# Some Rabbit Questions



## June2012 (Jul 2, 2016)

I'm very sure some of my questions have been asked, but I have some other things thrown in here. Some ideas that I've been contemplating but have no idea if they'd work or not!

I would like a meat rabbit that I and possibly, my family, would eat. Nobody has tasted it yet except for one person who ate it a lot when she was younger. (Her grandmother thought it would make her a very fertile woman -- it worked! lol) She says she doesn't like it, but the rabbits used were very old because she used to be poor and older rabbits were cheaper + there's word that it's more potent too? No idea really, but I'm curious: does rabbit have a strong smell to it? Is it like mutton? I don't find chicken or beef to have that strong of a smell, and sometimes, chicken can smell for us, so we marinade it.

I also wanted to note that we generally don't eat a lot of meat as a whole. We're almost vegetarians because of the fact that we're not crazy about meat. We like it, but we don't eat it on a day-to-day basis. Maybe 1-3 times a week? Something not too big or too small would fit us nicely. However, I don't mind a larger breed since I can feed extras to my dog.

Besides this, I'm looking at meat breeds that give a fairly nice pelt. I don't live anywhere cold enough to actually wear it, but I think selling it on the Internet would be a pretty good idea.

Are there any breeds that do pretty well on tractoring more so than others, in your personal experience? I also would like to harvest Angora fur, so I've thought about having some Angora does, breeding them with a meat buck when I need to, and eating the litters. The breeding does are strictly for Angora production. I don't know how good of an idea that is, though. Could the crosses be in a tractor? Would it be too hot for the cross? If it matters, I'm looking at German and Satin Angoras.

I have an idea, although a little strange, of making a system with different "floors". The "B" Floor, the Life is Good Floor, and the Nursery. The "B" Floor would belong to a buck and his friend, or possibly another buck if they get along. (I've read of some bucks be good friends if there are no females near by?) "Life is Good" floor would be the single females, as I'm imagining that I would rotate the females producing. The last floor, the Nursery, would belong to females and their kits. Once the kits are weaned, I can put them in tractors until old enough to eat.

Currently, I think Silver Foxes would suit my purposes, but I would like some insight on Florida Whites. Or the classic Californians and NZWs. 

TIA! Hopefully, I'll get some answers, and my ideas aren't too crazy. I won't be owning rabbits very soon either. Probably in about a year or two, but there's no pain in asking now, haha.


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## Latestarter (Jul 3, 2016)

Greetings @June2012 & Welcome to BYH  You've posed some very good questions and I'm sure the answers will be well varied. I don't own rabbits but will tag a few folks who may be able to address some or all of your Qs. Glad you joined! Hope you'll browse around a bit  and maybe decide to stick around. There's a wealth of info on the threads.

@Hens and Roos @Bunnylady @promiseacres @chiques chicks @Shorty @LukeMeister @Pastor Dave @Ebers @Samantha drawz

Gosh... there are quite a few active rabbiteers here... There are others, but I can't recall them all. Anyway, Good luck moving forward!


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## Hens and Roos (Jul 3, 2016)

Welcome glad you joined us.  I will try and answer some of your questions based on our experiences with rabbits.  We have both Californian and French Angora.

Our Californians are raised for meat, we process for the most part when the rabbits are young under 6 months so the pelts are not as thick as they would be on an older rabbit.  We do from time to time process the older rabbits.  We will either cook the rabbits in the crock pot or roast in the oven (we add a few strips of bacon and some cut up apple- it helps keep it tender).  Over cooking can make them dry out.  We don't think the rabbits have any stronger smell then chicken.

Our French Angora are raised for fiber but we do end up processing them from time to time for meat as well.  They are lighter then our Californians because their primary purpose is to produce fiber. 

Personally, we would not cross a meat buck over a fiber doe- I'm not sure that the doe could produce enough milk to provide good growth for the kits.

We house our bucks separately to prevent fighting.  We have 1 floor pen with a Cali doe and her female kits to give them more space and for now since the kits aren't at maturity it works- once they hit maturity it can be difficult to keep them together- space is a big factor so the more space you can provide the better.

Good Luck and keep us posted on what you end up getting.


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## June2012 (Jul 3, 2016)

Latestarter said:


> Greetings @June2012 & Welcome to BYH  You've posed some very good questions and I'm sure the answers will be well varied. I don't own rabbits but will tag a few folks who may be able to address some or all of your Qs. Glad you joined! Hope you'll browse around a bit  and maybe decide to stick around. There's a wealth of info on the threads.
> 
> @Hens and Roos @Bunnylady @promiseacres @chiques chicks @Shorty @LukeMeister @Pastor Dave @Ebers @Samantha drawz
> 
> Gosh... there are quite a few active rabbiteers here... There are others, but I can't recall them all. Anyway, Good luck moving forward!



