# Good Goat gone bad ???? I'm new to this.



## Theykeepmebusy (Nov 1, 2010)

O.k hello everyone, I'm new to goats and was given 2 registered pure bred boer goats, almost a year old, and were spoiled rotten by my friends granddaughter.....but after having them for a week, I don't know if maybe the male was just getting to much to handle. I was told he was the friendliest, most spoiled goat and he's been far from that since day 1.  He's most aggressive  when I enter the pen. Friends can be in there with him and I can enter on the opposite side and he goes straight into "attack" mode, he will chase me, licks his lips over and over, tries to pee on who ever, if the female comes to me (she's a sweetie) he will go after her, butt her out of the way.  
 I had read about pvc pipe on his horns, I will try anything to calm him down, I really don't like having to tie him to a post while I do my outside chores  and I don't like having to be rescued or hurt by my pet.  
 Anyone have some advice for me???  Does this pvc pipe work and how exactly do I do this?  Thanks in advance.


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## mistee (Nov 1, 2010)

maybe he wuvs you,,,, and I mean wuvs!!!!! is he a buck,, sounds like it!

i have a buck when in rut loves EVERYONE... I keep a spray bottle on hand when i have to deal w/ him.... He thinks if it is in his pen then it is fair game but only when in rut!!

try the spray bottle see if that works


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## Theykeepmebusy (Nov 1, 2010)

A buck he is, I will try the spray bottle. He isn't like this with everyone else unless I step in the pen. I really want him to be as friendly as the previous owner said he was. Thank you.


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## mistee (Nov 1, 2010)

he just might really like you,,,lol.... do u want him to stay a buck? if not i would get him casturated,, he is going to be a big boy!!!

my is just a little nigerian buck so big difference.. my other 2 bucks dont act like that but they are a bit skittish,, diddy was raised by me so he isnt,,

i was in there the other night trying to catch some run away chickens to put them bak in the coop.. hubby thought it was funny that i was afraid to turn my back on him,,,, shoot,,,, he was trying his best to make me one of his ladies,,,lol!!!!

try the water bottle,, hose,,, anything,,lol...


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## Theykeepmebusy (Nov 1, 2010)

I think I want him to stay a buck....??? I would like kids, I am going to have to read more on goats, this started because I wanted a couple to eat the weeds, then I learned about the milk, was going for Nubians but my parents found these 2 and well, here I am.  And I made the mistake of turning my back, day 2, that was an unexpected back snap,crackle pop, along with a push/slide in my flip flops (morning chicken chores) to my back door. I didn't know what else to do but grab him by the horns and let him push away, soon as he had me close to my door, I ran    This is going to be an experience.


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## mistee (Nov 2, 2010)

hmmmm,, dont know.. doesnt sound like a guy i would want around.....

hopefully someone else will chime in here..

#1 you dont want to get hurt!!!!!!!

i have kids and I cant keep a buck i dont trust... this is my bucks first year acting like this and i told hubby if he keeps it up he is out the door,,,lol.. he has also gotten to be a real bully w/ my other bucks!


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## lilhill (Nov 2, 2010)

Bucks *do not *make good pets.  Especially bucks in rutt.  He may be a sweetie pie when does are not around, but sounds like you should rethink the idea of keeping this big boy around.  Being new to goats and then getting an aggressive boer that can weigh much more than you when fully grown, maybe isn't a good idea.  I will not keep a buck around that I can't handle, even when he's in rutt.


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## mistee (Nov 2, 2010)

All my horny buck does is flap his tongue and grunt at me,, he has never butted me or anything yet,,lol.

I have had a woman contact me a few x's in the last few years cause she has a very aggressive pygmy buck and she needed advise.. They dont want to cut him and her husband wont let her sell him.. He has horns and is very,, very,, aggressive.. He has hurt her pretty bad a few x's now... I dont know,, maybe hubby is hoping he hurts her,,,lol... She is terrified of him!

