# Questions about ram management?



## patandchickens (Apr 9, 2010)

It looks like I will end up with 2 dairy-bred ewe-lambs, plus a grown shetland ewe, plus a shetland ram-lamb. I know, I said before I really didn't want to own a ram, but, oh well, in the end I think this may be the simplest way to proceed after all.

1) I don't want the ewe lambs bred before Nov (as per their breeder's advice - they are Jan. lambs), so I assume I will have to separate the ram from them (and the shetland ewe) at least a few months next fall - how do I know when to separate him from them?

2) once they are bred, can I leave him in with them?

3) after the lambs are born and a few wks old, can the ram be in with them or does he need to be separate? 

4) my plan is to wean the lambs at 4-6 wks and milk the ewes... if the ram is with the ewes at this point, will their milk taste funny (as per 'don't run a buck with your milking goats' type thing)?

5) describe a good pen in which to separate ram from ewes -- fence height/type, pen size, etc.  Shelter is likely to be a little small shed. Should he be able to see the ewes, or not? (property is not large enough to prevent him from hearing/smelling them, and preventing him from seeing them would be tough though not impossible)

Thanks for all advice,

Pat (woo hoo, I'm really getting sheep!  )


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## aggieterpkatie (Apr 9, 2010)

I'd separate the ram by 4-5 months of age unless he starts acting interested in them earlier.  You can leave him in with the girls during gestation, but be it'll be hard to manage his feed intake since a ram doesn't need as much feed as a pregnant ewe.  

When you separate them, it would really be best if he has a buddy.  Sheep are horribly miserable when they're alone, even if they're in the sight of another sheep.  As far as fencing requirements, I think a 4' fence would be fine.  

I'd separate them before lambing, but that's me.  Are you going to be bottling the lambs when you remove them from their moms at 4-6 weeks?


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## Beekissed (Apr 10, 2010)

patandchickens said:
			
		

> It looks like I will end up with 2 dairy-bred ewe-lambs, plus a grown shetland ewe, plus a shetland ram-lamb. I know, I said before I really didn't want to own a ram, but, oh well, in the end I think this may be the simplest way to proceed after all.
> 
> 1) I don't want the ewe lambs bred before Nov (as per their breeder's advice - they are Jan. lambs), so I assume I will have to separate the ram from them (and the shetland ewe) at least a few months next fall - how do I know when to separate him from them?
> 
> ...


Pat, I'm glad you are getting sheep!  

I brought my borrowed ram home last night and I will be facing some of the same space problems as yourself, so I will be following this thread for good tips!


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## Mea (Apr 17, 2010)

aggieterpkatie said:
			
		

> I'd separate the ram by 4-5 months of age unless he starts acting interested in them earlier.  You can leave him in with the girls during gestation, but be it'll be hard to manage his feed intake since a ram doesn't need as much feed as a pregnant ewe.
> 
> When you separate them, it would really be best if he has a buddy.  Sheep are horribly miserable when they're alone, even if they're in the sight of another sheep.  As far as fencing requirements, I think a 4' fence would be fine.
> 
> I'd separate them before lambing, but that's me.  Are you going to be bottling the lambs when you remove them from their moms at 4-6 weeks?


What  Aggieterpkatie said.

   And...If You can arrange a way to feed and water from Outside the ram's ( and companion's) area  is a good idea.  As rams mature they get a little testosteroni acting and can be quite un-nice to handle.  Even spring born ram lambs can pack a good wallop when they butt a person !   But a companion is a great idea.


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## dwbonfire (Oct 4, 2012)

so glad to have found this thread as i was wondering a lot of these same questions.

i have jacob sheep, which are not year round breeders. fall is when they start cycling and will cycle through winter.. i have one ewe who i want bred, and the other is a ewe lamb who im unsure if i should have bred or not.. she was a march baby of this year.. so if she were bred within the next couple months she would lamb at 12-14 months of age.. not sure if this is ok or not?

-if i seperate the ram NOW (crossing fingers neither are bred yet, not seen any activity so far) and put him back with both ewes in december she would lamb at 14 months or so (may/june).. so this would be better, but still is it old enough?

-here in NC it is still very warm, but days are getting shorter which i am told controls the ewes coming into season.. my ram is very laid back, and was also a march lamb this year so not sure he quite knows what to do with the ladies. should i be too worried they may already been in cycle and bred yet? any way to tell this early on if they were?

-i am making a seperation pen for my ram this weekend and he will be staying in there.. i know it very much depends on the ram but how unruly are they with fencing? how tall should it be without risk of him jumping it? this guy is super laid back, though i know that could change.


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## Alice Acres (Oct 4, 2012)

We use a combination of stock panels and tube gates to keep our ram in a separate pen (and not penned alone, as mentioned. We've been using our little pony Teddy as the ram buddy, sometimes with some young wethers in there too). We also use thin plywood (in addition to the fence) as a visual barrier as needed. 

Also, we have a separate place for summer pasture, so many times he ends up on a different property entirely when he needs to be apart...works well for all.

