# *graphic picture warning*



## BlueMoonFarms (May 31, 2014)

My goat Annie, is on the verge of being down. I can get her to stand but its difficult. 
Shes hot to the touch, has liquid diarrhea and she keeps yawning. No blood in stool.
This all happened within 24 hours.
No sign of worms, nothing toxic that we can find in the goat pen, and he food has not changed.
I have called my vet but have not hard back yet. Until then, any suggestions?


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## Goat Whisperer (May 31, 2014)

Take her temp. What do her eyelids look like? Check her gums, are they white or gray?


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## BlueMoonFarms (May 31, 2014)

Gums are pink, eyes are dark red but hubby just milked her out and we found blood in one of the milk glands.
The mastitis test did not show up mastitis either yesterday or today (We do random testing thankfully) 
I'll take her temp shortly.


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## alsea1 (May 31, 2014)

How are the other herd members
Does the diarrhea have a foul odor to it
If it does smell really bad I would suspect cocci
without lab work though a diagnosis is just guessing game at best
I hope your vet gets to you soon.
Till you hear from the vet I would give electrolytes and just do supportive care right now
Dehydration is going to do a lot of harm.  So you need to keep her hydrated and replace the stuff she is loosing


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## alsea1 (May 31, 2014)

Def. take her temp
An abnormal temp can tell you if there is some kind of infection somewhere


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## BlueMoonFarms (May 31, 2014)

alsea1 said:


> How are the other herd members
> Does the diarrhea have a foul odor to it
> If it does smell really bad I would suspect cocci
> without lab work though a diagnosis is just guessing game at best
> ...


It smells different, but not sour. Still no word from vet.
I have gatorade im going to give her if I cant get her to eat. molasses water first.


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## BlueMoonFarms (May 31, 2014)

105.1 is her temp. its high not low which means infection correct?
Also her stomach is getting a little tight while she is laying down, you don't think I should be worried about bloat on top of everything else do you?


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## BlueMoonFarms (May 31, 2014)

Oh, and every other animal in the farm is acting normal. No diarrhea, no thick poop, not even a belly ache.


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## alsea1 (May 31, 2014)

How long ago did she kid
It might be good to massage her belly to help her move any gas
Get your vet out asap
Is she fairly alert still
Is she making any sounds of distress


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## BlueMoonFarms (May 31, 2014)

She kidded 6 weeks ago.
She is not making any distress noises, I still haven't heard back from the vet, I just another message but if shes in the barn and forgot her cell phone it could be an hour+ that I wait.
She is still a tiny bit "alert" sorta speak. She did get and move, she is not laying out flat just hunched up.
No distress calls.


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## BlueMoonFarms (May 31, 2014)

Eureka! I found a retired vet close by who will be coming out to check on Annie.


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## alsea1 (May 31, 2014)

I'm so glad to hear that.  You must be so relieved. I know I would be.
Let us know what his diagnosis and treatment plan is.


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## Goat Whisperer (May 31, 2014)

Update?


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## BlueMoonFarms (May 31, 2014)

Sorry, i've been running around all morning tending to everything I ignored while freaking out of Annie.
I have good news and bad news.
Good news is we know whats wrong with her. Its mastitis caused by environmental factors (?) and it came on within hours which was horrifying. Her temp spiked to 107.2 while we waited for the vet. The vet put her on three types of antibiotics that she needs to stay on for a few days. One I have to infuse the teat with while the other two are injected under the skin. I also need to strip her one to two times every one to two hours.
The bad news? Its a 50-50 chance that Annie is going to make it, and then if she does make it there is a chance she could end up loosing the function of her udder...
It just goes to show that you can be as careful and clean as possible, but can still end up with problems. And those stupid test strips don't tell you anything!
I just hope she ends up making it, udder or not.


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## goatboy1973 (May 31, 2014)

Hope the best scenario plays out!


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## alsea1 (May 31, 2014)

Oh gosh. You are going to be frazzled by the end of this.
She may pull thru with flying colors and be just fine.
Thank heavens you found that vet.


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## Goat Whisperer (May 31, 2014)

Hope she can make it! 

Sorry you have to deal with this.


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## AshleyFishy (May 31, 2014)

coliform mastitis? Or staph A?


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## BlueMoonFarms (May 31, 2014)

AshleyFishy said:


> coliform mastitis? Or staph A?


He said it was environmental not contagious, and said something about it being staff, so im assuming he meant Staff A?
I was so out of it and scatter brained that I will honestly have to ask him again. I know he did a test on it because he wanted to rule out E.Coli.


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## AshleyFishy (May 31, 2014)

Oh don't I know that feeling! You poor thing. Well yes IF it is staphylococcus aureus it is hard to get rid of and CAN return. Has he done a culture or did he just have a hypothesis? I know you said he did a test.


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## BlueMoonFarms (May 31, 2014)

AshleyFishy said:


> Oh don't I know that feeling! You poor thing. Well yes IF it is staphylococcus aureus it is hard to get rid of and CAN return. Has he done a culture or did he just have a hypothesis? I know you said he did a test.


He did do a culture but has not gotten back to me yet, we will find out!  What if it ends up being the other one?  Either way im not very optimistic about her longevity. Even with the antibiotics she is still not really acting any different. Her udder is still swollen 
My other vet just got back to me to (More like a few hours ago actually) she could not find her work phone all day and called me when she could.
She said that due to the suddenness and aggressiveness of the infection she thinks its more injury related. It would make sense actually since I did see her head butting with another goat a lot yesterday. Im not sure how it all works honestly, so now im just waiting to hear back from the first gentleman who came out to see her.


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## alsea1 (May 31, 2014)

It will take a day or so to see real improvement.  Be patient and follow vet instructions.


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## goatboy1973 (Jun 1, 2014)

Still hoping for a good outcome for her.


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## jodief100 (Jun 1, 2014)

So sorry.  Hoping things are better.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 1, 2014)

Well shes definitely acting a tiny bit better. She ate a few maple and apple leaves, got up on her own to drink some water and then while I was out scooping poop in the dog run my roommate told me he saw her eating some hay.
She is still not well, still just kinda...laying there and needs to be encouraged to move, but other then that she appears to be showing some improvement emotionally.
Udder wise, the one side has started to shrivel up while the one infected has turned into a half filled water balloon full of fowl smelling bloody liquid...
Fabulous...
At least she appears to be pulling through maybe? Yes? I don't know, i'm honestly afraid to be optimistic.
And no the vet did not do a culture, he said he could do one and I swear I said yes do it, but now he just has guesses.
This is why i like my vet...


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## alsea1 (Jun 1, 2014)

I know what you mean. I tend to think the worst. That way when things don't go bad I'm thrilled.
This sounds like it is going to be a long recovery.
Keep us posted on your journey.


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## Goat Whisperer (Jun 1, 2014)




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## Goat Whisperer (Jun 2, 2014)

How is she doing?


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## HoneyDreameMomma (Jun 2, 2014)

Hope she pulls through!


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 2, 2014)

Well she is certainly better then Saturday. Shes up more then she was, she was caught drinking and eating some hay, and she took some goat treats from my mother this morning.
All signs are looking optimistic, however that udder still looks really bad. The good news about her udder is that its draining naturally now. At least I think its good, its oozing out on its own now.
I'll see about getting pictures when I go back out to strip her again.


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## Goat Whisperer (Jun 2, 2014)

Glad she seems to be on the upswing!

Has her udder changed color? Does it feel hot or cold (it will feel cold after the udder dies) or normal? 

Sounds like she can make it thru this!


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## Goat Whisperer (Jun 2, 2014)

Is she on pain meds?


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 2, 2014)

Nope, no udder color change. Though it does get cold until I massage the warmth back into it which i do every hour.
*Benefit of working from home*
And yes, she is on a pain med. Though it does not seem to help a lot. I think he gave her a weaker dose.


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## Goat Whisperer (Jun 5, 2014)

How is she today? Hope she is doing better!


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## alsea1 (Jun 5, 2014)

How is your goat doing


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 5, 2014)

Shame on me I keep forgetting to post these.



 

 

 

 
Here is poor Annie...
She is definitely feeling better, but that udder frightens me...
The wall on the left side (looking at the picture) is getting thinner like an abscess ready to burst. Only its hollow not firm, and its ice cold now...
I am just waiting for it to sluff off, and when that happens I really might faint.
Im really good with blood and gore but omg an udder falling off in my hand is SOOO not something i think i'll be able to handle. Ugh...


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## frustratedearthmother (Jun 5, 2014)




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## Farmin' Girl (Jun 5, 2014)

Aw, poor girl, I hope she recovers soon.


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## alsea1 (Jun 5, 2014)

I have heard of some pretty bad cases recovering. There's always hope


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 6, 2014)

alsea1 said:


> I have heard of some pretty bad cases recovering. There's always hope


Oh I hope so...
This is becoming very gross.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 8, 2014)

Ok, I think this is good news. Annie's udder does have a hole in it but its scabbed over now, and all that is coming out of her udder is an almost clear liquid. Hopefully all it wants to do if have a hole and not fall off!! A hole i can deal with...


