# Yogurt Kidded!  baby pic  Need advise



## jodief100 (May 4, 2011)

Yogurt wasn't due for another 10 days so I wasn't ready for this.  I came home to a fluffy, dry but muddy running around and bouncing 8 lb boy!







Forgive the muddy baby, my barn yard is a pit from all the rain.  

Question, she is cleaning him, talking to him, nuzzling with him and seems to be a good mamma. He was dry when I came home, he is very active, his belly isn't full but it doesn't seem empty either btu every time I see him get near her udder, she side steps away.  

All indications are she has fed him.  I am just worried about the stepping away behavior.  

Any clues?  

Edited to add she is a first time mommy.  25% kiko, 75% boer


----------



## ksalvagno (May 4, 2011)

Is she a first time mom? Maybe she just doesn't want to let him nurse when you are around. 

Congratulations! he is a cutie!


----------



## elevan (May 4, 2011)

Congratulations!


----------



## St0rmyM00n (May 4, 2011)

Malina does this with her baby they go round and round in circles I worried for a while... then he would catch her while she was eating and it just worked out. 

It takes a little bit for them to figure it out.


----------



## DixieLandFarm (May 4, 2011)

No advice on the feeding issue. But he is so cute! Congrats.


----------



## Ariel301 (May 4, 2011)

Keep an eye on him and her udder. If he gets lethargic or her udder gets over-full, he isn't getting enough to eat and you'll need to intervene. 

Some does just seem to be annoyed at nursing their kids. I've got a doe who loves babies, any babies, but she's really touchy about her udder and doesn't like them to nurse very much. She also starts acting nervous when I am milking her and she's almost empty, like maybe her udder is sore a little bit still from the chronic mastitis she lived with a long time before I got her.


----------



## jodief100 (May 5, 2011)

Her udder was really tight this morning.  He wasn't lethargic but not as active as he was.  Belly still seeming about half full.

So I milker her.  That was a very tight udder and an adventure.  I have Meat Goats.!  I do not have a milking stand!  I tied her head to the hay rack and pinned her to the wall while I struggled with tiny 1"  long teats.

I am sore and bruised but I got about a quart out of her.  She still has lots in there but at least she isn't tight anymore.  

Baby was shivering so I took him up to the house.  His temp was 100.0 degrees so I gave him about 4 oz of what I milked out.   I put him in the laundry basket with a towel and turned the space heater on in the bathroom with the doors shut.

I am off to the feed store.  I dropped my thermometer between the kidding pen and the barn wall and can't get it out!  I am going to need it today.


I do not have time for a bottle baby!?!?!?  I am leaving town tonight which is the reason I am off work today.


----------



## Emmetts Dairy (May 5, 2011)

Congrats!! Hope it works out...I have a FF thats not a fan of nursing either..but shes doing okay..it took alot of encouragement by me...but they are doing great.  

I hope she settles into motherhood for you!!

Hes a Cute boy!


----------



## PattySh (May 5, 2011)

Congrats on your little fellow,  hope mom comes around to nurse him.


----------



## Zanzabeez (May 5, 2011)

Congrats on your adorable new addition. 

Sorry to hear about the issues with your doe letting him nurse. Is there anyway for you to pin her against the wall for him to nurse after he is all warmed up? I know it is harder to do with a boer doe but she may start to get the idea after he has nursed a few times.

Tracy


----------



## 20kidsonhill (May 5, 2011)

Sounds like you are well on your way to having a bottle baby.  What size pen do you have the two in?  I recommend a small space no more than 4x6.   

If she is nuzzling him and acting like the baby is hers, but just not letting him, nurse. she will have to be encouraged.  Because my kidding pens are so small, I am able to just sit my bottom down on a bucket in the middle of the kidding pen, get the baby up, set the baby in front of mom, and let the baby try to suck on mom's chest and front legs, normally they will let them do this and act like the best mom in the world, until the baby gets near the forbidden area. 

then they move away. 

I let the mom kind of back herself into a corner and then just encourage the baby  to keep finding the udder, sometimes just holding the mom's leg off to the side works, sometimes more restraining is needed and mom's head will need to be held.   

the doe can learn that you aren't going to let her get away with walking away and you expect her to stand still, I do this every 3 or 4 hours during the day, making sure the baby is full at bedtime and then no more than 8 hours before the next feeding in the morning. 

If the baby has lost the drive to eat from mom, supplementing with an ounce of milk can get the sucking drive going and then put baby by mom.  It can be a very frustrating experience.   then let the baby nurse as long as they want. Then repeat after 3 to 4 hours. 

IF the baby is very lethargic I use around 15cc or 3 teaspoons of corn syrup, to kick start the nursing reflex, this kind of energy absorbes quickly, getting to the brain faster than milk would. 


