# Goats are sick | Here we go again!



## GoatCrazyLady (Oct 12, 2012)

My alpine exploded poo all over the other three this morning. Big mess! All their faces are swollen. Sitting at the vet now. Brought stool sample in. He thinks it's a parasite


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## 20kidsonhill (Oct 12, 2012)

bottle jaw from parasites?  

Hope your vet can find the problem.  

If you don't have B-complex, get some from the vet for the bottle jaw.


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## GoatCrazyLady (Oct 12, 2012)

Ok has this happened to you? I'm a nervous wreck right now.


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## 20kidsonhill (Oct 12, 2012)

We have dealt with bottle jaw, if that is what you are dealing with. A swelling under their jaw line, it can swell up so bad that their checks will swell up and it can be hard for them to eat.  I have never seen one with  bottle jaw that didn't look obviously anemic. Did you check their gums for color?


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## 20kidsonhill (Oct 12, 2012)

We really like injectable pig iron. It is great for getting iron in their system.  

Pen them and feed them off the ground, that helps the swelling.   Grazing will make the swelling worse.


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## GoatCrazyLady (Oct 12, 2012)

O.k. So they are being treated for coccidia / Haemonchous 

Prescriptions are  Albon (sulfadimethoxine) 500mg & Panacur ( Fenbendazole) for 5 days 

Just wish I new what they got into. I'm thinking it might be their dirty hay that I throw in a trailor to be emptied. Since the cold weather they are freaking out looking for anything to chow on and I've had to chase them away from it.


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## 20kidsonhill (Oct 12, 2012)

GoatCrazyLady said:
			
		

> O.k. So they are being treated for coccidia / Haemonchous
> 
> Prescriptions are  Albon (sulfadimethoxine) 500mg & Panacur ( Fenbendazole) for 5 days
> 
> Just wish I new what they got into. I'm thinking it might be their dirty hay that I throw in a trailor to be emptied. Since the cold weather they are freaking out looking for anything to chow on and I've had to chase them away from it.


Parasites don't work that way.  You may wish to copper bolus them,  That really helped us with the Haemonchous. 
I would repeat your treatments 21 days after finishing them.  To help with reblooming of the worms.

Also Panacur is not always affective against haemonchous. so I would consider another fecal in 2 weeks after you are done with treatment. Or if you don't see a lot of improvement after 3 days of treating them, consider a stronger wormer.


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## GoatCrazyLady (Oct 12, 2012)

20kidsonhill said:
			
		

> GoatCrazyLady said:
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Oh thank you for the suggestions. This is making me crazy with worry.


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## GoatCrazyLady (Oct 12, 2012)

So where can I buy copper bolus from?


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## 20kidsonhill (Oct 12, 2012)

GoatCrazyLady said:
			
		

> So where can I buy copper bolus from?


called Copasure:

jefferslivestock
valleyvet


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## GoatCrazyLady (Oct 12, 2012)

Thank you for your help


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## GoatCrazyLady (Oct 13, 2012)

So would I need to buy both pig iron and copasure? Anyone? Please! Did someone say you can get from health food store?


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## 20kidsonhill (Oct 13, 2012)

Pig iron is sold either at Jeffers or valleyvet on-line or some feed stores may carry it. If they are anemic(gums look white) and have bottle jaw, then pig iron would be the first thin that you would want to consider. or perhaps another form of iron would be Red cell for horses. REd cell for horses is given orally, pig iron is injected.  The pig iron will work faster and better, because it is injected. Red cell for horses is also sold at your local feed stores, normally in a gallon, but I have seen it sold in smaller amounts. 
Around $22.00 for a gallon of red cell, get the smaller bottle if they have it. 
or get a 100 ml bottle of Iron Ferrous 100, which is the pig iron. 

Copasure is copper oxide rods and they are given orally and lay in the stomach lining of the goat, Barberpole worms(heamonchous) do not like copper oxide and it will help some. But is not going to get rid of them completely. 

How are they doing?  
How are the treatments going? 

