# Worming?



## LilyD (Jan 17, 2011)

How often do you worm your goats each year? We have one goat that is 9 month old doe and a buck that is 10 months old. 

I know the buck has been wormed because I just bought him last friday and she wormed him before I picked him up but I was not sure when to worm the doe. 

Also what wormers can be used for goats. I use ivermectin for my horses or safeguard. 
What types of wormers are there for goats and where can I get them?

Any help would be great!

Thanks,
Lily


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## jason_mazzy (Jan 17, 2011)

I was told by my local goat breeder at least twice a year with safeguard.


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## julieq (Jan 17, 2011)

We use Hoeggers herbal wormer a couple of times per year.  Really easy to add to the grain.  O&P checks occasionally by our vet remain clear.  We're really happy with it.


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## jason_mazzy (Jan 17, 2011)

anyone use verm-x? curious if it is helpful if you wanna stay natural


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## LilyD (Jan 17, 2011)

So if I was to use safeguard can I get the horse wormer or is there a specific one sold for goats?

Also how much do I give them my doe is 120 lbs the buck is ab out 125

Thanks
Lily


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## glenolam (Jan 17, 2011)

Do your goats need to be wormed?  There's some back and forth about worming on a schedule vs. worming as needed.  I only worm as needed so that the wormload in my immediate area doesn't develop a resistance to the worming medicine.

Most dewormers can be found at feed or livestock stores, but Jeffers Livestock or Hoegger's Goat supply are also good places.  There's a few other on-line stores as well.

There's a thread somewhere on here about the different classes of dewormers and what they're all good for - I'm searching but just can't find it.  I'll keep looking and post it when I find it.

ETA - Didn't find the thread, but found an article from sheepandgoat.com about deworming goats.


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## LilyD (Jan 17, 2011)

My buck Skov has been wormed already I just purchased him on Friday and the lady I bought him from actually wormed him and did his feet so he is all set for a bit.

My doe we got when she was 4 months but I am really not sure if she has been wormed or not. She is very healthy but I want to make sure if I have to worm her I know how and how much to give her. I was told that you should do it at least every 6 months which would mean if we did scheduled worming she would be due. 

How do you tell if she has worms to worm on an as needed basis?

Lily


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## elevan (Jan 17, 2011)

IMO you should not worm on a schedule but that is due to the worm situation in my area.  I would check with a local vet to determine what the best course is for your area (schedule or as needed)

Also you should do fecals to determine what type of worm it is and what dewormer to use.  Fecals can be done by you if you have the equipment and know how or you can most likely take a sample to the vet for a reasonably low cost.

Although you should worm kids when they are 4-6 weeks old for the first time regardless.

You also generally don't see worm issues in winter (but it depends on where you live).

Signs of worms are varied but can include "dog type" poos, goats looking thin, not eating normally...there are other symptoms too but these are what I notice most.


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## glenolam (Jan 17, 2011)

If the ivomec you have is 1% injectible for cattle, it's good to use on your doeling - it's the one that I use but only because I don't have horses or any other animals to use it on.  I'm not sure if others on here have a different type of ivermectin that is multi-use.

To dose the ivomec (1% cattle one) you give it orally at a rate of 1cc/22# - some do more (like 1cc/15#) some do less (like 1cc/40#).  That all depends on you.

The safeguard (there's one specific for goats) is becoming less used because there's a big resistance among the worm poplulation and people are finding they have to wayyy overdose just to get it to work a little.

A good place to start is sending a fecal sample out to a vet or doing a fecal your self.  That way you'll know if she has any worms and a vet (or the internet!) can help you decide how to treat her.

Another quick way is to check their eyelids.  If you google FAMACHA or search that term on this site you'll find pictures of this.  Basically, you compare their lower eyelids to a chart and the whiter they are the more they need to be wormed (in a nutshell anyway).

Has either been treated for coccidia?


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## LilyD (Jan 17, 2011)

I am not sure they were both being raised in back yards and I know the buck was wormed the doe was bought at 8wks and she let her grandchildren raise them but she did not mention getting them any shots. I am fairly new to raising goats so I was not sure what I needed to get them. 

How do you treat for coccidia


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## LilyD (Jan 17, 2011)

I know that the buck was being seen by a vet so I am pretty sure that he was given the treatment since he came originally from a dairy farm to a back yard breeder. 

The doe I got though I am really not sure of her history and when I picked her up the lady was in a hurry and really didn't take the time to give me much of a back ground on her. 

Should I treat her for it now at 9 months?

