# ReluctantFarmer Journal



## ReluctantFarmer (Nov 12, 2018)

Took my third load of cattle to the market on Saturday, five 1-1/2yo heifers.  Also put one of our oldest cows down and had her hauled off.  Vet came out on Friday and we gave wormer, lepto and blackleg shots to the five cows we are keeping.  My little bull also lost his manhood.  Bought some hay, so we should have enough to get through winter.  Starting to feel like I’ve got a handle on some stuff but still don’t know what I don’t know... to be continued


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## Rammy (Nov 12, 2018)

You have come to the right place. Lots of very knowledgeable, experienced members on here.  Glad to see you here! Welcome!


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## greybeard (Nov 12, 2018)

ReluctantFarmer said:


> Took my third load of cattle to the market on Saturday, five 1-1/2yo heifers.  Also put one of our oldest cows down and had her hauled off.  Vet came out on Friday and we gave wormer, lepto and blackleg shots to the five cows we are keeping.  My little bull also lost his manhood.  Bought some hay, so we should have enough to get through winter.  Starting to feel like I’ve got a handle on some stuff but still don’t know what I don’t know... to be continued


I always hate to hear of one having to be put down, as it is usually a waste of beef and breeding animal, not to mention the financial loss.
Was your oldest cow not worth or able to be hauled to market as well?



> but still don’t know what I don’t know...


That, more often than not, is the hardest part, but understanding that there are things we don't know is a giant step forward. Experience is the hardest and cruelest teacher but learning doesn't always have to be thru experience nowadays. 
Worse than not knowing, is thinking we know but do not.
You can give the lepto/blackleg shots and do the worming yourself and save on the vet bill, but it is always good to develop a relationship with your vet too...they are usually  more apt to come out in an emergency if it is an established client. 
What breed cattle do you have?


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## Latestarter (Nov 12, 2018)

Sorry you had to lose the one cow. Hope you did OK with the sales.


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## Senile_Texas_Aggie (Nov 12, 2018)

Glad to have you aboard!  You will find a lot of knowledgeable folks here (except me, of course).  Regarding cattle, Mr. @greybeard, Miss @farmerjan, and Miss @Wehner Homestead (and probably lots more) know a lot about cattle.  And don't be afraid of asking dumb questions -- after all, I am an expert at that!

Senile Texas Aggie


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## ReluctantFarmer (Nov 12, 2018)

greybeard said:


> I always hate to hear of one having to be put down, as it is usually a waste of beef and breeding animal, not to mention the financial loss.
> Was your oldest cow not worth or able to be hauled to market as well?
> 
> 
> ...



I’ve go black angus AFAIK.  My dad said black cattle always brought more at the sale.

The oldest was pretty broken down.  The sale barn has a big sign that non-abalatory animals are not to be unloaded.  She moves so slow that I thought it’d be cruel to make her go through the chutes at the sale barn.  She probably would’ve only brought $80 at the sale.  So got my 22 mag out and it was quick.  I’d rather her not suffer.  Had a feller haul her off to the dog food plant.

I did specifically call the vet out to establish a working relationship and get some lessons.  He was real patient with me and helped me pick which animals to keep.  My Dad used to use the same vet office, but the vet passed away from cancer last year.  I decided to give the new guy a try and was satisfied, even slipped him and his helper a $20 each for all the “free” advice.  Turns out I’m gonna have 3 calves in February, so hopefully he remembers me if I need help then.


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## RollingAcres (Nov 12, 2018)

@ReluctantFarmer this is definitely the right place to be. A lot of helpful and knowledgeable folks here. Sorry to hear that you had to put down your oldest cow. Glad that you started a journal to help you "keep track" of your journey and share your stories with us.



Senile_Texas_Aggie said:


> And don't be afraid of asking dumb questions -- after all, I am an expert at that!


I've asked some of those questions myself.


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## greybeard (Nov 12, 2018)

ReluctantFarmer said:


> She moves so slow that I thought it’d be cruel to make her go through the chutes at the sale barn.


