# Help - baby kid too young to bring home?  We are so worried...



## gigiintheforest (May 25, 2012)

We just picked up our young pygmy goats from the breeder.  The youngest is seven weeks and was still nursing but the breeder sent him with us because she said he was ready to wean.  He's VERY tiny and when we got him home he has yogurt-consistency diarrhea and is barely eating.  I managed to give him 4 cc's of electrolytes and some probios.  He's drinking a little water.  What should we do?  The breeder lives an hour away but we can certainly drive back if he still needs to nurse.  We don't want him to get worse..


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## CochinBrahmaLover=) (May 25, 2012)

I would say he needs to nurse... Sounds like he was from triplets, and got the short end of the straw.


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## DonnaBelle (May 25, 2012)

Yes, I'd say he needs to nurse.  Call the "breeder" you got him from, tell them his condition.  See if she has any bottle feeding supplies.  Like a bottle (or you can use a plastic coke bottle that a nipple will fit on) and some nipples.  If she does, drive over, get some goat milk from her and start feeding him about 4-5 ounces at a time.  This is if she won't let you bring him back to stay for a couple more weeks and nurse from MOM.  Baby goats need milk until they are 3 months old to develop properly.  Yes, supposedy you can wean them at 8 weeks, but I don't think you get good growth doing that.  Just my personal opinion.

If you can get a gallon of goat milk, great.  You can feed him goat milk for a couple of days, then buy whole cows milk, and start mixing it 1 part cow milk to 3 parts goat milk for 2 days, then 2 parts cow milk 2 parts goat milk for 2 days, then 3 parts cow milk, one part goats milk until you have him on whole cows milk.  He needs about 10 to 16 oz of milk 3 times a day until he's about 9 weeks old, then cut him back to two times a day, morning and evening.

Put out a little goat feed for him to nibble along with some hay.

He needs Probios.  Give him that 2 times a day, about 5 ccs. Comes in white tube, blue lettering, it's probotics for animals.

Good luck, let us know if you can get him stablized.

Ask the breeder if he's had CD & T shots.  He will need that too.  

DonnaBelle


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## gigiintheforest (May 25, 2012)

Yes, I think you are right.  I gave him probios and electrolytes in a bit of water.  I tried to give him a bottle with whole milk - couldn't find goats milk on this short notice but he won't nurse.  We'll take him back to the 'breeder' first thing.




			
				DonnaBelle said:
			
		

> Yes, I'd say he needs to nurse.  Call the "breeder" you got him from, tell them his condition.  See if she has any bottle feeding supplies.  Like a bottle (or you can use a plastic coke bottle that a nipple will fit on) and some nipples.  If she does, drive over, get some goat milk from her and start feeding him about 4-5 ounces at a time.  This is if she won't let you bring him back to stay for a couple more weeks and nurse from MOM.  Baby goats need milk until they are 3 months old to develop properly.  Yes, supposedy you can wean them at 8 weeks, but I don't think you get good growth doing that.  Just my personal opinion.
> 
> If you can get a gallon of goat milk, great.  You can feed him goat milk for a couple of days, then buy whole cows milk, and start mixing it 1 part cow milk to 3 parts goat milk for 2 days, then 2 parts cow milk 2 parts goat milk for 2 days, then 3 parts cow milk, one part goats milk until you have him on whole cows milk.  He needs about 10 to 16 oz of milk 3 times a day until he's about 9 weeks old, then cut him back to two times a day, morning and evening.
> 
> ...


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## Straw Hat Kikos (May 25, 2012)

What color is the diarrhea? I saw someone on here say their goat had green diarrhea, was it yours?


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## lunaflora (May 25, 2012)

I would treat him for coccidia ASAP -- very common problem with the stress of weaning, and probably the most common cause of diarrhea in kids. I treat for coccidia in kids at weaning time even if I don't see symptoms. Coccidia can be asymptomatic and still wreck their digestive systems for years down the line. I used Dimethoxx, also called Albon. Be careful of Corid, I know some people who've had major problems using it with goats, though it does seem to be the most common coccidiostat sold in feed stores. And has he been wormed? Definitely worm him if not. That can also cause diarrhea. I use Valbazen for kids. I always worm and treat for coccidia at weaning. It's just a hard time for their little immune systems. 

Also, I would not give up on getting him on the bottle. It takes time and patience and persistence. Are you warming the milk to 101 degrees? Some kids are VERY picky about temperature. Test it on the inside of your wrist and it should feel warm like a comfortable hot bath, but not burn your skin at all. Expect to have to force the nipple in their mouth the first (maybe first many) times. Tilt his head up while he's got the nipple in his mouth, make sucking sounds, gently move the nipple in and out of his mouth....I have coaxed a lot of resistant babies to take a bottle, including one right now that was dam raised but didn't do well when I sold his mom when he was 8 weeks. I give him two bottles a day still, and he never touched one until he was 8 weeks old. So it can be done. 

Honestly, doesn't sound like he was getting the greatest of care at the breeder, so I would try to take care of him yourself if you can.

