# Red's Kidding Thread - Penelope



## nstone630 (May 8, 2017)

Hi everyone! I've been MIA, with work and home I'm lucky to jump on here once a month now  I'm playing some major catch up right now with everyone's posts!

Red (my kids named her lol) was bred to my buck on Feb 20th, making her due date July 20th. The count down is on . She's been filling out, recently it's becoming noticeable.


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## samssimonsays (May 8, 2017)

Love the name and can't wait! How are your others doing?


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## TAH (May 8, 2017)

Hope she kids well for you! What breed is she?


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## nstone630 (May 8, 2017)

samssimonsays said:


> Love the name and can't wait! How are your others doing?


Thank You. They are all great! Moonpie's doeling we kept is getting so big! Probably 50+ lbs now.  But still oh so loving  So much like a bottle baby, you'd never think she was dam raised!!

@TAH   She is Boer, I bred her with my Boer buck so I'm hoping for some very pretty DOELINGS!


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## samssimonsays (May 8, 2017)

That is great!


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## Sally Sunshine (May 8, 2017)

I would love to follow too! I screwed up and had the girls with the buck for some time because I didnt think he was doing his job! doh! So mine are getting large quickly now, terrible not to know when it will happen or about when for their ff!    are we able to copy paste images from other places on inet to here?


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## nstone630 (May 9, 2017)

Sally Sunshine said:


> I would love to follow too! I screwed up and had the girls with the buck for some time because I didnt think he was doing his job! doh! So mine are getting large quickly now, terrible not to know when it will happen or about when for their ff!    are we able to copy paste images from other places on inet to here?



I'm not sure about copy and paste (took me awhile to figure out how to post a pic in lol)

And I was clueless with my ff too. Had left her and my buck living together thinking it just wasn't happening. Then one day she just got bigger, and bigger...I've since survived her and my first kidding. 

It's enough to make you crazy! You're in the right place for all the help! I'm not sure I nor my precious Moonpie would have made it through with our lives or sanity had it not been for all the help here! 

I'd love to see some pics of yours!


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## Sally Sunshine (May 9, 2017)

I am sorta freaking, Pheebe (all our ND have P names)  anyways she has a bit of green white stuff at her privates! Ligaments are still there, no other signs of anything.  
Will get pics when I go back out then.  MUST get kidding info together and my basket for kidding!  Will check back in then!


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## nstone630 (May 9, 2017)

Sally Sunshine said:


> I am sorta freaking, Pheebe (all our ND have P names)  anyways she has a bit of green white stuff at her privates! Ligaments are still there, no other signs of anything.
> Will get pics when I go back out then.  MUST get kidding info together and my basket for kidding!  Will check back in then!



Gloves, towels, lube, warm bucket of water, iodine, nipples, sprite bottle, colostrum (just in case), probiotics, nasal aspirator, and molasses (for mom). @Goat Whisperer what else am I missing??? 

That's what I had ready, and all I needed was the iodine and towels (thank goodness!!!) But it's better to be prepared


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## norseofcourse (May 9, 2017)

Flashlight
Little cup to put the iodine in to dip the navel
And keep your fingernails clipped really short


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## Sally Sunshine (May 9, 2017)

https://www.backyardherds.com/threads/kidding-supply-list-and-notes.35939/


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## nstone630 (May 10, 2017)

norseofcourse said:


> Flashlight
> Little cup to put the iodine in to dip the navel
> And keep your fingernails clipped really short



Yes! We forgot the little cup to dip the iodine in! DH improvised with a shot glass, worked perfectly


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## Sally Sunshine (May 10, 2017)

I will need a bottle of jack and a shot glass for sure   I am already stressing


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## nstone630 (May 11, 2017)

Sally Sunshine said:


> I will need a bottle of jack and a shot glass for sure   I am already stressing


 

We all know the goat code - keep us stressed out right up until we about lose our minds, then they will make us wait some more  They love us though


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## Goatgirl47 (May 11, 2017)

Sally Sunshine said:


> I would love to follow too! I screwed up and had the girls with the buck for some time because I didnt think he was doing his job! doh! So mine are getting large quickly now, terrible not to know when it will happen or about when for their ff!    are we able to copy paste images from other places on inet to here?



I usually use Photobucket to post pictures on this site. You download the picture, and then copy and paste.


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## Goatgirl47 (May 11, 2017)

Your girl is beautiful!