Lily


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## glenolam (Jan 17, 2011)

LilyD said:
			
		

> I am not sure they were both being raised in back yards and I know the buck was wormed the doe was bought at 8wks and she let her grandchildren raise them but she did not mention getting them any shots. I am fairly new to raising goats so I was not sure what I needed to get them.
> 
> How do you treat for coccidia


ETA - got rid of the doeling age question...didn't realize you just posted it above   At 9 mos I wouldn't treat for coccidia unless she needed it - and signs of needed it might include weight loss, diarreah, being lethargic...

Generally, goats need to be given a shot of CD&T either every 6 or 12 months depending on your use of the goats.  If they're just pets or backyard farm animals, you can probably get away with giving the CD&T once a year.

Coccidia is given to kids usually starting at 3 weeks of age.  If your goats are older now and don't seem to have any health problems there's nothing really to worry about and, depending on their age, it's too late to give them the usual coccidia treatment.

How is their health now?  Are they pooping/peeing/acting normal?

Are they housed together?


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## LilyD (Jan 17, 2011)

The doe is very healthy glossy coat and a typical nubian she talks all the time is pooping and eating anything her roommates don't eat and is very energetic.

The buck we have only had since Friday but the lady I purchased him from said he has never been sick any time her vet had seen him. She did not mention coccidia specifically as something he had been treated for but he is healthy thus far. It's hard to tell with him though cause he's still in the stage where he's looking for his friends rather than sticking with the other animals so he's not moving around as much as the others but at her farm he was very energetic so I think it's just the new environment. 

They are housed together in a large field and have a 12 by 12 stall to sleep in at night. There is also two sheep that sleep with them as well. So far they all seem to be getting along really well. 

Lily


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## glenolam (Jan 17, 2011)

Is it just the two goats with the sheep?  Sheep and goats (while they can be housed together) have different mineral needs - sheep can't have copper while goats must have it.  Sorry if that's something you already know, but figured I'd say it anyway.

Are you trying to breed your doeling?  If she's living with the buck she's going to get bred eventually so you'll definitely want to get him out of there by the time she kids so he doesn't try to breed any new doelings.

If she looks as healthy as she sounds I'm sure you don't need to worry about worming her.  I would contact the prior owner and ask about the CD&T vaccination, though.  If you can't get anywhere by contacting them just give her the shot anyway. It's not going to hurt to ensure she's covered.


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## LilyD (Jan 17, 2011)

What is CD&T sorry but this is new to me is that for the coccidia or is it for something else?

They are housed together but fed different foods the sheep have their own grain and are fed that twice a day and the goats have goat feed they also have free choice hay all day long and the occasional piece of bread for a treat or veggies from the garden. 

We tried to keep their feed separate because we weren't sure if they could eat all the same thing.

Lily


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## glenolam (Jan 17, 2011)

CD&T stands for Clostridium perfringins types C and D (overeating disease) and tetanus.

Here's a link to an article about it:

http://www.sheepandgoat.com/articles/flockvaccinations.html

The goats should have loose minerals free choice as well, which is why it's hard to keep sheep and goats together.  The sheep cannot have the same minerals that goats have - if you have a place the goats can get to that the sheep cannot (which isn't very easy to do) you can keep the minerals in that place so the goats can eat them as they need to.  You're correct in keeping their feed separate, but it's more the mineral thing you need to think/worry about.

I know there's a few people on here who may have tried to house their sheep and goats together, hopefully they'll chime in with what worked/didn't work.  It may be best to separate the goats from the sheep, but I'm not sure since I only have goats.

So...any plans on wethering that buck or did you get him to breed your girl?


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## LilyD (Jan 17, 2011)

We bought them to breed together in the future and we were going to try meat goats but we are also really getting interested in the idea of milking our own goats and making cheese and yogurt. Right now we just have the two and two sheep. They share a large pasture that is about 5 to 6 acres of grassland but there are three stalls attached to it as well so there is definitely the possibility that we could separate minerals for goats and sheep by placing them in different stalls at night. We are planning on separating the kids from the adults once they are weaned. The vet told us we could wean them around 12 weeks of age. I am hoping that this is early enough that the boys will not try to breed with them, but if not we can always place the boys in the smaller paddock we made for the babies . We just started this fall actually buying our animals and originally we had said two sheep and two goats but now we are actually talking about maybe more. Who knows we'll have to see how it goes for the first year or so.

Lily


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## 20kidsonhill (Jan 17, 2011)

All our goats are given 2cc CD& T injected at birth and again 21 days later or after being purchased and brought to the farm. Then 1x a year, most of them are vaccinated that one time a year 30 days prior to their due date.

The entire herd is on free-choice loose goat mineral salts all the time. 

