# Expelling the after birth



## glenolam

How long does it take for heifers to expel the after birth?

We have 1 who's A-OK and another heifer who we think _may_ have not yet expelled it.  They both calved yesterday morning.

We are contacting a vet this afternoon just in case, but figured I throw this out there as well.  Thanks!

ETA - let's also add this question:

How do you know if she has a retained placenta?  What's normal and what's not?

Our heifers both still have discharge, but we are assuming that's normal since, well hey, they just gave birth....


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## jhm47

Most likely she expelled it shortly after giving birth, and either she ate it, or a dog or some other predator dragged it off.  If the calf is nursing properly, the cow will naturally give off oxytocin, which causes her uterus to contract, and this usually will cause the afterbirth to expel.  Discharge is normal for several days after parturition.


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## aggieterpkatie

Unless you actually see it hanging from her, she likely passed it.


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## glenolam

Thanks - both have "stuff" hanging from them and we just weren't sure if we needed to be concerned.

Everyone is still eating/drinking/acting healthy so our level of concern is still low, but we know to never be off guard.

The vet said at this point there's nothing he would do if they in fact didn't pass the placenta - he said they don't use oxytocin to stimulate uterine contractions anymore beause recent studies have shown that the affects are so minimal it's pretty useless.  He also said he does NOT advise pulling it out (Ummmm...to me that just seems like a bad idea anyway and I didn't even suggest it) because it could break off into peices or cause the placenta to detach from the uterus incorrectly.

He said that if they still have the placentas and they're showing no signs of distress, they'll eventually pass it as it will start to decompose, get loose and just fall out.


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## aggieterpkatie

Do they just have discharge or a large amount of tissue?  I mean, you'd know if it was the placenta.  Usually if it's retained they get an antibiotic treatment.


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## herfrds

How about a couple of pictures?

Every once in awhile we get one that does not pass the after birth. We give them a shot of lutelyis (sp?) and start them on antibiotics.
it is not pleasant for the cow to have that decomposing in her and they do get sick.

Once it starts to decompose we help by pulling it out. Word of warning wear a gas mask. the smell will gag a buzzard.


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## glenolam

Sorry - I haven't had a chance to take pics.

But I actually think they both have a retained placenta.  They both have tissue still hanging from their vulva.

I called the vet again, but someone's got to call me back.  Heifer #1 is acting fine (still eating, drinking, peeing, pooping well) and seemed to push a bit more out yesterday, but heifer #2 may be "off", we just can't decide.  She didn't gobble the grain down yesterday afternoon like our other 2 cows did, but when we gave them hay later on in the evening (we've been giving them hay in addition to pasture to keep their condition up) she ate some up.

When I spoke to the vet on Monday, he said that if they showed signs of distress he would give them LA200.  When a vet calls back I plan on asking how much, how often etc - I'm wondering if it would be easier and less expensive to buy a big bottle of it from Jeffers or something than buying doses from the vet.

I read the dose is 4.5 ml/100lbs and 1 dose lasts 3 days - is that right or is the dose off label?

Am I still just over reacting and really should let nature take its course?

I've read so many conflicting articles/forums and spoken to other farmers in the area who all say something different.  Some say we're going to loose them fast because of this scaring us to death and some say we need to relax - sometimes it takes several weeks.


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## herfrds

Ok since you are saying tissue it does make me think they did retain the placenta, but without seeing it I can't say for sure.

Now they do have a normal discharge of what looks like tissue but is actually mucus. It has fooled me before. Only way to really tell is grab it. If  it is hard to pull and does not come out it is the placenta. If it comes apart in your hand it is mucus.

Is #2's ears starting to droop? Head hanging a bit lower then normal? Just laying there looking sorry for herself?

Go get a bottle of LA200. Now this goes under the skin. (SQ).
Best to dose #2 in a squeeze chute with a head catch.
Figure 1100# give 50cc's. 
Do not give it all in one location. The neck and shoulder.
Use a 50cc syringe with a 16 gauge needle 1/2" long. For SQ the needle does not have to be very long.
When we give that much at one time we divide it into 3 different areas.
Roughly 16cc's on each side of the cows neck and the last along the shoulder.

Your not overreacting. Better to do something now then wait and have a bigger problem.


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## glenolam

The "stuff" coming out both are hard to pull, so I'm going with they have retained their placentas.

They both were laying down when we got home and it took them a pet or two (mind you, they don't like to be pet at all) to get up, but after giving birth I could understand they're tired.  Once up, #2 went right to eating the grass and grazing, which was something she wasn't doing yesterday.  #1 was acting just as she has always done - and we haven't noticed that there's anything wrong with her.

We put hay out and all three went right for it and gobbled it up.  We were happy to see #2 up and about, eating/peeing and pooping and I did notice that when she pooped a little more of the placenta came out.  Not much, but some.

I'll order the LA 200 and do as you said.  We had to give the chute back, but I'm sure we can borrow it again soon.  There's no way I'd give her the shot without the chute anyway.

Would you suggest I give #1 the LA 200 as well?

If I give 50 cc, when do I have to follow up, or do I have to at all?


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## herfrds

Yes give it to both.

Follow up in 3-4 days same dose.

Keep an eye on them.

Also in a few days it should have decayed enough that you can try to remove it. Like I said before wear a gas mask, gloves and goggles.
Pull downward and out.
This is the only time we attempt to pull out a retained placenta. Never do it earlier you can damage the uterus.
Just grab it and apply some traction, don't pull too hard, if some comes out and stops and becomes too hard that is fine, give it another day. Just work at it slowly.
It will be white and grayish in color and hard to hang onto and it will smell bad.
Our vet hates calls to do this.
I know some will say just leave it and don't worry, but we like to try to get it out for the cows sake.


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## glenolam

Well - good news and sorta bad news.

Heifer #2 (with the horns) has expelled the afterbirth!  I came home today and she's funk free on her rear end - no "strings of stuff" no discharge, nothing.  Now, I can't find the afterbirth, so she either ate it, which I doubt b/c she refused to clean her calf, but hey...who knows, or it's deeper in the woods than I thought.  They haven't brought their calves too far in the woods yet, but of course we're not home to watch them 24/7.

Heifer #1 still has her stuff hanging out, but we saw her push about 4 times today and get a few inches out.  It's looking like she'll hopefully push hers out soon too.

Both are eating very well, active (#1 even played with her bull today), and pooping/peeing normally.

I have the LA 200, but haven't used it :/  We weren't able to get the chute back, and I wasn't going to press the issue because both girls were seeming fine.

thanks for all the help!


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## glenolam

Another quick and happy upate - both heifers have expelled the placenta on their own, no antibiotics were needed, but at least we now have them on hand just in case!


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## aggieterpkatie

glenolam said:
			
		

> Another quick and happy upate - both heifers have expelled the placenta on their own, no antibiotics were needed, but at least we now have them on hand just in case!


I'd give them a round of antibiotics anyways.  It was quite a while before the finally passed them, and you don't want to mess around with uterine infections. Plus, you dont' know if the whole placenta came out, or if parts of it rotted off and stayed inside.


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## glenolam

Makes perfect sense aggieterpkatie....thanks!!


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