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## nstone630 (May 12, 2017)

Goatgirl47 said:


> Your girl is beautiful!



Thanks! This weekend I'll try and post some more photos!


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## Sally Sunshine (May 12, 2017)

Goatgirl47 said:


> I usually use Photobucket to post pictures on this site. You download the picture, and then copy and paste.


  seems to work copy paste from FB video was a bit more involved just like byc no biggy!    



any updates on Red?  Do you do anything special during pregnancy?


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## nstone630 (May 12, 2017)

No new updates. I won't have too many until closer to the due date (July 20). I'll post some pics of her getting bigger and bigger! Can't believe it's only 69 days from now. I'm sure she will start keeping me on my toes in about a month LOL

I just let her eat all she wants lol She has such a different attitude than my Moonpie who kidded in January. She was very skiddish, never a friendly goat, still isn't. Red lets me rub her and I love it  

I don't let her indulge too much on grain, as I don't want HUGE kids to be a problem. But she gets daily snacks.


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## nstone630 (May 16, 2017)

Updated pics of Red. Not due until July 20.


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## nstone630 (May 16, 2017)

And some pics of Moonpie and her doeling Sweetheart. Both doing great.


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## Sally Sunshine (May 16, 2017)

pretty smiley girl!!


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## nstone630 (May 23, 2017)

Well this is new...
She is CL negative even though this has presented perfectly for it. The vet looked at her and says that since she is negative we can just lance it and clean it with betadine solution. 

Tips on lancing this beauty?


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## Latestarter (May 23, 2017)

I'd make sure she was immobilized then place some sort of "catch" medium (newspaper/cardboard, something) under the area & use a standard scalpel to cut a small slit in it. Excise the stuff and proceed from there. If you can get sequential pics to post it might help others down the road.


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## Southern by choice (May 23, 2017)

nstone630 said:


> Well this is new...
> She is CL negative even though this has presented perfectly for it. The vet looked at her and says that since she is negative we can just lance it and clean it with betadine solution.
> 
> Tips on lancing this beauty?



A one time test is the least accurate. It is quite possibly CL.
Did you see the results yourself?

As far as lancing... there is a long list of precautions BEFORE you do this so don't do this just yet.....
You do however NEED to isolate her in an area where you will never ever have another goat go again. She will need to remain there after you lance and until you get results back. If positive you must isolate her until the hole completely scabs over and is healed up.

Get back to you in a bit.


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## nstone630 (May 23, 2017)

Southern by choice said:


> A one time test is the least accurate. It is quite possibly CL.
> Did you see the results yourself?
> 
> As far as lancing... there is a long list of precautions BEFORE you do this so don't do this just yet.....
> ...



Yes, I have a copy of the lab results from PAN American Vet Labs and all 3 of her labs came back negative.


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## nstone630 (May 23, 2017)

Attached are the results that were sent. It's hard to see in the photo, but they are listed as negative.


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## Goat Whisperer (May 23, 2017)

You should still test the puss for CL
That is the most accurate way to truly tell if they are negative. Like SBC said, a one time blood test doesn't mean much, that is why we do yearly testing. When you've been testing 5+ years and always gotten clean/negative results you can assume they truly are negative. 

Treat her like she has CL or the "worst case scenario". Something caused that abscess and you don't know what. Corynebacterium pseudotuberculosis isn't the only bacteria to cause lumps, you really need to find out what bacteria she has. Some of them are incredibly nasty and can set your herd up for disaster. 

I assume she was the only goat in the herd to be tested? If she were newly exposed when you tested her, the test would come up positive anyway. I've told you how rampant CL is in the meat goat world, and many of these goats to have it internally- so even if the goats didn't have a present lump/s when you visited the farm they could potentially be spreading it by coughing (if in the lungs), milk (if in the udder) etc. 

Her lump is very concerning because it's at a CL location. Look at the pics in the link-
http://goat-link.com/content/view/101/96/#.WSSUZzz3aEc


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## nstone630 (May 23, 2017)

Goat Whisperer said:


> You should still test the puss for CL
> That is the most accurate way to truly tell if they are negative. Like SBC said, a one time blood test doesn't mean much, that is why we do yearly testing. When you've been testing 5+ years and always gotten clean/negative results you can assume they truly are negative.
> 
> Treat her like she has CL or the "worst case scenario". Something caused that abscess and you don't know what. Corynebacterium pseudotuberculosis isn't the only bacteria to cause lumps, you really need to find out what bacteria she has. Some of them are incredibly nasty and can set your herd up for disaster.
> ...