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 8, 2014)

Ugh...So I was right. The top layer of skin came off around the back of her udder. The scab I did not get a good picture of as she was kicking pretty fierce. She does not like me going near that area. I'll try to get a picture of it in the morning. The whole bottom of her udder is cold and rubbery. Bleh...


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## frustratedearthmother (Jun 9, 2014)

OMG - bless her heart! (and yours!)


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## Goat Whisperer (Jun 9, 2014)

Eww, that is nasty. Poor girl.    

I know it sounds crazy, but my vet has done surgery's to remove half the udder on goats that have mastitis. Have you considered it? I have no idea on what it would cost, but I'm just throwing it out there.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 9, 2014)

Goat Whisperer said:


> Eww, that is nasty. Poor girl.
> 
> I know it sounds crazy, but my vet has done surgery's to remove half the udder on goats that have mastitis. Have you considered it? I have no idea on what it would cost, but I'm just throwing it out there.



We have not as we did not know it was an option? It would end up depending on how much it costs in the end and if she was in pain or not. Right now the vet just wants to see if she can heal up and shrivel up naturally without getting infected again. They still seem to think that she will recover without loosing the bottom half...
So I guess I am stuck waiting and reporting to them how shes doing. *shrug* 
Either way i am properly grossed out every time I touch the thing...At least shes still on her pain meds and can't feel anything. Bleh.


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## goatboy1973 (Jun 9, 2014)

Poor girl. I hate this for her and you also. Goats are pretty resilient critters so maybe she can pull through this with her mammary system  returning back to normal. Did the vet suggest any hydrotherapy like soaking her whole bag in warm Epsom salt water once or twice daily?


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 10, 2014)

So...yeah...
The vet keeps telling me she will be fine, that amputating the udder is not necessary and to just let nature take its coarse like balls on a soon to be weather...
We have to keep it clean, keep it "milked" and keep draining it...
Yup...Its going to be coming off...and now its only a mater of time.
I figure at this point I should keep posting pictures for those who might be in the same situation as Anne and I. If anything its educational no?
Bleh...


 

 

 
Its now lost the top layer of skin all around the outside of the udder, the teat has turned black, and the scab that formed over the hole has wrapped around the entire top of the area missing skin.
Nothing but light brown/clear liquid is coming out now, and the udder is completely rubbery...


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## Farmin' Girl (Jun 10, 2014)

Poor girl, hope she heals well!


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## frustratedearthmother (Jun 11, 2014)

Oh wow - you definitely deserve another jewel in your crown for dealing with this!


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 14, 2014)

So...its now become this.
Her nipple either, shrunk, fell off or she bit it off.  because it is certainly missing quite a bit of length to it...


 


And of course while I was taking pictures she just had to dump her water bucket and soak her pen...
Guess what i'm doing right after I post this? Ugh...


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## Melanie (Jun 14, 2014)

I am so sorry.  That must be very hard to deal with.  You are a very strong person to be able to continue to milk her and care for her.  I would be in tears every time I had to milk her out.  I will be praying for her to have a quick recovery for both of your sakes.  Even though this is very disturbing to look at it is very educational for me because I have never had to deal with mastitis.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 14, 2014)

Melanie said:


> I am so sorry.  That must be very hard to deal with.  You are a very strong person to be able to continue to milk her and care for her.  I would be in tears every time I had to milk her out.  I will be praying for her to have a quick recovery for both of your sakes.  Even though this is very disturbing to look at it is very educational for me because I have never had to deal with mastitis.


Yeah, I just put a graphic picture warning on the title because of that. I'm so used to seeing it I forgot how bad it was.
So thank you for putting that bit in about it being disturbing! And I hope you didn't just stumble onto this thread and find the pictures without the warning >_>
Anyway, its very hard. I wont lie. I make my husband do it when I just cant stomach it.
The good news is that it appears to be shrinking/healing very quickly now. So i'm just hoping that it keeps progressing that way. Quick, and without anymore infection.
(Edit: I need to make sure to pay attention before I press send next time...)


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## Melanie (Jun 14, 2014)

I did not just stumble upon the thread.  I have been silently following it.  I thought you might like to hear that this thread will be very helpful for people like me who have never had to deal with anything like this.  I also wanted you to know that I am praying for you and your doe.  I am happy to hear it appears to be healing quickly.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 14, 2014)

Melanie said:


> I did not just stumble upon the thread.  I have been silently following it.  I thought you might like to hear that this thread will be very helpful for people like me who have never had to deal with anything like this.  I also wanted you to know that I am praying for you and your doe.  I am happy to hear it appears to be healing quickly.


Im sorry I mistyped, but I fixed the error in the previous post. not mad or snippy I promise. Just not paying attention while I do 20 things lol.
I am happy that your finding this educational, that's the whole reason why I keep posting pictures.
Its gross but hopefully someone will be able to learn something, or at least be prepared for it.
I hope you never have to deal with this!


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## alsea1 (Jun 14, 2014)

Its looking like she may have use of her other teat.
Given the circumstances you did a great job of pulling her through.
That was a fast and vicious infection.
This kind of information is invaluable to the rest of us.  
You will get used to this sorta thing as time goes on.  Seems if you raise animals you eventually wind up more or less a vet tech out of necessity.


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## Farmin' Girl (Jun 14, 2014)

I don't have any goats unfortunately, (my dad doesn't really have a heart for goats like I do) but it is still a great learning experience. Thanks for keeping us updated, and I am glad to here your sweet girl is having a quick recovery.


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## goatboy1973 (Jun 14, 2014)

Sounds like it may have been some sort of staphylococcus infection where Bactrim DS might have been a better choice of antibiotic but nevertheless, glad to hear she might be turning the corner on this infection.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 14, 2014)

goatboy1973 said:


> Sounds like it may have been some sort of staphylococcus infection where Bactrim DS might have been a better choice of antibiotic but nevertheless, glad to hear she might be turning the corner on this infection.


I might have posted this elsewhere but all I know is that I had to give her two antibiotic injections daily, her pain killers, and then this blue stuff that I needed to squirt into her udder.
One shot was clear, the other cloudy, neither were labeled...The blue stuff was chiffereslive sol...Yeah thats as good as the spelling is going to get as I can not read a darn thing on the bottle. Chicken scratch!
Anyway, that's what I had to give her. Not sure if that helps at all but there it is.
Anyway, i'll keep posting pictures!


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## goatboy1973 (Jun 14, 2014)

Sounds like you went above and beyond for your doe.


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## goats&moregoats (Jun 15, 2014)

I wish you the best of luck!  Loosing one of our animals is very heart wrenching.


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## Goat Whisperer (Jun 15, 2014)

Poor girl. You are doing everything you can for her, I do admire that!   

If you are worried about the pics, you could put them in a spoiler/



Spoiler: Test



(put pic here)


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 15, 2014)

Goat Whisperer said:


> Poor girl. You are doing everything you can for her, I do admire that!
> 
> If you are worried about the pics, you could put them in a spoiler/
> 
> ...


I think the warning should be enough. I find it gross but its not as bad as others i've seen.
Melanie just got me thinking that I really should put a graphic warning up there just to safe then have someone wander onto the post thinking, "Oh they need help ok." and then find some pictures they really didn't want to see.
So, at least this way they can be prepared 
And thank you. I'm just grateful that my husband was willing to pay the bills. He doesn't admit it, but he loves the goats, and has a very soft spot for Annabel.


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## alsea1 (Jun 15, 2014)

LOL, It is surprising how far you will go for them isn't it.
Managing to save an animal is very fulfilling.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 16, 2014)

So...Here she is a few days later.
Nothing but clear stuff is coming out now which according to the vet is good.
Its almost completely scabbed over from the front and then has a bit more to go from the back. The nipple re-appeared also. We think it was swelling that hid it from us. 
Though now the dang thing is shaped like an L and every time I milk it I end up squirted in the face...Hubby thinks its hilarious...Guess who's not laughing anymore since I put him on milking duty? *insert evil laugh*
The only positive that is coming from this is Anne is SOOO much friendlier. I get groomed every-time I go out there and she talks to us when ever she sees us.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 18, 2014)

So...Now its starting to shrivel, which is a good thing! Its not getting infected, or disgusting. Though since she keeps biting at the area the vet pulled some of the pain meds so she could feel it a bit more and stop playing with it.
I'm just waiting for it to fall off...


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## Goat Whisperer (Jun 18, 2014)

Even tho its nasty (getting squirted in the face ) its good to laugh in times like this, its a good way of releasing the stress... Even tho its so nasty, I couldn't help to laugh!  

Her udder looks awful Glad she is getting sweeter with y'all


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 18, 2014)

Goat Whisperer said:


> Even tho its nasty (getting squirted in the face ) its good to laugh in times like this, its a good way of releasing the stress... Even tho its so nasty, I couldn't help to laugh!
> 
> Her udder looks awful Glad she is getting sweeter with y'all


Oh trust me everyone was laughing. Except me. Its got this smell, like a mix of rotting cheese and a dog with diarrhea...Now imagine that stuck in your hair.
I now reserve my giggles for him every time he milks her, and for when I hear the subtle sounds of cursing which means he got himself in the face. 

