# Horns growing AFTER disbudding?



## NubianNerd (Aug 13, 2009)

We have 4 month-and-a-half Nubian doelings that were disbudded at 12-14 days(one set was born two days earlier and we did them all on the same day) I know, I know, you're supposed to do them earlier, but the shipment was late.
So anyway, one goat from each set of twins has grown horns about an inch long. Not scurs, properly developed horns. None of the homes that are taking these babies want horns, so I was wondering if we could just burn them again? I don't want to gouge or anything...
(yes, I know, I'm sorry, I never posted pictures)


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## Roll farms (Aug 13, 2009)

You can try reburning them, it doesn't always work.   Same rules apply, don't leave it on too long, go for the 'copper ring', then (my own lil trick) use the side of the disbudder to burn the center of the horn in sort of an X shape.

I get more scurs / grow backs w/ the bucklings than the doelings.  
Darn horns, anyway....


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## onedozenphyllises (Aug 13, 2009)

We had the same problem with our first kids - they actually belonged to a friend at that time and we helped her disbud all the kids.  It was everyone's first time to do it.  ALL of them grew horns.  We thought we had done it right, but apparently not.  We had our little boy surgically dehorned by a vet at about 3 months old - FYI, it cost us about $100 but was totally worth it.  No trauma, no open holes in his head, no horns to worry about.  Our doe still has hers.  Looks like they'll stay, too, since she's 8 months old now.  We think we didn't keep the iron on long enough (it's so hard when they're little and wailing!).  We know better now.  

I have heard that you can re-burn if they're small enough for the iron to still fit over them, but we didn't see our goats between the time we disbudded and when they came to live with us after weaning, and by then they were too big to re-burn.


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## kstaven (Aug 14, 2009)

It happens to many people. Many times you find that the iron was not preheated long enough beforehand.


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## cmjust0 (Aug 14, 2009)

We had one that started growing what looked to be a perfect little pointy horn after disbudding, but it ended up basically being hollow..  It fell off at some point and she ended up with little round nubby scurs..  Thinking back, I'm pretty sure I didn't get a good copper ring.

As for making an 'x' in the center of the horn bud....my understanding is that the goal of the copper ring is to be sure that all the blood vessels are destroyed in a ring around the horn bud..  No blood vessels means no blood flow, so the horn cells starve.  If you leave even one spot that's not crispy copper, blood can still flow and some of the cells will live, leaving your goat with a scur..

Point being, so long as you get the copper ring, you shouldn't really need to burn the horn bud itself.  It won't hurt the disbudding if you do, but for me....as little time as I can spend with an 1,100 degree iron in close proximity to a baby goat's ears and eyes, the better.


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## trestlecreek (Aug 14, 2009)

At this point, I would wait until the goat is about 6 months old, and then I would band the horn.


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## cmjust0 (Aug 14, 2009)

trestlecreek said:
			
		

> At this point, I would wait until the goat is about 6 months old, and then I would band the horn.


Probably not an option, since the OP said none of homes that are taking them want horns..  Can't really expect to sell someone a goat that was supposed to be disbudded and say "Oh, by the way..you're going to have to band these horns...."  

Plus...6mo is only six weeks from now, since they're 4-1/2mo old.  That tells me the "horn" isn't really growing much at all.  If it were a normal horn, it should be much longer than 1" at 4-1/2mo of age.

My guess is that the horns you see growing are really just hollow, leathery shells, and that they'd pop right off and reveal a little roundish, blunt, nubbin of a scur.  If so, the nubbin will continue to grow really slowly and probably never amount to much.  So long as a scur isn't growing back into the skull or flesh, I don't worry about them.

You don't want them if you can avoid it, obviously, but a scur wouldn't prevent me from buying a goat that I otherwise liked, let's put it that way.  Horns would, but not scurs.


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## NubianNerd (Aug 14, 2009)

cmjust0 said:
			
		

> trestlecreek said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


There's four of them, not four months. Each is one month and a half old.
Thanks for all of the good info guys!
So what I'm taking away from this is that I should burn them again, then if that doesn't work, see the vet. Am I right?


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## cmjust0 (Aug 14, 2009)

nn said:
			
		

> There's four of them, not four months. Each is one month and a half old.


wow...I totally gacked it, didn't I?  

Ok, so...n/m on everything I said.


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## trestlecreek (Aug 14, 2009)

You can try to re-burn them, but you run a risk of thermal damage to the brain. It takes several months for a goats head to heal from just one burn. Personally, I wouldn't take that risk, but ultimately that's a choice you have to make.
As far as banding, that is the safest alternative. You can put the band on 4 weeks before selling the kids and explain the situation. 
A vet would likely surgically dehorn the goat. That is a risky operation with a long recovery period.


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## onedozenphyllises (Aug 14, 2009)

We had our vet surgically dehorn one of our goats and his recovery was only about a day or two.  We did NOT go the route of leaving an open wound that had to be kept covered, etc.  It cost more, but the vet gave a general anesthetic and stitched the site closed.  It's not really cost effective to do this all the time, but for one-off cases, I'd say its a good option.  We pulled the stitches ourselves after about two weeks, which was...entertaining.  

I guess if you're considering the surgical route, its worth asking HOW they do it.


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## norcal (Aug 22, 2009)

Blanco, one of my lil' wethers, has the same little pointy nubbin coming out.   I hope it's just hollow like y'all are saying.   I don't have the guts to try to disbud myself (it was done by the seller).   He is 13 weeks.  I will post a pic later to see what you guys think!?!


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## norcal (Aug 27, 2009)

Uh, Blanco's lil horn nubbin' fell off.   
I guess I won't take pics.  There's still a little sharp pokey thing, but it's really small and thin.   

I guess it's a learning game....


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