# How to keep LGD puppy from killing/eating chickens?



## CocoNUT (Jul 19, 2012)

PLEASE!  Someone help me out...how do I prevent/train my sharplaninac juvenile from chasing/catching/eating our chickens?! So far....she's gotten two of them.  A silkie hen - and today, a cochin juvenile.  Even though she's recovering from some kind of illness (either coon hound paralysis or some other infection type issue - she's responding to antibiotics and not all of the bloodwork has come back yet) and isn't "full-strength," she's still running down any stragglers that get out of their run!  It's really distressing!  She knows that we DO NOT allow it...but it seems her prey drive/instincts override her better judgement and our commands to stop!  

We tried the tying of the dead chicken to her thing.  That was REALLY gross as she started muching on the dead chicken as it was tied to her!  We've done the rolling her on her back.  She doesn't care...she wants those chickens!  

Any guidance/help is appreciated!  We know we have a year + before she 'matures' and grows out of this...but I would like some help so we can get this under control!  No..we don't have an older LGD to 'train' her with.  

Thanks!


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## CochinBrahmaLover=) (Jul 19, 2012)

Now I'm no LGD expert, but if our dogs do something wrong we give them a GOOD smack on the nose. They always stop then, cause it hurts, and us saying in a very mad voice "NO BAD GIRL/BOY"  they stop. 

Just a suggestion


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## Stubbornhillfarm (Jul 20, 2012)

You  may end up having to secure your chickens to make sure that no stragglers get out.  Fill in holes, make fence taller or add angled-in piece to top so they can't fly and perch on it to get out, or clip their wings.  

Our LGD pups will run after a loose chicken or turkey if they get out because the chicken or turkey is running around all frantic.  Where as where they were raised, Mzyla had her chickens all free ranging around the pups and parents.  Everyone was calm and lived in peace.  But that was largely in part to the fact that her chickens where not running around and acting like they were playing a game.  

I believe with maturity and with you consistantly reprimanding, she will get it eventually.


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## MonsterMalak (Jul 20, 2012)

I have run LGDs for 23 years to protect my poultry.

If you have a pup doing this, remove her from the immediate area, and only take her in with the fowl when you are there to supervise.  
Left unattended, she will continue, and it will be harder to break.   Escalate the punnishment to stop the behavior.  

Years ago, I had a cross LGD that it took a shock collar to break the habbit.  But be careful, as many LGDs are sensitive, and can shut down on you if punnished to harshly.

Alot of your success will depend on the breed, and the bloodline.  If you have to start over, do your homework.  
Buy pups from parents that are working like you would want yours to work.  

A good breeder should offer a replacement if the pup does not have the right temperament for your situation,,,, 
As a breeder, I would much rather replace a pup, than have them disposed of or just not working out.

With Poultry, and my experience;;;;
Pyrenees were real good, except a few exceptions.
Had trouble with about 25% of the Anatolians I had (could have been the bloodline though)
Problems with about 15% of the Kangals and poultry.
Have had good luck with my Boz,,,, less than 10%.  And they correct easier.   So far ))

Patience, supervised access until can be trusted, and luck!!!!!


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## CocoNUT (Jul 20, 2012)

Thanks guys!
Our "puppy" is a sharplaninac female...and quite good at her job.  The chickens she's gotten a hold of have somehow "escaped" from their enclosure.  We have two drakes that free range in the back yard with her and she mostly leaves them alone.  But she sees a chicken and it's "game on" for her!  She has a fantastic disposition actually.  She obviously doesn't respond to corporate punishment...but we do force her on her back...and I "scold" her when she shows interest in trying to grab it.  Then we ignore her.  She's never with the birds directly as they're in a fenced in run...she patrols outside of their run.  

She's not interested in the rabbits...just those chickens.


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## Straw Hat Kikos (Jul 20, 2012)

I tie the dead bird onto the dog's collar and leave it there until it starts to rot. Most dogs don't like something hanging on their neck for days on end. I also pay them no attention what so ever. When I did this to Callie she was so depressed. You could see it when you walk by. She just looks up at you and wags her tail and rolls over to submit. I do not have contact with her until I remove the bird, other than feed and water. It seemed to have worked a bit but she is never with birds anymore because she lives in the woods now. There are bird that live in the woods in her area but they know to stay away, so it hard to judge how well it worked. I do know that many people do this too and they say that it has worked for them but most of the time it takes two tries. GL on it!!


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## redtailgal (Jul 20, 2012)

The trick to tying the dead bird to the collar is to have the bird draped across the back.......this puts the bird in a dominant position over the dog.  A young dog may become frightened and try to run from the bird..........this is good.

I tie a cord around the neck of the bird and attach that cord to the collar, so that the head is over the dogs shoulder but out of reach of the dogs mouth.  I like for the head to be able to bob about when the dog moves.

