# New here-looking for opinions



## TheMixedBag (Oct 16, 2010)

Definitely new to this place (my favorite forum's getting shut down, so I need a new place to hang out).

Anyways, I've had goats since last year, and it's mostly been a mixed bag with what we've had. We started out with a Saanen doe, and kept her until about this past June (lost her and a LaMancha buck to liver fluke). Along with her, I've had a couple of boers, a kinder, a pygmy and a LaMancha. When we lost her and the buck, I got another Saanen doe (already milking) and an alpine/saanen buckling. After the neighbor's dogs ate him (haven't seen them around since August, and I think the bull in the next-door pasture may have something to do with it), we got a registered Alpine buck and a couple of days ago I got a registered Nubian doe, due next month. (it's been a horrible year for me with goats, but I'm determined I'm not gonna quit)
Anyways, any comments on the two registered goats? I had plans on entering them in shows soon.

The Saanen I have purely for milking, as she milked a gallon a day as a first freshener. She's purebred, but her conformation is absolutely horrible. Bad legs, bad...everything, except her udder. Absolutely perfect temperament, though. (the pic is bad, but it gives you a fair idea of her...unprettiness)





This guy cost me $100, and aside from wonky horns, he's absolutely gorgeous (to me). Excellent breeding, according to the people who know and bred him. I've got 2 people with fairly large herds wanting him for the end of October and some time in November. (again, bad pics, but I may get better ones soon)









She cost me $275, and while I HIGHLY doubt she milked 11lb on any day, she looks good enough from my limited knowledge to do pretty well in the show ring (her udder's a bit messed up right now-I'm guessing one side was underdone...)


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## ksalvagno (Oct 16, 2010)

Sorry you have had so much trouble with goats. Hopefully those days are behind you. Is the Nubian currently being dried up? Do you know that the udder is ok since it is lopsided? I'm no expert on conformation so hopefully someone else can tell you that. They look like nice goats though.


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## TheMixedBag (Oct 16, 2010)

She's out of champion does, including for udders, so it's a safe guess that it's ok. The teats may be a bit too large to win her anything, but that just makes me happier when I'm milking.

But yeah, she was dried off fairly recently, she was sent to be bred about a month ago, which is how they found out she was already pregnant.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 16, 2010)

You may want to try milking that larger teat and make sure everything is ok. I'm guess she isn't totally dried up yet.


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## warthog (Oct 16, 2010)

Can't answer any of your questions, but I think you have lovely goats.

Sorry you have had such bad luck in the past.

Hope everything goes well for you.


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## Emmetts Dairy (Oct 16, 2010)

WELCOME...

I think your Saanen is pretty...I dont show my goats so Im not a expert!!

  I love the ghost like fog apperance in the picture...It looks cool!!


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## TheMixedBag (Oct 16, 2010)

ksalvagno said:
			
		

> You may want to try milking that larger teat and make sure everything is ok. I'm guess she isn't totally dried up yet.


I might....if I can ever get her back up on the stand. I know she was milked last year but she acts like she's never seen anything like it in her life. I had to pick her up and set her on it, and hold her still while someone shut the stanchion....

The really funny thing is, I went out and checked on everyone about an hour after I posted this, and Jenny (who I now learned her name is actually Capricorff Ranch Zelda) was dripping white mucousy stuff from her pooch. Still no interest in or from Maverick, though...


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## Ariel301 (Oct 18, 2010)

I wouldn't say your Saanen doe is that bad. She's not going to make a champion (unless there's little competition) but she's decent from what I can see. 

The buck looks pretty nice, but you won't be able to show him at ADGA shows with horns. Local fairs and other shows may vary in their rules on horns. Ours does not allow horns or bucks. He's not as "uphill" as he could be, but he's got a pretty nice topline and nice legs, nice looking neck and head.

The Nubian doe is not bad, but again not going to be a grand champion at a big show. She's a bit steep in the rump, but that is common with Nubians. She's beautiful through the shoulders and neck, very well put together there; nice length and width to the body, but that udder is going to be her downfall. The lopsidedness ought to clear up if it's just from the way she was being milked or if she had mastitis that was taken care of promptly, but the rear attachment doesn't look great in that photo, it should be tight and high and not sagging. I wouldn't discount the milking...11 pounds is not out of the question for that girl, I've got a similar uddered doe who can put out about 8 pounds a day from only one half of her udder, the other side doesn't milk anymore from mastitis that went untreated.


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## TheMixedBag (Oct 21, 2010)

I got better pictures of them (needed to, I finally broke down and built a website).

Jenny looks *ok* to me in this picture, but she absolutely will not stand the way I want her to. You try to hold her head higher, she throws her head up and pulls back, screwing up where you just placed her feet, so she won out and we kept her head lower. (we are still debating over whether or not she's pregnant and due soon-her teats have lengthened and are starting to fill out, but no udder growth-just a huge and round barrel). Her knees look pretty over to me when she's standing normally, but you should have seen her mother...














Her udder's all wonky from being milked funky. I emptied it the other day (saltiest milk I ever tasted....probably from the lysigin I gave her), and it's nice and even now, or at least the teats are.
The only fault I really *knew* she had was her ears are too short.









