# Guardian and a pet?  Is it possible?



## dianneS (Jan 20, 2013)

Do you think its possible to have a LGD that is fully socialized with people, even living in the house part-time and still have it follow the instincts to guard and stay with the herd when necessary?

I'm not about to try it, but I'm wondering is anyone has or thinks its possible to have a dog that can be both a house pet and a good guardian.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 20, 2013)

Yes and No.It is  the instincts of the dog that generally make this difficult. They are nocturnal animals and WANT to be out and doing a job. My LGD's are socialized, have house time etc. I have tried  to make 1 of my pyrs a "house dog"...never gonna happen. They really do love their job. They love their people too but are generally not happy in the house for longer than 30 minutes at a time. If they are in the house they will tend to sleep throughout the day but when it comes evening...that's it....they will go crazy to get out. Once the dog becomes really bonded to their animals they tend to not really want to be in a house etc. 

My one pyr does love his "status" on the farm...kind of a mascot/spokesdog... he goes for car rides etc. we bring him out to meet customers etc. but in the end...my baby boy wants to be with his herd.

Your LGD can be well socialized and well mannered, however, I warn you... when they are in their fence with their herd/flock social skills are out the window. They instinctively will guard their area. It is their job.


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## Grazer (Jan 20, 2013)

I would say it depends on your setting, the breed and on the individual dog.
For instance a well bred Caucasian or Central Asian Ovcharka (that word means shepherd dog) will bond with its owners first and guard anything (meaning both the property and the animals on that property) that belongs to that owner.
Regardless of whether they get to spend some time inside the house or not. The instinct is there (or at least it should be in every well bred CO or CAO).
With that said, even a thoroughly socialized CO or CAO will not act like a pet in the traditional sense of the word.
For example a well bred CO will remain extremely protective & aloof towards strangers and in general neither of the two breeds will get along well with strange dogs.
And as long as you know how to remain in control, you can take them to places just like you would a pet dog, and they will still guard just as well when they are on their own property.
I also must add, the way a well bred Caucasian Ovcharka guards its property is too much for most people.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 20, 2013)

Grazer you really add a lot to these threads. The fact that you have such a rare (here in the US) breed it is so very helpful to those of us that are not familiar with them.  Although these dogs are amazing and you have described them so well they are really NOT for everyone. 
It's probably a good thing they are such a well kept secret. 

The pyr...not being rare at all, is still a hardheaded stubborn breed and as anyone can clearly see by looking at all the rescues, are also not for everyone.


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## boothcreek (Jan 20, 2013)

Being use to the south russian ovtscharkas we always try and socialize our LGDs with people.

We dont have the South russians no more but we still treat our LGDs the same, our AkbashXMaremma needed a lot of socializing since the first 10 weeks of his life he had never anything to do with humans(they just dumped the food over the fence and done). We like to be able to lock the dog in the house etc in emergencies without having to fight him there or the house being taken apart because the dog wants out.

He isnt bonded to any particular livestock, anything that we call part of the family is protected. He spends his nights outside guarding, then in the mornings he comes in the house and sleeps for a few hours and is being an overall suck-up. Even in the house its amazing how he seems to notice something is off outside behind the barn and he is up and standing at the door to be let out in 2 seconds flat and goes investigate and doesnt come back until the problem is solved. 







We also go for regular walks with the dogs, and he is our guardian wether its cougars or bears he will stay by your side and makes it his business to see you safely home.

Of course if your LGD doesnt have any instincts in regards to guarding you are hooped anyhow, we currently are so frustrated by our KuvazXAkbash its not even funny, he is afraid of the dark(he will sit inside and bark, you kick him out he goes hysterical and it will cost you either a door or window cause he wants back in). Any livestock to him either has to want to play with him or its evil and he bites/chases/ignores it...... if anything smells of predator when we go for a walk he is the fastest to run home and hide.
We were hoping to have a partner for our other LGD to take on the coyotes with but it looks like we will have to rehome him and try another, not all are cut out for it.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 20, 2013)

Excellent post boothcreek. Your AkbashXMaremma sounds like an awesome dog! 

This is why understanding how to pick a pup and breeders that know how to assess a pup are very important. The 2nd dog should have been pulled by the breeder. Your first dog is a great example of how LGD temperaments and traits really do vary. There are many factors involved in selecting a pup. Breeders that do not ask lots of questions about the prospective owners always bothers me.  When a breeder knows the plan for the LGD it helps the breeder select the right dog for the right job.

