# mites!.. nope, LICE! ew



## dwbonfire (Jan 26, 2012)

omgosh, yall must think i have some sickly animals and a dirty place cause suddenly i am posting all over about issues with all my animals! i have had such good luck with all my animals for years and all of a sudden i am having issue after issue.  i try my best to learn as much as possible and i take good care of them all and im just having a real wave of bad luck around here i guess.

i was taking pics of my doe because i wanted to post them and ask about her itchiness and her hair shedding out. i was seperating her hair to take pics and thats when i saw the creepy crawlies  im horrified!! how did she get mites?! she goes out in the yard with my calf and my ewe, but shes not friendly with them and they dont have real close contact. also she has her own stall cause she likes her space. so how do i treat mites on a pygmyX doe? and should i treat my calf and ewe (who dont show any symptoms so far)

i have recently been treating two dogs for mange, and i was affraid it was going to spread like wildfire thru all my animals because they all have some contact with eachother. as far as i know you cant see mange, so this must just be a seperate issue. i dont have a clue where she got mites, and is this also going to spread to the other animals?

thanks!


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## cmjust0 (Jan 26, 2012)

If they're creepy crawly and you can *see* them, it's almost certainly lice and not mites.  Mites burrow into the skin...all you ever really see of mites are the crusty, scaley, oozy damage they cause to the skin.  She may have that too, in which case she's got both mites and lice.

Meh. 

What I do for external creepy crawlies is inject Ivomec (or, preferably, some cheaper generic equivalent) at the label dose of 1ml/110lbs of body weight.  SubQ is fine.  If you're worried on account of everyone going GHA! NEVER INJECT IVOMEC OR YOU'LL CREATE RESISTANCE! then I'd go ahead and dose her orally as well, as you normally would.  

Injected ivermectin should take care of pretty much any creepy crawly she'll get.  Lice, mites, even ticks in the summer.


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## 20kidsonhill (Jan 26, 2012)

We inject ivomec. 2 cc per 100lbs is the dosage we are using for external parasites, but I don't use ivomec as a wormer.


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## dwbonfire (Jan 26, 2012)

ok thanks.. i did some reading and saw that dusting them with DE will work also? i know everyone has thier ways of doing things and ill always get different opinions, but im just wondering if that would actually be effective enough? ill strip out her stall and add new bedding and dust the stall with DE, so i figure if im going to buy it i might use it on her as well.. but if iver. is the best most effective thing to use ill go ahead with that too.


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## autumnprairie (Jan 26, 2012)

dwbonfire said:
			
		

> ok thanks.. i did some reading and saw that dusting them with DE will work also? i know everyone has thier ways of doing things and ill always get different opinions, but im just wondering if that would actually be effective enough? ill strip out her stall and add new bedding and dust the stall with DE, so i figure if im going to buy it i might use it on her as well.. but if iver. is the best most effective thing to use ill go ahead with that too.


I use the food grade not pool graden DE in my animals bedding it works you can also douse your house too, ants, fleas any hard  shell ecto-skeleton bug


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## 20kidsonhill (Jan 27, 2012)

There are lots of choices for lice,  powders such as the DE and Co-Ral,  sprays sold at your feed store and pour-ons such as ivermectin and cyclence. You have lots of options.   Lice are easier to get rid of than mites and more common problem than mites.


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## ksalvagno (Jan 27, 2012)

The DE is going to take a lot longer to get rid of the lice. If you have bad cases, then it really is better to go with something else. Use the DE after you get rid of them to try and keep them away. 2011 was a bad year for a lot of things and it seems to be continuing.


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## dwbonfire (Jan 28, 2012)

hmm ok, well i got some DE and dusted the heck out of her, she looked like an antique goat afterwards  i dusted her stall too, i figured i would strip it out tomorrow and dust the new shavings as well. how long until i dust her again? and can you use too much on them? i hope not...

i looked at TSC at the ivermectin cattle pour-on. is that what i'd use? how do i use it? its cheaper than ivermectin injectable and i dont have any trouble giving shots, but i've been told ivermectin stings pretty bad when injected so i feel like if i can go the cheaper pour-on route i'd rather. just need to know where to pour it on and how much how often.


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## that's*satyrical (Jan 28, 2012)

Tea Tree oil also works if you're looking for natural. Cleared up my son's in a heartbeat when he brought the creepies home from school. Of course that is a larger area to cover & it could get expensive going that route... You could mix some with water in a sprayer & spray the rest of the herd that's near her down well & it will repel them so they don't jump off her onto the others when you treat her.


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## elevan (Jan 28, 2012)

dwbonfire said:
			
		

> hmm ok, well i got some DE and dusted the heck out of her, she looked like an antique goat afterwards  i dusted her stall too, i figured i would strip it out tomorrow and dust the new shavings as well. how long until i dust her again? and can you use too much on them? i hope not...
> 
> i looked at TSC at the ivermectin cattle pour-on. is that what i'd use? how do i use it? its cheaper than ivermectin injectable and i dont have any trouble giving shots, but i've been told ivermectin stings pretty bad when injected so i feel like if i can go the cheaper pour-on route i'd rather. just need to know where to pour it on and how much how often.


You don't want to use a pour on as a pour on for goats as they're more sensitive.  But you can use it orally.

I don't have much faith in DE for parasites (yes, I've tried it).  

I like Python dust and ivermectin (and I too inject for external creepy crawlies).  Injecting ivermectin does cause a "reaction" but I've never lost a goat due to an Ivomec injection.


