# Indigestion in Goats - How to administer Epson Salt?



## Mzyla (May 28, 2011)

I was reading and reading....until I find what matches the most with my goat symptoms:

_Indigestion
It could be occur due to eating of azaleas, mangrove in flowers and fodder sprayed with insecticides. The indigestion result into loss of appetite, excrete flinty or small dropping, goat became lethargic. This need Epson salts like 120g, 80g, 60g and 30g on successive days. Heavy doze of magnesium carbonate 30g daily or Mylata 120g, three times a day used to neutralise excessive fermentation. New and fresh food should be given along with a mineral tonics like Ferri -Phos- Co (Parrishes food), and Metatone (Park Davis) 30ml twice a day to restore appetite. Clove tea (use 12 cloves in 500ml of water, boil for 10 times, when cool divide into three parts) use as 3 times a day help to restore appetite._

But....they don't say HOW to give this Epson Salt to a goat????
Mix with water/ milk?  They won't drink willingly....

It started like this: one of my goats suddenly refused bottle.
Her hairs on a spine was (and still are) sort of "up"
Then I see diarrhea...greenish color.
Since I noticed this righaway, I treated and stopped the diarrhea within an hour.
Goat is still little lethargic and only nibling a small quantity of food.
Eyes nice and pink. No temperature.

I suspect she eat something....I was sprinkling pesticide around coops...I also cought her nibling on plastic bag, which I took away from her, but maybe she digested some of it....

The other (bigger) goat is thriving! She doesn't show any signs like the smaller one. Altough, she stopped jumping as usual and it's kind of quiet?! They not crying....which is strange, because previously they both were screaming for milk....
I did stopped milk. Instead I'm giving them "Life water" and yougurt.

Any help is appreciated!

Pictures how she looks just now I'm posting on the "Chickens" Forum under "Other Livestock". I just signed to this Forum and they won't let me post pictures yet.
I noticed her scratching her ears? I didn't see this ever before?


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## elevan (May 28, 2011)

I've never given epsom salts to goats  

You have a lot of variables here...
bottle baby with runs
pesticide around coops
eating plastic
2nd goat maybe feeling bad


You say you stopped the "poops" right away with treatment - please elaborate...
Too much pepto can be bad for goats and you could have gone from runs to stopped up

Ingestion of plastic could result in a blockage and requires vet assistance

Pesticide ingestion really depends on what the pesticide was

Bottle baby with runs...I don't bottle feed...can't give you suggestions there.

2nd goat maybe feeling bad...is it related to the other? or is it just having a bad day? idk


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## Mzyla (May 28, 2011)

elevan said:
			
		

> I've never given epsom salts to goats
> 
> You have a lot of variables here...
> bottle baby with runs
> ...


Thank you!
I mixed a little bit of Pepto with Yogurt. Used 2 ML syringe.
Did this 3 times since yesterday.

It was D-earth, but not the "food" quality. It was the "pest" quality. I sprinkled a lot!

They are 2 sisters. I got them at 2 weeks of age. Now they are 2 months old.

I love them very much! I was mad when they were crying....now it is strange when they are quiet....I feel very nervous....


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## helmstead (May 28, 2011)

I would sooner suspect cocci than indigestion (and the treatment you've copied out I am TOTALLY lost on, but I don't practice 'natural' therapies).

I would get them on dimethox (Albon) ASAP if they were here.  I would also give some bicarb and veggie oil to get things moving, perhaps also do an enema on the one refusing to eat.


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## Mzyla (May 28, 2011)

helmstead said:
			
		

> I would sooner suspect cocci than indigestion (and the treatment you've copied out I am TOTALLY lost on, but I don't practice 'natural' therapies).
> 
> I would get them on dimethox (Albon) ASAP if they were here.  I would also give some bicarb and veggie oil to get things moving, perhaps also do an enema on the one refusing to eat.


Thank you so much for your advice!

I will get on it right away; I will prepare some baking soda and some oil....
Any suggestion how to feed this to her? Mix with anything else for better taste?

Dewormer I ordered yesterday....so it should come in a mid of next week.

What else can I do?


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## helmstead (May 28, 2011)

It tastes bad, they're not going to like it and there isn't much you can do about it.

Dimethox is a sulfa antibiotic for bacterial scours, not a dewormer.  You might have to find a vet or goat breeder to get some, or look at the local farm store.  It is usually readily available in the stores as a powder, which has to be mixed with a little water and drenched.


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## Mzyla (May 28, 2011)

I just gave it to her about 1.5 ML....oh boy....she was spitting!
I will try to give her some more in a while....

