# Should we breed a doe with supernumerary teats?



## savingdogs (Feb 4, 2010)

My husband and I bought three baby dairy goats in the fall to start a small dairy production for family consumption and making cheese and soap, and have pets who clear our brush. We got triplets, a wether (more as their leader and friend), Ginger, the extra-teated doeling, and Molly, a nice uddered doeling. Barn is small, mini mixes were in our budget. Ours are super lovely friendly sweet, can't say enough about their personalities, they are cross breeds (nubian mixed with 3/4 ND 1/4 pygmie).

We were informed by the seller that having the extra teats was not desireable on Ginger and we got an excellent deal, but now that I've read some of what people have written on BYH about avoiding them, I wonder, should I even plan to breed Ginger? I do not have a buck.

Ginger is a much more easily handled goat than Molly and lets us handle her udders and feet more easily. The extra teats look like they would not prevent the primary teats from working. I'm not really familiar with this issue however. And we will be learning to milk.

Our goal was to keep a couple of Molly's offspring (Molly is adorable). However Molly is small so we thought to breed her to something pretty small for her first freshening (lotsa pygmie bucks around here) and probably not keep her first offspring. We'd like to breed her the second time to a mini nubian the second time and hopefully get a nice female to keep. Maybe look like her but with nubian ears (Molly has airplane).

However with Ginger who is larger we would want to breed her right to a mini nubian if we were planning on keeping her offspring especially. However I would not want to breed more super numerary teated goats.
Is there a breed that has them less I could cross her with if I do breed her? What I'd really like is to get a nice female mini nubian type with nice udders and nubian ears from her the first year I breed her but wonder if that is just wishful thinking. 
Freemotion, I was really hoping you would chime in here and almost private messaged you because I think you would be great at advising us here. 
I'd be happy to cross Ginger with any suggested breed that would get me a useful animal. I would be hoping to sell the wethers as brush eaters (I know, wishful thinking, but we do live in blackberry country where goats are useful). That is, if I can milk Ginger.

I do have many months to think this through still......but I'm at the research stage and don't want to breed undesireable animals. 

Hopefully those of you with more experience than I can give me some good advice here, I could use it.


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## Roll farms (Feb 5, 2010)

Extra teats are a crapshoot...You can breed her to a 2 teated buck and try for kids w/out extra teats, but there's just no guarantee you won't get extra teats.

I've never had a dairy kid born w/ extra teats, only boers and kikos...so I would assume (however dangerous that may be) that there isn't a strong genetic background for extra teats in your goat, so *maybe* that would improve your chances of correcting it w/ a good, 2-teated buckling.

If you do get a doeling w/ extras, you can always sell her as a pet, same as a wether....just a thought.

I'd be tempted to ask the breeders which 'side' she got the extras from, the P / ND side or the Nub side.


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## ()relics (Feb 5, 2010)

If you are thinking that these new goats are going to be the foundation stock of your herd, I wouldn't take the chance of breeding her...If you are building your herd you want to start with the best animals you can because eventually all your herd will be related to these first doelings...Undoubtedly somewhere along the way, and it may be years from now, you will run into multiple teated youngsters and will look back and regret not culling her...JMO...I'm not a dairy goat person, but I know alittle about genetics and herd building...Yeah she may throw correctly teated kids but will her kids and her kids and her kids all throw correct kids.  Not a chance to take if they are foundation stock....again JMO


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## savingdogs (Feb 5, 2010)

()relics said:
			
		

> If you are thinking that these new goats are going to be the foundation stock of your herd, I wouldn't take the chance of breeding her...If you are building your herd you want to start with the best animals you can because eventually all your herd will be related to these first doelings...Undoubtedly somewhere along the way, and it may be years from now, you will run into multiple teated youngsters and will look back and regret not culling her...JMO...I'm not a dairy goat person, but I know alittle about genetics and herd building...Yeah she may throw correctly teated kids but will her kids and her kids and her kids all throw correct kids.  Not a chance to take if they are foundation stock....again JMO


This was somewhat my concern (after reading the story on fiascofarms especially). It is just such a shame she has such a good personality. I suppose I could breed her with the intent of selling all her offspring as pets. Our area does support alot of goats. If she passes on her good personality that would be a plus.

My goats were an accidental mating but the nubian dad was the one they keep for breeding their nubians and the mom had normal teats (they were milking her). I didn't think to ask about what kind of teats the sire throws for their nubians but I can ask them.


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## freemotion (Feb 5, 2010)

Didn't see a PM.....

I am certainly not experienced with this, but of course, I do have an opinion!   I can just say what I would do.

