# *please* go and do these two things for your animals...



## patandchickens (Jul 14, 2010)

I have gotten somewhat frustrated by posts by well-meaning but really unprepared animal owners, and would like to gently promote the _very large virtues_ of two things:

1) *Right now*, before you have any reason to need it, figure out exactly *how you will isolate one or two of your animals* (small pen or stall). If it requires you to do any construction, materials-acquisition, etc, get to work on that NOW (really it's something that should be done before even bringing the animals home, but better late than never). Really, this is part of basic livestock-husbandry equipment, unless you want to take a "whatever happens to them, happens" approach.

2) *Right now*, if you haven't already, *sock away at least a few hundred dollars towards emergency expenses* in a dedicated separate savings account, or shoebox, or DEFINITELY ALWAYS available free space on a credit card, or what-have-you. This isn't just meant as a vet expense fund (although yes, that is one big purpose of it), it's also for things like "oh wow, someone crashed through the paddock fence and I need $100 worth of lumber and posts to fix it".  Nearly everyone who can afford to keep animals in the FIRST place can afford to pare back on other expenses for a while as necessary, to build this fund up. And then do the same to replenish it if tapped. THEN go buy new doodads or fancier food or acquire more animals or whatever.

Unexpected expenses and unexpected need-for-confinement-or-isolation are just as much a PREDICTABLE part of animal ownership as feed bills, hoof trimming, that sort of thing.

Please make them part of your regular setup, so that little fixable things do not snowball into much larger maybe-less-fixable and certainly-more-expensive-and-dire situations.

<off soapbox>,

Pat


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## ksalvagno (Jul 14, 2010)

Always a good idea even for people who only own cats and dogs.


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## glenolam (Jul 14, 2010)

Pat - I agree with you 150% and get frustrated as well, so please don't take this personally or the wrong way. I'm not meaning to start an argument or anything like that, just trying to present another side of some sort....

If we didn't have those who don't prepare for every situation, we'd never come up with solutions that _may_ be less costly than a vet trip.  We may even be able to help someone save their animal by suggesting home remedies instead of saying "Just go to the vet and pay $100 to find out you only need to give them baking soda".  If people didn't jump in with "OMG what do I do about my fence?!?" we couldn't say the things we did to fix our own fences, such as use free pallets or what have you.

Again, I'm not disagreeing with you at all (  ), and we do have the two things you mentioned at our house, but having those who don't also helps me come up with creative solutions and the ability to fix things myself before it gets that bad.


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## patandchickens (Jul 14, 2010)

glenolam said:
			
		

> Pat - I agree with you 150% and get frustrated as well, so please don't take this personally or the wrong way.<snip>
> If we didn't have those who don't prepare for every situation, we'd never come up with solutions that _may_ be less costly than a vet trip.  We may even be able to help someone save their animal by suggesting home remedies instead of saying "Just go to the vet and pay $100 to find out you only need to give them baking soda".  If people didn't jump in with "OMG what do I do about my fence?!?" we couldn't say the things we did to fix our own fences, such as use free pallets or what have you.


Oh, I certainly agree that necessity is the mother of invention and education, and all that! 

And honestly no matter HOW well prepared a person thinks they are, there will still always be things that leave you scrambling -- need to fix more fence than you have supplies for, and can't get to a store b/c flooding or ice storm or no working vehicle; sudden unexpected changes in personal finance that wipe out what emergency fund you had; need to confine or isolate one more animal than you have individual quarters for  -- that sort of thing.

So I really do not think that having people be _prepared_ to confine/isolate an animal, and having a reserve fund for sudden expenses, is going to actually cut into our educational opportunities very much. Especially since some things, like "ok so how DO I cheaply knock together somewhere to keep this animal confined by itself?" can very easily be dealt with _in advance_, as opposed to when emergency need arises. Thus letting more people productively share their creative solutions.