Thank you! The tags are going to be an immense amount of help to me. 



Hens and Roos said:


> Our Californians are raised for meat, we process for the most part when the rabbits are young under 6 months so the pelts are not as thick as they would be on an older rabbit. We do from time to time process the older rabbits. We will either cook the rabbits in the crock pot or roast in the oven (we add a few strips of bacon and some cut up apple- it helps keep it tender). Over cooking can make them dry out. We don't think the rabbits have any stronger smell then chicken.



Do pelts need to be from older rabbits?? I can see how too young could be a problem, like duck or goose down I suppose? And to mask the smell of rabbit, what do you usually do if you don't like it? For chicken in our house, we use milk. 



Hens and Roos said:


> Our French Angora are raised for fiber but we do end up processing them from time to time for meat as well. They are lighter then our Californians because their primary purpose is to produce fiber.



I don't mind smaller rabbits, but I do want the rabbits to be worth butchering and feeding. Do you think crossing them would make the kits too small?



Hens and Roos said:


> Personally, we would not cross a meat buck over a fiber doe- I'm not sure that the doe could produce enough milk to provide good growth for the kits.



Would a fiber buck over a meat doe work? I would like tractoring to be a possibility, but I'm not even sure if the Angora blood could make that possible even though they're a cross.



Hens and Roos said:


> We house our bucks separately to prevent fighting. We have 1 floor pen with a Cali doe and her female kits to give them more space and for now since the kits aren't at maturity it works- once they hit maturity it can be difficult to keep them together- space is a big factor so the more space you can provide the better.



I do know that space is very important. I don't know if my idea about having separate stories would really work. It's just an idea, really, to save some space since the floors will probably be indoors in a barn or something. I thought about outdoor colonies, but I'm scared of the heat affecting them. Especially the Angoras, and I feel keeping the rabbits together would be easier. Or would it be more humane for the meat rabbits to be outside looking at nature and all that? The indoor rabbits would most likely have A/C so I don't have to worry about males becoming sterile. I want the A/C to be solar powered, but I'm still wrapping my head around the specifics of set ups and stuff. 

Oh, and should I just keep the Angoras and meat rabbits separate? I won't be really trying to improve my herd of rabbits since it seems like a huge head ache, having to change out the buck now and then, finding the best rabbit, etc. I just want some Angora fiber to play with and some meat rabbits, for well, meat!

_Edited because my previous post was crap._


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## samssimonsays (Jul 3, 2016)

I don't have time to read through all of it but I do know people who raise rex or satin rabbits for their pelt to be used after as well. The rex more so.


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## Hens and Roos (Jul 4, 2016)

From what we have run into, the pelts of younger rabbits are easier to tear and thinner. 

As for the smell of the rabbit- I guess we don't notice it, before we even added rabbits, we picked up some meat to try to make sure everyone liked it.  Generally we use the cooked meat in pot pie and mix it into gravy.

Since we don't cross our meat rabbits with our fiber rabbits, we cant speak on how this cross might work.  If they are crossed, the fiber would most likely be different and not useable- again I'm just throwing some thoughts out for you.

Because my kids show both breeds of rabbits for 4-H projects, our angoras stay in full coats so we have to watch the weather so its not too hot for them and they become over heated.  Winter is easier because they live in our heated shop.

The person we purchased our angoras from had her rabbits housed in what use to be a dairy barn.  She build floor areas on each side of the main walk area.  She kept each breed separate, does got the run of the main area and bucks were housed in individual cages within the area.


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## June2012 (Jul 5, 2016)

Samantha drawz said:


> I don't have time to read through all of it but I do know people who raise rex or satin rabbits for their pelt to be used after as well. The rex more so.



Thank you! That'l help me in my decisions for sure.  Do Silver foxes make good pelts? I'm thinking of making mittens and stuff with the pelts, but it's not necessary. I just want fiber and meat.



Hens and Roos said:


> As for the smell of the rabbit- I guess we don't notice it, before we even added rabbits, we picked up some meat to try to make sure everyone liked it. Generally we use the cooked meat in pot pie and mix it into gravy.



You did say that older rabbits are needed for pelts... We'll see how this goes, and I'm sure I could find a way to eat the pelt rabbits when need be. Do you think Rexes or Satins are good for meat?



Hens and Roos said:


> Since we don't cross our meat rabbits with our fiber rabbits, we cant speak on how this cross might work. If they are crossed, the fiber would most likely be different and not useable- again I'm just throwing some thoughts out for you.



