# clean Nigerian dwarfs in Indiana



## Ariel72 (Jan 13, 2011)

Hello, I'm new here and have been reading everything I can find about dairy goats, especially Nigerian dwarfs and Pygmys.  My main concern is finding a breeder that tests for CAE, CL, and Johnes.  I'm located in Indiana south of Fort Wayne and north of Marion.  I'd like to start out with maybe just a doe and a wether in the springtime, but want to be sure I'm starting with healthy animals.  My goats will be for milking, but will also be well loved pets.


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## ksalvagno (Jan 13, 2011)

Helmstead has Nigerian Dwarfs and probably isn't too far from you. Just do a search for her name. If you don't mind traveling a bit, I have tested all my goats. I'm in Ohio.


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## SDGsoap&dairy (Jan 13, 2011)

I also have goats bred by Kate.  I'd give Helmstead Minis a recommendation any day!


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## helmstead (Jan 13, 2011)




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## julieq (Jan 13, 2011)

Ariel72 said:
			
		

> Hello, I'm new here and have been reading everything I can find about dairy goats, especially Nigerian dwarfs and Pygmys.  My main concern is finding a breeder that tests for CAE, CL, and Johnes.  I'm located in Indiana south of Fort Wayne and north of Marion.  I'd like to start out with maybe just a doe and a wether in the springtime, but want to be sure I'm starting with healthy animals.  My goats will be for milking, but will also be well loved pets.


SO glad you've done the research and are going the extra mile to find a reputable breeder, good for you!


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## Ariel72 (Jan 14, 2011)

Thank you for your kind replies!  My situation is that I'm a homesteader who is beginning to produce most of our family's food.  Last year was a garden and free range chickens  and this year I want/need to start supplying all our milk from our little 5 1/2 acres.  Showing isn't a big priority (though I do have a daughter who would like to do 4-h went she's old enough).  A sweet gentle healthy doe who can be part of our large family and help us be self-sufficient is my priority.  

She doesn't even need to be purebred or registered.  I always research each species of animal I'm interested in to the tiniest detail I can find information on them (I'm a real nerd).  I've settled on ND's as my favorite breed because I like their temperament, size, looks and their feed to milk conversion rates.  

They do seem to be economical to feed which is important to me since I'll be supplementing their feed with things I can grow myself.  I also hand carry all the animals' water, so just as a practical consideration,...smaller goat= less water.  I would even consider pygmy goats if I could find some in the area from a tested herd, though I understand they're not as suitable for milking as ND's are.  

Our situation forces practicality on me (dang it!).  I know a high quality show doe is out of my price range, but if I could find a good milker with at least 1/2 Nigerian blood I would consider myself lucky.  I have an older horse who loves goats, but if she wouldn't see him as a companion I'd get her a wether as a buddy.  I won't settle for untested goats even though they seem to be a dime a dozen around here.  

Thanks for sticking with me through this long post...told ya I was a nerd.


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## SDGsoap&dairy (Jan 14, 2011)

I'd consider a grade nigerian from a proven milker or who is a proven milker.  I have a doe who's pygmy/nigerian cross and I DREAD milking her.  I only do it when I have to because I feel like I need hemostats.   Not fun.  She fed her babies well (and has other qualities I like), but milking her is such a chore because of her teat size.

 I do have a grade nigerian doe (NMGA only) though with easy to milk teat size who produces nicely, particularly for the amount of grain she gets.  You don't have to worry about show quality (until 4-H), but be mindful of teat size and production ability as not all grade does will give you the same results.  If you were getting a doeling you'd look for those qualities in both the dam and the sire's dam.

Good luck, researching new critters is so much fun!


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## Ariel72 (Jan 14, 2011)

A grade doe like that would be the type I'm looking for.  I wouldn't mind driving several hours to get her either.  Getting her bred to a nice buck may be an issue.  I have to face that I may need to consider one of the larger breeds for now.  I have a friend that has a tested Nubian buck she says I can use.  She's very careful about having a disease free farm.  To me homesteading is, in part, making whats available to you, work for you.  I have until springtime to get things figured out for sure.