As far as worming we only worm as needed all wormer is given orally. We individually check each animal every month or two for pale gums and eye lids and worm with one of the following wormers only if needed.

cydectin cattle pour-on given orally at the rate of 1cc per 20lbs, great for many worms and mites and lice, but will not kill tapeworms. Very safe for pregnant animals. 

Valbazen(only non-pregnant) at rate of 1ml per 10pounds given orally. will cause abortions. (tapeworm segments) but does not kill heads

Equimax paste  for horses at triple the dose recommended for horses. (for tapeworms) this will kill the heads and segments, because it contains prazaquintal. 

I have also used safegaurd but can't remember the dose.

We weight our animals for accurate dosage.

We follow a 30 day withdrawal for all the wormers, even if there isn't one. 

We don't milk, we raise Boer and boer/cross.


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## 20kidsonhill (Jan 17, 2011)

I just saw that you have sheep with the goats. Sheep have a cooper sensitivity and you can't feed goat feed or goat minerals to sheep. You can however feed sheep feed and minerals to goats, but your goats would need some sort of copper given to them, this I am not familiar with we feed our animals seperate.


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## glenolam (Jan 17, 2011)

It's probably best to only put the buck in with the doe when you want her bred.  he'll try to breed her every chance he can and she'll end up pregnant more or less a month after she's given birth which isn't good.  If she has boys, they can start breeding as early as 3 weeks, but that's pretty rare.  Most people either wether the boys around 8-12 weeks or separate them from the girls at that age.

I'd say you should separate the sheep from the goats, separate the buck from the doe and get 2 more goats, a wether as a companion for the buck, and either another wether or another doe as a companion for the doe.  This way everyone has a friend (they are very social animals as I'm sure you know!) and you don't run the risk of having goat babies running around 24/7 and babies having babies...JMO


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## LilyD (Jan 17, 2011)

Any boys that we have will definitely be whethered at 8 to 12 weeks so they can't breed. I was thinking that Once the ewe and doe give birth I would separate the buck and ram from the main herd. Not sure how I would separate them more permanently. The lady that we bought the sheep from actually pasture breeds her ewes with her rams. They are together all the time. But if the goats are going to try to breed year round then I will definitely need to keep them separate so she doesn't get bred back to back constantly. 

That is going to mean some creative pasturing come spring time. 

Lily


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## glenolam (Jan 17, 2011)

Nubians are more seasonal breeders (fall-early winter) but that doesn't mean they won't try....after all...accidents do happen when you least expect it!

I'd wonder if you could put the ram and buck together - you'd still have to worry about the mineral intake, but it'd save you from having to get more friends....unless you want more friends for them!

Be careful - it's really addicting!!


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## LilyD (Jan 17, 2011)

This is the 10 month buck Skov






This is the doe her name is Suzy she loves to climb can you tell?






This is the two sheep they are with I am pretty sure the ewe is already pregnant but Bear keeps pretty close tabs on her to make sure she's okay. 

Sorry for the quality of the pictures but I thought I would show you who I was talking about. 

I do agree with elevan I can already tell they are becoming addicting. We have already started talking about maybe keeping some of the babies rather than sending them all to become meat. Lol before you know it we will have a little herd.

Lily


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## glenolam (Jan 18, 2011)

Love that bucks coloring!  You've got a nice bunch there!

Do the 2cc's of CD&T for Suzy assuming the previous owner won't tell you anything and check her eye lids or get a fecal test done.  I wouldn't do anything you don't have to do.  Then just repeat the CD&T again in 4-5 mos - this is just in case Skov has already bred her.  You should give preganant does the shot about 2-4 weeks prior to kidding so the kids are born with some of the drugs passed to them.  About 4 weeks after the kid(s) are born, give them a shot, same dose, and again about 4 weeks later (This info was taken from the link I posted earlier from SheepandGoat.com).

Good luck and keep us posted!


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## LilyD (Jan 18, 2011)

Thank you the kids have started to call him tye die because he looks like someone put him in the wash with bleach. He's super friendly. We also talked to our vet. Good thing we use the same feed store. He said that he would be more than willing to do fecals and shots as needed for the goats and sheep as well as steering us towards what might be best for us to use for worming when we need it in our area. Now I just have to see what they have already had and we can go from there.


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## glenolam (Jan 19, 2011)

Glad you have a vet that knows something about goats!!  That's not too easy to find now adays!


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## LilyD (Jan 19, 2011)

He's usually just a horse vet by choice but he's done all our animals for so many years that he agreed he would just add on the new beasties with the rest of our horses. He also does our dogs and cats which is amazing because my cat hates going to the vets office. When he comes I just pick her up, she gets her shots and is done wala.


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