# Fudgie's first freshening, questions about FF udders and BABY PICS!



## glenolam (Feb 8, 2011)

Fudgie was/is due anywhere from Feb 2nd - Feb 22nd.  She hasn't yet kidded, but her little udder has grown substantially.  It was stretched last night - sorta like a little basketball, but her teats are still teeny tiny.  She's an oberhasli/nubian cross.

Do they drop milk into their teats as they get closer to kidding?

Here's a pic -it's not the best one, but it's what I could get since she's refusing to be touched, looked at, talked to, paid attention to, etc.  I promise her udder is bigger than it looks in this picture - it really is like a small basketball.








Here's some pictures of her taken last night:


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## helmstead (Feb 8, 2011)

FF teats are often smallish.  They get longer and wider through the first lactation, and then considerably bigger (usually) on the 2nd and 3rd lactations.

Can't tell you how close she is based on that...though.


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## glenolam (Feb 8, 2011)

Do FF sometimes wait to fill their teats until they freshen, like some does wait to bag up until the day they kid?

She only has a week and a half left at most, I just woulda thought her teats would have filled a little more by now.


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## ksalvagno (Feb 8, 2011)

Some do, some don't. I have heard of girls that don't even bag up until they are birthing.


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## glenolam (Feb 8, 2011)

:/  That's what I figured.  

On the plus side, I have noticed her ligs are very soft (from the quick grabs I get in).  Almost to where I can wrap my fingers around the tail head.  She's maaing and biting her right side and giving me pathetic "Mmmmmmmm"s.  No major stretching or hunching yet.

Now what is really funny is this am when I was out there I noticed my herd queen squat to pee and she did the "hunch and punch".  I think she got a waft of hormones and excited herself!


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## Emmetts Dairy (Feb 8, 2011)

glenolam said:
			
		

> :/    She's maaing and biting her right side and giving me pathetic "Mmmmmmmm"s.


Shes saying "God help me..get these darn kids outta of me..will this even end" !!!!!


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## glenolam (Feb 8, 2011)

I think at this point she's thinking "What the heck is going on inside and what has he done to me?

Edited to change it from 'what have YOU done to me' since I'm not really the one who did this!


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## Emmetts Dairy (Feb 8, 2011)

I love the close up pic of her!!! She looks like shes smiling!!!!

Love goatie faces!!!


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## Emmetts Dairy (Feb 8, 2011)

glenolam said:
			
		

> I think at this point she's thinking "What the heck is going on inside and what has he done to me?
> 
> Edited to change it from 'what have YOU done to me' since I'm not really the one who did this!


  

Oh yes...its her first time..!!!  

Hope she does well for you!!!


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## Ariel301 (Feb 8, 2011)

Looks like a normal first freshener udder to me. The teats will expand as she is getting milked/nursed; they'll stretch and in a year or two will be easier to milk.


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## glenolam (Feb 8, 2011)

Now...another FF udder question.  She's got black spots on the orifices of her teats.  Is that a FF plug thing?  I dont recall seeing it on my seasoned doe when she freshened last year, but I dont ever recall really looking.


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## chandasue (Feb 8, 2011)

I'm pretty sure what you're seeing in the waxy little plug.


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## glenolam (Feb 8, 2011)

Well - I think I'm in for a freaking really long cold night.  We have amber goo, minor contractions, stretching but NO NOISE.  It's weird.  She squats to pee, goo comes out and not a peep!

I'll keep you posted as I run to and from to warm up!  Wish us luck!


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## femalecbrown (Feb 8, 2011)

Not to sound stupid but...what does the term "first freshener" mean?


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## elevan (Feb 8, 2011)

First time kidding (having babies)

eta: and there are no stupid questions.


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## freemotion (Feb 8, 2011)

It is the first time the doe has kids and starts lactating.  Freshening refers to each new lactation (and new kids...or calf, in the case of a cow.)


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## femalecbrown (Feb 8, 2011)

elevan said:
			
		

> eta: and there are no stupid questions.


