# snuffles or just hot?



## chickenchaps (Jun 16, 2011)

I have 3 rabbits, NZ white, California, about 6 months old.
Monday I noticed they all had wet muzzles.  I thought they were just sweating as the temperatures soared close to 100!!  (east FL)

Someone I was talking to said rabbits dont sweat, it is snuffles.  ?! 
Researched, learned.  

But I have never heard them sneeze - I dont even know what that sounds like.  There is no dripping from the nose, no dripping from the eyes.  They are eating and drinking.  

I also noticed the last 2 nights, when the clouds rolled in and it cooled off, the muzzles dried.

Could they be just hot?  Would they purposely spray themselves with the automatic nipple type waterer?   Or is it snuffles?  I bought antibiotics and probiotics yesterday intending to start treatment but didnt get to do it yet.  

Opinions appreciated!


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## woodleighcreek (Jun 16, 2011)

Could you post a picture of their noses? And if the inner paws are matted, that is a sign of snuffles.


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## chickenchaps (Jun 16, 2011)

I will take a picture tonight.  Thanks


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## dewey (Jun 16, 2011)

It sounds like it's from the heat.  Are your buns in full shade and in open air cages?  

The hair around their noses/mouth will become moist/water-wet looking when they're hot and their mouth might be held slightly open with fast breathing/panting.  Once they're cool they don't do that anymore and their face dries up.  

It was 110 here yesterday (gets 115-120+) and the ones that are not in the cooled barn got wet down a couple of times during the day with water (just drizzled through my fingers from a gallon jug since it was handiest) and their ears wet down, they also have a big box fan to move air and frozen 2 liter bottles.  Mostly not needed but it gives them some relief.

Hoping the best for your buns.


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## chickenchaps (Jun 17, 2011)

I think they are ok.  I dont think its snuffles at all.  

Their muzzles were not wet yesterday as it was only 90 degrees and not as miserable hot.  It was only on them super hot days and everybody was panting, sweating, hot.  

I took a picture, there is no drippy nose or eyes, no matting on the front paws.  
They are in full shade open air cages, yes.  I have shade cloth on the sides where the sun could come in.
I am new to rabbits and didnt know they sweat like that, or maybe wet themselves with the water?
Thanks for the replies!


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## dewey (Jun 17, 2011)

> I am new to rabbits and didnt know they sweat like that, or maybe wet themselves with the water?


It's sweat.  But it's a good idea to keep them from getting to that point.  One would think otherwise, but when they get really hot they won't drink enough.    

It's good they're in open air cages, athough hot climate rabbits really need 100% shade that allows good air flow, and also protection from reflective sun/heat from the ground or other nearby surfaces.  

Shade cloth allows a little air (unlike a solid heavy tarp draped on cages) but not enough shade, at least it wouldn't be enough here.  The rabbits would have heat stroke with shade cloth.  Shade cloth or other materials placed right against or on cages will actually hold heat in...best to have any materials (tarp, shade cloth, wood) at least a few feet off the cages for a buffer zone to allow heat to rise up off the rabbits.

Good luck, and cute buns.


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## chickenchaps (Jun 17, 2011)

GOOD!  Thank you!

Thanks for the info too.  Im not sure how or if I can modify to move the shade cloth away from the cage itself.  Its against the fence and the other side is not my propery (empty lot).  Its in an open area so there is decent air flow, and the bottom of the cages get air in too...  If the shade cloth wasnt there, they would roast in the sun for sure!  I have the tin roof painted with that expensive rubber roofing stuff to help insulate it.

Here, maybe this helps visualize.  If you see something I can do different I am open to suggestions...






Thank you again for your help and suggestions!  I really do appreciate it.


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## oneacrefarm (Jun 17, 2011)

A wet muzzle is a bad sign, your rabbits are overheating dangerously. Do you give them frozen 2L bottles of water? Do you spray down the roof to lower the temp? Do you mist their ears with water? That is where they lose the heat and misting the ears will help by evaporative cooling. I am thinking that the shade cloth is keeping the air from flowing properly because it closes off three sides. Can you prop it away from the cages on the ends? Also, some of that reflective insulation on the underside of the roof will help keep heat out as well.

