# Getting discouraged...



## nstone630 (Feb 10, 2014)

So, I've been trying to raise meat rabbits for about a year now. And I've only had 2 successful litters so far. and several failed litters. I just don't know what I'm doing wrong.

Others that have started that I know are thriving with this...But I can't seen to get anything right. We have researched and researched til my eyes bleed to make sure we are doing all we can..

ANY tips would be greatly appreciated.


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## Bunnylady (Feb 10, 2014)

I remember a guy at a rabbit show saying, "I bought two rabbits on such-and-such a date, guess how many rabbits I had a year later?" He got a bunch of guesses, and when all had guessed, he said, "Wrong! One died, so I had exactly one!" Rabbits can be that way . . . .

I know, it can be really discouraging. Obviously, whoever coined the phrase "breeds like rabbits" never tried it. There are a million and one things that can go wrong, and just when you think you've gotten every possible contingency covered, they come up with something neither you nor anyone else ever seems to have thought of. 

Rather than looking at it as failures, think of them as learning experiences. When something goes wrong, knowing what happened can help keep it from happening again. 

Though sometimes, you never know. Someone gave me a NZ doe that they hadn't been able to get bred, nor had the breeder they had bought her from. I got a few litters from her and a Harlequin buck before she simply got too old - no idea why she wouldn't breed to those NZ bucks.

Hang in there!


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## VickieB (Feb 10, 2014)

How many does do you have, nstone630?  If you've had no success in the last year you really should consider new stock. Where do you live? If your are anywhere around the Tulsa area I could tell you where you could buy some PW  (Production White). I've been raising them since last spring, and I have had no problems with breeding any of them. They are a great breed to raise for meat.


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## nstone630 (Feb 10, 2014)

I've tried swapping out the Does, no such luck. And by brother in law lives next to us, and i gave him 2 that I couldn't get pregnant, and wham bam thank y ou ma'am...they both just had litters for him, and great moms.

My husband also looks at is as a learning experience. He's much more positive about it then me. I just get tired of my learning meaning little warm babies are dieing. All they want is to be warm and loved when they are born, and it seems that I can't even get them that...

I am not giving up yet, just venting my frustrations, and looking for help.....sooo I don't give up.


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## cwrabs (Feb 10, 2014)

In all honesty, I think it's kind of hard to tell you without seeing your setup, how and what you feed, are there any other animals around, etc.    Everyone has to learn, but don't get discouraged....it will work out eventually. What works for one person may not work for you. Whatever you do though...relax and enjoy!!


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## P.O. in MO (Feb 10, 2014)

Hang in there nstone, I been at this a year also and had quite a few disappointments.  I have 4 does and 2 bucks and a freezer that only has 4 rabbits in it.  But I am persistent.  I have a litter of 3 still in the nest box from a doe I let get fat,  another does I think is pregnant (but since I don't seem to be able to palpate yet I am not sure), and another one that has been bred.  My other doe is resting after her first litter of 4 of which I lost every one because I pulled the nest box at day 35 and she waited 3 more days to have them.  All learning experiences and sometimes a general aggravation.  Patience has never been one of my virtues but my rabbits have decided that they are going to force it on me whether I like it or not.


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## nstone630 (Feb 10, 2014)

What I'll do is take some pictures and post them.


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## nstone630 (Feb 10, 2014)

P.O. in MO said:


> Hang in there nstone, I been at this a year also and had quite a few disappointments.  I have 4 does and 2 bucks and a freezer that only has 4 rabbits in it.  But I am persistent.  I have a litter of 3 still in the nest box from a doe I let get fat,  another does I think is pregnant (but since I don't seem to be able to palpate yet I am not sure), and another one that has been bred.  My other doe is resting after her first litter of 4 of which I lost every one because I pulled the nest box at day 35 and she waited 3 more days to have them.  All learning experiences and sometimes a general aggravation.  Patience has never been one of my virtues but my rabbits have decided that they are going to force it on me whether I like it or not.


 
Did you have litters die?


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## P.O. in MO (Feb 10, 2014)

I lost the one litter as I said because I pulled the nest box at 35 days and she kindled 3 days later.
I lost a kit to some kind of eye injury which I think was due to the wire clip on my J-feeder and another just died after 2 or 3 days.  I felt bad about the one I pulled the nest box on.  She had built a nest, pulled out a bunch of fur to line it and I took it away from her.   By biggest problem in the beginning was getting one of my does to cooperate with my breeding program.  At that time I only had 2 does of age so I was struggling to keep something in the freezer.  I have had 2 more come of age and one of them is not cooperating much either.  If the 2 problem does were the only ones I had acquired I would probably be as discouraged as you seem.  With the 2 does I have that are doing their job properly I can see how it is supposed to work so if they don't start acting like rabbits are supposed to I will replace them.  The one I pulled the nest box on will definitely get another chance as it was her first litter and my other one has built a nest and I think will deliver this time.  Either way I will work with what happens and do what I need to keep this endeavor going.  Do post some pics if you have time,  maybe some of the more experienced people will be able to see anything that might be of concern.