I probably wouldn't breed her, unless the market for pet goats is really strong in your area.  It isn't here.  The market for meat goats is very strong in my area, and even a dairy goat can be sold in a heartbeat if one is willing to take $50 just to be rid of the extra mouths to feed.  I'm not so sure I could sell the female offspring of my favorite doe for meat, as pragmatic as I try to be.

On the other hand, if I were willing to keep the offspring myself as pets for the next 15 years, I might try for two teated doelings.  I would try to sell them as pets if they had extra teats, but would have to be prepared to keep them if the market is not there.

What you decide to do is really dependent on what YOU are willing to put up with, IMO.  I do understand wanting offspring from a special animal, imperfections and all.

I am planning on attempting to raise the bucklings for meat and the doelings for sale or to keep.  It was a different matter when I was a kid myself and didn't have to make the decisions.  Right now, my buckling will be going to freezer camp and it breaks my heart.  I wish he was an obnoxious pest.  It would be much easier.


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## doublebow (Feb 6, 2010)

For myself I wouldn't risk it unless I knew that the babies would be going for meat. If you sell a goat as a pet there is no guarantee that she won't be bred.


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## savingdogs (Feb 6, 2010)

Gosh, I think I'm learning that we should not breed her. 

While I see alot of brush eating goats around, I'm a little inexperienced to know if there is a good market for dairy goats that are pets, to be perfectly honest. I would think okay. I see Boers around here alot more for brush eating, not goats like mine. 

I don't have the resources to "put up" with much, like Freemotion says....I did not PM you my dear, I knew you would find this thread, I always wait to see how you will chime in on most topics and enjoy your posts on these forums. I feel a little embarrassed bugging people with my amateur questions!


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## currycomb (Feb 7, 2010)

sorry, i don't agree with culling because of the teat issue. breed her to a clean 2 teated buck. folks around here with the multi teated boers cross on nubian bucks to " clean-up" the offspring. i have personally seen it work. had a beautiful nubian doe, judges loved her, until the checked her udders. even had one judge tell us to go get the extra teats removed!!! no, won't put her thru that, she had clean teated does for us for 3 years(sold her, new owner wasn't concerned)


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## savingdogs (Feb 7, 2010)

Are there degrees of this problem? I can't imagine how you could surgically remove Ginger's extra teats without changing the integrity of her udders radically. Perhaps I need to try to photograph them for y'all. I'm laughing a little picturing myself trying to get my camera under her belly. Perhaps my son could hold her front legs up and someone else spread her hair? I can just imagine how she would like that (not!). 

The way I would describe it is she has two extra teats, on the outer side of the udder, that ride higher up on the side of the udder and are smaller than the main teats by at least a third or a half. The udder itself has an altered shape from my other female.

I do want to MILK this doe. The people we purchased her from said we "probably" could milk her fine. I do think they were not trying to scam us, they disclosed this to us when we didn't know what to look for prior to making the sale. They said we would just milk the primary teats. 

The nicely uddered doeling is much more skittish about letting us touch her teats and we have been working on that every night. Guess we better work harder! But the main purpose of purchasing these doelings was to milk them so I'll be a little dissapointed if we have two we are feeding as company for the one useful one who may be harder to milk. 

I really do not want to raise dairy goats as meat animals. However, I do live in the land where blackberry rules the county. People around here like goats.


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## Roll farms (Feb 7, 2010)

Sometimes the extra teats get in the way, sometimes they don't.
Sometimes they produce milk, which makes it harder to aim for the milk bucket....sometimes they don't.

Honestly, in your shoes, I'd breed her to a buck I was SURE had no extra teats in his history and give it a shot.  Try milking her and see how she does.
(Since you'll probably not be marketing to a "show doe" buyer, the folks who buy your kids may not even care about the teats.)

AND...keep in mind that a doe can be kicky when unbred or even close to due, and turn out to be a fine milker, and a doe who never kicks beforehand, might be a mean doe on the stand.  

Don't judge their future milkstand behavior before they're tried out.


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## savingdogs (Feb 7, 2010)

Wow! I'm learning so much on here. Thanks everyone. What would I do without you? My husband and I have so much more valuable food for thought now. 

I think alot may depend on our opportunity to find inexpensive bucks to breed to. Since I don't want to keep any of my own, the stud fee for Ginger to be bred might not be worth the "crap shoot". However perhaps if I could find a nice candidate for her easily I could give it a try. I'm thinking maybe pygmie if anything so if I end up feeding them very long it won't cost me as much. I don't want to be the "pet home" myself as I chose small goats because I have a small barn.

I started as a lurker on BYC and now I'm a total addict of all the sister sites.


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