# What to do with dead sheep



## mystang89 (Jun 13, 2018)

It's a morbid question but one that I know needs answering. If I have a sheep die due to illness, what should I do with the sheep? Bury, burn, eat, feed to dogs? What to do with sheep that die from another animal? 

Figured I'd ask before this actually happened. Thanks.


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## mysunwolf (Jun 13, 2018)

Depending on the illness, I'll feed the meat to the dogs. Or if I don't want to cut it up, just bury. If it's winter, we compost or take to the landfill. Sheep that die from non-illness causes are fed to dogs. 

Always good to be prepared for deadstock, s*** happens!


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## mystang89 (Jun 13, 2018)

Is there a reason that you don't eat them if they've been killed by a predator?  Is it because of the unknown possibility of contamination and sanitation?  Possibility of intestines rupturing etc?


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## Donna R. Raybon (Jun 13, 2018)

It is good to have a plan in place.  Our county landfill takes livestock and this is what we usually do with cows and goats.  Dogs we bury.  
If you can get to them in time and know for sure cause of death, then human consumption is an option.  We had to put down a lovely yearling doe who had somehow nearly torn her rear leg off.  We butchered her, quartered her, and smoked each quarter, pulled meat and put in freezer.  Lucky it was not blazing hot weather as that is NO FUN to try and butcher!!!
My dogs are very valuable to me and I would not take a chance on feeding them anything that might hurt them.  Anything like clostridium caused illness (blackleg for example) or any mastitis (can be caused by staph, strep, e-coli), or listeriosis,   are too dangerous to try to feed.  And, if you have doctored animal at all, then you have to worry about residue.  

Good idea to have a heavy tarp and a place to put the body in case something happens in really bad weather, like a snow storm, where critters can't get to it and it doesn't draw in scavengers.


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## mystang89 (Jun 13, 2018)

Great advice everyone. Thank you, it's nice to know what people who may have already been through it have done.


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## Mini Horses (Jun 13, 2018)

I bought a backhoe.


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## Southern by choice (Jun 13, 2018)

This is a really good question.
First, if death was from illness I always say necropsy. Necropsy done through state lab is usually less expensive and more thorough.
Recently there was a farmer that had several calves die, different ages. Initial symptoms said pneumonia. The farmer was smart though and took one calf in. 
The calf did have pneumonia but a very good Vet at the State Lab thought not all the symptoms the farmer had mentioned fit... continued looking.
Rabies.
6 people's lives were probably saved possibly more because of the early diagnosis.

It is just always good to keep in mind.


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## greybeard (Jun 13, 2018)

Southern by choice said:


> The calf did have pneumonia but a very good Vet at the State Lab thought not all the symptoms the farmer had mentioned fit... continued looking.
> Rabies.


That happens fairly frequently with cattle and probably a lot more than is even reported thru necropsy.

One of the reasons many small operators do not have a necropsy done in cattle is the reportable disease thing.  Vets and medical personnel doing necropsy and finding an illness that is on the reportable list are required to 'call it in' and some cattlemen--large operations and small, just don't want word out that it happened to one of their animals..

