# Opinions please! Pig Runt has horrible scabs?



## Newchick7 (Mar 28, 2017)

We received our (what we were told was a 3 month old) runt about 4 days ago. We were given her to us for free when we bought two other pigs from a pig farmer. What the guy said was "you guys want this runt? The mom just didn't have enough milk so she got pushed out and she never grew" so mind you this pig is suppose to be 3 months old and only weighs 7 lbs and is the size of a 6 week pig. I don't think anyone paid her any attention kinda like "if she dies she dies". She is very alert. Loves human contact. But not spunky as a piglet should be. She's wobbly on her back legs. She has mucas coming from her nose. Her eyes are a bit goopy. And she coughs and sounds suuuuuuuper congested when she does. She is often times able to clear her lungs. I notice she is nowgetting sore on her front legs/shin area. They dont look pussy yet but seem to be growing fast within the past 48 hours. She also has about 20 small scab she on her back. I thought It might be dried mud but it may be more suspicious than that. She has no appetite for any solid food. We have been feeding her goats milk (which she begs for ) and we give her a shot of Tylan 50 once a day and she lays in complete happiness in a wooden box in our garage with dry hay and a heat lamp. Any suggestions of what it could be or more to do? We are trying our best to nurture her back to health.


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## Latestarter (Mar 28, 2017)

Greetings and welcome to BYH. Sorry you're having issues with your new "free" pig(let)... I'll tag a few folks who have hog experience that may be able to help. Hope the little one comes around and begins to flourish for you and hope it's nothing serious. Meanwhile, browse around and make yourself at home! Glad to have you here with us.

@misfitmorgan @Mini Horses @farmerjan @NH homesteader and I'm sure there are others.


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## NH homesteader (Mar 29, 2017)

Sorry, I have no idea. I have never seen that before. Are the other pigs healthy? If she has respiratory issues I would keep an eye on them. Beyond that? I haven't a clue. One of the others will though, I'm sure!


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## farmerjan (Mar 29, 2017)

Tylan 50 is probably not going to address the coughing, wheezing, congestion issues.  Do you have a regular vet?  Call them.  They will usually give advice over the phone if you are a regular customer.  The scabs could be from the other piglets biting at her as she tried to find a teat to nurse.  Could be other issues.  To me, they are the least of your worries.  It sounds like a case of severe pnuemonia, coupled with the fact that she is also severely stunted from malnutrition.  Mix some pig starter in the milk to make a "gruel" so that she is getting some nutrition as the milk alone will also wind up giving her the scours simply because her body needs more nutrition.  A heavy duty antibiotic like Draxxin or Nuflor or something from the vet is probably in order.  

I do not condone a farmer figuring if "she dies, she dies"  but understand that this pig will be 99% most likely to never do well, and will most likely not grow well, and have constant health issues. She will cost 3x what she is worth to raise and feed more likely than not.   Sometimes you have to be practical, but the kinder thing would have been to  put her down rather than suffer.  That said, if you talk to a vet and can get her healthy, then you might get her turned around.  This is not something you can deal with without some professional knowledge and without seeing her in person, it is very hard to diagnose her except that it is pretty obvious that the pnuemonia type symptoms need to be dealt with immediately.


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## misfitmorgan (Mar 29, 2017)

I completely agree with @farmerjan she needs to see a vet and the sooner the better. She sounds like she is very ill and not going to get better on her own. I don't think tylan is enough to get her well either.

As far as the scabs i have no idea but her body will have a hard time healing any kind of "damage" with her malnutrition and being so ill. 

She may have more problems then just being a runt. At 3 months old she should be much large then 7lbs, most piglets are 7lbs at a week or two old even runts. At 3 months old the farmer also should have had her and all the piglets well established on feed and weaned off milk. Commercial piglets are weaned are 4-6weeks old and farm raised are generally weaned at 6-8weeks old. Solid food/feed should have started being offered to them at 2 weeks old. 

I also think a wet mash would be best for her. Try adding a little ot her milk and slowly add more feed and less milk until she is eating mostly dry feed. Also try adding an egg and a little corn syrup to help up the calories until she gets onto full feed.

Definitely take that piglet to the vet.