Your boar is going to get to be big and strong.. Bucks dont make nice pets the kind you want to hug and kiss on,,lol.. They stink and pee on themselves and even drink it.. If it wasnt for breeding I wouldn't have any.. There is only one other Nigerian breeder around me and she wants $150 a doe to breed to her bucks


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## Roll farms (Nov 2, 2010)

He's acting that way for 2 reasons....he's in rut and you're 'new' to him, so he's trying to show dominance...sounds like it's working.

Castrate him or get rid of him....Oh, you can carry a hot shot or spray bottle around and be cautious around him....but that's such a bother.

Dangerous bucks are NOT pets.

Our boys live seperate from the girls (when not breeding) and even though I 'trust' them, I never go around them or into their pen alone.


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## patandchickens (Nov 2, 2010)

Remember you can usually breed your goats *without* owning a buck -- just take them whilst in heat to someone who will let you use their buck for a few minutes. 

"Friendliest most spoiled" is not necessarily a good thing in an intact male headbutting-type livestock animal. As you are discovering. He may, more or less kinda sorta, respect his previous owners and know where the lines are drawn; but it sounds like he has decided to write his own ticket here with you, and that can be dangerous.

Pat


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## mistee (Nov 2, 2010)

also,,, if he ends up hurting someone you will be responsible!!

crazy as it sounds,,, I have a friend who had a pit bull.. A guy broke into his house one time,, the dog bit him bad enough that he needed stitches.. the guy took him to court and won.. i dont get it!!!!!!

My kids get upset cause I wont let them in the buck pen but I dont want to take a chance..... I saw a man one time at an auction get gored pretty bad by a big buck,, the guy deserved it in my opinion w/ the way he was prodding adn whipping the goat..


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## Theykeepmebusy (Nov 2, 2010)

I have been reading on websites about his behavior and I guess next I would like to know  how old is too old to get him "fixed" and will it change him. I can't get rid of him, I would never hear the end of it . 
 I went out this morning and over his fence I visit him, I connected a leash to him and he did great walking up and down the perimeter, I went in the chickens side, he is now separated from them ,and I walked him some more,  he liked the walk ? Made none of those actions towards me, so I take the leash off, we are separated by electric fencing, and as soon as he hears the click, he starts his "bad" behavior. 
 I understand he is going to be way to much for me to handle and this is his nature and I can't change it.  I kind of wonder if they were given to me because he was getting hard to handle, from what I understand, they were both kept together in a dog kennel and a dog house and that they had started to tear it up. I thought maybe, before finding this site and reading on others, that it was because now he had room to roam , I kind of hoped it was the reason.  So now I'm on to next, is there an age to old to get him fixed, who/where can I take him to do this, or I need someone to come out here to do the job, lol. Is it painful, will I have to do some doctoring afterwards ?  
 What have I gotten myself into?????


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## patandchickens (Nov 2, 2010)

Bear in mind that even if you were to castrate him to keep the problem from getting worse, it is not likely to get *better* without some sincere long-term retraining (and even then, no guarantees). 

Pat, who learned last weekend that a ram can still butt you real hard if you are standing back by his hip, just whip round and wham you with the side of his horns. And this really *is* a very well-behaved, respectful, userfriendly ram.


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## Theykeepmebusy (Nov 2, 2010)

Are you serious??!!!! What is the reason we have our dogs in our homes and on our property????? I have 2 pit bulls, they've never hurt anyone, they roam outside, but people won't just open my gates and walk in with them.
 My weenie dog is the biter. I can't believe people can sue and they are the ones who broke in!!!!!!


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## Theykeepmebusy (Nov 2, 2010)

And I guess if I keep him in his own pen, he won't be happy. I can make him his own area, with plenty of room to roam and keep kids and friends out. Right now he won't cross over the electric wires keeping him separate from the chickens, the doe she will prance right over them, he, I don't know if this is normal, gets stuck on a tree branch, won't jump over it, I had to remove the branch because he won't get off of it, a friend and I would have to go out there and pick his back end up to get him un-stuck, he doesn't know how to jump? But I do have the resources to make him his own area, will he be happy ?