I am really hoping that her udder with just shrivel up and turn black then fall off rather then get weak and slough off. Ugh, I really hope for the other.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 22, 2014)

So, it appears to be shrinking. Nothing different other then size so far.


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## alsea1 (Jun 23, 2014)

Its looking tons better.


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## MDres (Jun 23, 2014)

I think it is days away from sloughing off. See that light gray line between the healthy pink and the dead black? Her body is doing a great job of healing and separating the dead flesh. It's for sure gonna look nasty again for a while, but it should fill in and heal.

I had a Hereford heifer get chronic mastitis back in 2005. She stayed at the vet for several weeks on several different occasions. In the end, the vet ended up injecting her entire udder, 1/4 at a time, with FORMALDEHYDE to slough the whole thing off. She was a pet, so we were willing to shell out the cash to get her taken care of. The clinic loved having the opportunity to do the procedure, because most times a poor-uddered or udder-less cow is just sent to slaughter vs. being treated to this extent.

We never did find out what caused the mastitis in the first place. She had never been bred, or even exposed to a bull. Snake bite and spider bite were ruled out, the only other thing the vet could think of was puncture wound from one of the many hedge apple (bodarc, bodoc, what-have-you) trees on our property.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 23, 2014)

MDres said:


> I think it is days away from sloughing off. See that light gray line between the healthy pink and the dead black? Her body is doing a great job of healing and separating the dead flesh. It's for sure gonna look nasty again for a while, but it should fill in and heal.
> 
> I had a Hereford heifer get chronic mastitis back in 2005. She stayed at the vet for several weeks on several different occasions. In the end, the vet ended up injecting her entire udder, 1/4 at a time, with FORMALDEHYDE to slough the whole thing off. She was a pet, so we were willing to shell out the cash to get her taken care of. The clinic loved having the opportunity to do the procedure, because most times a poor-uddered or udder-less cow is just sent to slaughter vs. being treated to this extent.
> 
> We never did find out what caused the mastitis in the first place. She had never been bred, or even exposed to a bull. Snake bite and spider bite were ruled out, the only other thing the vet could think of was puncture wound from one of the many hedge apple (bodarc, bodoc, what-have-you) trees on our property.



I am glad to hear that you have had some experience or at least know what your seeing and what I should be expecting.
You know my vet said the exact same thing, that most people just send off the animals who get mastitis so they rarely see what ends up happening to the udder during healing.
Im kinda hoping that her udder just keeps shriveling up until its nothing but a scab >_> But I know it will end up coming off...Bleh.
Your cow did end up pulling through right? I assumed she did from the way you wrote everything but I didnt want to jump to conclusions.


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## MDres (Jun 23, 2014)

Yes, she survived just fine. She wasn't real happy about being at the clinic and being treated like a "cow" and was terrified of the other cows there! She'd only ever been around horses.

She stayed at the vet for 75% of the healing process. It was wicked ugly and smelly! I visited her every couple of days... The vet had the facilities to keep her in a deeply bedded clean stall to make her heal quicker, and they had the equipment to do hydrotherapy on her. So I didn't bring her home until it was okay for her to lay down in pasture dirt - grass - mud, etc.

She was an extremely smart and gentle pet. Before being sloughed, I had to strip and inject her udder 2x a day. This meant I had to tie her to a sturdy post or tree. I only had a few of each scattered close to the house. I swear she knew exactly how long the leadrope was, because she got to the point that she would stop 2' short of me reaching the tree or post to tie her. That's also why she stayed at the vet so long!


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## hilarie (Jun 23, 2014)

MDres said:


> Yes, she survived just fine. She wasn't real happy about being at the clinic and being treated like a "cow" and was terrified of the other cows there! She'd only ever been around horses.
> 
> She stayed at the vet for 75% of the healing process. It was wicked ugly and smelly! I visited her every couple of days... The vet had the facilities to keep her in a deeply bedded clean stall to make her heal quicker, and they had the equipment to do hydrotherapy on her. So I didn't bring her home until it was okay for her to lay down in pasture dirt - grass - mud, etc.
> 
> She was an extremely smart and gentle pet. Before being sloughed, I had to strip and inject her udder 2x a day. This meant I had to tie her to a sturdy post or tree. I only had a few of each scattered close to the house. I swear she knew exactly how long the leadrope was, because she got to the point that she would stop 2' short of me reaching the tree or post to tie her. That's also why she stayed at the vet so long!


Ai yi yi.....I give you credit and blessings for staying with it.  What we do for love!


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 26, 2014)

And it is officially starting to come off.



 

 
You can actually see where the scab is starting to separate from her skin. The nipple has completely scabbed over and the part that was milkable has now shriveled into a scab with one single soft spot left that you can see in the first picture.
Im actually very curious as to what her udder will look like under that scab! And terrified to lokk at it at the same time...


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## MDres (Jun 27, 2014)

I'm betting it will look like a head of wet pink cauliflower. Not that cauliflower in that form exists, but it is the easiest way to visualize granulation tissue. The "cauliflower" will scab over, and then you will see a pink line of healthy skin start creeping from the outside edge to the center. It will take time, but it will get there. You just want to make sure the "cauliflower" stays flat, and level with the skin. If it starts puffing up and getting tall, or bumpy like brocolli, then you will have to change your method of treatment. Granulation tissue that goes a bit crazy like that is termed "proud flesh". It is more common on bony areas that are healing (like legs) than it is on fleshy area. Just keep an eye out for it... If you don't catch it in time, then it has to be surgically removed, which sets the healing process back a long time.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 27, 2014)

MDres said:


> I'm betting it will look like a head of wet pink cauliflower. Not that cauliflower in that form exists, but it is the easiest way to visualize granulation tissue. The "cauliflower" will scab over, and then you will see a pink line of healthy skin start creeping from the outside edge to the center. It will take time, but it will get there. You just want to make sure the "cauliflower" stays flat, and level with the skin. If it starts puffing up and getting tall, or bumpy like brocolli, then you will have to change your method of treatment. Granulation tissue that goes a bit crazy like that is termed "proud flesh". It is more common on bony areas that are healing (like legs) than it is on fleshy area. Just keep an eye out for it... If you don't catch it in time, then it has to be surgically removed, which sets the healing process back a long time.


Cool! And at the same time..Bleh 
I'll definitely take pictures when it does fall off. Thanks for the info!


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## Goat Whisperer (Jun 27, 2014)

Wow that is nasty! 

Love that you update it thru the processes of it all


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jun 27, 2014)

Um, ok so today was interesting. *barfs*



Back side before we milked cleaned and milked her...



Front side before we milked and cleaned her...



After we milked and cleaned her.



And the front after we milked and cleaned her...

OMG it was awful.
It looks like her milk gland is still trying to produce milk. I am not quite sure what to do as it heals, our vet said we could still milk her but if that other udder is going to be leaking nasty pussy goat cheese milk curdled yuck, then im not so sure...
We packed it with Fura Septin and made sure the udder was done leaking before we put her back in her pen.


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## Melanie (Jun 27, 2014)

OMG... Nasty!!!  I think you are a very strong person to still be taking such great care of your doe.  I hope that this never happens to one of my goats but if it does I really hope I can do as great of a job as you and your husband caring for them.  It should be very interesting to see if she stops producing milk on that side.  I sure hope so for your sake.  I will continue to be praying for her recovery.  It does look a whole lot better and less painful.


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## Goat Whisperer (Jun 27, 2014)

Melanie said:


> OMG... Nasty!!!  I think you are a very strong person to still be taking such great care of your doe.  I hope that this never happens to one of my goats but if it does I really hope I can do as great of a job as you and your husband caring for them.  It should be very interesting to see if she stops producing milk on that side.  I sure hope so for your sake.  I will continue to be praying for her recovery.  It does look a whole lot better and less painful.


Well said!


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## hilarie (Jun 28, 2014)

Necrosis....never pretty but it beats the pants off of acute infection, and I'm guessing it bothers her a whole lot less than it bothers you now.  And I'm with you; I don't think I could milk that, or use what came out of it.  I'm also with those nominating you for sainthood for taking such good care of this girl.


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## Goat Whisperer (Jul 1, 2014)

Whats it looking like now? Any improvement?


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jul 1, 2014)

Well, its kinda been the same honestly.
It looks no better or worse, although the oozing appears to have mellowed out quite a bit and the smell is not as bad. I think the infection is pretty much done and now she is just healing. The udder is...retreating a bit? I think thats a good thing, but this scab is just refusing to come off. I think its going to do what I had hoped it would do and just shrink up into the body like a pair of testicles and then fall off when the body is done with it.
*fingers crossed*




 

 

 
She didnt want to pull her face out of the feeder to say hi, so a side head shot it is!