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## dwbonfire (Jan 29, 2012)

elevan said:
			
		

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if i went the route of the pour-on and used it orally, how much would i use? i am bad at estimating weight, but shes probably 40 lbs? dont know if you remember seeing the pics of her in one of my threads.. i think the pour on cattle iver. said 5mg per 1 ml? could i use that and sprinkle the python dust on her and the others (as prev.) or would that be too much stuff at one time? cause i dusted her in DE yesterday.
ETA: shes going to be in heat soon, like a matter of a day or two im guessing. should i hold of having  her bred since she'll have these chemicals in her system?


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## elevan (Jan 29, 2012)

dwbonfire said:
			
		

> elevan said:
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Ivermectin and Python dust are both safe for breeding and pregnant goats.

You could give the pour on orally at a rate of 1 ml / 22 pounds.  If you think she weighs 40# just go ahead and give 2 ml.

I just dealt with a lice issue with Daisy and her twins.  I used ivermectin and Python dust.  They're fine to use together.  Just repeat in 14 days.


eta:  Don't worry about having dusted with DE yesterday.  It's not a chemical.  Another concern that I have with DE is that the dust can cause respiratory problems if you over do it.


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## cmjust0 (Jan 30, 2012)

Ivermectin given orally in goats is very poorly absorbed by the bloodstream.  If you want to be sure to kill external parasites, it *must* be in the bloodstream.  Therefore, oral ivermectin for external parasites isn't the best option.  And I especially don't recommend giving pour-ons orally, since they contain petrochemicals that aid their absorption into the skin.  

So, in a nutshell, giving a goat pour-on ivermectin orally for lice is probably the worst possible option to pursue.

If you want a pour-on for lice, use CyLence, and use it as a pour-on...put it right on their skin.  I usually dose at a rate of around 1ml/25lbs, IIRC.  CyLence won't kill mites, but it does a bang up job on lice.


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## aggieterpkatie (Jan 30, 2012)

Last year I had a doe with lice, and I treated with DE.  Worked like a charm!  I treated her once, then again about 7 days later, and no lice to be seen.  I also just treated both goats with DE the other day, just as a preventative.


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## cmjust0 (Jan 30, 2012)

I always think about it like this...if I was suffering with _______, would I "try" homeopathic/organic/'green' treatment using _________ first and see what happened, or would I go straight to modern medicine?

When it comes to lice...uh, yeah...I don't think I'd mess around with it for long if they were crawlin' around on MY head!..  Gimme something that burns my scalp, stings my eyes, and makes it difficult to breathe..  (That's how ya know it's working!.. )  Just saying, I wouldn't want to be the goat that has be miserable with lice until my owner had sufficiently proved to themselves that DE either works, or doesn't.....and most of the experiences I've seen recounted say it *doesn't*..  

Not saying it never, ever works, of course...just saying what I've read makes it seem somewhat less than promising as an alternative to modern chemistry.


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## aggieterpkatie (Jan 30, 2012)

cmjust0 said:
			
		

> I always think about it like this...if I was suffering with _______, would I "try" homeopathic/organic/'green' treatment using _________ first and see what happened, or would I go straight to modern medicine?
> 
> When it comes to lice...uh, yeah...I don't think I'd mess around with it for long if they were crawlin' around on MY head!..  Gimme something that burns my scalp, stings my eyes, and makes it difficult to breathe..  (That's how ya know it's working!.. )  Just saying, I wouldn't want to be the goat that has be miserable with lice until my owner had sufficiently proved to themselves that DE either works, or doesn't.....and most of the experiences I've seen recounted say it *doesn't*..
> 
> Not saying it never, ever works, of course...just saying what I've read makes it seem somewhat less than promising as an alternative to modern chemistry.


Well, don't people normally wait until they're really sick before going to the doc?  Most people don't rush to the doc and demand meds as soon as they start sniffling.     And if this was human head lice, I would go straight for the Rid-X.  Since this was my dairy goat (and we drink the milk) I wanted to try DE first, because then there would be no milk w/d, and she wouldn't have to deal w/ a toxic substance unless it was absolutely necessary.  I never saw her itch, I just noticed I had one on my hand after I milked.  If she got the the point where she was bald and itching constantly, I may have considered doing something stronger.  

And, here's firsthand experience telling you it works!


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## dwbonfire (Jan 30, 2012)

well i checked her out today and only saw a couple lice still moving i *think*. sometimes my eyes play tricks on me and she wouldnt stay still long enough to get a good still look at her skin. so i think the DE definetly helped, just might need another dose. however, the resporitory concern seems to be valid because today shes doing some kind of snorting. i dont know if this is normal when they are in heat (because she is, and shes with the buck now and she keeps walking into him and making little snort noises) or if its from breathing in the DE :/
ETA: im going to get some python dust tonight and try that as well. want them gone!!


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## Bugg (Jan 31, 2012)

We have show steers and heifers... They have lice after being at a show.... I have dusted with seven dust but it
doesn't seem to be working. We use pour on Ivermictin (how ever you spell it), I guess it has to be wearing off..
Any suggestions?  
Also we have use seven dust on our show lambs and goats before, never had lice again... Just seems we cant get it off our bigger animals..


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## SassyKat6181 (Feb 4, 2012)

I have been having a problem with lice on my chickens.  I have been using DE for 18 months now, and it seems to be a good preventative, but not a cure once you have a problem.  The Ivomec Pour-on will NOT work on lice, as lice do not bite.  It will work on worms and mites, but not lice.  I used the Livestock Dust that is sold at TSC, but this only worked short term.  I just dusted them with Sevin a few days ago, so we'll see how this goes.  I tried to go the "natural" route and have slowly worked my way up to chemicals.  I think my girls would have been better off to go the chemical route from the beginning, as much as I hate to admit it.  Would have helped their health sooner and would have been less work for me.


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