# Broken scur..what a MESS!



## RockyToggRanch (Jan 13, 2011)

I went to the barn this evening to find my young togg buck with a bloody head and face. (I mean...sopping, but not dripping). I was alone until my DH got home 2 hours later. I held him as still as I could with one hand and sprayed wound coat and dumped bloodstop powder on it. When DH got here we went out with warm water and cloths prepared to clean him up. He looked wet, but not dripping.
Well, now I wish we'd left him alone. As soon as we brushed against it (accidently) it starting bleeding harder. We dumped more powder on it and decided not to try to clean him off or bandage it....he was freaking out 

Now I'm hoping that it stops bleeding and needless to say, I won't sleep tonight. How long does bloodstop usually take? I covered all surfaces of the broken scur with a thick coating...more than once.

His sire has knocked off scurs before, but nothing as bloody as this:/


----------



## SDGsoap&dairy (Jan 13, 2011)

We had a kid play too rough and knock into something after disbudding- holy moses was his head gushing!  The styptic powder did nothing on it's own, but with a ton of styptic powder and a solid 60 seconds of pressure it did stop.  It's tough enough to keep an 8 lb kid still, I wish I had a suggestion for restraining your full sized buck's head while you keep pressure on it!    I do think that head wounds usually look worse than they generally are though.


----------



## aggieterpkatie (Jan 13, 2011)

My buck knocks his scurs off occasionally and it's usually not very bloody. I don't do anything to them. I used to spray them with Blu-Kote, but now I just leave them be because they're so tender for him.  

Unless it's really a LOT of blood, I'm sure he'll be fine!


----------



## RockyToggRanch (Jan 13, 2011)

His sire knocks them off and bleeds and I leave them alone...but this guy...oh my.. How much blood is a lot of blood? I'm not easily sickened by blood or guts, but this has me queezy.


----------



## ksalvagno (Jan 13, 2011)

As long as he is up and acting normal, I wouldn't worry about it. As my vet always says, "the bleeding ALWAYS eventually stops."


----------



## RockyToggRanch (Jan 13, 2011)

Yes, it eventually stops. Hopefully with a living goat remaining:/ He's not acting "normal" but is trying to rub his head and seems really p'd off. 

Is there much chance of him bleeding to death overnight? I know that I'm over protective and paranoid about them at times, but I don't want to call the vet out in 6 degree weather in the middle of the night...unless I really need to.


----------



## ksalvagno (Jan 13, 2011)

I wouldn't think he would bleed to death from a broken scur but like with anything with goats, there is no guarantee. Maybe duct taping some gauze or something on it? Kind of a funny thought with a goat full of duct tape but


----------



## helmstead (Jan 13, 2011)

No, it's probably not going to cause him to bleed out.  Trust me it looks worse than it is!!  I've had this happen a handful of times.  With a cracked scur, which sounds like is what you have...there is nothing you can really do to stop the bleeding outside of burning the whole thing off and cauterizing it, which is NASTY.  At least on a cracked HORN you can wrap the devil out of it with duct tape, but not with a cracked scur...

Hopefully it hurts badly enough he'll not bump it anymore...and it will clot.

One note, that blood will dry like leather and be nearly impossible to remove...but I would still leave him alone for a good while so he'll have a good clot on before you mess with it again.


----------



## RockyToggRanch (Jan 13, 2011)

He broke the entire thing off about 1/2 an inch from his skull. There's not much there to wrap. I was afraid that if I wrapped it around his neck, he's surely hang himself by morning:/

I'll leave him be.. hope it stops on it's own now...hope there are no coyotes within sniffing range..  and then I guess I'll deal with the dried blood tomorrow. I'll plan a haircut:/


----------



## Roll farms (Jan 13, 2011)

It probably isn't hugely sanitary, but I've found the absolute best thing to stop bleeding is a big wad of cobweb.

Some old timer told me about it years ago and I added it to my "yeah right / no way" file in my head, but one day I cut a doe's hoof BADLY when she jerked her leg during a trimming.  Next thing you know I'm using a broom to sweep up a big wad of cobweb from the rafters and it really worked.



Now when I have to clean the cobwebs out, I save a big honkin' wad of them for just in case when hoof trimming.

