# Mastiff-hound mix



## Amanda Normie (Jun 28, 2018)

I have the option of getting mastiff/hound puppy mix dogs for free. I am also in need of a couple of LGD dogs. Free is worth saving up for! BUT would they make good LGD dogs? I have goats, chickens, & ducks and will be adding cows this year or next. I have 2 acres fenced in, 6ft tall fence. So what do you all think would a mastiff/hound mix make a great LGD? Does anyone else have a mix like this?


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## BoboFarm (Jun 28, 2018)

What kind of mastiff? You might get some guarding instinct from the mastiff part of the pup but I wouldn't get my hopes up. If someone is giving away pups then I certainly would question the working ability that these pups will have inherited from their parents. I personally wouldn't trust any kind of hound near livestock.


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## Southern by choice (Jun 28, 2018)

No they are not livestock guardian breeds. Period. 

They may make a good farm dog but a LGD they will not be.  

The hound would be most concerning.   What kind of mastiff? What kind of hound?


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## Donna R. Raybon (Jun 28, 2018)

I am very, very, very poor $$$ wise.  But, the money I have spent on LGD is the best money I ever spent for the peace of mind it gives me.  Stick with over ten thousand years selective breeding of dogs that have been bred to do one thing- bond with and protect with their own lives your livestock.  

Crossbreds among the LGD breeds are fine.  One of best dogs I have had was a quarter Komondor, a quarter Anatolian, and half GP.  The one I have now is half Anatolian and half GP.  

Pure GP is great, too, just make sure hips, lips, hearing, eyes are OK.  The long hair is a chore to keep mat free.  I bred GP for years and loved them dearly, but the hair was sometimes a drawback.  

Hounds have been bred to be of two types- sight hunters or scent hunters.  Neither instinct is good to have around stock.  Especially the sight hunter.  For example the Border Collie gets it keen ability 'eye' to  herd from infusion of sight hound into the mix.


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## Amanda Normie (Jun 28, 2018)

Thanks everyone! this was one of my concerns was the hound in it. they also come from house parents, so not even any kind of working dog. They are couch potatoes, so this was another concern. Also based on feed costs, hubby and I will probably go with Lhama's instead of dogs, for now anyways.


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## Donna R. Raybon (Jun 28, 2018)

If you have any serious predator problems bigger than raccoon, llama won't do.  Also, if it very sunny, hot, they will overheat.  I raised LGD for years back when llama were tens of thousands of dollars.  The breeders were suffering loss due to dogs and coyotes and I sold about half my puppies to protect their high dollar llamas.


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## jhoeck (Jun 28, 2018)

I would be cautious, even as "just" a farm dog.
Last year, we tried getting a puppy who was an "Idaho shag" which is an Aierdale/border collie cross. They are used as farm dogs in Idaho for herding and whatnot. We thought she would be a good fit, not for guarding, but for general patrolling and helping herd a bit. Well, we couldn't get passed the terrier side of things. She LOVED chasing our birds and dug holes all over. I have a lot of experience training animals and she wouldn't give it up. She was also extremely sensitive. Twice in a week-span she got stung by a bee on her paw and I thought she was dying at first she was so distraught. It took me a long time to restrain her so I could even see what was wrong. She needed constant watching (which is hard when you have to duck in to gather eggs or check on the rabbits...) and was a lot more effort than herding or patrolling the place ourselves. One redeeming quality she had though was excellent recall (unless she was chasing a bird...)

She also ended up having skin issues which transferred to our other dogs...She was only $100 but getting her was one of the only things I have regretting doing. After her skin condition was fixed, we rehomed her to a non-farm home and last I heard, she fit in well.

After several months of indecision, we got a Great Pyrenees puppy recently. We are training him to be an LGD for our goats and deter predators from the birds. He cost more but it was worth it and, if he grows up into a good guard, will be worth more money than we have in the bank (which isn't much but you know what I mean!)


Hope that helps and good luck!


