# Vaccine questions?



## Reptigirl (Jun 13, 2011)

I have two 9 week old kids.. they are due for there second CDT booster.  I was not the one who gave them there 1st one.  I have given many Vaccines before to my dogs & cats so I'm not too worried.

But I was advised to have epinephrine on hand because some goat kids can go into anaphylactic shock.  Is this really a big risk?  I know it is always a risk but by the way this person was talking it is very common in goat kids?  Should I run out and get some before vaccinating them?

Also they were given there first shot 4 weeks ago... this will be the 2nd booster.... Do they need any more boosters?  Or is it just the yearly after this?


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## elevan (Jun 13, 2011)

After the first shot they get a booster in 3-4 weeks and then an annual booster thereafter.

The threat of anaphylactic shock isn't great...but IF it happens and you don't have epi on hand then you're gonna lose the goat.

I would have epi on hand because you run the risk of needing it any time you give an injection to your goats.


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## Reptigirl (Jun 13, 2011)

Okay, thanks!  I SHOULD have it on hand anyways.  It is that time of year for all my pets to get there shots... I just have never had a problem so I never got around to buying any... 

The person who told me sure made it sound common... made me a little scared!  

Do they sell it at the feed store?  Never used it before


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## elevan (Jun 13, 2011)

It's RX so you'll need to get it from a vet.


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## Ariel301 (Jun 14, 2011)

I've never seen one get a reaction to a CDT shot. It's much more likely with an antibiotic, especially penicillin. 

Epi is something you should have on hand if at all possible, but it has to be purchased with a prescription, so you sometimes run into a problem with that--some vets won't give you one because they don't want you doing your own shots, they want you to go to them and pay them for doing it.  At least, that's the case for me right now. They either say that or they won't give out anything at all for goats no matter what, or they won't give a prescription without an exam, and they charge $300 for the exam...

After the second booster, they will need one dose annually. Some people do it every six months, so it's whichever you prefer.


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## Reptigirl (Jun 14, 2011)

Ariel301 said:
			
		

> I've never seen one get a reaction to a CDT shot. It's much more likely with an antibiotic, especially penicillin.
> 
> Epi is something you should have on hand if at all possible, but it has to be purchased with a prescription, so you sometimes run into a problem with that--some vets won't give you one because they don't want you doing your own shots, they want you to go to them and pay them for doing it.  At least, that's the case for me right now. They either say that or they won't give out anything at all for goats no matter what, or they won't give a prescription without an exam, and they charge $300 for the exam...
> 
> After the second booster, they will need one dose annually. Some people do it every six months, so it's whichever you prefer.


$300 for an EXAM!!!!! Geeezzzzzz I so wish my normal dog/cat vet would see goats! LOL  She is awesome.  She knows I do most of my own meds. She always works WITH me not against me!  Hum... maybe she can get me some.....

Is there a specific dosage for goats? I have Nigerians....


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## Goatherd (Jun 14, 2011)

My vet didn't sell me a bottle, but sold me two syringes filled with Epi should I need it.  
Actually, with the small number of goats that I have, and the chance of never needing it, this will suffice for me.  

I keep it refrigerated and then take it with me when I'm administering a vaccine or injection.

Maybe your vet will sell it to you this way?


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## 20kidsonhill (Jun 14, 2011)

I would say it is very rare, We have had goats 15 years, 30 to 70 head given the year and time of year(when we have all the babies). and I have never purchased epi.   Never had one with a reaction. We are not organic, we do give shots, vaccinations and antibiotics. 

With that said,  If it is going to really bother you to give a shot and then by the off chance your goat should have a reaction and falls over in front of you, you probably should have epi on hand.


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## Reptigirl (Jun 14, 2011)

I have an appointment on Friday to see the vet so I will ask about it when I'm there!


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## BetterHensandGardens (Jun 14, 2011)

I just went through the same thing, getting all set to give our goats their annual CDT & BoSe shots, and then realizing that I should have epinephrine on hand.  Here's the story if  you're interested: http://www.betterhensandgardens.com/2011/05/04/annual-cdt-bose-injections-for-goats/

Anyway, I decided better safe than sorry too, our vet called it into Pet Supplies (didn't have to pay anything for the vet), and they shipped it out overnight.  It's a fairly large bottle that should last our small farm just about forever for $30.


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## ksalvagno (Jun 14, 2011)

Epinephrine does have an expiration date. So you may not want to keep it forever. I do replace mine when I see it is past the date on the bottle. I just get a small bottle and I'm thankful when I throw out an unused one. I just get mine from the vet.


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## BetterHensandGardens (Jun 14, 2011)

ksalvagno said:
			
		

> Epinephrine does have an expiration date. So you may not want to keep it forever. I do replace mine when I see it is past the date on the bottle. I just get a small bottle and I'm thankful when I throw out an unused one. I just get mine from the vet.


Indeed it does, didn't notice that - Thanks for pointing it out


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## Mzyla (Jun 15, 2011)

After researching for the past two days about *Anaphylatic Shock* and about *Epinephrine*, I found out, that many goat owners are using equivalent:
*PRIMATENE MIST*  it does contain *Epinephrine*.
It is recommended to give about 5 puffs to the goat.

