# How Do I Put My Does On A Diet?



## brentr (Jul 25, 2011)

I expected two litters this week, but so far just empty nest boxes.  Darn!  Not sure if I was a victim of summer sterility in the buck (it was +/-90 when I bred them; bred them at night when it was cooler) or what, but now I'm concerned that my does are carrying excess weight.  I'd been feeding them free choice on the assumption they were pregnant.

I plan to wait until late August to breed again, and let the temps drop a bit.  In the meantime, what suggestions are out there for rationing my does?  I think it would be a little better at breeding time if they were just a bit lighter than they are now.  I feed them a 15% pellet (producer's pride from TSC) and some orchard grass hay to nibble on.  What amount should I feed them per day?  And does it matter if I feed it all at once (one time per day) or should I break it into smaller amounts a few times a day?

Any input is welcome!


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## Beekissed (Jul 25, 2011)

When I wanted does to diet, I'd feed the low protein feeds and limit the portions but provide plenty of hay for them to nibble upon.  One doesn't have to give continuous feed just because one had a continuous feeding bin in the cage.  IMO, rabbits eat less when it's hot anyway so this should be a good time to cut down on the grub.


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## dewey (Jul 25, 2011)

It could very well be the bucks with the heat.

Many rabbits thin down in the summer from not eating as much...but if the does are truly overweight, feeding them more hay (a total diet food) and no more pellets than they will eat in 15 minutes or so 1x daily should help.

Can any bone be felt when stroked down the back with very light pressure?  If so, the does are probably not overweight, especially if they're NZ's (sorry, don't recall your breed).


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## Ms. Research (Jul 27, 2011)

dewey said:
			
		

> It could very well be the bucks with the heat.
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> Many rabbits thin down in the summer from not eating as much...but if the does are truly overweight, feeding them more hay (a total diet food) and no more pellets than they will eat in 15 minutes or so 1x daily should help.
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> Can any bone be felt when stroked down the back with very light pressure?  If so, the does are probably not overweight, especially if they're NZ's (sorry, don't recall your breed).


Sorry to but in but I have a question. 

Dewey, I've read that pellets are not good and can cause a doe or buck to become overweight when they become adults (at one year?).  As well as alfalfa grass/hay.   I read it's unwise to feed alfalfa pellets to young rabbits as well.  My plans are that at 7 months to start cutting back on the timothy pellets that I free choice now.  Do you think this would be too soon or too late, maybe 5 or 6 months and start supplimenting more greens and fruits, at 7 months.  They will always have free choice timothy grass/hay.  I also have timothy cubes for them to roll around and chew on.  

And how much pellets should an Adult dwarf (any breed) need?  Body weight would be the answer?  

Thanks.


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## bunnygal (Jul 27, 2011)

Hi Brent:

Does should not be free fed while pregnant.  Free feeding for those 31 days leading up to kindling can cause a doe to become quite fat.  An overweight rabbit can have birthing problems and stillborn kits.

Weight loss in rabbits needs to be done very, very slowly.  Determine what the normal daily ration should be to maintain the rabbits current weight, then decrease it by 1/4 cup a day to result in a slow and steady weight loss.  

Best luck with future litters!

Lisa L.


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## Ms. Research (Jul 27, 2011)

Excuse me again for popping in again, but I have another question.

bunnygal partial reply was:

*Does should not be free fed while pregnant.  Free feeding for those 31 days leading up to kindling can cause a doe to become quite fat.  An overweight rabbit can have birthing problems and stillborn kits.*

Would you free choice alfalfa?  Not in pellet form but grass/hay.  I know alfalfa is low-protein and is only good for putting on weight.  But could that help with the doe and her milk?  I understand completely about the overweight, but how do you maintain that weight until the kits birth?  And what would you feed her for the 6 weeks until weaning?  

Thanks


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## bunnygal (Jul 27, 2011)

Ms. Research said:
			
		

> Excuse me again for popping in again, but I have another question.
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Gosh no!    Alfalfa is inot low in protein - just the opposite it is incredibly high in protein and calories.
Alfalfa hay is 20% protein, where timothy hay and orchard grass range from 7-10% protein.
You can free feed first or second cut timothy hay or orchard grass, but nothing that can make them fat.

Pregnant and nursing does should be on an 18% protein pellet.  If that were to be combined with alfalfa hay, the protein level could actually lead to kidney failure.

Lisa L.


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## bunnygal (Jul 27, 2011)

Ms. Research said:
			
		

> Excuse me again for popping in again, but I have another question.
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I realize I didn't answer all of your question.

In my 24 years of rabbit breeding, I have never had a doe lose weight while pregnant.  They need nothing more than their normal rations while pregnant and hay if you choose to feed it.

Free feed should begin on the second day after kindling and be stopped one week before weaning.  I wean at 4 weeks, so I stop free feeding at 3 weeks.

Please let me know if I can be of any further help.

Lisa L.


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## Ms. Research (Jul 27, 2011)

bunnygal said:
			
		

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Thanks for putting me straight on the alfalfa.   I really appreciate your informative guidance.


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## Ms. Research (Jul 27, 2011)

bunnygal said:
			
		

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I thank you for your offer of help in the future.  It's great to know and I will definitely keep you in mind for guidance.  Thanks.