Thanks for the information.  We got 2 goats 18 mts ago.  They are due around Feb. 15.  One has formed her bag but not too sure about the other.  She is the stubborn one in all ways.  ha


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## elevan (Feb 8, 2011)

femalecbrown said:
			
		

> elevan said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I've got one I'm waiting on too...her revised due date is 2/12-2/17...

Ask as many questions as you need to that's what everyone is here for!


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## glenolam (Feb 8, 2011)

Well - you can add two pink to my list!



Fudgie did awesome...so far. She's not really getting the "your babies need to nurse" thing.  One of the girls is up & around suckling on everything and anything.  I saw her get ahold of one teat and the other girl I had to help find it.  She got a little suckle, but is much slower at getting up.  She's just now starting to get up on all fours (bout 45 min after she was born).

One girl is chocolate brown with a racing strip - solid brown ears, and the other doeling has a white spot on her head and has more of Fudgie's coloring.  I even think the chocolate brown one has some light moon spots, but I'm not sure.

I'm taking a break to let them be alone then I'm going back in to make sure they're up and nursing.


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## Our7Wonders (Feb 8, 2011)

Congratulations!!!  Looks like you didn't have too long of a night - you still have plenty of time to get a good night's sleep!

Enjoy those babies - and get us some picture when you can!


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## femalecbrown (Feb 8, 2011)

Congratulations!


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## glenolam (Feb 8, 2011)

I'm going to be up all night checking in on them. It's really really cold and windy.  I moved the heat lamp to their side and hung it about 4 feet off the ground.

Here ya go!


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## ksalvagno (Feb 8, 2011)

Very cute.   Congratulations!


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## chandasue (Feb 8, 2011)

Lovely!


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## helmstead (Feb 8, 2011)

Oh My GOSH how cute are they?!


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## themrslove (Feb 8, 2011)

OoOoOoOoooo!  I love that little dark one!  
They are both precious!!!


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## glenolam (Feb 8, 2011)

Awww...thanks!  I feel quite special that she had two doelings on her first freshening.

And...because I'm so proud....here's more pics!


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## phoenixmama (Feb 8, 2011)

Sooooo cute!    I can't wait to see the kids out of my does!

And by the way, it does look cold there.  I shouldn't mention that it was sunny and 70 here today.  That would just be mean.


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## freemotion (Feb 8, 2011)

Aww, I already commented on them over on ss, but still.....awwww!!!

You can lower that heat lamp for tonight.  Just put it high enough that mama can't get burned.  But your stall looks pretty snug, and they have each other and that hay barrier to snuggle up to.  Don't ya just want to snuggle in with them?    OK, take them into your bed for the night, if I'm gonna really be honest????


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## glenolam (Feb 8, 2011)

I'd love to lower it, but alas, I don't have any place I can clip it to and don't really want to just let it hang.  When I go out there again...in two minutes...cause it's been 30...I'll see what I can do.


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## Livinwright Farm (Feb 8, 2011)

glenolam said:
			
		

> When I go out there again...in two minutes...cause it's been 30...I'll see what I can do.


  Oh, I can't wait for these days to come for my little herd!!  Seriously, I can't! 
Your new babies are 100% adorable!!!   I LOVE the long eared one!  I would call it Nestor(after the claymation christmas donkey mini-movie)  ^_^


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## freemotion (Feb 8, 2011)

Oh, I didn't see that it was clipped....I wrapped my cord around a rafter several times to hang mine, so I could raise or lower it by working at the wrapped cord and adjusting it.  I am so paranoid about fire, I wrapped it several times.  That thing was not moving!


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## glenolam (Feb 8, 2011)

phoenixmama said:
			
		

> And by the way, it does look cold there.  I shouldn't mention that it was sunny and 70 here today.  That would just be mean.


My sister lives out in Phoenix... 

Just Joking!  It's beautiful out there, but I've got to say, even with the snoverload we've had and these gawd aweful frigid temps I still prefer to live here where we have "real" seasons.


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## glenolam (Feb 8, 2011)

Free - when I was just out there...cause I was....and soon will be again...I did look and thought I could clip it to the hayfeeder to the left in the picture.  But then it would be at Fudgie's nose level and she's already sniffing it as it is so I'd hate for her to shove her nose in there and smell burnt nose hairs.