Probably. I sort of expected that, but who knows? Maybe I'll develop this weird rabbit thing that turns out great!
I've heard that French Angoras are sort of dual purpose, depending on the lines, but for the most part, they are mostly for fiber production. Do you think this is true?



Hens and Roos said:


> Because my kids show both breeds of rabbits for 4-H projects, our angoras stay in full coats so we have to watch the weather so its not too hot for them and they become over heated. Winter is easier because they live in our heated shop.



How do you keep them cool in the summer?


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## Hens and Roos (Jul 5, 2016)

we only have Cali and French Angora rabbits so we cant speak to how any of the other breeds will be.

we have had to process some of the angoras, they are smaller in body size and therefore less meat.

We run a fan as needed in the warmest months (May-August) and they are housed in our shop, so far this has worked for us.


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## June2012 (Jul 5, 2016)

Hens and Roos said:


> we only have Cali and French Angora rabbits so we cant speak to how any of the other breeds will be.
> 
> we have had to process some of the angoras, they are smaller in body size and therefore less meat.
> 
> We run a fan as needed in the warmest months (May-August) and they are housed in our shop, so far this has worked for us.



Thank you for everything! I honestly am looking forward to rabbits one day, and am thinking that I probably wouldn't cross the both fiber and meat animals together...
I know nothing about 4-H, honestly, but does that mean you breed the French Angoras? And if you do, have you found a significant difference in rabbit care when raising two different breeds that need to be separated? Cost wise, time wise, everything wise?


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## Hens and Roos (Jul 5, 2016)

We do breed both the FA's and the Cali's- we have separate areas with cages for both breeds and 2-4 floor pens depending on how many litters we have.  The biggest difference is that with the FA's we have to groom them to help keep them from getting wool block(they groom themselves similar to a cat but cant throw up the hair balls).  We have separate feed for the 2 breeds- we try to keep things simple- we did this so that our 3 kids were able to help when they were younger(we have had rabbits for several years now).  The FA's shed out about every 90 days but we found that if we can groom them every other week or even once a month it makes a big difference in keeping their fiber from tangling/matting up.  Over all they do take more time and the wool formula pellets are a little more expensive.


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## Bunnylady (Jul 6, 2016)

The gene that causes the angora coat is recessive, meaning that a rabbit has to inherit it from both parents to have long hair. If you cross a longhair to a rabbit with a normal coat, you will get normal-coated babies. Though the coat from such a cross might be normal in length, that doesn't mean the texture will be normal; it may be denser and softer because of genes inherited from the angora. When you cross rabbits of different coat types, you can wind up with the worst of both worlds; some traits that make one type of coat good can be an absolute wreck on another type of coat.

The tricky part of pelt production is that shedding thing. A rabbit usually molts from nose to tail; there is usually a discernible line called a 'prime line' with fresh new coat behind it that moves down the rabbit's body as the molt progresses. A rabbit that has just completed a molt is said to be in prime coat; that's the goal in pelt production. The problem with pelts and fryers is timing - young rabbits usually start getting their first change of coat at about the same time as they reach slaughter weight. The pelt of a rabbit that was shedding when it was slaughtered is a mess; waiting until the rabbit has completed the molt means older, tougher meat - which is the reason that most people aim for meat production or pelt production, but not both.

The body type of basically all of the rabbit breeds you have mentioned is the same - what the ARBA calls commercial type. That means they are supposed to have well-filled, muscular bodies. Some may take a little bit longer to reach slaughter weight because their adult size is a bit smaller, but when you get down to it, you can eat any rabbit - they all taste the same. Shoot, I used to know a guy who bred dynamite Netherland Dwarfs, and ate his culls, though he said the only parts worth bothering with were the loin and back legs.


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## June2012 (Jul 7, 2016)

Bunnylady said:


> The gene that causes the angora coat is recessive, meaning that a rabbit has to inherit it from both parents to have long hair. If you cross a longhair to a rabbit with a normal coat, you will get normal-coated babies. Though the coat from such a cross might be normal in length, that doesn't mean the texture will be normal; it may be denser and softer because of genes inherited from the angora. When you cross rabbits of different coat types, you can wind up with the worst of both worlds; some traits that make one type of coat good can be an absolute wreck on another type of coat.



OH! I actually thought it wasn't recessive because of Satin Angoras was a cross between a French Angora and a Satin rabbit, then bred from there as a breed... That's good to know! And I can see that happening. I really don't think it'd be the best of plans, lol. I'm thinking that the Angoras could be pets, possibly. 