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jul 1, 2014)

Opps! Apparently I forgot to post some in between pictures. Yeah their has been quite a change, the white stuff has separated from the udder quite a bit and the scab is now just squished and hanging onto the tissue.
We clean it out every day to prevent maggots and flies.
Here are the pictures I forgot to post.


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## MDres (Jul 1, 2014)

If she manages to pull it off before it is ready, you might want to have your vet show you how to wrap her udder in a "sling" for support AND to keep the mammary tissue moist/clean.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jul 1, 2014)

MDres said:


> If she manages to pull it off before it is ready, you might want to have your vet show you how to wrap her udder in a "sling" for support AND to keep the mammary tissue moist/clean.


That is a very good idea, i'll give him a call and see if he'll come out again as a favor. Thanks!


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## Goat Whisperer (Jul 1, 2014)

I was going to ask you how you keep the fly's off, now I know. 

Are you still able to "milk" her?


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jul 1, 2014)

Goat Whisperer said:


> I was going to ask you how you keep the fly's off, now I know.
> 
> Are you still able to "milk" her?


Nope, it has stopped producing fluid, the only udder that is producing milk is the one beside it and everything coming from that we have just been tossing in the garden or feeding to the chickens.
The flies have been a huge  worry of mine. They love her udder, and its all I can do to keep them out of it. We even resorted to a chemical spray to kill fly's that bite her. 
So far so good


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jul 4, 2014)

So...Ready for your boobs to start hurting?


 

 

So...yeah. Im not sure what exactly is going on now except that her udder is separating from the healthy tissue.
My vet keeps saying to just keep packing the edges with the antibiotic and to leave it alone. Nature will take its course i guess.
Its oozing a tiny bit from the left hand side and has obviously dropped tremendously from the healthy tissue.
I asked about bandaging and they said to leave it be. *shrug*
Now every time I go outside to take care of her I cringe...
Its been rough, and she keeps reaching back to chew on it so im just doing what I can now.
If anyone has ever dealt with anything like this please add your input and let me know if this is normal.


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## alsea1 (Jul 4, 2014)

I agree that is looking pretty knarly.
She is a tough goat. It looks like her opposite teat is going to be just fine.


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## frustratedearthmother (Jul 4, 2014)

I'm following this thread with baited breath....   My question is this.... on any succeeding lactations will that half of her udder fill with milk that has no way to escape?


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jul 4, 2014)

frustratedearthmother said:


> I'm following this thread with baited breath....   My question is this.... on any succeeding lactations will that half of her udder fill with milk that has no way to escape?


I think that might be what the oozing is actually. You can see it on the right hand side of the udder.
Its foul and not something I would ever think of putting near me. Bleh...
But, that's pretty much my assessment of things when it comes to the milk.


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## hilarie (Jul 5, 2014)

Sadly, I have no direct experience in this kind of teat infection.  But I have a TON of experience in infection, necrosis, and the like in humans.  I so want to go at that dead tissue (called eschar) with a scalpel and *clean it up*, as I'm sure you do.  I would imagine the dry, nasty part (and whatever is purulent underneath that) will eventually slough off and not bother her - or you - again.  And it does look like the other side is OK.  My hat's off to you again, for the good job you've done taking care of her, even when it was revolting


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jul 5, 2014)

hilarie said:


> Sadly, I have no direct experience in this kind of teat infection.  But I have a TON of experience in infection, necrosis, and the like in humans.  I so want to go at that dead tissue (called eschar) with a scalpel and *clean it up*, as I'm sure you do.  I would imagine the dry, nasty part (and whatever is purulent underneath that) will eventually slough off and not bother her - or you - again.  And it does look like the other side is OK.  My hat's off to you again, for the good job you've done taking care of her, even when it was revolting


Yes...Just yes...The temptation to remove everything dead that I can is SOOOOOO strong. I literally eye the scissors every time I go out there...But I know im not supposed to touch it and just let nature take its course, plus I dont want to screw anything up, so I have been able to control those, cut it off, urges...
How long does it take for  human tissue to fall off then?


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## hilarie (Jul 5, 2014)

Depends on a lot of things: the age and condition of the patient, whether they have other comorbid diseases (like diabetes), whether the circulation is good to that area.  That's a big area, though.  I'd think it might be weeks longer.


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## Harbisgirl (Jul 8, 2014)

Wow what an ordeal. Thank you for posting pictures so often, its very education. Its made my stomach flip a few times, but it is comforting to know what to expect.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jul 8, 2014)

So, this is how I found it this morning.
It was hanging off, and I tugged it a tiny bit, only to realize that it was not actually attached to anything. The flesh was hanging from a loop of good flesh that I assume was an artery or something.
So, I went and found a scalpel and did some digging...Because im impatient....
Turned out the flesh literally was hanging by a thread and slipped off the loop easily 
I flushed the wound with sterile water, cleaned any remaining loose flesh out, and then packed it with the yellow antibiotic. i forgot what its called...
Anyway, here are the seriously gross pictures, but at least its off now and the real healing can begin. 
I'll keep you all updated on how the udder heals up.



 

 

 

 

 

 

 
Bleh...Oh the smell was awful...


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## Harbisgirl (Jul 8, 2014)

Oof, gruesome. Thanks for the update!


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## MDres (Jul 10, 2014)

It looks great!

My only concern is *IF* that is a portion of an artery bulging out of the wound, you'll want to protect it. If it gets nicked or opened in any way, she will bleed out and die within minutes. I've seen it happen to dairy cows who cut the artery that is visible under the skin on the abdomen. They bleed out before we can get them clamped off and sutured...


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jul 10, 2014)

MDres said:


> It looks great!
> 
> My only concern is *IF* that is a portion of an artery bulging out of the wound, you'll want to protect it. If it gets nicked or opened in any way, she will bleed out and die within minutes. I've seen it happen to dairy cows who cut the artery that is visible under the skin on the abdomen. They bleed out before we can get them clamped off and sutured...


Very good point. Shes still up in the kidding pen so thankfully she isn't moving around to much, but now that you mentioned something I'll call the vet and have them come out just to check and see what it is and what i should do.
Its healing very quickly now, still has a bit of a smell to it but other then that now that the flesh is gone its cleaning up nicely


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## Goat Whisperer (Jul 10, 2014)

Glad that its healing quickly! 

Do you think you will breed her again? I know some people breed their goat with half an udder.


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## Pearce Pastures (Jul 10, 2014)

Wow.  Just WOW.  This is one of those threads that is so educational/horrifying-car-crash-on-the-side-of-the-road that I had to read the whole thing.

Good for you for sticking with her and helping her mend.  I don't know if I could stomach it and I like to think of myself as pretty hardy.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jul 10, 2014)

Goat Whisperer said:


> Glad that its healing quickly!
> 
> Do you think you will breed her again? I know some people breed their goat with half an udder.



Well...To be honest we dont know. We are going back and forth on what to do with Anne.
What I have read says she will do fine with only half an udder and actually produce close to what she made with both. 
Then we are battling with our conscious as to whether it would be safe. Last thing we need is for her to get mastitis again and loose her other udder :/
She has a leaky udder, the one that is now gone was the one that leaked the worse. 

So, we aren't sure what were going to do right now. It's pretty much touch and go at the moment.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jul 11, 2014)

So the vet said its not an artery and that covering the wound would welcome more infection due to the wound still leaking out bits of dead tissue. 
I guess it has to breath to heal best.
I just have to keep packing it three times a day with the yellow stuff.
The thing has retreated up into the body, and it smells sooo much better now.
Only a little bit of dead yuck is coming out and the hole seems to be closing up 



 

 
It does seem to be tender to the touch though. Anne is not on any more pain meds as the vet felt she did not need them any longer.
Talk about expensive...But thankfully she is alive.


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## Farmin' Girl (Jul 11, 2014)

So glad to see she is almost healed!


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## Melanie (Jul 11, 2014)

She looks so much better.  Good Job.  Your hard work and dedication is really paying off.


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## Harbisgirl (Jul 14, 2014)

Good news. Can't wait to see the pic where she is all healed up! You definitely get Goat Mommy of the Year Award


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## Goat Whisperer (Jul 14, 2014)

Harbisgirl said:


> Good news. Can't wait to see the pic where she is all healed up! You definitely get Goat Mommy of the Year Award


x2! You have done an awesome job!


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## Goat Whisperer (Jul 17, 2014)

Its almost been a week now, I bet its looking great!


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jul 17, 2014)

Well...Kinda. I'll take pictures shortly.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jul 17, 2014)

Its not really getting any smaller, its just kinda, oozing and staying pink.
I clean it up every day and pack it but its not really doing anything.


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## MDres (Jul 19, 2014)

Taking pictures like you have been doing is an excellent way to monitor progress. It should slowly start closing in from the outside. At this point, it is like watching a pot boil, it seems like it is never going to happen.

