# Sundragon Farms. The saga continues.



## Sundragons (Dec 24, 2017)

So I kind of started this in my intro thread. Here's that link
https://www.backyardherds.com/threa...ouse-you-live-in-an-urban-farming-tale.37136/

Picking up from that initial post, Here's where will continue the saga of life as an urban farmer in the 21st century. I have no doubt whatsoever that this journal will go completely sideways on a regular basis, because that's kinda how we live our life.Be prepared for anything, I'll try and keep it herd related, but I'm a semi-pro photographer and my muse is the 5 year old kid in my head who's constantly begging me to take pics of everything, so I'm positive that'll leak through.


For today though, some updates on rabbits. We had a litter of Holland Lops on the 20th, 8 total, one still, and one runt that passed overnight last night. So 6 there that are all looking like they're either going to end up broken tort of some variety, or black tort. Then another of our does delivered last night on day 31, 6 healthy babies. No pics of those yet, probably later. Add those 12 to the 3 Netherland Dwarf 10-day olds, and it's a busy time at the urban farm.

Some pics:

This first one is of my Blue American Bresse roo "Cluck Norris". He earned his name helping fight off a coyote to broke into the yard and managed to whack 7 of my laying hens just before Thanksgiving. Bonus pain in the butt Aussie Shepherd in the BG. She's great with all the animals, she's just an annoying dog in general. 





HL litter  from 12/20. Sadly the wrinkly one on the far right is no longer with us.



10 Day old ND's. One REW, one Chestnut, one we're not quite sure on yet. Initially we thought broken orange, but her eyes are black, so maybe broken tricolor? Also sex is indeterminate still, so I'm using "she".


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## ViolinPlayer123 (Dec 24, 2017)

Following...


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## TAH (Dec 24, 2017)

Following... 

Cute rabbits.


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## Sundragons (Dec 24, 2017)

Baby Holland Lops. First litter is 3 days. Mom is a broken blue named Bluebelle and dad is a sable point named Cappuccino, but he's kinda dirty silver. One of our breeder friends called it "smutty", but I'm not sure that's official nomenclature. 





Second litter born yesterday. Mom is a vienna marked blue-eyed orange named Butterscotch, and dad is a broken tort named Squiggles.





These will all likely end up petted out unless they're really awesome.


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## Latestarter (Dec 24, 2017)

Have to say, they're a lot cuter once they have some fur...


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## Sundragons (Dec 25, 2017)

Latestarter said:


> Have to say, they're a lot cuter once they have some fur...



That they are, for sure.


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## Bruce (Dec 26, 2017)

Latestarter said:


> Have to say, they're a lot cuter once they have some fur...


True of people as well. Of course there are some that start with "fur" and some that don't. And lots tend to have quite a bit less after some decades 



Sundragons said:


> One of our breeder friends called it "smutty", but I'm not sure that's official nomenclature.


That is how I refer to my 2012 Faverolles from Ideal. Colorwise they don't look ANYTHING like SOP Favs. Blotchy black on their fronts and sides. Yep, "smutty".


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## greybeard (Dec 26, 2017)

Bruce said:


> rue of people as well. Of course there are some that start with "fur" and some that don't. And lots tend to have quite a bit less after some decades


And some, tend to have quite a bit more after the same decades long time period.
Taken in early 2012..


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## Bruce (Dec 26, 2017)

True. And some that get a bit shy up top compensate with extra a bit lower down. Not in your case of course.


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## Sundragons (Dec 29, 2017)

Fuzzy Butts! First ND out of the nesting box.


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## ViolinPlayer123 (Dec 29, 2017)

Sundragons said:


> Fuzzy Butts! First ND out of the nesting box.
> View attachment 41662


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## Sundragons (Dec 30, 2017)

Christmas is "ruff" when you're a dog. Look at how exhausted they are after a day of doing nothing. 





(L: Dutchess Charlotte Wigglebritches, Red Merle Aussie Shepherd. R: Canis Cuprum AKA "Copper", also Red Merle Aussie)


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## Latestarter (Dec 30, 2017)

You are a mean task master forcing them to do so little that they end up completely worn out like that...


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## Bruce (Dec 30, 2017)

Sundragons said:


> Christmas is "ruff" when you're a dog. Look at how exhausted they are after a day of doing nothing.


DD2 looks like that after a day of doing nothing as well!


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## Sundragons (Dec 30, 2017)

Sooooo much better with some fur!

Group 1, born 23 Dec:
Doe: Orange VM
Buck: Broken Tort
Looks like:
1 black tort,
1, possibly 2 broken black tort,
2 broken orange
   


Group 2, born 21 Dec:
Doe: Broken Blue
Buck: Sable Point (smutty silver)
Looks like:
2 Black tort
3 Broken Black tort
1 Blue tort?


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## ViolinPlayer123 (Dec 31, 2017)

Sundragons said:


> Christmas is "ruff" when you're a dog. Look at how exhausted they are after a day of doing nothing.
> View attachment 41672
> 
> (L: Dutchess Charlotte Wigglebritches, Red Merle Aussie Shepherd. R: Canis Cuprum AKA "Copper", also Red Merle Aussie)


Hobbes says hi!


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## Sundragons (Dec 31, 2017)

ViolinPlayer123 said:


> Hobbes says hi! View attachment 41774


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## Baymule (Dec 31, 2017)

Your bunnies are cute. Love the colors. Your Aussies are pretty dogs, I've had 3 Aussies over the years. Our blue merle died in my arms a couple months ago, she left a big hole in our hearts. A neighbor has 2 red merles, so I can go get my Aussie fix, LOL.


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## Sundragons (Jan 8, 2018)

As their coats come in, they're getting easier to distinguish. This pair is one broken blue tort and one broken black tort. Now It's becoming tough to pet them all out. We'll have to see...


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## Sundragons (Jan 8, 2018)

Baymule said:


> Your bunnies are cute. Love the colors. Your Aussies are pretty dogs, I've had 3 Aussies over the years. Our blue merle died in my arms a couple months ago, she left a big hole in our hearts. A neighbor has 2 red merles, so I can go get my Aussie fix, LOL.



They're great dogs and do a great job herding things. I've got to be honest though, I'm not sure we'll get another one. I miss my Malamutes in a bad way.


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## Sundragons (Jan 11, 2018)

3 week shots. It's going to be very hard to let some of these go. We may end up keeping more than initially planned, which isn't a bad thing either.

1.) Broken black tort buck





2.) Black tort doe


 
3.) Blue and Black tort bucks


 
4.) REW doe and broken "something" Netherland Dwarfs. Some orange and black on her, so maybe tricolor? We're definitely keeping the REW, and the broken is going. These guys are actually almost 5 weeks and have been almost completely weaned. They'll go into their own cage late next week if all goes well. FWIW< that's their hay basket. Molly (mom) is in the bg.


 

 5.) Broken blue tort doe. She's such a cutie.


 

6.)A pile of sleeping babies.


 

7.) Life is exhausting when you're 3 weeks old!


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## ViolinPlayer123 (Jan 11, 2018)

Sundragons said:


> 3 week shots. It's going to be very hard to let some of these go. We may end up keeping more than initially planned, which isn't a bad thing either.
> 
> 1.) Broken black tort buck
> View attachment 42220
> ...


There so tiny! I love the lops at this stage, when their ears are just starting to "lop". And of course their eyes are way to small for their head.   Great pictures! Especially that last one!


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## promiseacres (Jan 12, 2018)

Very cute!


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## Baymule (Jan 12, 2018)

Adorable!


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## Sundragons (Jan 16, 2018)




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## Bruce (Jan 16, 2018)

Rabbits eating ... lettuce?? I put some brussel sprout leaves and lettuce out for the wild rabbit. It ate the brussel sprout leaves, dragged the lettuce out and left it.


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## Sundragons (Jan 16, 2018)

Bruce said:


> Rabbits eating ... lettuce?? I put some brussel sprout leaves and lettuce out for the wild rabbit. It ate the brussel sprout leaves, dragged the lettuce out and left it.



Yeah, the adults get romaine as treats along with other veggies. Ruby isn't strictly speaking supposed to have it yet, but if Mom says she can, well, who am I to judge?


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## ViolinPlayer123 (Jan 18, 2018)

Sundragons said:


> View attachment 42364 View attachment 42365 View attachment 42366 View attachment 42368


Why do you keep them on blankets?? Just curious.