The list of cattle specific and multi-species diseases that are known to affect or be transmitted by cattle is pretty long and new diseases can be added at any time. The Federal (USDA/APHIS) bovine list:
Foot‐and‐mouth disease (FMD)
A020 Vesicular stomatitis (VS)
 A040 Rinderpest
A060 Contagious bovine pleuropneumonia (Mycoplasma mycoides mycoides) A070 Lumpy skin disease
 A080 Rift Valley fever
A090 Bluetongue
N001 Crimean Congo hemorrhagic disease 2001 Akabane (congenital arthrogryposis‐hydranencephalaly syndrome)
 B051 Anthrax (Bacillus anthracis) B052 Aujesky's disease (Pseudorabies)
B053 Echinococcosis / hydatidosis (Echinococcus granulosus, E. multilocularis)
B055 Heartwater (Cowdria ruminantium)
B057 Q Fever (Coxiella burnetii)
B058 Rabies
B059 Paratuberculosis (Johne's disease ‐ (Mycobacterium avium paratuberculosis)
 B060 New World screwworm (Cochliomyia hominivorax)
B061 Old World screwworm (Chrysomya bezziana)
B101 Anaplasmosis (Anaplasma marginale, A. centrale)
B102 Babesiosis (Babesia bovis, B.bigemina)
B103 Bovine brucellosis (B.abortus)
B152 Caprine and ovine brucellosis (B. melitensis)
B253 Porcine brucellosis (B.suis)
B104 Bovine genital campylobacteriosis (Campylobacter fetus venerealis) B105 Bovine tuberculosis (Mycobacterium bovis)
N117 Bovine viral diarrhea (BVD)
B108 Enzootic bovine leukosis (BLV)
B109 Hemorrhagic septicemia (Pasteurella multocida, serotypes B/Asian or E/African)
B110 Infectious bovine rhinotracheitis/infectious pustular vulvovaginitis (IBR/IPV)
B111 Theileriasis (Theileria annulata, T. parva)
B112 Trichomoniasis (Tritrichomonas [Trichomonas] foetus)
B113 Trypanosomiasis (tsetse‐transmitted)(Trypanosoma congolense, T. vivax, T. brucei brucei, T. evansi))
B114 Malignant catarrhal fever (specify wildebeest or sheep form)
B115 Bovine spongiform encephalopathy (BSE)
N158 Epizootic hemorrhagic disease (EHD)
C613 Melioidosis (Burkholderia pseudomallei)

Other species have their own list and some states have their own list as well.


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## Southern by choice (Jun 13, 2018)

greybeard said:


> That happens fairly frequently with cattle and probably a lot more than is even reported thru necropsy.
> 
> One of the reasons many small operators do not have a necropsy done in cattle is the reportable disease thing.  Vets and medical personnel doing necropsy and finding an illness that is on the reportable list are required to 'call it in' and some cattlemen--large operations and small, just don't want word out that it happened to one of their animals..
> 
> ...



Yes, the list is long and you are right some states will quarantine for some things others will require eradication.  
Over the years there have been several cattle farms here that have been quarantined for rabies. It is usually discovered by the Livestock Guardian Donkeys showing signs first.  
We had a letter out from the extension services earlier this year, if I remember correctly, recommending farmers discuss with their vets about vaccinating their livestock for rabies. 
The threat/risk of rabies is increasing.


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## Sheepshape (Jun 13, 2018)

Crikey.....things are very different over here. Each animal has to have two matching number ear tags, one of which is electronic and is scanned when the animal, for example, goes to market. Whenever, and wherever an animal moves, a 'Movement Licence' has to accompany them.....one copy to the buyer, one to the seller and one to the Government. All animals are therefore traceable.

If an animal dies it has to be taken to a recognised incineration facility and a 'Duty of Care' document issued (which includes the animal's ear tag number).We are inspected occasionally and have to be able to account for every animal. Unfortunately incineration costs over £20 per animal (when the sheep at market may only realise £50).Dead animals cannot be left in fields to rot/be eaten by raptors.Failure to comply can lead to a hefty fine and a ban on keeping livestock.

These stringent measures have been introduced after Foot and Mouth and BSE (though the latter was down to feeding infected cow material to other cows!). We now have some of the healthiest and least profitable animals on the planet (and a lessening of many raptors). 

Our dog has been known to eat a lamb born 'fresh' dead, but that's about as 'adventurous' as we get with dead stock.


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## mystang89 (Jun 14, 2018)

Wow.... Um, I'm sure the animals are healthy there but....I really don't think I like that system. Seems too authoritarian. If it came to that same thing here I probably wouldn't raise animals. I'm not a huge fan of having to report everything to Big Brother.


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## Southern by choice (Jun 14, 2018)

@Sheepshape   we have a scrapie program here where which by law any sheep, goat must have ID to move across state lines or be able to go to a processor. Not sure what they do about cattle here. 
To move across state lines vet health certificate must accompany etc.
We have fought off the National ID system here and will continue to do so.  There have been attempts for this. Poultry is one that there was a real issue with. Again fought off.
The poultry would be a nightmare alone. Poultry is lost everyday to hawks, fox, other predators... how do you account for an animal taken?  