If it seems like healing stalls or quits, and it isn't making progress, then call the vet. That's where the pictures come in REALLY handy, because you can show the vet how it hasn't changed much, but I'm betting your vet is already pretty familiar with the timeline of the injury/healing. My horse had an injury back in 1999 that required the wound edges to be refreshed, or cut back, to stimulate it to heal fully. Sounds backwards to make the wound bigger to get it to heal, but in his case, the edges just stopped trying to reach each other, and he had a fist sized hole in the skin on his shoulder blade. It was pretty cool to see the muscles moving thru the hole, though. The vet cut the edges back, and wala! the wound decided to close up - slowly, but it did close without much of a scar, even.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jul 19, 2014)

MDres said:


> Taking pictures like you have been doing is an excellent way to monitor progress. It should slowly start closing in from the outside. At this point, it is like watching a pot boil, it seems like it is never going to happen.
> 
> If it seems like healing stalls or quits, and it isn't making progress, then call the vet. That's where the pictures come in REALLY handy, because you can show the vet how it hasn't changed much, but I'm betting your vet is already pretty familiar with the timeline of the injury/healing. My horse had an injury back in 1999 that required the wound edges to be refreshed, or cut back, to stimulate it to heal fully. Sounds backwards to make the wound bigger to get it to heal, but in his case, the edges just stopped trying to reach each other, and he had a fist sized hole in the skin on his shoulder blade. It was pretty cool to see the muscles moving thru the hole, though. The vet cut the edges back, and wala! the wound decided to close up - slowly, but it did close without much of a scar, even.


I think whats going on right now is that the lumpy thing is extending past the part of the flesh that is healing leaving a permanent opening.
Aka the vet needs to come back...Ugh...
I'll let you all know what ends up happening.


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## Farmin' Girl (Jul 22, 2014)

Hang in there, not much longer now hopefully.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jul 23, 2014)

Yup, its not going to be closing on its own. I was asked to wait a bit to see how the wound would progress, and this is what its like now.



Its not closing properly  I put a call into my regular vet, hopefully she will be able to do something for Annie. I really want the wound to heal...


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jul 23, 2014)

And the verdict is!!! Leave it alone. 
If its still the way it is or bigger in the fall then we will do surgery. Her suggestion was to coat the spot with Vaseline and just wait until fall when there are no bugs to infect the wound and then preform surgery if and only if necessary. Hopefully it will close by then.  
Until then i'll still post updates and pictures, and then if she needs surgery i'll take pictures on that as well.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Jul 23, 2014)

I just got done cleaning out Annabelle's pen, and I think she has discovered the finer things in life.
I need to get my camera ready for next time, because this is the second time she has done it.
Every time I clean her pen and put down fresh sawdust and hay she spends a good three minuets hopping about, headbutting anything in the other pen and throwing up mouthful's of sawdust and hay (after which she has to spend a second spitting the remnants out) up into the air. 
She is quite the character. I'm just grateful she lived through this ordeal to keep sharing her unique personality. 
Does anyone else's critters do stuff like this?


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## Melanie (Jul 23, 2014)

My LGD Great Pyrenees loves to roll in the hay when I am cleaning the goat house.  I always tell my kids she is helping spread the hay because she grabs mouthfuls and runs around and tosses it in the air.


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## Melanie (Jul 23, 2014)

I am glad she gets more time to heal before surgery.  My son severed the tip of his finger and they are giving him time before surgery and so far I am very pleased with the progress.  I hope she heals up before the fall.


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## Harbisgirl (Jul 25, 2014)

One of my goats gets like that when I put down new straw too. She flops down in it and rolls, flops around, kicks her legs - looks like bad break dancing LOL. Its really cute though  Nice to see someone appreciate your efforts. And thanks for the continual updates and pics - very informative.


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## Goat Whisperer (Aug 8, 2014)

Update?


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## BlueMoonFarms (Aug 8, 2014)

Its still the same :/ The lump appears to be growing a little bit bigger like I was warned it might do. I'll take a picture in the morning.
I wish i could say it was doing something exciting.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Aug 9, 2014)

I stand corrected!!!
I made the mistake of ignoring it for about a week, and when I checked it this morning this is what I found.



 
I had kept pulling the skin apart thinking it was sticking together due to the ooze. It must not have been! The skin must have been trying to heal around the lump that was growing. 
So, for people who end up with something like Anne's mystery lump, leave it alone and dont bother it unless it starts to really look bad or something. 
Because now within a week of my not packing it or touching it look what ended up happening!!! 
Oh this is exciting


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## alsea1 (Aug 9, 2014)




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## Goat Whisperer (Aug 9, 2014)

Awesome!


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## Tracy0052 (Aug 10, 2014)

Just read your whole thread. Very educational and I'm so glad she pulled through! Great post!


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## PoultryQueen101 (Aug 14, 2014)

Tracy0052 said:


> Just read your whole thread. Very educational and I'm so glad she pulled through! Great post!


I did too, very inspiring. We are getting a nigerian dwarf doe for show next yewr, and possibly a pygmy doe as well. I will make sure I keep her pen clean ... like I forgot to do with our ducklings, and it rained that night.. resulting in 3 deaths  I feel horrible, but it was like it was meant ot happen because it really helped us out.

What kind of goat, im sorry if I missed this, I wasnt really paying attention.
Can we see a picture of her whole udder with the one half now gone?


We went through something similar with one of our blue copper maran hens, she lost her rump feathers and it got scabby and then, one day with tornado sirens going off, we were closing the coop up and her intestines had popped  through that area. It was disturbing and we had to use a razor blade to cut the dea tissue around the hole. Then we brought to the bathroom..... where she decided to regurgitate.... and we pushed her intestines back in and stitched her up with cotton thread.... she lived, but now she has to live alone, hef feathers havent yet grown back and the area grew huge. She lays, eats, and drinks though. I with we could artifically breed her to our lavendar ameraucana so she can have a baby and we could name it copper jr.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Aug 18, 2014)

PoultryQueen101 said:


> I did too, very inspiring. We are getting a nigerian dwarf doe for show next yewr, and possibly a pygmy doe as well. I will make sure I keep her pen clean ... like I forgot to do with our ducklings, and it rained that night.. resulting in 3 deaths  I feel horrible, but it was like it was meant ot happen because it really helped us out.
> 
> What kind of goat, im sorry if I missed this, I wasnt really paying attention.
> Can we see a picture of her whole udder with the one half now gone?
> ...


Yes, keeping clean is a must, but then again it sounds like you already learned that  lesson  Sorry about your ducklings. Loss of life is never fun regardless of what it is.

Anne is a Lamancha goat. Shes small for her size, but she makes up with attitude and faking us out every kidding by pretending to be in labor for like...a moth or two before she actually is ready to have the baby. 

Sure! I have been ignoring the udder some more in hopes of it being completely healed up when I go out to finally check it. Since its been a while i'll peek at it tomorrow  *fingers crossed* and i'll make sure to take a picture. Its really kinda weird seeing her with only one udder. Poor girl looks like shes trying to waddle around with a water balloon stuck to her butt...

Woo now thats an experience I never want to go through. Wow! So glad to hear your bird made it through all of that!


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## Harbisgirl (Aug 19, 2014)

So glad she is improving. Can't wait to see the final pic where she is healed 100%


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## PoultryQueen101 (Aug 19, 2014)

I just thought about my last sentence... I would never name it copper jr. Now to think about it. In case I jinx something and it happens...again!


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## BlueMoonFarms (Aug 19, 2014)

Tada!!  Almost completely healed! One or two more weeks and that puppy will be gone 100%! Yay no surgery needed!!


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## alsea1 (Aug 19, 2014)

Amazing. And it looks like she will still have one side.


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## Melanie (Aug 19, 2014)

Oh I am so happy for you guys!!!   All the hard work and dedication has really paid off.


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## Goat Whisperer (Aug 20, 2014)

Y'all really have done such a great job with her!


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## goatgurl (Aug 20, 2014)

have been following this and I've got to tell you, that's amazing!  you did a great job


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## Melani (Sep 18, 2014)

I am not dealing with anything like this myself, but wanted to say thank you for the pics as things progress just in case (knock on wood) I ever do encounter it.


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## Alicia (Jan 10, 2015)

all I can say is wow!!! I stumbled upon this thread and got hooked. I'm so sorry you had to go through this...I'm.so grateful you posted all the pics and updates!! Kudos for having the time and love to take car of your doe.


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## Mantis71 (Jan 10, 2015)

Wow. I just read all 14 pages of this thread in one sitting.  I'm both soo happy for you I could cry, and so grossed out I could puke.  Wild ride. You do such an incredibly awesome job.  I hope I never have to deal with anything like this  :::shiver::: but I'm grateful that you documented everything just on case!!!


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## treeclimber233 (Feb 8, 2015)

I just read thru all 14 pages in one sitting too.  Very gross pictures but as you said everyone was warned. Hope I never go thru that myself. I just wanted to add that I had a doe that had no apparent injury to  1/2 of her udder but every time she kidded I could never get any milk out of one side. It would just get very full and then dry off just fine while the baby and I got milk out of the other half. Amazing creatures.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Feb 9, 2015)

For those of you who are curious, Annabelle was bred one last time.  