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## Dani4Hedgies (Jan 18, 2018)

SOO cute just LOVE the broken blue tort!!!!


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## Sundragons (Jan 18, 2018)

ViolinPlayer123 said:


> Why do you keep them on blankets?? Just curious.



When we have viewings with potential adopters, we put a sheet or blanket down under the play yard thing, just to be sure they don't pick up anything off the carpet or try to eat said carpet while they're in the playpen. There's the added advantage of being able to quickly clean up 14 baby bunny's worth of pellets and not have to run the vacuum to do it.  

We also use place mats from the dollar store on the floor in the cages. When they're still small like this, their paws can slip through the floor mesh, and when they're older, it gives them some place they can get off the mesh if they want to. Since they're a buck each, it's not a big deal to replace them when bratty rabbits chew them up.


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## Sundragons (Jan 18, 2018)

Dani4Hedgies said:


> SOO cute just LOVE the broken blue tort!!!!



She's super cute. She's already sold too, clients came to see her this weekend and put a deposit hold on her (not weaned yet so not ready to go until 15 feb). She's got a sibling that's just as cute, I just haven't managed to get a good pic of him yet.


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## Dani4Hedgies (Jan 18, 2018)

Love love love the broken torts soo pretty!!!


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## ViolinPlayer123 (Jan 19, 2018)

Sundragons said:


> When we have viewings with potential adopters, we put a sheet or blanket down under the play yard thing, just to be sure they don't pick up anything off the carpet or try to eat said carpet while they're in the playpen. There's the added advantage of being able to quickly clean up 14 baby bunny's worth of pellets and not have to run the vacuum to do it.
> 
> We also use place mats from the dollar store on the floor in the cages. When they're still small like this, their paws can slip through the floor mesh, and when they're older, it gives them some place they can get off the mesh if they want to. Since they're a buck each, it's not a big deal to replace them when bratty rabbits chew them up.


That makes sense.  Thanks!


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## Sundragons (Jan 30, 2018)

I knew this day would come. My wife has been wanting a pig for years and years, and when she let me get my hedgehog, I knew this was going to be the tradeoff.

Presenting Bacon, of Clan Oinkington. Squealer of squeals, First of his name. He's coming home Friday. He's a Juliana pig, and will run in the 20-40 pound range and 15-17" tall at the shoulder.


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## Sundragons (Jan 30, 2018)

Bonus pic: Sir Winston Pricklebottom, said hedge piggy.


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## Bruce (Jan 30, 2018)

I don't think I'd want to pick up a hedgehog! OWIE!!

I don't think you would get much bacon from Bacon, might as well let DW keep him as a pet.


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## Dani4Hedgies (Jan 30, 2018)

OHH PIGGIES!!! I LOVE HEDGIES bred them for years such great little pets a spiking 1 lb cat in a litter box is how I described them. And actually if your handle your hedgie a lot you don't get poked by them cause they relax their quills


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## Sundragons (Jan 30, 2018)

Dani4Hedgies said:


> OHH PIGGIES!!! I LOVE HEDGIES bred them for years such great little pets a spiking 1 lb cat in a litter box is how I described them. And actually if your handle your hedgie a lot you don't get poked by them cause they relax their quills



The quills also dull a bit as you handle them. When Winston's relaxed, it's like handling a Brillo pad. Winston's a butt though and doesn't like to be handled a whole lot. He also hates baths. I woulnd't mind trying to breed them, but we need a bit more experience keeping hedgies ourselves before we try that.


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## Dani4Hedgies (Jan 30, 2018)

Anytime you want to chat about breeding hedgies feel free to Pm me and we can chat they are wonderful sweet pets and are a lot of fun to breed.


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## Sundragons (Jan 30, 2018)

Dani4Hedgies said:


> Anytime you want to chat about breeding hedgies feel free to Pm me and we can chat they are wonderful sweet pets and are a lot of fun to breed.


I'll take you  up on that when we get to the point where we're ready to give it a shot.


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## Sundragons (Jan 30, 2018)

Last few days with moms before they go to the weaning cages.

broken black tort buck. Love his ears.



 

Broken Blue Tort doe. She's staying with us.


 

Trogdor the Bunnynator (foreground) . He's sold, that's what they named him. 


 

Pile-up at the feed trough. 3 bucks, 2 does, all will go (I think. I'm still debating keeping pink ears there second from right)


 

Blue tort and broken black tort


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## Dani4Hedgies (Jan 30, 2018)

Sooo cute!!!! I'm still learning what colors come from what breeds is it possible to get a Tort in either Rex or Angora?


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## Sundragons (Jan 30, 2018)

Dani4Hedgies said:


> Sooo cute!!!! I'm still learning what colors come from what breeds is it possible to get a Tort in either Rex or Angora?



They're not an identical match, but sable in rex's can look similar to a black tort holland.  Angoras DO come in tortoise, in all 4 varieties it looks like.


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## Dani4Hedgies (Jan 30, 2018)

Sundragons said:


> They're not an identical match, but sable in rex's can look similar to a black tort holland.  Angoras DO come in tortoise, in all 4 varieties it looks like.


Great thank you I thought so but I wanted to make sure


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## Sundragons (Feb 3, 2018)

Took some "Glamour Shotz" today. Here's a few.

Broken Black Tort. His name's Gizmo, and he's staying in our breeding program.




Broken Orange with soft pink ears 



Another broken black tort. Just a few little black stains though. 



 Another broken black tort, the twin of the one above. The only way we tell them apart is one has white tipped ears.



This guy's just a little goofball. No telling if his ears are going to fall or not, but he's really friendly and energetic 



 Black tort


 

And Miss Penelope of Pancetta. She's my wife's birthday present.


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## Dani4Hedgies (Feb 3, 2018)

Love them sooo pretty and the piggy is soo cute


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## ViolinPlayer123 (Feb 5, 2018)

Sundragons said:


> Took some "Glamour Shotz" today. Here's a few.
> 
> Broken Black Tort. His name's Gizmo, and he's staying in our breeding program.
> View attachment 43267
> ...


Da bunnies are CUTE!


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## Sundragons (Feb 6, 2018)

ViolinPlayer123 said:


> Da bunnies are CUTE!


They're flying out the door too. Had a breeder working BEW schedule an appointment last night, they're very interested in my vienna carriers. Hoping I can work out a trade with them because I'd like to work a line of BEW Hollands and need some stock diversity.


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## Sundragons (Feb 10, 2018)

Saturday at our place...

Newborns, my Wife's birthday piggie, and some 7 week olds hanging out.


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## Sundragons (Feb 13, 2018)

Derpy Charlotte is a derp.


 

Looks like the Netherlands are 3 chestnuts and 2 blacks. We'll see if that holds up.


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## Sundragons (Feb 17, 2018)

Little Chestnut ND kit, a week old today.

...Vienna Marked? @Bunnylady ? is that what I'm seeing here?


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## Bunnylady (Feb 17, 2018)

Sundragons said:


> Little Chestnut ND kit, a week old today.
> 
> ...Vienna Marked? @Bunnylady ? is that what I'm seeing here?
> 
> View attachment 43962



Possibly, though a blaze that perfectly centered could be Dutch markings. Any BEW's in the background?


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## Sundragons (Feb 17, 2018)

Bunnylady said:


> Possibly, though a blaze that perfectly centered could be Dutch markings. Any BEW's in the background?



REW, yes. Mom threw one last litter and both of her litter sibs have as well. Not BEW though, at least not that we're aware of. This is dad's first litter, and he's a black.

All 3 of the Chestnuts in this litter are marked like this. This one's the most prominent. the other 2 in this litter are black. (5 kits total)


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## Bruce (Feb 18, 2018)

Reading rabbit threads suggests there are too many pattern/colors for bunnies!! How do you keep them all straight, or even figure out what a given bunny is?


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## Sundragons (Feb 18, 2018)

Bruce said:


> Reading rabbit threads suggests there are too many pattern/colors for bunnies!! How do you keep them all straight, or even figure out what a given bunny is?



I'm using a program called Rabbit Register to track pairings and the general operations of our rabbitry. It gives me predictions based on the parents for a litter, and then based on what I know about their pedigrees and their siblings, I can make some reasonable guesses about outcomes. I'm still learning the rabbit genome myself, and the research can get overwhelming at times. Having some sources you can trust to ask questions (like bunnylady) also helps.