How do you control a people? Control the food.


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## Sheepshape (Jun 14, 2018)

Southern by choice said:


> Poultry is lost everyday to hawks, fox, other predators... how do you account for an animal taken?


 Ha....poultry is entirely different.Chickens can be slaughtered at home (sheep, pigs, goats, cows etc. can only be slaughtered at licensed premises), and it is only necessary to register a flock with DEFRA if you have over 30 chickens. I am DEFRA registered, but they have only ever contacted me when they have put bird 'flu restrictions in place. Foxes regularly take chickens and there is no legal requirement  to keep records about them. 

Since the introduction of Movement Licences we have had no real problems with ghastly diseases, so it has its uses, though is tedious to comply with. Another great advantage is that animal welfare standards have improved a lot. Healthier for folk, too as a random sample of carcasses is taken and tested for the presence of antibiotics, growth stimulators etc. Prior to the introduction of such measures some folk were not adhering to the 'meat withdrawal period' after antibiotic treatment.....now the source of the carcass can be traced.

We have few predators capable of taking livestock over here, but animals do sometimes get lost. We are able to enter 'lost' on our farm records, but I don't think that it would be looked on favourably if animals were 'lost' on a regular basis or in large numbers.

Sometimes regulations make little sense.....horses and dogs have to be micro-chipped.......but strays are often found without them. Cats?.....well nothing for cats (who probably carry more diseases transmissible to man).



Southern by choice said:


> How do you control a people? Control the food.


Maybe THAT's why I don't eat meat......vegetables are very unregulated.


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## Southern by choice (Jun 14, 2018)

@Sheepshape  you cannot slaughter your own sheep for your family's consumption?


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## Sheepshape (Jun 14, 2018)

Southern by choice said:


> @Sheepshape you cannot slaughter your own sheep for your family's consumption?


No...slaughter to eat has to be done by a licensed premises (who usually also butcher the animal). Where things get a bit silly is that it's perfectly OK to euthanise an animal diseased or badly injured by shooting it (if you have an appropriate gun and licence), but the animal has to be then taken away for incineration.

I'm not  a gun person, but our neighbour owns several and has euthanised a couple of our sheep via a bullet to the head. Seems to be a lot quicker than lethal injection into the neck veins.


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## Southern by choice (Jun 14, 2018)

Sheepshape said:


> No...slaughter to eat has to be done by a licensed premises (who usually also butcher the animal). Where things get a bit silly is that it's perfectly OK to euthanise an animal diseased or badly injured by shooting it (if you have an appropriate gun and licence), but the animal has to be then taken away for incineration.
> 
> I'm not  a gun person, but our neighbour owns several and has euthanised a couple of our sheep via a bullet to the head. Seems to be a lot quicker than lethal injection into the neck veins.


Bullet is fastest, never understand why anyone would choose lethal injection.


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## Mike CHS (Jun 14, 2018)

Tennessee has contracted for a removal service for any livestock over 75 pounds.  They are expected to respond within 48 hours of being contacted.


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## Jennifer Hinkle (Jun 18, 2018)

Sheepshape said:


> Crikey.....things are very different over here. Each animal has to have two matching number ear tags, one of which is electronic and is scanned when the animal, for example, goes to market. Whenever, and wherever an animal moves, a 'Movement Licence' has to accompany them.....one copy to the buyer, one to the seller and one to the Government. All animals are therefore traceable.
> 
> If an animal dies it has to be taken to a recognised incineration facility and a 'Duty of Care' document issued (which includes the animal's ear tag number).We are inspected occasionally and have to be able to account for every animal. Unfortunately incineration costs over £20 per animal (when the sheep at market may only realise £50).Dead animals cannot be left in fields to rot/be eaten by raptors.Failure to comply can lead to a hefty fine and a ban on keeping livestock.
> 
> ...


Where do you live again?


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## Baymule (Jun 18, 2018)

We buried a ewe on our farm. We haven't had a lot of loss.


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## Sheepshape (Jun 19, 2018)

Jennifer Hinkle said:


> Where do you live again?


Mid Wales.......land of 12 million sheep and 3 million people. Sheep prices are quite low (but lamb remarkably high in the supermarkets!)

