# What to do with CL



## Augie (Mar 3, 2021)

I  have some mixed breeds goats, I got from a meat goat producer. Today I have a goat that with an abscess under its ear pop with white cream puss. I'm worried that it is CL. What should I do? I cleaned the puss around the ear and sprayed blukote around the area. I' getting a purebred Boer buck and I'm worried im going to screw him up with CL.  Do most meat goat producers have CL?


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## Longhornbreeder101 (Mar 3, 2021)

Augie said:


> I  have some mixed breeds goats, I got from a meat goat producer. Today I have a goat that with an abscess under its ear pop with white cream puss. I'm worried that it is CL. What should I do? I cleaned the puss around the ear and sprayed blukote around the area. I' getting a purebred Boer buck and I'm worried im going to screw him up with CL.  Do most meat goat producers have CL?


There is no *cure* for *CL*. However, *CL* abscesses must *be* treated to prevent ruptures and further contamination of other animals and environments. If you *have* an animal that develops an abscess: Immediately isolate the animal from the herd.


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## Baymule (Mar 3, 2021)

You could take a pus sample to the vet to be tested. Wear gloves. Sometimes goats and sheep get an abscess that is not CL. Call the vet and ask how to get a sample.


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## Longhornbreeder101 (Mar 3, 2021)

Baymule said:


> You could take a pus sample to the vet to be tested. Wear gloves. Sometimes goats and sheep get an abscess that is not CL. Call the vet and ask how to get a sample.


I agree with @Baymule she is correct it also may just be an abscess but if it is cl just if she or he is near any goats still separate from herd just for safety reason.


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## Baymule (Mar 3, 2021)

Absolutely agree with separation from the other goats. Better safe than sorry.


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## Augie (Mar 3, 2021)

Baymule said:


> Absolutely agree with separation from the other goats. Better safe than sorry.


Should I vaccinate the whole herd?  Even if I don't know if there are CL or not? I cant find any of the yellow top test tubes. That aren't super expensive.


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## Baymule (Mar 4, 2021)

Test first. Make sure that it is CL before you get all upset. My sheep have had abscesses and it was not CL. If you vaccinate, the animal will always test positive for CL or at least that is what I have read. I have never personally dealt with it. Call the vet and test the animal. And ALWAYS quarantine any new animal where other animals have no access to them. If you have to, load up the animal and take to the vet, but do it now before the abscess heals up.


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## Mini Horses (Mar 4, 2021)

Few things to add....  Agree to separate!   Agree to test!   

CL will normally be a heavy material, blu cheese looking as to thickness.   If runny, quite possibly not CL.   Test it.    Use iodine to flush wound, wear gloves, keep away from others.   It is better to lance before bursting, to prevent the materials from getting onto surfaces to reinfect.

Be sure to use goat vaccine for CL, not sheep which costs less.  Work differently.  CL can be cysts inside the animal that you may never see.  So, vaccinating is good med.

Now, it has been found that some control of CL can be had using Formalin, as there is no cure.  Onion Creek meat goats has some info on their & their vets experience.  And it's to treat the abscess so it doesn't burst, which can infect more animals.


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## Augie (Mar 4, 2021)

Mini Horses said:


> Few things to add....  Agree to separate!   Agree to test!
> 
> CL will normally be a heavy material, blu cheese looking as to thickness.   If runny, quite possibly not CL.   Test it.    Use iodine to flush wound, wear gloves, keep away from others.   It is better to lance before bursting, to prevent the materials from getting onto surfaces to reinfect.
> 
> ...





Baymule said:


> Test first. Make sure that it is CL before you get all upset. My sheep have had abscesses and it was not CL. If you vaccinate, the animal will always test positive for CL or at least that is what I have read. I have never personally dealt with it. Call the vet and test the animal. And ALWAYS quarantine any new animal where other animals have no access to them. If you have to, load up the animal and take to the vet, but do it now before the abscess heals up.





Ffagirl22 said:


> I agree with @Baymule she is correct it also may just be an abscess but if it is cl just if she or he is near any goats still separate from herd just for safety reason.