Not all LGD's "BOND" with their charges, some bond intently, but the term "bond" can be used in a variety of ways. Some dogs do not necessarily become best buddies with the livestock but seriously guard wherever you put them and with whoever you put them with.  I have 4 LGD's and each is different.

Some breeders don't really know how to see the different traits, it doesn't make them a bad breeder.  It sure is nice though when you do.  

So sorry about your 2nd dog. Highly unusual issues for that mix. Were both parents of true working stock? Almost sounds like retardation. How old was he when you got him? How old now?


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## Grazer (Jan 20, 2013)

Southern by choice said:
			
		

> Grazer you really add a lot to these threads. The fact that you have such a rare (here in the US) breed it is so very helpful to those of us that are not familiar with them.  Although these dogs are amazing and you have described them so well they are really NOT for everyone.
> It's probably a good thing they are such a well kept secret.
> 
> The pyr...not being rare at all, is still a hardheaded stubborn breed and as anyone can clearly see by looking at all the rescues, are also not for everyone.


Thank you Southern, I'm glad you think so 

I'm sorry if it is not obvious in my posts that these breeds are not for everyone  

All LGD breeds in general are only suited for people that already have plenty of experience with large guardian breeds and can give them a job to do, but I would also like to add that the CO & the CAO are not a typical LGD breed.
The Caucasian shepherd is a human aggressive breed.
The Central Asian shepherd on the other hand is usually not as protective against strangers, 
but a potential new owner should know that there are a lot of fighting lines within CAO as a breed.
Meaning the CAO is being used on a large scale by horrible owners as fighting dogs, more so in the past 20-30 years than before.
And especially in the former Soviet Union countries and surrounding. 
Those are not fights to the death, but a dog fight is a dog fight and has nothing to do with guarding livestock.
So if anyone who is interesting in CAO (Central Asian Ovcharka) reads this, then I would have to say to them: be very careful where you get your dog from & learn how to read pedigrees in order to avoid the fighting lines.
Look for a pup that is health tested and comes from working stock 



@ boothcreek, your AkbashXMaremma is really gorgeous and I'm sorry the KuvazXAkbash  is not working out


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## boothcreek (Jan 20, 2013)

> So sorry about your 2nd dog. Highly unusual issues for that mix. Were both parents of true working stock? Almost sounds like retardation. How old was he when you got him? How old now?


Both parents were working dogs, guarding a herd of about 120 goats. He was 9 weeks when we got him, he is now a year old and showing absolutly no tendency towards guarding anything. I know he is still a young dog, but we have had LGDs for a long while and found if they dont show even the slightest incliniation to their job by this age, you can pretty much forget it. He still acts like a 9 week old puppy, doesnt seem to have grown up much mentally except for he lifts his leg to pee.... I bet he would make someone a great pet, just not a working dog.


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## dianneS (Jan 21, 2013)

If you want the dog to guard and be a pet, should it bond with the herd first, or the humans?  Does it really matter?


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## Pearce Pastures (Jan 21, 2013)

I am certainly new at this but I would say your herd should be first to make sure that it happens-if they do not bond with the herd first, and perhaps instead only bond to the family, I would be concerned for the safety of my herd.


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## goodolboy (Jan 21, 2013)

Our pups are all born with the sheep, and raised with the sheep. So we have never had an issue with our pups. The dogs we have bought go straight to the pasture, they get all their lovin' out there.


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## dianneS (Jan 21, 2013)

goodolboy said:
			
		

> Our pups are all born with the sheep, and raised with the sheep. So we have never had an issue with our pups. The dogs we have bought go straight to the pasture, they get all their lovin' out there.


That's the way I've done it too.  I was just curious as to whether or not anyone ever tried to have one in the house first, make it a pet and hope that its instincts will kick in whenever outdoors with the herd?  I know someone who is trying it, so I guess we'll find out if it works or not.


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## Southern by choice (Jan 21, 2013)

Alot of this depends on the actual breed and it's specific traits. However, for a LGD it is best to start the pup out where the pup will be working. There are many people who SHOW their pyrs and anatolians, and maremmas  and once finished these dogs are able to go and work the land. 

So, those dogs were extremely pampered, groomed, and trained and full time bonding with their humans. A great dog with good instincts can still go into a field.


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## Mugen (Jan 22, 2013)

This is Titus, my CMD. He's about 12 months old. Yes, he's LGD and a pet. He sleeps like a baby at night.


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