# Mara is obsessed with her sister, not the herd.



## BlueMoonFarms (Apr 17, 2013)

Well, we separated Mara and Trinity three days ago, and so far Trinity could care less, but Mara is having a nervious melt down.
Its not the territory, as she has been fine exploring the big pen away from the one she used to stay in. However, since I have separated her and put her in with the sheep, she has been howling screaming and wailing. Shes a lot better today, but I have noticed she only really acts up when Trinity goes out of sight. 
The goats could be there, but the moment her sister vanishes from view it sounds like someone is beating her relentlessly...

Is there anyway I can break her of her obsession with her sister and redirect it to the sheep? Trinity is fine, its just Mara whos having the freak out over being separated.
I mean Maras doing great with the sheep, even the baby and ducklings when I let her in with them. Shes currently in with Mist and Kora, my two Jacobs, and the ducklings when they slip through the fence to go say hello. Trinity wants to eat the ducks, and shes overly interested in the lamb, where as Mara does not seem to care and has been great with them. I want to be able to keep Mara with the sheep, and Trinity with the goats since Mara chases the goats, but Mara is SOOOO obsessed with trinity that I dont know if it will work?
Is there anyway I can redirect her obsession? Or will it come in time as long as I keep them separated?
Any and all advice will be very much welcomed. they are both 4 1/2 months old, so they are still young thankfully.
This is Mara, my problem child...





And This is her sister Trinity who has been acting perfect. *Southern!! Shes loosing her badger marking!! Nooo!!!*


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## babsbag (Apr 17, 2013)

Hopefully Southern will be along soon to answer you but I feel your pain. I have border collie sisters and try as I might they are inseperable. When they were babies I took them to 16 weeks of puppy training on seperate nights to try and develop their independence; it worked to some degree. But for the last 5 years they have been constant buddies. I had people tell me not to keep siblings, I should have listened. I also had a trainer tell me that she could teach my dogs a perfect recall, but that it would be a package deal, I would never be able to recall only one of them. I think that sibling thing is stronger in dogs than it is in people.
I love my girls, but will never do it again.

I hope Southern or some other trainer has some encouraging words for you. And yes, I have one needy one and one that acts as if she could care less.


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## BlueMoonFarms (Apr 17, 2013)

babsbag said:
			
		

> Hopefully Southern will be along soon to answer you but I feel your pain. I have border collie sisters and try as I might they are inseperable. When they were babies I took them to 16 weeks of puppy training on seperate nights to try and develop their independence; it worked to some degree. But for the last 5 years they have been constant buddies. I had people tell me not to keep siblings, I should have listened. I also had a trainer tell me that she could teach my dogs a perfect recall, but that it would be a package deal, I would never be able to recall only one of them. I think that sibling thing is stronger in dogs than it is in people.
> I love my girls, but will never do it again.
> 
> I hope Southern or some other trainer has some encouraging words for you. And yes, I have one needy one and one that acts as if she could care less.


Mara appears to be getting better everyday, so im not in a complete rush. I just dont like how obsessed she is with Trinity, I know it wont hurt anyone but I would really they be split up and protecting the herds.
Thats my problem to! Trinity does not care, but Mara is crazy...Of course...
Ugh, hopefully she will get better. I cant get a third LGD X_X


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## babsbag (Apr 17, 2013)

BlueMoonFarms said:
			
		

> I cant get a third LGD X_X


Sure you can.   When I get the rest of my land fenced and a new barn built I might need another one too. Just don't tell DH yet. He already thinks I am getting rid of all my boers when I get the dairy licensed, HA HA


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## BlueMoonFarms (Apr 17, 2013)

babsbag said:
			
		

> BlueMoonFarms said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


If the bank that owns the land next door, ever gives us the paperwork we might think about a thrid, but as of right now we really cant T_T


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## Southern by choice (Apr 17, 2013)

Oh that Mara!    I agree siblings play a big part in most cases and I never recommend getting siblings...and yes you will hear how many people have siblings and they are all fine.... I am talking in a broad sense... dealing with thousands of dogs trust me- it plays a part. *BUT*, I do think there is a greater factor here.

Based on conversations/correspondence I *really*  think her "traits" were more "pet" or "better paired".