This thread must have caught my eye for all the wrong reasons. My seemingly healthy and beautiful Blue Faced Leicester ewe, Marilyn, aged just 2 dies suddenly on Saturday. In the morning she was in the field 'holding her usual conversation' with me (answered loudly to her name), I went into town for a few hours and came back to find her dead in the field. I have no idea what she died of.I hadn't expected to be going through the process of dead sheep removal with her.


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## Latestarter (Jun 19, 2018)

Awwwww... So sorry Sheepshape.  This has been one heckuva tough year for you.


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## RollingAcres (Jun 19, 2018)

Sheepshape said:


> Mid Wales.......land of 12 million sheep and 3 million people. Sheep prices are quite low (but lamb remarkably high in the supermarkets!)
> 
> This thread must have caught my eye for all the wrong reasons. My seemingly healthy and beautiful Blue Faced Leicester ewe, Marilyn, aged just 2 dies suddenly on Saturday. In the morning she was in the field 'holding her usual conversation' with me (answered loudly to her name), I went into town for a few hours and came back to find her dead in the field. I have no idea what she died of.I hadn't expected to be going through the process of dead sheep removal with her.


Sorry for your loss...


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## mystang89 (Jun 19, 2018)

Real sorry to hear that sheepshape.


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## goats&moregoats (Jun 19, 2018)

Sorry for your loss Sheepshape. I had one year that was terrible..a couple years ago. A few kids died day after they were born, Dwarf Nigerians..those were small enough to burn. Had one larger kid I had to bury. However, I wrapped it up in some old chicken wire, some old goat fencing, a piece of old tarp, then another layer of fencing. Before burying it and covering the hole over with rocks.


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## Donna R. Raybon (Jun 19, 2018)

Mini Horses said:


> I bought a backhoe.[/QUOTE
> 
> A backhoe!
> EEEEEEEEKKKKKK!  OMG don't like the sound of THAT!  Over the years we would have an acre of 'cemetery' if we had a backhoe!!!
> ...


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## greybeard (Jun 19, 2018)

> =Mini Horses:
> I bought a backhoe





Donna R. Raybon said:


> A backhoe!
> EEEEEEEEKKKKKK! OMG don't like the sound of THAT! Over the years we would have an acre of 'cemetery' if we had a backhoe!!!
> 
> But, dh says he would LOVE to have one!!!! He got to use one of those cute mini backhoe on a landscaping job. Another good thread along with this one is how to safely put an animal down if vet unable to make it out to do the job.
> ...


I have a backhoe/loader combo. Comes in pretty handy for all kinds of things, tho it is very heavy and I don't use it in wet weather. In dry weather tho, it's the thing to have instead of a shovel. I'd not look forward to digging a hole large enough to bury a good sized calf or mature cow with a shovel.
I am not at all sure what the following means:
"_They also cautioned that a rifle is not good to use because the velocity of the slow just as it leaves the barrell._"
'slow' is a relative term when it comes to rifle ballistics.
Altho a rifle round does pick up velocity between the muzzle and about 50 yards, it's not a heck of a lot of gain.
I've read Dr. Biagiotti's article and another from American Association of Bovine Practitioners that quoted from it.

Both are contradictory, considering velocities and energy at the muzzle of the different firearms mentioned. Energy is important...it is the biggest contributor to knockdown/penetrating power and it's always highest at the muzzle because virtually no energy has been expended propelling the projectile to max velocity.
.
They caution not to use a .22 on a mature cow. It's muzzle velocity is virtually the same as 12 ga 00 shot shell. Winchester .22lr solid point=1070-1125 fps and around 100-140 ft lbs of energy--depending on barrel length.
Muzzle velocity of a standard 12 ga 00buckshot is around 1200fps and energy of 1413 ft-lbs. HOWEVER, each of those 9 pellets has only 157ft lbs of energy.
(in comparison..A really good air rifle pellet ..14.66 grain H&N FTT .22 caliber pellet....leaves the muzzle with 14ft lbs of energy and at around 645 fps)

Captive bolt pistols by the way, the bolt is moving at about 79fps with energy approx 131 ft lbs.
(for you metric folks, that is 24 m/s impact with energy @ 178 joules for the captive bolt pistol)
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7463537
ALL bullets, regardless of whether it is a rifle or handgun, gain a little velocity right after they exit the muzzle as the bullet stabilizes from barrel twist, but at a loss of energy.
That added velocity is extremely short lived and drops off rather quickly in low power rounds and firearms.

