# Meat Rabbits that aren't breeding HELP!!!!!!



## autumnprairie (Oct 25, 2011)

ok I hope I am posting this in the correct spot. 

I need someones help, in April I bought 3 meat rabbits one  died ended up being a dogs playtoy that was my buck he has been replaced back in July. with a 1 year old buck that they said had sired a litter and a 
6 -7 month old doe both are NZ whites.

I have put her with him every month since then and to no avail NO KITS.  My other NZ doe just turned 6 months in September and I put her with him for 3 days. she should have her kits by now and nothing.

Grr do I buy another buck from someone else is it my buck or my does?




am I doing something wrong?


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## crazyturkeydesigns (Oct 26, 2011)

autumnprairie said:
			
		

> ok I hope I am posting this in the correct spot.
> 
> I need someones help, in April I bought 3 meat rabbits one  died ended up being a dogs playtoy that was my buck he has been replaced back in July. with a 1 year old buck that they said had sired a litter and a
> 6 -7 month old doe both are NZ whites.
> ...


It's probably not you, providing they are getting the proper nutrition. If you started trying in July, heat was probably your biggest culprit...heat can cause temporary sterility in bucks. With our American Sables (a little smaller than the NZs), I usually wait until 8 months of age just to be safe unless I feel the doe is ready and mature. 
There's a lot of info online about breeding, so maybe doing a little digging will help too. Here's a good article about breeding (it's a little general in some parts, but I still really like it): Barbi Brown's breeding article 
Good luck and keep us updated!


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## brentr (Oct 26, 2011)

Do you actually see them mate?  See the buck mount , the doe lift her hindquarters, and then see the buck fall over to the side - the sign of a successful mating?  That would be where I'd start.  

Another area is feeding.  What do you feed your rabbits?  They should get a ration that is 15-18% protein, etc.  A good pelletized feed would have everything they need.  Are your rabbits in good condition?  Too fat or too thin.  Does that are too fat have trouble conceiving, and bucks that are too fat have low desire.  Yet another is a visual inspection of both rabbits.  Buck: testes descended, full and plump looking, penis clean and normal looking, clearly visible when you gently draw back the skin around it?  Doe: vulva area clean, no discharge, color pink to almost purple (the darker the color of the vulva when you expose it, the more ready the doe is to breed)?  General inspection for both: eyes and ears clean, fur in good condition, not molting, eating and drinking well?

Some things I have found successful in trying to breed rabbits:  I feed my rabbits in the evening, and I have found that if I put the doe in with the buck just before feeding he is more active and aggressive for mating.  Then he gets the post mating reward of his pellets (after I take the doe out).  I have also found that putting my doe & buck in side by side cages for several hours before putting the doe in with the buck can help.  It lets them smell each other and "get acquainted" so to say.  That can trigger the doe to be more receptive.

If you have the connections, try your doe with another buck and/or your buck with another doe and see if there is success.  Agewise, your rabbits should be mature enough and ready to mate.

I am no expert, and if all the things I mention are in order for you and your rabbits, I don't know what cause might be affecting your breeding program.  I hope you find success soon.


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## autumnprairie (Oct 26, 2011)

I have seen them mate every time I am beginning to wonder if he is sterile. unfortunately I dont have another buck to verify this. unless I have my dates wrong and she still has a week or so left before she kindles


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## DKRabbitry (Oct 26, 2011)

I have been having fertility issues with some of my bucks.  Two of them are proven breeders and I have had 7 does miss between the two of them the past 2 months   The 2 does I bred to a different buck took.  It is really getting on my nerves.  Good thing I have a surplus of bucks right now... too bad I have to resort to the ones I didn't really want to use.  I plan on giving mine two more tries each, and if the does miss again they are gone


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## autumnprairie (Oct 26, 2011)

I went to go check on her and guess what she had BABIES    dont know how many but they are there. when can I check to see how many?
 This her first litter


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## oneacrefarm (Oct 26, 2011)

autumnprairie said:
			
		

> I went to go check on her and guess what she had BABIES    dont know how many but they are there. when can I check to see how many?
> This her first litter


You can check as soon as she seems to be done. Make sure they are all in the nest, that none of them are dead and remove any bloody hay, afterbirth, dead kits from the nest. You don't have to worry about not touching them, I touch mine everyday from day one and have never had a doe reject her kits. You should be checking the kits everyday to see that they have full bellies and that none have died in the nest. 

