# Little doeling with pale gums, staggering and shaking her head??



## dianneS (Nov 11, 2009)

What the heck is going on???  I have a perfectly healthy doeling.  She is at least four months old, she was totally fine this morning and yesterday too.  She was outside shivering and bawling like she was in pain or something.  I brought her inside to warm her up.  Her gums and tounge are pale and grey.  She keeps shaking her head like she's disoriented, I don't know what is going on??  She was perfectly healthy this morning?  What could have happened.  She's been vaccinated and wormed, she is healthy until now?  She's acting so strange I don't know what is going on!!

I put her in a pen by herself.  I put a sweater on her to keep her warm.  She has water and good hay, she ate quite a bit of pelleted feed and she's eating animal crackers.  She just stands around and shivers and every now and then she tosses her head around and wobbles like she's losing her equilibrium?  This is very odd.  I think she behaved this way before but to a lesser degree and she just got over it.

She's doing better, and I don't think she's in any imminant danger, but I'd really like to find out what her problem is?


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## Roll farms (Nov 11, 2009)

Take her to a vet.

If her gums are that pale, she's anemic to some degree...so maybe what you're 'worming' with, isn't the right dewormer for the worms she may have...maybe it's coccidia.   

Are her vaccinations UTD?

Temp?

All that aside, I'd take her to the vet anyway.


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## dianneS (Nov 11, 2009)

Her temp is normal.  Her vaccinations are UTD, she had panacur about a month ago.  I gave her some albon today when she started acting strange.  I don't know what her previous owner gave her to prevent coccidiosis, she said it was something that was put into the water.

I've been reading up on listeriosis and that can be caused by certain coccidiosis medications.  It causes a thiamin deficiency.

I can't get her to the vet today, I wish I could, but my husband won't be home until 10 tonight and I can't drive right now.  I'm having blurred vision and numbess in half of my face.  I can't think straight either.  I think its a migraine, or maybe the goat and I are both suffering from something environmental!


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## cmjust0 (Nov 11, 2009)

Pale and gray..  Is her mouth cold?  

She almost sounds dehydrated, but I would think you'd notice a reason for her being dehydrated....like scours or something.

I'd probably get this one to a vet, ASAP.


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## kimmyh (Nov 11, 2009)

What is her temp? When people say her temp is normal, the first thing we all think is (not saying this is true for you) the owner didn't take a temp. Her temp can give people a lot of information. I agree with the above, call the vet, a goat that is staggering is not one you can safely watch and wait on. She could have a million things going wrong, like Polio, Listerosis, an insect bite, she could be dieing form a parasite over load, etc. The only way to know is to head to the vet.


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## dianneS (Nov 11, 2009)

Her temp is 101.7.  She's acting normal now.  Just cold.  Its been 70 degrees for the past few days and today its 40!  Every time we have a cold snap, this little goat reacts badly.  She doesn't adjust well to the cold.

She was a premature baby and was very small and weak at first.  She's been healthy so far and growing.  She's getting her winter coat, but when the weather turns cold suddenly she stands still and shivers for a day or so until she adjusts to the cold, then she is fine.

That is how she was behaving today when I found her, just fluffed up and shivering, bawling like she was miserable.  I took her in the house and that is when she started shaking her head and sort of staggering a bit.  I took her back outside and she started eating and acting normal after a few minutes, except for being fluffed up and shivering.

Her gums look normal too, I'm not sure if her tounge was really pale or if she just has a bluish tounge?  I have two weathers that both have blue tounges like a Chow dog!  I never looked at this girls tounge, so I have nothing to compare it to.

I guess I've got to get her to the vet tomorrow.


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## kimmyh (Nov 11, 2009)

101.7 is low normal, and given this girls rough start, I would look to add a warm place for her to get out of the cold (if you can) and try to put some fat on her. I know that sounds bad, but a little fat can make a huge difference in cold weather. Can you construct a box for the stall with a roof, and an open front? If you can, I would put at least 4" worth of straw in there, so she can get in and warm up. It's a pain because you have to change the straw daily, but the only other way I know of keeping her warm is with a heat lamp. At least with the box there is no fire danger/increased power bill.


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## cmjust0 (Nov 11, 2009)

I can't imagine true hypothermia at 40, but I've seen young goats shiver at those temps before -- especially if they come early and their winter coats aren't really in yet.

What's her housing like?  Does she have a place to get in out of the wind, or does she just have a covered area to get out of the rain?  Is her bedding especially damp or anything like that?  Water is an excellent conductor of heat, so damp bedding wicks body heat right into the ground.

Just out of curiosity, does this goat eat much hay?  Or is it one of those that's sorta learned to make a living off grain and just sorta picks around a little beyond that..  I ask because a young goat that hasn't eaten much hay won't likely have much of a rumen, and when it gets cold, digestion in the rumen goes a loooooooong way toward keeping them warm.  

So many people -- and this isn't aimed at the OP specifically, mind you -- but a lot of people feed a lot of grain to their young goats thinking they're treating them especially kindly, but what they fail to realize is that the animal's not really building much of a rumen unless it's eating a good bit of graze, browse, and hay..


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## dianneS (Nov 11, 2009)

No, I don't feed my goats grain at all, just as a treat now and then.  We have plenty of pasture and only give hay when necessary.  When we had our first cold snap, I started giving this little one some goat balancer pellets since she was so bothered by the cold.  But I don't feed it to her regularly.  My goats have always thrived on pasture for the most part.

I put a sweater on her for the first few days of cold weather about a month ago, and then she adjusted.  We've had a short indian summer this week, but today its cold and rainy and miserable.  The horses aren't even leaving the barn much either.

