# More natural and economical approach to feeding?



## Chelsea2258 (May 22, 2014)

For those of you that do a more natural approach to feeing your goats, what is your feeding routine? I'm thinking that when I get goats (don't have any just yet) that I'll do browse/grazing, free choice alfalfa hay, and free choice loose minerals and then add some grain in the winter (Michigan) and/or when pregnant/nursing. Would this be enough? My research tells me that it should be fine but then I hear people giving pellets and baking soda and all this other stuff. I really want to go with as little commercial feed and as natural as possible without making it complicated. I also want to mix my own grains but I'm not sure of any good recipes that don't have commercial pellets or whatever in it. TIA for any and all help!


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## OneFineAcre (May 22, 2014)

Nothing wrong with your plan.  Baking soda isn't for any nutritional need, just for a sour stomach.  Helps with the gas.  You don't need pelleted feeds although they are formulated with the proper nutritional requirements for goats.  But there are other options.  Sorry, can't help with a recipe for your own, we get a local mix.


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## Chelsea2258 (May 22, 2014)

Thank you for your reply. Just needed a experienced persons advise/approval of it so that I don't think I'm doing it wrong. Lol. I just need to research or hopefully someone will comment with a mix. I will be growing my own wheat for flour and corn for eating and cornmeal so I'm hoping I can use some of what I'm growing in the mixes.


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## greenmulberry (May 23, 2014)

If you are feeding alfalfa and quality free choice minerals, with a small amount of grain in winter, it is fine to use corn for the grain. You may find as you get to know your goats better, that there are other grains you wish to include. I feed a little corn to my pregnant ewe in winter, I also like a handful of black oil sunflower seeds for vitamin E and protein. People have been using what grains they had available as animal feed for a long time, while everyone has their preferences, there is no one perfect mix. If I had wheat and corn on hand, that is what I would feed (in addition to the other good food of alfalfa and minerals). I have sheep but it is a similar feeding philosophy. If you feed good hay and minerals, I don't think the exact grain component is critical.


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## Chelsea2258 (May 23, 2014)

Thank you! Wheat berries, Corn, and Sunflower seeds, I can do! That's perfect and will keep my feed cost low.


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## SheepGirl (May 26, 2014)

You don't have to feed hay if they have access to pasture or browse. Waste of money imo.


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## Chelsea2258 (May 26, 2014)

I might ration hay in the summer and free choice in the winter. Not sure yet.


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## SheepGirl (May 26, 2014)

If you leave hay out free choice, animals tend to waste it or eat too much...all of which costs money. If they don't eat a lot of it, then it sits in the feeder until next feeding, getting sun bleached, rained or snowed on, etc, and the animals don't want to touch it because they know the 'good fresh stuff' will be coming next time they see you so they just hold out.

Read my post on this thread, you may find it useful: http://www.backyardherds.com/threads/how-much-hay-do-i-need.27054/#post-344030


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## OneFineAcre (May 26, 2014)

SheepGirl said:


> If you leave hay out free choice, animals tend to waste it or eat too much...all of which costs money. If they don't eat a lot of it, then it sits in the feeder until next feeding, getting sun bleached, rained or snowed on, etc, and the animals don't want to touch it because they know the 'good fresh stuff' will be coming next time they see you so they just hold out.
> 
> Read my post on this thread, you may find it useful: http://www.backyardherds.com/threads/how-much-hay-do-i-need.27054/#post-344030



SheepGirl really knows her stuff.  

I've learned a lot from her on the forum even though she has sheep and I have goats.

One of these days when I have time I'm going to build one of those feeders like she has.  She's quite the carpenter too.


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## Chelsea2258 (May 26, 2014)

I was planning on having the hay inside the shelter but I get your point. Maybe I'll ration year round but give a little more in the winter compared to summer because they'll be able to browse in the summer. Thank you.


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## greenmulberry (May 27, 2014)

Once the grass is up nicely, I don't offer hay. You can just play it by ear you know?

I find that no matter how much hay they have, or how nice the grass is, if I bring a flake of hay out, they all come over and pull it out of the feeder just to check if it is something extra good. 

In the summer, if I have doubts about the quality or the amount of grass out there, i will give my small flock one flake of hay. If they eat most of it, I might offer another, but they are like cats in that they will ALWAYS act hungry if you bring new food, even if there is perfectly fine food out there being ignored.


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## Chelsea2258 (May 27, 2014)

Yea. That's probably what I'll do. Play it by ear. I don't know how it'll be yet because we haven't bought a house yet so I don't know the quality of the grass or anything. We'll see.


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## Chelsea2258 (May 29, 2014)

Ok so another related question. Since I'm not feeding grain unless milking/pregnant or in the winter time, how much grain should I give goats who are milking/pregnant and how much should I give them in the winter (wheather they are milking/preg or dry/open)?


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## SheepGirl (May 30, 2014)

I don't give grain to non productive animals, even in the winter. Feeding hay actually is better in the winter because it makes the rumen work and digestion creates heat, which helps to keep them warm.