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## Newchick7 (Mar 29, 2017)

farmerjan said:


> Tylan 50 is probably not going to address the coughing, wheezing, congestion issues.  Do you have a regular vet?  Call them.  They will usually give advice over the phone if you are a regular customer.  The scabs could be from the other piglets biting at her as she tried to find a teat to nurse.  Could be other issues.  To me, they are the least of your worries.  It sounds like a case of severe pnuemonia, coupled with the fact that she is also severely stunted from malnutrition.  Mix some pig starter in the milk to make a "gruel" so that she is getting some nutrition as the milk alone will also wind up giving her the scours simply because her body needs more nutrition.  A heavy duty antibiotic like Draxxin or Nuflor or something from the vet is probably in order.
> 
> I do not condone a farmer figuring if "she dies, she dies"  but understand that this pig will be 99% most likely to never do well, and will most likely not grow well, and have constant health issues. She will cost 3x what she is worth to raise and feed more likely than not.   Sometimes you have to be practical, but the kinder thing would have been to  put her down rather than suffer.  That said, if you talk to a vet and can get her healthy, then you might get her turned around.  This is not something you can deal with without some professional knowledge and without seeing her in person, it is very hard to diagnose her except that it is pretty obvious that the pnuemonia type symptoms need to be dealt with immediately.


Thank you for your information. We do not have a livestock vet in the area. However we will be calling our regular vet to see what he suggest or prescribed. We knew when we took her she would be a bit of a challenge. And we do understand that she will end up costing us some money. Thanks for all you help!


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## Newchick7 (Mar 29, 2017)

misfitmorgan said:


> I completely agree with @farmerjan she needs to see a vet and the sooner the better. She sounds like she is very ill and not going to get better on her own. I don't think tylan is enough to get her well either.
> 
> As far as the scabs i have no idea but her body will have a hard time healing any kind of "damage" with her malnutrition and being so ill.
> 
> ...


We will be taking her to the vet as suggested by a few people.


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## Newchick7 (Mar 29, 2017)

farmerjan said:


> Tylan 50 is probably not going to address the coughing, wheezing, congestion issues.  Do you have a regular vet?  Call them.  They will usually give advice over the phone if you are a regular customer.  The scabs could be from the other piglets biting at her as she tried to find a teat to nurse.  Could be other issues.  To me, they are the least of your worries.  It sounds like a case of severe pnuemonia, coupled with the fact that she is also severely stunted from malnutrition.  Mix some pig starter in the milk to make a "gruel" so that she is getting some nutrition as the milk alone will also wind up giving her the scours simply because her body needs more nutrition.  A heavy duty antibiotic like Draxxin or Nuflor or something from the vet is probably in order.
> 
> I do not condone a farmer figuring if "she dies, she dies"  but understand that this pig will be 99% most likely to never do well, and will most likely not grow well, and have constant health issues. She will cost 3x what she is worth to raise and feed more likely than not.   Sometimes you have to be practical, but the kinder thing would have been to  put her down rather than suffer.  That said, if you talk to a vet and can get her healthy, then you might get her turned around.  This is not something you can deal with without some professional knowledge and without seeing her in person, it is very hard to diagnose her except that it is pretty obvious that the pnuemonia type symptoms need to be dealt with immediately.


We took because when he showed us to her we couldn't leave her there   We wanted to help her. Our other pigs we bought from the guy seem healthy! We are on the phone now trying to find more of a livestock vet. Thanks for everything.


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## farmerjan (Mar 29, 2017)

Don't blame you in the slightest for taking her and wanting to do something for her.  Most all of us on here would have probably done the same in a heartbeat.  When you stop having compassion for an animal then you need to not have any animals.

Keep us posted on what you find out and WELCOME to BYH.


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## NH homesteader (Mar 29, 2017)

Couldn't agree more @farmerjan


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## Newchick7 (Apr 2, 2017)

She is doing much better! Her sores are under control and her snotty nose has stopped. However she still has a slight dry cough. And our other two pigs who are outside and separated from her are now coughing. We called the livestock vet and he said to give the other two pig penicillin suspension. However we can get the mixture to mix!!! Any ideas???


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## farmerjan (Apr 2, 2017)

Not knowing exactly what you are calling a penicillin suspension... assuming it is in a bottle, thick, white and hard to shake up to mix??  Sounds like a shot type mix.  What did you give to the little one?  And congrats on getting her back to the land of the living and hope she continues to improve too.