Congratulations on the popples!


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## crazyturkeydesigns (Oct 26, 2011)

oneacrefarm said:
			
		

> You can check as soon as she seems to be done. Make sure they are all in the nest, that none of them are dead and remove any bloody hay, afterbirth, dead kits from the nest. *You don't have to worry about not touching them, I touch mine everyday from day one and have never had a doe reject her kits. You should be checking the kits everyday to see that they have full bellies and that none have died in the nest. *
> 
> Congratulations on the popples!


I do the same...when I first started in 4-H I remember people telling me that you couldn't touch the babies because the doe would reject them and if you did you'd have to put vix/vanilla on the does nose blah blah...but I've always handled them, never had a problem. I think it's really important to get any dead kits out because if you don't they will start to decompose and then you have a much bigger problem on your hands. I do usually give the doe something (like oats) and pet her forehead before I dig in the nest, but it's really just as a treat to her for doing such a good job. 
Congrats on babies!! I've got 2 new litters right now and it's just so exciting!!


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## DKRabbitry (Oct 26, 2011)

Awww I want babies so bad!!! I haven't had any for like 4 months... It's killing me!!  Congrats on your new arrivals! 
We always touch ours right away.  Like the others said, gotta check for any dead ones and clean up a bit.


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## Snowfie (Oct 26, 2011)

Congrats on your rabbit babies!  YAY!

Another week or two I hope to have some myself.  Go bunnies!


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## autumnprairie (Oct 26, 2011)

My hubby won't let me check for a few days so when I get to I will let everyone know how many.  Moma is a NZ red and white mixed buck is a NZ white so the colors could be red white and black. This means that my other NZ white doe should kindle about a week from now


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## Ms. Research (Oct 26, 2011)

Hope all is well when you check.  But I wouldn't wait a few days though.  You need to know what's in that nest box.  Dead kits need to be removed right away so as to not affect the healthy kits.  

Can't wait to hear the news on color.


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## autumnprairie (Oct 26, 2011)

I went out and snuck a peek 

they all seem to be alive still not sure how many I have counted 6 but there are still more where I was counting and on the left side too maybe 8-12 but I am guessing out of the 6 most had black bodies not pink so does give any idea on color? I want to see them all now but hard to on how we have there cages set up.  



ps these are my meat rabbits I am not suppossed to get attached


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## Ms. Research (Oct 26, 2011)

autumnprairie said:
			
		

> they all seem to be alive still not sure how many I have counted 6 but there are still more where I was counting and on the left side too maybe 8-12 but I am guessing out of the 6 most had black bodies not pink so does give any idea on color? I want to see them all now but hard to on how we have there cages set up.
> 
> ps these are my meat rabbits I am not suppossed to get attached


I would guess black would turn to red.   Buck was White/Red mix.  Buck's genes are tend to override doe's.  So solid red.  Or until you actually see.  White/Red.  

But just learning myself about rabbit genetics, I could be completely wrong.  Took a shot.  Can't wait to hear when you really get a look.


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## autumnprairie (Oct 27, 2011)

Ms. Research said:
			
		

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sorry I may have put that backwards.

the doe is NZ white/red mix  my does  siblings were black,  white, red, brownish colored, patched rather spotted red and white, 


the buck is NZ white










here is a picture of her when she was 8 wks old and a different buck(white)


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## Ms. Research (Oct 27, 2011)

Kit's may have her coloring.   Hoping they have her built as well.   Not even close to an expert on spotting a "meat brick" but I think she's one.  

