# Escape artist, who should I kill first?



## dianneS (May 2, 2012)

I told my husband years ago that I didn't want goats because I remember how horrible my goats were when I was a kid.  They were awful.  These goats embodied _everything _bad that you hear about goats.

Well, somehow we now have 11 goats.  Never had a problem with any of these guys.  No one walking on cars, no one escaping, no one eating our landscape plants, no one breaking into the feed room.  They've all been great.  Until recently....

I have two bottle baby girls, toggenburg/nubian/boer doelings, and one of the girls has figured out how to get under the fence.  She can find a way out just about anywhere.  If you fix one spot where she escaped, she just finds a new one.  She can squeeze through the tiniest spaces too!  I figured as she got bigger she's have a harder time getting under the fence but noooooooooooooo, she's actually getting more skilled at it!  

Problem is this all began because my husband has been reinforcing this behavior by rewarding her with treats, and time in the yard.  He even held her up to one of our landscape bushes and let her nibble it all she wanted!  

I come home today to find my bush in the yard, *completely stripped of leaves*, all but the very top, and guess who's out running loose?  You guessed it!  The little escapee is at it again!  I threw her in the chicken coop tonight, I got so mad, I can't keep her contained anywhere.  She gets out of the barn, horse stalls, fences, you name it.  All I do is chase this goat, and now that she knows I'm mad at her, she runs from me, so I do have to _chase _her..... grrrrrrrr...  

I don't know who to kill first?  The goat for escaping?  Or my husband for encouraging it, and teaching her to eat our landscape plants? (We have plenty of pasture and forage for them, they have no need to be going after ornamental bushes)

I'm so mad right now I could scream!  Is there any hope at keeping this one contained, or will she always be a brat?  Should I just post her on craigslist now and get it over with before she makes me completely insane, or should I file for divorce?


----------



## Siouxqie (May 2, 2012)

I'm sorry, while I feel your pain, it still made me chuckle.  I think I might consider putting her on craigslist if she is making you that nuts.  With my mini donk, Leonard, I constantly threaten to get rid of him, because he's a pain in the you know.  But it's kind of a love-hate thing, because I have to admit, a part of me finds his antics and personality endearing.  We had some boer/nubian crosses a few years back that I got rid of for many of the same reasons you're describing.  Only instead of sneaking out, they were flattening our fences and breaking them down.  Good luck to you!


----------



## redtailgal (May 2, 2012)

Try adding an electric fence to train the goat.  Try an electric collar on the husband.

Keep them both in the barn until the situation is resolved.


----------



## SDBoerGoats (May 2, 2012)

HAHA Redtail, that made me laugh.  And so did the story about the escape artist.
 I came home one afternoon to find the Boer/Nubian cross in the front yard, with her twins, stripping the needles off my weeping white pine. I was furious. They were turned out in the barn area where there is tons of forage and weeds, etc. I had fencing OVER TOP of my lodge pole fence so they couldn't get in. Still, she found a way. Part of is, I am convinced, is the Nubian in her. She is stubborn and head strong.
 BUT I love her to death, she has beautiful babies. She THINKS she is the Queen, and when she is in the playground area with all the does and babies (a huge play area my son in law made out of tractor tires, he put thick plywood inside them, and also rail road ties for steps) Spicey gets on the highest platform, and stands there, sometimes for hours, over looking things. Like a statue. The other day she lay down and surveyed. I will never sell her, but she has made me mad enough that I have made up a few new 4 letter words.


----------



## manybirds (May 2, 2012)

i'm sorry but i LOATH nubians. and i'm not a fan of boers or toggs either. I would get rid of her. i have a problem nubian right now. i would get rid of the little beast in a heart beat but unfortunatly he was given to us by a friend and they like to keep updated   so he's here. he's 2 years now and just gets worse. let her go or have a nice goat roast


----------



## dianneS (May 3, 2012)

The thing is that she has a twin sister who is perfectly well mannered?  No problems with that one at all and you'd think she'd want to follow her sister under the fence, but she doesn't, she always stays put and is not nearly as obnoxious.

I put her on craigslist.  My husband doesn't want me to get rid of her.  I got two responses to my ad so far, and I'm afraid to respond... I feel bad getting rid of her.  She's driving me crazy, but I bottle raised her, know what I mean?  Maybe when she's totally weaned, she will bond more with the herd and stop escaping and bugging me to death every time I'm within view?


----------



## SuburbanFarmChic (May 3, 2012)

If she's still a bottle baby that changes the scenario a bit.  Ours follow us around like little hopping shadows and are terribly upset if we are in view but not in tasting distance. Because my pants might have milk on them or something. 

 Ours seem to settle down about 2-4 weeks after weaning.  They are still very excited to see us but it is less frantic.