I also take a cord and attach to one foot of the bird, take that same cord and go under the belly of the dog and attach it to the other foot (of the bird, that is).  This puts the bird in a straddling position, almost like it is riding the dog.

I've also been known to take a dead bird and spank the offending dog with it.

And, nothing personal, but NOTHING should override your commands, under any circumstance.  Her "instincts" are not a good excuse for disobedience.  You are her leader...she should obey EVERYTIME and she should do so INSTANTLY.  She should be able to obey in this manner while at the same time trusting you and looking to you for guidance as her leader.

If all else fails, muzzle her and walk her thru the birds several times a day, correcting her harshly when she behaves wrongly, and rewarding her lavishly when she behaves appropriately.  Once she can behave well on leash, remove the leash, leave the muzzle on and walk her thru the birds several times a day, with the same reward and praise system.  Then progress to leaving her unattended but still muzzled and leave to where she THINKS you cant see her.........when she goes for the birds (and she will) come out of hiding screaming NO NO NO BAD DOG like a crazy woman, continue to be harsh until she cowers.  When she does behave appropriately with you out of her site for about 10 minutes, lavishly praise her.

At that point, go back to working her on the lead WITHOUT the muzzle just as before, then graduate to your being present, her loose and unmuzzled, and finally her loose, unmuzzled and you out of site.

Once she can do all that, pick your least favorite bird, turn it loose and go hide.  She how she acts and respond accordingly.  Be firm, be harsh, and be consistent.


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## Straw Hat Kikos (Jul 20, 2012)

I agree with everything you said, but as you and I know LGD's, most of the time, don't care to much when you yell at them. They understand and you should still try and train them the best you can but most LGD's will never be a very obedient animal. I have heard of your method, which sounds like it might be one of the better ways. Many people tie the chicken to the dog and it does seem to work for most of us. But of course, you have people who think it is cruel and hate you for it. uuhhh 

I think the best advice here is "Be firm, be harsh, and be consistent.". That is the most important thing with LGD's. You can not let up and let them own you. You must show that you are the alpha and not them.


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## secuono (Jul 20, 2012)

Tying will never work, unless you are tying the dead animal to the FUR, it will always slide or be pulled around and chewed on. 

We are having the same issue with our pup, fine with the ducks, but 'plays' to death with the chickens. It's so hot I rarely have her with them anymore. Lock her up and leave her be, she comes out at night when I lock the birds away from her. Have one rooster that might not make it, she ripped out a lot of feathers and traumatized him. 

Dead things get eaten here, even the rotting, maggot infested stuff, she will eat/play with it. 

Drives me up the wall, don't have many birds, no job to just replace them. She also doesn't tend to bother the birds when I'm out there, it's when I leave and she gets bored, that's when she goes for them. Really wish I had gotten two, then they could play with each other and then just sell one of them as a trained adult...but w/e.

I also spank any animal that does something wrong, fastest way to set them straight. Just so hot now, can't sit out there with her.


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## Grazer (Jul 21, 2012)

Our neighbors have a pitbull/black labrador mix and one of those "teacup" yorkshier terriers.
Both come from backyard breeders and yet neither one of the dogs chase and/or kill chicken.
My grandma who has had LGD's (mostly Sarplaninac's) all her life, but didn't want another one because she's old and thinks they're too much of a dog for her right now, 
got a random mutt from a distant cousin who works at the animal shelter. Nothing is known about that dog's background.
That dog is a little over a year old now and has never killed a chicken or duck or any other small animal for that matter.

Normally these examples would be a recipe for a disaster, so why did these dogs leave chicken and other birds alone?

My point is these things take lots and lots of time, patience and consistent corrections + praise when the dog shows good behavior.
After many, many years, experienced farmers will be able to raise just about any dog to leave poultry alone and even chase off small predators. (we're talking about normal dogs here, with no neurological issues of course)

It really helps if one gets an LGD puppy from parents who are good poultry guardians themselves. These puppies will be much easier to train.
I know you feel like you're about ready to pull your hair out of your head, but it does gets better with persistence.. 

All dogs have prey drive, just some much lower than others (like most LGD breeds for instance). 
The key for beginning LGD owners is to look for LGD breeds with low prey drive from a breeder who knows what he/she is doing, knows their dogs and chooses the right pup for your situation.
And of course constant training from day 1, with puppies being separated from poultry when it's not possible to supervise them.


I'm sorry your puppy is going through that mysterious illness  , I hope the vet will be able to fully fix her.


