# first timer - found a billy to breed to! *questions*



## dwbonfire (Jan 5, 2012)

that pretty much sums it up! just wondering if its too late to try having my doe bred. i need to find a buck, have a few offers to have a date but need to look into it more. i know its not the best idea to bring the doe elsewhere to breed with someones buck, or have the buck here to breed with the doe, because of risks of disease and parisites etc. would you totally rule out that option? i figured i would go see the buck and see how the goats are kept and living conditions and whatnot to see if they look clean and healthy. i dont know how else to have her bred, i really dont want to keep a billy here. any ideas or advice? and did i miss the window for this season anyway?


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## BetterHensandGardens (Jan 5, 2012)

It depends somewhat on the type of goats you have - some breeds can only be bred in the fall, while others (like Nigerians) can be bred year around.  If you can determine when she is in heat, then she can be bred.  

As to taking her to a buck, if she has been tested to be free of CAE, CL, Johnes, etc. diseases; then you would want to make sure that any buck (and the herd he comes from) have also been tested to be free of disease.


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## dwbonfire (Jan 5, 2012)

i am very new to goats, and when i asked the previous owner if she had been tested for those things she said not since shes had her and doubts she has been before. she successfully had a kid when she first got her, she didnt even know she was bred. she is a pygmie.. i have no idea how to tell when shes in heat, i have read about tail flagging but havent seen that, or any other signs to think she might be. i still dont "know" her that well to pick up on certain signs, but what are some obvious ones i should see?


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## mama24 (Jan 6, 2012)

Do you think she's in heat? I just got 2 new yearling does. 1 should be bred already, but the other was too young/small and didn't go into heat before I got them about a month ago. I'm pretty sure she's in heat now, though! She's been walking around with her tail up and her girl parts are sticking out where they weren't before!


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## marlowmanor (Jan 6, 2012)

Pygmies are not seasonal breeders so once you figure out when she is in heat you should be able to make a "date" for her when you find her in heat. Good luck finding an appropriate suitor and getting her bred!


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## Chirpy (Jan 6, 2012)

As stated Pygmies can be bred all year round... you just need to figure out their heat cycle.    Why do you want to breed her right now?  If I were you I would test for CL, CAE, Johnes and Brucellosis and THEN, if she's negative on ALL of those then find a buck who has current (within a year) papers showing he is negative on ALL of those and any other goats on the same property as the buck are also proven negative for those then decide if you want to take her to the buck or bring him to you.  If you want to have early summer babies then do the blood testing and wait till next year to breed her.

I've done it both ways... I've had a buck here for a full month to make sure all my does were covered by him but I prefer to take my girls to the buck and leave her there.  For my does that are easy to tell when they are starting their cycle (here's a great site to help you with your questions --   http://fiascofarm.com/goats/index.htm) I have it arranged to take her that day and leave her for a few days and then bring her home... the buck owner keeps an eye on things and has always seen the breedings take place.   I've also had does that were impossible to tell when they came into heat (a silent heat) so I've taken them to the buck and left them for about 32 days to make sure they are covered.   The huge disadvantage to having a buck with your doe for more than three or four days is that you have a really large window of when they can kid.   Meaning - you are on kid watch for potentially two full months not knowing for sure when she's going to have her babies.   When a doe has been with the buck for three days... you have a very narrow time window of her having her babies which makes it much easier on you.

I think if you read through Fias Co Farm's site you'll get lots of answers for your questions....


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## Queen Mum (Jan 6, 2012)

We call off farm breeding, 'driveway dates'.  It takes about 20 minutes.  And as long as the breeder is reputable, you are not risking disease.  If you recognize the signs of when your doe is in heat, it is a snap to take her to the breeder for a driveway date.  You take her, stop for about 20 minutes, the date occurs and you take her home.  Five months later you will have babies.  Most reputable breeders will allow a return visit if the first one or two visits are unsuccessful.


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## dwbonfire (Jan 8, 2012)

its hard to find someone who would be considered a "reputable breeder" in my area, it seems like most people have goats and breed and sell them and thats about it. im not saying they dont take good care of them, but anyone who i have asked about all those tests look at me like i have 10 heads. however, i am having a bit of a time finding someone willing to lend a billy or have me bring my doe there. people say they keep a "closed flock" so they would rather sell me a billy. i understand completely, because i havent had those tests done either so i see why they may not want thier goats in contact with mine even though she seems totally healthy to me.
i hate to buy a billy just for one doe, so im going to keep looking. thanks for all the info everyone!


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## RareBreedFancier (Jan 8, 2012)

I'd say you'd have a better chance of finding a buck for her if you had the tests done. I know I wouldn't want an untested doe here but if she's tested she'd be welcome to visit for dates. 

Admittedly I haven't got my tests done yet (car needed new engine and several emergency vet bills have postponed testing) but I'd get them done immediately if someone wanted to use my buck. I want to get them done soon anyway as if they are clear I can use a pure bred dairy buck close to me and I won't need to keep a buck here.

Edit for spelling.


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## dwbonfire (Jan 8, 2012)

yeah i understand the caution. ill have to look into how much the tests cost and see if its something i can do at this time.

so today i noticed her posturing like she was about to pee, and nothing as happening. then a while later i was petting her and scratching her back and she arched her back all sideways and was peeing all over the place! lol shes never done this before so im wondering if this could be a sign that shes in heat??


