# couple questions bout oir bottle calf



## dragonmorgan (Feb 21, 2012)

This is my first time bottle feeding and calf and my husbands first time in around 7 yrs. We think shes around 2 months old or so. Not 100% sure. She was gettin 2 - 2qt bottles a day until recently when we upped her to 2 - 4qt bottles a day because she was startin to look thin. She also appears to have some diarrea that comes and goes. Some days she will have a more solid pile of poop and some days it will b a runny puddle. Im not sire if thats from the move to our backyard that she made a couple days ago or not. She seems to be doin fine right now. Shes eagat to eat and has enough energy to stay away from ya when you try and pet her but ive noticed she lays around alot. I dont know if shes just layin in the sun to stay warm or if shes bored or what but shes not like the other calves i see who are all jumpin around and kickin and stuff. I wouldnt say shes weak or anything because other than no bein very springy and havin some diarrea she seems fine. We are about to start her on some starter food too. Will that help with the diarrea and help boost her energy? Are we feeding her too much.? I dont figure shell overeat because alot of the times she only ends up drinkin about a bottle and a half before she just walks off actuin full.


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## jhm47 (Feb 22, 2012)

Are you feeding her milk, or milk replacer?  If replacer, did you double the amount of powder?  4 qts a day is obviously too much, if she's not finishing it, so cut her back to 2 qts a day, and provide fresh water and starter.  She should have been getting starter at 1 - 2 weeks.  The starter will usually help to prevent scours.  Make sure she's not having any sign of blood in her stools, which would be a sign of possible coccidiosis.  Also start to provide her with some GOOD quality hay.


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## Stubbornhillfarm (Feb 22, 2012)

jhm47 said:
			
		

> Are you feeding her milk, or milk replacer?  If replacer, did you double the amount of powder?  4 qts a day is obviously too much, if she's not finishing it, so cut her back to 2 qts a day, and provide fresh water and starter.  She should have been getting starter at 1 - 2 weeks.  The starter will usually help to prevent scours.  Make sure she's not having any sign of blood in her stools, which would be a sign of possible coccidiosis.  Also start to provide her with some GOOD quality hay.


x2


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## dragonmorgan (Feb 22, 2012)

Milk replacer. We are mixin it one cup (the one that comes in the bag) and then fillin the bottle to the 4 pints mark. Am i sposed to be usin 2 cups of the powder? Usually she finishes both bottles (id say 90% of the time). Im workin on gettin a couple bales of horse hay for her (since thats usually better quality hay around here) and some starter for her too. Is her feed the reason why shes so...not springy? How can i get her to warm up to me so i can get close to her. Also theres no blood in her poop that i can see. Its just dark green/brown and like loose pudding. Ive se en a few smore solid piles but the dogs tend to go in there and eat them when im not lookin


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## Stubbornhillfarm (Feb 22, 2012)

Mix according to the directions on the bag.  But if she is having the runs you should cut her back from the 2 feedings of 4 quarts per day and make sure that she has water, hay and starter feed for her to try out.  IMHO anything over a full bottle (2qts) at a time is too much and may cause her to scour. 

As far as her trusting you to touch her.  I would say to be persistantly patient.  In other words, when she will let you near her, go near her, talk to her, work around her.  Get her used to you without wanting to pet her.  In time, she will become more trusting and will come to you.  Then little by little, you will be able to pet her.


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## dragonmorgan (Feb 22, 2012)

Sounds great. We are headed to town today si well pick up some starter while we are out and cut back the bottles to 2 a day. Im workin on gettin some good hay for her too so hopefully we can have some of that soon too. Im happy shes not weak or anything so hopefully we dont have far to bring her before shes in better health. Calves are just so fragile it seems like.


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## redtailgal (Feb 22, 2012)

http://www.backyardherds.com/web/viewblog.php?id=2952-bottle-calves


http://www.backyardherds.com/web/viewblog.php?id=2952-calves-scours

These pages could answer some of your questions.


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## dragonmorgan (Feb 22, 2012)

Ok we just left the feed store and they told us that bull creep was better to give her than calf starter. Im assumin theyd no because the feed store we go to has a couple hundred cows themselves. Hubby said its got alot of cotton seed in it which im guessin is good for her.