Our rams go in with the ewes in mid-November, for mid-April lambs. We are in MN - just too much hassle with earlier lambs - been there, done that. 
They stay in until about a month before lambing. So March to November they are elsewhere.
We keep each ram 2 years, then go to a new one.


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## BrownSheep (Oct 4, 2012)

Dw. Our ram actually stayed in with our ewes during lambing. Of course for birth and a couple days afterwards mom and the babies stayed in their own pens but after that they were back with everyone. I truely think it depends on the ram. Our boy, who just for the record is a huge jerk when it comes to people ( former bottle baby), even let our two bottle lambs try to nurse off him.  He was sooooo confused. 

I like my ewe lambs to be pretty close to their adult size for lambing. I see no issue for lambing at 12-14 months as long as she is agood and healthy size. Most large producers in my area breed for lambing at 12 months. Just make certain she is well conditiond and make certain you keep an eye on her once she starts developing an udder.

It possible your guy is a little young yet. Our second ram had no clue what to do his first year. Make fencing sturdy. Rams with horns like to itch them on fences and fence posts. Our oldest guy likes to scratch his rear on the fence as well.  Please, remember no matter how calm your ram is DO NOT BECOME FRIENDS WITH HIM.  We have three rams. Two are terrified of us and are much easier to handle vs the friendly one. If I had known he was a bottle baby I think I probably would have passed him up.


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## Bridgemoof (Oct 4, 2012)

DWBonfire, I have the same thing as you, with the same kind of sheep and the same age! 

I'm getting my new Jacob ram lamb on Monday (can't wait, he's form the Unzicker line in PA). He was born in March. My two youngest Jacob ewes were born in February. I'm going to be putting them together right away. I'm not sure if the ram lamb will be old enough to figure things out yet, or if the ewe lambs will be ready, but I figure by the time they all figure it out they will be old enough. I don't quite care when we have lambs because I have had my Cormo ram with my other ewes all summer and fall, so I think I will be having lambs starting from January on....

Plus we just got a March Finn ram to go with the March Finn ewes we got, too. I plan on breeding him to my Shetlands as well. They are older, and I believe they have had a heat cycle already, but Finneas the Finn isn't quite ready yet. They are together now and they haven't shown any interest in anything yet. The Finns are supposed to be young breeders I believe. We are going to be lambing machines in 2013! 

Then I think once the lambing starts, we will be keeping the ewes separate from the rams for a while.

I can't wait to see your adorable Jacob babies in the spring!


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## Roving Jacobs (Oct 4, 2012)

My Jacobs are cycling already (but I'm not breeding until Nov.) and ram lambs certainly know what they are doing. If you haven't separated them yet I wouldn't be surprised if they are bred already but it's hard to tell until they start coming in to season again (or not). A marking harness would help with that. Some rams are "shy" and only breed at night or early morning. Plus it only takes a second and its easy to miss. Breeding your ewe lamb is up to you. I've had ewes lamb at 12-14 months and do just fine but I prefer to wait to breed them their second winter. I've found yearling ewes just have a little more trouble and still have a silly teen brain until that second year and I don't want to deal with it.

Before I had more boys I ran my ram with the ewes until their lambs were ready to wean in the summer. He is very good with the lambs and his ladies but he would shove them out of the way to hog food. You'll have to watch your boy because they can hurt lambs and butting ewes can cause miscarriages. I tried briefly to keep my separated alone and he was miserable, aggressive, and busted down any door or wall he came across. Rams really, really need company. I've never had one leap a fence, even the Jacobs who are known for leaping, but they will plow right through them if they can to get to other sheep.

There are going to be so many spotty babies on this forum this spring!


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## dwbonfire (Oct 4, 2012)

hmm.. well i will make his pen and seperate and see if i can notice any sign of the girls cycling again. darn, hope he was too shy this cycle  but i guess i will know once/if i start seeing udders. sheep are like goats, 5 months 2 weeks right?
i have read about the dystocia (not sure i spelled that right) so thats my main concern about the ewe lamb being bred yet. but again, i know many people would breed her too. well again, i am hoping shes not bred quite yet so i can get her closer to the 14 month mark for her to lamb, but will just keep a close eye on her. has anyone dealt with the ewe lambs having trouble like that, and if so could you share your story and advice? id just like to prepare for the possibility of trouble so i have things i might need (i know its 5 months off lol)


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## EllieMay (Oct 5, 2012)

I'm in the same boat as yourself.
I have March-born ewes and ram that I will be breeding this December.
My ram is kept in the pasture right next to the ewes (separated by woven-wire field fencing) and he has two LGDs as companions.
I'm assuming my ram will know what to do with the gals once he's let in cuz he's been practicing on my poor dogs.  :/


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## dwbonfire (Oct 5, 2012)

well this is still a very informative thread, but i did want to update that my ram died today.  i have another thread going about it.. but now i guess i do hope my gals are bred even if it was a little earlier than i wanted, because who knows when i will find/afford another beautiful ram like he was.. we will find out in a few months..


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