Now, for my sheep, ewes get 1/2 lb of grain per head per day in the last 30 days of gestation. If they are getting thin during this period, it usually means they have probably 3 in there so the grain gets upped to 1 lb. During lactation, ewes get 1/2 to 1 lb of grain per baby they are nursing, depending on their condition.

Again this is for sheep not goats, so you may need to adjust a little.


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## Chelsea2258 (May 31, 2014)

SheepGirl said:


> I don't give grain to non productive animals, even in the winter. Feeding hay actually is better in the winter because it makes the rumen work and digestion creates heat, which helps to keep them warm.
> 
> Now, for my sheep, ewes get 1/2 lb of grain per head per day in the last 30 days of gestation. If they are getting thin during this period, it usually means they have probably 3 in there so the grain gets upped to 1 lb. During lactation, ewes get 1/2 to 1 lb of grain per baby they are nursing, depending on their condition.
> 
> Again this is for sheep not goats, so you may need to adjust a little.


Ok. Thank you.


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## goatboy1973 (May 31, 2014)

Welcome to the herd! I too like the natural approach. Our farm, Calfee Farms (www.calfeefarms.net) hardly ever use grain and when we do use grain it is a treat and used to get the goats  to come when called for things like hoof trimming and deworming etc. our goats are grass/ forage fed year round along with a good grass hay in winter. We vaccinate all goats and deworm our goats on an as needed basis and any goat that needs any more than 3 dewormings a year is culled and same goes for the hoof trims; any more than 3 a year and they are taken to auction.


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## Chelsea2258 (May 31, 2014)

goatboy1973 said:


> Welcome to the herd! I too like the natural approach. Our farm, Calfee Farms (www.calfeefarms.net) hardly ever use grain and when we do use grain it is a treat and used to get the goats  to come when called for things like hoof trimming and deworming etc. our goats are grass/ forage fed year round along with a good grass hay in winter. We vaccinate all goats and deworm our goats on an as needed basis and any goat that needs any more than 3 dewormings a year is culled and same goes for the hoof trims; any more than 3 a year and they are taken to auction.


Thank you!


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## jodief100 (Jun 1, 2014)

We do not offer hay in the summer and limit it in the winter when they have stockpiled pasture.  They get grain year round though what they get in the summer is about 1 lb/ 8 goats- just enough to keep them running towards me when I shake the bucket.  What they get in the winter is very dependent on what stage they are in and what else is going on. Getting your hay tested will also help determine what they eat.   The best thing to do is watch your goats and check them daily. IF they are gettign thinner, feed more, if they are getting fatter, feed less.  In my opinion, alfalfa hay is too rich for them.  I feed an alfalfa mix hay if I can get it, mixed grass if I can't and add alfalfa pellets.


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## goatboy1973 (Jun 1, 2014)

jodief100 said:


> We do not offer hay in the summer and limit it in the winter when they have stockpiled pasture.  They get grain year round though what they get in the summer is about 1 lb/ 8 goats- just enough to keep them running towards me when I shake the bucket.  What they get in the winter is very dependent on what stage they are in and what else is going on. Getting your hay tested will also help determine what they eat.   The best thing to do is watch your goats and check them daily. IF they are gettign thinner, feed more, if they are getting fatter, feed less.  In my opinion, alfalfa hay is too rich for them.  I feed an alfalfa mix hay if I can get it, mixed grass if I can't and add alfalfa pellets.


Yeah, I totally agree with you about the alfalfa. It is WAY too rich for goats and not even recommended for male goats due to its high calcium content. I would think that this mainly applies to wethers due to their increased risk of urinary calculi. If i do feed a commercial feed in the winter, I custom mix it. I use one part sweet feed, to one part straight alfalfa pellets, to one part finely crushed corn, to one part dry shredded beet pulp. This is a wonderful feed for lactating does, expecting, sick, injured, creep feeding...a high energy and high vitamin/ antioxidant food source that aids in tissue repair and overall immune system booster. This the mix I also feed for a week to my kids that I am weaning with the addition of pelleted calf manna.


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## Chelsea2258 (Jun 2, 2014)

Thank you for your advice. I'm thinking that I'll do a alfalfa mix hay instead.


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## jodief100 (Jun 2, 2014)

I do something similar to GoatBoy only I don't use sweet feed.  They don't need the molasses and there is a risk of the food getting moldy.  I mix 2 parts commercial 18% protine pellets to 1 part whole corn and 1 part alfalfa pellets.  I will adjust the protein pellets up and down depending on condition and what hay I have.


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## Chelsea2258 (Jun 2, 2014)

Yea I'm leaning toward hay more than grain since I'm going the more natural route. Of course, I'm still doing grain for different stages or in the winter.


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## SheepGirl (Jun 4, 2014)

Just wanted to clear this up real quick...


goatboy1973 said:


> Yeah, I totally agree with you about the alfalfa. It is WAY too rich for goats and not even recommended for male goats due to its high calcium content. I would think that this mainly applies to wethers due to their increased risk of urinary calculi.



