# Banding goats horns



## Horsefly (Mar 1, 2010)

Well we have a month and a half old buckling and his dehorning job didn't work out so well.  We had a vet burn them twice (I have since found out from here that was really dangerous) and they have still grown.  2 weeks ago they were looking like they may fall off and then I got bad pnemonia and went into the hospital for 11 days.  I only got to go see them the first time yesterday.  The animals were in the care of my family and they basicly just fed everything.  So I have heard of people banding horns to make then fall off and was wondering how well it worked.  I was thinking it would be best to do it while his horns are still really small to be the least tramatic and invasive.  I really have no idea what's involved in this and if I can do it myself or what. So any tips or instructions would be great.  Thanks, oh and we may show him so he really can't have horns or be messed up up there.


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## Roll farms (Mar 1, 2010)

Never done it myself, but a friend of mine explained it to me.  
Her dehorner's older than dirt and she often gets scurs.

She cuts (scores) a ring around the scur / horn at the base, as close to the head as she can, and then rolls the band down to that spot.

I would think the horn would need to have some length and circumferance before this method would work, though....otherwise the band won't be tight enough and could roll right back off.

Also, I wouldn't do this until wayyy before or after fly season because it takes months sometimes for the scur to fall off.

Don't know how accurate any of that info is, just what I've been told....


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## helmstead (Mar 2, 2010)

Banding works great, we've banded our entire grade herd and a few registered goats - around 20 of them from young does to a 5 year old buck.  The goat needs to be over 6 mos old, though, and it's not always a walk in the park.

Wait until he's older before you fuss with it.  He's already been burned twice, I think reburning isn't a good option.  To show, with Nigis and Dairy Goats anyway...you can't have a scur over 3" long...so...see what really happens.


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## lorihadams (Mar 2, 2010)

Do you have to take the horns off? We are getting registered nigis soon and they are coming to us disbudded but my hubby says he doesn't have the heart to do it after watching a video on youtube. Just wondering if it is better to leave them on, burn them with an iron, or wait and band them?


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## ksalvagno (Mar 2, 2010)

Helmstead - How did you do the banding on the older goats?

There is an Alpine doe in milk that someone wants to get rid of on Craigslist and I'm really tempted since that would mean immediate milk and a full size dairy goat but she still has her horns.

lorihadams - coming from someone with little experience but watching the disbudding, I personally think I prefer disbudding the little kids. It truly is over so quickly and they forget so quickly what happened. If you plan to show, dairy goats have to be without horns. I think it would be much harder and more stressful to dehorn them later. Yes, it is one of those distasteful tasks but I look at it as one that just has to be done and just buck up and do it.


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## helmstead (Mar 2, 2010)

Karen - I'll PM you a link to my step by step on another, private forum...

Disbudding is no big deal.  We were staunchly against it at first, but once we learned how to do it...it's over in seconds and the kids forget immediately.  DeHORNING is not for the faint of heart or those who cannot/will not get their hands on a vet/pain meds/etc in my opinion.  It is painful, drawn out and can be bloody, messy and cause an infection if not looked well after.

Horns, well...they are destructive.  We've replaced thousands of dollars worth of fence because of them.  Not to mention, show goats cannot have them.  My Nubian (who is disbudded) Scarlett smacked me on the face once on accident and broke my nose - if she'd had horns I would have been in OR getting facial reconstruction.  So, nowadays, I'm pretty anti-horns.


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## SDGsoap&dairy (Mar 2, 2010)

Disbudding is the way to go!  We just got our first kids in January and were lucky enough to be a part of the process.  I think Kate's tougher than I am but it wasn't nearly as bad as I thought it would be.  Don't get me wrong, it's pretty awful and you'll want to get a drink after witnessing it, but it really is the best option for the goat.  It will be harder on you than it is on the kids!


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## helmstead (Mar 2, 2010)

n.smithurmond said:
			
		

> I think Kate's tougher than I am


Did you see ME with the iron in my hand??


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## SDGsoap&dairy (Mar 2, 2010)

Oh yeah.  Well, I'm going to have to buck up, I think Jim would pass out if I made him do it!


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## SDGsoap&dairy (Mar 2, 2010)

Does Kelly do it herself?  She was so blase about the banding, it seems like she could handle it.