I've given her lots of enclosed spaces where she can get in and stay warm, ever since our first cold snap.  I've also put down LOTS of thick bedding.  She's totally out of the wind.  My goats go in and out of a section of the barn, with smaller sections inside the barn with low roofs to hold in body heat.

She is having her first experience with hay though.  Since it was cold and rainy this morning, and I know how much the goats hate being wet and cold, I took some of this great new hay out for them.  I don't know how much of it she ate, but they were all anxious to dive into it when I gave it to them this morning since they didn't want to go out in the rain to graze.

She's out with the other goats now, they are all grazing in the pasture.  She's got her sweater on, she's eating, but looks cold.  I gave her a little nutra-drench today too.  Maybe I should give her some Probios too?? She seems fine, just cold.


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## kimmyh (Nov 11, 2009)

Because she had a hard start, and because she doesn't tolerate the cold very well, I would make sure she has hay in front of her all the time. This time of the year, pasture have very little nutrition, and hay will do more to warm her core than pasture/grain. Baby goats do not thrive on pasture alone, they may survive, but I have never seen them thrive.


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## dianneS (Nov 11, 2009)

I'm watching her out the window right now.  She's easy to spot in her burgundy sweater!   She's grazing with the rest.  I'll make sure she's got plenty of hay.  I'll give her some more pellets tonight and add some corn oil to her feed.

She's completely fine now.  This is all very strange.  Her behavior was quite disturbing this morning, and now she's fine???


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## dianneS (Nov 11, 2009)

Its starting to get dark, so I went out to get everyone settled in for the night.

She's still behaving normally, not even cold anymore.  She ran to me for treats, even stood up on her hind legs to beg with her brothers.  She gobbled down her grain, pellets and corn oil that I gave her to warm her up.  I loaded up their pen with more fresh hay for tonight.

She seems fine.  Could she have just been THAT cold that she behaved so strangely?  I don't think she wanted to be outside with the rest this morning, I think she followed them out to the pasture just to stay with the herd.  She was hiding under one of their big wooden wire spools and shivering when I found her this morning.  I think she would have preferred to be in the barn.

Well, I'll be keeping a close eye on her that's for sure, but as for now, she's totally back to normal.


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## freemotion (Nov 11, 2009)

Can you create a nest for her so she will retain more body heat overnight?

Grain and other supplements will help her grow, but it is the fermentation of roughage like hay that creates heat.


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## dianneS (Nov 11, 2009)

She has about three different little nesting spots where she could curl up tonight.  I didn't want to pen her up by herself so that she could choose to cuddle with her brothers or the bigger goats or even the dog.

I just went out to check on her and she and one of the big girls were munching hay from the pile.  The rest were settled in for the night.  She didn't seem ready for bed yet, she just kept following me, and standing up, putting her feet on me, hoping for treats!

She's still got her sweater on too, that really seems to help.  I think she'll be fine tonight.  Very odd situation earlier today??  Hope it doesn't happen again.


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## freemotion (Nov 11, 2009)

Sometimes you just never know the answer to why or what.... :/


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## cmjust0 (Nov 12, 2009)

dianneS said:
			
		

> She gobbled down her grain, pellets and corn oil that I gave her to warm her up.  I loaded up their pen with more fresh hay for tonight.


It's not grain or pellets or protein content that warm a goat through rumination...it's _bulk_.  The courser the hay, the more heat it'll make -- regardless of the nutrient content.  

When it gets really cold, make sure you're throwing the coursest hay you've got..  And, like Kimmy said, make sure they've _always_ got hay.


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## ksalvagno (Nov 12, 2009)

It probably wouldn't hurt to give her some probios for a few days. Obviously she is more delicate than the others and will just have to be watched more closely. At least you know this and are doing just that.


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## Beekissed (Nov 12, 2009)

If this recurs, this would be a goat that I would get rid of as quickly as possible.  If not, you are looking at vet bills and passing on a weak constitution in your herd.


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## dianneS (Nov 12, 2009)

I wouldn't breed this goat, I know she came from poor stock.  I wanted to rescue her from that woman that had her!

She's doing fine today.  She's got plenty of hay, but I can't force her to eat it.  She's perferring to graze today.  If she could get at the wild rose bushes, I'm sure that is what she'd eat.  Maybe I'll throw her a big pile, we just cut a bunch down to fix the horse fence.

Oh, and I tried giving the goats some warm maple and brown sugar oatmeal a few weeks ago when it was cold... they wanted nothing to do with it!!  They hated it.  I won't waste my time again!


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## mully (Nov 12, 2009)

I would put her on a drench for about 5 days. It will stimulate her appetite and take care of her weak condition ... she may even do better with the cold.


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## dianneS (Nov 13, 2009)

Sure, I'll put her on a drench and some probios for a few days.  She's adjusted to the cold now, and seems totally fine???  Strange.

Just found out I'll be getting two little fainting goats in the spring!  I'm so excited!


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## dianneS (Nov 24, 2009)

Okay, we had another cold snap last week.  My little goat was just as dramatic about it, but this time I didn't fall for it.  She stayed inside with the guardian dog instead of following the rest outside in the cold.  I gave her plenty of hay and a nest to stay warm.  She wasn't happy, but she would survive.  She's adjusted more to the cold since then.

We are having cold and rainy weather right now, this is the weather she hates the most.  She's handling it well compared to before.  Once again, she's not happy, but healthy and fine.  

I guess she's just a very delicate little thing.  I hope she outgrows that some day!  She's got everything she needs to stay warm and healthy and keep her belly full, so I'm not going to worry so much if she gets a little overly dramatic again!


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## FarmerChick (Nov 24, 2009)

Check inside her eyelids.

Are they truly pink.....or pale?

If they are pale, your goat has an overload of worms big time.

pale inside eyelid means you must de-worm strong.



I routinely check eyelids after worming.....best way to know if you have a problem with one goat.


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