Shosha
Chapel Hill, NC


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## lunaflora (May 25, 2012)

Also, when you said "whole milk" did you mean whole cow's milk? Goat kids can do fine on cow milk but you have GOT to transition him slowly. You really have to find some goat's milk. Most grocery stores have it now. It's expensive, but you could really shock a weak kid's system by giving him straight cow's milk if he's used to goat milk. 

Good luck!


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## Goatherd (May 25, 2012)

Personally, I would take him back and tell the breeder that you will pick him up when he's 10 weeks old.


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## elevan (May 25, 2012)

I agree.  If the breeder did nothing to begin and finish weaning and just yanked the kid I would take it back and tell them that you'll come back in a couple of weeks when the kid is properly weaned.


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## Roll farms (May 25, 2012)

Sounds like it could also either have bacterial scours or coccidiosis.....Tell him you'll pick him up when his poops' solid and he's properly weaned.

Sorry for the scary / worrisome experience.....


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## daisyjack (May 26, 2012)

gigiintheforest 
I am in the same boat as you. I just brought home a 6 week old. I got her on a bottle but now she is scouring because of the switch. They are not like dogs thats for sure.  I havent slept in days. My real kids are attention deprived. You are probably thinking what have I gotten into because I sure am. I am praying that both our gaots will be happy and health with no poopy butts.


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## gigiintheforest (May 26, 2012)

I wondered about coccidia.  I will treat him first thing with Dimethox this am as well as find goat's milk. Can you find Dimethox at Atwoods or Tractor Supply? We talked to the breeder and she is willing to have us  bring him back so he can nurse two more weeks.  I'm almost hesitant to take him back there as he's definitely not in the best of shape.  And I do agree about the breeder.  Her goats look great on their website but when we picked them up I was not pleased with their coat condition, etc.  That being said, we did also get a two year old bred doe who looks in very good shape so I just don't know.  Maybe this baby just somehow got the short end of things...  I don't know whether to take him back or to try to get him to nurse.  He''s really, really tiny - maybe the size of a full grown chihauha. ((sp?)




			
				lunaflora said:
			
		

> I would treat him for coccidia ASAP -- very common problem with the stress of weaning, and probably the most common cause of diarrhea in kids. I treat for coccidia in kids at weaning time even if I don't see symptoms. Coccidia can be asymptomatic and still wreck their digestive systems for years down the line. I used Dimethoxx, also called Albon. Be careful of Corid, I know some people who've had major problems using it with goats, though it does seem to be the most common coccidiostat sold in feed stores. And has he been wormed? Definitely worm him if not. That can also cause diarrhea. I use Valbazen for kids. I always worm and treat for coccidia at weaning. It's just a hard time for their little immune systems.
> 
> Also, I would not give up on getting him on the bottle. It takes time and patience and persistence. Are you warming the milk to 101 degrees? Some kids are VERY picky about temperature. Test it on the inside of your wrist and it should feel warm like a comfortable hot bath, but not burn your skin at all. Expect to have to force the nipple in their mouth the first (maybe first many) times. Tilt his head up while he's got the nipple in his mouth, make sucking sounds, gently move the nipple in and out of his mouth....I have coaxed a lot of resistant babies to take a bottle, including one right now that was dam raised but didn't do well when I sold his mom when he was 8 weeks. I give him two bottles a day still, and he never touched one until he was 8 weeks old. So it can be done.
> 
> ...


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## gigiintheforest (May 26, 2012)

I'm so sorry you are having this problem also.  I and my husband have been so worried.  We are running out to the barn constantly which I'm sure is not helpful with stressing the goats.  Just keeping our fingers crossed and doing whatever we can to help this baby.  



			
				daisyjack said:
			
		

> gigiintheforest
> I am in the same boat as you. I just brought home a 6 week old. I got her on a bottle but now she is scouring because of the switch. They are not like dogs thats for sure.  I havent slept in days. My real kids are attention deprived. You are probably thinking what have I gotten into because I sure am. I am praying that both our gaots will be happy and health with no poopy butts.


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## gigiintheforest (May 26, 2012)

Yes, it was cow's milk but he didn't take any so I think that part's okay.  This morning I'll run into town and find goat's milk.  To top things off, he's covered with lice poor baby.  So need to treat for that also but didn't want to shock his system anymore than needed.  I'm so frustrated with both the breeder and with us for not noticing these things when we picked him up.  We got four pygmys from this breeder and were so involved with getting them loaded, etc. that I didn't pay the attention to details that I should have.  



			
				lunaflora said:
			
		

> Also, when you said "whole milk" did you mean whole cow's milk? Goat kids can do fine on cow milk but you have GOT to transition him slowly. You really have to find some goat's milk. Most grocery stores have it now. It's expensive, but you could really shock a weak kid's system by giving him straight cow's milk if he's used to goat milk.
> 
> Good luck!


Y


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## gigiintheforest (May 26, 2012)

His diarrhea is brown.  No it wasn't me.



			
				Straw Hat Kikos said:
			
		

> What color is the diarrhea? I saw someone on here say their goat had green diarrhea, was it yours?


