# My doe that was NOT pregnant just dropped a kid!  Ahhhh!



## KellyHM (Dec 15, 2010)

Ok, obviously she WAS pregnant, but she had no belly, no bag, nothing.  She STILL doesn't have a bag!  

My neighbor came banging on the door and this is how the conversation went:
Neighbor: Your goat just dropped a kid in the pasture.
Me: What goat?  Mine have all had their kids.
Neighbor: Well, I promise I just saw a kid fall out of one of them.
<me frantically running to the pasture>
Me: Holy crap!  Where did that come from?  She wasn't even pregnant!
Neighbor: Obviously she was.  


Of course she dropped him right in the DIRT!  He's currently residing in the bathroom on a heating pad with my other bottle baby.  I got about 4 oz of milk/colostrum into him from my other doe, but she's 48 hours post-freshening.  Is that "colostrum" enough or is it mostly out of the good stuff by now?  Do I need to get some powdered colostrum tomorrow?


----------



## greenfamilyfarms (Dec 15, 2010)

Well, it's good you were at home. As cold as it is, the little fellow could have been a kidcicle.


----------



## ksalvagno (Dec 15, 2010)

The colostrum is pretty much out of the good stuff for a newborn. If there is any way you could get the colostrum tonight, that would be good. My experience is with alpacas but I'm assuming this would be the same with any animal. The first 12 hours are the most important to get colostrum into a baby for immunity. So your new little guy really needs some colostrum now. He pretty much didn't get any colostrum from the goat milk. It is good that you are home and can tend to him, especially if mom doesn't have any milk. Have you tried milking her to see if there is any milk at all?


----------



## KellyHM (Dec 15, 2010)

I don't have any access to colostrum tonight.  I didn't have time to get to the feedstore by the time he was born.  I didn't try to milk his dam b/c she's CAE positive, so I wouldn't give him that colostrum anyways.  I guess I'll just have to take my chances and run to the feedstore first thing in the morning.  Sigh...


----------



## chandasue (Dec 15, 2010)

FWIW I raised 3 very healthy kids without any colostrum. Just whole cow's milk. It was all I had. They're perfectly fine at 8 months of age.


----------



## helmstead (Dec 15, 2010)

Oh, wow.

Are you SURE you can't get any colostrum from the dam?  I'd get it, heat treat it and get some in that baby, fast.

Congrats on the surprise!

Next time one of the CAE negative does kids, be sure to freeze some colostrum!


----------



## hcammack (Dec 15, 2010)

helmstead said:
			
		

> Oh, wow.
> 
> Are you SURE you can't get any colostrum from the dam?  I'd get it, heat treat it and get some in that baby, fast.
> 
> ...


I agree we have a freezer full of colostrum at the farm I work on. Its very important that they kid or calf gets colostrum soon after birth.


----------



## KellyHM (Dec 15, 2010)

The problem is I currently only have 3 does, 2 of them being CAE positive.  The CAE negative doe is nursing her own twins, and I was already milking her for the other doeling from the 1st CAE pos doe, so that didn't leave much colostrum to freeze.  

I don't think it's going to matter though b/c I think this newest little buck has white muscle disease.    He's got all the symptoms and this same doe's kids died soon after birth last year (one at 24 hours and the other at 7 days after being on IV fluids, dextrose, etc for 3 days).  I don't really understand how she could be so deficient since she eats the SAME diet as everyone else...Purina Goat Chow, free choice coastal supplemented with alfalfa, & a mineral black available at all times.  The other CAE pos doe is her twin sister and has NEVER had any problems with her kids.  I just don't get it.  

I have a learned a LOT since I got my Nubians and most of it has been through hands-on experiences that are not so positive.  I'd really like to  the people that sell sick animals that they KNOW are sick and don't disclose it to people who are naive enough not to ask.

Ok, rant over.


----------



## helmstead (Dec 15, 2010)

BoSe...NOW!  And keep your does current on BoSe, a booster 30 days prior to kidding (when you know the date, approx, of course).