I left it as is...both girls are plunkering out after their grand entrance into the world.  I just hope they plunker down together - The white eared one laid down closer to the hay bales and cattle panel and the brown one was standing in the corner - Fudgie looked at both and jeeuuusssttt about laid down in between when choco felt the need to warm up on Fudgie juice.


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## Roll farms (Feb 9, 2011)

Adorable, congratulations.  I've often wondered what a Nub x Ob would look like....now I know.


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## SDGsoap&dairy (Feb 9, 2011)

Congrats- they have such sweet looking little faces!


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## glenolam (Feb 9, 2011)

Everyone is still doing well this morning & survived the cold night.  It's supposed to be in the 20's today, bright and sunny, then drop down to the single digits.  But at least they're dry now.  I sat with them for a while this morning and they both took turns inspecting me.  It totally made up for the lack of sleep!


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## 20kidsonhill (Feb 9, 2011)

glenolam said:
			
		

> I'd love to lower it, but alas, I don't have any place I can clip it to and don't really want to just let it hang.  When I go out there again...in two minutes...cause it's been 30...I'll see what I can do.


We don't even turn our heatlamps on when the low is only 30.  But I can't imagine it is giving those babies much heat way up there.  Have you considered making a heat lamp barrel for in the future?


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## glenolam (Feb 9, 2011)

Yes - 20k, a good friend of mine has 2 and if I want/need one it's there for the taking.  As I sat out there this morning under the light it didn't seem as bad as it did last night.  Neither of the girls were shivering and they were walking around under/near the light so I guess it's ok.  And...when I said "cause it's been 30" I meant 30 minutes since I'd been out there! 

When I went in there first thing this morning I almost had a heart attack because I couldn't see them.  They were both against the cattle panel and Fudgie had sorta wrapped herslef around them as best she could.  It was really sweet.

I'm very fortunate she's turning out to be such a great mom.

Now let's see how she does on the stand today!  I'd like to get a little colostrum saved _just in case_!

But those teats....milking them is going to be a two finger job - my thumb and pointer!

Does anyone have any tricks for milking FF right after kidding?  Keep in mind I'm not going to milk her out at all, just relieve some of the pressure and get a little colostrum to freeze.


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## SDGsoap&dairy (Feb 9, 2011)

glenolam said:
			
		

> Does anyone have any tricks for milking FF right after kidding?  Keep in mind I'm not going to milk her out at all, just relieve some of the pressure and get a little colostrum to freeze.


I have a trick: Patience, patience, and more patience. 

I have 2 ff's in milk right now and FWIW they're both perfect angels on the milk stand.  One is super easy to milk out, despite itty bitties, the other takes a good bit of work.  But I'll bet she behaves herself better than you expect.  At least I hope so anyway!


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## 20kidsonhill (Feb 9, 2011)

glenolam said:
			
		

> Yes - 20k, a good friend of mine has 2 and if I want/need one it's there for the taking.  As I sat out there this morning under the light it didn't seem as bad as it did last night.  Neither of the girls were shivering and they were walking around under/near the light so I guess it's ok.  And...when I said "cause it's been 30" I meant 30 minutes since I'd been out there!
> 
> When I went in there first thing this morning I almost had a heart attack because I couldn't see them.  They were both against the cattle panel and Fudgie had sorta wrapped herslef around them as best she could.  It was really sweet.
> 
> ...


funny about the 30 minutes. LOL.

I milk boer goats all the time after kidding to reserve emergency milk and it just takes extra time with some of the smaller teated does. I always appreciate the big teat on the nubian cross breeds, I try to get Day 1,2 and 3 milk supplies saved for future problem kids.


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## glenolam (Feb 9, 2011)

After she realized what her teats were for she didn't mind me "milking" them to make sure there was stuff coming out for the kids.

But...it was like a pin hole in a baloon.  Milking that is going to take FOREVER!

