# First dead litter..advice?



## zachbelle (Mar 19, 2015)

My new Zealand white kindled her second litter last night it was quite windy and cold but she had a beautiful nest with a ton of fur she had pulled the last few days then had pulled a ton more the cover them with. When I put my hand on top of the nest there was no movement so I took them out they were cold I brought them in and tried to warm them with no luck they were already dead when I found them which I suspected but of course I tried anyway. At the bottom of the nest was a placenta she must of missed which was frozen solid so I assume this acted as an ice cube that chilled the whole litter, my question is (being the first time I've lost a litter) what should I expect from the doe at this point..I'm not sure if she knew they were dead when I took them, when I checked her this afternoon she had neatly placed all the fur I had moved to get the kits back into the nest. I guess I'm just worried about her grieving. Also when would it be safe to re breed her?


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## zachbelle (Mar 19, 2015)

Oh I forgot to mention two of the four looked to have full bellies as the other two didn't look like they had full bellies so it's possible two were dead on arrival I'm not sure on that.


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## Hens and Roos (Mar 19, 2015)

Sorry to hear it's hard to say what might have lead to the loss- could have been a combination of what you mentioned.  If she has a nest box- I would remove it so she knows that the babies are gone.  She may grieve- we have had does who lost a litter and you could tell that they knew.

I would give her a week or so and see how it goes before rebreeding her- gives her some time to heal.

Good luck and keep us posted!


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## zachbelle (Mar 19, 2015)

Thank you for the info. It will be atleast two weeks til we re breed because we are moving and I don't want to breed before moving but I didn't know if that would be too soon. I'm in no hurry will do what's best for her.


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## animalmom (Mar 19, 2015)

I am sorry to hear of your loss.  You mentioned that this was her second litter.  Was she successful with the first litter?  How many were in the first litter and how many were in her second litter?  Reason I ask is to see if this was just a combination of bad events (cold, windy) or if there might be something else going on.

If you think the doe is healthy, was successful the first time, then certainly rebreed once you are settled in your new place.  Sometimes bad things happen.  Good luck with your doe and keep us posted.  Looking forward to a lovely success story the next time!

Oh, do take the nest box out.


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## zachbelle (Mar 19, 2015)

Yes sorry her first litter was successful she had 7 and was a great mom we didn't loose one this back in October I didn't breed all winter cause it has been a very hard cold winter here and I was figuring by mid March weather would be better which some days it has just happens the night she kindled we had very very strong winds and cold


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## animalmom (Mar 19, 2015)

Good to hear!  Sounds like it was just an unfortunate fluke for your girl.

Good luck with your move.  I hate moving, packing, unpacking, figuring out where to put things in the new place.  Sigh.


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## zachbelle (Mar 19, 2015)

I hear ya there!! I hate the process too but the huge barn at our new place will be worth it  thanks for replying!


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## animalmom (Mar 19, 2015)

OHHHHH a huge barn!  Something to drool for!


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## zachbelle (Mar 19, 2015)

Oh the possibilities. .


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## zachbelle (Mar 20, 2015)

Ok so...went out this morning five more babies on the wire frozen...of course I took nesting material out figures...is this normal??? Only thing I can think is she had four babies in one horn and five in the other kindling two separate nights?


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## Hens and Roos (Mar 20, 2015)

not sure how long labor lasts for rabbits.  I guess that could be possible- how many times was she bred(like on one day and then again the next)?  Did both groups look fully formed?  Sorry that you lost this group too


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## zachbelle (Mar 20, 2015)

They were all fully formed yes and only bred on one day. I know i didn't miss 5 babies yesterday so not sure what's happened but she is now frantic since i took the second half of the litter out and trying to rebuild her nest i feel terrible for her and even was tempted to foster a couple from the doe i had Kindle last night but i don't dare to with the cold weather and I'm afraid she would reject them at this point. I just feel bad for her


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## Hens and Roos (Mar 20, 2015)

I am really not sure, I would watch her for a few days going forward and then see about rebreeding her.


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## GLENMAR (Mar 20, 2015)

I just lost a litter too. She was a new mom and pulled the hay out if the box chilling the babies. I also had another litter where I lost a few because the would stay latched on and get pulled out of the box and get chilled. At least when I rebreed those does, it will be warmer at night. I hate loosing them to cold. I check on them several times a day, and sometimes it is not enough.


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## Bunnylady (Mar 21, 2015)

Unless there is some particular reason not to (as in your case, the move), when a doe loses a litter, I usually give the doe a couple of days to recover, then re-breed her. Rabbits don't "go into heat" like a lot of animals do, but they do experience hormonal peaks and valleys. One of the highest peaks a doe will ever experience comes right after kindling. Given the chance, a lot of does will re-breed immediately after kindling, and the result may be one of the biggest litters the doe will ever produce. The two week interval may work out, or it may not; it will probably coincide with a dip in hormone levels, and even if the doe does rebreed, the ripened eggs are two weeks old at that point, and less likely to be still viable. The doe may refuse to breed, she may breed and produce nothing, or the litter size may simply be small. In any case, you will want to check her vulva color before you put her in with the buck - that should give you a good indication of what your results are likely to be.


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## zachbelle (Mar 26, 2015)

Thank you for that I have never heard anything about checking the vulva, what would I be looking for in color? She is a great mom and was obviously distressed over loosing her kits but has seems to have finally calmed down now.


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## JakeM (Mar 29, 2015)

Her vulva should be red in color with red/purple as being pretty much the best time. If it is pale, then I wouldn't even try.


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## samssimonsays (Mar 31, 2015)

I am so sorry for your loss. it is very likely they chilled regardless of the placenta. sometimes it just gets too cold. She may grieve for them but I was recommended to breed a doe back within 24-48 hours after losing a litter. You would be surprised how the hormones of a new pregnancy will stop the grieving. I had a doe lose all of her babies but one at 6 weeks old and she went so over the edge that she almost killed the last baby trying to find the others. She would search and search for them. I bred her finally after a week of her getting worse and worse and within two days she was fine again. Each rabbit will take it differently but if she is having a hard time with the loss breed her back and she should snap put of it.


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