 
One of our friends is interested in a pet, a pet who she can milk for the fun of it until she gets tired of doing it twice a day. Her weathers sheep companion passed away last october and it was agreed that we would let Annie have another kidding so Joann could milk her.
Pardon the after pregnancy bleck...


  (Dang thing wont rotate, sorry guys)
If you look closely you can see the top part of her missing udder has swollen like normal. I suspect it may be attempting to make milk, and if my anatomy is right it is just being re-directed to the other udder. Her good udder is actually milking out more then last year. That could just be age, but I still find it interesting. 
The kids are a swarming mob of "FEED US NOW MINIONS!!!" and so wont cooperate for a picture, but if you look closely in the right hand corner, you will see a cream/white llamancha eared baby. That is her little girl. And In the back, the big boy who looks just like her.


 
She will be leaving the farm next Friday, but at least we will be able to keep in touch, and quite possibly we may be keeping her baby girl. It will all depend on if hubby can stand having Annie's daughter taking her place. She was our very first goat, 4 years old, and after going through everything we did with her Hubby is taking the hit of having to give her away pretty hard. 
Sometimes being practical stinks...
BUT at least she is going to a fantastic home where she will have an entire barn, llama, and whethered goat boy to boss around. Cant get any better then that


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## goatgurl (Feb 9, 2015)

so glad she is doing well and is going to have a happy home, she's been thru so much.  and so glad you got a doe kid from her.  tell DH that you just haaavveee to keep her, look at that sweet face.


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## Sweet Sue (Feb 9, 2015)

I just finished reading this entire journey with Annie. What an awesome job you did. Thank you so much for sharing your story with us. I am glad it has all turned out ok. We just have to be tough and do what we have to do. And that is exactly what you did.


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## alsea1 (Feb 11, 2015)




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## babsbag (Feb 11, 2015)

Annie is so lucky to have you to take care of her, you did an amazing job. It is funny how the DHs get so attached. I have 3 goats that I should rehome as they are not productive milkers and he won't have any part of that; they are "old timers" here so he says they have squatters rights.


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## Chytka (Mar 19, 2015)

Excuse my lateness, but I just read all 15 pages in one sitting and I have to say, well done! You are so brave. I hope I never have to go through this when I get my goats! Thanks for keeping everything updated with pictures, such a great learning experience.


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## Latestarter (Apr 9, 2015)

You did a wonderful job. Congratulations on going through the process, and THANKS for sharing! It has been very educational for so many of us and we all (no doubt) hope that we never have to go through it! 

OK, so it's been a couple of months now... How is Annie doing with her new owners? Did you keep the doe kid? and as always, pics are a requirement!


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## Ridgetop (Apr 17, 2015)

I just happened on this thread and read the entire thing.  You did an incredible job to save the goat.  We had a first freshener die of mastitis in 36 hours!  It was the worst form that kills so quick you don't even have time to call the vet.  We are experienced dairy people and this mastitis was unlike anything I had ever seen.  In the am she was fine and milked great, in the pm her udder was hard and cold and I called the vet.  By the time he got out the next am she was dead!  She was a beautiful LaMancha and one of my son's favorites. 
I am amazed that you were able to save the other half of her udder.  I have heard of losing only one half or one quarter (in cows) but never seen it.  Treating the infection was horrible for you.  I had a horse that got cellulitis behind her elbow and I had to clean it out and debride the tissue 2 or 3 times a day so it could heal.  I used vaseline to keep the leaking pus from causing scald to the lower leg.  He had me use a water pic and iodine wash to clean the deep puncture wound.  It was nasty and took months to heal, but was a huge learning experience.  It never looked as bad as that udder though and kudos to you for being able to pull her though.
You are incredible - thanks for sharing this with us - even yucky stuff is needful to know.


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## Wheat (May 14, 2015)

BlueMoonFarms said:


> So the vet said its not an artery and that covering the wound would welcome more infection due to the wound still leaking out bits of dead tissue.
> I guess it has to breath to heal best.
> I just have to keep packing it three times a day with the yellow stuff.
> The thing has retreated up into the body, and it smells sooo much better now.
> ...


We had a half Nubian half alpine come down with mastitis and lost one of her teets, was a terrible long process but she survived and was rebred the next year, unfortunately she came down with mastitis the following year in died within the week. So breeding her again is an option, I'm just not sure how the milk production and chances of mastitis are with only one teet.


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## newton the goat (Jan 26, 2017)

Was just browsing one of the forums when I came across this thread, and being new to having any type of farm animals, this honestly scared the daylights out of me.... our little girl is three weeks or a little more from her due date... and I hope this never happens to her. It was amazing to read all that you went through. I'm so glad she made it, I was on the edge of my seat the entire time thinking "please let her have survived" i hope I can be atleast half as good of a goat owner as you are, both In the near and far future. How is she doing now?


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## Goat Whisperer (Jan 26, 2017)

The poster hasn't been on for some time, but if I remember correctly she ended up rehoming the doe to a pet home. Her udder did heal up nicely though. 

I just love the outcome of this story! Having gone through this before, and ended up having to put our girl down, this makes me so happy to see this doepulled through. 

Unfortunately our girl couldn't keep the raging fever down, even with all the meds. She was suffering so we did what we had to. 
Some, like Bluemoons doe, cope fine and can go on to live a good life. I was very happy to help walk Bluemoon through this! It just warms my heart that she pulled through!


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## newton the goat (Jan 26, 2017)

Goat Whisperer said:


> The poster hasn't been on for some time, but if I remember correctly she ended up rehoming the doe to a pet home. Her udder did heal up nicely though.
> 
> I just love the outcome of this story! Having gone through this before, and ended up having to put our girl down, this makes me so happy to see this doepulled through.
> 
> ...


I'm sorry to hear that your doe didn't make it. It's sad that sometimes they aren't strong enough after fighting through that and it always leaves sad people behind.... I hope you won't have to go through that again...


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## babsbag (Jan 26, 2017)

I had a doe that went through this last year. She is one of the fortunate ones that is alive and well with half an udder. She responded well to the antibiotics and raised her doeling quite easily. She was very sick for a few days but in the end came through with flying colors. I did not have to do all the treatments that Bluemoon did, I simply kept the flies off of it with spray and let it heal and slough off on its own. It was disgusting to say the least, but I did not take pictures or document her journey.  The doe is due to kid in about 2 months. Watch her have triplets with one teat for them to share. LOL


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## newton the goat (Jan 26, 2017)

babsbag said:


> I had a doe that went through this last year. She is one of the fortunate ones that is alive and well with half an udder. She responded well to the antibiotics and raised her doeling quite easily. She was very sick for a few days but in the end came through with flying colors. I did not have to do all the treatments that Bluemoon did, I simply kept the flies off of it with spray and let it heal and slough off on its own. It was disgusting to say the least, but I did not take pictures or document her journey.  The doe is due to kid in about 2 months. Watch her have triplets with one teat for them to share. LOL


Sounds entertaining to watch. Lol! I'm glad she survived... I've read a few posts of the less fortunate ones and it breaks my heart seeing the owners go through it with them...


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## farmerjan (Jan 26, 2017)

The type of mastitis that the doe had that the half sloughed off,  was probably gangarene mastitis.  It happens in dairy cattle sometimes; often only affecting 1 quarter but once in awhile will affect one side. Don't know if there is one specific bacteria that causes it but often there is coliform involved.  It does take time to slough off, is really gross, but if you can keep the infection from getting into the bloodstream, they often recover.  There is also one called klebsiella, that they get suddenly, udder goes from regular milk to next to no milk, and what there is is like water, in 12 hours, cow will sometimes run a high fever and the udder will look like a dry cow and be cold...can kill them in less than 24 hours.  Coliform mastitis will often cause them to get a hot hard quarter, watery milky stuff and swollen.
Klebsiella has been traced to using sawdust from oak trees that have been drug through damp earth catching in the bark etc.  The cure for that is taking "green sawdust" ( not dried like you buy at the store in compressed bales)  and covering it to "heat it" ( like composting it) and it will kill the organism. E-  Coli is environmental and they can pick it up from a wet pasture after a rain, just from laying in wet grass especially if the weather has gotten warmer. Causes an "explosion" of the e-coli bacteria.  Staph and strep are usually not as sudden and do not normally cause the quarter or half of the udder to slough off like that.  There are many animals that are actually high somatic cell count  carriers and you will have to culture it to find out which one.  Staph aureus is nearly impossible to cure and the animal will usually have a high cell count for life.  Strep is a little more curable, but there are many that are  chronic for life.


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## babsbag (Jan 27, 2017)

I had my doe cultured and she did indeed have Staphylococcus aureus.  She freshened in a brand  new barn, on brand new hay. The pen had never been used before for anything. Just goes to show that Staph is everywhere. 

I never really thought about SCC and her having Staph.  I am months away from that right now but it is something to think about.