Since she kidded later yesterday I didn't want to put her on the stand after she kidded since by the time I would have been ready to it was past midnight.  Today I had to come into work so I plan on doing it this afternoon, not quite 24 hours later.  Figured it's not the best, most fresh colostrum but any is better than none.


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## ksalvagno (Feb 9, 2011)

I was going to take some colostrum from each doe to have on hand but when 2 of the does had triplets, I didn't want to take from the kids. My first one that had twins I did keep some colostrum.


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## jodief100 (Feb 9, 2011)

Those babies are sooo cute!  I can't wait to see dry pics. 

I think I will post pics of how we have our heat lamps hung and what kind.  I don't worry about mammas burning or lights coming down because of how we have them strung.  Hubby is an EE so he has everything fixed, hard wired and strung properly.  He made up a chart for me on what I can pug in where so I don't overload any circuits.    He is planning on rewiring the barn this summer so I can get more things plugged in and better organized.


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## glenolam (Feb 9, 2011)

Sounds great, Jodie!  And when he's done tell him to trot on over to the north east and do my barn!   Although, he'd prolly roll over in shock at our set up!  My DH is a fire sprinkler fitter, so at least if we start a fire he can put it out


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## jodief100 (Feb 9, 2011)

We use the 500 W "shop lights".  I got them for $10 at Lowes.







The cage has closely spaced wires and is far enough away from the lamp that mamas can't get close enough to be burned.  

Hubby uses conduit clamps to attach the bracket directly to the wall of the pen.  I noticed yours are particle board so I suggest screwing it through the particle board into a thicker board, such as a 2 x 4 on the opposite side. 

I am paranoid about fire in my barn.  We are on a cistern so no city water.  If we had a fire putting it out will be a challenge.  I have a fire extinguisher in my barn and another in the house.


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## 20kidsonhill (Feb 9, 2011)

Nice set-up Jodie. We don't have electricity out to our barn, we have to run extension cords(chords?). I could use your husband here, also.  500 watts per kidding pen would be a lot on our extensions cords.  I know some of you have heard my husband is a genius comment, but 8 years and still no power in barn, I might just take back my comment. 

I can't beleive you got those lights for 10bucks. For the bulbs and fixtures or just the bulbs?


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## jodief100 (Feb 9, 2011)

The $10 was the fixtures and the bulbs.  The online price is the same, you can order them.  The bulbs that came with them are low quality,  burned out quickly.  New ones were $4 and they seem to be holding up just fine.


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## glenolam (Feb 9, 2011)

So those are permanent fixtures, huh?  Or can he just unscrew the conduit clamps to remove the light?


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## aggieterpkatie (Feb 9, 2011)

Ahh, I thought that one doe looked like an Ober.


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## jodief100 (Feb 9, 2011)

glenolam said:
			
		

> So those are permanent fixtures, huh?  Or can he just unscrew the conduit clamps to remove the light?


You just unscrew them when you want to take them down.  I got Hubby a cordless drill for Christmas and he is LOVING it!  Much easier to get these things done.


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## freemotion (Feb 9, 2011)

20kidsonhill said:
			
		

> Nice set-up Jodie. We don't have electricity out to our barn, we have to run extension cords(chords?). I could use your husband here, also.  500 watts per kidding pen would be a lot on our extensions cords.  I know some of you have heard my husband is a genius comment, but 8 years and still no power in barn, I might just take back my comment.
> 
> I can't believe you got those lights for 10bucks. For the bulbs and fixtures or just the bulbs?


You can make the warming boxes/barrels that some here on byh use, basically a container with a smaller watt bulb (not a heat lamp) attached high up inside it.  There is a small door cut out at the bottom for the kids to crawl into, and the doe can't get in.  The container holds the heat, both of the bulb and the kids' body heat.  Very ingenious and simple.


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## jodief100 (Feb 9, 2011)

I have one of those too...

http://www.backyardherds.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=7995

I only use it in the "main" pen.  Then the babies have a safe place away from all the big does.  In the kidding pens I like mommas to be able to snuggle with their babies.


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## poorboys (Feb 9, 2011)

Cute little girls!!! love the long ears.