Shannon


			
				chickenchaps said:
			
		

> GOOD!  Thank you!
> 
> Thanks for the info too.  Im not sure how or if I can modify to move the shade cloth away from the cage itself.  Its against the fence and the other side is not my propery (empty lot).  Its in an open area so there is decent air flow, and the bottom of the cages get air in too...  If the shade cloth wasnt there, they would roast in the sun for sure!  I have the tin roof painted with that expensive rubber roofing stuff to help insulate it.
> 
> ...


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## chickenchaps (Jun 17, 2011)

No, I dont/havent done them things.  I could spray them when I get home from work, but by then they are already hot - I will do that if it will help them.  I leave for work at 5:30 am.  Its not hot then.  I get home about 3:30.  If I put a frozen bottle out there, by the time it did get hot when they need it, it wouldnt be cold anymore anyway.  

If I removed the shade cloth the 2 end rabbits would cook, morning and night.  As you look at the cages, that is facing south.  Thre is a gap on the back shade cloth, and I do believe it allows air flow, sure it may filter it, but air gets through.  At least the sun doesnt.  I dont think removing the shade cloth is a solution at all.  I dont know how I can prop it out.  Ideas?  

I could glue some styrofoam insulation on the inside of the roofs, maybe that could help some.  I could put an extra couple sheets of tin on the roof at both ends and remove the shade cloth from the ends too.  

Im trying to think of improvements... Thanks for the help!
Fortunately we dont typically get to 97+ degrees.  I am close enough to the coast, we get nice sea breezes.  We just had a few miserable days this week.  Lets hope we dont get more.


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## dewey (Jun 17, 2011)

If I understood correctly, the front of the cages face north (a good thing) and the back of the cages get south sun in the afternoon through the shade cloth (not a good thing).  

The bottom of the cages let air in, but they're also getting reflected sun/heat off the ground under and around the cages.  

North facing is good but even direct sun from the north is too much sun.  Is the roof attached to another structure to the north of it so it gives shade in the morning, or is it free standing?

The quickest, easiest thing would be to put up a shade canopy of some sort with south backing.  Otherwise, and it might take some doing, but if the setup could be moved away from the fence several feet and the back roofline extended that far, then a solid structure that blocks the sun could be added at the back almost all the way to the ground, with the sides of the roof extended out and down to shade the end cages.  A hose mister and a fan can really help.

A roof or hutch setup that's not shaded will be extremely hot since it's in direct sun.  Your setup looks really nice and would be great if it were under big ol' shade trees or a shade canopy.  

If nothing else, I'd add insulated reflective board to the roof and even though it'd be solid, a wood back on the cages almost down to the ground would at least keep the south sun off and out from under them...that, and propping up something solid at the sides, and a big fan.  It can attract flies but soaking a large area of ground around them will help, too.


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## chickenchaps (Jun 17, 2011)

Thanks!  Great ideas!

I was thinking of someday expanding and building more cages, which wouldnt be limited on the back by property line as these are.  I could build that and move them to that new structure with all these helpful hints in mind.

Yes, you have it correct, the front faces north and NO sun at all comes in from that direction.  The tin overlaps to the north well far enough to keep it shaded.  This time of year, until winter, the south will not get sun either.  The sun is close to straight up (FL), only in winter does it slant in from the south.

The ground underneath is sand, I dont think its reflecting heat at all.  These hutches are inside my chicken coop run (completely predator proof) and the chickens hang out underneath the rabbits during the day as its the cool spot.  

Ill look into the reflective insulated roof boards, that is a good idea.  ANd Ill work on doing somekind of mister fan setup too.

Thank you all for the great ideas and help!  Im just glad they werent snuffling.  ? is that a word?  lol


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## rockdoveranch (Jun 17, 2011)

+1 on frozen water bottles.  Stick them in in the morning and put them back in the freezer for the next day.  We use 1/2 gallon juice bottles.


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## chickenchaps (Jun 19, 2011)

Ok, I put more tin over the rabbits and removed the shade cloth from the east and west ends.  I think I will try removing the shade cloth from the south (back) side as well - as the sun is basically straight up this time of year.  I will try it and see if too much sun is coming in or not.  Id rather them be in shade, instead of worrying about wind (wind comes from the east most of the time).  Having the ends open will surely help I think, and should have sufficient shade with the extra tin roofed.  I will also still get some insulation for the roof.  There is no way to prop the shade cloth on the south as that is on my property line and I cant overlap into the other property.  Come fall, I can put the shade cloth back up on the south, when the sun shifts south.  