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## BrendaMNgri (Jun 28, 2018)

Amanda Normie said:


> I have the option of getting mastiff/hound puppy mix dogs for free. I am also in need of a couple of LGD dogs. Free is worth saving up for! BUT would they make good LGD dogs? I have goats, chickens, & ducks and will be adding cows this year or next. I have 2 acres fenced in, 6ft tall fence. So what do you all think would a mastiff/hound mix make a great LGD? Does anyone else have a mix like this?



I am relieved you rethought this and are not getting the dog. 2 acres would be pushing it in terms of keeping an LGD content.

If you cannot afford to feed a dog, you must be honest with yourself, and if money is tight, don't over extend yourself. 
This also means reining in buying lots more livestock until you can perhaps (?) bolster fences if needed (and maybe it's not) or look into other practical, cost effective predator control and deterrents. Dogs are not always the answer because they require much more work, time and effort on the owner's part. LGDs have become a huge fad to where everyone thinks they "have to have one" when really that is not the case at all.

Good fencing (again, sounds like you have) and good attentive shepherding combined are often enough to stave off problems. 
Llamas can work well if there are not bear or wolves or aggressive packs of feral dogs or coyotes so I would not discourage you from pursuing that.

Again, take a step back from this and take a deep breath and don't make impulse buys you will regret later. Don't buy an LGD because you are being pressured to - buy one _only if you can commit to what it takes to own and raise and operate one._
Think for the long term. Don't binge buy anything - stock or LGDs or llamas. Ask your neighbors - what do they do? Do they lose stock? What predators if any are around, etc. etc. Think on this. What works for me and others here may not be your answer, and that is OK!

Prudent discernment is 99% of being a success in farming and ranching, and that means making sound, mature, practical, good choices and not buying "just because" it seems like everyone else is. Again, I am very happy you changed your mind. There are many other options out there and do your research. The right things will present themselves. PM me if you like.


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## goats&moregoats (Jun 29, 2018)

I glad that you re-thought this as well, but only due to the non-working parents and the mix of the pups. 
@BrendaMNgri , It's not the size of the land, but the predator load that keeps a LGD "content" I had four very "content" LGD's on less then 2 acres. I also had a few packs of coyotes that kept them quite busy protecting the 13 goats, 2 sheep and about 30 chickens I had. The two older LGD's also taught the younger ones to ward of the hawks.


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## Southern by choice (Jun 29, 2018)

goats&moregoats said:


> I glad that you re-thought this as well, but only due to the non-working parents and the mix of the pups.
> @BrendaMNgri , It's not the size of the land, but the predator load that keeps a LGD "content" I had four very "content" LGD's on less then 2 acres. I also had a few packs of coyotes that kept them quite busy protecting the 13 goats, 2 sheep and about 30 chickens I had. The two older LGD's also taught the younger ones to ward of the hawks.



 I agree. I think that is also why those that breed need to be able to evaluate their dogs so they may be placed properly.


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## BrendaMNgri (Jun 29, 2018)

@goats&moregoats I agree with you as far as keeping LGDs content they do need the work, and something to protect their charges from - no matter what it is, obnoxious jerks driving by on ATV's, wolves, coyotes, or (fill in the blank). And it helps for their owner to be around so they know they have back up and the owner is invested in what they are doing for them - but there is a saying: "Don't try to keep a 1000 acre dog happy on 10 acres." It's why I don't have my Kangals anymore. They were much too stifled here, and that was with considerable predator pressure, stray dogs, neighborhood jerks and much more work and livestock than I have now. They were always looking out my fences 5 miles down the road... They came off a 100 +acre ranch in MT. That contributed to their discontent. I've found my larger heavier breed LGDs stay content on my smaller acreage. @Southern by choice good point - and the hound/mastiff breeder probably wasn't very worried about where the free pups were going!


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## goatboy1973 (Jul 4, 2018)

Amanda Normie said:


> I have the option of getting mastiff/hound puppy mix dogs for free. I am also in need of a couple of LGD dogs. Free is worth saving up for! BUT would they make good LGD dogs? I have goats, chickens, & ducks and will be adding cows this year or next. I have 2 acres fenced in, 6ft tall fence. So what do you all think would a mastiff/hound mix make a great LGD? Does anyone else have a mix like this?


