# EMERGENCY PLEASE HELP



## nuts4goats (Jan 1, 2012)

My neighbor has a herd of goats that he puts out to pasture and doesnt do much else with.  None of his goats are vaccinated, and they eat strictly browse.  He has a pygmy mix doe that just had a baby about two weeks ago.  This morning, my daughter found her having a seizure in the field.  My neighbor is currently in the hospital ad we have been unable to contact him to let him know.  So, we brought her in and  wrapped her in a heating blanket.  We went ahead and gave her some pen G, and also have been giving her molasses, and corn syrup.  I just gave her some calcium also.  I have no idea what else to do.  I do not have a large animal vet to call.  She is completely down.  Any other suggestions?  My best bet would be to get a vet out tomorrow, as I know my neighbor will not do this.  Also- it now appears I have inherited a bottle baby, as well.  With him being two weeks old, can we feed him whole milk, 3 x a day?

HELP!!!

Also, any suggestions for a large animal vet in nw georgia?  My regular vet referred me to one, and I cant get them to call me back.


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## nuts4goats (Jan 1, 2012)

I forgot to describe her condition... she is very rigid, and completely down. No injuries that I can find.  She was found having seizures.  Her body temp is low.  She appears to have been having scours, or her back end is still messy from freshening.  My guesses are postpartum ketosis or hypocalcemia?  Or possibly a uterine infection or retained placenta?  Any advice?


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## Roll farms (Jan 1, 2012)

The rigidity sounds almost like Tetanus....but with this many variables there's just no way to definitively diagnose her online.

I would give her 1cc of Pen G per 20# every 8-12 hrs. for at least 2 days, then 1cc per 40# for a week or more, 2x a day.  
Pen G is my 'favorite' drug for uterine infections *and* the treatment drug of choice for tetanus soooo...hopefully....this will help.

BIG shot of B vitamin or Thiamine if you have it....1cc per 10#.  Now, tonight, and again in the am.

Get / keep her warm.  If she's grinding her teeth / acting like she's in pain, Banamine or Ibuprofen liquid, but don't do either long-term, you can damage liver / kidneys.

If she's unable to eat / drink, you'll have to either trickle drench some fluids or get lactated ringers to hydrate her.

Red Cell if you've got it.

Once (if) she's more responsive, make a slurry of oats, chopped alfalfa, fiberous stuff - chop and mix w/ molasses or propylene glycol and enough water or gatoraide to make it able to pass through a big syringe with a hole cut in it to pass through.  You have to keep some bulk in her rumen to keep it from shutting down.

Keep her hydrated, give her probios / probiotics of some type, keep up the antibiotics.

Pygmies *usually* don't get hypocalcemia b/c they're not huge milk producers BUT it's not absolutely unheard of, either...it's just more common in dairy breeds.

Yes, switching the kid to Vit. D milk should be ok.  Probios can help prevent any upset the switch causes.

Good luck.


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## nuts4goats (Jan 1, 2012)

So I have another question, may be a dumb one...
If it is tetanus, can the baby get this? And when can I vaccinate him for this?

Also, I am going to continue my search tomorrow for a large animal vet if she is still hanging in there, unless I can talk my regular vet into trying to treat her.  But, if I cant locate one... can I hydrate her by doing a bolus of fluids SQ like they do for dogs, or does this need to go intravenously?

I do not have vit B or thiamin on hand, and the farm supply is closed today, but I will grab that asap tomorrow morning,

Oh what a mess I am in!


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## 20kidsonhill (Jan 1, 2012)

yes, you can do sub-Q hydration. Wont work as fast, but it will help.


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## Roll farms (Jan 1, 2012)

Whoops, I completely forgot the most important thing....Tetanus antitoxin.  Give her the whole bottle if you've got some.
If it is tetanus, and you don't have any.....get some / get it in her ASAP.  Call any other goat producers who might have it, friends, etc.  


Yes, the baby should get some, too.  Tetanus enters through wounds / open sores and it could 'travel' up the umbilical cord.
I've never treated a kid for tetanus, but Fiasco's website says to use 1/2 ml for newborns.  I'd be tempted to give a 2wk old kid 1ml.

The important thing to remember is that antitoxin is for Treatment / Prevention - it will NOT provide long-term protection like the CD/T toxoid does.

So after 10-14 days, you will need to vaccinate any that are given the antitoxin w/ toxoid to provide long term protection.  

(Any time a non-vaccinated goat gets a wound, they should be given the antitoxin, and then vaccinated w/ toxoid later.)