Did you check their gums? Did they look anemic?


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## GoatCrazyLady (Oct 14, 2012)

20kidsonhill said:
			
		

> Pig iron is sold either at Jeffers or valleyvet on-line or some feed stores may carry it. If they are anemic(gums look white) and have bottle jaw, then pig iron would be the first thin that you would want to consider. or perhaps another form of iron would be Red cell for horses. REd cell for horses is given orally, pig iron is injected.  The pig iron will work faster and better, because it is injected. Red cell for horses is also sold at your local feed stores, normally in a gallon, but I have seen it sold in smaller amounts.
> Around $22.00 for a gallon of red cell, get the smaller bottle if they have it.
> or get a 100 ml bottle of Iron Ferrous 100, which is the pig iron.
> 
> ...


All are doing fine except for my alpine. He got it the worst! Face is swollen still but his berries are getting better, he is eating and drinking fine but can tell he's not his normal self. checked his gums and they look pink to me. I placed an order for the pig iron and copasure from the website u gave me and also vitamin B complex. I'm going to call the feed store and see if they carry the pig iron so I can give ASAP. 

I can not thank you enough!


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## GoatCrazyLady (Oct 14, 2012)

If his gums are not white do I still want to give the pig iron?


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## 20kidsonhill (Oct 14, 2012)

GoatCrazyLady said:
			
		

> If his gums are not white do I still want to give the pig iron?


I have never had a goat with Bottle Jaw that wasn't very anemic.  Are you sure he isn't anemic looking and you are just being confussed by skin pigmentation?  Bottle Jaw is caused from anemia.   Giving him 1 or 2 cc of pig iron isn't going to hurt anything if he isn't truely anemic. But I am a little confused why he would have bottle jaw. 

It does take time for some of them to recover, that is why I suggest repeating treatment in 21 days . So the parasite doesn't take advantage of an already weakened animal.


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## GoatCrazyLady (Oct 14, 2012)

Well, I could be very confused I suppose. I will give it when I get it then. I called my local L&M store and they do not carry either product. So I will try our local feed store tomorrow. Not very hopeful as they don't carry much.   otherwise I will have to wait for the shipment. Oh... and I also ordered meds for doing the second round of treatments. 

I just caught him playing with one of my other goats, I hope this is a good sign.

 Does giving this copasure  ( yearly ) help with the prevention of these parasites?


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## 20kidsonhill (Oct 14, 2012)

copasure normally given twice a year, and it may only help with the Haemonchous worm, probably doesn't do anything for coccidiosis. Although having enough copper in the animals system can help their immune system and therefor help them handle other parasite loads. I have read that a goat with adequate copper levels is almost immune to lice and mite infestations and wont have hoof rot problems. Copper can be overdosed, but copper oxide rods are a very slow way for copper to absorb. To truely increase copper levels in an animal copper sulfate needs to be used. It should be found in your loose goat minerals in adequate levels and copper sulfate is also in REd cell for horses. REd cell for horses should never be used on a regular basis. You will eventually overdose your goat on certain minerals. 

Sheep are also sensitive to copper containing products, so goats housed with sheep need to be cared for differently.


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## 20kidsonhill (Oct 14, 2012)

None of it will be a cure, we do all of this and some years parasits are just worse than other years or time of year. Spring time is always tough for us, and a few days following a rain after a drought period can be tough. Like we don't get any rain in July for a montha and then get a couple days of rain. We wait a week and check the entire herd. There are always a couple if not more than a couple that will need to be wormed.  

After a doe kids, or after a doe is weaned they have more stress in their life and may need to be checked a week to 10 days later for a worm load.  

But we have found giving Copasure a couple times a year, One time right near the end of winter before it worms up for the spring and then one time middle of summer. Really has helped us.


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## GoatCrazyLady (Oct 14, 2012)

Daunte, our alpine seems much better this evening. His swelling has gone down some and he is following me around again.

Also I gave the pig iron in the skin and not the muscle. Will this hurt anything? How and where do you give a shot in the muscle? Ugh!


