# Penny kidded!  Pics / long story page 2



## Roll farms (May 2, 2011)

Penny's my fav. doe, a black Ob.  She's had difficult kiddings both times in the past, and was left open / milked through in 2010.  This time she was bred to our Togg buck, just to see if I can get twins / smaller kid(s) so she kids easier.  
If this one is hard on her, I may just retire her and keep her as a pet once she dries off.

She looks HORRIBLE right now, we are suffering some issues b/c of a shipment of truly awful hay we bought in late January.







Her udder ain't pretty, but it sure is a productive thing.






Stupid me decided to feed it (I should have tossed it) and we've had goofy-legged kids, copper deficiency issues, does losing condition, etc.

I did toss part of it and bought new and Penny's been Bolused, drenched w/ copper sulfate, BoSe'd 3 times, and alllll the good alfalfa she can want.  

I hope we turned it around in time that the kids won't have issues.

She'll be at day 150 on Weds.


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## jodief100 (May 2, 2011)




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## Livinwright Farm (May 2, 2011)

Hopefully this time it will be easier on her... 
If not, you could try one more breeding, but breed her to a Nigerian or Pygmy... the kids will be guaranteed to be smaller and much easier for her to kid.
There are farms near me that only breed to freshen and don't really care what breed the sire of the kids is or even if the buck was registered.  If you are only wanting to freshen this doe each year, this could be an option for you also.  Obviously(as with any stud), you want to see and have a copy of the buck's test results to ensure he won't pass a disease onto your farm.. but this is something that I am certain you already know.

If I lived closer I would let my little boys be there for your girls in exchange for the resulting kid.


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## SDGsoap&dairy (May 2, 2011)

That's too bad about the hay issues... Good luck Penny!!!


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## warthog (May 2, 2011)

She's a pretty girl, hope things are easier for her this time round.

Looking forward to pictures.

Good luck.


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## oakmarsh nigerians (May 3, 2011)

Good luck Miss Penny!


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## swest (May 3, 2011)




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## St0rmyM00n (May 3, 2011)




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## Ariel301 (May 3, 2011)

I've been having the same issues with the last load of hay I bought...also in January. Was told it was 125 pound bales of alfalfa, but it was actually 70 pound bales of alfalfa, bermuda, and ground up cactus. :/ Nothing I could do though, since it was the only hay for sale under $15 a bale. 

Good luck Penny!


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## Livinwright Farm (May 3, 2011)

Ariel301 said:
			
		

> I've been having the same issues with the last load of hay I bought...also in January. Was told it was 125 pound bales of alfalfa, but it was actually 70 pound bales of alfalfa, bermuda, and ground up cactus. :/ Nothing I could do though, since it was the only hay for sale under $15 a bale.
> 
> Good luck Penny!


Ew! Glad I don't live in a cactus area!


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## St0rmyM00n (May 3, 2011)

Livinwright Farm said:
			
		

> Ariel301 said:
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Malina and Kuzco love cactus it grows wild here and they eat it like mad.


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## Mo's palominos (May 3, 2011)

thinking lotsa of pink for penny !!


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## Roll farms (May 3, 2011)

The plot thickens...

The fella who delivered the hay....guess I better take you back to the beginning...We agreed to 'hire' a goat / chicken buying customer of ours to deliver hay b/c my dh's back is getting bad and that's one less time we have to handle it.  He brought some 'test bales' and we agreed on a price, etc.  Got 100 bales and used them w/ no issues.

Fast forward to the next batch, left during a snow storm, unloaded quickly and unchecked until we were ready for it...I was TOLD it was the 'same hay'...same cutting, same farm, etc.

Today I found out it most certainly was NOT...it was 1.5 yr old 1st cutting someone had left over in their loft that he bought for .50 EA!!!  I won't tell y'all what I paid him for it....but BOY am I ticked.

Ya know, I remember opening these crappy bales and going, "How can this be the same hay??" but dumb old trusting me, he said it was, so ...it must be, right...?  grrrrrrrrr.


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## Roll farms (May 3, 2011)

Pink...w/ black polka dots, LOL.


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## Livinwright Farm (May 3, 2011)

Roll farms said:
			
		

> The plot thickens...
> 
> The fella who delivered the hay....guess I better take you back to the beginning...We agreed to 'hire' a goat / chicken buying customer of ours to deliver hay b/c my dh's back is getting bad and that's one less time we have to handle it.  He brought some 'test bales' and we agreed on a price, etc.  Got 100 bales and used them w/ no issues.
> 
> ...