*Pet-* this doesn't mean Mara cannot be a good guardian...she has instinct given, it just means that she probably had more trait/qualities that would be better suited as a pet. Playful and a bit needy of attention one way or another

*Better Paired*- these are pups at 8 wks you can see really "need" a buddy... there are ways to assess a litter to determine that, I know your breeder doesn't really believe that... by 12 weeks it would have been clear. These "need a buddy" dogs really are great dogs and *CAN* make great guardians but they do not cope well alone. They are *not* nutjobs or lesser dogs in any way, they are usually very good when paired with the right dog.

I really think she would fair better partnered however she is 4 1/2 months old and "high- wired" LOL 
My suggestion is-
1.keep dogs separated. if that is your end goal it will take work though 
2. ALLOW time together for playtime.  - _this is important_ she will learn what is hers, is hers- and the playtime will keep both girls civil towards each other long term. Really try to establish their own identities... when you spend time with them its ok for them to be together but you must have the time with each dog alone. Mara is kinda living off Trinity.

The downside to a pup that is in one of those two categories is that you ultimately want something different and you are moving against the dogs "make-up". It causes great frustration to the human owner as well as the dog. Moving with the dogs given make-up usually ends up in a win win situation. Mara is going to take work...if it was me she'd be in my house on the couch getting all smooched and loved on...and we'd be yelling at her to get off the counters!

oh and trinity losing her badger markings...     I know...so purty! She is a beautiful girl!  

So send Mara down here...I WANT a HOUSE PYR! 

BTW- I am recalling what the breeder said to you and I am LMAO- You remember don't ya


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## BlueMoonFarms (Apr 17, 2013)

Southern by choice said:
			
		

> Oh that Mara!    I agree siblings play a big part in most cases and I never recommend getting siblings...and yes you will hear how many people have siblings and they are all fine.... I am talking in a broad sense... dealing with thousands of dogs trust me- it plays a part. *BUT*, I do think there is a greater factor here.
> 
> Based on conversations/correspondence I *really*  think her "traits" were more "pet" or "better paired".
> 
> ...


Ugh i just had a good long reply and the computor died...GAH!! So ill highlight stuff instead of going into depth.
Ok, Mara is a good girl, I don't mind working with her.
They hate the house, omg the drool...Six times, and still they hate it, so we stick to outside playtime.
Every morning im down with the goats for one to two hours, so attention wont be a problem.  
I got taken for a ride T_T I know...But at least Mara is good with the sheep and Trinity is good with the goats.
Mara was never needy when I went to see her as a puppy. Every-time she was off by herself, so i think shes just a pet.
How long should I wait until I let them play together again? And how long do you think it might take for her to settle?
The breeder I think was just trying to get rid of another puppy T_T and may have knows she was a pet.


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## Southern by choice (Apr 17, 2013)

You can still do a daily playtime. 20-30 minutes til they wear each other out.
She will need to acclimate... deal with the yipping and barking as you would normally in any dog...keep correcting. She may very well find an animal that she bonds extremely tight with and that will be it!  She is a pup and is really still developing. 

Our Pyrs! we sure do love em huh! even the naughty ones, they are so endearing... I mean just look at that face... I know- ya just can't be mad at em for more than...well  til you look at those eyes!


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## BlueMoonFarms (Apr 18, 2013)

Southern by choice said:
			
		

> You can still do a daily playtime. 20-30 minutes til they wear each other out.
> She will need to acclimate... deal with the yipping and barking as you would normally in any dog...keep correcting. She may very well find an animal that she bonds extremely tight with and that will be it!  She is a pup and is really still developing.
> 
> Our Pyrs! we sure do love em huh! even the naughty ones, they are so endearing... I mean just look at that face... I know- ya just can't be mad at em for more than...well  til you look at those eyes!


Oh wonderful  she will enjoy that ^^ 
I already went to our neighbor and warned/apologized for her howling.
So far today though shes been really calm and quiet. She really seems to like the ducks, she curls up as close as she can to them and waits for them to waddle towords her and lay next her. Who knows! She might be a poultry and duck dog 
Oh she is so naughty...Every time I turn around there is another problem or quirk, but oh do I love her. 
I think she will settle in very well, and hopefully will bond with one of the other animals


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