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## glenolam (Feb 9, 2011)

Here's a few dry pics:


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## rebelINny (Feb 9, 2011)

Very pretty girls! Congrats!


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## glenolam (Feb 10, 2011)

So....tried milking Fudgie yesterday.

Yeah.....

She was absolutely perfect on the stand.  Couldn't have cared less about what I was doing. However, given that her teats were the size of my pinky nail I wasn't able to get anything.  Milk came out so her teats are not plugged or anything but I couldn't get any more than little dribbles.

After trying for about 10 minutes I just let her down and left her be.  Hopefully after the kids have nursed for a few days I'll be able to get more.


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## ksalvagno (Feb 10, 2011)

It could be that she wasn't letting her milk down for you too. Plus just practice.  The kids are just adorable!


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## 20kidsonhill (Feb 10, 2011)

freemotion said:
			
		

> 20kidsonhill said:
> 
> 
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Thank you, we have 6 barrels, with heat lamp fixture screwed to the top  of them. We tried 125 bulbs, but decided they weren't warm enough on a cold night, so we put 250 watt heat lampbulbs in them. The barrels are sooo much safer than just hanging the heatlamps. I am surprised some people only use 60 watt light bulbs in the barrels.


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## 20kidsonhill (Feb 10, 2011)

glenolam said:
			
		

> So....tried milking Fudgie yesterday.
> 
> Yeah.....
> 
> ...


I have a couple boer that are like that. Since I have have others to choose from I just don't bother with getting emergency milk from them.


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## glenolam (Feb 10, 2011)

ksalvagno said:
			
		

> It could be that she wasn't letting her milk down for you too. Plus just practice.  The kids are just adorable!


I thought that, so I tried all the 'tricks' I've learned along the way - putting kids in front of her, bumping, etc but nada.  I think she just needs to woman up a little more.

I am going to continue trying each day, though, just so she gets more used to the stand for milking purposes as opposed to grooming.  Although, judging by her attitude yesterday I doubt I'll have to try hard to get her used to milking!  She was a gem!

I have several friends near by that could help me out in a pinch, but it's always useful to have some on hand.


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## Hillbilly (Feb 10, 2011)

congrats - lovely babies - and they look big babies, did she manage OK on her own.
I suppose they were only shivering after coming from a nice warm world into the cold and being wet wouldn't help


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## glenolam (Feb 11, 2011)

Fudgie did great, Hillbilly, much better than could ever be expected.

The doelings don't really shiver much anymore - Fudgie's been doing a great job of keeping them warm.  I put little dog sweaters on them yesterday because, even though I have a nice heat lamp set up for them they choose to lay down and sleep in the darkest, coldest spot in the barn :/  But they don't shiver and are still hopping around so I'm not worring about it.

We're thinking of names - trying to keep along the lines of Fudge Ripple since mom is Fudgie and dad is Rip.  So for the chocolate one we've got Rocky Road or Mocha Fudge and for the white-ish one we have Heavenly Hash or Moose Tracks.  Just can't decide

Tried putting Fudgie on the stand.  Still didn't get much out of those teats, but at least she was still a gem up there.  She still couldn't have cared less about me messing with her udder.  Those black spots on the orifices of her teats are still there, but I inspected them and there not really plugs since milk comes out no problem (I just have to really work for it!).  Since my fingers aren't sucking in addition to milking I figured the girls get enough when they nurse as opposed to me milking.

I'll try to get a picture of her udder this weekend and post it in the udder thread so you can see how she's doing.


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## aggieterpkatie (Feb 11, 2011)

Her udder could just be congested too.  It should soften up in a few days hopefully.


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## ksalvagno (Feb 11, 2011)

It could be that the kids are taking everything from her. I was getting about a quart a day from my girl and now I'm barely getting a pint from her and I need to feed one of her kids. But look at the other boy that is nursing from her and you can see where that milk is going. He is significantly bigger than his brother.


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## glenolam (Feb 11, 2011)

That was my other thought, too, k.  At any rate, I'm not going for gold any more - it just would've been nice to have a little colostrum on hand.


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