# weight at 4 weeks...



## VickieB (Jun 13, 2013)

I just read a blog from RRR on their meat rabbits.   "The weight of a litter at three weeks of age helps the caretaker evaluate how well the doe is milking. Any doe whose kits do not consistently weigh at least one pound at three weeks of age should be culled. "   

Is this about an average weight? I didn't weigh mine at 3 weeks, but did at 4. I have 2 litters that are now 5 weeks old (my first litters). The kits in one litter are obviously larger than the ones in the second litter (they were all born within 30 minutes of each other). The larger ones averaged 15.5 oz, and the smaller ones averaged about 14.1 oz. But this was at 4 weeks, which would make them at least 1 week behind. How many of you weigh your kits at these ages, and what do you find their average weight to be at?


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## P.O. in MO (Jun 13, 2013)

What RRR posted does make a lot of sense.  I am fairly new at this too and have only butchered one litter of 7 and have a 4 litter and 10 litter growing out now.  Only one left in the freezer and it's going soon.  At this stage I am just trying to keep myself supplied with rabbit meat.  I don't weigh mine until they get close to butcher age but after reading this I probably should start so I know which does are producing the most cost effective offspring.  I only have 2 breeding does now, so culling wouldn't be an option at this point anyway.  I have 2 more does and 1 buck from totally different stock that will be ready to start breeding around the first of August so at that point I would be in a position to worry more about productivity and less about what's for dinner.  Don't know if this helped much but maybe you are in the same situation at this point in your rabbit raising.  It was a good question and am interested in what others have to add to this topic.   PO


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## VickieB (Jun 13, 2013)

Actually, P.O. you seem to further along in your rabbit ranching days than I am. I've had 4 litters so far, but my oldest is only 5 weeks old, so we still have some time before our first dispatch date. I have 4 does and 1 buck. I had heard that 2 to 3 does was good to start with, and it's just my husband, me and 2 sons (18 and 21), but I was going to be raising some for my daughter's family too, so I decided I'd start with 4 and then adjust if needed. 

I'm wanting to make the best use of my rabbits too. We live in town and so it's important that I keep the number of breeders down to a minimum. You mentioned breeding in August... I'm down here in Oklahoma and it's way too hot to be breeding that time of year. I've shut down shop for the buck for the season, and we won't be able to start back up until October. Do you have yours under AC or do you just have cooler summers? I would love to be able to continue, but we've been hit with such a heat spell this week and I think it's going to stay warm now until fall. 

Have you been collecting some good recipes? If so, make sure you post them!


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## P.O. in MO (Jun 14, 2013)

I have an insulated shed with a dirt floor. I have a 14 inch ventilator fan in one end and a screen door (varmint proof) in the other.  I also have a couple of box fans hanging from the ceiling over my cages just to make some breeze. I did put a small AC unit in it because it does get hot around here sometimes (like last summer). I have double stacked cages so I can keep all my rabbits at one end of the shed in a small area. I use a couple of old quilted bedspreads to block off the rest of the shed where I keep my feed, hay and all that other stuff you need along with some space for expansion if I want so I don't waste any electricity cooling that. So I am only cooling an area 15 feet long by 10 feet wide and 7 feet tall. It got up to about 94 a couple of days ago and went out around 2 PM and it was getting close to 85 degrees which I have read is starting to get dangerous.  They were definitely just laying around panting.  I turned it on high for a couple of hours and got it below 80 and then turned it down to low.  I ran it til the sun went down and the watt meter I hooked up said I used 65 cents worth of electricity.

I may be looking at this wrong but it seems to me that when I get all 4 does of age and a buck that 's 5 rabbits eating 5 oz. each of feed a day for a total of 1.56 lbs. at around 31 cents a lb.  That's 48 cents a day to feed these rabbits.  If I turn on the AC it means I will be feeding pregnant or nursing rabbits so it is not a wasted 48 cents so some of that pays the electric bill.  Like I said I am new at this but I have a litter due June 26 and then another about a week later.  I will keep the temp from going over 80 and see what happens and what it costs. 

I am sure I will eventually reach a point where I know how many I will eat in a month and can get ahead when it's cool and not need to breed in July and August. But then again if I don't have any problems I could cut down on does and just breed straight thru the summer.  I have some friends that are wanting some too so that's part of what I am doing. 

