# what breed(s) have the least-goaty milk?



## patandchickens (Mar 13, 2010)

Hi all, 

I am starting to really REALLY want some kind of milking critter for hobby cheesemaking. Since a cow just seems like way too much work and expense (at least at this particular point in my life), and milking sheep seem too hard to find and it's not clear to me whether they can be hand-milked anyhow, I am thinking about goats. (I really loooove goaties in a 'pet' sense anyhow, have been waiting til kids get to 4H age on the theory that'll justify our getting a few... LOL)

The thing is, I really do not care for the goat's milk I've tasted in the past, or goats-milk ice cream. I need to hit the stores and buy a variety of goats-milk cheeses to learn more, but I have had some goats-milk cheeses that were not strongly goaty and that I DID like.

So if a person were looking for a couple goats to milk for hobby cheesemaking (i.e. quantity is not a big concern), what is the "least goaty tasting" breed? Does it still make good cheese?

Thanks for any info,

Pat


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## ksalvagno (Mar 13, 2010)

Nubians and Nigerian Dwarfs have the highest percentage of butterfat which would probably be good for cheese. Also have a sweeter tasting milk. I do have an Alpine that I'm milking and her milk tastes like cow milk to me. It is my understanding that a huge part of the "goaty" taste is in how the milk is handled, how quickly you get it out of the barn, how clean everything is, how well rinsed your equipment is, how fast you cool it down, what your goats eat,etc. Also makes a difference if it is pasteurized or raw. I am drinking my goat milk raw.


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## Roll farms (Mar 13, 2010)

If it tastes "goatey" then it's not clean, whether it's the milk itself or the cheese, ice cream, etc.

And store-bought goat milk is nothing like fresh-from-the-goat milk....sort of like store bought eggs vs. fresh eggs, or fresh pork vs. meat counter pork.

Cleanliness is the best route to GOOD milk.  That and a good diet.
Dirty cow milk would taste funky, too.
Wash the udder, use glass and stainless containers when possible, strain it, and cool it fast.

I think Nub and Boer milk tastes the best, other breeds taste 'watered down' (like skim milk) to me, since the butterfat is lower.
I wouldn't want to milk Nigis by hand, but that's just me....lots of folks do and are fine w/ it.  I'm used to girls w/ big old tah-tahs.

Now you need to decide what breed you like, personality and looks-wise, and get that kind.


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## michickenwrangler (Mar 13, 2010)

LaManchas have fairly high butterfat compared with Toggs, Saanens and Alpines and are sweeter and quieter than Nubians and Nigerians.


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## aggieterpkatie (Mar 13, 2010)

I've read that Oberhasli milk tastes the closest to cow milk.  I know I love the taste of my ober's milk.


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## lupinfarm (Mar 13, 2010)

And if you end up getting Nigi's, there is a woman in Campbellville  that breeds registered Nigerian Dwarfs....


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## dkluzier (Mar 13, 2010)

My saanen/nubian cross doe has thinner milk (lower milkfat) than my nubian/pygmy cross doe. The saanen is easier to milk  since she has larger teats. She has a better disposition for putting up with being on the milking stand.  As far as taste, I don't notice a goaty taste or wild taste to either of them.  I prefer their milk to cow's myself.


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## SDGsoap&dairy (Mar 13, 2010)

michickenwrangler said:
			
		

> LaManchas have fairly high butterfat compared with Toggs, Saanens and Alpines and are sweeter and quieter than Nubians and Nigerians.


I have an incredibly sweet nubian- just LOVES to have her head and cheeks stroked and she was dam raised.  I also have a couple Nigis that "trance out" when they're getting scratched on the sides.  And, when you stop scratching, into the lap they want to go!  Noisy?  Ok, yeah, a little.  But there's no argument about them being sweet.


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## freemotion (Mar 13, 2010)

I snatched the xmas trees away from my Alpine doe last winter so her milk wouldn't get strong tasting.  This past winter, I said "what the heck" and let her have all the xmas trees she wanted...I ended up dragging almost 50 unsold trees home.  I noticed no change in the taste.