In the end, even with general predictions, It's still a roll of the dice on what you get. With this specific doe even, we got a REW in our last litter and we didn't know she carried the gene for it until she was born.  Specifically with this litter I figured we'd see chestnuts, black, and probably otters. I just wasn't expecting the white markers.


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## Bunnylady (Feb 18, 2018)

Sundragons said:


> REW, yes. Mom threw one last litter and both of her litter sibs have as well. Not BEW though, at least not that we're aware of. This is dad's first litter, and he's a black.
> 
> All 3 of the Chestnuts in this litter are marked like this. This one's the most prominent. the other 2 in this litter are black. (5 kits total)



There are things known as Vienna Carriers, that have a copy of the gene for BEW but don't express it. Vienna Marked is much more common, though.

I'd think it would be pretty unusual to have that many VM's with no blue eyes at all, so I'd be looking at eye color to help me to decide. There are a lot of Dutch pattern genes running around in the Dwarfs, which can get you small facial markings and/or white on the feet.

Neither parent are brokens, are they?



Bruce said:


> Reading rabbit threads suggests there are too many pattern/colors for bunnies!! How do you keep them all straight, or even figure out what a given bunny is?



There are a bunch of genes that go into making rabbit coat color, but if you are familiar with the concept of a "dichotomous key," that's kind of how you arrive at the color. You ask yourself, "do I see_ this_, yes or no?" If yes, then you go one way, if no, you go another way, through all the various steps of the key, until you arrive at the combination that is that color. When you know what the genes do, it's not that hard to figure out what you are seeing - most of the time. Pictures don't always get you there, though; sometimes it can be something subtle.



An example of that might be the 5-day-old Netherland Dwarf babies in this picture. The one in the back is probably a REW, though it might be a Himi, I don't yet know what the buck was so I can't be sure. The one in the front isn't dark enough to be a Black, doesn't appear to be any shade of brown,  so I know it's a Blue something. The belly and the insides of the ears are light colored, so I know it's not a Self color, which leaves Agouti and Tan patterns. The body hairs are long enough for the banding of Agouti to show, and since there is no banding, it must be a Tan pattern - which leaves only Blue Otter or Blue Silver Marten as possibilities. The insides of the ears don't look yellowish, but I'm waiting for a light-colored triangle to develop behind the ears to be sure. If the triangle is white, it's a Silver Marten, if it is tan colored, it's an Otter.

Pretty simple, really, for most breeds. It gets crazy-making with the Angoras; the colors get so diluted on those long hairs, some colors get pretty hard to tell apart.


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## Bruce (Feb 18, 2018)

I read what you wrote @Bunnylady ... and  got a headache.


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## Bunnylady (Feb 18, 2018)

Bruce said:


> I read what you wrote @Bunnylady ... and  got a headache.





Just the process of elimination - what's so tough about that?

But like I said, when you know what the genes do, it's not so bad. You just have to learn them one at a time rather than trying to take on the whole thing at once.


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## Sundragons (Feb 18, 2018)

Bunnylady said:


> There are things known as Vienna Carriers, that have a copy of the gene for BEW but don't express it. Vienna Marked is much more common, though.
> 
> I'd think it would be pretty unusual to have that many VM's with no blue eyes at all, so I'd be looking at eye color to help me to decide. There are a lot of Dutch pattern genes running around in the Dwarfs, which can get you small facial markings and/or white on the feet.
> 
> Neither parent are brokens, are they?



Nope. Mon's the brindled harlequin Orange I asked you about a few weeks ago, and the Buck's a black. I was thinking I'd have to watch eye color to be sure, but the Dutch marking didn't occur to me at all, so now I'm leaning that way pending seeing their peepers. 

I know about VC, I have a VM Orange Holland lop doe with blue eyes. However, am I incorrect in assuming that her offspring would all be VC since she's VM?


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## Bunnylady (Feb 18, 2018)

No, VM and VC are the same - one copy of Vienna, and one of non-Vienna. Because she has one of each, the doe will give Vienna to some babies, and non-Vienna to others. If she is bred to a buck that doesn't have Vienna, some of her babies will not have any Vienna genes at all, though without test breeding you can't be sure which are simply non-Vienna and which VC.


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## Sundragons (Feb 18, 2018)

Shots from today.

1. The ND litter sleeping.





2.Bluebell's litter, 4 days old. (Parents are a broken blue doe, broken black tort buck) There's a 4th but it's a peanut, and while it's fighting, I'm guarded on whether or not it'll make it. Half the size of the others and we're supplementing it with KMR to try and keep it going. Looks like we have a broken blue, a broken black, and a broken black tort.





3. Butterschotch's litter (mom's a Blue eyed VM orange, buck is a black self). Looks like a black, a VM orange, possible a VM black otter, and a black otter 3 days old


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## Sundragons (Feb 18, 2018)

Bunnylady said:


> No, VM and VC are the same - one copy of Vienna, and one of non-Vienna. Because she has one of each, the doe will give Vienna to some babies, and non-Vienna to others. If she is bred to a buck that doesn't have Vienna, some of her babies will not have any Vienna genes at all, though without test breeding you can't be sure which are simply non-Vienna and which VC.



Ah! OK, I thought it was cause/effect. not like to like. Now it makes sense.


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## Sundragons (Feb 28, 2018)

Bunnies update, and a new piggle at the farm. His name is Obi Wan Swinobi. That name barely beat out close contenders "Albert Einswine", and "Ham Solo". "Pjork", while AMAZING, was nor fitting for a boy, so we'll hold onto that one for another girl later if we have one.


 

 

 

HL litter one. 3 brokens form broken parents on both sides.


 

HL Litter 2. A great mix from a proven buck and doe. they always have super cute babies.


 

ND litter. 5 little spaz monkeys, all in a basket.


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## Bruce (Feb 28, 2018)

Too funny! And you have names for future swine.



Sundragons said:


> 3 brokens from broken parents on both sides.


You know, something just doesn't sound right about the rabbits being broken.


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## Sundragons (Mar 4, 2018)

Chicken math being what it is, I picked up this one Russian Orloff yesterday while out getting rabbit supplies.


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## Latestarter (Mar 4, 2018)

Yup... yup... I only see ONE there!  Not good to only have one chick though... you may want to go get a few more so it has company.


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## frustratedearthmother (Mar 4, 2018)

LS - need new glasses?  I see six!  (their color does blend with the shavings though)


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## Bruce (Mar 4, 2018)

I believe that @Latestarter is an enabler. Selective vision.


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## Sundragons (Mar 4, 2018)

frustratedearthmother said:


> LS - need new glasses?  I see six!  (their color does blend with the shavings though)


Nah, LS is right. In chicken math, that's "one".


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## frustratedearthmother (Mar 4, 2018)

True dat!


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## Dani4Hedgies (Mar 5, 2018)

Yep only see one lonely chick


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## Sundragons (Mar 10, 2018)

Saturday morning randoms.

1. The girls out cruising the yard



 

2. Tortoise having some eggs for breakfast.


 

3. Obi Wan Swinobi having his breakfast


 

4. 4 week old Netherland Dwarf buck


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## Latestarter (Mar 11, 2018)

That's a pretty good sized tortoise!


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## Sundragons (Mar 11, 2018)

Latestarter said:


> That's a pretty good sized tortoise!



She's about 12 years old. ~22" long and pushing 85 pounds. She's our largest. No where near fully grown, either.


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## ViolinPlayer123 (Mar 16, 2018)

Glad you got a friend for your 1 chick.  I'm sure everybody over here will want to see the 2 together.


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## Sundragons (Mar 16, 2018)

ViolinPlayer123 said:


> Glad you got a friend for your 1 chick.  I'm sure everybody over here will want to see the 2 together.



Hadn't gotten that far yet, you're cheating. 

ANYWAY, yes, picked up a friend today for the Orloff I got a couple weeks ago. He looked kinda lonely, and the TSC by my house had a bunch of mixed breeds come in today that were all supposedly sexed, so I picked up a companion. She's a Silver laced Wynadotte/Blue Wyandotte/ Speckled Sussex mix.



 

Here they are playing together.


 

Bonus lazy piggle action.