It could also be CAE encephalitis...in which case, I don't think there's much to do.  I can't remember if that has a birth onset or is later, around weaning time...


----------



## KellyHM (Dec 16, 2010)

I'm headed to the store for BoSe (assuming I can find it) as soon as they open this morning.  I'm almost positive CAE encephalitis only occurs if they're allowed to nurse from the dam, which he was not, but I'd have to look it up again to make sure.  He seems to be slightly improved this morning.  If I put him on his feet he can stand for short periods of time and walk around a bit.  He even managed to get up on his own once.  He doesn't sounds as congested as he did last night either.  He still gets super worn out after standing/walking and eating.  Still taking the bottle well.  Fingers crossed it's just his skeletal muscle and not his heart and that the BoSe will snap him out of it!


----------



## Calliopia (Dec 16, 2010)

I believe BoSe is by prescription only.  You can get selenium-E gel/paste stuff at TSC and the like but it's dosed for horses and is hard to divide for goats.


----------



## Roll farms (Dec 16, 2010)

It also isn't absorbed as quickly (IMHO, not enough to help here).

Get a bottle of BoSe from a vet THIS MORNING, give him 1/2 cc ASAP.

You may have to give him another 1/2 cc tomorrow....but don't overdose him.  
If it's going to help, it will do so quickly.  I would be tempted to give him a B shot as well.

Good luck.


----------



## KellyHM (Dec 16, 2010)

Want to hear the funny part?  Don't laugh at me...I am a vet.  But I do small animal emergency and we get ZERO goat stuff in school.  I have Vitamin B complex and will give some of that.  The LA vets I know don't carry BoSe b/c they don't see goats and generally don't neet it.  I'm trying to call BoSe in to Walmart.    The guy probably thinks I'm nuts.  If they don't have it I am scheduled to go see another farm today and pick out a future kid.  The lady who owns it said I can borrow a cc, so one way or the other I'll get my hands on some!  Lesson learned for next time...


----------



## Calliopia (Dec 16, 2010)

Write your own scrip then and call it into one of the online Vet RX places. Then overnight a bottle to yourself.


----------



## KellyHM (Dec 16, 2010)

Calliopia said:
			
		

> Write your own scrip then and call it into one of the online Vet RX places. Then overnight a bottle to yourself.


Yep, will do.  Wal-mart doesn't carry it.  

ETA: I think I'm going to make a list of all the things I've found that I need and order them all when we place our clinic order on Monday.


----------



## phoenixmama (Dec 16, 2010)

Maybe the feed stores around you are different...but around here, the ones that carry vaccines also usually have the frequently used prescriptions meds in stock.  I bought a vial of Bio-Mycin from my feed store a few months back.  My goat's veterinarian told me about this...I thought it was illegal, but I must be wrong about that because it seems to be common practice around here.  

My point?  Maybe the feed stores around you have BoSe.


----------



## ksalvagno (Dec 16, 2010)

Biomycin isn't prescription. There are a few antibiotics that don't need a prescription.


----------



## phoenixmama (Dec 16, 2010)

Oh, I guess you are right.  I assumed it was since it was on the "drugs allowable" list on the prescription from the veterinarian.


----------



## KellyHM (Dec 16, 2010)

Well, he's up walking around and screaming at me for food, so I think he may make it (knock on wood).  He's still a little weaker than the others, but he's picking up speed.  Got the BoSe and gave him 1/2 cc tonight.  Hopefully he'll continue to do ok.


----------



## ksalvagno (Dec 16, 2010)

I guess you will soon be a goat vet!   Glad your little guy is doing ok.


----------



## ohiogoatgirl (Jan 7, 2011)

yep, you gotta wonder at goats timing on these things... and why in the dirt! :/

there is a joke like that...
what's a good exam paper for a vet?
"how can you tell if a goat is pregnant or not and an explanation of why"





ha ha ha ha !!!!!!


----------