As far as remedies and first aid, FWIW personally I think it is still _always_ worth seeing if there is a reasonable and sensible home treatment for a medical problem, before getting the vet out (especially when you don't have access to a vet who's especially good at the particular kind of animal in question). (well unless it is a clearly time-of-the-essence problem, like animal is choking and a vet could perfectly well BE gotten). So by no means am I campaigning against people from posting things like "my sheep is exploding, what should I do?" and being told to get out the baking soda   All's I'm saying is that, when the general wisdom is that you DO need a vet, or when you get a vet out and he says you need <whatever> diagnostic or treatment expenses, there is not _usually_ much good excuse for not having at least SOME reasonable money to put towards it.

Pat


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## lupinfarm (Jul 14, 2010)

I agree with you at least a little bit. It is always the best idea to keep supplies on hand such as fence rails, nails, screws, posts, ect. (this something we do, we also have enough extras of insulators, tposts, fence posts and such to create a whole 'nother farm) but in some instances where say emerge isolated housing is needed it is just not possible for folks who have little land and few places to put such animals. while we have a barn, it is hecka far from our goat shed and two things contributed to my decision not to seperate Cissy this week and they are, a) barn is very far away and she'd be lonely/scared/panicked ect. b) the situation was not at a point where she needed isolating, ie. lump on her neck was no losing hair nor was it growing or getting smaller. therefore, not a priority to get her into a different space before the vet could come the-next-day. 


I would love to know where on your (self-admittedly swampy) land you find room to keep an isolation pen when instances like CL arise (somewhere easily cleanable, away from your other animals and not on soil so CL can't get into your soil...). Just curious.


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## michickenwrangler (Jul 14, 2010)

Done!


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## patandchickens (Jul 14, 2010)

lupinfarm said:
			
		

> I would love to know where on your (self-admittedly swampy) land you find room to keep an isolation pen when instances like CL arise (somewhere easily cleanable, away from your other animals and not on soil so CL can't get into your soil...). Just curious.


I was _not_ talking about you specifically, I was addressing the (very common) issue in general.

But, ok, I'll play. Suppose that one of my sheepies sprouted actual or possible CL and I wanted to isolate her while I thunk about what to do or while the abscess healed. I would probably put her in one of the kennel runs (which are concrete) or juggle the sheeps over to the barn (adding extra electric wire as needed for sheep retention and coyote exclusion), where I could put her in the barn looking out and have the others visibly near. Actually I suppose she could go into a knocked-up pen in the garage, if necessary (from which the current sheep paddocks are visible) although that would require leaving the back "people door" of the garage open.

But then I am lucky in having several concrete-floored outbuildings to use. If I did not, I would knock together a pen (probably from kennel panels, put electric on step-ins at least a few feet away so as to reduce coyote attraction factor) on some area that was visible to my other sheeps but not on ground they're ever likely to inhabit, preferably somewhere I could till and lime but an out of the way part of lawn would work fine too. Actually I have some spare large pavers I could use as a disinfectable isolation pen floor, but I do not know as I'd bother (see next paragraphs).

It is not like the CL bacterium spreads everywhere like wildfire once it touches soil, it is just that the more it gets into your soil the more there *is* there (since you can't utterly sterilize soil very easily) and there is some degree of lateral transport (tracking around, soil organisms, etc). 

Anyhow isolation is not just a black/white thing -- there are *degrees* of it, and particularly if one's other animals are likely to already be exposed or carriers and/or if there is no great likelihood of obtaining definitely-CL-free stock, simply using measures that prevent direct contact with contaminated animals or recently-contaminated areas seems perfectly reasonable and constructive to me.

Really. It is just so common to see (these are common but MADE UP examples, I have tried to avoid citing ones found in recent threads but if I've missed an active thread I apologize, any resemblance would be purely coincidental) posts where a horse gets a bowed tendon and they owner is advised to keep him stalled "but I just can't, I don't have a stall or small pen nor any way of making one" and the tendon is permanently ruined. Or a chicken has to be separated because it is getting pecked on "but I don't have any way to do that!" so, what, cannibalism is inevitable? "I can't possibly put my horse inside during this nasty winter storm even though he is soaked and shivering and has no shelter, because I *have* no stall or shelter for him, and his only blanket is soaked thru too, so it's not _my_ fault if he gets miserable or sick, I've done what I can". Or "I can't afford to have the vet out to see why he's walking so funny, I just bought some <new animals> and am broke right now". 