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## Latestarter (Mar 16, 2018)

here's my latest pig action:


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## Sundragons (Mar 16, 2018)

Latestarter said:


> here's my latest pig action:
> View attachment 45450



That looks amazing! I'm throwing a pork butt in the smoker tomorrow.

...just not these specific butts.


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## Bruce (Mar 17, 2018)

Sundragons said:


> She's a Silver laced Wynadotte/Blue Wyandotte/ Speckled Sussex mix.


Where the heck did TSC get that? Hatcheries that sell to the farm stores don't generally sell SOP quality birds but they don't sell mutts either. At least not unless they are trying to make their own "non breed".


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## Sundragons (Mar 17, 2018)

Bruce said:


> Where the heck did TSC get that? Hatcheries that sell to the farm stores don't generally sell SOP quality birds but they don't sell mutts either. At least not unless they are trying to make their own "non breed".



Apologies, I was using chicken math descriptions. 1 Blue 'dotte, , 2 silver laces, 3 sussex. In chicken math, 1+2+3 = 1. Since there's only "one", it MUST be a hybrid.

Expanding on that a bit, I have "one" Orloff chick as well as you can see in that second photo. So 1+2+3+6 = 2, because we all know chickens do well in pairs.


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## Bruce (Mar 17, 2018)

Sorry I can't double "like" that post!


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## Sundragons (Mar 17, 2018)

Bruce said:


> Sorry I can't double "like" that post!


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## promiseacres (Mar 17, 2018)

Good chicken math. What type of tortoises?  My friend has a couple, a small Russian and A sulcata they are really neat pets.


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## Sundragons (Mar 17, 2018)

promiseacres said:


> Good chicken math. What type of tortoises?  My friend has a couple, a small Russian and A sulcata they are really neat pets.


We have 4 large adult Sulcatas. 1 male, 3 female, all between 9-13 years old, and 65-90 pounds.


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## promiseacres (Mar 17, 2018)

Neat. Thor is only about 45 #.  Loves scratches.


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## Sundragons (Mar 24, 2018)

We got a new buck to put int he BEW pool. He's 8 weeks so it'll be a while before I can breed him, but we're hopeful. Kids named him Ice Bear.



 
Also tossed out the orloffs into the grow-out pen. Then the other chicks spent an hour complaining and calling for them, so we tossed them out too. Fortunately it's warm enough here thaty they'll be fine as long as they sleep in the nesting area.


 

And a basket full of netherlands out for some playtime


----------



## Sundragons (Mar 25, 2018)

Backyard day. Did a whole lot of nothing and enjoyed it. Some pics:

1. Obi Wan Swinobi


 

2. Frizzle!

 
3. Silkies be crazy. This one's no eggception.


 
4. Svart Hona


 
5. A few of the girls hanging out.


 
6. Ole' (Olay), GLW


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## Sundragons (Mar 26, 2018)

Annd, yet another instance of "no matter where we go, horses want to lick me". For scale, I'm 5'6" (1.67M), and his back's a good 6" over my head at least. I love big Percherons and Friesians.


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## Bruce (Mar 26, 2018)

Yep, BIG horse! I'm 6'1", I'd have to jump to see over his back!


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## Latestarter (Mar 27, 2018)

Yup, you picked a couple of rather large sized horses to like. You are obviously very tasty.  to horses


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## Sundragons (Mar 27, 2018)

Latestarter said:


> Yup, you picked a couple of rather large sized horses to like. You are obviously very tasty.  to horses



Yeah, wifey and I both love the bigger draft lines. I'd feel bad asking a smaller horse to haul me at anything faster than a leisurely walk. I'm not fat, but I'm also not the ideal weight for someone of my stature. Friesians are a bit more spunky, but if you ask them to go, they'll fly. Perches aren't as quick, but they're surprisingly agile for such a massive frame. It's like riding a sofa.


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## Sundragons (Apr 5, 2018)

Some of the goings-on around these parts recently.

Obi eating my shoe.



 
Penelope begging for treats


 

Morning conference around the water cooler


 

Fluffy selfie


 

Ruby at Easter


 

Former family member Trogdor and his new Friend Vader on their first visit. Seems like a good match.




Assorted Orloffs, Speckled Sussex, and a couple flavors of Wyandotte in the grow-out coop


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## Wehner Homestead (Apr 5, 2018)

I’m now following along on your math adventures! I love it! Going to have to use this to my advantage!!!


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## Sundragons (Apr 17, 2018)

First of 5 liters delivered about an hour ago. Chestnut x Broken Silver Marten ND parents, 4 kits. At least one that looks to be a broken patterned just like Dad, and one otter. The other 2 are light but can't tell what yet. Fingers crossed we'll get the other 4 litters soon too.


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## Latestarter (Apr 17, 2018)

congrats!


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## promiseacres (Apr 18, 2018)

Congratulations! We had a litter of Polish this morning.


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## Sundragons (Apr 18, 2018)

Litter 1: Agouti doe x broken silver marten buck. Looks like 2 brokens, one otter, one probably agouti


 

Litter 2: Black otter doe x black buck. Looks like 3 black otters.


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## Sundragons (Apr 18, 2018)

Litter number 3 has arrived, 2 black tort holland lops from first time momma. Pics soon.


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## Wehner Homestead (Apr 18, 2018)

kits!!! Congrats!


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## Sundragons (Apr 18, 2018)

Litter 4 is inbound. momma is stripping herself naked and tossing fur EVERYWHERE. Then One more to go (#5), and the one I am most worried about. She had a rough delivery first time and we're keeping a close eye on her because she's absolutely dripping with babies when you feel her belly.


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## Bayleaf Meadows (Apr 18, 2018)

Why is Trogdor a "former" family member?


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## Sundragons (Apr 18, 2018)

Bayleaf Meadows said:


> Why is Trogdor a "former" family member?


 
Trogdor was a rabbit we adopted out from a previous litter to family friends. He was claimed the day he was born.  That photo was taken the night we took Vader (now known as Poe) over for meet and greet. As expected, he stayed.


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## Sundragons (Apr 19, 2018)

Sundragons said:


> Litter number 3 has arrived, 2 black tort holland lops from first time momma. Pics soon.




Edit:
5! Either I counted too soon or I didn't dig  deep enough in the nesting box to find the other 3.


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## Sundragons (Apr 22, 2018)

Baby update. #5 is still overdue. She's going to the vet tomorrow if we don't have some action.

Pics of the other litters

Holland Lop: 5x Black tort. Doe is Black Tory, Buck is a smutty Sable Point. First litter for this doe, and she seems to be doing OK so far.



 

Netherland Dwarf:

#1. 3x Black. Doe is a Champagne and Buck is a Sable Point. This litter is our first pedigree litter and I'm hopeful we have some showable kits. Dad has a BOB and a BOS leg under his belt. Since Mom's a champagne she's not showable, but she has great form, so fingers crossed.


 

ND Litter #2. 3x Black Otter. Doe is BO and Buck is black.


 

ND litter #3. 2x Broken black marten or Broken Silver Marten, one Black otter or black silver marten, one chinchilla(? She looks less brown in person). Doe is a chestnut, buck is a broken silver marten


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## Sundragons (Apr 22, 2018)

Play day with Mr Tortie this morning while we cleaned his pen.


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## Sundragons (Apr 23, 2018)

Well, slight setback. I had to take 3 kits from my first time mom Holland Lop. She was only feeding 1 of the 5 and it doesn't seem like she's got enough milk. one of them died in my hands as I was trying to get it warmed up and fed, I left the one who's obviously been eating with her, and the other 3 I fostered out with our 3 Netherlands who all delivered the same day. I'm sort of guarded on their prospects at this point.


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## Sundragons (Apr 24, 2018)

Lost another one. I was not sure it'd make it, was pretty lethargic last night when I was checking on it and wouldn't eat. The others seem to be doing OK. full bellies and staying warm.


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## promiseacres (Apr 24, 2018)

that's a bummer, hard to get them back once they start fading.


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## Bruce (Apr 24, 2018)

So sorry @Sundragons. The more I read about raising rabbits the more I think it isn't as easy as "They breed like rabbits".


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## Wehner Homestead (Apr 24, 2018)

X2!


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## Sundragons (Apr 24, 2018)

Bruce said:


> So sorry @Sundragons. The more I read about raising rabbits the more I think it isn't as easy as "They breed like rabbits".