----------



## dianneS (May 3, 2012)

SuburbanFarmChic said:
			
		

> If she's still a bottle baby that changes the scenario a bit.  Ours follow us around like little hopping shadows and are terribly upset if we are in view but not in tasting distance. Because my pants might have milk on them or something.
> 
> Ours seem to settle down about 2-4 weeks after weaning.  They are still very excited to see us but it is less frantic.


I'm working on weaning them now.  My husband wants me to give her a second chance.  If I do, he is going to have to run some electric fence because I'm not doing it!


----------



## SuburbanFarmChic (May 3, 2012)

Electric makes a BIG difference in exactly how much the little monkeys escape.


----------



## dianneS (May 3, 2012)

SuburbanFarmChic said:
			
		

> Electric makes a BIG difference in exactly how much the little monkeys escape.


My only problem is that part of their pasture is my riding arena and I didn't want that wire down low where the horses could get tangled in it.  Maybe I could do something temporary until she learns her lesson, and when she's bigger and can't fit under the fence, I could take it down and see how it goes?


----------



## Pearce Pastures (May 3, 2012)

redtailgal said:
			
		

> Try adding an electric fence to train the goat.  Try an electric collar on the husband.
> 
> Keep them both in the barn until the situation is resolved.




Or maybe clicker train him.


----------



## marliah (May 3, 2012)

Growing up our Nubians were like that, I'm too annoyed at the memory of them to ever own another one lol  that's why we have Nigerian dwarfs, they seem to be content in their pen and aren't big enough to jump the fence, or at least haven't tried. Our Nubians when I was a girl would take a running leap right over a 4 ft fence, nothing would keep them in!


----------



## dianneS (May 3, 2012)

marliah said:
			
		

> Growing up our Nubians were like that, I'm too annoyed at the memory of them to ever own another one lol  that's why we have Nigerian dwarfs, they seem to be content in their pen and aren't big enough to jump the fence, or at least haven't tried. Our Nubians when I was a girl would take a running leap right over a 4 ft fence, nothing would keep them in!


Oh great.  This little one is already flinging herself at the fence and she's almost able to reach the top rail!  She's only 18 inches tall!  Probably once she is too big to get under the fence, she'll just start going over.  Wonderful....


----------



## SDBoerGoats (May 3, 2012)

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Sorry Diane, but that really made me laugh out loud! yep, you fix one thing and they figure out another. I truly do believe that Nubians are hard headed and stubborn. Maybe her sister got more Boer in her! LOL! My Boers don't mess with fences, they are content where they are put. They wouldn't dream of jumping, but Spicey and her kids???? Oh my. But like I said, I love her. She's not as bad as yours sounds, as long as she gets what she wants....ah hem......


----------



## dianneS (May 3, 2012)

> Maybe her sister got more Boer in her!


I think she does.  You can actually see it in her face, she looks more Boer than the other.

The little brat was out of the fence at least three times today.  The only good thing is that she doesn't stray far from the fence, she does stay as near to the other goats as she can.  If the herd moves away from her, she will scoot back under the fence and go with them.  However, if I step outside the house and she sees me, well then she comes bounding up to me yelling like a nut... until she sees that I'm mad, then she puts on the breaks and heads the other way.  Then a wonderful chase ensues... such fun.


----------



## gigiintheforest (May 11, 2012)

I'm laughing so hard - sorry.  Just thinking of it as making memories - ha, ha, ha.


----------



## bonbean01 (May 12, 2012)

Red....you are too funny!!!!!  I'd go with her suggestion...


----------



## dianneS (May 12, 2012)

Pearce Pastures said:
			
		

> redtailgal said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I like the shock collar idea.  That might work, although sometimes punishment training only causes him to rebel even more.  

  Clicker training may work better.  He responds well to positive reinforcement.  If I used oreos or nutter butters as treats it would probably be a big success.  Hmmmm, think of all the behavior I could modify to work to my advantage....


----------



## redtailgal (May 12, 2012)

Let me know how it works out..........husbands can be awful hard to train.  I've had mine for 20 years, and was ready to cause permanent damage just the other day.

At least he is house broken now, thats a start.


----------



## rascal (May 12, 2012)

dianneS said:
			
		

> Pearce Pastures said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Can I send you mine for training???


----------



## WhiteMountainsRanch (May 12, 2012)

dianneS said:
			
		

> SuburbanFarmChic said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


*

Where are you I'll take her! I HEART  Nubians!  *


----------



## sawfish99 (May 15, 2012)

It's legal to eat goat.


----------



## Mossy Stone Farm (May 17, 2012)




----------



## Citylife (May 18, 2012)

How incouraging this discussion is.  LOLOLOLOL   my baby nubians are almost a month old and flinging their bodies against the shed next to them and already 1/2 crazy.  My little "kenya" is even learning how to untie knots and bum rush you at the gate to get out.  Sure wish they would start to play with my cocker spaniels.......  that would at least tire them a bit.  
With electric fencing, how many strands are best and about how high do you place them?