Bunnylady said:


> The tricky part of pelt production is that shedding thing. A rabbit usually molts from nose to tail; there is usually a discernible line called a 'prime line' with fresh new coat behind it that moves down the rabbit's body as the molt progresses. A rabbit that has just completed a molt is said to be in prime coat; that's the goal in pelt production. The problem with pelts and fryers is timing - young rabbits usually start getting their first change of coat at about the same time as they reach slaughter weight. The pelt of a rabbit that was shedding when it was slaughtered is a mess; waiting until the rabbit has completed the molt means older, tougher meat - which is the reason that most people aim for meat production or pelt production, but not both.



Hmmm... I see. So it's really either one or the other, I guess. I can't imagine myself raising three different breeds of rabbit, so I would need to narrow it down to what I want in rabbits, right? That'd be meat and angora because I love to knit...don't know what I'd do with pelts, but thought it'd be a cool side product.
Would it hurt to have a pelt breed, have some for meat and some for pelts or how I felt about it? At what age must the rabbits be for the pelts to be in there prime, say, for a Silver Fox?



Bunnylady said:


> The body type of basically all of the rabbit breeds you have mentioned is the same - what the ARBA calls commercial type. That means they are supposed to have well-filled, muscular bodies. Some may take a little bit longer to reach slaughter weight because their adult size is a bit smaller, but when you get down to it, you can eat any rabbit - they all taste the same. Shoot, I used to know a guy who bred dynamite Netherland Dwarfs, and ate his culls, though he said the only parts worth bothering with were the loin and back legs.



That was what I was aiming for when choosing breeds.  Do you have any particular suggestions on which breeds seem to be the most heat tolerant? I was thinking of Florida Whites because I read that they were smaller blocks of meat on legs, and were fairly heat tolerant! But I also love how Silver Foxes look, and can only imagine how nice the pelts would be...
Oh my god, Netherland Dwarves? XD I always wanted one as a pet when I was younger...they're just so freaking adorable.


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## Latestarter (Jul 7, 2016)

Hmmmm a veritable plethora of conflicting issues,  leading to the inevitable conclusion that you should quit your day job and open a rabbitry encompassing the full gambit of possibilities.  

Your property covered with large, climate controlled breeding houses for each of the three "types"; meat/fiber/pelt.   Maybe a 4th building specifically for the cuteness bunnies as pets.   And each building of sufficient size to handle several breeds within.  With a proper business plan in place you could market all sorts of items; meat/pelts/fiber/pets/show quality rabbits, right down to organic fertilizer   I know, I know...  

This is about where my mind goes when thinking about all the various livestock I want... goats, sheep, pigs, chickens, bees, maybe a steer or 2 or 3, maybe some meat rabbits... And I haven't even sold my present little place to buy the bigger place to handle all these "wants". Then when I get the bigger place, there's all that required infrastructure  I'm by myself and not getting any younger.. Don't know that I'll ever get to the point I envision.

Hope you're still with us down the road when you finally start bringing your ideas to fruition. We'll want pics or it never happened!


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## Bunnylady (Jul 7, 2016)

June2012 said:


> OH! I actually thought it wasn't recessive because of Satin Angoras was a cross between a French Angora and a Satin rabbit, then bred from there as a breed...



Satin is also recessive; the creator(s) of the Satin Angora really had their work cut out for them.


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## June2012 (Jul 8, 2016)

Latestarter said:


> Hmmmm a veritable plethora of conflicting issues,  leading to the inevitable conclusion that you should quit your day job and open a rabbitry encompassing the full gambit of possibilities.
> 
> Your property covered with large, climate controlled breeding houses for each of the three "types"; meat/fiber/pelt.   Maybe a 4th building specifically for the cuteness bunnies as pets.   And each building of sufficient size to handle several breeds within.  With a proper business plan in place you could market all sorts of items; meat/pelts/fiber/pets/show quality rabbits, right down to organic fertilizer   I know, I know...
> 
> ...



HAHAHAHAHAHA! I love that idea!! I wish, but I need my goats, cows, sheep and poultry free ranging everywhere lol. Ugh, but it honestly seems so amazingly great. And just imagine, what if it was all humane certified and everything? Plus all heritage breeds? I would more than anything want it! I also planned solar paneled A/C and heating for my future barns 
I also want to tell you something... Age is honestly just perception, and the end is when your body gives out. My mother became a nurse at the age of 53. She always wanted to be one, but life was a PITA. Achieving dreams is about will power and work, that's it! 



Bunnylady said:


> Satin is also recessive; the creator(s) of the Satin Angora really had their work cut out for them.



Dang... Maybe I should have an Angora farm with meat rabbits on the side for self-sustainability.


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