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## farmerjan (Jan 27, 2017)

Sorry about the staph problem;  it is a chronic problem with some dairy cows and when they get it, seldom do they ever get cured.  It will be subclinical, then flare up.  Sometimes it can be cured if a really aggressive antibiotic course is followed but I haven't heard of alot of success.  When I milk test and the farmer gets back a "hot sheet" of his high cell count cows, they often will take a sample of that cow to the state lab to get it cultured to see what it is and what will work.  We don't do culturing for specific types of somatic cell causes...


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## Goat Whisperer (Jan 27, 2017)

Yes, it is a gangrene mastitis. Our vet calls it Bluebag. 

The culture on our was e-coli.

It was terrible, our poor doe just wasn't going to make it. Didn't matter how much drugs we gave. She was suffering, only reason she would move was to try and feed her kids. The life was no longer in her eyes and she was going to die. In our case, I know I did the right thing.


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## farmerjan (Jan 27, 2017)

So sorry for the goat suffering and yes you did the right thing for her.  It's always an individual situation and sometimes you have to make a call. We just put down a cow that had gotten thin, started limping, then wouldn't get up and was eating some if we took it to her, then started laying over on her side and couldn't roll herself back up and after 2 days of rolling her up and propping her, she would get out flat again and we just decided that there was no reason to prolong her suffering.  She quit trying and that was the end of it.  You do what you have to do.  With us it is a business so that loss hurts the bottom line as well as makes us feel bad.


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## newton the goat (Jan 27, 2017)

Damn.... I never actually realized how often something like this actually happens.... I haven't heard about it much before getting animals.... or even joining this site....


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## babsbag (Jan 27, 2017)

@farmerjan I am hoping that since the half of the udder that was diseased is now gone that the staph went with it. We will see. She is due to kid 4/8 and beginning to look pretty large already.


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## farmerjan (Jan 28, 2017)

Cannot remember if any of my farmers have ever said if the cows tested still had any staph or anything.  Most just milked the cows out and shipped them except one that was pretty far along and they dried her off til she calved since it was sexed semen and had a heifer, she got mastitis not long into that lactation, they didn't even treat it, just shipped her.  I can only hope for your sake she got rid of the staph when she lost the half....


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## newton the goat (Jan 28, 2017)

farmerjan said:


> Cannot remember if any of my farmers have ever said if the cows tested still had any staph or anything.  Most just milked the cows out and shipped them except one that was pretty far along and they dried her off til she calved since it was sexed semen and had a heifer, she got mastitis not long into that lactation, they didn't even treat it, just shipped her.  I can only hope for your sake she got rid of the staph when she lost the half....


That's so sad


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## farmerjan (Jan 28, 2017)

newton:   sorry but I can't really agree that it is sad that they shipped the cows.  When I said  "milked them out", I meant that after they got them cured of the gangarene mastitis, they milked them for the rest of the lactation  until the production fell below the break even point and all drugs were out of their system. You are talking commercial dairy farms where they have to make a living, and with the milk prices up and down more than a yo-yo;  they cannot afford to keep an animal that is not pulling her weight with sufficient production to pay her share.  I consider it  more than decent and caring that they tried to save the cow when she was pretty "gross" instead of just putting her down.  Also, they are paid to produce milk that meets certain standards and requirements;  if not they can penalized and even have their milk permit suspended and then where would they be with a tank of 1000 gallons +  and can't sell it?  Down the drain does not pay any bills.  So they have to make management decisions that a hobby farmer or a backyard animal owner with a couple of pets would maybe do differently.  Since I do not want to drink milk that is from animals with a high somatic cell count,  I applaud them for saving and curing the animal, as much as is practical, and then trying to salvage some of the investment.
Believe me, most dairy farmers do have feelings for their cows and there are alot who keep a "pet" cow around alot longer than is economical because she has a special hold....like she was the first one their kid showed in 4-H or she's the daughter of the cow that got out and brought home the rest of the cows that got out of a field...or any other reason.  Have one farmer that kept a totally UNECONOMICAL  cow that didn't make enough milk to pay her costs, and would not get preg no matter what they did, all because she was friendly and liked to steal the milkers" (on the farm)  soda bottles and could actually get her tongue around it to drink it...
When a cow has a chronic staph subclinical infection and no amount of treatments seems to cure it, then I am glad they ship them.  I won't keep a cow with chronic problems in my barn....


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## newton the goat (Jan 28, 2017)

farmerjan said:


> newton:   sorry but I can't really agree that it is sad that they shipped the cows.  When I said  "milked them out", I meant that after they got them cured of the gangarene mastitis, they milked them for the rest of the lactation  until the production fell below the break even point and all drugs were out of their system. You are talking commercial dairy farms where they have to make a living, and with the milk prices up and down more than a yo-yo;  they cannot afford to keep an animal that is not pulling her weight with sufficient production to pay her share.  I consider it  more than decent and caring that they tried to save the cow when she was pretty "gross" instead of just putting her down.  Also, they are paid to produce milk that meets certain standards and requirements;  if not they can penalized and even have their milk permit suspended and then where would they be with a tank of 1000 gallons +  and can't sell it?  Down the drain does not pay any bills.  So they have to make management decisions that a hobby farmer or a backyard animal owner with a couple of pets would maybe do differently.  Since I do not want to drink milk that is from animals with a high somatic cell count,  I applaud them for saving and curing the animal, as much as is practical, and then trying to salvage some of the investment.
> Believe me, most dairy farmers do have feelings for their cows and there are alot who keep a "pet" cow around alot longer than is economical because she has a special hold....like she was the first one their kid showed in 4-H or she's the daughter of the cow that got out and brought home the rest of the cows that got out of a field...or any other reason.  Have one farmer that kept a totally UNECONOMICAL  cow that didn't make enough milk to pay her costs, and would not get preg no matter what they did, all because she was friendly and liked to steal the milkers" (on the farm)  soda bottles and could actually get her tongue around it to drink it...
> When a cow has a chronic staph subclinical infection and so amount of treatments seems to cure it, then I am glad they ship them.  I won't keep a cow with chronic problems in my barn....


Sorry what I didn't mean to be insensitive or offend you  ... I understand that it was done for the best, and what you mean and looking back on my comment I probably should have put more though into it.... I guess I just find it sad because since I'm not selling a product from my animals, and haven't experienced what your talking about before besides a few chickens who got sick, which is not very comparable to a cow and her milk getting a staph infection in a barn full of other heifers... sorry about that


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## babsbag (Jan 29, 2017)

I seriously thought about putting my goat down last year as I was worried about her infecting my other goats. But my vet told me staph is everywhere already so just keep her in a pen until it starts drying up and she should not be contagious so that is what I did. It would an entirely different story if she was on the milk line in the dairy. I would have to make sure beyond a doubt that she can't infect anyone else. I am still trying to wrap my head around how to sanitize inflations between goats; I am not into sharing germs.


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## farmerjan (Jan 29, 2017)

Newton;  I wasn't really offended, I guess that I just wanted to make sure that you didn't think that most commercial dairy farmers were insensitive to their animals or that they just had a "numbers" mentality and that she was "just a cow".  Yes there are farmers that are not as concerned about some stuff like that, but most have an investment of $1500 to 2000 in each cow that they are naturally hoping she will be productive and stay there for many lactations.
  On top of that, it costs in the neighborhood of at least $6. to $10. per day per cow to keep them, and with milk prices at $16.00 to $18.00 per hundred weight, which is about 12 gallons of milk (weighs 8.5 lbs per gal), they have to produce a minimum of 50 lbs to even make the break even point. SO many people just don't realize what it costs and what little the farmers get back for their milk.  The farm that I milked on back in 1989 when I had my car wreck and was out of work for 6 months, was getting $17.50 per hundred weight then for milk; and it cost ALOT less for  input costs back then.   And yes, I have kept some cows over the years that were not economically productive for various reasons;  I have one right now that has not calved in 2 years but am hoping she is pregnant now.   I also have an off the farm job, and have the luxury of access to pasture etc due to our farming operation.  But she really is a liability.  If she is bred, she will raise me an average of 3-5 calves for her next lactation and will pay me back for her unproductive time, but if she fails to be bred this time, she will go.

What I am trying to do is  "educate" people that have no real knowledge of commercial operations, just how much it costs, and what farmers go through to try to make a living.  I realize we all have budgets, but the farmer is expected to make do on less with his costs going up all the time. People want cheap food in this country, I am no different; I cringe some times when I go grocery shopping.  I have had 4 farms sell out this past year that I milk test for, because the kids/grandkids have seen that there is just no way they can make a living.  Farming used to be considered a good way to make a living; you worked hard but you realized a "reward" for it, and had a great place to raise your family.  It's harder and harder for them to do so. Add in the value of land, and anyone , like us, cannot afford to pay for the land purchases unless there is an outside income to do so. 
Do you know that the average age of a farmer in this country is 56?  and that the average size of a beef producer is only 30 cows when you actually count all the farmers?  Sure there are those with BIG operations, but most are now incorporated, most have been in operation for years and got established when you could make a living, and the land is mostly paid for.  75% of the farmers have a spouse that works off the farm now (if they don't both work off the farm),  just for the "benefits and insurance".
I am not trying to be negative or make you think I am upset or offended in any way.  I just try to let people know that farmers are not only caring, but that they have to make tough choices in order to try to survive, and most really do love what they do.