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## jodief100 (Nov 2, 2010)

Shannoniganshens said:
			
		

> Are you serious??!!!! What is the reason we have our dogs in our homes and on our property????? I have 2 pit bulls, they've never hurt anyone, they roam outside, but people won't just open my gates and walk in with them.
> My weenie dog is the biter. I can't believe people can sue and they are the ones who broke in!!!!!!


The laws on this vary from state to state.  If your state has what it commonly called "The Castle Doctirine" you will be fine.  It specifically states that you have the right to defend your home, with lethal force (gun or guard dog) if necessary.  States without it usually require you to "attempt to flee" before using force.  

I know OH, KY and FL have the Castle Doctrine.  I think AZ and TX do and CA does not.  

FYI: Anyone can sue for anything; the burden of proof in civil cases is much different than criminal cases.  You just have to get a jury to agree the other person owns you.

As far as the buck, you can always get him wethered, age just alters the methods available to you.  He will do better with company.  At least he can be with his doe friend if he is wethered.  Since he walked nice with you I think there is a good chance you can get him under control if you wether him.  Right now he is being controlled by his hormones.  Time and training is what it will take.  No guarantees.  

I never go in the buck pen during rut without a big stick.  I have one who will be sweet as pie until you turn your back and then he rams you from behind.


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## Theykeepmebusy (Nov 2, 2010)

Thank you everyone, I am now going to search how to get him wethered, I am not seeing me doing this myself, I appreciate everyone's advice and I will give warning  I'll be back.  As my son would say, I'm a noob.


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## Calliopia (Nov 2, 2010)

My buck is a sweet angel until those hormones start going.  Then I don't go in unless I HAVE to and I have a flat shovel to bap him on the head with and my husband is standing outside the fence.


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## mistee (Nov 2, 2010)

I would just call a vet and have them come out and do it.. in the long run he will have a better life for it and since he is still young you should be able to get him to change his way,,lol..

Maybe w/ the hormones out of the way he will once again be a sweetie!!


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## LollingontheFarm (Dec 28, 2010)

I've had a 3 yr old pymgy buck since birth.  Max was always friendly never aggressive until recently.  Only ME!  Yesterday he had my penned to the fence and was into butting me over and over until my son heard me screaming for help.  The only thing I could do was cling to the fence post so he couldn't bring me down!
The does are all bred (out of rut).  Any ideas why he turned on me in particular?


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## jodief100 (Dec 28, 2010)

Because he is a buck.  

They are controlled by their hormones and can be unpredictable. Some instinct told him to do it, who knows what his goat programming is.  He may have seen you as a threat or a possible mate.  Either way it is just hormones and instinct.


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## LollingontheFarm (Dec 28, 2010)

hmmmmm  Well I've moved him to the calf pen where he will share the area with our new calf who loves the goats.  Max will not be happy with this but my legs hurt where he repeatedly rammed me yesterday.
Thank God he is polled and I didn't have to deal with horns too!!
I sold his father off asap b/c he was extremely aggessive from the get go.  Beautiful babies nice to the does but mean to the rest of us.
The man who bought him had a large herd of free ranging does.  Drove a pickup truck 2 hrs to get him, loaded him in the front seat with him, and drove away feeding him cookies.  Mind you this goat had a HUGE rack on him and was MEAN to the BONE!
I was afraid to watch the news that night as I was sure they would have a horrible traffic incident with a goat mentioned.  lol
Thanks


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## Emmetts Dairy (Dec 28, 2010)

jodief100 said:
			
		

> Because he is a buck.
> 
> They are controlled by their hormones and can be unpredictable. Some instinct told him to do it, who knows what his goat programming is.  He may have seen you as a threat or a possible mate.  Either way it is just hormones and instinct.


AGREE 100%.  We often times put human feelings into our goats.  Never forget they are goats...and you must think like a goat when tending to them.  Bucks in Rutt especially!!! 

You must completely understand his instinctual behavoir and what he's trying to achieve during his rutt season.  It is up to us as owners to understand their behavoir.  Humans are the last thing on this mind right now!!!    I cant carry enough raisins to distract him!!!  

