# What guardian would be best for this situation?



## CoffeeCow (Nov 6, 2012)

As many of you in the goat section know, we are about to move to Colorado. There are a lot of new predators out there that we do not have in our current location. They have a lot of coyote, foxes, skunks (we do not have skunks here in eastern NC) etc..

First, I'll tell you what animals we have and are planning on getting;
We have 2 goats currently. They are Boer/pygmy mixes.
When we arrive and get settled in, We are planning on getting more goats, a new flock of chickens, and 3 or 4 cows. 

We have 2 small children, ages 4 and 2, so we don't want anything that will attack them.

I have read some horror stories about Guardian Donkeys that kill the goats they are supposed to be protecting, so we are not interested in them.

As for Dogs, We would need something that wouldn't go after the kids.. any breeds you would suggest?

I have heard that Llamas are good guardians, but how do they fare against a coyote?

Any input here would be welcome, 
thanks guys.


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## Southern by choice (Nov 6, 2012)

Any LGD breed, being raised with your family will not attack your children! The only breed I find very iffy is the Komondor.  We have 3 pyr's and an anatolian here. All great all love everyone in the family. Kids lay all over them. I will say I think in some ways the anatolian is a little less hard headed and stubborn  than the pyrs. It also depends on males and females of the particular breed, as far as being hard headed. I would recommend reading up on LGD's. We also did not ever entertain the idea of donkeys or llamas because of the younger children and the cost of maintaining them. After the first year LGD's really don't eat much at all. I do know that donkeys and llamas are very effective though.


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## CocoNUT (Nov 6, 2012)

Our LGD LOVES kids! Any kids! My daughter's friends come over...she LOVES them! We take her to the local mega petstore....she navigates specifically towards the kids...and will lap up all the attention they bestow! She looks after them and watches them.  She puts up with them tugging and grabbing her....and she's only 10 months old!  Also, I NEVER have to 'fear' for my daughter's safety outside. EVER. Our LGD watches EVERYTHING and EVERYONE...even when she's playing. If something/one tried to get in the yard or get at our daughter....our dog would take care of it. She protects our goats/birds....and still has the ability to smother us with love. 

Look into LGDs. Some breeds - like Southern said - are more stubborn than others. Gender can make a BIG difference in temprement as well...and if you can...get at least a PAIR! (I'm learning this the hard way!) It'll give them some-puppy to play with when you're not around...AND they can work as a team - which is how they normally work. 

Good luck!


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## promiseacres (Nov 6, 2012)

my 36" mini donkeys are strong enough to do damage to a coyote (a pack IDK)  but I reall wouldn't know how to train one...  I've known many people how swear by them and have to put them up when company comes b/c they're so terriatorial.  so far mine like each other and no one else and they play so rough with each other I havne't tried them with any other critters. they're mainly my dh pets. I think a good LG donkey may be a hit and miss thing. JMO

they are fat on grass, no grain so very little cost


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## CoffeeCow (Nov 6, 2012)

I am not too concerned about feed, but llamas would eat the same as my goats. 

The main concern I have about a dog is... well, we love animals, and I have never had an outside dog before. All our dogs are family members, and sleep in the house, and go hiking with us...
I know we would be getting the dog for a specific job, but I am scared that the family will latch on to it and it will become a house pet..


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## Straw Hat Kikos (Nov 6, 2012)

CoffeeCow said:
			
		

> I am not too concerned about feed, but llamas would eat the same as my goats.
> 
> The main concern I have about a dog is... well, we love animals, and I have never had an outside dog before. All our dogs are family members, and sleep in the house, and go hiking with us...
> I know we would be getting the dog for a specific job, but I am scared that the family will latch on to it and it will become a house pet..


An LGD will not do good in a house. They want to live outside believe it or not. You bring that dog in and he/she will want to be outside before long. I am very attached to my dog (Anatolian Shepherd) but she lives outside with my goats. I also love the Pyrs here. They are all great dogs and those dogs love us as much as we love them. They love when we go out to see them!! They loved to be pet, scratched, loved on. Sometimes I will go out and lie down with them, with my head resting on them. They will just fall asleep and lie there. I think that if you got an LGD you may want to bring him in at first but you must remember that he has to be outside. If you bring him in and let him stay in for a few days he will always want to be inside. So re-frame from bringing him in in those first few days and he will be a great guardian but as long as you love them and care for them they will be your big babies. 