When they go to sleep I will run to Tractor Supplies and see what they have over-the-counter.

Thanks!

P.S. Just a while ago, it was excited moment, because my baby Pyr killed his first victim - a racoon!

Pictures will follow shortly on a "Chicken" forum.


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## elevan (May 28, 2011)

I second getting some Di-Methox for Cocci on this one.


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## Mzyla (May 28, 2011)

Ok guys....I came back from tractor supply and bought the only things they have:
- Tetracycline
- Corid

(Di-Methox I have to order online)

I gave a bit of Tetracycline to the sick goat; mixed a small pinch with bottle of water and yogurt, then filled up a syringe and gave her that mixture - about 2 ML

Should I administer Corid too? For the time being until I get the better stuff?
And should I continue with Tetracycline?

Thanks for all your help - it makes me not being alone, knowing that there are people who care!


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## SDGsoap&dairy (May 28, 2011)

Make sure you're giving the right dosage of tetracycline if you give it at all.  Underdosing antibiotics is probably worse than not using them at all.


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## Goatmasta (May 28, 2011)

Corid is 2.5 cc/10lbs once a day for 5 days (Do not give vitaminB or thiamine with it) undiluted yes give it immediately!


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## helmstead (May 28, 2011)

Do not give that baby any more tetracycline...it won't do any good, for one, and for another can cause bone & tooth growth issues.  Young kids should only get antibiotics from the penicillin family unless vet prescribed.

CoRid is fine if dosed properly. (ie NOT following the label dose - Goatmasta posted the proper dose)


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## elevan (May 28, 2011)

For Cocci you can use Albon, Di-Methox or CoRid.


On the Tetracycline...*it is VERY IMPORTANT when giving antibiotics that you give the CORRECT DOSE and USE FOR THE FULL TIME* _or you are breeding antibiotic resistant bacteria and not helping your animal._


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## Mzyla (May 28, 2011)

That Corid is 10oz bag of powder...
The Instructions are for 125 gallons!
I'm going crazy here and already have headache from trying to calculate how much of this powder should I put to let's say 1 quart of water?
I mean how much 1 baby can drink? And I don't want to waste the whole bag...

Any good mathematician here? I always hated math 
Help   please?


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## Goatmasta (May 28, 2011)

I don't know about they corid powder, the dosage I posted was for the liquid.


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## elevan (May 28, 2011)

Mzyla said:
			
		

> That Corid is 10oz bag of powder...
> The Instructions are for 125 gallons!
> I'm going crazy here and already have headache from trying to calculate how much of this powder should I put to let's say 1 quart of water?
> I mean how much 1 baby can drink? And I don't want to waste the whole bag...
> ...


0.08 oz powder to 1 gallon of water

1 gallon = 4 quarts so... 0.02 oz to a quart of water


eta: I don't normally use CoRid...I think those instructions are probably for prevention and not treatment...treatment may be a higher percentage?


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## Mzyla (May 28, 2011)

Thank you Herd Master!

I have this "Postal Scale", but the minimum it takes is 0.2 oz
So, when I placed on the scale 1 tea spoon of powder, it was 0.2 oz.

That means I have to divide this 1 tea spoon into 10 parts?

And take 1/10 of that tea spoon into 1 Quart of water.

Is that correct?


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## elevan (May 28, 2011)

Mzyla said:
			
		

> Thank you Herd Master!
> 
> I have this "Postal Scale", but the minimum it takes is 0.2 oz
> So, when I placed on the scale 1 tea spoon of powder, it was 0.2 oz.
> ...


0.02 Ounces = 0.12 Teaspoons = approx 1/8 tsp

If you have a measuring set you should have an 1/8 tsp...

But this seems too diluted to me...like I said I don't use CoRid...

Oh, and Herd Master is just a "label" you're given when you have so many posts    My user name is elevan or I'm just plain Emily


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## elevan (May 28, 2011)

Give me a few minutes to do some checking and math


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## Goatmasta (May 28, 2011)

there is a calculator on the corid website http://www.corid.com/calculator.html

  it is formulated for cattle.  In the goat world apparently we use about 5 times the dosage...   the dosage I gave you was for the 9.6% oral solution..

http://www.corid.com/drench_treatment.html


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## elevan (May 28, 2011)

Just found this:



> AS A DRENCH
> 
> CORID drench solutions may be stored in a clean, closed, labeled container for up to 3 days.
> 
> ...