Could be that I am a cretin, though....

I found a quart of milk WAAAAY back in the fridge that was marked January 20...and last night I made cream of mushroom soup with some of it and had hot chocolate this morning with some more.  This was the first time I tasted milk that was "goaty."  It was not quite two months old, so I'm not sure why it was goaty.    Maybe it was the xmas trees.....


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## michickenwrangler (Mar 13, 2010)

freemotion said:
			
		

> I snatched the xmas trees away from my Alpine doe last winter so her milk wouldn't get strong tasting.  This past winter, I said "what the heck" and let her have all the xmas trees she wanted...I ended up dragging almost 50 unsold trees home.  I noticed no change in the taste.
> 
> Could be that I am a cretin, though....
> 
> I found a quart of milk WAAAAY back in the fridge that was marked January 20...and last night I made cream of mushroom soup with some of it and had hot chocolate this morning with some more.  This was the first time I tasted milk that was "goaty."  It was not quite two months old, so I'm not sure why it was goaty.    Maybe it was the xmas trees.....


We live in a cedar swamp and the deer around here regularly eat pine needles and cedar needles. Though we don't drink their milk (too hard to get them on the milking stand  ) their flesh tastes like turpentine from all the pine/cedar resin/sap in their diet. 

Darn DNR deer baiting ban!


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## cmjust0 (Mar 15, 2010)

Personal opinion/theory time...  

The taste of goats' milk, while absolutely influenced by handling, is also influenced by the amount of caproic acid it contains.  Caproic acid has a sour, rancid smell and taste...sorta like how butyric acid flavors parmesan cheese.  

I think different goats impart different levels of caproic acid into their milk..  

I also think caproic acid levels dictate how much bucks of different breeds tend to stink.

With that in mind...we've never had a Nubian or nubi/cross buck that was just unbearably smelly..  Conversely, I've heard tell of Oberhasli bucks that will knock you down at 20 paces..

With that in mind...and not to be a 'breed snob', but...I've also heard quite a few different folks say that Oberhasli milk tends to be the 'goatiest' of goat milks, while Nubian milk is generally considered to be among the mildest.

Again...just a theory/opinion.


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## ksacres (Mar 28, 2010)

First things first:  goats can be generalized by breed.  But, goats are individuals and some goats (in any breed) can actually produce ucky tasting milk-it's just an individual trait.  I recommend you purchase an adult doe already lactating and TASTE HER MILK beforehand to verify you like the taste of that particular doe's milk.

Fresh, properly handled goats' milk is sweet and slightly creamy.  Very pleasant and no bad aftertaste.  Much better than storebought cows' milk, though some people will tell you (as a selling point) that it tastes the same.  But it doesn't.  It's richer and sweeter.  

Clean milk is the first step, when we milk for house milk, we milk into a prechilled stainless steel bucket (actually, a bucket within a bucket, the bigger bucket containing ice, the second bucket for the milk) and we milk through cheesecloth to keep any dust/dirt/hair out of the milk from the get-go.  Also, I would recommend only milking into a dedicated stainless or glass container.  Plastic can't be properly sterlized and can trap odors that it will release into your milk.  We run our buckets through the dishwasher to heat sterilize, but you can get powdered dairy sanitizer very cheaply.  

Milk needs to be chilled quickly (hence the bucket in a bucket).  If we are milking for house milk, that doe is milked last, so that when it's done, we take the already chilling milk inside, strain it and put it in an ice bath to finish the chill.

Your milking area needs to be scrupulously clean, milk picks up flavors very easily.  A lot of people raising dairy goats for the first time don't realize that milking in a dirty/smelly or dusty barn is going to make the milk taste that way and blame it on the goat rather than their own poor sanitation practices.  That's also why many people have or quickly get a designated milking area that can be kept much much cleaner than a normal "barn".