Anyway, good luck with your litters.  PO


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## P.O. in MO (Jun 16, 2013)

Wanted to add one more thought to this post.  When using AC you lose the ventilation required to keep the ammonia smell down.  When I use the AC I need to clean dropping pans daily including a good rinsing.  I turn off AC in evening when it's cooling off and open up the shed and turn on the fan but if it gets hot enough to use it again the next afternoon I clean pans before closing up and cooling.  PO


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## VickieB (Jun 16, 2013)

You're not getting any sympathy from me, P.O.!    My rabbits are sitting on my back porch. They have plenty of ventilation, but they do start to stinking soon, and attracting flies. I wash down my pans daily, or it would be unbearable. The one mystery I have to solve is: Why is it that rabbit poo can smell so bad while in a tray under the rabbit, but go throw it in your shade garden and the smell instantly dissipates?  I have 3 months of rabbit poo in my garden and if you walk by it you would never know. 1 day of rabbit poo in a drop pan, and you can't sit on the back porch!


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## P.O. in MO (Jun 16, 2013)

I know what you mean.  Before I got into raising rabbits I bought 4 butchered fryers from a breeder just to make sure I liked them.  He had at least 50 rabbits in his barn.  There was poop 16 inches deep under his cages with a dirt floor and it really didn't smell bad.  I have a dirt floor in my shed but decided to go with the pans cause I want all the poop for my garden too.  Great stuff.  I clean my pans into a 5 gal. bucket then dump that into another 5 gal. bucket with a hole in the bottom and drain all the urine and water they spill into a jug.  Kind of a urine and manure tea.  I mix this with water so its about the color of tea and have been using it on some of any of my plants that I can put it on without getting it on what I am going to eat.  I call it GO JUICE!  Been doing it once a week.  I have a couple of tomato plants I can sacrifice and have been increasing the dosage just to see how much they can take.  Everything looks real healthy and green.  The weather this spring was so cool tomatoes didn't get in til mid may but i may still have some by 4th of July I hope.  I save up the manure in a 55 gal drum and when it's full I run it thru a shredder and mix it with horse manure compost and add to my raised beds.  I can really tell the difference from last year when I just had the horse manure compost.  Rabbit manure was another reason I chose rabbits for meat.  I raise chickens for eggs but the first time I cleaned the coop and put everything in a compost bin next to my garden within 2 days I couldn't stand to work in the garden.  The smell was terrible.  I had to move the pile downwind a couple hundred feet.   Much prefer working with rabbit manure, not nearly as nasty.  The chicken manure and composted chicken manure just gets spread on my regular dirt garden in the fall and tilled in to mellow out over the winter.


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## Citylife (Jun 20, 2013)

I have been raising rabbits for a bit over 4 years now.  I do not weigh them until they are butchered and in a freezer bag.  My average 10 week old runs at butcher weight around 2-2 1/2 lbs.  @ 12 weeks around 3-3 1/2 lbs.  I do NOT know what their live weight is.  I have a buck on hold who comes from NZ lines who will give you a 5 lb live weight at 5 weeks of age.  I am looking forward to seeing if that is true!  As I am a bit skeptical to say the least.                  My problem is..........  my pure NZW does are on the small side (8 lbs or so) so I do not know if they will handle the milk load.  What I do know, is they are great mothers and tend to have 10-12 kits and raise them.  I am looking forward to seeing if there is a difference.  If so, I will most likely be buying more stock from this lady.  
I do not expect my American Blues to produce like that as they have not been bred for commercial production like the NZ's and CA's.

I am in KC,MO and we have some really hot temperatures so my rabbitry has a small a/c unit in the summer time.  I do breed all year round so the rabbits need a bit extra care.
I occasionally butcher at 8 weeks and have a 1 1/2 lb  rabbit most of the time.  I am happy with that for my family as there is just two of us.  It will feed us two meals.  
I to use the manure in my gardens..........  it is wonderful stuff.


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## VickieB (Jun 20, 2013)

CityLife, how many rabbits do you have? I have my 4 does and 1 buck, BUT the babies are really beginning to grow and to be honest, I'm getting a little nervous. I have 17 babies that are out of their nests, and they are getting nice size, along with 19 in the nest boxes that will be coming out within the week. I know that is what I wanted, but now that I'm here I have developed this fear that the city is going to find out and y'all will see my face posted on the 6 o'clock news as the crazy rabbit lady, and the city dragging my dinners away...