That sounds much better


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## Goatmasta (May 28, 2011)

That is too diluted in my opinion if you work the math backwards it doesn't come out to the 2.5cc/10lbs of undiluted 9.6% oral solution that is commonly used for goats


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## elevan (May 28, 2011)

Goatmasta said:
			
		

> there is a calculator on the corid website http://www.corid.com/calculator.html
> 
> it is formulated for cattle.  *In the goat world apparently we use about 5 times the dosage... *  the dosage I gave you was for the 9.6% oral solution..
> 
> http://www.corid.com/drench_treatment.html


So...are you advising that the OP give 5x the dosage?  As I've said CoRid is not what I grab for cocci...

Drenching instructions for cattle state:
give 1 fl oz of this solution for each 100 lb (45 kg) body weight.

By your statement that would mean they should give 5 fl oz per 100#...that seems like a lot...especially to what I use with Albon...


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## elevan (May 28, 2011)

Goatmasta said:
			
		

> That is too diluted in my opinion if you work the math backwards it doesn't come out to the 2.5cc/10lbs of undiluted 9.6% oral solution that is commonly used for goats


Do you use CoRid?


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## elevan (May 28, 2011)

20Kids uses CoRid....maybe they can help out...


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## Goatmasta (May 28, 2011)

Yes I use corid as well as dimethox.  If you look at the calulator and put in 10lb animal on the 5 day treatment they recommend ..02oz or .47ml /day 5x less than what is commonly used.  if you switch tabs to the 20% powder it recommends half that amount

But I have never used the powder!


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## elevan (May 28, 2011)

Goatmasta said:
			
		

> Yes I use corid as well as dimethox.  If you look at the calulator and put in 10lb animal on the 5 day treatment they recommend ..02oz or .47ml /day 5x less than what is commonly used.  if you switch tabs to the 20% powder it recommends half that amount.


Their math is gonna be based on the % of medicines is in each part of solution.

You normally use 9.6% and the OP has 20% which means that the OP is gonna use a smaller amount.  No question about that.


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## Mzyla (May 28, 2011)

Thank you guys! I appreciate all of your united effort to figure this one out.

Averaging all of these Instructions and calculations - 1 tea spoon into a 1 Quart of water seems like a compromise?


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## Goatmasta (May 28, 2011)

elevan said:
			
		

> Goatmasta said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


If you go to the calculator you can swap between the 9.6% and the 20%...   If you calculate on the 9.6% it tells you to use 5x less the amount that is commonly used for goats.  which is 2.5ml/10lbs.


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## helmstead (May 28, 2011)

I HATE math...

Mkay...I THINK I would put SIX oz dry measure of the powder into 1 qt of water...and then dose as they've said (1 fl oz per 100 lbs) remembering that there are nearly 30 ccs per fluid oz...



Because with the 9.6% one should x5 the dose, so makes sense that at 20% one should x2 the dose OR SO...


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## elevan (May 28, 2011)

helmstead said:
			
		

> I HATE math...
> 
> Mkay...I THINK I would put SIX oz dry measure of the powder into 1 qt of water...and then dose as they've said (1 fl oz per 100 lbs) remembering that there are nearly 30 ccs per fluid oz...
> 
> ...


You know Helmstead I think that sounds pretty sensible   

My problem is that I need to know the mg per part and I'll go through figuring out all the math to get to the solution to divide the blah blah blah blah


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## Mzyla (May 29, 2011)

UPDATE

Seems like goat is doing lot better!
They both were beeeeeee-meeeeeeee-ing this early morning for food.
The "sick" one poop regular black berries.
In a bottle I only gave her mixed yogurt with my home made fruit juice.
(We don't drink store juices; I boil water with fruits and some sugar)

Now they free ranging and picking leafes from trees.
I also noticed her eating little hay - must be hungry!

I still like to believe that she eat sometning, because yesterday I took magnifying glass and look into her poop, which was still little clumpy and I observed some white particles resembling pieces of plastic and also some pieces resembling broken egg shell)

In comparison between these two, she is skinny and still appear weaker then normal. She did jump on a car tough 
The other one it's always been like a wine barrel!

No matter what, I will feed them both with that Cocci stuff - just in case, right? Or should I rather wait for the shipment of the better stuff, which I ordered online?


Thanks!


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## elevan (May 29, 2011)

Mzyla said:
			
		

> UPDATE
> 
> Seems like goat is doing lot better!
> They both were beeeeeee-meeeeeeee-ing this early morning for food.
> ...


Whatever you do - don't stop treating just to wait for something better.

And the white pieces of stuff in the poop sounds like it could be tapeworm eggs.  I would start treating for tapeworms.  Use Safeguard (can get at TSC) and dose at 3x the label dose.