Congratulations and continued success with your Doe.


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## autumnprairie (Oct 27, 2011)

Ms. Research said:
			
		

> Kit's may have her coloring.   Hoping they have her built as well.   Not even close to an expert on spotting a "meat brick" but I think she's one.
> 
> Congratulations and continued success with your Doe.


The rabbitry I bought my first rabbits from was in Maine SunShine Rabbitry I think it was, he taught us a lot about how to pick my does and how to sex them and the lines I want for my meat rabbits.


He does NZ, Californians and there mixes, and a few others, but the main reason he like the mixes you get a longer and thicker loin and californians throw more kits on average and more docile than the NZ doe


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## Ms. Research (Oct 27, 2011)

autumnprairie said:
			
		

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It's really good to find a breeder that is willing to help out by not just selling quality stock but giving you the knowledge to be successful in your venture.


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## oneacrefarm (Oct 27, 2011)

autumnprairie said:
			
		

> I went out and snuck a peek
> 
> they all seem to be alive still not sure how many I have counted 6 but there are still more where I was counting and on the left side too maybe 8-12 but I am guessing out of the 6 most had black bodies not pink so does give any idea on color? I want to see them all now but hard to on how we have there cages set up.
> 
> ...


Black skin usually means black fur...pink skin can mean white, red, or any number of light colors. Usually, if a rabbit is going to be of the 'broken' variety, you will see this reflected in the skin color as well. Your white rabbit could be carrying ANY kind of color variation as the REW (red eyed white) gene covers up any other colors in that rabbit's genetic mix and does not allow them to be expressed. So, in theory, a white rabbit can have babies of any color that happens to be anywhere in their background.

I cannot stress this enough...you need to get into that nest and remove all the babies and do a thorough count. There could be dead ones on the bottom or squished in the sides. If they start to rot, you will lose your litter. Also, you need to make sure they are being fed, and that means picking them up and looking for full bellies.  Properly caring for a litter does not mean that you are "getting attached." Good rabbit care includes hands on time, every day, for every rabbit.  Especially for those who are new to rabbits. This would not work for a big commercial rabbitry (1000+ rabbits) but for small home rabbitries, it is essential. Rabbits are good at hiding injuries and illnesses, they have to be in the wild.  Maybe your hubs needs to read up a little on rabbit care. Do you have any books? Raising Rabbits the Modern Way by Anna Kanable is a good one.

Congrats on the babies!
Shannon


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## autumnprairie (Oct 27, 2011)

oneacrefarm said:
			
		

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Thanks for the advice and I will let him know.

The actual number of kits is 8. 3 solid black , 1 split colored on the underbelly and 4 pink. all healthy . she has been feeding also. my other doe has made her nest and pulled hair so I am assuming she is bred also.
My california doe is not wanting anything to do with my buck and will bite him if he tries. I will try again in another couple of weeks unless i get other advise. pictures coming soon.


thank you everyone on your advise and help. It is nice to have a place you can go to if you have questions


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## crazyturkeydesigns (Oct 27, 2011)

Congrats!!! Babies are always so exciting! 

The black skinned ones will probably end up black, the white ones white, and the others will most likely look like their mom. Sounds like a bee-u-teeful litter to me


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## autumnprairie (Oct 27, 2011)

crazyturkeydesigns said:
			
		

> Congrats!!! Babies are always so exciting!
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> The black skinned ones will probably end up black, the white ones white, and the others will most likely look like their mom. Sounds like a bee-u-teeful litter to me


and will have another litter from my NZ white doe within the week to 10 days.....

I need better counting and memory skills, better yet a system to keep track  

any suggestions?


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## Ms. Research (Oct 27, 2011)

autumnprairie said:
			
		

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Get yourself a notebook. Write down who was with who. Date.  How many kits.  Their health.  It will help you see the pattern of your does too.  Not just for color but also if the does is kindling the right type of kits to sell for meat.   It's just a good time line to keep to help be successful in actually any breeding.