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## RareBreedFancier (Jan 9, 2012)

Sounds like it.  Does will stand and pee for the buck so I guess she's hoping she'll attract one.


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## dwbonfire (Jan 9, 2012)

silly girl.. ok now that i know shes probably in heat, if i miss this cycle as far as getting her bred, how long until her next cycle will be?

a man called me about two bucks he has that he will let me use to breed to. one is lent out right now and wont be available for a month or two. he said hes the smaller of the two bucks and real pretty.. i am specifically looking for a small buck because my doe is real small. i havent had much experience with goats at all, but the woman i got her from said she was the smallest doe she had and she thinks she might be considered a mini.. if i measure how tall she is will that give a better indication of her being a standard size or mini?
he has another buck that is bigger, but im affraid if she is infact considered a mini and the buck is alot bigger that she will have trouble kidding and i sure dont want that.
he said he charged her $30 to take the buck and i assume he'd charge me the same. is that average? i got offered a 9 month old billy for $35 but i just dont know if i want to keep a buck here all the time..


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## Chirpy (Jan 9, 2012)

Goats cycle every 18-21 days.  So you can watch at that time period to see if she shows signs again or can plan a breeding for that time.

I, personally, would never use a large buck with a very small doe... it's not worth the risk of losing her or her kids because they are too big for her to give birth to.  Some small bucks throw larger kids... you should do some research to find out what kids this buck has on the ground and what size they were (of course the doe has lots to do with size also so there are no absolutes but general ideas).

Can you post a picture of your doe?  That would help us help you know the possible breed and give you better ideas on what size buck to use for breeding.

As for breeding fees?   It's different everywhere... we pay a minimum of $50 here (that's for a good buck not just a backyard buck).  The better the buck the closer to $100 the fee is.

You are doing a great job learning...  keep it up and keep asking questions.  


edited for spelling error


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## dwbonfire (Jan 14, 2012)

i had opened a new thread with pics of my doe and yall seem to think shes an average or big pymgy! i was thinking the opposite lol, so anyhow i found a young billy that i can take and keep here as long as i need. i have done dealings with the man and his animals are healthy so thats not much concern. im not sure she is still in heat right now, so i might end up missing this cycle. however if i havent then i counted that she will have a mid- June baby. if i missed this cycle and shes bred next month then a mid- July baby. i am in NC so my summers are hot, is a mid summer baby an ok idea? i dont want to have bad timing.. what do you all think? i see a lot of kidding threads this time of year so it seems a lot of people have kids fall/winter. do you all have a second crop too or just breed for fall/winter kids? i was told my pygmy is not a seasonal breeder so she could have kids anytime, but i just want to know when is the best time weather-wise.
thanks!


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## Chirpy (Jan 15, 2012)

I've had kids in winter (January) all through the spring and into early summer (June).   Our weather is very different from yours but I much prefer late spring or summer babies.   There is always a concern when kids are born in cold weather...  newborn kids get cold really, really quickly and can have life threatening issues.   Kids born in warm/hot weather seldom have body temperature issues (I think the only concern would be if they were born outside in the rain and weren't able to get dry right away).   

I don't know what potential negatives there would be where you live for summer kidding... possibly issues with the doe being to hot??   I hope someone who lives with your weather temps chimes in.


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## dwbonfire (Jan 16, 2012)

thanks for your input!

well i picked up a young billy from the man that i know. i think i missed this cycle but im hoping for the next one we will have success! i will take some pics of the billy, hes only about 9 months old and hes very small and pretty. i was told he should have no problem breeding my doe, he will find a way! hes brown with black.

he was wormed with cydectin right then before i took him, and i was thinking i might should worm my doe before i put them together and shes bred? i havent wormed her since i got her, and im not sure when she was wormed at her previous home. she appears fine, but i thought it might be a good idea so i wont have to worry while shes pregnant. what do yall think? i figure i will worm my calf and ewe at the same time since they all run together. is cydectin a good choice for her and the rest of them as well? its quite pricey and i would like to eventually get some but im not sure i can afford that right yet, so is there a less pricey but still effective wormer out there i could use?

thanks! i will post pics of the billy tonight.


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## cindyg (Jan 16, 2012)

I don't think it's a good idea to worm them just in case.  It's pretty cheap to get a fecal examination to check worm load and the vet will then recommend worming or not.  Mine had not been wormed since I got them, and I was thinking the same thing, just in case, but the exam showed extremely light/no worm load, so you never know.


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## dwbonfire (Jan 17, 2012)

well i missed this cycle which is not a bad thing. it gives me some time to get a fecal done and see if shes got any worms and time to treat before shes bred. also to keep the little billy in quarantine for a couple weeks, not that i suspect anything wrong with him. hes enjoying his stay next to the turkeys lol they arent so thrilled but hes very intersted in them so i guess they keep him entertained.

here he is, isnt he so cuute! 











im supposed to be just borrowing him, but hes got such a darling little face and expression i dont know how i will give him back! i do have option to buy him, so i just need to figure out if its worth it for me to keep him around for just one doe.... i think i just need to get a couple more does


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## Missy (Jan 18, 2012)

He is sooo cute! He looks like a mini Oberhasli(I know he is not


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## Chirpy (Jan 18, 2012)

He is a cutie.... I love his color.


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