# Bottlejaw worse after worming!?



## norseofcourse (Aug 16, 2015)

I've had to treat a few of the lambs for parasites lately.  One in particular is worrying me.

On July 26, I wormed three of the lambs with Valbazen - both of Rose's twins, and Gracie's (ex)ram lamb.  None had bottlejaw.  They all had pale eyelids - Gracie's lamb was the palest/  He had also been lying down more, and a slightly lowered appetite.

In the week following, Rose's twins improved somewhat, but Gracie's lamb stayed the same, in fact his appetite and energy level both seemed to slowly decrease, to the point his legs would tremble sometimes if he stood too long.

On August 3, Monday morning, I re-dosed Gracie's lamb with Ivermectin.  Tuesday morning his appetite was slightly better, and he didn't go lay down right after eating like he had been doing.  Tuesday evening his appetite was again slightly better - but he now had bottlejaw.  His appetite and energy level both continued to improve every day, and the bottlejaw started to go down after a couple of days.  However, on Friday his bottlejaw seemed to be increasing again, and his eyelids were still very pale.

On Saturday August 15 I wormed Gracie's lamb again with Ivermectin.  His activity level and appetite were really good, nearly what I would consider normal, but his eyelids were not getting very much color back, and the bottlejaw was not going away.  This time I dosed him with a 78 lb. dose, although he's probably closer to 50 - 60 pounds.

That was yesterday.  Last night and this morning, he had a good appetite and his activity level was very good.  This evening when I brought them in from the main pasture, I noticed his bottlejaw is worse again - it's more swollen than I've ever seen.  His activity level and appetite are still loads better than they were at the beginning of all this, but he ate his grain noisily, almost like the swelling make it hard to eat and breathe at the same time.  I listened to him afterwards and he didn't sound congested, and he didn't cough at all.  He went to the hay feeder and ate hay, then went outside.  It was too dark for me to check his eyelids.

So twice now, one and a half days after a dose of ivermectin, he's gotten bottlejaw (or had it get worse).  It did decrease after a couple days the first time, so I'm optimistic, but I'm also worried.  Can this be a side effect of the worms dying off?  Is there anything else that causes bottlejaw?  Anything that can help it?  He was getting Nutridrench when his appetite was low, till he was back to scarfing down his grain as fast as the others.  I've seen him at the loose mineral feeder.  Any thoughts appreciated - thanks!


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## norseofcourse (Aug 17, 2015)

Morning report - his bottlejaw is still large, but it's softer than it was yesterday. Activity level and appetite good, and he wasn't noisy when he ate.  I checked his eyes, maybe a bit of color around the edges, but not much.  I'll take the camera out for pictures after work.


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## mysunwolf (Aug 17, 2015)

It can be a sign of parasite resistance starting in your flock. Just this year we had to switch to Prohibit since the Cydectin and the Valbazen both became useless at once. We have a new vet now that is helping us through. Given the time interval, I would suspect resistance.

Bottlejaw is only caused by anemia that I know of. However, anemia can be caused by multiple different things, not just barberpole. It does make it hard for them to swallow. You could do a fecal and see if he has any cocci that might be inhibiting his recovery.

It could also be that he was so severely anemic that when the worms left his system, he couldn't generate enough red blood cells. To help them out, we give iron shots for a few days, a Bo-Se if they haven't had it recently, a B complex shot almost daily, plus a Red Cell-type drench that we get from our vet (it has no copper). We also deworm, wait 24-48hrs, then move to a mostly clean (30+ days of rest) field. 

This has been a bad year for us and anemia, I am so sorry that you are going through it as well


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## purplequeenvt (Aug 17, 2015)

Bottle jaw is sometimes worse in the evening than the morning. It has to do with their heads being down grazing all day. 

Sounds like things are improving. If he were at my farm, I'd do a 3 day treatment of Valbazen or a 5 day treatment Safeguard. The Safeguard I treat with 1ml per 10 lbs. The Valbazen is 1ml per 25 lbs.


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## Roving Jacobs (Aug 17, 2015)

Yeah bottlejaw is almost always worse in the evening than in the morning. If he were mine he'd get a shot of iron, a shot of b complex, and 3 days straight of wormer like purplequeenvt suggested. That's always brought them around for me.


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## norseofcourse (Aug 31, 2015)

Thanks everyone.  I had suspected the swelling was worse in the evening due to grazing.

He's had vitamins, minerals, probiotics.  I've added extra protein to the lamb's food (first with ground flaxseed, but now with sunflower seeds).  I've given him a garlic/vinegar/molasses drench a couple times - not as an alternative to chemical worming, but supplemental as a 'can't hurt, might help' type of thing.  His appetite is great, his energy level is nearly the same as the other lambs.

I've read that where the worms attached can bleed for a day or so after they die and detatch - and I believe he had a heavy worm load and I'm dealing with the aftermath.  Except for the bottlejaw and pale eyelids, he's continued to improve, so I kept up the support and supplements.  August 30, finally, his bottlejaw was noticeably less swollen that evening.  He's not out of the woods yet, but it's a hopeful sign.


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## norseofcourse (Sep 18, 2015)

He's still hanging in there... his bottlejaw has continued to improve - it would vary throughout the day but kept trending smaller.  A couple times it was nearly gone.  However, his anemia was still severe.  Through all this, his appetite and activity level have been good, I even saw him run a couple times the past few days.  I did a third worming with ivermectin about 3 weeks after the second one.

I was finally able to get a fecal sample to the vet today (they are only open the same time I work) and he called and said he still has a heavy worm load.  In fact he was surprised the pellets were nice and normal looking, with as many worms as he had.  There was no coccidia.

He suggested going back to the Valbazen, or trying levamisole (Prohibit).  Since the Valbazen was already tried once and seemed to have no effect, I'll be getting levamisole in the morning.  He said do 2 doses, 2 to 3 weeks apart.  Now I just have to figure out dosage - the package will worm 12,800 pounds of sheep, and I'm doing one 50-pound lamb!  Wonder how long the stuff is good after I mix it (it's a powder).


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## Roving Jacobs (Sep 18, 2015)

Prohibit last for 90 days once mixed and if you mix up the concentrated dosage he'll need 2 ml. I've had good luck with prohibit but I'd do another fecal in a couple weeks and then re-dose then.


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