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## dewey (Jul 28, 2011)

Ms. Research said:
			
		

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Hey there.   Feeding too many calories causes weight issues, regardless of what's fed.  Pellets (mostly alfalfa) often get needless bad press...they've been used quite successfully for many years.  There's more than one way to feed rabbits and I'm all for whatever works for the individual meat producer.  Pellets made raising meat rabbits easier while being nutritionally sound without having to work all kinds of mojo to be sure they received the nutrition needed, especially so for production herds.  

My nursing does and kits get 18% pellets with timothy or bermuda hay.  They get hay every day but I go easy on the hay amounts with nursing does and growing litters bound for the table, since I want neither group on diet food for obvious reasons.  I do not feed alfalfa hay (even though we raise 2000 acres of it and have for over 100 years on the family ranch, ha) since the 18% pellets do not usually need a protein boost, nor the issues created from too much calcium.  

I free feed pellets to nursing does, and growing buns until around 5 months old.  None ever get fat.  At 5 months (a few months shy of breeding age) I eval their condition and adjust pellets and hay as needed for conditioning.  Others get their daily ration that they will eat in a short time (I do feed 2x daily by cutting rations in 1/2..many others feed 1x daily just fine), plus hay...and many folks never feed hay or veggies to their production stock and litters with great success.  Most large commercial meat producers do not feed hay or extras.  

For my kits intended to wean, they get plenty of hay from birth on (in the boxes) and during weaning and beyond to help with a healthy gut during weaning, but not so much hay that they would be thin.

Everyone has their own way and no one way is right or wrong.   I think we all keep learning and adapting to what works best for us.


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## Ms. Research (Jul 28, 2011)

dewey said:
			
		

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Thanks Dewey, I really appreciate the time you took for this informative input.  My Guys are putting on weight well free choice of pellets and they will be seeing the Rabbit Vet at 4-1/2 months.  I will find out then HOW they are fairing and if they are at the right weight in his opinion.   I think at 5 months I can cut down on their free choice of pellets and am considering the split feed.  1/2 in the morning with fresh hay and the 1/2 evening with fresh hay and a few veggie treats.  

Also thanks for the explanation of the pellets, both timothy and alfalfa.  

I truly believe we all keep learning and adapting to what works best for us.  I appreciate those who have been there giving someone like me starting out a leg up with a variety of information to help find a common ground.


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## dewey (Jul 28, 2011)

Ms. Research said:
			
		

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You're welcome.  

I'm sure your buns are doing great.  The few I have outdoors in higher temps are hayed in the a.m. then fed their whole daily pellet ration at night, to eat when it cools off a bit....when it gets so warm as it's been here they haven't much interest in eating until it cools down at night, and no sense having it lay untouched all day.  

All the best with your research.


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## Ms. Research (Jul 29, 2011)

dewey said:
			
		

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Thanks for your best wishes.  Since my pet bunnies are "inside".  And my "breeding" does, when I'm ready will be "inside" as well, I guess the heat or cold won't matter.  But it's kind of logical the way you feed "outside" bunnies.  I know I don't really feel like eating anything heavy when it's hot.   But I was also thinking that bunnies are more active at night, and feeding the pellets at night would be best?    I already have my bunnies on a morning schedule and not a good idea? to change the routine once established or like introducing new food could be changed gradually.  I was wonder what you thought about feeding pellets morning or night?   Being the weather really doesn't affect them considering they have a/c and heat.


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## dewey (Jul 29, 2011)

Ms. Research said:
			
		

> Thanks for your best wishes.  Since my pet bunnies are "inside".  And my "breeding" does, when I'm ready will be "inside" as well, I guess the heat or cold won't matter.  But it's kind of logical the way you feed "outside" bunnies.  I know I don't really feel like eating anything heavy when it's hot.   But I was also thinking that bunnies are more active at night, and feeding the pellets at night would be best?    I already have my bunnies on a morning schedule and not a good idea? to change the routine once established or like introducing new food could be changed gradually.  I was wonder what you thought about feeding pellets morning or night?   Being the weather really doesn't affect them considering they have a/c and heat.


If feeding pellets just once daily, weather being a factor or not, feeding the ration at night would probably be considered fairly standard.  Most healthy rabbits would do fine flip-flopping their feed schedule if they have hay available.  When I've thought I had more bags of feed in the shed, but there wasn't (someone stocks it from the shed to the barn for me) the rabbits have done fine with just hay until next feeding.   Years ago I got flooded in for several days and the buns had only hay until the washes lowered enough to get out to the feed store.  Not the best way to go for them but all was fine.


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## Ms. Research (Jul 29, 2011)

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Thanks, didn't want to do anything to mess up their diet.   I think as I grow from two bunnies to more in October, I'll just start the the new ones on the same routine and intend for them to reach the routine I set for Dobby and Kreacher at 5 months.  Dobby and Kreacher by then will be hay in the morning and their ration of pellets (no free choice) at night.  They have grown very well since I got them in June and I want to keep the balance for them for a long life.  I want to hit that 7 year mark.  After that, it's all extra!  

Lots to think about and plan.  Thanks for your help.  I really appreciate your honest straight forward answers.


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