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## gigiintheforest (May 26, 2012)

Thanks for your help.  We are going to drive back this morning.  The breeder said she will keep him as long as we want.  I'm just hoping he's able to survive the stress.  We should have paid more attention when we picked the goats up today but we took her at her word.


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## Goatherd (May 26, 2012)

> We should have paid more attention when we picked the goats up today but we took her at her word.


You are doing the right thing by taking the baby back to the breeder (and I use that term loosely).  If there is one thing you should/will learn when you deal with animals, any animals, many people are less-than-honorable when it comes to breeding and selling.

All the best to you and little one.


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## elevan (May 26, 2012)

Goatherd said:
			
		

> > We should have paid more attention when we picked the goats up today but we took her at her word.
> 
> 
> You are doing the right thing by taking the baby back to the breeder (and I use that term loosely).  If there is one thing you should/will learn when you deal with animals, any animals, many people are less-than-honorable when it comes to breeding and selling.
> ...


x2

You've also learned some important questions to ask the next time you go pick up a new (baby) animal.


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## ThreeBoysChicks (May 26, 2012)

Very scary.  Hope it all works out and you are able to pick up a healthy happy baby in a few weeks.


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## redtailgal (May 26, 2012)

I hope that you told this breeder that when you return you'd like a fully weaned healthy baby with no runny poop and no lice.

Personally, I'd find a new breeder.  This person is questionable to say the least.


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## lunaflora (May 26, 2012)

I think the sad fact is that a lot of people who may actually take really good care of their own does (ie the pictures on the website, the bred doe in good condition) don't take the best care of their boy babies. To me, if you bring a life into the world you are responsible for caring for it, but I think for a lot of people the boy babies are just expendable. And sometimes all the babies they don't plan to keep are expendable (this was definitely the case at one of the dairies I worked at). 

It sounds like you are taking the baby back, but for future reference, I personally have never been able to find Dimethox at a feed store -- I've always had to order it online. I order the powder and mix it up at home (much cheaper shipping than buying the liquid). It probably depends on how many people have goats in your area as to what coccidiostats the local stores stock, though, so maybe you'll be luckier than me, but I generally just try to order it before kidding season to have on hand. Also, you can treat lice topically with  Diatomaceous Earth (from a garden store -- rub it into his fur, don't feed it to him), or kitten flea powder. Both are very gentle (DE is totally non-toxic, used in organic agriculture) and will get rid of the lice (at least the ones on him) without bothering him much. 

Poor little guy! Sorry you are having such a tough experience with him. Good luck with the others, and I hope this breeder takes good care of him until you see him again. 

Shosha
Chapel Hill, NC


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## gigiintheforest (May 26, 2012)

Well, the baby is back with his mama.  I completely agree with you regarding the breeder.  I do have to say that she was very agreeable and was going to take him to her vet so I hope it all works out.  Yes, unfortunately many more people want doelings rather bucks or wethers.  But there is a responsibility that everyone should recognize when they breed.  And we will be more savvy the next time.  Hopefully we will have these animals for many years to come.

I'm ordering the Dimethox so that I will have it on hand.  Our feed store and Atwoods did not carry it.  I do have DE so thanks for the tip on that.  I use it in my chicken coop with great results but hadn't thought to use it for lice on the goats.

Everyone else seems very healthy but I'm keeping a close eye on them.  Thank you, Sosha, and thanks to everyone on here who helped - you can't imagine how much I am grateful for your ideas - when you sitting up with a baby at 3:30 in the morning things can get a bit bleak.  I'm hoping baby guy comes back healthy and really weaned this time. (-;



			
				lunaflora said:
			
		

> I think the sad fact is that a lot of people who may actually take really good care of their own does (ie the pictures on the website, the bred doe in good condition) don't take the best care of their boy babies. To me, if you bring a life into the world you are responsible for caring for it, but I think for a lot of people the boy babies are just expendable. And sometimes all the babies they don't plan to keep are expendable (this was definitely the case at one of the dairies I worked at).
> 
> It sounds like you are taking the baby back, but for future reference, I personally have never been able to find Dimethox at a feed store -- I've always had to order it online. I order the powder and mix it up at home (much cheaper shipping than buying the liquid). It probably depends on how many people have goats in your area as to what coccidiostats the local stores stock, though, so maybe you'll be luckier than me, but I generally just try to order it before kidding season to have on hand. Also, you can treat lice topically with  Diatomaceous Earth (from a garden store -- rub it into his fur, don't feed it to him), or kitten flea powder. Both are very gentle (DE is totally non-toxic, used in organic agriculture) and will get rid of the lice (at least the ones on him) without bothering him much.
> 
> ...


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## lunaflora (May 26, 2012)

You're totally welcome! I cannot even tell you how many people have helped me out on forums like this. I had a goat get very very deathly sick when I was very new to keeping them, and without a doubt it was an assortment of random friendly strangers on the internet that saved her life. 

Best of luck to you.


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## elevan (May 26, 2012)




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## gigiintheforest (May 29, 2012)

We just talked to the breeder and the baby is doing very well.  We will pick him up in about three weeks when he is really weaned - Yay!  Here's a picture of his month older brother adjusting to our pasture.


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