 Why that downright mean rotten so n' so!!!   he deserves a GOOD


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## elevan (May 3, 2011)

The old bait and switch! What a low thing to do!


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## Roll farms (May 4, 2011)

Oh my DANG.

It's been 8 yrs since I've called a vet to assist w/ a kidding.  8 years.  I thought I had this 'kid pullin' thing licked.

Guess not...

Penny tried, I tried, we tried...and tried...and tried to get this kid out...for 1.5 hrs....her on her own for 45 mins, then me and her for 45 mins.  Then I called the vet.  It took them 30 mins to get here and by then I was sure the kid was toast.  

I was also sure by that point that just by his size / hornbuds I could feel, that it was a HE.  And that he looked Togg, I could tell by the white legs / chin I could get out...but nothing else.

I was just sure he was a goner, I hadn't felt any movement for a while, and I was trying to keep her vulva opened so there was an airway, just in case...but I was pretty sure it was a lost cause.

The vet got here and tugged and tugged and pulled and asked, more than once, "WHAT THE HECK IS IT HUNG UP ON????" because neither of us could feel anything causing him to be hung up, she's just narrow in the pelvis.  
(She was on the milk stand during all this, locked in.)
He tried putting one leg back in and delivering a shoulder, then the head, etc....back in, back out, nothing worked.  Finally he just squatted down on the floor and gave a mighty tug w/ Penny bellowing like she was dying and FINALLLLLLYYYYYYYY....he came out.  

All 12 pounds of him!  That'd be a huge kid for a boer, much less an Ob!
And he's 37" long!  THIRTY SEVEN INCHES LONG!  THREE FEET!

I was so relieved b/c I really didn't want to put her through a C-section but when I saw the kid was alive / breathing...I WAS ELATED.  







For perspective's sake, here's a shot of me holding him...






I'm not sure how the poor boy's front legs aren't now about 6" longer than the back ones...they're pretty weak and buckle-prone, but good golly after having them yanked on for 1.5 hrs I don't blame him.  He's alert, standing on the back legs, trying to get up on the front legs, has eaten 2 times and acts fine.

Penny's poor twee is so swollen, I feel so bad for her.  He didn't think we needed to give Pen G (neither of us could ever really 'get in' there, there was no room w/ Mr. Big Head holding us back...) so we gave her some Banamine for pain / swelling, oxytocin to help her pass the stuff, and I'm to monitor her for bleeding.  Which has stopped.

She gave me a bit over 1/2 gallon of liquid gold (colostrum) and ate a hearty dinner and is being a very sweet doe, considering all we put her through.  I'd probably kick anyone who came near me after that, poor kid.

Vet's opinion...Penny just makes big kids.  
I asked if cutting back her feed would have made a difference and he said maybe a slight one, but the kid isn't 'fat', he's just long / wide / big framed.  Also said since she's a heavy milker, cutting her feed back might not be a good idea b/c of the hypocalcemia angle...

Who wants to let me use their black Nigi buck next year for her?


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## 20kidsonhill (May 4, 2011)

Glad after all that the kid survived, and very very happy for you the doe survived.


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## elevan (May 4, 2011)

WOWZERS!!!

Congratulations!


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## freemotion (May 4, 2011)

Holy CRAP-ARONI!   You need to take that photo again holding a fishing pole.  It reminds me of one of those "big catch" pictures!


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## ksalvagno (May 4, 2011)

Congratulations! I just can't believe the size. Talk to Kate about one of her bucks!


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## jodief100 (May 4, 2011)

My goodness!   That is one of those is it real or it is photoshop kind of pictures!


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## chandasue (May 4, 2011)

I'm lost for words......... 

Looks like you're in the mini-ober biz for sure!


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## helmstead (May 4, 2011)

GADZOOKS

  Massive miracle there!

And, Kim...I have just the black Nigerian buck for you, and he's moonspotted LOL


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## Livinwright Farm (May 4, 2011)

3 ft... WOW.... 12 lbs...  HOLY CRAP! I know women(including myself) who would  thinking about a woman passing a baby that big!!  I feel for poor Penny!!  MAN!!  But he is a pretty "little" buckling!