Bucks are not easy as pets.  They serve a purpose and that is to breed your does.  They can be wonderful animals and I adore mine.  But when he's in rutt...I tend to him with kid gloves!  We spent alot of time together and he repects me...I would NOT hit him or hurt him...IMO..that just causes agressive behavoir to escalate.  He will then think of you more of a threat and will defend himself and his herd.   And he can seriously hurt you if he really wanted to.  

If you wanna keep him...get him working and keep a wether with him in another pen as company.  And most of the year he will be a joy.  But if your gonna let him be a buck..respect him for what he is and wait it out.  

But I did'nt like getting peed on either my first time!!!  I dont ever think Id wanna go out with a guy like that!! Not too charming !!! But the does love it!!!!     

But my best advice is..is to understand him for who is in the goat herd and what he's trying to do.  He has a purpose and its very difficult for us as humans to change or speculate on what these hormonal and instinctive behavoir mean all the time.  

So love him for who he is and give him boundries...or get em wethered!! The choice is yours.  It all comes down to what you want out of him and what you can tolerate. 

Good luck!!!


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## Emmetts Dairy (Dec 28, 2010)

Headbutting is never an aceptable play behavoir with humans. IMO. Never Never encourage it when they are babies.  Although its adorable..it is never a good thing.

When my buck starting butting me when young.  I would walk away and not encourage it.  Once as I walked away he ran up behind me and butted me.  So then I climbed over his back sat on him lightly and pulled his front legs down and kept him down for a few mins.  None of my goats ever butt me...its marvelous!!!  I wont have it!!! Im the goat boss and they all know it!!!

This is submission for him.  Did'nt hurt him..just his pride!! LOL But I just showed him I was the boss.  And thats whats important.  You cannot let them run amuck you must show them boundries.  Becuase they are goats!! And they will push and push and push and see how long we go until we snapp!!!!    Just like a 3 year old!!!  

But good luck...I think if you understand him and work with him..he will be fine...but its up to you...


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## mully (Dec 28, 2010)

Bucks will be Bucks


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## txhomegrown (Dec 28, 2010)

You can't show any fear. They sense it and use it too! Like the old guy with the "bad" buck in the front seat, the goat could feel that the old guy wasn't going to take any crap and was happy eating cookies and going for a ride. 
And climbing on top and showing who is boss, I have used it with mean dogs and it works. You have to be careful though, because every now and then you will find one that is a little badder than you. OUCH!

WARNING!!!

Do not try this method with wolves, wildcats or professional wrestlers.


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## Emmetts Dairy (Dec 28, 2010)

txhomegrown said:
			
		

> WARNING!!!
> 
> Do not try this method with wolves, wildcats or professional wrestlers.


  Love it!!!  Heed the warning!!!  

Its not always easy being the goat boss!!!  

Just remember with bucks!!  "No pain, No gain"


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## KellyHM (Dec 28, 2010)

Reading all your storeis really makes me appreciate my bucks!    The only reason I try to avoid them during rut is b/c they're still big babies and want to love on me and get pet...then I have to go take a shower to get the smell off.


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## elevan (Dec 28, 2010)

Makes me really appreciate my buck, Speedy!

Worst I get from him during rut is occasionally being peed on and being "spoken" too with his wup wup wuuuuppp...  

When he starts that with me, I just look and him and say "Sorry I'm not one of your girls" and leave the pen  

But I agree either wait out rut or castrate him.


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## rebelINny (Dec 28, 2010)

Sounds like my buck. His is VERY tall but he is such a momma's boy!!! I didn't even raise him. He is about a year and a half old but he doesn't act aggressive at all even when in rutt! At least not yet. Hopefully he will stay mild-mannered.


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## theawesomefowl (Dec 28, 2010)

You really need to get rid of him!!!!! Bucks can kill people!!!! I wouldnt trust him, even if you like him. 
The only male animal I'd cOnsider safe is my Serama rooster. He is in my avatar.


