# Skinny goat now has diarrhea!



## Goatgirl47 (May 31, 2016)

One of our goats has been acting strange for the past couple days. Firstly, she self-weaned her then seven-week-old twins, and dried herself up (almost). She still has a little bit of milk left, but her udder is the smallest I've ever seen it.
Penelope has always been a "tank" (as my brothers call her), but now she is the skinniest I've ever seen her. She kept her weight well after kidding, and she doesn't get very much food unless I milk her. The last time I milked her was a couple weeks ago though.

Her kids were really loud yesterday, because they are little piglets, and want their milk. They have been quieter today. Whenever they try to nurse on her, she runs away into the woods and stays there for a while. She avoids them.

Her kids were born April 2nd, and although I'd rather of had them nurse longer, I think they'll be fine without milk (after they get over themselves). Penelope is the real one I'm worried about.
Today I noticed that her hind end was all messy - she now has bad diarrhea.
I put her in the stanchion and gave her some pelleted dewormer (DuMOR), but she wouldn't eat it.

What should I do? Do you have any idea what is the matter with her?

This is a picture I took of her yesterday.....it doesn't show how skinny she is, but it does show how small her udder is.






And if it matters, Penelope is a purebred Myotonic.


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## TAH (May 31, 2016)

I will tag some people.
@babsbag 
@Southern by choice 
@Goat Whisperer 
@OneFineAcre


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## babsbag (May 31, 2016)

Can you get a fecal done on her? My guess would be worms but without a fecal hard to say.  Do her lower eyelids look pale?  If she won't eat the pelleted stuff then get some ivermectin and dose her. I use 2cc per 100 lb. but a fecal would really be best. If she has a really heavy worm load the cure can kill her as the worms detach from her stomach and she bleeds out.  

There are other things that can cause scours, like Giardia, eCoil, Salamonella, cocci, and other kinds of worms that might not respond to ivermection, like tape. That is why the fecal is so important. Any vet out to be able to run one for you. 

There can also be Johne's. But not as common and diahreah is not a usual symptom in a goat but if the fecal don't show parasites or cocci then I would look there next. 

Also, could be a simple as something she ate caused the scours and raising twins made her skinny. Some of my milkers just look awful this time of year and will only look worse as the hot weather sets in. 

Again, you really need that fecal to know where to start.


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## Goatgirl47 (May 31, 2016)

I will check her eyelids tonight. No, I haven't done a fecal on her, but should do it or have the vet do it? I've only done a fecal once before this. 

This past April we tested all of our goats for Johnes, CAE, and CL, and they all came back negative.


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## Southern by choice (May 31, 2016)

You need to run a fecal. Parasite blooms occur 3-6 weeks after kidding. This will be when their parasite load is generally the heaviest.

When they are under a heavy load it is taking way too much to produce milk. This is probably why she weaned the kids. She has nothing to give.

When fecal is run even though she is an adult always check for cocci levels.

I like a 5 day course of fenbendazole at 1cc per 10 lbs. if load is very high... moderate 3 day course.

Less issues with internal bleedout if she does have a heavy load and goats have a very high metabolism... running the course with a dewormer like fenben keeps a good steady stream so it is more effective that single dose dewormers. 
Cocci is something that is treated completely different.

Stay away from dewormer pellets, they are not ideal for goats and often it ends up not being enough and this is what ends up building resistance.


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## Latestarter (May 31, 2016)

Hope you get her figured out and on the mend. let us know the outcome please.


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## Goatgirl47 (May 31, 2016)

Would we be able to use the Ivermectin that is listed for cattle?


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## babsbag (May 31, 2016)

Yes, you can use the ivermectin for cattle. I use the injectable and give it orally. But what @Southern by choice says is a good way to worm too and probably safer if the load is high.

I have next to no worm issues here so I am not the expert at all when it comes to worms. I used to worm once a year with ivermectin just as a routine but have stopped. Between the dry lot my goats are on and the oak trees that they consume I have never had a worm issue, other than tape worms now and then which is treated with fenbendazole.