To help you remember - needs fix*in* - antitox*in*  - toxo*id* - to avo*id*

How to administer lactated ringers - I've never done it but this seems pretty comprehensive.
http://goat-link.com/content/view/207/195/


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## elevan (Jan 1, 2012)

You've received some good advice so far.

I have one question and a word of caution.  Did this neighbor ask you to care for his goats prior to going into the hospital?  If he did not then you've opened yourself up for potential financial / criminal consequences if the animal(s) do not survive.  I understand that your heart is in the right place and am not questioning that.  If the neighbor asked you to help then you still be cautious because people can react strangely if one of their animals die or become ill under someone else's care.

I'd definitely do the tetnus antitoxin and Sub-Q fluids.

Sub-Q fluids are easily especially if you've ever given a sub-q shot.  Just tent the skin stick the needle in and open up the IV.  Allow it to flow and build a pocket until the desired amount is administered.  Remove the needle and apply pressure to the "hole" for a minute so it doesn't leak.  Repeat on the other side to create a saddle bag effect.  I just learned how to do this last May with a downed calf and am currently doing it with my dog.  I prefer using IV tubing as it allows you to insert the needle and open / close the line while leaving you with both hands to restrain the animal (if need be) while the fluid fills the pocket.  You can also use a sterile syringe to create the pockets.  You want to use Lactated Ringers or Sodium Chloride solution (sterile).

On the vitamin B...you can crush up human tablets and add to some yogurt and administer orally.
Here is the contents of the livestock formula:
Active Ingredient(s): Each milliliter of sterile aqueous solution contains:
Thiamine Hydrochloride (B1)   12.5 mg
Niacin amide   12.5 mg
Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (B6)   5.0 mg
d-Panthenol   5.0 mg
Riboflavin (B2) (as Riboflavin 5' phosphate sodium)   2.0 mg
Cyanocobalamin (B12)   1000 mcg


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## nuts4goats (Jan 1, 2012)

Everybody thanks so much for the advice! I really appreciate it!

Elevan, no my neighbor did not ask me to care for his goats...and honestly I wish I werent, because this is one big heartbreaking MESS.   

The other option I had was to let her lay in the field and die, and that is not an option for me.  More likely then not, she is going to die, and I'd rather she be somewhere warm and comfortable, rather then cold, and raining.  I probably should have just let her be, but I COULDNT do it!   I just cannot ignore a dying animal when I know I can atleast try to do something about it.  If he were going to sue me for the loss of an animal,  I would argue that perhaps he should vaccinate his goats, provide them shelter, and feed them daily so that these losses do not occur.

But we wouldnt have that conversation, because he is a very good friend of ours. 

I know I have overstepped my boundaries, but I really didnt have a choice, in my mind.  I couldnt ignore it, or I honestly wouldnt sleep for several weeks thereafter


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## DKRabbitry (Jan 1, 2012)

I don't have much imput for you, but I have been reading along.  I just wanted to send warm wishes and I truly hope everything works out okay. 
At least with you taking charge he is only losing 1 goat.  If you hadn't the kid would have died for sure too.  Starvation really is a terrible way for anything to go :/


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## elevan (Jan 1, 2012)

I completely understand and would probably step in if I were in your shoes too.  I just wanted to make sure you understood the potential for legal ramifications.

I do wish you luck in nursing the goat and her kid.  Please keep us posted.  If you have access to the solution to give Sub-Q fluids then I'd definitely be giving them at least.


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## nuts4goats (Jan 1, 2012)

I'm really thinking now it is most definitely tetanus. It is so heartwrenching watching her. She is so stiff and rigid and her whole body goes into contracture. There is nothing else I can do until morning because everything else is at the farm supply that I need  I am about to give her another dose of pen g and I am able to get syringes of water carefully down without her aspirating thus far.  In the morning, I will try to contact my neighbor and make sure it is ok that I am intervening.  If she is still alive, and he allows me to proceed I will again try to get a vet out here also. I plan on staying up with her through the night. 

Also- I have some poultry drench. Do you think it would be worth a shot trying to give her some of that so she gets some sort of nutrition until tomorrow?

Also- how much milk should the baby get? He sucked down 5 oz and then quit on me. He seemed lime a hungry little guy and then just quit. Don't know if he's just not used to the bottle or if his tank got full?  

I don't know what I'd do without everyones advice!  Thanks again!


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## autumnprairie (Jan 1, 2012)

If it helps I couldn't walk away either.  praying for them


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## Roll farms (Jan 1, 2012)

FWIW, the doe I nursed through Tetanus survived, but my vet said it's almost always fatal.

