp with Manna Pro goat skin & coat added.  I'm looking into adding either soybean meal with added dyne supplement or prince hog concentrate (a meal form also) to her beet pulp. If she won't eat this, I am out of ideas. She is losing condition. I'm at a loss. I've never encountered a goat who won't eat sweet feed. Does anyone have any suggestions on what other feeds to try? I'm willing to try anything at this point to get her to at least maintain.


Have you given her a B vitamin?  At my feed store you can get it as a paste.

I would give her  vitamin B paste, AND a probiotoc paste...  and see if that helps her appetite.


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## Alaskan (Oct 5, 2021)

What does she eat while you are milking?


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## Jesusfreak101 (Oct 5, 2021)

I use to use the following mixture
2 parts oats
2 parts barley
1 part black oil sunflower seeds
1 part calf manna
mine seem pretty happy with it. they really liked oats and barley. if you have some old fashion oats in the house for like oat meal might want to try it and see what she thinks


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## Lesheffer (Oct 5, 2021)

Alaskan said:


> Have you given her a B vitamin?  At my feed store you can get it as a paste.
> 
> I would give her  vitamin B paste, AND a probiotoc paste...  and see if that helps her appetite.


I did give her b complex for 3 days orally and it didn't seem to do much. However, I will try this again with the probios. At this point, I'm willing to try anything. Thank you!


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## Lesheffer (Oct 5, 2021)

Alaskan said:


> What does she eat while you are milking?


She eats beet pulp with the goat skin and coat. She is a calm goat and stands well while milking. She wouldn't eat any of the other things we've tried. It was suggested to me to try beet pulp last week with alfalfa pellets soaked. She refused to eat it with the alfalfa in it.


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## Lesheffer (Oct 5, 2021)

Jesusfreak101 said:


> I use to use the following mixture
> 2 parts oats
> 2 parts barley
> 1 part black oil sunflower seeds
> ...


I will give this a try as well. Thank you.


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## Alaskan (Oct 5, 2021)

Well...  next thing, if the vitamin b and probiotics don't work, is start to dry her off.

if she isn't producing milk she should be able to maintain weight on just hay.


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## Lesheffer (Oct 6, 2021)

Alaskan said:


> Well...  next thing, if the vitamin b and probiotics don't work, is start to dry her off.
> 
> if she isn't producing milk she should be able to maintain weight on just hay.


That is the plan, but I want to exhaust all options first before I dry her off. Thank you for your help.


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## Alaskan (Oct 6, 2021)

Just crazy....  must be something else wrong with her since she doesn't want to eat....

The question though....  is what.

Are you going to worm her again?  Since she is so pale?

And....  maybe due to the anemia, she needs vitamin b, pro biotic, and red cell for iron.


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## Lesheffer (Oct 6, 2021)

Alaskan said:


> Just crazy....  must be something else wrong with her since she doesn't want to eat....
> 
> The question though....  is what.
> 
> ...


Her worming has been completed. She got red cell for two weeks. I've started giving her b complex again with probios. Her color has improved a little, but not where I would comfortably call a 3. At milking, I offer her goat pellets in the feed bucket, then give her beet pulp in a bowl on top. This morning I got her to eat soaked beet pulp with soybean meal. After watching her eat last night and this morning, I'm wondering if she has teeth sensitivity. She will eat a couple bites, but chews cautiously. She got a hard piece of something and she refused to eat after that.😔


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## Lesheffer (Oct 6, 2021)

Lesheffer said:


> Her worming has been completed. She got red cell for two weeks. I've started giving her b complex again with probios. Her color has improved a little, but not where I would comfortably call a 3. At milking, I offer her goat pellets in the feed bucket, then give her beet pulp in a bowl on top. This morning I got her to eat soaked beet pulp with soybean meal. After watching her eat last night and this morning, I'm wondering if she has teeth sensitivity. She will eat a couple bites, but chews cautiously. She got a hard piece of something and she refused to eat after that.😔


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## Alaskan (Oct 6, 2021)

Lesheffer said:


> Her color has improved a little, but not where I would comfortably call a 3.