I've never had any luck w/ the blood stop powder.

I've had bucks knock scurs off and look like Slaughterhouse 5...they did fine.  
Go to bed, sleep, he'll be a crusty, but fine, mess in the morning.


----------



## julieq (Jan 14, 2011)

Roll farms said:
			
		

> It probably isn't hugely sanitary, but I've found the absolute best thing to stop bleeding is a big wad of cobweb.
> 
> Some old timer told me about it years ago and I added it to my "yeah right / no way" file in my head, but one day I cut a doe's hoof BADLY when she jerked her leg during a trimming.  Next thing you know I'm using a broom to sweep up a big wad of cobweb from the rafters and it really worked.
> 
> ...


If cobwebs could be properly packaged and marketed for their blood clotting ability I could make a FORTUNE harvesting them from my 100 year old dairy barn!


----------



## SDGsoap&dairy (Jan 14, 2011)

I've heard about the cobwebs too but never tried it.  Actually, we didn't end up with many last year now that I think about it.  We always end up with a plague of daddy long-legs but I don't typically see webs from them, they're just EVERYWHERE.  Blegh.


----------



## Emmetts Dairy (Jan 14, 2011)

Went thru a bad broken scur myself.  It does look like ALOT of blood...but really..its will be okay.  If he did not lift any skin up off the skull  with the scur and its truly just a broken scur...he will be fine.  

It hurts him and the more you chase him to tend to him..you are raising his blood pressure..in turn will make him bleed more.   I always access the situation to make sure its just the scur itself and no skin etc...and let him be.  They will take care of themselves.  Dont wash the site...becuase the blood needs to sit on the site to allow it to clot.   Just blue kote and blood stop to keep clean...and thats all you can do right now.

The theory behind the bloodstop, cobwebs, flour,cornstarch etc...is to hold the blood on the wound so the coagulators in his blood work.  It the coagulators in his blood that actually stop the bleeding...not the stuff itself!!  Per my vet..after he came out for a broken scur!  And it makes alot of sense!!  

Believe me..I learned the hardway!  I listened to a old farmer and put cayene pepper on the scur...what I mess I made.  Never again.!!!!   I felt like an idiot...so I washed that mess I made off, carefully mind you..blue koted him..and in a few days his was back to himself!!!  It was also a very low break as yours...its was actually right down and almost flat!! And that low they bleed alot...I was scared to...thats why I had the vet come out.  

What I would recomend is to let it scab over and keep putting blue kote on it to keep it clean.  If you wanna put some iodine or something else..thats fine...wash his face etc where the blood dripped all over him...but let that scur scab and dont distrupt the scab...leave it alone and he will be fine...you pull the scab with water etc..he will begin to bleed again...just blue kote and let him heal!  He will be mindful of his boo boo!!!  

Its scary!! I hate when that happens!!!  Believe...Ive been there!!! 

I hate scurrs!!!!!!!


----------



## Emmetts Dairy (Jan 14, 2011)

Keeps us updated if you can!!!  

Im sure he will do great!!


----------



## RockyToggRanch (Jan 14, 2011)

This morning his messy face was no longer bright red soaked. It's all yucky brown old blood now , which is a start. I couldn't hold him still long enough to wash it off last night. He kept bopping his scur trying to pull out of the stand. DH mentioned the blood pressure at that point. (The goats..not mine) and we decided not to stress him out anymore.

So this morning the scur still looks wet, but not bright red and not dripping. He ate and pooped just fine.


----------



## AlaskanShepherdess (Jan 14, 2011)

Cayenne pepper is WONDERFUL at stopping the bleeding because it equalizes the blood pressure. My SIL put her hand through a glass cupboard, severed her ligament and the artery on her wrist. She put cayenne pepper on the wound and internally. By the time the EMT's arrived the bleeding had completely stopped and she was laughing and joking with them. The EMT's couldn't believe it.


----------



## Emmetts Dairy (Jan 14, 2011)

RockyToggRanch said:
			
		

> This morning his messy face was no longer bright red soaked. It's all yucky brown old blood now , which is a start. I couldn't hold him still long enough to wash it off last night. He kept bopping his scur trying to pull out of the stand. DH mentioned the blood pressure at that point. (The goats..not mine) and we decided not to stress him out anymore.
> 
> So this morning the scur still looks wet, but not bright red and not dripping. He ate and pooped just fine.


