# What does "steep in the hip" mean?



## rockdoveranch (Jun 24, 2011)

I haven't really wanted to talk about this as if makes me very sad and I become withdrawn and silent when bad things happen, but our White Dorper ram died.  We have no idea why.  He was down and we could not find anything physically wrong.  His eye color looked good, but we wormed him with ivermectin anyway and gave him penicillin but he died a short time later.  We have been having trouble with our lambs getting snake bitten by copperheads, but I did not see any of the tell-tell signs of snake bites on him, plus copperhead bites are not usually bad unless you are allergic to the venom.  We considered taking him to A & M for a necropy but decided against it.  

We bought the ram June of last year along with 2 White Dorper ewe lambs.  They were all born January and February of that year.  None grew to the height of the sheep the seller has.  We were first time Dorper owners and he pushed this ram as the ram we really should have.  I asked if he was a bottle baby and he said no, but having had bottle baby Barbado I am convinced this ram was a bottle baby by his behavior around us.  

We were told all the sheep were Pure Bred and they are registered.  However that one ewe I posted has wool that is different than the ram and other ewe and she has not shedded out.

I have decided NOT to call the breeder with questions.  I am just going to stay away from him.

Now that my rant is over, I will ask my question.

We are now looking for a White Dorper ram lamb.  I found someone on craigslist who has 2 White Dorper rams for sale.  She emailed me back saying they were *a little steep in the hip* for what she needed for show sheep.  So, does steep in the hip mean?

Thanks.


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## carolinagirl (Jun 24, 2011)

I am sorry your ram died.  that's really sad.  

I don't know what steep in the hip means, but I am already impressed with the seller's pointing out flaws in them.  Many sellers are so anxious to unload something that they won't point out ANY defects.


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## rockdoveranch (Jun 24, 2011)

carolinagirl said:
			
		

> I am sorry your ram died.  that's really sad.
> 
> I don't know what steep in the hip means, but I am already impressed with the seller's pointing out flaws in them.  Many sellers are so anxious to unload something that they won't point out ANY defects.


Thanks Carolinagirl!  I get really withdrawn when bad things happen and do my best not to talk about it until I have processed it for a L O N G 
* L O N G* time.  

I just got through emailing the seller to ask.   She has a website but it is for boer goats.


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## rockdoveranch (Jun 24, 2011)

The seller just emailed me back.  She said she just sold the ram lambs. 

She did not answer my question.


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## marliah (Jun 24, 2011)

I'm sorry about your ram  

I hope you can find a good one. 

Its hard when things go wrong on the farm. I had my beehive fail or almost fail (I am still praying it miraculously comes back) this year and I am really bummed about it.


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## patandchickens (Jun 24, 2011)

In a horse it would be tend to mean that the pelvis is too angulated (top of croup not flat enough) for what the person was looking for. 

You might email the breeder back and restate your question, indicating that you want to learn more about breeding sheep and could she perhaps give you a quickie definition of what she meant. I mean the worst she can do is not reply 

Good luck, have fun,

Pat


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## carolinagirl (Jun 24, 2011)

I googled it and looked and looked, but the only thing I could find is that steep hip is a fault in some breeds.  I am not sure, but I think it's when the hip from the pin bone to the tail head slopes too much.  This is normal in Barbados Blackbelly sheep and your Barbado sheep.  It looks like meat production sheep and wool sheep are straight in the area from the hip and the tail head.  One interesting thing I did find is a breeding score card where it lists serious faults for each of the breeds they were judging.  The steep hip was listed as a fault for some breeds, but not Dorpers.  Maybe it's a fault, but not a serious fault?


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## aggieterpkatie (Jun 24, 2011)

Yes, steep hip is just like what it sounds like.  The rump from hooks to tailhead is too sloped.  It should be nice and level.  Show sheep really need to be level, so it's understandable someone would sell a ram with a sloped rump.  The theory is that level rumps mean more meat, and you want more meat in those breeds that are meant to produce.  

http://www.highnoonfeeds.com/winners/images/sheep/2004/A_M_Ram_at_NAILE.jpgHere's  an example of a nice level hip.  

Here  are some lambs with sloped rumps.


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## aggieterpkatie (Jun 24, 2011)

Here's  a Dorper ram with a nice rump.


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## doxiemoxie (Jun 24, 2011)

I get really withdrawn when bad things happen and do my best not to talk about it until I have processed it for a L O N G 
L O N G time.


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## aggieterpkatie (Jun 24, 2011)

Ack, I'm such a heel!   I'm so sorry about your ram, Rock!!!


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## rockdoveranch (Jun 26, 2011)

Thanks you all the information everyone and especially the photos Aggie! And thank you all for the condolences and hugs about our ram.  He was a very sweet boy.  The breeder claimed he was not bottle fed, but his behavior made me think like wise.  I may be repeating myself.  Sorry if so.  I have not even told my adult kids yet.

I am thinking about replacing him with a St Croix or St Croix/Dorper mix.   Looks like you almost have to be ready to jump in your truck and drive to get sheep that are for sell the second an ad goes online.

Yesterday we had a white dove release for a 5 year old little boy who drown.  Normally at a funeral for a child we do not get any feed back because of the overwhelmingly sadness that a child has passed, but yesterday we did, even from the parents.  None-the-less, I will be glad when June is over.


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