That's all I'm saying. If one is going to own animals, one oughta have a plan B and C ready-to-hand for these kinds of events, because you KNOW they are likely to happen at some point.

Pat


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## patandchickens (Jul 14, 2010)

michickenwrangler said:
			
		

> Done!


ok so I should have phrased it as "if you haven't already", so sue me 

Pat


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## michickenwrangler (Jul 14, 2010)

patandchickens said:
			
		

> michickenwrangler said:
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You have animals. You don't have any money


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## patandchickens (Jul 14, 2010)

michickenwrangler said:
			
		

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LOL

Well you could sue me for the _animals_. "The court hereby awards the plaintiff three retired horses, four housecats one of them very high-maintenance, five sheep, and an undetermined number of chickens. The defendant will also be assessed court fees in the amount of however many turkeys they can find."

And you'd at least be *tempted* to, admit it...



Pat


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## aggieterpkatie (Jul 15, 2010)

I definitely agree, Pat!  Good points!


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## michickenwrangler (Jul 15, 2010)

patandchickens said:
			
		

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With the exception of the cats, I might take you up on it. Turkeys will end up in the freezer though.


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## Beekissed (Jul 15, 2010)

I agree....now, the money thing is sometimes hard to keep back when one is living on a tight budget and emergencies arise....but its a great idea to keep back emergency money for all things, not just animals.

The proper penning or a place in which to do so is also sometimes hard, according to your living circumstances...but always a great idea to provide BEFORE one gets animals/chickens.  

I'm pretty methodical about my decisions to get new animals and it sometimes takes me a couple of years research/planning/building before I am ready to commit......and sometimes an opportunity arises and you just jump right in and build later.

When I got my milk cow it was more of a pity purchase and I had no facilities adequate for cow ownership, though I managed with what I had.  Once I had her health on a better path, I arranged for her to go to a more appropriate place to live...and made a profit on the whole deal, which wasn't bad.  

If I had had more land and a good and bigger barn, she would still be with me today.  

I agree, Pat...for all practical purposes, it is more wise to be prepared.


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## MsPony (Jul 20, 2010)

I mainly deal with smaller animals, no room for anything big besides the horses!

But this is why I keep every cage (bird and rodent) and have a slew of x-pens at the ready. I feel like a hoarder, but last week when I had a freshly neutered dog needing to be isolated, with two bunnies that needed their own BOTH separations, chicks coming in and a rat that needed separation....I was thankful for being a cage/x pen hoarder


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## patandchickens (Jul 20, 2010)

MsPony said:
			
		

> But this is why I keep every cage (bird and rodent) and have a slew of x-pens at the ready. I feel like a hoarder, but last week when I had a freshly neutered dog needing to be isolated, with two bunnies that needed their own BOTH separations, chicks coming in and a rat that needed separation....I was thankful for being a cage/x pen hoarder


I tell you, I just KICK myself for all the times over the years when I could have gotten a large or XL collapsible metal dog crate for free or $5ish. There was one here when we bought this property eight years ago, and it has turned out to be SUPER useful (for chicks, for chicken isolation, for for injured feral cat, for sheep transport, even for use as a gate in its folded-flat configuration, for supporting piece of plexiglas on which to process meat chickens, etc etc). I have gotten a second, much less rusty, one now too, but where oh where have all the offers of free ones gone, now that I could *use* them? 

Pat


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## lupinfarm (Jul 20, 2010)

Pat, we have TONS of those collapsible metal dog crates. We have them coming out the ears. Mum has been collecting them over the years with our dogs. We even have one big enough to fit 2 goats LOL.


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## glenolam (Jul 20, 2010)

lupinfarm said:
			
		

> We even have one big enough to fit 2 goats LOL.


THERE's your emergency pen!


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## lupinfarm (Jul 20, 2010)

Funny enough, its a massive giant breed crate (or double crate, it has a divider and 2 doors) that we bought for our big black lab that hated crates so she'd get crated with our other lab. Hence the need for a huge enormous crate haha.


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