The poultry electrolytes would be better than nothing, add it to the water you're giving her.  Is she able to swallow?  That's a good sign if she is, but again, I don't want you to get your hopes up.  I would also put a TBS of baking soda in the water, she's at risk of bloat.  Switch her from side to side tonight if you can to help prevent bloat, also.  Goats who lie on their sides tend to bloat so be on the look out for it.  (Our goat w/ tetanus bloated, too....) 

If she's still alive tomorrow, after the vet visit / she's been given the antitoxin, you will need to do the fiberous slurry feeding.

Make sure you're giving her BIG doses of the Pen G, at this point you will do more harm underdosing than overdosing.

I would think 5oz 3-4 x a day would be fine.  Here's some bottle baby info for you.
http://www.backyardherds.com/web/viewblog.php?id=586

I spent the entire night up w/ my Tetanus doe.  Flipped her from side to side, rubbed her bloated belly to help her pass gas, trickled vit/ elec. and gatoraide down her throat every 2 hrs, and gave the Pen G every 6 hrs.  
The vet was amazed when she saw it really was tetanus and she was still alive the next morning when I met her at the office. 

A lot depends on how far the bacteria / disease progresses before you start treatment.

Whatever happens, don't feel bad if you lose the battle, you already won by caring.


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## nuts4goats (Jan 1, 2012)

Thanks for helping me along!  If she makes it, it will be an absolute miracle at this point.  
This is what I have done so far, tell me if I can tweak at all until morning:

3cc Pen G 1st dose.  (She is a very little goat, probably 30 pounds TOPS)
2cc Pen G 2nd dose
Oral liquid calcium
2 parts Molasses/1 part corn syrup via syringe this morning and afternoon
Oral poultry drench (contains molasses, thiamine, Vit A,B,D,E. Glycol)
6 oz Fluids with baking soda, and ProBios every 2 hours (Ive managed 12 oz so far)
Tetanus antitoxin for her and baby FIRST thing tomorrow as soon as farm supply doors open!

I made her a thicker padded pallet, and repositioned her and flipped her to her other side
Im warming her with a heating blanket set on low.

Im going to do fluids via syringe every two hours also.  She is swallowing.  But she is completely rigid with all 4 legs stiffened out like a sawhorse, and spasms horribly.  She bellows in pain.  It is most definetly tetanus from everything Ive read tonight. I cant stand it. I try to be very quiet and keep the lights to a minimum because she spasms with any sort of stimulation. When we first got to her this morning, she was comatose, frothing at the mouth, and seizing.  Now she does open her eyes, and is vocal...but I dont know if thats because she is improving and trying to fight more, or the condition is worsening, and she is in more pain.    She sure is fighting very hard.  Also, her gums were white this morning, and now they have pinked up some.  But I am still very guarded, and although I hope she'll pull through, I'm thinking this will have a sad ending. She looks HORRIBLE. 

As for little guy, he sure is cute, and a little pig to boot.  I dont think hes been getting much milk- Momma's bag is pretty small. We're calling him Mikey, and he's taking the bottle great so far.


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## Queen Mum (Jan 1, 2012)

Wow,  you are doing great!  You can give her some muscle relaxants if you can get them.  Try to get your hands on some injectable Valium.   You can go to the local ER 1/4 to 1/2 CC of injectible Valium.  Take the goat with you if you have too.   That will help her muscle spasms.  (Yes, it is indicated for goats.)  I wish I was close enough to you, because I have .25 cc's at my house.  My vet gave it to me for my goats when they are totally stressed and not eating.  

If you can't get injectible and you know someone who has some, you can crush a tablet and feed her a 1/4 tablet orally by drench.  The other choice is to try a muscle relaxant for humans.  Again, the dose would be 1/4 what you would give a human.


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## nuts4goats (Jan 2, 2012)

Well, she is still hanging in there. We have 3 more hours until the farm supply opens so I can get her antitoxin. She is so uncomfortable. I hate this. I'm trying so hard. I wish there was something else I could do! I gave her some metacam for pain. It's the only thing I have on hand. I don't know if I should have done that but at this point death might be kinder than this suffering.


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## Roll farms (Jan 2, 2012)

When I got mine to the vet, she gave her steroids, antitoxin, and she was able to sit up for the ride home.

She didn't feel good for days, but the improvement once given the antitoxin is amazing....


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## nuts4goats (Jan 2, 2012)

About to head out the door to the farm supply. The metacam seemed to make her alot more comfortable. I gave her another dose of pen g, poultry drench, baking soda. Ive flipped her again. I'm afraid I'm going to od her on the pen g. She has firm stool and has urinated so I'm hoping that's a good sign too. Her urine has that ketosis smell. I'm gonna get a wider syringe and do the gruel as soon as I have given her the antitoxin.  Hoping the molasses in the poultry drench will keep her blood sugar up enough.  She is swallowing better too.  But still completely down and stiff as a phone pole   I have no idea what I am doing!!!!