You'll have to let us know how the new buck does! 5 lbs at 5 weeks would be amazing!


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## nawma (Jun 20, 2013)

Im in the desert of West Texas. We have 95 to 100 degree days from mid May till mid to late Sept. My rabbits are in a 14x14 ft cinderblock well house. We put a big evaporative cooler in because the room was up around 90 degree days when I got my rabbits last Sept. I started with 8 does and 3 bucks. We produced 82 buns this last fall and winter. I still have 15 in two grow out cages and we have been harvesting 4 or 5 every weekend for awhile now. Im not breeding this time of year as I have more than enough for our needs till late fall. I too catch my poop and feed my garden as well as pecan and fruit trees with it. Am using the urine in compost bin and it has really starting the composting to excellerate. So everything gets used but the hides. Havent the courage yet to try to tan a hide.  I hope this next fall to keep better records of bun weights and feed costs so I can make good decisions about breeders. Helps to know you guys are on the learning curve too. Have learned so much here on this forum.


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## P.O. in MO (Jun 20, 2013)

Not only amazing but cost effective too.  You definitely have to keep us posted on how this turns out.  Even if it was 5 lbs. at 8 weeks would still be good.  Yesterday I butchered a litter of 4(her first) and I don't check live wt. either but the whole litter dressed out weighed 13 lbs. 6 oz. which averages out to 3 lbs. 5 1/2 ozs. each.  They were a day under 11 weeks.  I have a litter of 10 that will be 10 weeks on 7/2 and weighed one today at 3 lbs. 7 ozs.  They are going to have to hurry to make 5 lbs. at 10 weeks.  I am keeping track of feed on this batch and will post how it turns out when it's over.

Will be watching the news to see if they raid the Crazy Rabbit Lady.  I wouldn't worry too much, usually people only complain about noise or smell and you said you rinse pans everyday so you should be ok.  Sounds like you will have a bunch in the freezer soon.  PO


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## Citylife (Jun 25, 2013)

VickieB said:
			
		

> CityLife, how many rabbits do you have? I have my 4 does and 1 buck, BUT the babies are really beginning to grow and to be honest, I'm getting a little nervous. I have 17 babies that are out of their nests, and they are getting nice size, along with 19 in the nest boxes that will be coming out within the week. I know that is what I wanted, but now that I'm here I have developed this fear that the city is going to find out and y'all will see my face posted on the 6 o'clock news as the crazy rabbit lady, and the city dragging my dinners away...
> 
> You'll have to let us know how the new buck does! 5 lbs at 5 weeks would be amazing!


VickiB,
I have a Sr. CA buck who throws kits with a ton of meat, a 1/2 ca 1/2 nzw Sr. Doe who is his partner.  They are great together.  (I was switching breeds and ended up with a tad bit of a mix.)  she has had 4 litters of 8 and has raised 4 litters of 8.  She is a great mom and gets visually upset at weaning time.  5 kits left from one litter and she is also due again in 2 days.  I will butcher who is not sold next week.

1 Pure NZW Sr.  buck and 2 Sr. does.  ( 10-12 Kits per litters) 17 kits right now.  they have 16 kits right now and are rebred.

1 Sr. American Blue buck and two Sr. American Blue does.  10 kits from one doe.  the other Sr. Doe is on a weight loss program before she breeds. 
2 Jr. American Blue bucks and two Jr. American Blue does   (not old enough to breed yet)

I would not worry about the city, as rabbits are quite.  Neighbors are the ones I pay the most attention to.  I give my neighbors fresh eggs.  They know some chickens are for meat and some are for layers.  They do  not like the idea that I raise meat rabbits and process them.  But, I keep a good relationship with them and show them respect.  In turn, they show me the same.  Keep a good relationship with your neighbors is my best advise for NO trouble.

MY NZW's and NZW/CA crosses are weaned at 6 weeks of age and put into a grow out cage.  When they are 8-12 weeks of age and I am home I process them.  I am the only one in my household who butchers, so it varies. 
Off to bed now.
goodnight all............