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## WildRoseBeef (Feb 22, 2012)

You need to compare the crude protein percentage between the bull creep and the calf starter.  Calf starters should have a higher protein content than bull creep since calves need a higher protein in their feed than bulls do. You might also want to compare some feed content values between each.  The links that RedTail provided are pretty informative too.

I'm scared to say this, but I hope she's not a PI calf if any of your cows are tested for BVD...  crossing my fingers that it's not that and just a case of cocci


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## dragonmorgan (Feb 22, 2012)

Ill do some comparing when i get home. Id like to say iys not bvd because she came from a herd of cows who are better maintained yhan ours are. Also shes not weak and she has a great appetite. No runny nose and doesnt feel feverish (altho ive never tested her actual rectal temp). She looks healthy and eats good. Aside from the diarrhea and non-playfulness she seems pretty normal. Is there anything else that might could tell me if it is something like bvd or cocci?


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## redtailgal (Feb 22, 2012)

Sounds to me like its a simple case of too much milk too fast.  

Cut her milk back, give her some time to clear up and then EASE her up if she needs it.

Doubling her milk all at once like that, well, thats almost a guarantee for an upset tummy and the squirts.


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## dragonmorgan (Feb 22, 2012)

Yea i was afraid of that. I was just worried about her not havin enuff food to keep herself warm. All that was before i found these forums tho and ive learned so much. Its awsome to know i can ask questions and get advice and its all so helpful. DH is impressed by how much ive really taken an interest in the cows and how much ive learned from here. We are only gonna give her one bottle tonight and then tomorrow we are gonna put the feed out for her. Im checkin around tryin to find some good hay for her too so i should have that for her this week.


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## dragonmorgan (Feb 22, 2012)

Ok i did some lookin around and im not sure if the numbers would be different than what we woulda got (since out feed store makes its own feed) but it said calf starter should have around 18% protein and this bull starter we got has a minimum of 10%. Can we still use it or should we use it only until we can get some actual calf starter?


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## redtailgal (Feb 22, 2012)

It wont hurt the calf, but it wont help much either.

Go ahead and sue it for now, but get the calf started as soon as you can.

I dont want to step on your toes here, but if I were you I'd switch that baby over to a bucket right away.  If you pour the milk into a bucket, then float the nipple on top or even better get him/her sucking on your finger and lower his face into the milk, he should catch on quickly.

I say to get him on a bucket quickly because this will encourage the calf to take to grain a little easier.  He will get used to putting his head down for feed other than grass, and get him used to recognizing a bucket as a food source, thus making him more interested in the grain.  

just offer one handful of grain at first, when he does well with that offer two handfuls.  Dont be afraid to PUT some grain in his mouth to show him that it is food.

Please, please, make sure that there is hay available to him.

Sorry, I just read back, it seems he is actually a she, but I am far too lazy to correct my post!


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## dragonmorgan (Feb 22, 2012)

lol its ok. I didnt even catch the "he"s until you said something. We have some hay in with the big cows that imma give her until I get some better quality hay. Ill get some actual starter feed for her too. Im hopin she likes this we got. Id eat it if I was a cow lol. Shes pretty used to watchin other cows eat out of buckets and was even penned with a calf who ate from a trough before we moved her here. Hopefully that will make it easier. If not weve got a spare bucket so we shall see. Ill keep yall posted.


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## WildRoseBeef (Feb 22, 2012)

dragonmorgan said:
			
		

> Ill do some comparing when i get home. Id like to say iys not bvd because she came from a herd of cows who are better maintained yhan ours are. Also shes not weak and she has a great appetite. No runny nose and doesnt feel feverish (altho ive never tested her actual rectal temp). She looks healthy and eats good. Aside from the diarrhea and non-playfulness she seems pretty normal. Is there anything else that might could tell me if it is something like bvd or cocci?


I know for sure that scours is caused by all sorts of types of bacteria, from E. coli to Streptococcus and Salmonella.  You never mentioned what her breathing was like, as calves her age are prone to getting respiratory disease (like pneumonia) which can cause her to be lethargic like she is.  Is her nose dry, does she have laboured breathing, coughing, snotty nose, anything like that?


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## dragonmorgan (Feb 23, 2012)

Her breathing sounds fine. I dont think her nose is dry or snotty but she licks it and picks it so its hard to tell. Its what makes it so confusing that nothin seems to really be wrong. Shes doesnt seem to be gettin any worse or any better.