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## Roll farms (May 4, 2011)

I can't OWN a Nigi buck, I just need him for 5 mins. once a year.   I'd happily pay a breeding fee, though.  I'll worry about that if / when the time comes.

I just have nowhere to keep one where my 'big boys' wouldn't have access to him.  And I am at 5 bucks now....seems silly to have one to service only 1 doe.

I have decided to keep her in milk as long as she will produce (she went 16 mos last time and was actually still in milk when we decided to breed her to the Togg, then dried her off) so I can see her lactating for 2 yrs straight.

I'm just so relieved it ended well.


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## St0rmyM00n (May 4, 2011)

He is so cute thought, poor Penny. I am glad everyone is ok !!!


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## Ariel301 (May 4, 2011)

OUCH!

Poor Penny.  

I had a delivery like that this year too. My 60 pound mini doe delivered a 7.5 pound doeling that nearly turned her vulva inside out! The kid was so big she had to squat down to nurse right from the start. 

Right after birth:





But I think your kid might have mine beat, wow. He's a good looking boy at least.


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## SDGsoap&dairy (May 5, 2011)

He is an absolute MONSTER, Roll!  Good golly.  If you breed her again you might consider a CIDR.  Maybe you could get some multiples?  And yeah, go to Kate's for a "date."


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## oakmarsh nigerians (May 5, 2011)

Wow, congrats! He looks half grown! Good job Penny, she deserves a treat or 6!

Kate: Is that one of Fire Flame's? I think my FF doe is finally going to do something today!


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## helmstead (May 5, 2011)

LOL Kim, I have TWELVE bucks right now, stop yer plainin...

Oakmarsh - yep, thats Scorch, Flame x Aspen.  Hope you get babies today!


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## swest (May 5, 2011)

Congrats Kim! Big Handsome Feller!


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## Roll farms (May 5, 2011)

Kate, your 12 are lil fellers.  My bigguns equal 2.378 of yours, LOL.


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## rebelINny (May 5, 2011)




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## Emmetts Dairy (May 5, 2011)

OH my gosh!!! Poor girl!! 12 lbs    Glad they both made it through that ok...thats a loooonnnggg time in labor!!

I just went through that torture with Nora...thankfully it was twins and not "gigantor the toggie buck"  

Best of luck with her recovery after that!!!


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## GrowURown (May 5, 2011)

OMG!  I just read this and your MONSTER baby DWARFS my monster baby!  All I can think is....OUCH!  That's awesome though that things turned out okay!  and still I just keep thinking in my head "WHOA!"  That big right at the start....WHOA!  Poor, poor Penny....


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## PattySh (May 5, 2011)

Wow he's big! We had a big un last year a 10# out of a 100# (if) doe, vet delivery also. We pulled and pulled and his legs buckled something terrible for a couple of days. He turned out fine and as a yearling wether isn't really that big. Glad both doe and buckling are fine! My doe Sasha had huge twins this year 8# each stuck vet delivered again.  Going to breed her to my daughter's Nigerian buck this season.


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## Zanzabeez (May 5, 2011)

DANG he is HUGE!!! Beautiful but HUGE. Wow, Penny really does grow them big. 

Thank God you were able to get him delivered without needing a c-section and wow that he is alive after all of that! All I can say is kudos to you and your vet!

Tracy


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## country freedom (May 5, 2011)

Roll farms said:
			
		

> Oh my DANG.
> 
> It's been 8 yrs since I've called a vet to assist w/ a kidding.  8 years.  I thought I had this 'kid pullin' thing licked.
> 
> ...


Can you post a pic of Mama and son together for size comparison?


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## Livinwright Farm (May 5, 2011)

Emmetts Dairy said:
			
		

> *"gigantor the toggie buck"*


   I vote that this is what you name him!!!     How many of you agree?


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## PJisaMom (May 5, 2011)

Livinwright Farm said:
			
		

> Emmetts Dairy said:
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I'm in!


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## Roll farms (May 5, 2011)

I don't name kids I don't keep....Sorry.


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## Roll farms (May 5, 2011)

Penny is now sick.   

Temp of 105.1, hasn't eaten all day, and Penny LOVES her meals, and she's just NOT feeling / acting like her normal self.  At pm milking she had 'stinky' drainage, clear-ish and dark red combined.
I didn't find the placenta this morning, so I'm betting she retained it. 