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## Roll farms (Jan 2, 2012)

If you see improvement (and it will be amazing - not cured, but surely better) after the antitoxin, you can probably safely switch to 2x a day on the Pen G, 1cc per 30#.  I would go a full 10 days at minimum, probably 14.  And then administer the CD/T on day 15.

Pick up probiotics of some form, too.

Really pulling for both of you.


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## autumnprairie (Jan 2, 2012)

You are doing an awesome job!
Keep it up I know you are exhausted.


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## nuts4goats (Jan 2, 2012)

Ok i have given her the antitoxin. I bought 2 vials and gave her a total of 3000 units BUT the instructions call for 3000 to 15000 units to treat active tetanus. Crap! Husband is headed back to farm supply for more. I an seeing some improvement. I can bend her legs now and her neck has become less rigid. I also gave her some jumpstart microbial, vitamins, and minerals gel. More baking soda, fluids. Husband is picking up 6000 more units. I think it will help her even more since I'm already seeing some improvement, just wasn't enough antitoxin, I think.


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## KellyHM (Jan 2, 2012)

I don't know if you've thought of it or not, but you might consider pumping some calcium into her.  Hypocalcemia can cause those symptoms, and although it's more common pre-parturition, it can happen afterwards as well.  Not saying she doesn't have tetanus or something else, but might as well treat for the more treatable, right?


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## 20kidsonhill (Jan 2, 2012)

you can do oral calcium, which may not be easy if she isn't responding very well, or you can get the IV calcium, and give it sub=q, just like hydrating her. Oral calcium may be easier to get at the feed store.


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## nuts4goats (Jan 2, 2012)

Thanks! I did give her oral calcium yesterday x3.  I'm trying to cover all the bases. Im hoping when we give her the next dose of antitoxin maybe we can get her on her feet if I don't kill her first! I feel like I'm experimenting.
I picked up some power punch too and I'm going to try to make her the gruel and give that to her next. Keep the advice and ideas coming. Hopefully we can get her stabalized soon while we try to track down her owner and see about a vet. Hopefully he has one we can use as my vet only sees small animals and everyone in the phone book that I have called only sees cats and dogs.


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## 20kidsonhill (Jan 2, 2012)

nuts4goats said:
			
		

> Thanks! I did give her oral calcium yesterday x3.  I'm trying to cover all the bases. Im hoping when we give her the next dose of antitoxin maybe we can get her on her feet if I don't kill her first! I feel like I'm experimenting.
> I picked up some power punch too and I'm going to try to make her the gruel and give that to her next. Keep the advice and ideas coming. Hopefully we can get her stabalized soon while we try to track down her owner and see about a vet. Hopefully he has one we can use as my vet only sees small animals and everyone in the phone book that I have called only sees cats and dogs.


I wouldn't give her the gruel if you can't get her upright.  If she can't hold her self upright I would stick with power punch, mollasses, corn oil, corn syrup type things.  If she can hold her head up, then maybe the gruel might be okay, She will bloat easily if she gets too much in her stomach. Getting her to stand up, is a good idea, especially after your drench her.


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## Roll farms (Jan 2, 2012)

Ug...I had a good reply typed up and inadvertently deleted it.....

I think 3000 units of AT is good for now, I personally would wait until tonight / 2nd dose of pen g to give more.  The dosage listed on the box is for horses, she's quite a bit smaller.

http://goat-link.com/content/view/199/30/

http://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/tetanus.html

http://www2.dpi.qld.gov.au/sheep/8584.html

http://www.goatnutrition.com/CONDITIONSILLNESSES/Articles/ECMD007253.aspx

Keep up the supportive therapy.  

You should be able to speak to a vet who can help you, or a vet tech, even if it's not close enough to actually visit w/ the animal.  Do a search in your area online for livestock / goat / equine vets.

eta, like 20K said, don't give her the fiber slurry until she's upright.  You don't so much need to worry about getting her to stand, but getting her to lie upright on her keel IS important.  Until then, keep flipping her and keep her hydrated.


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## SmallFarmGirl (Jan 2, 2012)

Hugs and prayers sent your way ...