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## redtailgal (Feb 23, 2012)

WildRoseBeef said:
			
		

> dragonmorgan said:
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Did I miss a post somewhere?  I cant find anything about this calf being lethargic, all I see are posts saying that she is acting fine, being a little difficult to catch even.  No problems other than the squirts.

I just reread the thread and still dont see it. Am I missing a post?


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## dragonmorgan (Feb 23, 2012)

I said a little about it in the original post. She just seema lay around alot. I never see her out there buckin and springin or runnin around like alot of calves do. Shes got energy to stay away from me she just doesnt seem to be like other calves ive watched. Maybe its because shes the only calf in the pen or something, im not sure. I just want to make sure nothing is wrong. Do all cows bounce around or are some more laid back? Most of my experience watchin calves is when we feed the herd and they always seem to b so playful. Most of the time our little calf is just layin down. Could she be bored?


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## dragonmorgan (Feb 23, 2012)

Ok so a morning update. I only gave her one bottle this morn and then filled a bucket half full with the feed. She was a lil spooked by the red bucket but i offered her some in my hand. While she was eatin it i lead her down to the bucket. That was all it took. She went right to work on that feed. I think its safe to say she likes it lol


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## Stubbornhillfarm (Feb 23, 2012)

dragonmorgan said:
			
		

> Ok so a morning update. I only gave her one bottle this morn and then filled a bucket half full with the feed. She was a lil spooked by the red bucket but i offered her some in my hand. While she was eatin it i lead her down to the bucket. That was all it took. She went right to work on that feed. I think its safe to say she likes it lol


Nice!   

I don't know if this is true or just a bunch of malarky about the color red.  But when I wear my read sweatshirt out near the cows, my big steer starts actin' all a fool.  I've tested it many times.  It's just the red.  Maybe she was spooked by the red bucket or maybe my steer is just foolish!  But anyway, I am happy for you that she dove right in!


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## dragonmorgan (Feb 23, 2012)

Lol i didnt even think of that. Hopefully she wont mind the color red too much. Any ideas how long it will take to notice any differences in her? Do i just leave her some out all the time or should i only feed her a little a day?


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## redtailgal (Feb 23, 2012)

I wouldnt leave it out all day.  

Give her a small amount each day.  Once her poop is normal ease up on it.  

How old is she?


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## dragonmorgan (Feb 23, 2012)

Not really sure. I dont think shes older than 2 months but im not sure how to tell. I can post a couple pics if anyone on here can guess by lookin.


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## WildRoseBeef (Feb 23, 2012)

redtailgal said:
			
		

> WildRoseBeef said:
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It's just when she said the calf wasn't acting all goofy and playful like she should and laying around a lot, that's what I took as being lethargic.  Maybe "lethargic" was the wrong word to use here...

Dragon, you could check her age by looking at her teeth.  Though you may have to catch her first and get her cornered somewhere with your hubby holding on to her while you check her teeth.  Though I'd have to find a link on determining age via teeth on a calf first before you can do that lol.


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## WildRoseBeef (Feb 23, 2012)

Try this link: http://avc-beef.org/AgingCattle-Griffin/AgingCattle-CL712.pdf  May not be the most accurate, but it should help.


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## dragonmorgan (Feb 23, 2012)

I tried to get a few good pics of her but it was tough to get her to be still. The flies in her pen are ridiculous. Im sure it has to do with the 70 degree weather we are having. We need a good freeze to hit us for a couple days. I dont know where our winter is but it must be runnin very late. Is there anything I can do to or are flies in the pen just a part of it?


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## redtailgal (Feb 23, 2012)

aww.  She is a pretty thing, isnt she!  Dont you just love their faces?

SHe looks pretty good in that pic.  Ears up, alert, doe eyed, and a little mischievous...  Your doing a good job with her.  I'd say about 6-8 weeks old.

Just ease up on her milk, 2 two quart bottles with free choice hay, and grain each day should be plenty for her.


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## WildRoseBeef (Feb 23, 2012)

Yep, not lethargic at all!


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## dragonmorgan (Feb 23, 2012)

She def seems to be up and around more than usual since i gave her that feed. I caught her eatin it a few times today. She even came up and smelled my hand . Thanks guys. I love little cutesy calves and its so cool to have one of our own now.


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## Stubbornhillfarm (Feb 24, 2012)

Who couldn't love a face like that?!


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