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## ksalvagno (Mar 2, 2010)

My hubby will hold but there is no way he will do the deed. That will be up to me. So I will HAVE to just put my feelings aside and JUST DO IT!


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## helmstead (Mar 2, 2010)

n.smithurmond said:
			
		

> Does Kelly do it herself?  She was so blase about the banding, it seems like she could handle it.


LOL I think her DH does it, too!


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## MrsCountryChick (Mar 2, 2010)

Jefferslivestock has flat bands so they won't roll.  Look up the "Tri-Band" Bander (castrating bander). In the description they describe the flat bands that you can select to order on the page right under the description, they come in a pack of 25.
http://www.jefferslivestock.com/ssc...8QNAHW5HF5P9J6364RF7B3VDCW4CHE6&pf_id=0027115


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## Horsefly (Mar 2, 2010)

Thank you everyone for all the info.  His horns have about the diameter of a quarter and are an inch or so long from what I remember.  I was thinkng band now before they get to much longer and it will be less likely he will hit them and knock them off prematurely.  Also I thought it would be less invasive as the conection to the skull is smaller.  His dad has huge horns and I don't think you could even band them they are so large around. I am kind of against horns because of his dad.  He really knows how to use them and we have to be careful around him and lock him up when we have company.


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## helmstead (Mar 2, 2010)

you really should wait until he's 6 mos old...


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## Horsefly (Mar 2, 2010)

Okay, I'm good with waiting if that's best.  But I do have to ask the reasoning for it?


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## helmstead (Mar 2, 2010)

Stress, mainly.  Babies are already susceptable to bacterial scours, worms, etc etc...stress makes this worse...and banding is stressful.

A 6 month old's horns are still butter soft, nearly, and come off fast.  Shouldn't take more than 2 mos if you do it right...probably just 30 days.


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## cadman68 (Mar 3, 2010)

This is a little off topic but not way off...lol

Has anyone ever tried the Dr. naylor's dehorning paste? I have read a lot about it but have never used it. Sounds like it is so much easier than burning. Shave the area apply the paste and let set for 30 minutes then wash off with water and vinegar and bam it supposedly kills the horn buds. From what i understand it works best on very young goats, say 1 - 5 days old.

Anyway i was just wondering if anyone has any experience with it.


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## cmjust0 (Mar 3, 2010)

cadman68 said:
			
		

> This is a little off topic but not way off...lol
> 
> Has anyone ever tried the Dr. naylor's dehorning paste? I have read a lot about it but have never used it. Sounds like it is so much easier than burning. Shave the area apply the paste and let set for 30 minutes then wash off with water and vinegar and bam it supposedly kills the horn buds. From what i understand it works best on very young goats, say 1 - 5 days old.
> 
> Anyway i was just wondering if anyone has any experience with it.


No experience with it, but the main ingredients are hydrated lime and lye.  Basically, it induces a chemical burn.  

If not for the idea of how bad it would suck to have something chemical burning my own head for 30 minutes, I always wondered how the hell anybody was supposed to keep a baby goat still for that long to ensure the stuff didn't get where it wasn't suppose to be..

Always feared I'd end up dis-eyeing one.  Or dis-earing it.


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## SDGsoap&dairy (Mar 3, 2010)

helmstead said:
			
		

> n.smithurmond said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Great- my DH is such a wuss about stuff like this!  That's what I get for falling for the "sensitive" type.  

I purchased my first vacuum tubes today; I'll be trying my hand at drawing blood on Tuesday.  Baby steps, right...?


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## helmstead (Mar 3, 2010)

cadman68 said:
			
		

> This is a little off topic but not way off...lol
> 
> Has anyone ever tried the Dr. naylor's dehorning paste? I have read a lot about it but have never used it. Sounds like it is so much easier than burning. Shave the area apply the paste and let set for 30 minutes then wash off with water and vinegar and bam it supposedly kills the horn buds. From what i understand it works best on very young goats, say 1 - 5 days old.
> 
> Anyway i was just wondering if anyone has any experience with it.


I would _never_ use this product.  JMO


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## Horsefly (Mar 3, 2010)

I know someone who used this on some calfs they had.  It didn't work and the horns were just kind of stunted for awhile but grew anyway.  I wouldn't recomend it.


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