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## GLENMAR (Feb 10, 2014)

I was reading somewhere recently that the fragile nature of the rabbit is the reason that they can not be raised "factory farm" style like chickens and others. I suppose that's why they are $35 each in gourmet grocery stores.


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## Hens and Roos (Feb 10, 2014)

hang in there , we are in the same predicament, we have 3 does and only one had a litter- which 3 survived to weaning only to lose 2 to enteritis.  At this point we have 1 doe who hopefully is due towards the end of Feb.  she is carrying hay around so we added the nest box already.

Going forward we will breed each doe at least twice, 12 hours apart.


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## cwrabs (Feb 11, 2014)

Hens and Roos said:


> hang in there , we are in the same predicament, we have 3 does and only one had a litter- which 3 survived to weaning only to lose 2 to enteritis.  At this point we have 1 doe who hopefully is due towards the end of Feb.  she is carrying hay around so we added the nest box already.
> 
> Going forward we will breed each doe at least twice, 12 hours apart.


 


We always breed twice. At least three "fall offs" then take the doe back to the buck anywhere between 2-8 hours later (depending on our schedule)


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## Hens and Roos (Feb 11, 2014)

cwrabs said:


> We always breed twice. At least three "fall offs" then take the doe back to the buck anywhere between 2-8 hours later (depending on our schedule)



thanks for the tips, we will try this idea when we re-breed hopefully this week sometime.


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## Hens and Roos (Feb 16, 2014)

Has anyone heard or know of;  the water one is using causing problems with breeding? A couple of people that I have been talking with regarding our lack of baby rabbits, mentioned this to me


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## P.O. in MO (Feb 17, 2014)

Hi H & R,  In all my reading when I was trying to figure out how to get started I never saw anything about this, they all just say rabbits need clean fresh water.  I use those ez crocks that clip on the side of the cage and I usually take them off and dump the and wipe them out about every third day in the winter as they usually are getting a little dirt in the bottom.  In the summer I bring them in a wash them every 2 or 3 weeks when the heat promotes something pink starting to grow in them.  I would think that since wild rabbits drinking out of puddles and muddy ponds manage to proliferate in the absence of a lot of predators that this wouldn't be the problem unless you have some seriously toxic water coming out of the faucet.  Hope you get a litter, I have one due tomorrow and another on the 25th. Am keeping my fingers crossed.


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## Hens and Roos (Feb 17, 2014)

Good luck with your litters, our Cali doe is due around the end of this week .  Just bred our French Angora doe this am so we will see what happens- plan to re-breed her later today and see what happens.


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## P.O. in MO (Feb 17, 2014)

Thanks H & R,  in that last post I meant to add that in Storey's Rabbit book,  Bob Bennett says that he believes daylight length affects the breeding cycle.  Since things DID seem to slow down this winter in my production I put some CFL daylight 23 watt bulbs (100 watt equiv) on a timer and have them coming on just before dark and staying on until 10 PM.  That's giving them around 15 hours of daylight.  I know they say chickens don't lay as much in the winter on short daylight hours and I have always had a light and timer in the coop.  I can tell a little difference in the number of eggs I get summer vs. winter but not much.   I don't know if this will make any difference with the rabbits but until I get a bunch in the freezer I am going to leave them on.  Hope all goes well this afternoon.


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## Hens and Roos (Feb 17, 2014)

We use lights as well with our rabbits and in our coop- my kids show chickens for 4-H so we have to have chicks hatching just after Jan 1st.

We are trying what Cwrabs posted several posts up... at this point it can't hurt!


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## sawfish99 (Feb 19, 2014)

In our experience, problems with a doe getting pregnant are most commonly associated with the doe being too fat.  We put fat does on a hay only diet for a few weeks.  I have culled some that had excessive fat built up inside and 1 that appeared to have cystic ovaries.


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## P.O. in MO (Feb 19, 2014)

Thanks for the post Sawfish,  I didn't know you could put a doe on a hay only diet.  I have been meaning to post some pictures of my does to get an idea of what is ok, what is fat and what is really fat.  I haven't been doing this long enough to really know.  I need to get on this as the one I think needs to go on a diet is on full feed since she is nursing  but I think I wean in a couple of weeks and I want to rebreed her as soon as I get her down to the size she needs to be.


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## Hens and Roos (Feb 23, 2014)

So our 1st time doe is now due- this morning she as moving hay into her nest box- so I gave her another 2 big handfuls which she moved some, we also noticed that she was pulling fur off her tummy area! We are so hoping for her to do a good job.