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## nuts4goats (Jan 2, 2012)

Ok, so I was able to contact my neighbor. He says to do what I can for her, and to keep her and the baby. Just what I always wanted...a sick and dying goat! Yay! So I was able to find a vet. He said the pen g and antitoxin were the right thing to do. The only other thing we can do is supportive therapy and a tranquilizer. So we are loading her up to take her over to him. He also suggested magnetic therapy? Don't know what exactly that is for, so now Momma goat is wearing my daughter's Phiten necklace. Lord bless! Will update when we get back from the vet.


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## terrilhb (Jan 2, 2012)

You are doing a fantastic job. I am so happy she has you. The poor girl.


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## nuts4goats (Jan 2, 2012)

We are back from the vet. I think the vet might be a little fruity, but we're willing to try anything.  He gave her a tranquilizer, and layed  her on a magnetic bed and then ran some kind of vibrating magnet all over her body for 20 minutes. Then he tubed her and gave her magnetized water, and put a magnetic necklace for animals around her neck. He put cotton in her ears to minimize stress from noise. And then he gave her tetanus TOXOID. I am not a vet, but I didn't think you were supposed to give the toxoid- but that's what he gave her. He said to give her 2cc pen G every six hours and keep the fluids going. She hasn't lost her swallowing reflex yet so the syringe is ok to keep doing, he said. He said at this point, the most important thing is to keep her penicillin going strong in the bloodstream to kill the toxins. This has turned into quite an expensive venture, but j have no regrets even if she dies.  

I'm going to try to prop her up on her knees if I can with some pillows, or even try doing some sort of sling to try to get her up. She does appear to be getting some bloat. So now I'm just going to try to focus on hydration, repositioning often, and steady antibiotics and probiotics with baking soda. He also gave us a tranquilizer we can administer to her again when it wears off.  He gave me enough for 2 days. And also gave me "magnetized" water to hydrate her with. 

If anything, it was worth the money to just get her that tranquilizer. She is much more relaxed now and I feel like she is finally resting comfortably.

It's all in the Lord's hands now.  I think I've done everything I can do.


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## Roll farms (Jan 2, 2012)

Well, Fruity or not, the Toxoid was the wrong thing....toxoid to AVOID...they don't get any immunity from it immediately, it takes 10-14 days with that, so that was a waste.

Keep up the antitoxin tonight and the Pen G.

Good luck.


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## KellyHM (Jan 2, 2012)

nuts4goats said:
			
		

> We are back from the vet. I think the vet might be a little fruity, but we're willing to try anything.  He gave her a tranquilizer, and layed  her on a magnetic bed and then ran some kind of vibrating magnet all over her body for 20 minutes. Then he tubed her and gave her magnetized water, and put a magnetic necklace for animals around her neck. He put cotton in her ears to minimize stress from noise. And then he gave her tetanus TOXOID. I am not a vet, but I didn't think you were supposed to give the toxoid- but that's what he gave her. He said to give her 2cc pen G every six hours and keep the fluids going. She hasn't lost her swallowing reflex yet so the syringe is ok to keep doing, he said. He said at this point, the most important thing is to keep her penicillin going strong in the bloodstream to kill the toxins. This has turned into quite an expensive venture, but j have no regrets even if she dies.
> 
> I'm going to try to prop her up on her knees if I can with some pillows, or even try doing some sort of sling to try to get her up. She does appear to be getting some bloat. So now I'm just going to try to focus on hydration, repositioning often, and steady antibiotics and probiotics with baking soda. He also gave us a tranquilizer we can administer to her again when it wears off.  He gave me enough for 2 days. And also gave me "magnetized" water to hydrate her with.
> 
> ...


Fruity is not the word I would pick.  Idiot might be better...sounds like he's just plain insane if you ask me and obviously doesn't have a clue about goats.


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## elevan (Jan 2, 2012)

I'm kind of at a loss on the whole magnet therapy and magnetic water treatment for a goat   :/  Do you know the vet's basis behind this?

That added to the fact that he gave the goat a toxoid just makes me question the validity of this vet's ability to handle this particular situation....in other words he sounds like a complete quack to me, but I'm really trying to "see" this a different way.  But I really think he just took your money for nothing.


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## Queen Mum (Jan 2, 2012)

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say, there is some miniscule basis for the magnetic therapy thing, but it's so miniscule that there is not much to it. HOWEVER, since he is convinced, you will not change his mind.  AND if the animals pulls through, he won't ever be convinced that it had nothing to do with anything But the magnets.  He's not a quack, he's just a vulnerable guy who was sold on a bill of goods. Never-the-less, he did give you the time, and the other medicines.  So be kind to him and if need be, maybe you can educate him later.  

Keep up the good work.