I don't have a vet and i cant get the correct yellow/red test tubes until the ending of March. Is there any downside of vaccinating anyways even if my herd is negative or positive? Shouldn't be done anyways? The puss was pretty thick and curdy.  Is it a once time thing? will she have more swelling? If it is CL.


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## Baymule (Mar 4, 2021)

@Ridgetop we need some help here!


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## rachels.haven (Mar 4, 2021)

The pus needs to be tested if it is available. The tubes are just for looking for antibodies.


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## rachels.haven (Mar 4, 2021)

https://waddl.vetmed.wsu.edu/animal-disease-faq/caseous-lymphadenitis
		

The red top tube is just for an example. You need some sort of sterile container. If no vet is availablr I'd contact waddl asap and ask for instructions.


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## Augie (Mar 4, 2021)

rachels.haven said:


> https://waddl.vetmed.wsu.edu/animal-disease-faq/caseous-lymphadenitis
> 
> 
> The red top tube is just for an example. You need some sort of sterile container. If no vet is availablr I'd contact waddl asap and ask for instructions.


Alright cool. I will find a sterile container. But shouldn't I vaccinate anyway? Is there negative aspect in vaccinating? Why does it matter that I have a false positive?.


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## rachels.haven (Mar 4, 2021)

If you vaccinate for CL the antibodies test will detect cl antibodies when you test whether your goats have CL or not for the rest of their lives. You will never know if your goats are really negative or positive and prone to sprouting abscesses internally or externally at random times forever. I suggest only vaccinating for CL only if your pus test comes back positive (or if an antibodies test comes back positive twice). It's more of a cutting your losses vaccine. I believe it mostly helps them not get it as badly rather than not getting it at all.


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## Augie (Mar 4, 2021)

rachels.haven said:


> If you vaccinate for CL the antibodies test will detect cl antibodies when you test whether your goats have CL or not for the rest of their lives. You will never know if your goats are really negative or positive and prone to sprouting abscesses internally or externally at random times forever. I suggest only vaccinating for CL only if your pus test comes back positive (or if an antibodies test comes back positive twice). It's more of a cutting your losses vaccine. I believe it mostly helps them not get it as badly rather than not getting it at all.


But I'd rather have a false positive than a positive positive. They only drawback to vaccinating is that you can't test?


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## rachels.haven (Mar 5, 2021)

You won't ever know if you actually have it as diseased animals won't always show abscesses. You won't be able to tell buyers your herd is healthy and tested clean. Many goat people don't want this. Most of the time this is fine for strictly terminal, non breeding animals for your use only for the most part (abscesses can condemn a carcass at the processor meaning you don't get the meat), but if you want more than that out if your herd don't vaccinate unless necessary. Cl cuts into your herd's outputs. The disease itself really does and gets into your soil so you're stuck with it.


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## Baymule (Mar 6, 2021)

You are being advised NOT to push the panic button and vaccinate. TEST the one with an abscess. Calm down, it may only be a abscess, not CL.

@rachels.haven i don’t know much about CL, it it detectable by a blood rest, it that what you were referring to when you said 2 positive tests? If so this may be the best way for the OP to go, testing the herd before vaccination.


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## Mini Horses (Mar 6, 2021)

Do you have a State vet lab near you?  They can provide a tube, instructions, tests, etc, with very, very reasonable fees.  I am fortunate to have one about 20 miles from me.  They offer many services that a small operation may not even know about.  Necropsy is one of many.


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## rachels.haven (Mar 6, 2021)

Baymule said:


> @rachels.haven i don’t know much about CL, it it detectable by a blood rest, it that what you were referring to when you said 2 positive tests? If so this may be the best way for the OP to go, testing the herd before vaccination.


The common thought in the goat community is that the antibody detecting blood test for CL is less accurate, but the pus test is always spot on. The chance of a false positive would be significantly decreased if the test were repeated. The pus test is just plain better.


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## purplequeenvt (Mar 6, 2021)

Do not vaccinate anyone until you have tested the pus and the blood. Once you vaccinate, there will be no way of telling whether your animal has CL or is just testing positive because of the vaccine.

Where was the lump? Are there more lumps? Sheep can get lumps for a million different reasons besides CL. It could be an abscess from getting stuck by something or, if it’s on the body, it could be a clogged sebaceous gland.


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