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## farmerjan (Jan 29, 2017)

@babsbag ;  one thing that one of my farms did was to dip the teat inflations in a bucket of diluted chlorine water in between cows and let it hang for a minute to "drip it dry"  before putting it on the next cow to try to cut down on the possibility of carrying any "germs" from one cow to another.  Also. several use H2O2  hydrogen peroxide now as  pre milking teat dips.  Germs and bacteria cannot live in super hydrogenated oxygen which is what hydrogen peroxide is.  The dentists always had people rinse their mouths out with it after any dental surgery;  the mouth has more bacteria than any other place on the body.  It's like 1 part to 10 parts water... I will have to check on that.
Yeah, staph is everywhere, which is why it is such a problem with milking cows and them getting mastitis from it.

Edit:  it is super oxygenated water not super hydrogenated oxygen....my brain wasn't in gear...


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## newton the goat (Jan 29, 2017)

farmerjan said:


> Newton;  I wasn't really offended, I guess that I just wanted to make sure that you didn't think that most commercial dairy farmers were insensitive to their animals or that they just had a "numbers" mentality and that she was "just a cow".  Yes there are farmers that are not as concerned about some stuff like that, but most have an investment of $1500 to 2000 in each cow that they are naturally hoping she will be productive and stay there for many lactations.
> On top of that, it costs in the neighborhood of at least $6. to $10. per day per cow to keep them, and with milk prices at $16.00 to $18.00 per hundred weight, which is about 12 gallons of milk (weighs 8.5 lbs per gal), they have to produce a minimum of 50 lbs to even make the break even point. SO many people just don't realize what it costs and what little the farmers get back for their milk.  The farm that I milked on back in 1989 when I had my car wreck and was out of work for 6 months, was getting $17.50 per hundred weight then for milk; and it cost ALOT less for  input costs back then.   And yes, I have kept some cows over the years that were not economically productive for various reasons;  I have one right now that has not calved in 2 years but am hoping she is pregnant now.   I also have an off the farm job, and have the luxury of access to pasture etc due to our farming operation.  But she really is a liability.  If she is bred, she will raise me an average of 3-5 calves for her next lactation and will pay me back for her unproductive time, but if she fails to be bred this time, she will go.
> 
> What I am trying to do is  "educate" people that have no real knowledge of commercial operations, just how much it costs, and what farmers go through to try to make a living.  I realize we all have budgets, but the farmer is expected to make do on less with his costs going up all the time. People want cheap food in this country, I am no different; I cringe some times when I go grocery shopping.  I have had 4 farms sell out this past year that I milk test for, because the kids/grandkids have seen that there is just no way they can make a living.  Farming used to be considered a good way to make a living; you worked hard but you realized a "reward" for it, and had a great place to raise your family.  It's harder and harder for them to do so. Add in the value of land, and anyone , like us, cannot afford to pay for the land purchases unless there is an outside income to do so.
> ...



Thank you. For explaining to me what it is actually like. I didn't really understand before but now I have a much clearer idea of what you meant. Before in my first comment I should have said along with how I though it was sad that I understand it's a mandatory thing, one of the dairy farmers that lives close by to my place has said that he knows every single one of his girls and each personality, he loves his cows but he understand that there is a time and a place to get sentimental in the world of livestock. When a cow is sick he cannot afford to keep her around the other girls, if the treatment doesn't work at first, he can't afford to keep her around because though he grows his own food for them, it is still a large sum of money to keep feeding her. And he says what's the hardest is there are those few girls he bottle raised and brought up due to their mothers getting I'll or refusing then so when those ones grow old or get sick they are the hardest ones to get rid of but he has to do it. Thank you for taking the time and giving me a new perspective. And I never thought bad of dairy farmers, I have only ever met ones who put the utmost care into their ladies. I am still new to the world of farming, we are getting more pigs this year so I only know about them and not cattle. I would love to know more about dairy.


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## farmerjan (Jan 29, 2017)

What your farmer said about the ones he bottle raised is exactly why Lara is still at my place even though she hasn't had a calf in 2 years.  She is a 1/2 hol 1/2 jersey that I got off a registered hol dairy.  They tried everything to get their cow bred, used jersey semen as a last result.  Any preg was better than not preg.  Got the heifer calf and they did manage to get the cow back into  a productive state and all.  So Lara came home, was bottle fed.  Got a couple of calves out of her and she will raise 3-5 per lactation if I am diligent about it.  Have her daughter Mara, she had twin heifers last year, first time, one born dead the other fine.  Everyone is getting bred to angus this year since I am having these joint issues and will get them in the barn, get the extra calves established on them,  so I will not have to milk while my treatments make it painful to get around for a week or two after.  Once, I either get some relief, or have to go replacement route, then they will be getting bred A I again and I will try to do some milking and feed calves and do cow shares for the milk. By then, 2-3 years, I will also be retired and have some more time to do it.  
By  rights Lara should have gone a year ago....
and the personalities are unbelievable...you just can't push them around like a goat or catch them up and carry them like a chicken....
And yes, I raise purebred poultry for show also....


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## newton the goat (Jan 29, 2017)

farmerjan said:


> What your farmer said about the ones he bottle raised is exactly why Lara is still at my place even though she hasn't had a calf in 2 years.  She is a 1/2 hol 1/2 jersey that I got off a registered hol dairy.  They tried everything to get their cow bred, used jersey semen as a last result.  Any preg was better than not preg.  Got the heifer calf and they did manage to get the cow back into  a productive state and all.  So Lara came home, was bottle fed.  Got a couple of calves out of her and she will raise 3-5 per lactation if I am diligent about it.  Have her daughter Mara, she had twin heifers last year, first time, one born dead the other fine.  Everyone is getting bred to angus this year since I am having these joint issues and will get them in the barn, get the extra calves established on them,  so I will not have to milk while my treatments make it painful to get around for a week or two after.  Once, I either get some relief, or have to go replacement route, then they will be getting bred A I again and I will try to do some milking and feed calves and do cow shares for the milk. By then, 2-3 years, I will also be retired and have some more time to do it.
> By  rights Lara should have gone a year ago....
> and the personalities are unbelievable...you just can't push them around like a goat or catch them up and carry them like a chicken....
> And yes, I raise purebred poultry for show also....


Lol I would love to see someone try to push a 1000 pound heifer around, the farmer I was talking about would go into the pen somtimes to do god knows what and some of his girls would try to steal his hat or just all around goof off and he would be trying to shove them off saying stuff like "damnit maycie that was a new hat!" (All his girls have names) and try to push them out of the way and they just stand there ignoring his protests . It's actually really funny! He's been having trouble with breeding his girls too... it's gotten to the point where he is considering bringing a bull in just to get then in the mood even if he doesn't use him, but that's a lot of work and bulls can be dangerous.


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## Baymule (Jan 29, 2017)

@newton the goat this is the site where we talk about the real world of livestock. We have a good mix here, people with one pet to people who farm for a living. We all would love to live in the "ponies and rainbows" world, but reality is a smackdown and what is real and what is fantasy must be sorted out and dealt with. It is so much better for you to go into the world of livestock with your eyes wide open than your head stuck up in the clouds. There is great reward in caring for our hoofed friends, but sometimes the heartbreak of loss makes you question why. It is knowing that the next birth, the next ear rub, the next baa, moo, bleat, grunt, squeal or squeak when they see you coming, makes it all worthwhile.


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## newton the goat (Jan 29, 2017)

Baymule said:


> @newton the goat this is the site where we talk about the real world of livestock. We have a good mix here, people with one pet to people who farm for a living. We all would love to live in the "ponies and rainbows" world, but reality is a smackdown and what is real and what is fantasy must be sorted out and dealt with. It is so much better for you to go into the world of livestock with your eyes wide open than your head stuck up in the clouds. There is great reward in caring for our hoofed friends, but sometimes the heartbreak of loss makes you question why. It is knowing that the next birth, the next ear rub, the next baa, moo, bleat, grunt, squeal or squeak when they see you coming, makes it all worthwhile.


And that is one of the reasons why I have joined this site  I want to know more, learn things from other people's perspectives telling me the different sides of farming, I know I will likely have one of those days where I will question things like why one of my animals die. I know what it's like to lose animals but not ones that I depended on to help make a living. I enjoy learning new things and having opinions corrected, if I'm wrong about something I want someone to tell me and then give me an explanation so then I don't make the same mistakes. I want to see past those "ponies and rainbows" and if I need a reality check to get past it, then I need a reality check. Lol


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## farmerjan (Jan 29, 2017)

newton;  I think you will do just fine....


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## newton the goat (Jan 29, 2017)

farmerjan said:


> newton;  I think you will do just fine....


Thanks I hope you are right lol


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## Baymule (Jan 29, 2017)

farmerjan said:


> newton;  I think you will do just fine....


X2


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