Im Glad he's doing better!!!  

I knew how you felt though!! Its alot of blood and its scary and not pleasant.


----------



## PattySh (Jan 14, 2011)

Glad to hear your boy is ok. Years ago I had to saw off a horn from a Saanen buck and what a mess of blood on that boy. Neighbors were horrified! But we rescued him and he had a horn penetrating his head and an ingrown collar. After I fixed Homer up the dang goat loved me and would try to rub his smell on me every chance he got lol. He was a gorgeous buck, very gentle and HUGE and wow did he Stink.


----------



## Roll farms (Jan 15, 2011)

Peroxide is a great blood dissolver / remover, if it warms up enough you can use it to help remove his ickies.

Glad he's feeling better / stopped bleeding.


----------



## Henrietta23 (Mar 18, 2011)

I'm going through this right now. My wether knocked his scur off and after trying to put stop quick stuff on it nothing was working. It was dripping blood and he was freaking out. If we tried to touch it he screamed. DS who is not quite 9 stuck his head in the barn and said, "Mom, remember KC (a friend who has sheep) said to use cobwebs?" Dog gone it! There were tons right over our heads. So far it seems to be helping. It's hard not to believe he's going to bleed to death. We are ALL covered in blood. His head is soaked. He is calmly munching hay while the does are wonder what the heck happened....


----------



## RockyToggRanch (Mar 18, 2011)

If I ever have a buck with scurs that bad...I will grab webs for sure. 

I sold that buck this week. and will make sure that whoever does my disbudding this yr, knows what they're doing. I know what to look for..in case they need to be re-burned.  My herd sire has small scurs that he knocks off once or twice a yr..no major bleeding.


----------



## Henrietta23 (Mar 18, 2011)

Two of my goats were disbudded by the small animal vet who sold them to me. I'm afraid he needs more practice. 
So far so good. He's not bleeding anymore. He just looks awful. Now I'm wondering if I just let it all be or does he need antibiotics or anything....   I think I'm breathing again. I can't believe how much I started shaking at the sight of all the blood. I used to work in a veterinary clinic. I've seen worse than that.


----------



## RockyToggRanch (Mar 18, 2011)

When I saw by young buck with his head and face saturated in blood...I thought ..OMG, he's a dead boy if I don't stop this bleeding.

I got my non-animal loving DH to help get him into the milk stand and we tried to put bloodstop on it. Well..we barely touched it and the blood POURED from it. Now I'm thinking I should've let it be..it was obviously already clotting. oops


----------



## poorboys (Mar 18, 2011)

thats what i was gonna say.





			
				Roll farms said:
			
		

> It probably isn't hugely sanitary, but I've found the absolute best thing to stop bleeding is a big wad of cobweb.
> 
> Some old timer told me about it years ago and I added it to my "yeah right / no way" file in my head, but one day I cut a doe's hoof BADLY when she jerked her leg during a trimming.  Next thing you know I'm using a broom to sweep up a big wad of cobweb from the rafters and it really worked.
> 
> ...


----------



## Henrietta23 (Mar 18, 2011)

He bumped it coming into the barn tonight and there's a tiny trickle of blood starting up but the wad of webs is in place. He's a nightmare to look at but I can deal with that. He's acting absolutely normal otherwise so I'm going to sleep. I'm exhausted after the ordeal. Leaving him alone probably would have been best but it looked for all the world like a faucet of blood pouring from a hole on his head.


----------



## Henrietta23 (Mar 19, 2011)

Yup, he's a mess! He is up and around and eating but not willing to get too close to anyone. He lets the does eat then goes for the hay himself. I suspect he's experiencing quite a bit of pain. Poor boy!


----------



## RockyToggRanch (Mar 19, 2011)

Hopefully you're pre-fly season.


----------



## Henrietta23 (Mar 19, 2011)

RockyToggRanch said:
			
		

> Hopefully you're pre-fly season.


Pretty much. I've seen one in the house, but it's still pretty cool here.


----------