Oh and nobody says you can bring them in everyone once and a while for an hour or so.  Because I never do that. Ever. hehe


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## CocoNUT (Nov 6, 2012)

I know the feeling of having the dog inside. But here's the thing, Gus doesn't WANT to be inside! Of course, during Hurricane Sandy, she barked a little...but she and the goats went down and got into the barn - warm and dry! She cant' do her "job" from INSIDE the house! 

Now a girlfriend of mine has a Pyr for a PET. While I was complaining of my Shar puppy chewing up wood and this and that OUTSIDE...she would regale me with stories of how her Pyr puppy was CHEWING on the DRYWALL IN her house...one corner in particular! Now I don't know about you...but I'd take the digging holes and chewing on branches over my HOUSE anyday! Nevermind the hair everywhere! 

Gus is perfectly fine outside...and we go out there and give her attention and play with her. But, at the end of the day, her job is to protect our outdoor animals. She likes her job...and is GOOD at it! Watching her from the kitchen window amazes me...how she watches everyone...herds them 'away' from dangers...'counts' them. She 'watches' the hawks overhead...making sure she knows WHERE they are....if they get too low...she barks at them. Her coat gives her MORE than enough protection from the elements...and I can shave her in the summer if I need to...but I have a kiddy pool up for her to lounge in. I make sure she has her VACCINATIONS AND her flea/tick preventative. (Don't forget about mosquitos too - heartworm.) Most of these dogs seem to PREFER to be outside 'working'...keeping busy. 

Just do some research. I feel bad about her being outside when the weather is bad too...however....she has good shelter...and the goats would go nuts w/o her!


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## Southern by choice (Nov 6, 2012)

I do want to share something very important here.... LGD's WANT to have a job, they love what they do. They love the outdoors and often will not go to shelters provided unless it's extreme severe weather. Our dogs will lay out and sleep in the pouring down rain. They really don't care. As far as children our dogs love our children. We have family that comes over all the time, my "niece" is 8 and the dogs have been raised up with her around, however now the dogs are older and with work/school she is not around as often. If they are out of their fields and in the house or just out everything is fine, BUT now I will not allow her in the fields with the dogs. In the dogs eyes she is not "real" family, I know they will not attack her but they will purposely knock her down at this point. If she were to run and screech like kids do, especially toward one of the goats the pyrs especially have the tendency to trip a person. They just kind of step on them. I do socialized our LGD's, we have a small farm with many people stopping by all the time. I don't need or want my dogs "hitting" the fence with extreme aggression. Discernment is what I value and encourage in my dogs. We have family pet/farm dogs that are just that. 
Always respect the nature and purpose of the dog. Your childrens friends should not go in the fields with a working LGD. I know yours are still little but they grow fast. Just trying to help you think "down the road". 

It is tempting to keep them in! My one boy got a shoulder injury and ended up in the house for 3 weeks. He loved it, I loved it. He became the CGD (couch guard dog).But evernight it was a nightmare! HE wanted OUT! LGD's are typically nocturnal! :/  In the end he wants to be out, everyday he does come in for his house visit. Long enough to cuddle on the couch, surf the counters, table, which his back is taller than. He will still sometimes grab an apple out of the fruit bowl, waits at the fridge for his treat. 15-20 minutes later... standing at the side door to get back out!


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## babsbag (Nov 7, 2012)

CoffeeCow said:
			
		

> I am not too concerned about feed, but llamas would eat the same as my goats.


I don't own a llama, but I am not too sure they can eat the same as your goats, I guess it depends on what you feed your goats. I have dairy goats and feed 95% alfalfa. I have been told that llamas and alpacas can't eat alfalfa. Again, I don't know as I don't own any, just what I was told when I was looking at buying an alpaca.


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