To recap:
-give baby a small amount of mother's milk or corn syrup
-let baby suck on the front of mom, so mom can see baby and spend mom time with her. 
-after 3 or 4 min. nudge baby slowly towards the side and then back of mom.
-when mom freaks, put a hand on her side and talk calmly to her, but encourage her to stay put, up against the side of a pen in a corner works the best.
-if mom just want stand still, restrain her.
-repeat every 3 to 4 hours.

I ahve never seen a mom not take a baby, as long as the mom is showing affection towards the baby.  May take 3 or 4 days.


----------



## jodief100 (May 5, 2011)

Ok, I got him warmed up.  I gave him some corn syrup and molasses, a B12 shot and took him out to mom.  She nuzzled and licked him like crazy.  He didn't try to nurse.  I watched for a half an hour and he never tried.  I figured he wasn't hungry yet so I left them together.  I went up every 15 minutes to check on them, no nursing attempts.  After 2 hours he was shivering again with a temp of 98 degrees YIKES!

So he warming up in my bathroom again.  he is up to 100 degrees.  I would like to get him a little warmer and try again.  

I am on plane in 5 hours!


----------



## SDGsoap&dairy (May 5, 2011)

Oh man, I don't have any advice but you do have my sympathy! Hope the little fella figures it out.


----------



## ksalvagno (May 5, 2011)

When I have problems with first time alpaca moms, I find a shot or two of Banamine will work many times. They are in pain and don't want that baby back where it hurts. Get them out of pain and then they have no problems with letting them nurse.

Good luck!


----------



## 20kidsonhill (May 5, 2011)

Very very frustrating, I can feel for you.  If the kid was mine, I would do the following things if I couldn't get a good sucking reflex, I would drench with 1/2 teaspoon baking soda with a little corn syrup and milk mixed it, And give a 1/2cc Bo-Se shot,if you haven't already done that.  

I am assuming when you gave him the 4 oz of milk,he had a sucking reflex then, I would consider That a quit a bit of milk for a new born, and maybe it upset his stomach. Especially, if he was laying around a lot.


----------



## Ariel301 (May 5, 2011)

ksalvagno said:
			
		

> When I have problems with first time alpaca moms, I find a shot or two of Banamine will work many times. They are in pain and don't want that baby back where it hurts. Get them out of pain and then they have no problems with letting them nurse.
> 
> Good luck!


That's a good idea. I've noticed this too sometimes, after the birth the doe hurts and she associates the kid with the pain and is afraid of it hurting her again. Also, the udder  can be pretty sore at first, because it's filled with milk and she's not used to the pressure of a full udder, or the feel of a kid bumping/nibbling/pulling on her teats.


----------



## jodief100 (May 6, 2011)

When I left last night he was doing ok.  I had given him another bottle and hubby put the heat lamps bck up in the kidding stall.  Hubby said he doing well when he went to bed last night and I haven;t heard from him since.

I haven't heard from hubby yet this morning but the 3 hour time zone difference makes it difficult.  I hope to hear from him at lunch.  This is the worst part, not knowing how he is doing!


----------



## aggieterpkatie (May 6, 2011)

When I have a mom that is not sure about letting the baby nurse, I'll actually put the kid/lamb ON the teat. I'll hold the baby in place and open its mouth if I have to, and put it on the teat.  Usually the baby will start nursing and the mom will figure out it's ok to let them nurse.  Sometimes you have to do this a couple times, but it's way better than a bottle baby, and better than wondering if the baby is nursing or not.


----------



## DonnaBelle (May 6, 2011)

I agree with Aggie, sometimes you have to have help and hold the doe and put the kid up to the teat.  I sometimes squeeze the teat a bit and get some milk on the baby's mouth and usually that gets baby's interest in nursing going.  Besides, they are getting colustrum which they must have the first 24 hrs of life.

DonnaBelle


----------



## jodief100 (May 6, 2011)

We did put the teat in him mouth, several times.  Waited for him to get hungry and tried again.  He just didn't seem to get it.  

Hubby said his temp was fine this morning but he didn't want much of his bottle.  He said it looked like he *might* have been nursing.  Hubby isn't the best at judging but lets hope!


----------



## Emmetts Dairy (May 6, 2011)

ksalvagno said:
			
		

> When I have problems with first time alpaca moms, I find a shot or two of Banamine will work many times. They are in pain and don't want that baby back where it hurts. Get them out of pain and then they have no problems with letting them nurse.
> 
> Good luck!


I agree Karen.

I also agree with "aggie"  I had a few that I had to sit with right after and make sure they latch on.  I will milk the teat a few times and put the nose right to it so they can smell it and all.  

I hope it works out for you guys.  Bottle babies are very time consuming.  

Best of luck!!


----------