I just had to deal with a bout of cocci and tapeworms in one of my doelings so I feel for you!


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## helmstead (May 29, 2011)

elevan said:
			
		

> And the white pieces of stuff in the poop sounds like it could be tapeworm eggs.  I would start treating for tapeworms.  Use Safeguard (can get at TSC) and dose at 3x the label dose.


Tapeworm EGGS are microscopic.  Tapeworm segments, unmistakable.  Looking at feces through a magnifying glass is not diagnostic.

This thread is getting a little too speculative.  I'd recommend continuing the cocci treatment as best you can and getting a fecal sample to a vet on Tuesday.


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## Mzyla (May 29, 2011)

I will continue with the Cocci meds.
And guys - I did look it up on a internet how tapeworm eggs look like and what I saw in my magnifying glass was NOTHING like that.
The pieces I saw, was some triangles, som rectangles, some larger almost 1/4 inch pieces like shredded white shopping bag....
Believe me, it was visible even without magnifying glass.

I'm catching my goats nibbling on anything and everything....I'm constantly hiding objects from around the house...


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## elevan (May 29, 2011)

Mzyla said:
			
		

> I will continue with the Cocci meds.
> And guys - I did look it up on a internet how tapeworm eggs look like and what I saw in my magnifying glass was NOTHING like that.
> The pieces I saw, was some triangles, som rectangles, some larger almost 1/4 inch pieces like shredded white shopping bag....
> Believe me, it was visible even without magnifying glass.
> ...


Yep, you're right that doesn't sound like tapeworm _segments (meant to say that and said eggs - my bad)_


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## Mzyla (May 29, 2011)

Goats just wake up from their 2 hrs. nap
and I think Loli is cured!
She drink a bottle with such a thirst and hunger like she came from some starved 3-rd World Country ~LOL~
Now she is eating hay....

Oh...and yesterday I lefted on a bench a cup with that Oil/Epson Salt mixture....as always curious she knocked over and licked most of it!!!
That makes me think, that perhaps they need some sort of salt?

I'm very much relieved now - I hope that she will grow up and give me some milk one day 

I have only 2 of them and they are spoiled and pampered.
And why do they like shopping bags so much?
They have so much good food available to them all day long....

By the time I unload my shopping from the car to the house - they manage to shred most of these bags and any bag they can lay their mouths on???


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## elevan (May 29, 2011)

Glad to hear that she is feeling much better.  Keep up with the cocci treatment though.

Do you have loose minerals available to them all the time? If not then get some goat minerals from TSC and put them out.  I wouldn't give just salt as they'll eat all the salt and leave minerals which can make them mineral deficient.

As far as your grocery bags...you really need to nip that in the bud.  I would suggest getting some reusable canvas bags to haul your groceries into the house.  And / or pen the goats up when you're bringing home stuff.


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## Mzyla (May 29, 2011)

Thanks elevan and other members - for all of your concern and for sticking with me till this positive end!
I guess this should conclude this thread - since all is good now.

Goat is eating, drinking and foraging...still little tired, but that is normal after a sickness - just like we humans; when having upset stomach, we are weak for some time afterwards.


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## 20kidsonhill (May 31, 2011)

Sorry I missed out on helping, with the dosage, but I don't use nearly as high a dosage as some of you recommend.  We have been fishing and swimming and my brain is not ready to debate anyonse calculations. 

Glad the goat is doing better. 

I have used both Corid and sulfa-dimeth.  I only use the sulfa as an oral drench, and again not nearly as high a dose as some people on here are using.  

We use Corid in the drinking water starting when the kids are 3 weeks of age. I put 2 0z of corid in  (9.6%) in the drinking water per 5 gallons and continue for 6 or 7 days.  I sometimes adjust that, according to how much water they are drinking, adding more if there water consumption is not high enough.   

If they aren't drinking enough water I switch to oral drenching, corid is given at the rate of  1/2 cc per 10lb body weight, twice a day for the first couple of days and then one time a day for the remainder of the treatment.

One can debate if the kids are getting enough corid putting it in the drinking water, as long as the goats aren't on a bunch of wet spring grass and are drinking the water, I have not had problems with a cocci outbreak during the treatment or after the following 3 weeks after the treament. And I do have plenty of cocci around here, if I didn't treat, even on medicated feed, I would loose most my kids and yearlings.


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## Mzyla (May 31, 2011)

Thank you 20kidsonhill 
I continue with Corid...in fact I'm treating everyone including my chickens.
Goat is doing very good so far; jumping, grazing, drinking.
I did cut on milk. They love my home-made fruit juice! I'm giving them yogurt too.


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