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## P.O. in MO (Feb 24, 2014)

Keep us posted, I have one due tomorrow. Keeping my fingers crossed.  She was carrying hay around a week ago but since I put the nest box she hasn't pulled any fur.


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## Hens and Roos (Feb 24, 2014)

She had 2 sometime last night/early this am- both were very big compared to the kits our other does had.  unfortunately they were dead, not sure why or what happened- she did a good job of building a nest -pulled lots of hair but still a first timer guess we will try again.


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## P.O. in MO (Feb 24, 2014)

Sorry to hear it H & R, was hoping you'd get a bunch.  First timers are always more iffy and nothing is ever for certain with any of mine.  Hope you have better luck next time.  One of my other does had 4 last time and they were big too, and one of them was born dead.


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## Hens and Roos (Feb 24, 2014)

thanks P.O. we were actually surprised that the kits were as big as they were.  Now we just have to figure the timing out so we can potentially have rabbits in time for DD and DS to show at fair for 4-H.  Thinking we may rebreed this doe so we get hopefully a litter that would be older and then re-breed the older 2 does so we have younger ones.


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## P.O. in MO (Feb 26, 2014)

My doe came thru.  She was due Tuesday nite and she was pulling hair when I was out Tuesday morning.  I went out early and she had 7, all alive and well covered with fur.  This was her second litter her first was 11 with 10 surviving.  I am happy with 7, hopefully they will all make it.


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## issy (Feb 27, 2014)

Anyone have problems with a confused buck? I have a buck and two does, and so far, any time we put him with one of them, he gets excited but he tends to mount the wrong end >.<  as you can imagine, this is not productive at all. We've attempted about four times, and he's a year and a half old.


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## SA Farm (Feb 27, 2014)

Usually it's best to put the doe in with the buck instead of the other way around. Often young or inexperienced bucks (and even experienced bucks) will get the wrong end occasionally or at first. They usually figure it out after a while. If not you could always try pointing him in the right direction


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## issy (Feb 27, 2014)

I knew about putting her in with him, I read that somewhere, she gets defensive of her space or something. We do that. I've even tried holding the doe with the appropriate end facing the buck, and he still goes around her to the front. I thought of leaving her in with him over night, but someone told me they'd end up fighting instead. I have a hutch with two cages side by side,  so I tried putting them in that way, close to each other, but can't fight for a day or two then trying again, but always the same problem.


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## Hens and Roos (Feb 27, 2014)

P.O. in MO said:


> My doe came thru.  She was due Tuesday nite and she was pulling hair when I was out Tuesday morning.  I went out early and she had 7, all alive and well covered with fur.  This was her second litter her first was 11 with 10 surviving.  I am happy with 7, hopefully they will all make it.


That's great! Congrats on the litter


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## P.O. in MO (Feb 27, 2014)

Thanks Hens and Roos.  Issy, I have had a buck mount the wrong end also but he usually gets around to doing it right after a while.  How long are you waiting before giving up and putting them back in their own cages.  I had a doe that was hard to breed at first and I sat out in the shed for an hour and a half one morning before he bred her twice and at least that long that night.  He had only bred her once that evening and they hadn't been fighting, she had just been running around a squealing and refusing service.  I left them together all night.  I ended up with a litter and nobody was bloody the next morning.  There is a risk to doing this, just depends on the rabbits.  I was at the end of my rope with her and was going to make stew if she didn't come thru with a litter.  I was just worried she would damage my buck.  It worked out.  She has been easier since then, still a little problem but the last time morning took about 20 minutes and nite maybe 40.  Hope you get this worked out.


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## Striker911 (Feb 27, 2014)

Going to sub to this thread to look at later. I am in AR and in the same boat. Its not easy. Have had rabbits for almost 2 years and not one litter at all. My best bet is to buy them


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## issy (Feb 27, 2014)

Thanks p.o. we usually give them about half an hour (he tends to get bored and start exploring her food and water etc after that. ) Right now, we got a bit frustrated and borrowed a buck from a friend, and hopefully have two liters due on the 8th.


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## SA Farm (Feb 27, 2014)

issy said:


> Thanks p.o. we usually give them about half an hour (he tends to get bored and start exploring her food and water etc after that. ) Right now, we got a bit frustrated and borrowed a buck from a friend, and hopefully have two liters due on the 8th.


If he's consistently...confused, it may be time to replace him. If you're does aren't fighting him or grumpy in that half-hour, you could try leaving them in longer and see how he does, but I have the same philosophy with my bucks as I do with my does, 3 strikes and they're out. If a buck fails to breed an experienced doe three times in a row, he usually ends up in freezer camp. 
Hopefully your friend's buck got the job done! 
ETA: You could also try holding the doe with her head outside of the cage so that the only end he has available is the rear and see how that goes.


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