You probably did the right thing, prices are down and there's lots of them running thru the ring already so you wouldn't have gotten much at all for her.  Some of those sale barn boys can be pretty rough on cattle getting them in and out of the ring and the barns I go to won't take downers either.....it's against the law most places.


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## farmerjan (Nov 12, 2018)

Have to agree with @greybeard  on you doing the right thing for the old cow.  I just buried my oldest milk/nurse cow.  She got to acting real slow back in late june and had the vet out because I was afraid she had twisted. (DA).   Turns out she was full of tumors and they were causing some problems along her spine.  We decided to try Dex to shrink them a bit and she responded real well.  Her "calves" were right at 6-7 weeks old ( she had 3 on her) and the worst time to have to put them on a bottle etc.  She did real good and got through the summer, ate good and the calves were getting along well; recently I noticed she was starting to get around slower and told my son it was time.  Cull cows are in the cellar price wise, and I would not put her through it.  I went up one morning and she had died on her own the night before.  The calves have been coming in good for feed so it worked out.  Still is a loss of income, but it is what it is.

Glad you got the vet out, and the whole process went well.  Once you get a little practical experience then you can maybe keep a few replacements or something, but I think you did the very best thing for you and the animals by getting their advice and help.  It is always a good thing to develop the relationship with the vet before you "NEED" them.  

And yes, around here, black cattle bring the best money.  Go north into Canada and herefords and reds do well,  go south into the texas and hot weather areas and cattle with some brahma influence do well.  Unless you are into purebred or registered, it only makes sense to raise what will give you the most return for the money, so your dad probably was well educated on that for your area. 
Good luck with them.


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## Wehner Homestead (Nov 13, 2018)

Hello and ! You’ve joined a wonderful support group for your cattle obsession.  We are known to be supportive jokesters that have your back and are here to help each other with a little enabler (or a lot) mixed in.  You’ll find lots of information in the forums here. We will all try to help as we can. I’ve made lifelong friends on this page! 

I’m in Southern Indiana and we raise Show Cattle, dairy goats, chickens, an occasional pig or two, a slew of barn cats, and 3 Aussies. I’ll try to answer cattle questions as I can.

You did the right thing with your older cow. It was the humane choice that kept her from suffering.


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## RollingAcres (Nov 13, 2018)

Wehner Homestead said:


> We are known to be supportive jokesters that have your back and are here to help each other with a little enabler (or a lot) mixed in.



You got that right!


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## ReluctantFarmer (Feb 1, 2019)

First calf of the year!  A hungry little girl.  Calf and cow both seem to be doing fine.  Went out this morning and saw her in the field.  Came from a good experienced cow.  So glad there were no issues


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## frustratedearthmother (Feb 1, 2019)

Congrats!!


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## farmerjan (Feb 1, 2019)

That's great.....


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## Latestarter (Feb 1, 2019)

How awesome is that?! Congrats!


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## ReluctantFarmer (Feb 17, 2019)

Our second calf of the year, a hungry baby boy!  He’s three days old here.  Came from a very protective mature cow.  Hope the next three are this easy


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## farmerjan (Feb 17, 2019)

Congrats on your second calf.  Great that you have experienced cows... it makes the first few calves alot easier to deal with.  Just a note;  do be careful of a protective momma cow with a new baby.  They are only doing their job and are nervous with anyone that might get too close.  Most will calm down after a week or two, but the first few days can be upsetting.  The reason I say this is they might try to charge you to get you to keep your distance.  The thing is, the calves can get hurt because the cow can "run right over them" while trying to protect them.  I have had cows step on calves when they were being concerned and protective mommas.  Once you get to know your cows, you will see their different personalities evolve.  And most will calm down once the calf gets pretty mobile.  I like a cow to be somewhat protective for the first couple of days.  The heifers we have raised up mostly are very accepting of me but still, will want to take their baby off away from me when very new. They don't get aggressive towards me, but some of the older bought cows I would not turn my back on for a second.  
Hope the next 3 go as well for you.