Very true.  Losing any animal is the hardest part. I try very hard to not form an emotional attachment to them, especially when they're so young and at risk. Same with the chickens and tortoises. There's always going to be some loss and you have to deal with it as it comes. We're trying our best, and doing everything we can, but sometimes it just isn't enough, and you have to be prepared to accept that.

Doesn't make it suck any less, and doesn't make you stop second guessing what you did to see if there's anything you could have done differently that would have made a difference.


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## Sundragons (Apr 24, 2018)

And then you get something like this to end the day on a positive note. This little Chestnut Agouti VM Holland Lop doe went to a fellow rabbiter here in AZ for her BEW program Tonight she sent me this update. Her name's now Scooter and they're thrilled with her. Makes it all worth it when you get a good match.


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## Latestarter (Apr 25, 2018)

Awwwwww....


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## Sundragons (Apr 26, 2018)

Baby ND, about a week old. I think it's a broken sable marten because of the tan ears. @Bunnylady, that seem right to you? Buck is broken silver marten, doe is chestnut. markings are very similar to Daddy's, but daddy has no tan.


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## Bunnylady (Apr 26, 2018)

Wow. When I click on the picture, it gets so big, I can see fingerprints!

I'm thinking possibly Broken Black Otter,_ maybe_ maybe Broken Chin, but more likely, Broken Chestnut. You'll get a better idea in another week or two.


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## Sundragons (Apr 26, 2018)

Bunnylady said:


> Wow. When I click on the picture, it gets so big, I can see fingerprints!
> 
> I'm thinking possibly Broken Black Otter,_ maybe_ maybe Broken Chin, but more likely, Broken Chestnut. You'll get a better idea in another week or two.



Interesting! Will definitely have to watch this one then and see.


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## Sundragons (Apr 29, 2018)




----------



## Wehner Homestead (Apr 29, 2018)




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## Sundragons (Apr 30, 2018)

If you're on BYC you may have seen this over there when I posted it just now, but I'm posting it here too because we're super excited!

Found this little one under one of our Barred Rocks when I went to pick her up and put her on a perch. Had no idea we'd had  a hatch at all, and this is our very first. Woo!


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## Sundragons (May 1, 2018)

There's also this silliness going on. That's mom's pellet dish they're curled up in. ~12 days old, eyes open, and wandering in and out of the box.


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## ViolinPlayer123 (May 2, 2018)

Sundragons said:


> And then you get something like this to end the day on a positive note. This little Chestnut Agouti VM Holland Lop doe went to a fellow rabbiter here in AZ for her BEW program Tonight she sent me this update. Her name's now Scooter and they're thrilled with her. Makes it all worth it when you get a good match.
> 
> View attachment 47348


Very cute!  


I don't make it over here that much.


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## Sundragons (May 5, 2018)

Some  shots during cage cleaning chores today.


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## Bruce (May 5, 2018)

Nice buns!


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## Latestarter (May 5, 2018)

You really have very nice looking animals.


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## Sundragons (May 5, 2018)

Latestarter said:


> You really have very nice looking animals.


Thanks!


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## Sundragons (May 6, 2018)

Bruce said:


> Nie buns!


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## Sundragons (May 9, 2018)

For some reason, my 17 year old arrived home late last night with a random puppy. We didn't know anything about it until he showed up with it. Needless to say, we're not keeping the little guy but we are fostering him this week while the rescue we're working with makes a permanent arrangement for him. We would keep him if we had more room, but the zoo is full.

Cute little fella though, he'll be easy to adopt out, even for a pittie.




Obi likes him, they've been playing most of the day.


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## Sundragons (May 9, 2018)

Houdini, our adopted Harlequin Mini Lop, relaxing while I cleaned his cage.


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## Wehner Homestead (May 9, 2018)

Does he have control of that upright ear or is that a fault? Just curious. Love his coloring though!


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## Sundragons (May 9, 2018)

Wehner Homestead said:


> Does he have control of that upright ear or is that a fault? Just curious. Love his coloring though!



All radar, all the time.  Houdini came to us as an adoptee who was supposed to be a Holland and is clearly not. Kinda bummed. I love his coloration but I don't want to add minis as a third breed right now so he'll just be a mellow pet.

Amusingly, I DO have a wonderful HL buck who also has a radar ear that we named "Radar" because of it. So far it hasn't bred true with his offspring, which is great because he throws good babies.


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## Sundragons (May 9, 2018)

Life with pigs.





Also life with tortoises.


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## Sundragons (May 14, 2018)

Fostered this little cutie last week. He tested positive for parvo on Friday, but got released to his new foster fam today after spending the weekend in vet ICU! We think he's a Pitt + Basset or Daschund mix. DW is making noises about getting him back, so stay tuned.


 

Some random rabbits. The tiny holland is a little underweight so we're supplementing him with extras KMR 2x/day to bulk him up.


 



I may have a hard time letting this broken Chestnut go. SUPER cute.


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## Latestarter (May 15, 2018)

Sure is a very cute puppy face. Parvo totally sucks! Glad the little one made it through. My first PB golden retriever got Parvo and spent 3 days in puppy ICU. That ended up costing me twice as much as what I paid for the pup Very pretty rabbits as well. You have some really pretty, healthy rabbits. Love looking at them. They almost look unreal.


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## Bruce (May 15, 2018)

Sundragons said:


> I may have a hard time letting this broken Chestnut go. SUPER cute.


Aren't they ALL super cute?


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## Wehner Homestead (May 15, 2018)

X2


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## Sundragons (May 15, 2018)

Bruce said:


> Aren't they ALL super cute?



For sure. That's what keeps me in business, after all. Occasionally, however, we get one that's just too striking or cute to let go, and this little one may fall in that category.


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## Sundragons (May 15, 2018)

Checkup day at the vet! Clean bill of health!


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## Wehner Homestead (May 15, 2018)

Love the different eye colors!  Of course, I’m an Aussie fan too.


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## Sundragons (May 19, 2018)

Weaned and sexed today. Annoyingly, the best looking ones are all bucks! I may still keep one of the brokens anyway, because broken.

These are 2 bucks and a doe. Still insure of color, leaning toward black otter with silver ticking, but waiting to see how they shed out to be sure.




2 brokens. Struggling for colors here.One's definitely looking broken chestnut, and the other I was leaning broken black otter. The Chestnut though shoud not be possible according to rabbit register, so maybe broken sable chin? Either way, both bucks.



Black tort HL doe


 

These blacks are my pedigree line, 2 bucks and a doe. I'll hold on to them a bit longer and see if they have show potential before I pet them out. One of them will be staying though to forward the line. The blue in the back is looking blue marten today. Initially thought he was chin but definitely not.


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## Latestarter (May 20, 2018)

Pretty rabbits. No idea about all the varieties of names and colors. Too confusing to me.


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## Sundragons (May 20, 2018)

Me too. Suffice it to say that based on the mom and dad, what I'm seeing should not be possible unless one's carrying dilute somewhere.


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## Bruce (May 21, 2018)

Me three!!


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## promiseacres (May 21, 2018)

Any chance of sable martin? 
Dilutes sure can pop up out of no where. 


Sundragons said:


> Weaned and sexed today. Annoyingly, the best looking ones are all bucks! I may still keep one of the brokens anyway, because broken.
> 
> These are 2 bucks and a doe. Still insure of color, leaning toward black otter with silver ticking, but waiting to see how they shed out to be sure.
> View attachment 48415
> ...


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## Sundragons (May 22, 2018)

Just loving the colors on these two. They're officially on hold, a client fell for the entire litter.


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## Bruce (May 24, 2018)

Cute bunnies!


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## Sundragons (May 30, 2018)

New phone, new camera. What else am I supposed to do but take pics? 

Thirsty Hedgehog. Come to think of it, that might be a good name for a Pub.




"Can we come out? Please?" 



This little one is a bit runty, so we gave her some extra feed.  



Sally and Chickpea smooching.


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## Bruce (May 30, 2018)

Sundragons said:


> Thirsty Hedgehog. Come to think of it, that might be a good name for a Pub.


It would!!! When do you open?


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## Wehner Homestead (May 30, 2018)

X2!! Lol

I also laughed at the EXTRA feed!!