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## Goatgirl47 (May 31, 2016)

Sorry for all the questions, but is this the right one?   http://www.jefferspet.com/products/safeguard-dewormer-goats-125ml


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## babsbag (May 31, 2016)

That is the right one, but as you can see the dosage they suggest is lower than what @Southern by choice by choice uses. I don't know if there is a cheaper way to buy it or not, maybe someone else will chime in on this


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## Goatgirl47 (May 31, 2016)

I checked Penelope's bottom eyelids, they were paler then they should be. The color is about number three on this chart.


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## OneFineAcre (May 31, 2016)

You can get Safeguard at Tractor Supply if you have one
Or you could check if you have another farm supply store
I think it cheaper than that at TSC
But use the dose SBC suggested and not what's on the label


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## Goat Whisperer (May 31, 2016)

I wouldn't wait to order it online, try to find some local. 

I have seen goats still have decent eyelid color but still be have a very very high load. I would try to worm her ASAP, scours, drying up, and her getting that thin so quickly are all very bad. Don't wait on this!


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## Ferguson K (May 31, 2016)

Fenben is available at tractor supply cheaper than that and you get it immediately.


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## Goatgirl47 (Jun 1, 2016)

We are going to TSC this morning to get either the Fenbendazole or Ivermectin. Penelope's poop isn't nearly as runny as it was yesterday.


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## babsbag (Jun 1, 2016)

Just be aware that a goat with a heavy worm load can bleed out internally from a quick kill off. That is why the fenben is safer. You have to treat longer...but safer.


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## Southern by choice (Jun 1, 2016)

Fenben will take care of everything. Ivermectin will not.

Fenben when given properly is still an excellent and safe dewormer.


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## Goat Whisperer (Jun 1, 2016)

Any update?


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## Goatgirl47 (Jun 2, 2016)

Today we brought six goat kids (four to be vaccinated for CD/T and two to be dis-budded) to our local vet clinic, and we brought along some poop samples from Penelope and Clover, so the vets could run fecals on them. They both had worms pretty badly, but Penelope worse then Clover.
I will try to give them the Fenben we got from TSC tonight, if not, then tomorrow morning.

While we were at the vet's we weighed Penelope and Kendall's kids, and Iggy & Gloria (DOB 4/03) weighed around 23 and 21 pounds each, while Eddie & Midge (DOB 4/13) were 25 and 20 each. They are getting big. 

Thanks for the help!


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## Southern by choice (Jun 2, 2016)

Glad you got them to the vet and know what is going on.


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## Goatgirl47 (Jun 2, 2016)

I have a quick question - on the Fenben bottle it says "because a withdrawal time in milk has not been established, do not use in lactating goats". So I can't use this for Clover? It wouldn't be good for her kids to drink her milk if I worm her with that, right?


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## babsbag (Jun 2, 2016)

It is fine for her kids, it is just for humans that it says that. I believe that most people say 4 days for human consumption but I am not sure where that comes from, it is just what I have been told.


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## Southern by choice (Jun 2, 2016)

FARAD has set withdrawal periods... it is 4 days AFTER the last dose.
IOW. No human consumption everyday you are giving it and then once last dose add 4 days.

So a 5 day course will be 9 days
3 day course 7 days

Like @babsbag said - it is fine for her kids to nurse or bottle feed them.


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## babsbag (Jun 2, 2016)

@Southern by choice  I looked on FARAD today and couldn't find any information. Guess I didn't look in the right place.  Why do they put that warning on the label? That's silly.  But I did find this and they say no withholding of milk for cows. 

www.nmpf.org/sites/default/files/2012%20Residue%20Manual_VIEW.pdf


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## Goatgirl47 (Jun 8, 2016)

Update: Penelope and Clover both got Safeguard once a day for five days, and Penelope is looking much better now! I forgot to say in the original post that Penelope had been in the woods most of the day, and hadn't been eating, and her head was always drooping towards the ground (I don't know how I forgot to add that!). Well, now she is out browsing with the other goats, and is completely back to normal. Tomorrow her and her sister - along with her sisters twins - will be going to their new home. 

Again, thank y'all so much for your help!


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## Southern by choice (Jun 8, 2016)

So glad to hear they have bounced back and are doing well!


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## Goat Whisperer (Jun 8, 2016)

x2!


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## TAH (Jun 8, 2016)

x3


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## samssimonsays (Jun 9, 2016)

glad all is well again!


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