I would not use a Mastiff/ hound mix for a livestock guardian dog. You are just asking for trouble and waiting on disaster. A guardian animal is not a place to cut corners whatsoever. You can cut corners with any other aspect of  livestock, but not when it comes to the safety of your livestock. You owe it to them to keep them safe.


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## Ridgetop (Jul 4, 2018)

BrendaMNgri said:


> 2 acres would be pushing it in terms of keeping an LGD content.



I agree with everything except that 2 acres would not be enough acreage to keep an LGD content.  We started with 1 1/2 acres and had 2 LGDs just to take care of neighborhood stray dog attacks.  Then the coyotes started.  Now we have 5 fenced acres and are getting our 3rd LGD because the topography of our property, and the impact of the fires last January, have driven more predators in.  5 coyote packs in place of 1 or 2.  Loss of a lamb at night with both Anatolians working non stop.  I heard them working all night, and the coyotes drawing them from side to side of the property.  It depends on your layout and whether you have had any losses as to whether you need an LGD or not.

That said, cross-breds are only ok for livestock guardian work *if* they are *LGD breed crosses*, and even then I would want to know a lot more about their parents.  Just because one parent is an LGD doesn't mean that the other genetic half will not be present or any good. 

So genetically here is what to expect from these dogs:
*Hounds*, whether scent or sight, were  bred for over 1000 years to hunt and PULL DOWN game.  They still have this instinct very strong in their DNA.  Yes they can be couch potatoes with the family, but show them some game and they will be off.  Hounds are one of the harder breeds to obedience train too.  Good luck calling them back once they start chasing one of your sheep or goats.

*Mastiffs* are not LGDs.  They were bred for 1000 to protect large estates from intruders.  Some of the earliest ones were bred and trained as war dogs to attack the other troops.  While they have been bred to be less ferocious over the  years, there are lines that are still aggressive.  Also, they will give more size to the hound that will be chasing your sheep or goats.

OK, the owners want to place the pups in a good home.  Too bad they didn't ether spay, neuter, or isolate their bitch instead of letting her get bred.  Avoid this cross like the plague and save yourself heartache, aggravation, and expense.

By the way Happy 4th everyone!


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## Ridgetop (Jul 4, 2018)

BYW, we have also arranged for the breeder to get our dogs back for placement to good working homes if anything happens to us.  DS said he would take the dogs but since he might not stay here and keep livestock, I told him that he could keep the oldest dog if it was over 12 but younger dogs needed to go to working families.  Just a suggestion about making arrangements for your LGDs.


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## BrendaMNgri (Jul 4, 2018)

goatboy1973 said:


> I would not use a Mastiff/ hound mix for a livestock guardian dog. You are just asking for trouble and waiting on disaster. A guardian animal is not a place to cut corners whatsoever. You can cut corners with any other aspect of  livestock, but not when it comes to the safety of your livestock. You owe it to them to keep them safe.


 Wish more people had your mindset, @goatboy1973 unfortunately trying to make LGDs out of non-bonafide LGD breeds has become a national pastime  with hobby farmers and God save you if you try to argue with them over that, right?  

That and fad-based, "sport" breeding LGDs - binge breeding. Like I've said before, just because you CAN, does not mean you SHOULD. I got a call the other night from some lady I don' know in Ohio begging me for help. It's Monday night 6pm her time, her poor Maremma bitch had one pup at noon that day, but her water broke on Saturday night (she didn't know what that meant, she also didn't know what "teats" were on a dog - God save me...), she probably has a dead pup stuck in the birth canal or - fill in the blanks - and she goes on to say the bitch has stopped having contractions, and gee, what should she do....she has her in a scalding hot barn....I bit my tongue off managed to remain civil (amazing for me, right?) and not chew her a** out and told her get that dog into her vet first thing Tuesday AM. She said she'd call me back. Of course she didn't.  She has no business breeding LGDs. What irresponsible uncaring animal husbandry!  @Ridgetop happy Fourth to you too. Hope you are staying fire-free and cool.


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