All my goats have been testing, except my 2 youngest. Moonpies doeling and the 4 day old. All of them have come back negative. They've all been tested within a year. 

Even when the vet said due to the placement she would have thought her to have CL, but with a negative result just a couple months ago, she isn't concerned with it. 

So, we're thinking that a culture still needs to be done? I've read a lot of different articles since I've seen the abscess to figure out what it is or what to do. Some state that if they are CL neg, it could just be a pussy swollen lymph node. 

And yes, I've heard that with CL, they can present internally. That is why many meat goats are condemned at slaughter.


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## Goat Whisperer (May 23, 2017)

Yes, test it for CL and ask them to check it for other bacteria as well.

When did you buy this doe?
When did you test her?

She could have still been exposed at the farm you purchased her from, but it wasn't enough time to "incubate" to show a positive test.


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## Goat Whisperer (May 23, 2017)

Just looked back at the pic
Is she loosing the hair on it?
It looks like it is about to burst.
You need to separate her, lance & collect ASAP

If it bursts in the same pen your other goats are, it is very likely for them to contract it too. Especially with all the rain NC is getting- they are all going to be in the shelter together.


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## nstone630 (May 24, 2017)

Goat Whisperer said:


> Just looked back at the pic
> Is she loosing the hair on it?
> It looks like it is about to burst.
> You need to separate her, lance & collect ASAP
> ...



She is losing the hair on it. I have no where to separate her that the other goats will never go. The only place we have to separate goats right now is the kidding stall. Which the current resident is Miracle. And obviously we don't want her in there if it is something like CL. DH and I will have to figure something out... 

I purchased her in December, tested last month.


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## Southern by choice (May 24, 2017)

Either a dog kennel or some cattle panels to make a small pen up by the house or something to that effect with a tarp over it for shelter will suffice.
lance(scalpel or exacto knife blade) over a tarp gather contents, flush with iodine - burn tarp and everything used in treatment

Wear gloves as CL is zoonotic

Wait for results.
Personally I would not want a CL goat in my herd.  Having said that I think it is a decision for the herd owner to weigh carefully.

Even if it is CL I would not necessarily cull her. Retest and see what the titers are after she heals up. She may never get a lump again and if titers are low then just watch. If she ever has another lump then cull.  If you are simply raising for market and the doe is good otherwise ( meaning- kids well, feeds kids adequately etc) why cull.

I say this because so few are testing their goats for CL - meat goat breeders don't care and apparently it is just something that many have but don't speak about it and they are not going to test... just as many dairy goat breeders don't test either and go by "I have never had a lump"----- until they do.


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## nstone630 (May 24, 2017)

I do have some cattle fencing. I'l see what DH can come up with. *sigh*  

A decision will be made on her once testing is back. I'm discussing it with DH now about how we will proceed. I need to contact my vet as well, I'm assuming I can just drop off a nice cup full of puss to them and they can send it off for me. If she wasn't very pregnant, I'd probably cull. 

I'd prefer not to have CL or any of that in my herd. With speaking to my vet when she came out there are only 2 people locally who test. And only 1 of those is a meat farm. Even the vet said "everyone around here just trades goats, and they wonder why there is a problem". Ethically I don't want to sell animals that I know have CL without notifying the buyer. But, meat goats are a terminal animal, not many I guess are concerned with it.


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## Southern by choice (May 24, 2017)

nstone630 said:


> I do have some cattle fencing. I'l see what DH can come up with. *sigh*
> 
> A decision will be made on her once testing is back. I'm discussing it with DH now about how we will proceed. I need to contact my vet as well, I'm assuming I can just drop off a nice cup full of puss to them and they can send it off for me. If she wasn't very pregnant, I'd probably cull.
> 
> I'd prefer not to have CL or any of that in my herd. With speaking to my vet when she came out there are only 2 people locally who test. And only 1 of those is a meat farm. Even the vet said "everyone around here just trades goats, and they wonder why there is a problem". Ethically I don't want to sell animals that I know have CL without notifying the buyer. But, meat goats are a terminal animal, not many I guess are concerned with it.