Hope this helps.


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## autumnprairie (Oct 28, 2011)

Ms. Research said:
			
		

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not sure if I want to sell the meat because of an article I read in May.

http://www.naturalnews.com/032476_rabbits_USDA.html

but getting a notebook tomorrow

that is the article tell me what you think


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## Ms. Research (Oct 28, 2011)

autumnprairie said:
			
		

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Yes I saw that article in May too.  Made me rethink "meat rabbits" too.    Government intervention with the help from special interest groups who receive grants from said government does happen.  And examples have to be made to justify the years of non-action or a different agenda that is placed on the table by the government to be endorsed or even orchestrated by the special interest groups who receive grants from said government.  

My advise to all who sell rabbits.  Research what the laws are and what laws have been petitioned by special interest groups.  Because believe me, the examples will be "Mom and Pop" setups, like the article, who are trying to comply with the laws but aren't truly told what the changes have been made or all the true details pertaining to not only sale but the trend of Protecting this new catagory called meat rabbits.  Because remember, how does the Government give funding to special interest groups.  The information I found out about Superfund sites is from the fines of the guilty.  Viscous cycle, but it is what it is.   And unfortunately sometimes innocent people get swept up in this ugly game. 

Just my opinion.


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## autumnprairie (Oct 28, 2011)

Ms. Research said:
			
		

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I understand that so basically I have decided to give rabbit meat to friends and family at no cost for meat ask for a donation on food and rabbit supplies, nothing illegal in that. Mainly it is just family is interested at this point


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## DKRabbitry (Oct 28, 2011)

First of all... rabbit colors   Genetics are soooooo much fun!  I love reading about it.  Your doe, the brown one in the photo, is an agouti.  Your dark colored kits with the pink bellies will be that color.  MOST of the time when you breed red to another color other than red, you get that agouti color (also called copper, sandy, castor, etc depending on what breed it is).  We had red satins and ended up with a lot of coppers when bred to other colors.  I love breeding white rabbits to colored rabbits because you really get to see what they are hiding.  My NZW buck is actually a Steel.  Almost all of the babies he sires when bred to colored does end up gold tipped steel.  Very pretty I think.  White is a recessive color trait, so if you breed red eyed white to red eyed white you will always end up with white kits.  And like you said, your agouti doe was a red rabbit crossed with a white rabbit, that means that she carries white, which would be why you get white babies when bred to a white or another white carrier.  Pretty neat, eh?  I had to get rid of my satins though because I let myself get too caught up with colors and wanted to keep one of each variety and it got crazy out of hand  LOL now we have two breeds that are all one color, and just a few mutts for me to play with color wise 

Secondly... Do not be affraid to sell your bunnies.  There was a HUGE discussion on the meatrabbits group I am part of when that all went down with the Dohlorites.  They were not selling meat rabbits, they were selling pets to PET STORES.  That was their problem.  IF you sell more than $500 worth to a store you need to USDA licensed by law.  If they would have been selling the rabbits to individual people, it would not have mattered.  I cannot stress enough that you still need to check into laws in your area.  I will tell you I only sell them live, even for meat purposes.  I am not a licensed butcher, nor do I have the facilities to do so to the standards that are needed for that kind of licensing.  To void getting ripped off and people getting breeders at meat price (I charge a lot more for brood stock) I only sell bucks as live meat rabbits.  If it is a friend or family and they really can not stand to butcher, I will sell them a rabbit and then butcher them for free.  As far as I can tell that is not illegal since I am not charging for butchering services, but I still will NOT risk that with people I do not know.  Sad that we have to cover our butts like that... but it's the way it is.