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## shan777 (Jul 30, 2013)

VickieB said:
			
		

> You're not getting any sympathy from me, P.O.!    My rabbits are sitting on my back porch. They have plenty of ventilation, but they do start to stinking soon, and attracting flies. I wash down my pans daily, or it would be unbearable. The one mystery I have to solve is: Why is it that rabbit poo can smell so bad while in a tray under the rabbit, but go throw it in your shade garden and the smell instantly dissipates?  I have 3 months of rabbit poo in my garden and if you walk by it you would never know. 1 day of rabbit poo in a drop pan, and you can't sit on the back porch!


Hi there, I too had the same question.... then Joel Salatin from Polyface farm ( youtube him, amazing) solved this one for me.
The problem is manure and urine are extremely high in nitrogen content, therefore the smell. What you are needing is a form of carbon to soak the nitrogen up, mixed with oxygen, and you get lovely smells instead of yuck ones... another name for this is composting, which I'm sure you'd know. Some form of composting is going on when you put the poo on your garden and therefore not smelling.
The principles of composting are the C:N ratio and getting this right. Obvious forms of carbon would be straw, sawdust, but basically any organic matter that is 'brown'. 30:1 C:N ratio is ideal. So to solve your smell troubles -add a hec of a lot of carbon, and you'll have lovely smelling, earthy soil as the it breaks down. I had same troubles as you, then found a free source of sawdust ( extremely high in carbon). My smells went almost instantly.
Hope this helps


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## Citylife (Aug 2, 2013)

I recently purchased a Texas A&M NZ which they have been working on for around 20 years.  The Tamuk is a heat tolerant rabbit, that has large litters and supposedly will give you 5 lb kits at 8 weeks.  I have crossed my CA mix with a Tamuk to test this out.  I am looking forward to seeing if that is the case.  As I wouldn't mind at all butchering at 8 weeks.  I pretty much plan on keeping 2 does from that breeding.  The buck I bought is not quite old enough to breed, but will be soon.


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## VickieB (Aug 6, 2013)

You'll have to tell me how it turns out.  I finally dispatched my first two litters at 11 weeks and 5 days. I think I had one or two hit the 5 pound mark, the others were closer to 4 and 4 1/2 pounds. I would love to be able to get them to that 5 pound mark sooner. They went through lots of feed and I had lots to clean after too. I've been tempted to cull the litters down to 5 or 6 each, and double the does. I would rather an extra doe to feed than 20 kits to feed from 8 to 12 weeks.


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## Beachbunny (Aug 6, 2013)

I've been following this thread about weights at butchering, live weight , etc....just wondering what kind of scales do y'all use?  I have a kitchen scale that I weight meats with when packaging but would like to get a scale to weigh the buns while they're alive to get an idea of weights at different ages.


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## VickieB (Aug 6, 2013)

I put a light weight basket on my kitchen scale, zero it out, then weigh my buns. It's worked well for me.


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## Citylife (Aug 6, 2013)

I am not all that picky about what they weigh when I butcher them, but I realize a lot of people do care.  I don't mind a 1 1/2 lb fryer every now and then.  I also don't mind a 3 1/2 lb dressed rabbit at 8-12 weeks.  I don't often weight them live, when I do I am darn close to guessing it right thank goodness.  I rarely butcher over 5 lb. live weight.
I am looking forward to seeing the litter my CA/NZ mix has with this other Tamuk.  My doe is a great mother and Tamuk's are supposed to be nice rabbits (unlike some NZ lines) and the 5 lbs by 8 weeks does intrigue me a bit.  I don't mind at all NOT feeding them to 11 or 12 weeks.  So, the CA/NZ will give me a good idea on the line of NZ.  By the time the buck I bought is old enough to breed, I will have two pure NZ does to breed to him.  
He may be a bit young at that time but we will see if he gives it the ole college try.


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## secuono (Aug 7, 2013)

Mine have been fairly small and taking their sweet time to get anywhere. So I've been culling all my old stock and getting new, far better animals. Also switched to a better feed in hopes they reach good weights on time. I know some people have rabbits reach 8# around 3mo of age! But if I can get about 6# in 10wks, I'll be happy.