I do think part of it is because they are terminal, part is because it is so bad there isn't alot people can do UNLESS more people start testing and eliminating this, and the biggest part IMO is people are just simply to cheap to test.

All kinds of excuses from "not accurate", my vet says "don't bother", "I have never had a lump", too expensive... blah blah blah.
I use UC Davis and I am out of state , it is one of the more expensive labs when it comes to CL testing.   But when you look at numbers...
If you sell a goat for lets just say $300... and for many especially in the dairy goat world the kids can be significantly higher it they (parents) have "ribbons"  ... 
UC Davis is $14.50 a test.
*You can test 20 goats for the price of ONE kid*.
If a person has 20 goats to test then they have more than likely a considerable number of kids! 
People spend all kinds of crazy money on their goats, proper hay, proper feed, normal yearly care and then add money for milk testing (every month) will spend money every year on Linear Appraisals, show fees, hotels, travel etc but won't test for CL or Johnes which are both zoonotic. I don't get it. 

My "neighbor" who raises meat goats (show stock breeding stock)  sells his kids for a MINIMUM of $750! Tests for nothing. 

Sometimes I do feel like why bother ... no else seems to care why should I?  Yet I always come back to the same thing... I can only do what I can do and try my best to keep my herd clean so the goats I sell at least I can feel that I have done all I can do for the buyer. There are no guarantees in goats but monitoring herd health IMO is beneficial.

When we move we will be bringing in a herd from Washington (kikos) all tested for CAE, CL, Johnes, and TB of course... to add to our Kikos here. Really looking forward to it!


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## nstone630 (May 24, 2017)

Southern by choice said:


> I do think part of it is because they are terminal, part is because it is so bad there isn't alot people can do UNLESS more people start testing and eliminating this, and the biggest part IMO is people are just simply to cheap to test.
> 
> All kinds of excuses from "not accurate", my vet says "don't bother", "I have never had a lump", too expensive... blah blah blah.
> I use UC Davis and I am out of state , it is one of the more expensive labs when it comes to CL testing.   But when you look at numbers...
> ...




"Sometimes I do feel like why bother"...I hear ya. When the vet told me that only 1 other meat farmer anywhere near me tests, what am I even doing it for? But, like you said, personally I want to be able to tell the buyer they are negative. When I've looked into goats I've purchased and asked if they are tested every single time, I get told no. And most tell me they never test. It's frustrating when I'm in the negative with these things, have made no profit off them due to the vet bills, a lot of that from testing. And no one else gives a rats ass about it.

Sorry for the rant. But it's frustrating and tiring. DH says an old friend of his who also raises meat goats in the area says just lance it, I never test and all my goats are fine. Wouldn't even separate her from the herd while it heals. I get how that is the easy answer...I don't want to deal with this either. But, not sure morally I can just let it go.


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## Southern by choice (May 24, 2017)

Yeah, and that is why all these herds are infected. That is just stupid! The ground is contaminated at that point and all the goats will end up with it-  

I really think many in the goat world just don't realize that if people don't do what they can now, before it is too late, then long term what advantage is it to have goats over cattle?

Abscesses in meat herds cause a lot of carcasses to be condemned... that is a money loser right there.

Starting out with good quality goats from the start is beneficial. They don't have to be registered but quality and tested is worth it.


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## OneFineAcre (May 24, 2017)

I test for CAE and Johnnes and recently TB and Brucellosis
I don't test for CL.
Not accurate.
2 Vets have said not necessary. I know a 3rd vet who owns goats that doesn't test for CL
Never had a lump.
Cost isn't a factor.
You just got to do what you think is best.


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## Southern by choice (May 24, 2017)

OneFineAcre said:


> I test for CAE and Johnnes and recently TB and Brucelleosis
> I don't test for CL.
> Not accurate.
> 2 Vets have said not necessary. I know a 3rd vet who owns goats that doesn't test for CL
> ...



Many vets don't test for it just like many people don't test for it... in the end it isn't the vets herd, the vet loses nothing by someone elses goats getting it, it isn't the vets financial loss, or responsibility... not their investment.  Many vets feel the same about Johnes yet many vets are not up to date on the testing capabilities.  IMO it doesn't mean the vet is a bad vet... matter of fact they can be a great vet but not always agree on a matter. Many vets do test for CL, the ones we work with do test and recommend it although they leave the decision up to the client.

With testing I personally think it is something the goat owner has the responsibility to research and gather info and decide what is in the best interest of the herd owner and herd.