Alfalfa is actually GOOD for male animals in regards to male animals because of the calcium content. They need two to seven times much calcium as phosphorus in order to help prevent UC. It is the buildup of the phosphorus (primarily from the consumption of grains) that causes UC (a mineral blockage in the urethra); the calcium (found in most legumes, especially alfalfa) is what helps to break a part the phosphorus buildup.


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## goatboy1973 (Jun 5, 2014)

SheepGirl said:


> Just wanted to clear this up real quick...
> 
> 
> Alfalfa is actually GOOD for male animals in regards to male animals because of the calcium content. They need two to seven times much calcium as phosphorus in order to help prevent UC. It is the buildup of the phosphorus (primarily from the consumption of grains) that causes UC (a mineral blockage in the urethra); the calcium (found in most legumes, especially alfalfa) is what helps to break a part the phosphorus buildup.


Thanks for the clarification.


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## OneFineAcre (Jun 5, 2014)

I have dairy goats and while I do not feed alfalfa free choice, I consider it to be essential as a supplement to lactating does.  It helps boost production and helps to maintain good body condition. This is particularly true since we show our goats


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## goatboy1973 (Jun 15, 2014)

Chelsea2258 said:


> For those of you that do a more natural approach to feeing your goats, what is your feeding routine? I'm thinking that when I get goats (don't have any just yet) that I'll do browse/grazing, free choice alfalfa hay, and free choice loose minerals and then add some grain in the winter (Michigan) and/or when pregnant/nursing. Would this be enough? My research tells me that it should be fine but then I hear people giving pellets and baking soda and all this other stuff. I really want to go with as little commercial feed and as natural as possible without making it complicated. I also want to mix my own grains but I'm not sure of any good recipes that don't have commercial pellets or whatever in it. TIA for any and all help!


Here's what works for my operation and has worked for 13 yrs: I start out with a base of 50 lbs alfalfa pellets, 20 lbs of powdered corn, 15 lbs. of Black sunflower seeds,30 lbs of beet pulp (dry and shredded), 1/2 lb of CO-OP goat loose mineral with zinc, 1 cup of corn oil, and 1 large bottle of liquid molasses based goat vitamin such as Nutri-Drench. I have a good sized electric cement/ mortar mixer I use to mix all this up in. I first mix all the dry ingredients together except for the powdered corn and loose goat mineral. I then slowly add the corn oil, molasses based goat vitamin and mix until I achieve an even consistency. Then, with the mixer still running, I add the goat mineral and the powdered corn and mix until an even consistency is achieved. I feed this for about 6 weeks prior to breeding and the results are astounding. I usually feed this once daily and feed as much as my does can consume in 30 mins. To flush my bucks, I mix the same formula except I half the corn and alfalfa and replace the deficit with beet pulp due to corn and alfalfa being bad for male goats' urinary system. If you don't own an electric cement mixer, you can mix it in a large wheel barrow with a yard rake like I have done in the past with similar results. I mix up enough to last a week at a time. This mix must be kept in a cool place because it will rapidly start to ferment in the hot summer weather and spoil. Flushing works wonderfully at Calfee Farms. Most years we have 175% kidding rate, this year 200% kidding rate for spring kids and our fall 2012 kidding season we had all twins except for one single birth. Hope this recipe is not too complicated but once you get bags of each ingredient, you can mix as you need it even daily if you like.


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## M.L. McKnight (Jun 15, 2014)

You have a good idea. Personally, I don't feed my goats or cattle alfalfa because I don't want to have to worry about bloat. My horses and hogs LOVE when I get some for them though. I'd recommend that you grow some sainfoin instead of alfalfa, similar nutrient levels and doesn't cause bloat.

Try growing some sprouts for your goats. You can buy some of the ready made systems OR do what I do and sprinkle seeds in your own trays- water them and let the sun do its magic. My goats go nuts for sprouts, I've done wheat, oats, grass mixes and etc. It is really easy to do, just make sure that you keep the water changed, if you leave it too long you can end up having some ferment.

Have fun and good luck.


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## goatboy1973 (Jun 16, 2014)

M.L. McKnight said:


> You have a good idea. Personally, I don't feed my goats or cattle alfalfa because I don't want to have to worry about bloat. My horses and hogs LOVE when I get some for them though. I'd recommend that you grow some sainfoin instead of alfalfa, similar nutrient levels and doesn't cause bloat.
> 
> Try growing some sprouts for your goats. You can buy some of the ready made systems OR do what I do and sprinkle seeds in your own trays- water them and let the sun do its magic. My goats go nuts for sprouts, I've done wheat, oats, grass mixes and etc. It is really easy to do, just make sure that you keep the water changed, if you leave it too long you can end up having some ferment.
> 
> Have fun and good luck.


Our goats' main food source is pasture and overgrown woodland which they have access to 24/7 year round. We only feed the mixture for first time mommas if they need it or if we have a goat that is sick or injured.


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## goats&moregoats (Jul 19, 2014)

Have you gotten the goats yet?


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## Chelsea2258 (Jul 23, 2014)

No. My hubby just got out of the military and we moved in with his parents until we get jobs and are stable. Then we will buy a house and the goats will come a couple years after. I get ahead of myself a lot. Lol!


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