I also find out, that Primatene Mist will be no longer available after December 2011, due to environmental issue.

http://www.fda.gov/ForConsumers/ConsumerUpdates/ucm247196.htm

In this case Im buying some now. The cheapest prices are on Amazon.com


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## redtailgal (Jun 16, 2011)

.


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## elevan (Jun 16, 2011)

redtailgal said:
			
		

> Everyone needs to have the Epi.  They need to have it right there, ready to go in.
> 
> And they need to understand that it may not work, and when it doesnt, its horrid.
> 
> ...




Very true...you need it in a syringe ready to go.  That is exactly why human epi-pens are ready to go...there is no time to fumble around preparing the shot - it's a now or never type of thing.


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## Reptigirl (Jun 16, 2011)

redtailgal said:
			
		

> Everyone needs to have the Epi.  They need to have it right there, ready to go in.
> 
> And they need to understand that it may not work, and when it doesnt, its horrid.
> 
> ...


 That's terrible 

Was it from a CDT Vac?  Or an antibiotic?  Was it his first shot or had he had them before?

Just curious... How long after a shot are you safe?  Like if they don't react in 5 minutes? 10 minutes?


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## elevan (Jun 16, 2011)

Reptigirl said:
			
		

> redtailgal said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Redtailgal's situation was with penicillin.

A reaction will usually be immediate. But, if they are fine after 10 minutes you're not going to have a problem.


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## Mzyla (Jun 16, 2011)

Please tell me....is giving preventative shots definite *must* ?
I read every page of FiasCo Farms and they are NOT vaccinating their goats. Instead, they using herbs.
Many years ago, my grandma had goats and they never see a vet or give vaccinations. None of them got sick or die...
Just wondering???


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## elevan (Jun 16, 2011)

Mzyla said:
			
		

> Please tell me....is giving preventative shots definite *must* ?
> I read every page of FiasCo Farms and they are NOT vaccinating their goats. Instead, they using herbs.
> Many years ago, my grandma had goats and they never see a vet or give vaccinations. None of them got sick or die...
> Just wondering???


Herbal vs Medical is a HUGE HOT TOPIC here...you're gonna get different answers based on who responds.

You should do your homework on the diseases that the vaccines protect against and make a decision for yourself.  Do you vaccinate yourself and your human children against diseases? If so, why do you do it?  The same principals apply for your animals imo.

There is no right or wrong way of answering this question...unless laws in your state are specific about what you must do in regards to the treatment of your livestock.

I PERSONALLY vaccinate all of my animals.  I RECOMMEND that everyone else do the same.  Whether or not you take my advice is YOUR DECISION.  I won't fault you either way...but either way your choice may or may not have consequences and you should be aware of them before you make a decision.

Do your homework and make the choice that is right for you.

eta:  Fias Co Farm is not the end all be all of goat husbandry.  Their website is a resource (a good one generally), but should not be your only source of information or the reason by which you make full decisions about your goats.


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## DonnaBelle (Jun 16, 2011)

Elevan (Emily) has such a good way of putting things.

I say "ditto" to everything she said.

DonnaBelle


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## elevan (Jun 16, 2011)

DonnaBelle said:
			
		

> Elevan (Emily) has such a good way of putting things.
> 
> I say "ditto" to everything she said.
> 
> DonnaBelle


Thank you.  

_I read and reread my post several times before hitting submit...afraid that I might say something to offend someone or start a war about herbal vs medical._


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## Mzyla (Jun 16, 2011)

My question was inquisitive. Out of curiosity and desire to learn more.
I wanted to know what other people opinions are on a given subject.
Personally Im not against either one and using both.
I appreciate and thank you for any imputs.


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## elevan (Jun 16, 2011)

Mzyla said:
			
		

> My question was inquisitive. Out of curiosity and desire to learn more.
> I wanted to know what other people opinions are on a given subject.
> Personally Im not against either one and using both.
> I appreciate and thank you for any imputs.


I completely understand.  It's just one of those topics that some people will wage war about.  I tried to do my best to answer in an objective way.

I vaccinate because I never want to deal with an animal falling to one of those nasty diseases.

But everyone needs to decide for themselves.


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## Reptigirl (Jun 17, 2011)

Well we are done with the vet today.... sadly the vet would not give me any epi.  :/ She was sure that I would never need it.  Said she had never seen a goat have a bad reaction.... I sure was nervous when she pulled out the penicillin!!!!

Both of my kids had to get disbudded a second time...she gave them penicillin injections & they got another CDT vaccine... .Luckily no bad reaction!  I did the CDT myself and had the Primatene Mist ready.  Its been about an hour & both kids seem fine


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## elevan (Jun 17, 2011)

Quite frankly I'd look for a second vet...one who will give you the epi.  There are plenty of members on here who utilize 2 or 3 vets so that they can get what they need.


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## Goatherd (Jun 18, 2011)

I've not used an actual "goat vet" yet, as I've not needed one.  Yes, there are two in my area, so I am fortunate.  I should probably just have one out to do a wellness check and establish a relationship with them.

For now, my dog/cat vet is my drug supplier.  All they ever say to me when I pick up the "stash" is that I don't know WHERE I got it should I ever be questioned!  I guess this make me a goat junkie.


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## elevan (Jun 18, 2011)

Goatherd said:
			
		

> For now, my dog/cat vet is my drug supplier.  All they ever say to me when I pick up the "stash" is that I don't know WHERE I got it should I ever be questioned!  I guess this make me a goat junkie.


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