Again... yearly consecutive testing is not going to give you a false positive or negative year after year on the same goat.  Watching titers is also important because if it is internal you may not have a lump ever show up...


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## nstone630 (May 24, 2017)

OneFineAcre said:


> I test for CAE and Johnnes and recently TB and Brucellosis
> I don't test for CL.
> Not accurate.
> 2 Vets have said not necessary. I know a 3rd vet who owns goats that doesn't test for CL
> ...



Just for your opinion, if you had a goat that presented with t lump, would you test it? 

And please know I'm not trying to make this into a battle over testing.  We are all allowed to have opinions. I'm just learning, and don't have any other opinions to listen to except everyone on here. And I think everyone's opinion is respected.


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## OneFineAcre (May 24, 2017)

nstone630 said:


> Just for your opinion, if you had a goat that presented with t lump, would you test it?
> 
> And please know I'm not trying to make this into a battle over testing.  We are all allowed to have opinions. I'm just learning, and don't have any other opinions to listen to except everyone on here. And I think everyone's opinion is respected.



Absolutely.  I have  had 2 get an abscess on the jaw and tested both, despite the fact that the vet said it wasn't CL based on the pus.
Tested anyway.

Not a battle over testing, everyone has to do what they think is best.


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## dejavoodoo114 (May 25, 2017)

My doe with mastitis came up with a large lump in a CL location. Freaked me out because my herd has been tested and all negative. I took her with the goats I was going to show to the vet. The show goats for a health cert and this doe for testing the lump. You should have seen my vets face when she started going around all the goats and got to this doe (with one udder)! She had forgotten I was bringing her and was in "health certification" mode!  Anyway, pulled the liquid from the lump and it wasn't cheesy or CLish. We still tested. The test doesn't cost enough for me to not want to do it in such a situation. And when the results get back I will _know_ which is important for me. You do what you need to do for you and your farm.


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## nstone630 (May 26, 2017)

I spoke with my vet again. We are going to lance it, out of the pasture, keep her quarantined until the wound stops draining. If the would drains for over 24 hours, put her on antibiotics. Then use either Vaseline or pine tar to put on the wound to keep flies and the other goats away from it. We will culture it and see what results come back. She does say that goats get abscesses for many reasons other than CL and that with her having a negative result this close to getting this abscess, she is 90% sure it's negative.


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## nstone630 (May 31, 2017)

Well that was fun  Let's just say there were no photos taken for a nice picture tutorial or anything like that. It was a goat rodeo! It was DS (10), me and my father in law hold her down to immobilize her while we lance. Oh and did I mention I found out I'm allergic to my wonderful goats? broke out in hives from her on my arms and legs. That was fun. DS held her horns, FIL held her front legs while he lanced, I was in charge of the back end, gently sitting on rear end and hold legs. Let me tell you she is a STRONG lady. Anyways, we got the job done.

Surprisingly the abscess had little to nothing in it.   I flushed it with a batadine mix really good and put pine tar on her to keep flies and the other goats away from her. So far she is fly and goat free and healing very nicely. 

We shall see what the vet says once results come in. It will be next week.

I was not on much this weekend as I had that going on, a broody hen hatching out some bitties, the bottle baby is plum annoying now  She's got to realize she's a goat soon right?!!


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## nstone630 (Jun 1, 2017)

Day 150 isn't until July 21. What do yall think? She's seeming pretty preggers to have to wait over a month


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## Goatgirl47 (Jun 1, 2017)

I think that sounds about right. Her cute little udder still has a lot of growing to do.


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## nstone630 (Jun 2, 2017)

Goatgirl47 said:


> I think that sounds about right. Her cute little udder still has a lot of growing to do.



With the latest unexpected delivery on our little farm I'm a nervous nelly now!  EVEN THOUGH I KNOW her conception date  Why do we drive ourselves crazy???? 

I put the bottle baby out in the kidding stall last night. Which will be her spot of residence until Red needs it. She's still too small to put her with the whole herd. Red rams the gate trying to get in to her  Now, I'd love to think that her motherling instinct is coming out and wants nothing more than to get the screaming baby out and console her. But, the more rational me realizing she probably will trample the poor gal to death the moment I let her near her  

Anyone have any tips on introducing bottle babies (any new babies) to an older established herd? Pro's con's? Like it or not Miracle is in for a rude awakening come the middle of July when Red takes residence in the kidding stall.