----------



## dianneS (May 20, 2012)

Citylife said:
			
		

> How incouraging this discussion is.  LOLOLOLOL   my baby nubians are almost a month old and flinging their bodies against the shed next to them and already 1/2 crazy.  My little "kenya" is even learning how to untie knots and bum rush you at the gate to get out.  Sure wish they would start to play with my cocker spaniels.......  that would at least tire them a bit.
> With electric fencing, how many strands are best and about how high do you place them?


My babies will be 11 weeks old in two days.  They are weaned now and not driving me as crazy anymore.  However, the one girl is still escaping.  She doesn't stray far from the fence and will go back in if the other goats wander too far from her.

I was going to run a strand of electric along the bottom of my woven wire field fence that is tacked to my 4 rail, split rail horse fence.  I just have to keep this one little bugger from sneaking under the woven wire fence, so one strand along the bottom should suffice.  I don't know how many strands you would need of just electric fence alone to keep goats in?  Probably a lot!  The only type of goat I know that will stay contained with two or three strands of electric fence are fainting goats.


----------



## jimhammer1 (May 30, 2012)

I too have an escape artist to include up and over a 6 foot fence.  Electric has stopped it and makes me stay alert, as well.   A strand at the top and one at the bottom about a foot off the ground.  They stay away from the fence.


----------



## currycomb (May 30, 2012)

don't let my goats read about your goats! i have nubians and they stay behind their fences like good girls. the fainter was the escape artist, but the dogs kept her away from ornamentals and the front yard.(sold the fainter and the bottle babies, too much drama, and someone else wanted them)


----------



## dianneS (May 31, 2012)

currycomb said:
			
		

> don't let my goats read about your goats! i have nubians and they stay behind their fences like good girls. the fainter was the escape artist, but the dogs kept her away from ornamentals and the front yard.(sold the fainter and the bottle babies, too much drama, and someone else wanted them)


Huh, the fainter was the escape artist?  I thought fainters were supposed to be easier to contain?  I guess you never know with goats!


----------



## Roll farms (May 31, 2012)

It's the Togg in her making her obnoxious.  We couldn't keep Toggs in, our Nubs and boers never get out.

And now....I have a half togg/half boer kid to worry about b/c....DH loves her.

MEN!


----------



## dianneS (May 31, 2012)

Roll farms said:
			
		

> It's the Togg in her making her obnoxious.  We couldn't keep Toggs in, our Nubs and boers never get out.
> 
> And now....I have a half togg/half boer kid to worry about b/c....DH loves her.
> 
> MEN!


Really?  DH loves this one too.  

She's not very bright either.  One of those goats that gets so excited about things that she doesn't even acknowledge potential danger and such... if you know the type, you know what I mean.  Like jumping and bouncing around in unsafe situations completely oblivious to the fact that she could break a leg.  She takes no notice of the dog growling at her when she gets too near his food, and eventually ends up _standing* in*_ the dogs food dish trying to climb the fence... dog growls and snaps, finally chasing stupid goat away (now covered in slobber, thankfully not blood... yet), but does she learn???   Noooooooooo, she comes right back for more.  She's going to get herself killed.

Just no common sense in this one at all.


----------



## rjpcr (Jun 23, 2012)

im fairly new to backyardherding.  i have two ndg does in milk, one kidding next month ,  and one alpine doeling kidding in two months.  i think it is a good idea to get rid of problem livestock although i know it can be difficult.  however,  the well being of the entire herd (including your human tribe) has to be taken into consideration.  personally i would not sell  problem livestock. the perfect home is going to be your only selling option.   i would have to consider the option of  termination if the problem is really troublesome.


----------



## CochinBrahmaLover=) (Jun 23, 2012)

dianneS said:
			
		

> Pearce Pastures said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


No, what you do is if hes being 'good' give him a soft Oreo. If hes being great, give him a water gun  


I read the thread, and I kept thinking "Oh crap oh crap i have 2 nubians" ...  ... Hehe... I have 2 nigerians...  I THOUGHT THEY WERE THE SAME THING!!


----------



## SarahOS (Jun 27, 2012)

Can you safely hobble goats out at pasture for a few hours a day?  We have 3 rescue goats which were ill treated in different ways and are now all repaired and well and easy to handle - BUT - they escape from everything!!!!  We have lovely pastures with thick hedges full of delicious browse and would like the goats to graze with the sheep & llamas during the day.  They need sunshine & fresh air and pick your own food but nothing we do keeps them in.  Electric fencing just isn't an option, all our fields are 20 acres plus.

Surely someone sells modern, safer versions of old fashioned hobbles.  It was common practice in days gone by, and now we know why!!  We have been tethering just so they get some fresh air & browse, but it is a time consuming nightmare and far from the perfect solution.  Would be very grateful if anyone knows of a supplier of hobbles (rather than those used to stop milk goats kicking) or knows of a good design that we could get a saddler to make up.  Thanks


----------