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## DKRabbitry (Oct 28, 2011)

Oh yeah! And I forgot I also wanted to chime in on keeping records... We started out with a notebook.  When we only had a few bunnies that worked great.  But once we got over 5 does, it got harder... then we got pedigreed stock.... and it was rediculous trying to keep track of everything on paper so we ended up just investing in the Rabbit Register.  It is an amazing program that allows you to keep track of pedigrees, breedings, due dates, ages, weights and sooo much more.  If you keep really close track of things, it will even calculate your costs and profits and everything.  We don't use it for that since we mainly just breed for ourselves and a few show rabbits, but the option is there  
More info....  http://evans-software.com/winrbro.shtml


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## Ms. Research (Oct 28, 2011)

DKRabbitry said:
			
		

> Oh yeah! And I forgot I also wanted to chime in on keeping records... We started out with a notebook.  When we only had a few bunnies that worked great.  But once we got over 5 does, it got harder... then we got pedigreed stock.... and it was rediculous trying to keep track of everything on paper so we ended up just investing in the Rabbit Register.  It is an amazing program that allows you to keep track of pedigrees, breedings, due dates, ages, weights and sooo much more.  If you keep really close track of things, it will even calculate your costs and profits and everything.  We don't use it for that since we mainly just breed for ourselves and a few show rabbits, but the option is there
> More info....  http://evans-software.com/winrbro.shtml


Thanks so much for posting this.  Had no idea there was a program for rabbit breeding.  Know you eventually grow out of notebooks,  I was considering just using QuickBook.  That's very versatile for any business.   Basic accounting program that you can adjust to what you need.   Better yet, not to big of a program and not that confusing.  But nice to know there are other choices.  Definitely will take a look at it.


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## DKRabbitry (Oct 28, 2011)

OH OH OH!! (sorry I get a bit excited) ANNNND It shows you the color gentics!!!  Based on what color your rabbit is, and what color their parents are (and you can manually edit it if you know they are a carrier of a recessive color).  And you can do hypothetical pairings, and it will tell you the probably outcome of what color the kits will be.

Originally, I was just going to set up an Excel file, but then DH got looking into this stuff and I am sooo glad we got it (obviously  )
Okay, seriously done now, I NEED to get off here and go milk LOL


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## crazyturkeydesigns (Oct 28, 2011)

DKRabbitry said:
			
		

> OH OH OH!! (sorry I get a bit excited) ANNNND It shows you the color gentics!!!  Based on what color your rabbit is, and what color their parents are (and you can manually edit it if you know they are a carrier of a recessive color).  And you can do hypothetical pairings, and it will tell you the probably outcome of what color the kits will be.
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> Originally, I was just going to set up an Excel file, but then DH got looking into this stuff and I am sooo glad we got it (obviously  )
> Okay, seriously done now, I NEED to get off here and go milk LOL


Hmmm, I have been wanting to get Evans for a loooooooooooong time. Maybe after I sell some of these babies I will 
Anywho, I keep paper records...I sort of like being able to take everything with me when I go to a show or to another breeders...I've got rating sheets for individual animals, buck/doe records, kit records, papers, etc...but a program would be so much easier!!!!

There's a breeding chart floating around the internet somewhere that's really easy to use...if I find it I will post a link


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## oneacrefarm (Oct 28, 2011)

You could also try these:

Cunitec: http://www.agritecsoft.com/en/cunitec/

Kintraks: http://kintraks.com/

Both of these have a free version you can try....

Shannon


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## crazyturkeydesigns (Oct 28, 2011)

oneacrefarm said:
			
		

> You could also try these:
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> Cunitec: http://www.agritecsoft.com/en/cunitec/
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Have you tried these out? Just curious...I would like to have electronic records and I would like different opinions about programs. The thing I like about Evans software is that it lets you do genetics...do these programs have something similar? I didn't see anything but that doesn't mean they don't.
Sorry about thread hijacking!!


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## autumnprairie (Oct 28, 2011)

You guys are great I am excited to see what colors I get and thanks on the tip of selling meat rabbits live.  All the usda stuff came out as I was getting into rabbits and scared me silly.