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## nuts4goats (Jan 2, 2012)

Yes I agree he's probably a quack but he is the ONLY vet I could find.  I am at a loss.  I'm trying to do the right thing. If anyone has any other suggestions, or can recommend another vet in northwest Georgia other than a Dr. Chambers off Ward Mtn Rd. , I will call someone else? But other than that, I guess I'm just going to have to use these tranquilizers, Pen G, antitoxin, and PRAY. But I will say this, I absolutely can't hardly stand to watch her suffer, and if I don't see any improvement soon, I'm going to have to shoot her.  She's struggling.


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## Roll farms (Jan 2, 2012)

Can you call him and ask for steroids?  Our vet gave ours a shot of Prednisone.  

She may have been too far gone when you found her to be able to 'fix' this.  If they're too far gone when treatment starts, it really lessens the chance of recovery, from what I've read.

I'm really sorry you're going through this, fwiw.  DO NOT feel bad if she doesn't make it, you truly went above and beyond the call here.


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## nuts4goats (Jan 2, 2012)

Roll- I think we are past the point of help. She just had another seizure. She's struggling for breath. I went ahead and gave her the all the rest  of the antitoxin that I had, gave her more tranquilizer, and more pen G. I've already spent almost $300 on her. It's not even about the $$, though. If I honestly thought something else would help, Id call him one more time but I'm getting ready to give up. My husband wants to give her one more day. I want to give her all the time she needs, but I think were getting close to the line of cruelty by allowing her to suffer. I just got up from a nap so she's been unattended for a few hours. I'm going to monitor her real close but if these seizures don't stop I dont think I have another choice. She surely is a fighter, I will give her that. 
Praying with all my heart she makes a turn, but I'm skeptic. I think she should have responded to something by now.


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## DKRabbitry (Jan 2, 2012)

Sometimes you just have to make the call you think is best.  At least she is as comfortable as possible.  I still maintain the point of view that you were a God-send to that little kid she had.  Did you say the owner said you could have him too?  Maybe you could sell him and recoup a little of your cost?  Or keep him and love him and he will be your puppy-dog goat.   You fought for her a LOT harder than most people would have.


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## SmallFarmGirl (Jan 2, 2012)

I'm praying for you .. thats tough .... Hope the little kid can make it !!!


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## nuts4goats (Jan 2, 2012)

Yes- were definitely keeping the little Billy. The first time he took the bottle he melted our hearts. We'll wether him and keep him. He definitely helps keep it in perspective. He's a cute little rascal!


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## nuts4goats (Jan 2, 2012)

Also wanted to THANK everyone from the bottom of my heart for all of the wonderful advice! I've learned alot through this experience and next time I will know better what to do. I am going to take my time to seek out a reputable vet to have on hand should we need another. Under the emergent circumstances, we just had to take what we could get. I'm also going to buy a few veterinary references for goats that I can reference back to in the future should I need it. And also going to stock up on some basic things to have on hand. I'm glad I had the pen g. But I'm also going to get some lactated ringers, drench kit, and go ahead and get him some vaccines and epi if I need it. He's very healthy and robust. It took six of us to catch the little buggar yesterday and my husband is so sore today he can barely get off the couch . We stressed him pretty good yesterday chasing him, so I'm going to give him anti-toxin later thus week once I get epi from the vet supply and he's been eating good for a few days. His umbilicus looks good and clean, and I scrubbed it real good with betadine.  

I'm disappointed it was so difficult to find a vet for goats. There just aren't many around here. It almost makes me feel like people are better off just trying to treat their large animals themselves.


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## Roll farms (Jan 2, 2012)

FWIW, I do 90% of my own vetting, and still spent 2 grand on our herd in vet bills last year....granted, some of that was elective testing, not life-threatening issues.

I order most of my vet supplies through Jeffers Livestock.  Some things are cheaper at other places, but if you take into account free shipping if you order enough, it's just easier for me to get it all from one supplier.


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## DKRabbitry (Jan 2, 2012)

I use Jeffers & Valley Vet.  I usually make my list, make a cart at both places, and see which ones costs less at that particular moment LOL


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## nuts4goats (Jan 3, 2012)

I think I might be seeing some improvement from momma goat. She is alot less rigid and I am able to move her legs and head. She hasn't had a tranquilizer since 6pm. I just got up and gave her 2 cups of water via syringe and she is biting at the syringe and trying to lap up the fluid while she swallows. I went ahead and gave her some more pen g, and her usuals with the baking soda, probios, electrolyte gel, and power punch. Ive got her propped where she is almost sitting up. I rubbed her down head to toe and she let out an aggravated bellow. Although she's still horrible, I'm glad to see the rigidity lessening. Tomorrow Im going to ask quack doctor if he will give her some prednisone. He's the only person I've got right now that could do it. 