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## ReluctantFarmer (Feb 17, 2019)

Thanks for the good advice @farmerjan.  I do trust this one good enough, but I couldn’t get much closer cause she’d just take it off farther and farther away from me.  She kept it far away from the herd for the first two days.  

Luckily we’ve got a small enough herd that I’m getting to know them.  I try to make a point to walk in amongst them calmly, just so they get comfortable with me.  Now they have gotten to the point that when they see me coming, they come running 

Today momma and baby were hanging with the rest of the herd, so I’m glad about that.  The two new babys have started hanging out together, I’m sure in a month or three so they will be inseparable


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## farmerjan (Feb 18, 2019)

Yep, that's what ours do.  Usually pretty aloof for the first day or two.  I think it is nature's way of them bonding so the calf will instinctively "know" it's momma.  Then after a couple days they will be right back together.  And the smiles and laughs you will have when the calves start running and playing together....  they have so much energy.  Maybe not as "cute" as lambs or kids, but still, I love to watch calves on a nice sunny day just jump up and then start running around just because they can.  
You will also find that once the calves start sticking more together, that the cows will often go off and graze and there will be one "babysitter" cow that will stick close.  Kinda neat to see 3-5-8 babies all laying out flat sound asleep and one cow not far off keeping her protective eye on them as she munches away or just stands there dozing herself.


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## RollingAcres (Feb 18, 2019)

Congrats on the calves @ReluctantFarmer !


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## ReluctantFarmer (Feb 24, 2019)

Our 3rd calf of 2019.  Another healthy girl from older cow. We have been so blessed this calving season to not have any issues.  Two more to go from our heifers.  Fingers crossed


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## ReluctantFarmer (Feb 24, 2019)

Btw @farmerjan i think we now have a nursery . All the young calves were sleeping around the new mama yesterday while the other mamas came up to eat.  Every parent needs a babysitter occasionally!


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## B&B Happy goats (Feb 24, 2019)

Congratulations to you and your girls


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## Mini Horses (Feb 24, 2019)

What a lovely group you have there!     Calves are so cute -- as are most young animals.   Only thing with most goats is that they are usually tamer so the kids can be picked up & cuddled!   Nothing more fun than hugging the babies.   Cows are not generally so accommodating


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## B&B Happy goats (Feb 24, 2019)

A


Mini Horses said:


> What a lovely group you have there!     Calves are so cute -- as are most young animals.   Only thing with most goats is that they are usually tamer so the kids can be picked up & cuddled!   Nothing more fun than hugging the babies.   Cows are not generally so accommodating



at 66 i can cuddle and walk with a armfull of goat kids....a calf would probably do me in,....but they sure are cute


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## goatgurl (Feb 24, 2019)

congrats on the new babies.  and yup its kind of hard to cuddle a calf, either they or their mama object.  I love driving down the road and seeing the calf nurseries.  one mama stands guard and the rest go about their business.  makes me smile


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## B&B Happy goats (Feb 24, 2019)

goatgurl said:


> congrats on the new babies.  and yup its kind of hard to cuddle a calf, either they or their mama object.  I love driving down the road and seeing the calf nurseries.  one mama stands guard and the rest go about their business.  makes me smile



Funny you just said that, just came in from outside and neighbors cows and calfs are at my fence....so sweet to look out and see all the calfs, cows, pigs, chickens, rabbits, donkeys, and goats around us....this is my paradise


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## goatgurl (Feb 24, 2019)

I hear ya on that.  don't know what i'd do without all my critters.  gives me peace, or at least most of the time, lol


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## ReluctantFarmer (Feb 24, 2019)

Mini Horses said:


> What a lovely group you have there!     Calves are so cute -- as are most young animals.   Only thing with most goats is that they are usually tamer so the kids can be picked up & cuddled!   Nothing more fun than hugging the babies.   Cows are not generally so accommodating



Haha, yeah we usually don’t hug ours.  Except two winters ago when a calf got out and was running down the road, I had to jump out of the truck and tackle it. I laid there in the ditch hugging it tightly until Dad got there. I’m sure it looked funny with my Dad driving, me riding shotgun and the calf between us riding on the bench seat the whole way home!