P.S. I forgot to add this helpful link: http://www.anatoliandog.org/poultry.htm


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## CocoNUT (Jul 22, 2012)

Thanks everyone.  She's a puppy and I've been correcting her.  She KNOWS when she's being bad...trust me...I do scold her and I'm VERY consistent!  Today my husband accidentally let a young cockerel out of the run (he left the gate open...)...watering the birds is not normally his thing so he doesn't know the 'routine'...

Anyhow...he comes in freaking out that Gus got a hold of it and that I might want to come and get the bird - it's still alive.  So I come out there...and she sees the cock...and gets all 'predatory' and tries to go after it.  I yelled her name and pointed at the ground next to me and she did think about it for a second!  She did leave the chicken and came up to me - head down - and I immediately put her in the garage.  Then spent the next 10 mins trying to catch that stinking cockerel!  I finally got him and put him back in the run...THEN let Gus out.  She was quite frantic that I'd left her in the garage alone!

Not 4 or 5 hours later, the hubby goes out to put the goats away and he's yelling that she got another chicken!  He's yelling at her to leave it alone and she ultimately did.  My hubby held her down while I caught the poor pullet and put her away.  Gus tried to get her while I was holding her and I smacked her on the nose.  I also scolded her as she paced around the chicken run.  

She's getting it SLOWLY.  She is stubborn...but eager to please.  Her parents were working dogs and worked poultry as well as livestock.  

As a sidenote - Thank you Grazer for your concern.  Gus is pretty much back to normal.  All the tests have come back normal....MRI, spinal tap, and various neurological exams.  She's perfectly normal and VERY healthy!  They think she had "coonhound paralysis"...a type of tickborne disease...like Lyme or Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever.  She's been on anti-biotics and responding very well.  We figure with the heat wave for two weeks, the huge storms (& power loss for over a week)...she was worn out and a tick got on her (she's treated with flea/tick/mosquito treatments), her immune system was just worn down. Now she's back to her normal self of jumping and chasing!  She's even stsrted barking!  (She wasn't a big barker prior!)  Boy...does she have a BARK!  

We'll keep being persistent and consistent....and watch her!  Thanks again for your help!


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## Grazer (Jul 23, 2012)

I'm so glad to hear she's slowly but surely getting back to her normal self.
Ticks are so dangerous, but I never knew they could cause such paralysis.. I learned something new today.

We've been somewhat unlucky with our new puppy as well. I don't know if it's because of the hot & humid weather, but in just 6 weeks, she's been prescribed antibiotics twice.
First for something they call Canine Gastrointestinal Low Fat (basically she had a severe diarrhea and inflammation) and few weeks later she got hotspots.
The vet said he has never seen hotspots in such young puppy before.
Just our luck.

So I understand how frustrating this all must have been for you.... trying to figure out what's wrong, hoping it's not serious or genetic.
And then on top of that trying to get her to stop killing the poor chicken lol

You're right, she's just stubborn but with consistency it will get better. Some puppies are just a nightmare in their first 6 months or even in the first year. 
But then after all that training and them being difficult it's like something clicks and they become the dog you always wanted.
I was always told that males are more stubborn, but over the years I observed quite the opposite...females are far more stubborn it seems.

Do post some new pics of your puppy when you have time


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## CocoNUT (Jul 26, 2012)

Oh we LOVE our stubborn girl!  I did a bit of research on the breed before we decided to go with a Shar...and like most Shar owners...we've absolutely fallen in LOVE with her!  (She listens to me better than my husband...but I spend more time with her!) She's been getting a lot better at responding to my commands to "leave" the chickens alone.  She's only 7 months old and is learning.  Thankfully she does look to us for guidance and trust and even though her confidence is increasing, she still waits for our 'approval' on many things.  

While at the various vets offices (3) during that week, all of the vet nurses and Drs fell madly in love with her and her personality.  They loved how stubborn she is (she wouldn't stay in the kennels, she wanted to be out on the floor). I did inform them that she's a little "more" when she's at 100%! They'll see the difference when I take her in for her follow up tomorrow!

Ticks can be bad for your dog's health. Dogs can contract Lyme disease, Rocky Mountain Spotten Fever, Coonhound Paralysis and apparently a bunch of other diseases that can cause mild ilness all the way to death.  Nevermind mosquitos and heartworm! 

Good luck with your puppy Grazer! Last winter was pretty mild and didn't kill off as many ticks and germs as usual...then couple that with a humid/hot summer and it's a perfect combination!  

In the end all we can do is love the furballs!


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## Grazer (Jul 27, 2012)

You're right, these mild winters and hot summers are a heaven for varmints, ticks, germs etc.
Just the other day my cat came running to our bedroom, dragging a still alive garter snake  in her mouth. While our dogs were running right behind her, trying to get a piece of it. It was so disgusting lol 
And here I thought our backyard was snake-free 

Yes all we can do is love our furrballs and keep trying to do what's best for them


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