That would make we worm again with a different class wormer.

Or...  take a fecal sample and see what you see.

There are many kinds of worms, and some can become resistant to regular meds.


Lesheffer said:


> I'm wondering if she has teeth sensitivity. She will eat a couple bites, but chews cautiously. She got a hard piece of something and she refused to eat after that.😔


That does sound like a possibility.   But to check her teeth????  You would need 2 people and probably have to hog tie her as well.  Or have the help of an experienced and good vet.  But it does sound like a thorough teeth check is in order.


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## frustratedearthmother (Oct 6, 2021)

@Alaskan has given you good advice.  I agree that with the Famacha readings she's not where she needs to be yet.  

I've got a couple of ideas.  Was your doe wormed just once?  W have found that worming in 10 day increments for a month works better than one or two wormings.  We also have found that combining wormers works better than one wormer these days.  So many parasites have become resistant to worming medications.  Valbazen and Cydectin has worked well for me, however, keep in mind that Valbazen is not to be used in pregnant does.   We use the full dose of both wormers given one after the other.  We also copper bolus several times a year to help keep their parasite resistance at a higher level and try to worm on an empty stomach if possible.  I follow up with probiotics within 24 hours.  

Wouldn't hurt to check her teeth too.  Good luck with her!


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## farmerjan (Oct 6, 2021)

Your observations at milking of her eating and getting something hard made her quit makes me really lean towards  a problem with her teeth or jaw.  Do they "float" teeth in goats like in a horse?  I know that occasionally a cow will have a problem with teeth but they mostly just lose them... but she may have an infection in her jaw, and chewing on a certain tooth could make it painful if she hits it.... cows on silage and all can actually get by with few/no teeth and some have the teeth worn to nubs... grazing makes it very hard for them to get enough with short/no teeth... but being fed a total mixed ration in a bunk is not very difficult for a cow to get enough to eat without teeth. 
I would seriously look into the teeth/jaw angle.


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## Thefarmofdreams (Oct 7, 2021)

Another thought on the teeth/jaw angle... Do goat teeth get sensitive to sugar when they're hurting? Like people? If so, maybe that's why she won't eat sweet feeds...


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## Lesheffer (Oct 14, 2021)

We had the vet look at Olive's mouth. She had a thorn lodged between her gums and her tooth. We're not sure why it didn't abscess. 
As far as worming, we do use two classes of wormers, every 10 days for 3 treatments.
Thank you so much to everyone who offered ideas. I greatly appreciate it.


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## frustratedearthmother (Oct 14, 2021)

Fantastic!  Glad you got some relief for her!


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## Alaskan (Oct 14, 2021)

Lesheffer said:


> She had a thorn lodged between her gums and her tooth.


That will do it!

Did the vet give a different idea/suggestion as to worming, since she is so pale?


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## Lesheffer (Oct 14, 2021)

The vet said to continue red cell daily for another two-three weeks, check famacha and do fecal weekly. If fecals are good we aren't going to worm again, but will continue fecal weekly for a couple weeks after that🤷‍♀️ She says that Olive's famancha should starting improving soon. I've never had a goat with that high of a score before, so this is new for me.


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## Mini Horses (Oct 15, 2021)

Glad they found the source of pain.   Let us know if she begins to eat now.


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## Alaskan (Oct 15, 2021)

Lesheffer said:


> The vet said to continue red cell daily for another two-three weeks, check famacha and do fecal weekly. If fecals are good we aren't going to worm again, but will continue fecal weekly for a couple weeks after that🤷‍♀️ She says that Olive's famancha should starting improving soon. I've never had a goat with that high of a score before, so this is new for me.


Ah, ok, good to know.

How is her eating?  All better?  Or improving slowly?


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