I will look into all the links that have been posted.

Dk any recommendations on a dairy goat I have boer and ND


 but I think I would like a standard dairy.

I cant see my 3 year old boer letting me milk her or my ND she is 2 and has never been milked either.
how hard is it to learn to milk for me and my goats.

city girl who always wanted to be a farmer


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## DKRabbitry (Oct 28, 2011)

> You could also try these:
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> Cunitec: http://www.agritecsoft.com/en/cunitec/
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The Evans one has a free version too (or at least had one a year ago).  You just can't set it up with your farm name and logo and everything when you print out pedigrees.  I think there were some other limitations but I don't remember what they were.  We just went with the evans because it was recommended to us by someone else... I don't think we ever even looked into the other ones LOL... we aren't the best at shopping around... I see something I like and just dive 




> Dk any recommendations on a dairy goat I have boer and ND
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That is a loaded question!  Of COURSE I am going to recommend lamanchas, because that is what I have and I love them dearly... buuuut, I suggest getting involved in the goat section here (if you aren't already) and search the archives, this same question is asked quite a bit, and they give a lot of good info on each breed, but what breed you get boils down to what you personally like or have available to you (I set out looking for nubians, came across Lamanchas for sale, and am hooked)
As far as learning how to milk, that is... well a learning experience   I have only had the goats a year, and it is so funny looking back at how hard it was for me to get milk to come out in the beginning!  I have found that each new goat you milk is a little different, and you may need to take a little different approach, and their teats will all be different and milk out differently.  My first goat I milked was 2 and had never been milked or stantion trained before and had little teats, and little orficices and was a kicking fiend, and we just sort of worked at it.  I don't see why you couldn't milk your current girls with some training.  Now, she can run out of grain and she will just stand chewing her cud till I'm done.   But yeah, I'm kind of a newbie at the whole goat thing


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## Rabbitbreeder (Jan 4, 2017)

Congrats on the babies, however I am also having a problem with my rabbits producing, any suggestions? I have 3 different bucks and 9 does, 1 buck and 2 does are lop


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## Latestarter (Jan 5, 2017)

Greetings and welcome to BYH @Rabbitbreeder   Glad you joined us! We have quite a few active rabbiteers here including meat/pet/pelt/show. The thread you responded to was last posted to way back in October 2011  Honestly, there's only one person on this thread that's still active; @autumnprairie and though she was last on yesterday, she hasn't posted since Oct 2016 and early 2015 before that. (We miss her & hope she's well!) There's a lot of information, experience and knowledge available in the various threads in the rabbit section. Please browse around and make yourself at home! In doing so you'll get to know some of our other members as well through their posts. Please consider taking a moment and posting an introduction in the New Member section so we can welcome you properly! Oh, and as an aside, most of us are picture addicts, so if you'd be so kind as to share some, we'd all be very appreciative. One other thing... It would be really helpful if you'd put your (general) location in your profile as any questions you ask, the answers will often depend on where you're located (climate).


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## autumnprairie (Jan 5, 2017)

Rabbitbreeder said:


> Congrats on the babies, however I am also having a problem with my rabbits producing, any suggestions? I have 3 different bucks and 9 does, 1 buck and 2 does are lop


What are their ages? It really depends on their environment and their age, young bucks can be a hit or miss, does can be finicky and not like the buck have any of your does ever had a litter?


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## Latestarter (Jan 5, 2017)

HI! Good to see you back   It's been a very long time... I hope all is well with you & yours. Hope you'll stop in and visit some of the other threads and say HI.  Happy New Year!


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## autumnprairie (Jan 5, 2017)

Latestarter said:


> HI! Good to see you back   It's been a very long time... I hope all is well with you & yours. Hope you'll stop in and visit some of the other threads and say HI.  Happy New Year!


We are doing well thanks. Happy New Year to you as well. I miss being on here so who knows you may see me more of me.


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