I know everyone is probably tired of the blow by blow on this blog, but I'm just trying to document everything so maybe it will help someone else someday? 

Im not going to give up on her. She's hung in with me for 2 days now and hasn't quit. Tomorrow I'm going to try to get her up. And I think I'm going to try to do the slurry. She's swallowing really well now. I feel like if I can get some nutrition in her, keep stimulating her, I might get her to turn the corner.


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## SuburbanFarmChic (Jan 3, 2012)

I didn't have any better advice to offer than what you were already getting but I do wish you the best of luck with her. Hopefully you can get her through this.


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## wannacow (Jan 3, 2012)

This is amazing.  You are doing such a wonderful job.  We are not tired of the "blow by blow" documentation.  We are learning too.  Thanks for your hard work and your willingness to let us follow along.


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## Roll farms (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm still pullin' for you both.....  

eta, did you get / are you giving the B vitamin / thiamine?  If not, that'd be a real boost to her.

You can also try putting some warm water w/ molasses in front of her, she may be able to drink it on her own.

Def. get some roughage in that rumen.  Chop, chop, chop some alfalfa, oatmeal, and maybe soak some sweet feed or goat pellets in warm water.  My point is there needs to be some roughage.  An all liquid diet will shut down a rumen.


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## daisychick (Jan 3, 2012)

wannacow said:
			
		

> This is amazing.  You are doing such a wonderful job.  We are not tired of the "blow by blow" documentation.  We are learning too.  Thanks for your hard work and your willingness to let us follow along.


X2  I am learning a lot from this thread and it would be very helpful to anyone faced with this in the future.


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## Ariel72 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm hoping this all works out well for this poor little girl...and for you.  Definately continue to keep us posted.  Did you ever get hold of the owner?  Maybe he will learn from this too.


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## nuts4goats (Jan 3, 2012)

This morning, at 6, she was trying to get up! She is very very weak, and there is still some rigidity in her neck, but she is bending her legs now. She was also biting my syringe. I am working today, but I am going home for lunch at 12 to tend to her, and hubby will be home at 300. I've asked my boss for the rest of the week off. I'm really hoping we are turning a corner. Im going to work her real good when I get home. The rubbing and stimulation really seems to help. 
And yes, I'm doing the thiamin.

Another question- if her rumen shuts down, then what do I do? Is there a medication I need to go ahead and get to anticipate that?

Also, what specific steroid do i need to ask for, for her? I'm going to call the vet and ask if I can pick it up from him. Anything else I need to ask him for?

Should I try to tube the roughage?


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## elevan (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm wondering if Bo-Se would also be of any help...Roll, what do you think?


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## ksalvagno (Jan 3, 2012)

BoSe always seems to help. That is one of those "never hurts to do" kind of things.


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## Roll farms (Jan 3, 2012)

Prednisone is the steroid they gave my goat.  I can't find any info on the dosage, sorry.
Not sure if Dex would work in this case....anyone?

BoSe def. wouldn't hurt.  The dosage is 1cc per 40#, so I would think 2cc would do a pygmy....in the muscle (I usually give it in the butt cheek.)

If her rumen shuts down you'll need to (this sounds gross) steal a cud from another goat and shove it down her throat.  HOPEFULLY the probiotics will help.
Have you tried letting her eat on her own?  She might, and that'd really be the best thing.  Put some feed she just loves in front of her, or raw oatmeal, just anything that'll get her to eat.  Hay would be the best, but if she won't mess w/ it, try any 'fibrous' material she WILL eat.   (IF she's able to chew...if not, it'll have to be the slurry.)


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## nuts4goats (Jan 3, 2012)

Is BoSe something I can buy at the farm supply or do I need to get that from the doc also?


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## terrilhb (Jan 3, 2012)

WOW you are doing such a fantastic job. I keep checking in to see if their are any updates. Please keep them coming detail by detail. So many people could learn from this. Thank you.


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## ksalvagno (Jan 3, 2012)

You have to get BoSe from the vet.


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## nuts4goats (Jan 3, 2012)

I have been researching alot and found some information from Langston University that suggests giving 15000 units of tetanus antitoxin twice daily for 2 days along with penicillin. They also suggest allowing the wound to get oxygen.  I cannot find a wound anywhere on her body where the tetanus might have originated.  I'm thinking she probably had a uterine or vaginal tear associated with freshening. I guess I need to look at her toot and make sure there aren't any obvious outward tears, and uncover her backend. I'm trying to do everything I can think of.  I think I am going to give her more antitoxin also, depending on what she looks like when I get home.