Proper handling doesn't just mean clean milk, it means actual correct handling.  When you agitate goats milk (anything that makes the milk froth a lot-including extremely zealous milking habits) it breaks down the acid and releases the goaty taste that will increase the longer it sits.  Pastuerization also increases the bad flavor.  That's why pastuerized store bought goats' milk often leaves you feeling like you just licked a dirty boy goat-it gets agitated several times and then cooked then agitated again.  Yum.

Don't run your does with a buck-as stated, milk very easily absorbs smells.  If your does are running with your buck, they are going to rub against him and smell like him.  And since you can't milk your doe without, uh, milking your doe, you are going to have the smell in your otherwise clean milking area.

If you make fresh ice cream, it may taste *slightly* goaty, since it will be agitated by the ice cream maker.  But if made with very fresh milk, it shouldn't be a real problem, extra sugar and/or flavorings will mask it as well.

I, personally, don't like any goat cheese, it all has a bit of the goat flavor to me.  That's part of the appeal for many people though-the strong flavor is desirable in goat cheese.

If you are going to make pudding with it, eat it on the first day.  Again, if you agitate it heavily then let it sit, it's going to develop a stronger goaty taste.

All that said, I would say Nubian or La Mancha.

*Nubian pros:*
The most commonly kept dairy goat in the US means that stud service is readily available and kids are generally easy to sell to others.
The highest butterfat of the standard dairy breeds-more butterfat translates into sweeter tasting milk and more cream for cheese and butter.
"Old Style" Nubians are a dual purpose type animal-extra buck kids can be fed out for meat.
Multiple births are very common in Nubians, triplets and quads are considered perfectly normal.
*Nubian cons:*
Very vocal.  Don't get me wrong, I love my Nubians, but they can be downright obnoxious.
Generally have a lower output of whole milk-lower production is the price you pay for higher quality components (butterfat and protein).
Can be stubborn and difficult to break to the milking habit as compared to other breeds.

*LaMancha Pros*:
Second highest butterfat of the standard size dairy breeds.
Higher whole milk output (on average) than Nubians.
Sweet, mischeivious, but willing personalities-the easiest of the breeds (in my opinion) to break to the milking habit.
Some lines are also good multi-purpose animals, extra buck kids grow well and can be fed out for meat.
Multiple births of twins or triplets can be expected.  Quads are not nearly as common in La Manchas as in Nubians.
*LaMancha Cons:*
Considered ugly by some-not as easy to sell unneeded stock.
Not as commonly kept-could be more difficult to find a buck for breeding.

Mastitis can produce salty and/or sour tasting milk.  That is not a normal flavor of milk.  If you get this taste, it's time to check for mastitis.  Mastitis is not always a bright red, hot udder-it can be chronic and deep in the tissue.

Colostrum in the milk is bitter and unpalatable.  Most does are flushed of colostrum by two weeks fresh, but some continue for a month or more.  
_
*
Warning:  Gratuitous plug for dairy goats in general:*_
Dairy goats are smaller and more easily managed than cows.  They require less feed and produce good quantities of efficiently produced milk.  Pound for pound, a good dairy doe is going to produce milk much more efficiently dairy cow.  Goats are unique personalities, full of spunk and vinegar.  Goats almost never urinate or deficate while being milked or even in the milking area.  They just know it's a no-no.  And if they do-it's easily swept little berries.  Cows often spray manure on everything, including themselves, the floor, the wall, your clothes...


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## chandasue (Mar 28, 2010)

I'm lovin' my Nigerian's milk. Super creamy, borderline half and half consistency. Not goaty at all. Yes, tiny teats, but I'm using an EZ Milker and it works great. I could milk her by hand if I had to but I have a bad wrist that I'm trying not to make worse. And as far as personality they're very sweet and follow us around better than a dog, although a bit on the talkative side when they see me. If they don't see me they're quiet. They expect treats and to be let out to roam the yard if I'm in sight.


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