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## LollingontheFarm (Dec 29, 2010)

KellyM  thats how Max was until just recently!  Loving, stinking me up but respecting me!  We never rub the goats heads or act aggressive to them.  When I got rid of "Wilbur" the mean killer goat and retained Max I thought I'd become the ultimate goat herder "Smart/respected/experienced"  but Max has definately put me in my place.
I'm wondering if having 2 bucks during rut this season and then selling the other has made the difference?  (scratching my head here)  He learned to be aggressive in breeding and pushing this guy aside now the other buck is gone but his "aggressive" breeding style is here to stay.
Max is in the calf pen happily eating with Hamburger and sleeping in the addition stall with him.  
I really want to try the "sit on his back with legs pushed down" idea but I've gotten so arthritic lately I don't think I could pull it off so Max will stay in the calf pen for now.  
I couldn't help feeling a bit personal about Max's behavior toward me but he is a goat and I'm not.


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## ksalvagno (Dec 29, 2010)

Lolling - was he by himself? Maybe he just needed someone with him so he could play and get  his aggression out. I have 4 Nigerian males and when I come into the pen, all they want is some love from me. But they bang the heck out of each other.


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## cutechick2010 (Jan 16, 2011)

Lollingonthefarm- is the buck you have now the son of the aggressive one you sold? They do pass that bad attitude on from father to son. My suggestion would be to get a buck from different lines, JMO. 

To the OP: I may have missed this if you said it, but how old is your buck? Is he horned? In my humble opinion, I would not own this buck. Rut or no rut, no way would I keep an animal that would attack me repeatedly. If you can't get rid of him, it probably would be a good idea to at least get him castrated. 
  Oh, and just a side note-if you breed your doe ( I think you said they are Boers?) to a Nubian buck, you can get some really good milkers from that combo.


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## Theykeepmebusy (Jan 17, 2011)

Wow!!! I didn't even realize this post was still going on, my apologies to everyone!!! I still have Jackson, he has calmed down, now have more does, I've gone from my 2  to now 11, 5 Boers, 2 Boer/Pygmy crosses, delivered my first baby and just today got 2 Pygmy bucks, one I will not be keeping, he is so mean and aggressive, I would rather handle Jackson (buck that started this thread) than this little guy. and this week I will have 3 Nubian doe kids!!!  I never turn my back on Jackson even though he is a pretty sweet guy, we built him a pen, gave him a tarp and a crate and that is the only time  you ever see him be "aggressive" is if you try to touch his tarp or crate, he will turn so fast and run to them, then rub up on them as if you hurt them. I don't know, he just loves them now.  When he does escape, 2 times now, our own mistakes for thinking he just wasn't that smart, my girls will let me know, they scream and yell for me, the crazy is out and I never handle him alone.  
 I have read and learned and continue to educate myself on these great animals, my beasties   , I do love them and am happy that I was lucky enough to have Lilly and Jackson, my first 2 goats. 
  Now I am off to search about this very mean pygmy, if anyone has some input , they are father and son, where I got them they had them penned together and I guess just let them beat the heck out of each other, more or less let father beat the heck out of son, son is who I plan on keeping, he's a blue eyed sweetie, but for whatever reason , the breeder would NOT let me take one, they need each other......it's both or none..........now I'm seeing it as cruel to have them together, because the father constantly beats up his son!!!!! From what I have read, lots of people have their bucks together , but what if one is just to sweet, until I can find a new home for the dad, should I keep them together? I'm talking it's constant, son will be laying down, snoozing away and dad will just knock him one in the gut.  Am I wrong or right?  I understand it's their behavior , natural , but I don't want blue eyed sweetie to get hurt. 

p.s.- I have been attacked by a broody hen who tore me up and 2 roosters, greatest chickens, beautiful, but I guess I crossed their boundaries , the roosters refused to let me enter without attacking so they ended up in the freezer, hen well  I'd go ape if someone came near my babies.     Oh and Jackson learned to respect the hot wire, low voltage, if and when he does get out, all I have to do is hold up a wire (he stayed behind one for a couple months) and he will kneel down like I'm the queen.   I loves him.


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## theawesomefowl (Jan 17, 2011)

Good for you! I'm so glad the story had a happy ending!


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