# Surprise!!



## LilyD (Apr 25, 2011)

Last year around August we purchased a pair of Shetland sheep, a ram and a ewe with the hopes of breeding them and making some cheese and raising some baby lambs for meat. We had the shearer come out today and boy were we surprised to find out that our ram was most likely sterile. She buzzed off his winter coat and informed us that he did not appear to have any testicles. 

We are going to contact the lady that we got them from and see if maybe they will be able to trade rams with us. She sold him to us as a breeding ram. 

The only problem is he is so darn nice and everyone loves him. We might end up with an unwethered wether to hang out with the ladies when they aren't being bred. Not sure if we will be able to part with him and we definitely can't make him into lamb chops he's just way too nice. 

Just thought I would share my interesting day.


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## rockdoveranch (Apr 25, 2011)

Wow!  What a shocker!

I am told it is a good idea to keep a wether with the breeding ram if you only have one breeding ram.


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## Royd Wood (Apr 25, 2011)

Theres an old post on here from beekissed about getting in the pen and giving the ram a full kit inspection before she considers buying - I hope it was a genuine mistake and it gets sorted out for you. Keep us posted and good luck


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## aggieterpkatie (Apr 26, 2011)

Oh my.  When buying animals you should always thoroughly inspect them!  I hope the breeder you bought them from makes it right!


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## LilyD (Apr 26, 2011)

It was our first sheep buy and the lady was really nice. She said if for any reason it didn't work out she would take him back. I don't think she did anything bad. We did check him visually when we bought him and he had the appearance of testicles but I didn't physically feel them lol. The lady who sheared them didn't see any incisions so she didn't think he was actually wethered. We are waiting to hear back from her but I am pretty sure that she will give us another ram since she sold him to us as a breeding ram knowing we wanted to have lambs. She was really nice and all her sheep are like babies to her and they were all really friendly.


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## aggieterpkatie (Apr 27, 2011)

He had the appearance of testicles?  Sheep testicles are hard to miss. They're not like dog testicles, they actually hang down.  They would be VERY hard to miss.  What your shearer said doesn't make sense.  Either there are large dangly testicles or their aren't.    If there were no dangly testicles, he must have been banded.  

See this picture  of a Jacob ram?  Can't miss the testicles!  

Either way, I hope it works out and you get a ram!


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## aggieterpkatie (Apr 27, 2011)

Oops, you have Shetlands.  Here's a Shetland ram pic .


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## PattySh (Apr 27, 2011)

I agree sounds like you got a banded (castrated)  lamb. Either they were all castrated or someone grabbed the wrong one? What did the breeder say?


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## LilyD (Apr 27, 2011)

He has the sac that the testicles would come in but there is nothing in there. He was pretty young when we bought him so we figured his testicles would grow as he got older. They just never did and he never got any ram like tendencies either. The lady we got him from swears he was not banded or wethered and was sold to us as an intact ram. In talking to the vet he said that it's not unheard of to have a ram that is just born sterile and never develops testicles. Another option is that his testicles did not descend and are internal which would make him infertile as well. We wouldn't know without doing exploratory procedures and we aren't really willing to put the money into it to find out he's not usable. 

The lady we bought him from called us back today and said she would definitely take him back and give us an intact ram. We will definitely be checking under the skirts this time .


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## rockdoveranch (Apr 27, 2011)

LilyD said:
			
		

> The lady we bought him from called us back today and said she would definitely take him back and give us an intact ram. We will definitely be checking under the skirts this time .


Great!  Thanks for the update.

Ya know . . . in 7 years I have never thought about feeling the sac of our new born ram lambs to check for testicles.  When I am sexing them soon after birth, I just pick them up and check the under side to see what we have.  When there is a fuzzy sac, I have always assumed they are filled with testicles.

From what we have seen in all this time the little ram lambs start mounting the ewes and lambs really early on.

Our little ram lamb who was born 4/20 has been mounting his twin sister for two days now.  He is a real spunky little guy.  May be a keeper for us.

And speaking of the size of ram testicles.  When we had our entire family out for Thanksgiving years ago just about EVERYONE made comments and jokes about the size of the testicles.


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## LilyD (Apr 27, 2011)

That's what's funny. He was mounting the ewe pretty much all fall when they were together so we assumed she must be pregnant. Other than that though he had pretty small horns and had a super friendly temperament that was very unramish. I guess now we know why.


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## Ariel301 (Apr 28, 2011)

I'd bet he has testicles and they have not descended. Sometimes they will be retained inside the body, it's called cryptorchidism. Animals with this condition may or may not be sterile, but breeding them is a bad idea, because it can be genetic.


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## Royd Wood (Apr 28, 2011)

Our Romney rams sack is as big as a cows udder and when the ewes are pregnant they dont let him mount again. I'm sure it will all work out in the end for you


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## aggieterpkatie (Apr 28, 2011)

I'm so glad the breeder will take him back and give you a better ram! It's nice to hear stories like that, because many times the breeders don't keep their word.  

Yep, he sounds like a cryptorchid.  Don't be surprised if he did somehow breed your ewe. Most times the sperm is killed off from the increased temperature of being in the body, but they can surprise you now and then!


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## rockdoveranch (Apr 28, 2011)

This is a very interesting article in the Merck Veterinary Manual on bilateral and unilateral cryptorchidism, and true monorchidism.  It is about dogs . . . but still informative.  I found it 18+ months ago when I brought home a Boxer pup that I learned the following day at the vets had only one descended testicle.   

http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/index.jsp?cfile=htm/bc/181901.htm&word=canine,cryptorchidism

I won't go into the abusive posts I received on a Boxer forum with show people, but I will say, my breeder and members of the American Boxer Club did not think it was a big deal.  I left the forum.


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## marliah (Jun 1, 2011)

uh-oh

I have been wondering why I can't see anything on my "ram" too....he was wold to me as a ram but is also a sweetie friendly guy. I can't find any real evidence of manhood on him :/ I bought him from a guy who had bought him on auction. He is also shetland. Good thing if he is sterile I can keep him in with my ewes and he can be a pet LOL. I think I will try to get a pic of him later.....he sure doesn't look like the photo of the ram that was posted here.


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## TheSheepGirl (Jun 2, 2011)

Glad all worked out for you. 

This should be a word of warning for those of you considering the purchase of a ram. Always check for fully developed testicles before you even consider forking over any money. Even on a lamb the testicles will be evident enough if you inspect him. Don't be afraid or embarrassed to give them a good feel for good measure.

I checked my Shetland ram over before purchasing him and his whether companion. He was 6 weeks old and those testicles were already hanging down pretty low and noticeable.

Sometimes people selling sheep just don't know enough about them to be certain that they are intact or they just didn't bother to look.


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