Forecast shows another HOT week coming.  I will watch them closely and do whatever I can to keep them cool.

I appreciate all the help and ideas!  I am just very glad they didnt have snuffles.


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## rockdoveranch (Jun 19, 2011)

About the frozen water bottles, as the ice melts the bottles sweat.  My rabbits "seem" to enjoy the wet bottles.  If you have the freezer room, I  would suggest you have two sets of bottles for each rabbit and put one in each cage before going to work and then replacing them with the second set of frozen bottles when you get home.  Just a suggestion.

We are about 50 miles from the Texas Gulf Coast and I swear, with our sandy soil, it is hotter here than at the beach and you can get a faster tan or sun burn here than at the beach.

If you do rebuild or add more cages, you might consider making the tops of the cages wire and putting a solid roof over them about 2 to 4 foot higher.  And do the same with the side that gets the winter wind.


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## rockdoveranch (Jun 22, 2011)

chickchaps, How are your rabbits doing?

I wanted to tell you that not long after my last post I noticed that my 1 1/2 year old French Lop Buck's neck was totally wet.  I checked him out in his cage and his hair was very matted there too.  When I tried to look even closer he put his teeth on me but did not break my skin.

Our weather has been in the 90s and up to the 100s for months and months.

I wrapped him up in a beach towel and brought him in the house and lay him on his back on a table.  My husband held him down.  I wrapped my thumb and index finger around his mouth with my left hand so he could not bite me, and examined his neck.  

He had one serious yeast infection with two areas that were very red with two red, red sores.  It took about 30 minutes, but I cut away all the wet hair and a little of the dry hair in the adjacent area.  I dried his neck off well and then poured Betadine on his bare neck.

I added 1/8th teaspoon of Dacoxine (a drug we have here for our pigeons) to his 16 ounce water bottle and the sores have already cleared up and his skin no longer looks irritated.

I considered putting yeast medication on his neck and giving him a shot of penicillin, but went with the other plan instead.  Could be that simply cutting the wet, matted hair away did the trick.

Here is our cage that sits under our 15 foot house awning.







This is a first for me.


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## chickenchaps (Jun 23, 2011)

WOW!  What a scare that was!  Im glad you knew how and what to do and it worked!  

Your hutch is great!  Looks like it would have lots of nice air flow and cool.  But when its hot out, it just hot everywhere!  

My rabbits are good, thank you for asking!  I havent seen the wet noses anymore, since I put more tin up and removed the end shade cloths.  They are still panting, but at least improved some.  Do they ever get aclimated to the heat?  

I am saving up bottles now to freeze and put in their cages.  I figure its worth a try.  I doubt they would still be even cool by time I get off work, but I can put another out there when I get home, so maybe that would reduce the amount of time they are hot.


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## oneacrefarm (Jun 24, 2011)

chickenchaps said:
			
		

> WOW!  What a scare that was!  Im glad you knew how and what to do and it worked!
> 
> Your hutch is great!  Looks like it would have lots of nice air flow and cool.  But when its hot out, it just hot everywhere!
> 
> ...


Yep, that is pretty much what I do. I leave around 7am and I put bottle. When I get home, it is melted...sometimes still cool, sometimes not. If it is still scorching, I put another bottle. Mine love them, they will lay right on top of them! Misting or wetting down their ears is a quick way to cool them off too.

Shannon


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## dewey (Jun 24, 2011)

Glad your rabbits are ok.  

The ones I have outside enjoy their bodies being gently and completely soaked down with water (none down in their ears of course).  They stretch out waiting for their turn when they see me coming with the water.  They adore the massaging and scratching as I backcomb their fur with my hand making sure the water gets to the skin.  

I don't recall what type you have, but maybe you could also wet them down before you leave and again after you get home at the hottest part of the day.  A gallon jug should do 4-5.  

It's was 117 degrees here in the valley this week and it's gonna get hotter.


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