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## ReluctantFarmer (Mar 1, 2019)

So we had another calf three days ago from one of our two pregnant heifers.  She had no apparent problems and we have a healthy hungry girl (first pic).  I was headed back to the house from the top pasture, and I notice the other heifer off by herself headed towards the woods.  I looked where she was headed, lo and behold we had another calf!  Both heifers had no problems Praise the Lord!!! 

Unless the vet misdiagnosed, we are done with spring calving!  I’m fairly certain we have 4 girls and 1 boy all born within a four week span.


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## frustratedearthmother (Mar 1, 2019)

That's fantastic!   What a good start - and the m/f ratio is pretty darn good too!


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## ReluctantFarmer (Mar 1, 2019)

frustratedearthmother said:


> That's fantastic!   What a good start - and the m/f ratio is pretty darn good too!



Thanks!  I’d rather have all little boys since steers seem to bring more at the sale.  But they are healthy so I’ll take it


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## Wehner Homestead (Mar 5, 2019)

We are having a heifer year thus far also. 4-2


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## ReluctantFarmer (Aug 8, 2019)

Hi everyone, I’m still here :-D. Thought I’d post an update and another thank you to this group for the advice last winter.

We had 7 calves this year, one in September (2), one in October (3) and the rest very close together in February (4,5,6,7,8). Our 2 bred heifers (56, 57) had no problems and we kept the youngest unbred (58) and bred her this year.

The weather cooperated this year and we had a good hay crop: 35 bales of 4x6 round off of 11 acres, mostly fescue.  Now the Johnson grass is coming on strong, so may or may not get a second cutting.  Even if we leave it in the field I’ll use it for forage in the late months (Nov and Dec).

A neighbor loaned me a bull on May 25, and we have had him with the cattle ever since.

I’m trying to decide now which animals to take to the sale barn in October.  I’ve been trying to keep notes on them throughout the year related to overall health, body condition, coat condition and amount of flies they attract.

I’m trying to get a compact beef animal around 600-700 pounds from an 8-9 month old, and 1200-1400 full size.

Any comments good or bad are welcome on the pics below.  I’m still trying to figure this whole thing out.


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## ReluctantFarmer (Aug 8, 2019)

Turns out my picture taking skills favor some animals over others, and I think some are missing, but you get the idea ;-)

Cow pics are below.




This is actually our steer, he will go in the freezer.  He is a wooly bugger so don’t really want his babies anyway. I bet he’ll taste fine though.





I think this one may go to the sale.










She’s my oldest, and has a big rump.  Vet says wasn’t desirable but she is no muss no fuss




Our biggest cow




One of last winters heifers.  I think her body shape is good?





Oldest heifer, bony hips.


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## ReluctantFarmer (Aug 8, 2019)

One more piece of info, since I have 35 bales, was going to keep 8 bred cows and the steer over the winter.  I think with the grass, I shouldn’t run out of hay.  We don’t typically have much snow covering the grass in the winter, 4-6 weeks at the most usually.


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## frustratedearthmother (Aug 8, 2019)

I've got no words of wisdom for you - I barely know one end of a cow from the other, lol.  Maybe @greybeard or @farmerjan will come along and have a comment.


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## farmerjan (Aug 8, 2019)

Glad that you checked back in.  A bunch of questions.  First it is hard to tell with the grass/pasture being high around their legs as to type.  It does look like they are all pretty tame, that's a big plus for you and showing that you took some time to get them to be at ease around people.  
I went back through the thread and looked at the couple of pics of the first calves.  I wasn't overly impressed with the teats on 77 but from later pics the calf either got the large teats milked down, OR they didn't get nursed and dried up.  One strike against her because big teats only get bigger with subsequent calves.  
I am not at all impressed with the steer calf.  Honestly, I would ship him because he will bring more per pound than a heifer calf ordinarily, and choose a heifer that is growing better for your beef.  Any chance he is out of that 77 cow?  Maybe didn't get alot of milk?    Or look seriously at the cow that had the steer..... she may just not be that good a milker.  