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## nstone630 (Jun 7, 2017)

Results came back - NEGATIVE! 

At least I have 1 CL battle under my belt, but apparently from everything I've read and learned on here that this is an ongoing issue and constant testing is needed. *sigh*

Moving on to a more exciting subject - a fatter goat  She is MUCH larger than Moonpie ever got, so I cannot believe she has over a month to go! Even DH said last night "maybe she'll go early?"  I cursed him for saying such things! 

Oh, and my poor buck, yes he is still in the field with them. He would love for me to take Sweetheart away from Moonpie so she will come back in heat. But, for the time being, I'm happy to leave baby and mom together!


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## nstone630 (Jun 7, 2017)

Oh, and just to show how I was so creative on Sweetheart's name - hehe. She has the cutest marking on her back.


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## nstone630 (Jul 11, 2017)

Well her due date is around the corner. July 21. 
Here are the latest pics from yesterday. She's filling out very nicely if I might say so myself. 
I'm getting the birthing stall all set up for her. Need to get fresh hay to put down and move her in so she can get comfortable with her new home.


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## Goatgirl47 (Jul 11, 2017)

Looking good!


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## babsbag (Jul 11, 2017)

nstone630 said:


> At least I have 1 CL battle under my belt, but apparently from everything I've read and learned on here that this is an ongoing issue and constant testing is needed. *sigh*



My goats don't get many abscesses, maybe one or two a year and I own 40+ goats. If the abscess is on the cheek I honestly don't test. My herd is tested and closed and I don't show so there is no exposure. 

Hope that the kidding is uneventful, those are the best kind.


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## dejavoodoo114 (Jul 12, 2017)

Exciting!  We are getting ready for breeding season here. Maybe I should get a breed that more easily breeds year round...


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## nstone630 (Jul 13, 2017)

dejavoodoo114 said:


> Exciting!  We are getting ready for breeding season here. Maybe I should get a breed that more easily breeds year round...



Does give you more kidding times  but the additional stress of it all as well LOL


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## nstone630 (Jul 14, 2017)

She is not a fan of the kidding stall. She's never been enclosed and she's being very vocal about it all  She will be fine though. Her due date is a week away! I can't believe it. 

Most go right up to day 150 right? I wanted to put her in the stall just IN CASE she didn't go the full 150 days. It's much less stressful when I know the due date, geez, what a difference from when Moonpie was pregnant. 

Moonpie is still letting Sweetheart nurse from time to time. I feel this is why neither of them have come into heat yet, and I'm OK with that  I may put Moonpie in the birthing stall in October to dry her up so that she will come in heat next year. 

After kidding, and after taking away babies, how long after does it usual take for them to come back into heat? I know Boer's are good for breeding year round. Just wondering if anyone here has ideas?


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## nstone630 (Jul 17, 2017)

Day 146    Luckily since it is summer the kids are home ALL day most of the time. They are my eyes and ears while I have to be in the office. 

She's become VERY affectionate the last 2 days. Bag is very full. I'll try and get some photo's this evening when I get home for a better update!


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## nstone630 (Jul 18, 2017)

She's filling out nicely. Kids are attempting to get me some additional photos while I'm at work today


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## nstone630 (Jul 18, 2017)

For as pregnant as she should be, so doesn't look anywhere near as fat as some of your girls @Goat Whisperer. Neither did Moonpie though with just twins. Is this because you're expecting more than twins?

She has access to Hay 24/7, water and minerals. She also gets 1 cup of feed daily.
Before this week she was free range.
Could the stress of her being in the kidding stall be causing some weight loss? Just looking from pics before I placed her in the stall to now...she seem's to have lost weight. 

Here are the latest shots the kids got today.


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## Goat Whisperer (Jul 18, 2017)

I'm not understanding why a kid nursing would prevent the dam from getting bred? 
I milk my does ten months out of the year, they get bred while they are still milking. 
If the dam is deficient that will play a role. 
She could also be a seasonal breeder. 

As far as the red doe, she does look very thin. Part of it could be the pic, and maybe she's dropped a bit, but she still looks underweight. One cup (if you mean a kitchen measuring cup) is not near enough feed for a doe that size. She is going to need several pounds of feed come kidding time. I know you dealt with this when your other doe had kidded. 

What type of hay are you feeding? 