Maverick's getting dehorned before December. They're really just scurs, but they've kinda....gone a bit past normal scur stages.
The problem with trying to get him to stand for pictures is he HATES pressure on his collar, and will do everything he can to get away from it, so he's once again standing too far off his front feet for my liking-still looks ok, though. Bit too narrow.


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## Roll farms (Oct 21, 2010)

Salty milk can also be caused by mastitis, just an FYI.
I'd be getting her milk tested so you can preventative treat before she goes into milk again.

If you pull her ears down and they reach her chin, they're not 'too short'...it just looks to me like they're set high / she has a lot of control....but ears aren't NEARLY as important as udder.

I have to agree w/ a previous poster, her attatchment leaves something to be desired.   She also doesn't appear to have much depth / spring of rib...but more weight might help the appearance.
It looks like she's down a bit in the pasterns in her front legs..?  A shot of BoSe might help.
It may just be the pics, and I'm NOT insulting your animals...just offering my opinion.

Overall, I'd say the Saanen is the better looking doe.
The buck looks pretty good.  Is he young(er)?  He could be a bit deeper / longer but I've seen immature bucks change a LOT in just a years time.

Getting goats to pose is just such a pain.  I'm having an experienced 4-H girl come and help me w/ my next group of pics...hubby is clueless and can't square them up.  If I try to do it and he's taking pics, he always takes the pic to soon or too early....we usually end up 'having words' on picture day, lol.


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## Calliopia (Oct 21, 2010)

Salty milk is a sign of mastitis which  can also cause a lumpy lopsided udder.  You may want to get her checked out by a vet or just go ahead and treat for it.


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## TheMixedBag (Oct 21, 2010)

The lysigin was for staph mastitis, apparently (I did just have to ask, he'd only said staph), so yeah, that's the salty bit. It's also been treated since 10/2, but I've got an appointment for her on the 28th, too.
I'm not gonna defend her udder, either. The guy I got her from may have grand champions, but it certainly was never because of their udders. He doesn't seem to pay that much attention to them, either, at least not in his nubians. I'm still hoping she was worth the $275 I paid for her.
Also, she's not really low on her pasterns, at least, not genetically. The person she was sent to for breeding cut her heels down a lot, and I mean a LOT, so I've got corrective trimming to do soon as the wall's grown out a bit more.

Did I mention she's also REALLY fat? I can barely feel her ribs at all, and she's got big 'ole Krispy Kremes right behind her front legs. I can't pretend it's just because she's pregnant with that one....

The buck is fairly young, he's a 2009 baby. I'm hoping he grows up a lot in the next year, I didn't plan on keeping him much past 2-3 years.


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## SDGsoap&dairy (Oct 21, 2010)

Roll farms said:
			
		

> hubby is clueless and can't square them up.  If I try to do it and he's taking pics, he always takes the pic to soon or too early....we usually end up 'having words' on picture day, lol.




This sounds waaaayy too familiar.


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## rebelINny (Oct 22, 2010)

I feel for ya as having a rough year with the goats. This year has been rough for us too even though its our 4th year running. "Our" goats are healthy and hardy with no problems whatsoever, but we bought a herd of 16 a few months ago as well as some bottle babies from another farm to use up our excess milk and well......it wasn't all good. We lost three out of our eight bottle babies and another may still pass (still watching and helping). Out of the 16 we had a 5 month old buckling that died just 2 days after we got them (underlying problem or the move? not sure), we just had the kid from one die last night (she just wasn't healthy, about 13wks old) the kid's mother is sickly looking and too thin and a year and a half old Nubian doe is also sickly and thin and we have had to keep her on probiotics and yogurt off and on since we have had her. Thinking on culling the latter two soon. The rest are nice and doing well and staying healthy. So out of sixteen we have lost the two kids and will most likely cull two of the adults. Bummer as any goat loss to me is too much  I really hated the fact that the kid died last night, I knew it was inevitable but I worked so much with her and more than once brought her back from a desperate situation. These goats were not cared for very well by the previous owners in the last couple of years apparantly. The rest have fattened up and come out of the unsociableness to a great extent since we bought them. Our original 8 does and all their kids are doing FABULOUS! I just will not buy any more goats outside our farm again unless its a buck, it just is too risky. As for that, I am so glad you are happy with your new goats and hope all goes well for you and them. I am starting to breed mini-Alpine's now as well as French and American Alpine and its soooooooo much fun to show them


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## TheMixedBag (Oct 22, 2010)

The first goat we lost was just a flat stupid one. He was a pygmy playfighting with a full-grown Saanen, and while she caught his collar and broke his neck, it had happened at least 3 times before, so I really don't know what went on that time.
The next buck we bought was a good looking LaMancha buck, but he had a horrible immune system. He had pneumonia when we got him, and he had pneumonia when he died of liver fluke (we also lost the saanen doe to liver fluke a week later, because we got the wrong wormer and couldn't afford the right one for another 2 weeks). 
After that, I lost the SaanenxAlpine buckling to dogs (and one of the dogs was taken out by a bull), and when we got his mother, she was just horrible. Got sick the second day here from eating too many alfalfa pellets, sorta recovered 8 days later, and then snapped her own neck rolling under my porch....

NONE of it actually started until I bought Jenny, except for the pigmy buck.


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