I would take a good hard look at the calves as to WHO their momma's are. I would like to see a picture of the 74 cow's udder.  She was standing with her leg completely in front of the udder.  I also don't like that she seems to have a longer hair coat in the heat of the summer.  Could mean she is carrying a worm load when they don't shed off real slick for the summer.

What don't you like of the 75 cow?  Also, just because 54 has a little more "bone" showing, you need to look at her calf.  She may have put more of her fat into milk and the calf might  have better growth.  I don't think she is bony, but she is not as "fat" as some of the others. 

Are you planning to sell all the heifer calves?  I like the rump on 4 in the last picture, and didn't like her in the previous picture so that just goes to show that a different angle will show them in a better or worse pose. 
No closeup pics of 6 or 7.  
# 2 is okay but I like 4 & 5 better.  8 is the youngest?  out of a heifer?  So a little smaller.  Would really like to see them out on ground where you can see their legs to see how they are "setting up" on their legs.  Too straight, too angled... that sort of thing.  Believe me, a NICE calf will catch your eye.... overall balanced.  

One thing you need to think about too, is to cull anyone that isn't bred.  I would get them preg checked before you decide to ship any of the cows.  That may make your decisions easy.

The markets here are not great and don't look to get any better.   Very best steers in the 5-6 wts are bringing 1.60 when sold in weaned groups of 10-35.  Smaller groups, 1-2 to 5 or so are bringing in the 1.40's.  Heifers in the 1.10 to 1.25.  So that is another determining factor. 

It looks like you did good as to not having any problems with the calving, and they are in very nice shape overall.  I also don't see any pinkeye problems and that is a big plus.  We are having some major problems with it here in Va.  

Congrats on your first calf crop.  Any questions, please ask.  If you get a few pics of them out on flat, grazed off ground where we can see their legs better, would love to see them.

Is this bull the sire of these calves or a new one?  He's a pretty nice looking bull .  I would pull him out now and anyone that is not bred is a candidate to sell.  You want your calves to be born as close together just so that they are more uniform in size, which makes it easier to get a few together in a group. The cows are all in very good flesh so have no reason to not be bred back.  Calves bring more in groups of 3's or more,  than does a single most always.


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## ReluctantFarmer (Aug 11, 2019)

@farmerjan thank you for your reply, it is amazing what you saw in those pictures!  Lesson learned, I need to take better pictures 

Your comment about 77 and her big tweets is spot on with what the vet said.

Also, you didn’t hurt my feelings about the steer.  So glad we cut him cause he wouldn’t be good at all as a bull.  I think part of the issue (aside from genetics) is that he gets picked on.  He always walk with his head down, and isn’t the brightest bulb when we are working them.  We need beef for the freezer, but there is another younger steer that I may end up keeping instead.  Like you said about the groups, since he is an oddball, and doesn’t look great, I didn’t think he’d do great at the sale.

Also your comment about 4, she is one I was thinking about keeping.  I’ll have to check to see who her momma is.  But she was born with the group of 5 in Feb, but seems to have outpaced the others on growth.  Also her coat looked like velvet when she was younger, and she just always has looked like the “best” calf, with regards to sturdiness and how she holds herself.  Plus she seems pretty smart, stayed with the herd, and is fairly tame.  2 and 3 always hung out with our oldest cow away from the herd this winter, and were skiddish about wanting to get close to humans, or come up to the corral.

I thought the bull looked pretty good and isn’t absolutely massive.  He’s on loan from the neighbor who has other larger bulls he likes to use for his herd.  Also he is very mellow, which is good for an unfamiliar animal.  He is not the bull to these calves.  I don’t exactly know who the dad was, that’s my fault for not paying attention.

I’ll try to take some better pics in a month or so, and post again before we start culling.  Thanks again for your advise!


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