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## 20kidsonhill (Oct 15, 2012)

GoatCrazyLady said:
			
		

> Daunte, our alpine seems much better this evening. His swelling has gone down some and he is following me around again.


that is great. I am glad they are on their way to recovery. We had a heck of a time with one of our adult does this summer.  Parasits both internal and external have been terible this year. WE have had years that we didn't hardly worm anything, but this year was not the case with the warm winter.


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## GoatCrazyLady (Oct 16, 2012)

I'd better be getting myself a backbone then. Ugh! So stressful.


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## GoatCrazyLady (Oct 25, 2012)

O.k. So now all the goats seem to have puffy faces again. Urgh! So do I start them on meds again. Only been a week. Is it o.k?  Rain and snow the past few days. Wet....wet...wet...


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## 20kidsonhill (Oct 25, 2012)

my guess would be the Panacur isn't strong enough to lower your Heamancha(spelling?) worm load.  You probably need a stronger wormer.


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## GoatCrazyLady (Oct 25, 2012)

Like? I have safeguard from Jeffers. Will this work?


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## 20kidsonhill (Oct 25, 2012)

GoatCrazyLady said:
			
		

> Like? I have safeguard from Jeffers. Will this work?


Panacur is the same as safegaurd. 

Iwas thinking more on the lines of cydectin, synanthic maybe valbazene. 

You could try Quest wormer for horses. Quest is the same active ingredients as cydectin and works well on the type of worm you are dealing with. then you woudln't have to get a bigger bottle of medication that will cost more for just a couple goats. 

I think it is around $13 or so for a tube and will treat 600 lbs of goats, treat at twice the dosage for a horse. 

You treated for 5 days in a row for coccidiosis
and also 3 days with panacur???


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## GoatCrazyLady (Oct 26, 2012)

20kidsonhill said:
			
		

> GoatCrazyLady said:
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Yes. That is correct. Should i go another round of 3 and 5 days? 

Thank you again!


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## GoatCrazyLady (Oct 28, 2012)

For how many days should I give the pig iron and B complex?


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## GoatCrazyLady (Nov 13, 2012)

Parasites are back for round 4 and I'm so do for a nervous breakdown. I have no other pasture to bring them to. Vet suggested Cleaning with Borax. Going to clean shed and yard with this tomorrow. This really has been a complete nightmare. Every time I think they are better, within a day or two, the bottle jaw is back! Hoping the ground freezes real soon!  Just need to SCREAM >>> ENOUGH ALREADY! Oh.... The stress! No coping skills I guess.


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## mama24 (Nov 13, 2012)

I went through this last month. Wormed, seemed better for a few days, amybe a week and a half. Then bottlejaw again. Turned out they had sucking lice causing the anemia and bottlejaw! And here I just assumed they hadn't kicked the worms! So go through their hair and make sure you aren't missing something like that.


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## GoatCrazyLady (Nov 13, 2012)

mama24 said:
			
		

> I went through this last month. Wormed, seemed better for a few days, amybe a week and a half. Then bottlejaw again. Turned out they had sucking lice causing the anemia and bottlejaw! And here I just assumed they hadn't kicked the worms! So go through their hair and make sure you aren't missing something like that.


Really? O.k. What did you treat the lice with? Are they easy to find? 

Thank you.


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## mama24 (Nov 14, 2012)

Most of my goats are white, so they were very easy to see once I realized it was bugs and not dirt! I used an insecticide dust I got at the feed store that said it is approved for use in dairy cattle. I can't think of the name right now, but it came in a round can with a shaker lid, very easy to dust over them. I need to get another can to do another treatment this weekend. I hate to use pesticides on my farm, but I also wanted those bugs dead and gone ASAP! Better now than when they are pregnant or in milk!


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## GoatCrazyLady (Nov 14, 2012)

O.k. I looked and couldn't see anything but I did read that you can use ivermectin for sucking lice and that's what they are on right now for the worms. 

Thank you tho.


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