I don't know how many kids my girls are going to have, although the one doe (Clover) doesn't look very big to me, right now I'm guessing a single/maybe twins. But her udder is pretty big so who knows. Large does (generally) have more body capacity and are able to "hide" kids well. 

When was the last time you checked her fecal and last time wormed?


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## nstone630 (Jul 18, 2017)

Goat Whisperer said:


> I'm not understanding why a kid nursing would prevent the dam from getting bred?
> I milk my does ten months out of the year, they get bred while they are still milking.
> If the dam is deficient that will play a role.
> She could also be a seasonal breeder.
> ...




I was just thinking that a nursing dam may not come into heat ? But my thinking obviously can be incorrect. 

I was trying to not over feed with pellets but give her all the hay she wants. I will up the grain. 

DH wants to let her out to free range since she's looking thin. I just don't know what to do with that, as if she kids while we are not there, I risk other goats or animals being able to get to them. The kidding stall is secure enough that nothing is getting in or out unless it can climb 6 foot gates. 
Thoughts?? I thought everyone kind of "put up the dams" when they got real close.?? 

She was wormed just a month ago, with all the rest of them. No fecal testing recently as there have been so signs of needing it, scours or such.


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## nstone630 (Jul 18, 2017)

Here may be a better picture to show just how large she's getting. DH just sent this to me.


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## nstone630 (Jul 18, 2017)

Pictures from tonight. I felt for her ligs, still there.


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## Goatgirl47 (Jul 18, 2017)

I'd probably just let her out to free-range if you don't think she is doing well being locked up.
Last year with my first three does kidding, I kept them out (on pasture) up until they went into labor, when I'd lock them in the goat house. I wanted to put them in the goat house earlier, like when they came closer to their due date, but my goats are drama queens when it comes to putting them anywhere where they are not used to.  And especially if it involves a small(ish) place with 4 walls.


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## nstone630 (Jul 23, 2017)

A single doeling!!!


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## lalabugs (Jul 23, 2017)

Congrats! She's beautiful.


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## TAH (Jul 23, 2017)

nstone630 said:


> A single doeling!!!


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## nstone630 (Jul 23, 2017)

She's precious...I may habe a biased opinion lol


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## Latestarter (Jul 23, 2017)

Awwww... what a sweetie! Congrats!


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## nstone630 (Jul 24, 2017)

Mom and baby are doing quite well this morning. They will get some pasture time this afternoon 
She has been a great momma so far! Quite the helicopter mom!  always hovering over her! I went in last night and picked the doeling up for a few minutes and I was sure Red was going to go crazy! She kept looking around like "where'd she go, where'd she GO!!!"

Need a name! I'll get some better pictures later and see if we can't figure out a good name.


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## Goatgirl47 (Jul 24, 2017)

Penelope?

She is adorable, congratulations!


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## TAH (Jul 24, 2017)

Goatgirl47 said:


> Penelope


x2...


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## nstone630 (Jul 24, 2017)

I do like Penelope! I'll see what the jury (aka - the kids) rules. 

I cannot wait to get off work to get home to this little precious! I worry so about her. It was no use trying to sleep last night. You'd have thought I had a new born! Up every hour or so making sure she was feeding ok, no too cold with the fan in her pen, still breathing! *sigh* I'm tired.


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## nstone630 (Jul 24, 2017)

Ok. Need help...do I need to milk her some? Her one teat looks normal. The other like it's so full it could pop. How does it work with 1 kid, 2 teats full of milk?


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## frustratedearthmother (Jul 24, 2017)

If she's terribly engorged it wouldn't hurt to milk her a little to ease the pressure. BUT - you have to make a decision.  If the baby isn't nursing that side and if you don't milk it - it will dry up - problem solved.   OR, you could tape up the side the baby is nursing on so she'll find the other teat...   Usually when they figure out there are two faucets they'll use them both... OR - you can milk that side for your own use.


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## Goatgirl47 (Jul 25, 2017)

It could be that the kid isn't nursing on the other side because the teat is engorged. I would probably milk it out some and see what the kid does...


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## nstone630 (Jul 25, 2017)

We milked it last night. It went down fine. I'll check it again this afternoon and see what it looks like. I just don't want to risk mastitis


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## nstone630 (Aug 3, 2017)

Well she has adopted the name Penelope  Will update with photo's of her cuteness soon. She is doing very well.


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