Wishing I'da went ahead and put her on Pen G last night, but the vet said he didn't think she'd need it.  It wouldn't have kept her from retaining, but it might have staved off the infection.

I've drenched her w/ CMPK, and given her 40cc sub Q *just* in case shes' also going hypo on me.  Figure it can't hurt and the calcium might help her clean out.  Also gave her some Nutridrench and a B shot.

I gave her oxytocin an hr ago and am going to give her some Lut when I bottle feed the kids at 9pm.  I'll check her in the am and if needed, call the vet back out to flush her.

I've had 'bout all of this I'm going to take for the week, she's GOT to get better.

edited to change 9am to 9pm...I'm not thinking straight...


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## helmstead (May 5, 2011)

Poop.

Scarlett got a NASTY uterine infection this year after her first ever triplet litter which required me going in up to my shoulder to pull them.  NASTY one...

Hopefully she'll be ok...I think I'd choose a stronger antibiotic though.


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## SDGsoap&dairy (May 5, 2011)

Oh no!!  I'm sorry, Roll.  Hopefully it's just a hiccup after a really tough delivery.


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## elevan (May 5, 2011)

So sorry to hear that!  Hopefully things are looking up in the morning.


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## Livinwright Farm (May 5, 2011)

hoping she is MUCH better come morning(if not sooner)!!


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## warthog (May 5, 2011)

Congrats on the "big one'.

Sorry to hear Penny isn't too well, hope she turns rounds soon for you.


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## Roll farms (May 5, 2011)

I dunno if it's wishful thinking or not, but she seemed a *bit* perkier when I was just down there.


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## poorboys (May 5, 2011)

congrats roll, very nice looking buck, he looks like he's a month old!!! hoping all goes well with you and penny!!!!


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## Roll farms (May 6, 2011)

Penny's temp this am is 101.6 and she's snarfing alfalfa.

I went ahead and flushed her out (ick) and will keep her on the Pen G for probably 10 days.  

*whew*  I know she's not 'better' yet....but she's better than she was, and I will take it.


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## Livinwright Farm (May 6, 2011)

glad she is doing better!


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## SDGsoap&dairy (May 6, 2011)

Roll farms said:
			
		

> Penny's temp this am is 101.6 and she's snarfing alfalfa.
> 
> I went ahead and flushed her out (ick) and will keep her on the Pen G for probably 10 days.
> 
> *whew*  I know she's not 'better' yet....but she's better than she was, and I will take it.




That's GREAT news, Roll!  Sounds like she'll just need a little extra TLC after a rough kidding.


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## warthog (May 6, 2011)

Brilliant news, I am so glad to hear it, and I am sure she will get all the TLC she needs.


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## Roll farms (May 6, 2011)

She's still up / eating / acting like her old sweet self.  Now if only her milk production would go up...she's my ice cream supply girl.


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## SDGsoap&dairy (May 6, 2011)

So good to hear!   How's her huge kid?


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## Roll farms (May 6, 2011)

He's ok as far as eating / pooping / peeing.  But...I think we stretched one leg more than the other...the kid can't walk w/out dragging one of his legs.  I've got a splint on it trying to firm it up.

He was weak legged at first, which was to be expected, but this one leg really seems longer.  I'm wondering if we didn't hyperextend the tendon or something.  

Hoping tomorrow brings more improvement, he's been a bit better at walking every day.


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## RPC (May 18, 2011)

How is penny and her kid doing? I can not believe how big he was.


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## Roll farms (May 18, 2011)

The kid is fine, he wore a leg brace for a day or so until his legs got stronger and then never stopped running.  He's went on to his new home w/ his buddy Forrest.  (Thanks, Mo!)

I'd actually wanted to brag on Penny, she hit 9# of milk today (over a gallon) and I'm soooo proud of her.

She looks mighty sorry, though.  First time ever - I have a goat w/ an allergic reaction to Cyclence- but she did - and has a bald stripe down her back from a chemical burn. 


I had a BYH-er here today to pick up rabbits and I was ashamed to let her see her... but she wanted to meet her.

Other than the bald back...she's fine.  And I've lined up a date for her (after a nice loooong break / lactation) w/ a Nigi breeder about 30 minutes away when she's ready.


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## RPC (May 18, 2011)

Mini obes may become the new thing now. I am glad she is feeling better beside the bald back.


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## jodief100 (May 18, 2011)

Gald to hear mom and baby are both well!


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