The only realistic downside to using a higher energy higher velocity round is not ricochet, but the likelihood that the round will exit the backside of the skull. You want the bullet to do it's work and stay confined within the skull. The chances of something like a .270 or even a 7.62x39 round ricocheting off the front of a cow's skull is so low to be virtually non existent tho the former would not be my choice to do the job. It's simply too powerful..


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## Latestarter (Jun 19, 2018)

9mm works just fine in most cases. Could also use one of my other handguns. 357 mag with a .357 or .38 special cartridge, .44 mag, etc... Lot easier to handle in close quarters as well rather than trying to swing a rifle or shotgun around.

Sure wish I had a backhoe with a bucket... or a tractor with a bucket... Any heavy machinery would do for some good... A dozer would be helpful as well. <sigh> 

Come to think about it... @Mini Horses didn't you purchase a hay making set up for your tractor? Seems I recall someone on here was talking about doing so. How'd it turn out?


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## Donna R. Raybon (Jun 19, 2018)

Sheepshape, 
That sure stinks.  So sorry.


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## Baymule (Jun 19, 2018)

@Sheepshape I am so sorry. You have had a rough time lately, it is time for that to let up on you.


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## Farmer Connie (Jun 19, 2018)

My garden is also a grave yard.


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## Mini Horses (Jun 19, 2018)

No haying equipment, too expensive, too heavy, too much maintenance (for an old lady!).   Still buy hay. The back hoe is great when installing fence!  Moves up/down, back & forth, front/back/sideways.  There are ditches, trenches, lifting, all sorts of things to do with it!   But after I had to dig toe holes to climb out of the last big hole, I retired the shovel and me from that chore.


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## greybeard (Jun 19, 2018)

I once worked at a place in Chambers County Texas, where when something died or had to be put down, it was just drug off to the the far corner of the ranch and left.."to the bone pile".  Cows, calves and horses. I'm guessing that little plot of ground is pretty high in calcium now, tho the entire area is today,  a huge (and high $$) subdivision.


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## Sheepshape (Jun 19, 2018)

Farmer Connie said:


> My garden is also a grave yard.


Certainly one of the prime uses of gardens! Mine has cats, dogs, rabbits, chickens etc. Again, I think it's something we're not SUPPOSED to do......though interestingly enough, one person can be buried on the land.Best if they are cremated first, I think, as it could  be a really negative point when selling the house......"Oh, and under NO circumstances dig up THAT rose bed".....


Baymule said:


> You have had a rough time lately, it is time for that to let up on you.


It's been a sad year for me. I have lost some of my real pet animals.....the bottle fed lambs who had grown into affectionate and lovely ewes.It can feel very disheartening. With Marilyn, at least her ram lamb is big and doesn't need milk. When Arielle died in March I was left with her two lambs, one of which didn't take to the bottle straight away and needed lots of time and effort to assure his survival.
At times I think that I'll give up keeping livestock. That never lasts for long enough to actually make efforts to sell them, though.


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## babsbag (Jun 20, 2018)

Southern by choice said:


> we have a scrapie program here where which by law any sheep, goat must have ID to move across state lines or be able to go to a processor.



Every State is different. I don't have to have a tag to go to a processor.  I also don't have to have tags for low risk commercial goats..."Low-risk commercial goats—those raised for fiber and/or meat; those not registered or exhibited; those they have not been in contact with sheep; those not scrapie positive, not high risk or exposed; those not from an infected or source herd; and those not commingled with other goats at premises that do not meet these criteria."  So all of my goats don't need a tag.  

I can bring goats into CA without a scrapies tag but they do have to have a vet cert. I can take goats into Oregon or Nevada without a cert or a tag, no one checks. But Nevada wants an ear tag if you are at a show or a fair. Try that with a La Mancha.


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