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## Our7Wonders (Jan 14, 2011)

Ariel72 said:
			
		

> I have a friend that has a tested Nubian buck she says I can use.  She's very careful about having a disease free farm.  To me homesteading is, in part, making whats available to you, work for you.  I have until springtime to get things figured out for sure.


FWIW, if you have to go with nubians -our two Nubian's fit quite nicely on our little "less-than-an-acre" urban farm.  We started with chickens this summer too and just got our bred Nubian girls about 6 weeks ago.  We're a large family too - we have seven children.  I wanted Nigerians at first but when I figured the amount of milk we would need for all our drinking and baking needs plus yogurt, keifer, buttermilk, and cheese, it seemed two little goats wouldn't be enough for us.  Then I started helping at a nubian dairy goat farm just to see if the whole goat thing would work for me and I had to milk a couple does with smaller teats - one in particular was very small and I always hated milking her - and I realized that NDs were likely to be uncomfortable in my hands, at least to begin with.  I am, however, *considering* breeding them to a ND buck next year.  The idea of a mini nubian is somewhat appealing.  I haven't decided yet - one breeding season at a time for me.  My kids LOVED our nubian milk, tasted just like the jersey cow milk we used to get from an organic raw dairy - I can't hardly wait until they kid and we can have milk again!


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## BetterHensandGardens (Jan 14, 2011)

ksalvagno said:
			
		

> Helmstead has Nigerian Dwarfs and probably isn't too far from you. Just do a search for her name. If you don't mind traveling a bit, I have tested all my goats. I'm in Ohio.


I think Karen offers non-show quality, good milking goats (as well as show quality goats); and she's not that far from you actually.  About four hours east.  

I know because we live near Karen and my parents are basically in Fort Wayne.  We make the trip back to Indiana several time a year.


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## Ariel72 (Jan 14, 2011)

Karen's goats are beautiful.  Four hours isn't too far too go to find what I'm looking for.  We have a blended family of 8 kids.  It sure would be nice to let everyone have all the milk they want.  A friend of mine told me about a clean farm close to her with Nubians and a buck I could use.  I'm going there tomorrow to check it out.  Maybe I'll go the Nubian route and do the same thing and breed her with a Nigerian if I find one I can trust.  In a few years I may even be in a position to own my own buck.  Once I have a clue, I mean.  I'm excited about my little goat project.  Time for more research.


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## Roll farms (Jan 15, 2011)

I can't imagine a life w/out goats (or goat milk) now.  

Welcome to your new obsession.


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## SDGsoap&dairy (Jan 15, 2011)

When you meet her Nubians you might ask about the noise level.  Some nubian owners swear they're not all that loud, and others just learn to live with it.  Unless noise isn't an issue for you, you may factor that into your nubian search.

We had a nubian doe for 6 months before deciding that we couldn't live with the volume level.  We tried because she was a fantastic girl in all other aspects but in the end 4 hours of bawling EVERY day (2 hours prior to both the AM and PM milkings) overshadowed her loveliness.  Some days I found myself sneaking inside when I got home from work if she didn't hear me pull up the drive because she's start yelling if she saw me.    She was persistently louder than the nigies from day one, but tolerable until she freshened.  Once she freshened and she came to expect getting grained twice daily it became unbearable.

I know that not all nubians are like that (and in fact, since she's joined a herd of other nubians rather than nigerians the new owner says she's quieted down.  Although she's not in milk anymore so that may also be a factor.)  And she was a wonderful girl to be around when her mouth was closed or full of food.    Talk about sweet!  I'm not disparaging the breed, just suggesting that if you'd like a quiet farm you'll want to factor it into your search for the RIGHT nubian.

Also, our gal milked like a champ but no one could argue feed efficiency was one of her strengths.  Perhaps there are grades out there who are stronger in that department, but my experience in speaking with other Nubian folks is that they aren't known for it.