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## VickieB (Nov 29, 2013)

shan777 said:


> Hi there, I too had the same question.... then Joel Salatin from Polyface farm ( youtube him, amazing) solved this one for me.
> The problem is manure and urine are extremely high in nitrogen content, therefore the smell. What you are needing is a form of carbon to soak the nitrogen up, mixed with oxygen, and you get lovely smells instead of yuck ones... another name for this is composting, which I'm sure you'd know. Some form of composting is going on when you put the poo on your garden and therefore not smelling.
> The principles of composting are the C:N ratio and getting this right. Obvious forms of carbon would be straw, sawdust, but basically any organic matter that is 'brown'. 30:1 C:N ratio is ideal. So to solve your smell troubles -add a hec of a lot of carbon, and you'll have lovely smelling, earthy soil as the it breaks down. I had same troubles as you, then found a free source of sawdust ( extremely high in carbon). My smells went almost instantly.
> Hope this helps




Shan777, I have just started using hay under the rabbits. I was using a small amount, (just enough to cover the bottom of the pan) because I was under the impression that it was supposed to be 1:1, (I know, I should have googled it). But, also, the cost of the hay bale is $16. I bought alfalfa. Should I be using another type of hay. This is really going to get expensive because I will be using up the hay in just about 3 cleanings. I'm not going to be able to keep that up. 

How long does it take for your compost to finish? I bought one 115 gallon compost bin, and it was filled within the month. (And that was when I was putting hay under the quail only...) So I went and bought 2 more. Sometimes I get to feeling I've overdone it on the bunnies.


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## P.O. in MO (Nov 29, 2013)

It's terrible what they charge for hay at my local farm supply store.  Their alfalfa is $14.50.  I have a friend who has raises miniature horses and he buys a barnful of brome every year. last year for $4.25, so that's what I use.  Most rabbit sites will say timothy is the best and that's because it has more fiber than brome which is the main purpose of feeding the hay to your rabbits.  I have only been raising rabbits a year but I haven't had any digestive problems yet doing this.  My breeders get 5 oz.of pellets a day but most of them have it polished off by morning and I think they would be hungry without the hay to get them to feeding time.  They are all different and some eat more than others. But my rabbits always have hay to munch on. When I first started I was feeding alfalfa to the nursing mother and the grow outs but I decided I wasn't paying that much for hay.

From a rabbit website: (Pet rabbits)
There are two main types of hay, Grass Hay, and Legume Hay, Grass hay is the best type of hay for your bunny because it contains lots of nutrients, but not a lot of energy. 
rabbits can get fat very easily.
Grass hay includes hays like Timothy Hay, Meadow Hay, Brome and Bermuda Grass.
Legume Hays include alfalfa hay, clover hay, beans, peas, and peanuts. Your rabbit will find these hays very tasty, but they are not very good for it because they contain so much energy. The average house rabbit will not be able to burn off all the energy they get from these hays, and they will get very fat.

Hope everyone had a good thanksgiving!


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## Citylife (Dec 1, 2013)

I have 3 bucks and 7 does.  I had a few does miss this last fall so it has messed with my breeding program a bit.  Also, I have only seen one picture of you on a wanted sign.  I say that's not to bad.  LOL


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## Fodderfeed (Dec 18, 2013)

My hubby did a neat thing he put worms boxes under the rabbit hutches the rabbits feed the worms and the worms give us some really nice dirt along with not having to clean up after the rabbits!


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## VickieB (Dec 18, 2013)

I had my first buns to reach 5 pounds at 8 weeks. They were a small litter (she only had 4 and normally has 10 or 11). They were the first litter for the season, and I only put her in with the buck 1 time hoping she would have a smaller litter. I don't know if the small litter was due to the fact that I only put her in once with the buck (I've been doing this with my does for a while now and it really didn't seem to affect the size of the litter much before this litter, or after...) or if it was coming out of the hot season and the buck's sperm count might have been down. I suspect it had more to do with the latter.

The bunnies were born much larger than her other buns have been, and grew fast. There were 3 does and 1 buck. All 4 of them had the points that you see on the Altex. (The mother has those points too.) I weighed them at 8 weeks and they ranged from 5 pounds to 5 1/2 pounds. 

I made two wonderful meals out of the buck but I'm keeping the does to use for breeders. Out of my original 4 does, their mother consistently produced larger buns than my other does (she's a larger rabbit too) and these babies look like they could do the same. Today I bred their mom again, this time with an Altex buck I got from Animal Mom. I'm really looking forward to seeing what her next litter will be like.


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