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## Sundragons (May 30, 2018)

Annd just did bed check. Had 2 Hollands that were due 29th, so any day. One is one of my established does and even though she generally has good litters, sometimes she'll drop a kit on the wire instead of in the box. She delivered 4 healthy babies this morning. I bred her to my VM blue eyed buck, so I'm hopeful we'll get some good Vienna traits from her litter. 3 lights and a dark that looks like an otter. Man, a blue eyed black otter would be the bomb!

To our surprise, the first time doe I bred the same day actually delivered too. I didn't feel kits when I palpated her, she has shown zero signs of nesting, and so I'd given up. Turns out that was a mistake, she pulled overnight and made a nest in her litter box, of all places, with her dinner hay. Unfortunately she lost one, but I transplanted her and the baby to a larger cage with a nice box, so hopefully she can raise the other one. We'll keep an eye on her since this is her first litter, but I'm pretty excited.


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## Sundragons (May 30, 2018)

Well, Suck. Toothless (the first time mom) tossed her kit out of the nesting box sometime today while we were gone, and it did not make it. I expected it, but it still makes me sad.


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## Sundragons (May 31, 2018)

This rabbit continues to surprise me. She was acting a little odd and spending a lot of time int eh box last night after I removed the passed kit, so I left the box in for her figuring maybe she wasn't quite done yet. We have a ND that has delivered kits over a 24 hour period once before, so I know it's a possibility. Sure enough, she had another kit this morning and was in the box caring for it.

Just goes  to show you can't always predict how they're going to behave. Also checked on the other momma today. All 4 babies are doing well so far. 3 brokens and that dark one that looks otter or possible black VM. Time will tell, they're more wrinkles than fur at this point.


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## Sundragons (Jun 4, 2018)

Here's the Vienna Marked litter. 3 definite Vm (1 blue 3 orange). The broken, I'm not sure about but likely a vienna carrier if nothing else.


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## Sundragons (Jun 11, 2018)

This little blue is a pudge!




These VM hollands are going to be super cute.


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## Bruce (Jun 12, 2018)

Are there ears on that blue or is it a lamancha type?


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## Wehner Homestead (Jun 12, 2018)

I am shaking my head at you @Bruce ! Lol


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## Sundragons (Jun 12, 2018)

Bruce said:


> Are there ears on that blue or is it a lamancha type?



Hahahahahahaha! Van Gogh.

But seriously, it's got ears, they're just pasted back against it's head. I'm so bummed, this one would make an incredible show rabbit, but no pedigree.


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## Sundragons (Jun 12, 2018)

Went and pulled all the eggs from the broodys last night. 5 girls fighting over 3 boxes where everyone was laying. 42 of the 70 showed some kind of development, so they went into the 'bator. Someone kept killing chicks as soon as they hatched, so it was time to intervene.


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## Bruce (Jun 12, 2018)

Looks like there will be a lot of cheeping at your place soon. Sorry to hear about the chick killer.


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## Wehner Homestead (Jun 12, 2018)

Do you not have an issue with the “dirty” eggs? My first two bator batches grew until about day 16 and died. Was told probably a bacteria in my styrofoam bator...going to set some from my roo in the next few days. He attempted to attack me over the weekend and won’t take a chance with the kids. He’s going to rooster heaven by the end of the week. Just curious if I’ll have any success.

I am going to bleach my bator today and let it dry thoroughly. Gold listerine was recommended to spray the bator and eggs to disinfect. Let dry thoroughly. Dry hatch was also recommended. 

Just looking for some recommendations.


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## Sundragons (Jun 12, 2018)

Wehner Homestead said:


> Do you not have an issue with the “dirty” eggs? My first two bator batches grew until about day 16 and died. Was told probably a bacteria in my styrofoam bator...going to set some from my roo in the next few days. He attempted to attack me over the weekend and won’t take a chance with the kids. He’s going to rooster heaven by the end of the week. Just curious if I’ll have any success.
> 
> I am going to bleach my bator today and let it dry thoroughly. Gold listerine was recommended to spray the bator and eggs to disinfect. Let dry thoroughly. Dry hatch was also recommended.
> 
> Just looking for some recommendations.




This is our first batch in the bator, so I don't know. i didn't want to wash them first because I wasn't sure if the temp would fluctuate too quickly and upset the balance.


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## Sundragons (Jun 12, 2018)

Bruce said:


> Looks like there will be a lot of cheeping at your place soon. Sorry to hear about the chick killer.


we shall see!


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## ViolinPlayer123 (Jun 12, 2018)

Wehner Homestead said:


> Do you not have an issue with the “dirty” eggs? My first two bator batches grew until about day 16 and died. Was told probably a bacteria in my styrofoam bator...going to set some from my roo in the next few days. He attempted to attack me over the weekend and won’t take a chance with the kids. He’s going to rooster heaven by the end of the week. Just curious if I’ll have any success.
> 
> I am going to bleach my bator today and let it dry thoroughly. Gold listerine was recommended to spray the bator and eggs to disinfect. Let dry thoroughly. Dry hatch was also recommended.
> 
> Just looking for some recommendations.


I would skip the listerine.


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## Wehner Homestead (Jun 12, 2018)

ViolinPlayer123 said:


> I would skip the listerine.



What’s your process?


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## Sundragons (Jun 12, 2018)

THE BLUE VIENNA MARKED HOLLAND LOP HAS BLUE EYES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



 

No. I'm not excited at all. Why do you ask?


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## Wehner Homestead (Jun 13, 2018)

Will you retain that one?? Lol

It’s very cute!


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## Sundragons (Jun 13, 2018)

Wehner Homestead said:


> Will you retain that one?? Lol
> 
> It’s very cute!



Pretty sure this one's a keeper.


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## Sundragons (Jun 16, 2018)

Yeah, these 2 are DEFINITELY staying.


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## Sundragons (Jun 24, 2018)

Some more of the Netherlands.


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## Bruce (Jun 24, 2018)

Those bunnies sure are cute!


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## Sundragons (Jun 28, 2018)

Baby day! We were expecting 3 litters and we have 3 litters.

First time ND Mom BURIED HER BABIES. I thought she was just making a mess in the nest box so I pulled it to clear the garbage and uncovered these


 
Our Chestnut x brkoen silver marten ND also has 4. They're dark and otter patterned, we''ll see if they end up otters or martens. She's given us both with the same buck. I am bummed we got 4 solids and no brokens. First time that's happened with this buck.

Last my black tort x broken black tort (with dillute) dropped 6, 5 made it. All are torts, but with no fur yet I don't know how many are brokens.

Pics soon, probably this weekend.
Blue Silver Marten x Sable point, I'm really curious to see what we get. I didn't see any other babies so I'm pretty happy with 4 live from a first time delivery.


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## Sundragons (Jun 29, 2018)

Holland lops. All torts. I think that looks like a black tort, a blue tort, a broken blue tort, and 2 broken black torts, but it could be a trick of the lighting too. Need more fur! They're all definitely Black tort based.  Parents are black tort x broken black tort with dilute, so we'll see what colors we get.


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## Pastor Dave (Jun 29, 2018)

Here are approx week olds that my White and red broken pattern mutt kindled with a little help of my rookie NZW Intermediate buck. He's proven now, I guess. The dam to the doe was a red mutt that had black, brown, brokens. Just never knew what she would end up with.


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## Sundragons (Jun 29, 2018)

That's a good mix @Pastor Dave, those patterns are great.


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## Pastor Dave (Jun 29, 2018)

Unfortunately, no one here appreciates the coats. They're too big for pets, and the coat comes off for meat. They are cute for a while. It is why I prefer to raise the standard NZW. Not as much character to get attached to.


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## Sundragons (Jun 29, 2018)

Pastor Dave said:


> Unfortunately, no one here appreciates the coats. They're too big for pets, and the coat comes off for meat. They are cute for a while. It is why I prefer to raise the standard NZW. Not as much character to get attached to.



You can't sell the pelts?


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## Pastor Dave (Jun 30, 2018)

I guess it's best to have pelts from a mature species, be it beaver, fox, deer, mink, etc. A good rabbit hide probably comes from a year old or older. Mine are between 10 and 12 weeks when prime for meat, so the hides just get thrown away.