It really sounds like I'm trying to talk someone out of nubians... I'm not!  They're wonderful.  Those are just some things to take into consideration when you're looking for some that you may not otherwise think of.


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## Ariel72 (Jan 15, 2011)

Humm...so many things to think about.  Nubians are what are readily available here which is the main reason I'm considering them.  I may need to go for a "little" drive to get another breed from a clean herd.


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## cutechick2010 (Jan 16, 2011)

I think the Nubian noise factor tends to run in certain lines. I have four Nubians, three does and a wether, and a Nigerian dwarf buck. All but one of my Nubians are pretty quiet, I may hear a little bit of yelling at feed time but not much otherwise unless someone has a problem, like being caught in the fence. The one noisy doe though...Yeah, she is a yeller, for sure. It is getting worse right now because she is pregnant and extra hungry, LOL. I adore my Nubians though, they are so gorgeous and loving.


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## whetzelmomma (Jan 22, 2011)

n.smithurmond said:
			
		

> When you meet her Nubians you might ask about the noise level.  Some nubian owners swear they're not all that loud, and others just learn to live with it.  Unless noise isn't an issue for you, you may factor that into your nubian search.
> 
> We had a nubian doe for 6 months before deciding that we couldn't live with the volume level.  We tried because she was a fantastic girl in all other aspects but in the end 4 hours of bawling EVERY day (2 hours prior to both the AM and PM milkings) overshadowed her loveliness.  Some days I found myself sneaking inside when I got home from work if she didn't hear me pull up the drive because she's start yelling if she saw me.    She was persistently louder than the nigies from day one, but tolerable until she freshened.  Once she freshened and she came to expect getting grained twice daily it became unbearable.
> 
> ...


YES YES YES YES. And oh yeah... YES. We live in the country, and the nubian we had was SO LOUD. I felt bad for our neighbors, and they weren't that close!! They can also be really pushy, and with kids, that's something to consider. Actually, I think all goats are pretty pushy if they are tame, but with smaller goats it's not so hard to stay standing up. lol I'm with n.smithurmond. Just be sure you do your homework well!! Goats are such fun. I settled with Nigerian Dwarf Dairy goats. I use the Henry Milker to solve the issue of small teats vs. milking.


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## SDGsoap&dairy (Jan 22, 2011)

cutechick2010 said:
			
		

> I think the Nubian noise factor tends to run in certain lines. I have four Nubians, three does and a wether, and a Nigerian dwarf buck. All but one of my Nubians are pretty quiet, I may hear a little bit of yelling at feed time but not much otherwise unless someone has a problem, like being caught in the fence. The one noisy doe though...Yeah, she is a yeller, for sure. It is getting worse right now because she is pregnant and extra hungry, LOL. I adore my Nubians though, they are so gorgeous and loving.


I also think it's genetic.  I think if a person really wanted a Nubian they could work around it, but it'll take a little extra work.  The floppy ears are awfully irresistible.  The coat texture was what I loved best about our Nubian.


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## Roll farms (Jan 22, 2011)

3 of our does are descended from Dolly...the most 'polite' Nubian I know.
One of the others is quiet except for milking time...she will let you know she's ready.
The newest one?
SCREAMER!  She drives me batty.  
*Now* I get what people mean about nubs being loud.
But...she's STILL not as loud as dh's Togg doe.


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## helmstead (Jan 23, 2011)

My Nubians are all quite sweet girls. The ONLY time one lived up to the reputation was when we hauled Scarlett with us on a family trip because she was in milk.  She screamed NON STOP the WHOLE WEEK.  And, yeah...we brought her a buddy (who was quiet as a mouse and probably had a headache the whole trip).  I nearly put our Aussie's eCollar on her!


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## SDGsoap&dairy (Jan 23, 2011)

helmstead said:
			
		

> I nearly put our Aussie's eCollar on her!




I considered that every morning at 5 AM when ours started screaming.


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