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## Roll farms (Jan 3, 2012)

Sounds like a plan.


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## nuts4goats (Jan 3, 2012)

I am very sad to report she died. I went home for lunch and flipped her and noticed she just didn't look good. She died with her head in my hands.  Sorry y'all... I sure did try. I guess she was just tired. I'm so darn sad. Feels pretty silly to cry over a darned goat that wasn't even mine to begin with. 

Now I guess I will just try to focus on the positive.  I've got a cute little buggar in my laundry room that's a little piggy and my youngest daughter is in love with.  Guess we at least able to save one of the two.


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## Mamaboid (Jan 3, 2012)

nuts4goats said:
			
		

> I am very sad to report she died. I went home for lunch and flipped her and noticed she just didn't look good. She died with her head in my hands.  Sorry y'all... I sure did try. I guess she was just tired. I'm so darn sad. Feels pretty silly to cry over a darned goat that wasn't even mine to begin with.
> 
> Now I guess I will just try to focus on the positive.  I've got a cute little buggar in my laundry room that's a little piggy and my youngest daughter is in love with.  Guess we at least able to save one of the two.


So sorry.  Just know that all of your hard work made her last hours more comfortable.  You did good.  Good luck with the little one.


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## jodief100 (Jan 3, 2012)

I am sorry to hear you lost her.  It is very rare and extremly difficult to save an animal with tetnus that far advanced.  You did your best and her last few days she was warm and comfortable.  You did good.  

Glad to hear the baby is doing well.


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## SmallFarmGirl (Jan 3, 2012)




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## autumnprairie (Jan 3, 2012)

I am so sorry you lost her, I am sad too. We  have been rooting for her and you


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## ksalvagno (Jan 3, 2012)

You really did work hard on her. You did your best. I'm so sorry you lost her.


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## 20kidsonhill (Jan 3, 2012)




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## wannacow (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm so sorry, but I know you did your best.  I learned a lot from what you did.  FWIW even the pro's lose some.  Death comes with life.  You did a GREAT job and I'm sure we all aplaud you and your effort.


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## Roll farms (Jan 3, 2012)




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## daisychick (Jan 3, 2012)

You went way above and beyond the call of duty and you did a great job even if the outcome wasn't what we all hoped.    At least she isn't hurting anymore and you have a little bundle of fun to play with.


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## jmsim93 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm so sorry to hear this...was really pulling for her.  You selflessly did all that you could.  Have you been in contact with the owner?  If you are good friends, maybe he will offer to cover some of the cost???


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## nuts4goats (Jan 3, 2012)

Thanks everyone! I did speak with the owner yesterday. He offered to cover the costs, but I can't take his money.  I know that sounds really silly.  He's a sweet little old man.  He looks at animals differently then I do, and I respect that.  Some people won't try to save a piece of livestock if they feel they have no value.  He just keeps the goats to keep his property cleaned up, I think.  I made the decision to intervene because I knew he could/ would not. If he had ASKED me to care for her, it would be different. I don't really care about the $$. I'm just glad she didn't die out in this bitter cold we are having right now.

I plan on educating myself extensively on goats. I have a few vet books on order so maybe I will have a better idea if there is a ever a next time. Mikey will be getting vaccinated this week so hopefully I will NEVER have to see tetanus again (at least on my side of the fence) what a horrible horrible disease!


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## KellyHM (Jan 3, 2012)




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## nuts4goats (Jan 10, 2012)

Just wanted to update everyone on some more info that I have learned about tetanus. Since I am now the proud owner of a FEW goats-
( I got another one to be a playmate for my bottle baby), I went ahead and purchased a few veterinary textbooks for future reference. The first one came today and I immediately read up on tetanus. According to Mosby's Large Animal Internal Medicine- tetanus toxoid SHOULD be administered as well as the anti-toxin. These should be administered at different times and in different locations. I wanted to share with everyone. According to this reference, my vet DID do the right thing. I think I will keep him. As far as the magnetic therapy- I'm actually for any type of holistic therapy when it is coupled with medical treatment. It can't hurt, and given the state she wa in- anything that might have helped alleviate her suffering was worth it, to me.  According to Mosby's, a tranquilizer should also be administered to help alleviate spasms. After reading, I feel alot better knowing she was treated correctly. Just wanted to pass along the info should anyone ever have tetanus in their goats.


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## terrilhb (Jan 10, 2012)

I am so sorry for your loss. It is not silly. What an awesome person you are. Congratulations on your new babies.


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