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## Sundragons (Jul 1, 2018)

Pastor Dave said:


> I guess it's best to have pelts from a mature species, be it beaver, fox, deer, mink, etc. A good rabbit hide probably comes from a year old or older. Mine are between 10 and 12 weeks when prime for meat, so the hides just get thrown away.



I think you mentioned this previously but I can't remember. Are you doing meat for just sustainability or are you doing a bit of business in rabbit meat?


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## goats&moregoats (Jul 1, 2018)

Not Fair!  After reading this thread I am telling myself I do not need rabbits


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## Bruce (Jul 1, 2018)

You do not need rabbits G&MG! At least not at the moment


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## Sundragons (Jul 1, 2018)

Bruce said:


> You do not need rabbits G&MG! At least not at the moment



False! Everyone needs fuzzybutts (unless they're allergic to them). It is a moral imperative.


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## Sundragons (Jul 1, 2018)

Random cell phone pics from this weekend.

1. Grumpeh floof



 
2. Floof and Mom


 

3 and 4. Piggle!


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## Bruce (Jul 1, 2018)

Oh sure, now @goats&moregoats is going to have to tell herself she doesn't need piggies either!


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## Pastor Dave (Jul 2, 2018)

I was gonna say, those last two are definitely Not rabbits! Haha.
I believe rabbits are abt the best way to achieve a small, backyard herd. And in the end, isn't  that why we're all here? 
Not much space, just need a garden or compost pile to get rid of waste, and the quickest way to grow own meat other than the egg.
Yah, @Sundragons, I did sell some all processed in butcher paper, but didn't have enough repeat customers or continued interest to keep enough breeders for so little demand. I cut back production to half last Fall.


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## Sundragons (Jul 3, 2018)

Hope it wasn't someone he knew...


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## Bruce (Jul 4, 2018)

Probably not.


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## Sundragons (Jul 6, 2018)

So this happened tonight... Guy on FB posted up about needing someone to rescue a hedgehog his friend had to leave with a roommate due to personal issues, and then said roommate

 

 moved out and abaondoned her. Sooooo... Now I have a pair of hedgepiggies! I'll get some better photos once she's settled in and not as stressed out. Been a rough day I'm sure.


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## Bruce (Jul 6, 2018)

Soft pets and prickly pets!

Roommate is a sleaze ball.


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## Latestarter (Jul 15, 2018)

Nice rescue!


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## Sundragons (Jul 15, 2018)

Bucket full of Netherland Dwarf Babies. hat tip to @Bunnylady for helping ID the colors and explaining WHY they are those colors.


 

And a bunch of Holland Lop's in the weaning cage today.


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## ViolinPlayer123 (Jul 20, 2018)

Sundragons said:


> Bucket full of Netherland Dwarf Babies. hat tip to @Bunnylady for helping ID the colors and explaining WHY they are those colors.
> View attachment 50294
> 
> And a bunch of Holland Lop's in the weaning cage today.
> View attachment 50295 View attachment 50296


What do you call that tan color?


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## Sundragons (Jul 20, 2018)

ViolinPlayer123 said:


> What do you call that tan color?



Orange!  I've seen it also called fawn, but My understanding is fawn is darker tan/brown than this. Dad's pedigree says orange, so we go with orange.


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## Sundragons (Jul 20, 2018)

I should also point out they're Orange vienna marked. Lots of white in places you don't normally see it for oranges. They're from our BEW program herd, so totally expected. The Blue is staying because she's got blue eyes.


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## Sundragons (Jul 24, 2018)

New babies!


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## Sundragons (Jul 29, 2018)

Took some glamour shots of this litter of Netherlands earlier. Supper happy with how they turned out.

Blue Silver Marten


 
Blue Tort (snowballed)


 
Smoke Pearl Marten


 
This last one I'm not sure of. @Bunnylady what do you think? I know we talked about it being maybe a blue point marten, but it's so light I'm now wondering if it's Lilac Point Marten? It's a possibility with the parents, but I'm just not strong enough with colors to tell between those. Up in the air on it's eyes too. They're a really deep blue-grey color.


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## Bunnylady (Jul 30, 2018)

Sundragons said:


> This last one I'm not sure of. @Bunnylady what do you think? I know we talked about it being maybe a blue point marten, but it's so light I'm now wondering if it's Lilac Point Marten? It's a possibility with the parents, but I'm just not strong enough with colors to tell between those. Up in the air on it's eyes too. They're a really deep blue-grey color.



Blue is dilute black, lilac is dilute chocolate. Lilac isn't just a lighter shade of blue, it's a pinkish dove-gray instead of blue-gray. You can definitely see that a lilac has chocolate as its base color. Chocolate also lightens the eye color; the eyes of a lilac are also lilac in color.

I know, I keep repeating myself - baby colors can be weird, and that's especially true of the shaded colors. Shaded is affected by temperature, almost as much as Himi; you get more color when the bun is cooler, less when it's warm. Because it's so warm and snuggly in the nest box, there may not be a lot of pigment going into the hair as it grows in.  A lot of the "what the heck is that?!" babies get a lot clearer when they get their junior coats.


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## Sundragons (Jul 30, 2018)

Bunnylady said:


> Blue is dilute black, lilac is dilute chocolate. Lilac isn't just a lighter shade of blue, it's a pinkish dove-gray instead of blue-gray. You can definitely see that a lilac has chocolate as its base color. Chocolate also lightens the eye color; the eyes of a lilac are also lilac in color.
> 
> I know, I keep repeating myself - baby colors can be weird, and that's especially true of the shaded colors. Shaded is affected by temperature, almost as much as Himi; you get more color when the bun is cooler, less when it's warm. Because it's so warm and snuggly in the nest box, there may not be a lot of pigment going into the hair as it grows in.  A lot of the "what the heck is that?!" babies get a lot clearer when they get their junior coats.



I keep forgetting lilac is a chocolate. So keep saying it until it penetrates my thick skull, I don't mind.  I'm kinda curious how warm it was in the nest box when they were buried under all that bedding. We keep the room they're cage is in at 77F, but mamma had them under a heavy layer of cover.


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## Sundragons (Aug 4, 2018)

Eeyore in the studio today. She was thrilled!


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## Bruce (Aug 5, 2018)

I can tell!


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## Sundragons (Aug 9, 2018)

Piggies!


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## Wehner Homestead (Aug 17, 2018)

That baby on the left appears to have a heart on its head!!


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## Sundragons (Aug 17, 2018)

Checkin' out the chicken.


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## Sundragons (Aug 17, 2018)

Some more out in the yard today (first day out). You''ll note they found the mud almost instantly.


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## Sundragons (Aug 24, 2018)

Graduation Photos! With the exception of the first one, the rest of these are going up for adoption tomorrow. We're keeping the first one, his name's now 'Sundragon's Ghost".


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## Bruce (Aug 24, 2018)

Very cute bunnies!


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## Wehner Homestead (Aug 24, 2018)

I’m partial to the otters of that group


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## Sundragons (Nov 11, 2018)

Some Randoms. Been crazy busy and have had to reduce the herd due to schedules changing. Not super happy about that, but until we can geet into a bigger place and focus more on the animals, it's what we need to do.

1. Obi playing with his rock.


 

2. Little splay legged doe that went to a rehabber this morning. Hopefully she can get her squared away, she's a great little bunny.


 

3. Pigs and pumpkins, a match made in heaven.


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## Wehner Homestead (Nov 11, 2018)

Wondered where you’d gone. Glad things are at least going okay. What do you still have?


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## Sundragons (Nov 11, 2018)

Wehner Homestead said:


> Wondered where you’d gone. Glad things are at least going okay. What do you still have?



As far as variety goes, everything still (chickens, rabbits, tortoises, pigs, hedgies). We just reduced quantity. Down to a pair of laying hens, thinning down to 10 adult rabbits. Piglets were adopted out (was always the plan), and we're getting the boar fixed. We were just at the point where 2 hours a day and an entire day of cage and coop cleaning on the weekends was too much with all the things the kids have going plus keeping up on the housework, plus full time job. Right now, the life we want to be living isn't the life we need to be living, so, compromise.


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## Dani4Hedgies (Nov 12, 2018)

So get this its the same in our world,  how are your hedgies doing?