Anyway, most "suspensions " are designed to be given as injections. All else fails, are feeding the pigs any milk?  Take the required dosage and mix in the milk just before you put it in the pan.  It may not do as well, and take a little more treatments to work since the stomach acids will work on it not like a shot directly into the body...but they do make penicillin tablets.

If you have not been feeding any milk, I would suggest doing it for a few days, get them to REALLY want to scarf it down when you go out to feed, then you can put it in and they will eat/slop it up.  Taste won't be too great but if they are really wanting to eat they will get most of it.  I also would only feed them a small portion of their food with the "medicated milk" on top, then after they have devoured it, give them more that is not medicated. 
This way they will not associate the taste as well, and you will be able to get it in them.  And they will keep coming back for more.


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## farmerjan (Apr 2, 2017)

Didn't the other two pigs also come from this same place?  I think it is from there, in general and not that the little one gave it to the other 2.


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## misfitmorgan (Apr 3, 2017)

farmerjan said:


> Didn't the other two pigs also come from this same place?  I think it is from there, in general and not that the little one gave it to the other 2.



I would agree



Newchick7 said:


> She is doing much better! Her sores are under control and her snotty nose has stopped. However she still has a slight dry cough. And our other two pigs who are outside and separated from her are now coughing. We called the livestock vet and he said to give the other two pig penicillin suspension. However we can get the mixture to mix!!! Any ideas???



If you mean Pro Pen G that is an injection you just shake it up and draw out with a syringe the amount needed. Injection site is generally the butt/thigh area left side.

Pro Pen G, Penicillin Injectable, Pen-Aqueous, Agra-cillin, Penone-Pro.......are all the same thing as far as i know and they are all a penicillin suspension injectable.


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## Newchick7 (Apr 4, 2017)

misfitmorgan said:


> I would agree
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes. It is a liquid penicillin. The worker at ththe farm store said it is super thick and that we may have to microwave it. Lol. That sounded extreme. So we let it sit at room temp for a bit and that seemed to work. And yes we did get all the pigs from the same place.


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## farmerjan (Apr 4, 2017)

DO NOT MICROWAVE IT.  Microwaves destroy the "food value" of your food and will also render the pen much less effective.  A microwave should not be used to heat a bottle, to cook food, or anything.  Come on -- they use irradiation to kill the bacteria on food.  What do you think microwaving is  - irradiation.

It is not that thick unless it is about at freezing temps.  Use a syringe with a 16 gauge needle to draw it out of the bottle after shaking it well.  Yes, you can let it warm up a bit, but do not warm it to room temp.  Once it is a little warmer you can use an 18 gauge needle, or use the 16 as it will go in quicker.  Use a needle that is 1 inch long or even a 3/4 inch one. A pig that size doesn't have any "fat" to have to go through like a big hog.  We do 99% of our injections in the cattle  "sub-q" which means under the skin, but I think we always did the hogs I M (intramuscular).  Seldom did many injections with them.


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## misfitmorgan (Apr 6, 2017)

Heat will kill the penicillin so definitely dont nuke it. It needs to be kept in the fridge so it stays chilled same as a few other injectable meds/vaccines. The bottle should say it needs to be stored at 36-46F, most fridges are 38-41F while most houses fluctuate between 50-100+F.

All injections on pigs are intramuscular as it is not possible on most pigs to do Sub Q because the fat is stuck to the skin. The thigh/butt helps avoid the thick fat cap along the back and saves your tenderloin as some injections can discolor the muscle/meat. The standard is left thigh/butt which is ironically why you mostly only see hams made with the right leg.

If you having a hardtime getting the antibotic out of the bottle, shake it really well and switch to a larger diameter needle. This is general needle guidelines per age/size.

Piglet 5/8" long 21 gauge
7-60lbs 1" long 19 gauge
60-100lbs 1" long 16 gauge
101+lbs 1.5" long 16 gauge

Gauge works backwards in case you didnt know(i didnt used to know) 21 is smaller then 16, so so go up a size if you cant draw the med/vaccine..outside of the recommendations we normally us 1" 21 or 16 gague for everything so we only have to keep two needles sizes on hand since we buy them 100count at a time with the syringes. Also its handy to have a sharps container and your vet will accept sharps containers for disposal as will most hospitals, hospitals generally charge $5 per sharps container and our vet charges $7 per sharps container to dispose. If you only drop the needles with their covers or the scalpel blades into the sharps container it saves a lot of space which makes it last a long time between needing new containers.


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