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## ViolinPlayer123 (Nov 13, 2018)

Sundragons said:


> As far as variety goes, everything still (chickens, rabbits, tortoises, pigs, hedgies). We just reduced quantity. Down to a pair of laying hens, thinning down to 10 adult rabbits. Piglets were adopted out (was always the plan), and we're getting the boar fixed. We were just at the point where 2 hours a day and an entire day of cage and coop cleaning on the weekends was too much with all the things the kids have going plus keeping up on the housework, plus full time job. Right now, the life we want to be living isn't the life we need to be living, so, compromise.


2 CHICKENS?!


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## Bruce (Nov 13, 2018)

Chicken math in reverse!


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## Sundragons (Nov 13, 2018)

ViolinPlayer123 said:


> 2 CHICKENS?!


 
Yeah. 2 Super blues. In our case, we had to make the decision based on use cases. We're not showing chickens, so as yard art and egg production, they're a lot easier to find and buy than show quality rabbit stock is. As a result, we made the decision to rehome the entire flock as a group to a friend of a friend, and they're very happy on his 5 acres.

I miss them. we'll get more. Just not right now.


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## Sundragons (Nov 13, 2018)

Dani4Hedgies said:


> So get this its the same in our world,  how are your hedgies doing?


They're fine. I saw your PM. We're planning on pairing them off, but not until we have our other animals in order and down to controllable numbers (or we can find a bigger place)


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## Sundragons (Dec 5, 2018)

Vet needed a weight because this guys' getting neutered.


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## Sundragons (Feb 19, 2019)

part of IKEA's new "Ojinkling" line. We ended up picking up a 3 pack on sale.


(We're expecting a very cold night in the desert tonight, with temps getting down to freezing. Not uncommon, but it's getting a little late in the season for us. These  little 4 week old Juliana piglets are nestled up in their favorite toy to keep each other warm.)


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## Rammy (Feb 20, 2019)

Sundragons said:


> part of IKEA's new "Ojinkling" line. We ended up picking up a 3 pack on sale.
> 
> 
> (We're expecting a very cold night in the desert tonight, with temps getting down to freezing. Not uncommon, but it's getting a little late in the season for us. These  little 4 week old Juliana piglets are nestled up in their favorite toy to keep each other warm.)
> ...


Awww! Cuteness overload.


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## Baymule (Feb 20, 2019)

Adorable!


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## Sundragons (Oct 27, 2020)

Man, been a while.

The last 18 months have been complete and utter chaos around here. As mentioned before, we were in the middle of downsizing to get our herd to a more manageable size. Turned out to be a good thing too. March of last year we took in a rescue holland lop from some family friends who were moving out of country and could not take him. Turns out he had pasturella, and we ended up losing him and 3 other rabbits as a result despite vet care and our best efforts. As a result we made the decision to halt our breeding program and just keep our remaining rabbits as pets for their natural lifespan. No need to risk passing that along, even though we haven't had any issues since then.

Lost Sir Winston in March of this year. He was just a bit over 5. One day he was here, and happy, the next he was gone. We still have Cholla, but she's also approaching 6, which is super old for a hedgehog in captivity, so we're enjoying as much time with her as we can now, knowing her time may be limited.

Pigs are doing good. Obi is fat and lazy after getting snipped, Penelope is just silly and playful all the time, which is good.

Dogs are doing OK. Old man Copper had to have a tumor removed a couple mos ago, and it was definitely a sarcoma. They got it all and we're monitoring to see if it comes back, but he's 9, and man, AZ sure is hard on dogs when it comes to sarcomas. We'll see how he does.

About this time last year I got really sick and ended up in the hospital for the first time in my life. I've had a GI issue for a while and it decided to wombo combo me with a large kidney stone at the same time. Stones are common for me, so that part was normal (yay drugs). But due to the persistent issues my guts were causing, we made the decision to do a corrective surgery which involved removing a small section of my bowel and normally would have been fairly routine. When the time came at the end of october last year, it ended up being 30 cm of my small intestine and 30 cm of my sigmoid colon rather than just a couple of inches. Turned out I had contracted Valley Fever and it never showed up in any of my labs but had settled in my intestines because I was compromised form my GI issue. A year later I'm fine, but it's been a long road to recovery and I would say I'm definitely not 100% (and may never be again).

This year we've dealt with the same challenges as everyone else around covid and have had the kids home since early March. We're all stir crazy but healthy, and still looking for the right place to move the farm and get things moving forward again.

Here's a sad piggle after she wrecked her summer pool


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## Baymule (Oct 28, 2020)

Wow! You really have had a rough year. glad you are doing better. 2020 sucks, let's fast forward to 2021, it's gotta be better!


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## Bruce (Nov 5, 2020)

So glad to hear from you, you really have had a rough go since you were last here. I hope you can find the right farm property soon.


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## Sundragons (Nov 5, 2020)

Bruce said:


> So glad to hear from you, you really have had a rough go since you were last here. I hope you can find the right farm property soon.


Thanks. I don't really think of it as all that rough, comparatively. We're all still here and healthy, and so many people have lost livelihood and loved ones this year, so I feel... resolute and determined, I suppose. We will keep moving forward and do what needs to get done. That's how we've always lived our lives, really.


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## Sundragons (Nov 10, 2020)

Couple of randoms of Covid life around here.

Obi (pig) and Chip (tortoise) having a standoff at the back door. She wanted in, he wanted to not move. Ultimately she won.





My several times a day reminder that I have a pair of Australian Shepherds who need to check up on everyone. The come jam their noses in between my armpit and the desk to say hi while I work.


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## Sundragons (Dec 10, 2020)

Sometimes, it's easier to just let sleeping pigs lie.


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## Sundragons (Feb 22, 2021)

A pig and his treat dispenser


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## Baymule (Feb 22, 2021)

Haha that is so funny!


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## Sundragons (Aug 20, 2021)

Guess who's back, back again.


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## Baymule (Aug 21, 2021)

It's been awhile. Glad you are back!


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## Bruce (Aug 21, 2021)

Sundragons said:


> Guess who's back, back again.


Who? 


Nice looking chickens. I've got a Silver Laced Wyandotte growing up, a Gold Laced as well. They are 11 weeks old now.


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## Sundragons (Aug 23, 2021)

Bruce said:


> Who?
> 
> 
> Nice looking chickens. I've got a Silver Laced Wyandotte growing up, a Gold Laced as well. They are 11 weeks old now.


Chickens on the farm. Took in 2 adoptees over the weekend from a friend who was moving into an apartment and could not keep them. I really like wyandottes in general, this is our first welsumer and she lays beautiful blue-greeny-grey eggs.


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## farmerjan (Aug 24, 2021)

The welsummer is not a purebred if her eggs are blue/green/grey.  Welsummers lay a very dark brown egg..... other than marans they lay one of the darkest brown eggs.  Sounds like she is an "easter egger" hen.  But they all eat the same!!!!


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## caprines.n.me (Aug 24, 2021)

Agree with your Welsummer not being a Welsummer.  Hard to see from the pic, but it appears she has a pea comb.  Easter eggers and Ameraucana's have pea combs, Welsummers have a single comb.


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## Sundragons (Aug 24, 2021)

farmerjan said:


> The welsummer is not a purebred if her eggs are blue/green/grey.  Welsummers lay a very dark brown egg..... other than marans they lay one of the darkest brown eggs.  Sounds like she is an "easter egger" hen.  But they all eat the same!!!!





caprines.n.me said:


> Agree with your Welsummer not being a Welsummer.  Hard to see from the pic, but it appears she has a pea comb.  Easter eggers and Ameraucana's have pea combs, Welsummers have a single comb.


Appreciate the info both of you. I was going off of what I got from her last owners, and it's fine by me if she's an EE.


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## caprines.n.me (Aug 24, 2021)

I have them both.  They're both good birds.   As long as you like her, all is well.


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## Bruce (Aug 24, 2021)

Sundragons said:


> this is our first welsumer and she lays beautiful blue-greeny-grey eggs.


Definitely not a Welsummer, feather pattern and coloring is all wrong, as is the color of the egg. Probably an EE without the muffs and beard.


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## Sundragons (Feb 9, 2022)

Some random tortuga shots. size 10 foot (US men's size 10) for comparison. I had no bananas.They are 14 and 16 years old.


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## Bruce (Feb 9, 2022)

Can you get them to walk side by side so they can take you where you want to go?


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## Sundragons (Dec 15, 2022)

Some randoms.


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