# Another poo question



## valsetz (Feb 20, 2009)

I just noticed that my bull calf started having diarrhea yesterday. I have been reading all of the columns about scours. I was wondering since I got him less than a week ago and he is now eating about 3 pounds of startena and my brother in law said he was giving him about a handful of it if this would cause it? The color is green and I am bottle feeding him twice a day. I cut back his startena to about 1 1/2 pounds today hoping this might help. He loves the startena he would always eat the 3 pounds worth. The startena is medicated to help prevent coccidiostats. If it is scours I will just follow the guidelines talked about in other forums. 
With scours you talk about it looking sour which means it is viral. What do you mean look sour? How do you know if it is viral or bacterial? 
  I know his enviroment conditions are good, it is warming up here and he is in the barn where there is straw down and it is dry. I did have sheep in there this last summer and maybe he got something from there poo? Thanks for any help


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## Farmer Kitty (Feb 20, 2009)

Don't cut back the startena. Cut the milkreplacer amount you use in the water back and put him on a pail, it will be easier for you. You can still give him pet downs and what not if you are worrying about bonding.

A sour scour usually reminds me of milk gone bad (soured milk) but poo colored. This would be viral.


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## wynedot55 (Feb 20, 2009)

as said id cut the powdered milk back.an leave him eating his starter feed.id start him on scour meds as well.


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## jhm47 (Feb 20, 2009)

With all due respect to Kitty, I would keep on feeding him with a bottle till he's over his possible case of scours.  When they are sick, we shouldn't change things like that.  

Keep him on the startena, and if you have access to some good quality grass hay, that will help to firm up his stools.  Good luck!  

PS.  No offense Kitty?????


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## valsetz (Feb 20, 2009)

I will cut the powdered milk replacer in half starting tomorrow and try to teach him to drink out of the pail. I will also try the probiotics tomorrow. I have been offering him alfalfa but does not seem to be interested in it. I also offer him alfalfa pellets that I had extra he seems to love it. I only offer him maybe a half of a handful.
  He seems to be in good health besides his poo because when I go into the pin with him he starts circling around fast and seems to always nose my pants for some reason. Today he also started jumping and kicking, he did not seem to try to kick me but he was definitely excited. He did meet the dogs for the first time yesterday and they were with me today (outside of the pen) so maybe he was excited about that. Thanks for all the info. I can tell already that his ribs have more meat or fat on them. Spring is coming, it has been sunny and warm the last two days and everything is melting so I can not wait to let him out into the pasture.


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## Farmer Kitty (Feb 21, 2009)

No offense, jhm. If this is due to the high protein amount he's getting it won't hurt to switch him but, it can wait a day or two. I didn't mean it had to be done immediately.


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## Imissmygirls (Feb 21, 2009)

Just wondering, would the alfalfa pellets give him green poo? Maybe too rich and even a handful is too much?
No experience here with alfalfa pellets.  Fresh green grass would give the same result tho.


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## Farmer Kitty (Feb 21, 2009)

I've seen green poo on calves that don't get anything more than milk replacer and grain. Of course, there are many shades of green too! 

I hope the calf is doing better!


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## valsetz (Feb 21, 2009)

I got him to drink out of the pail today. It was actually very easy to get him started on it. I also gave him a dose of Probios with vitamin E so hopefully that will help him with his scours. Tomorrow he is going to get banded and then shot of BOC ( I think that was the name of it). My friend that has cattle is coming over to do it for me. I was talking to him today and he thinks the scours might be from transporting him last week. He said that he has used yogurt just like you have talked about Kitty. He said something else that he has tried and is an old timers secret   is giving them a handful of like Quaker Oats or the equivalent so I tried that today and will see what happens. 
  Thanks for all the help.


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## GrassFarmerGalloway (Feb 22, 2009)

I'm no expert on scours, but I can think of two causes:  Overly rich feed and illness.  Coccidiostats won't prevent all diseases that cause scours.  He might just... Have scours.  Make sure he's in a clean environment and I'd say separate him from other calves until you know what he has isn't contagious.

Why is everyone feeding calves grain?  Calves get along just fine without it, most of the time (there are obviously going to be exceptions, especially when a whole line of cattle have been fed grain)  Maybe the grain is too rich a feed for your cows.

I'm no expert, this is just what I would do.


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## Farmer Kitty (Feb 22, 2009)

GrassFarmerGalloway, you choose to not use grain. Others use grain. 

The grain he is using is a premix that is commonly used and is not to rich for the calf. The calf is getting older and eating more grain thus he doesn't need as much milk replacer. The mother cow's milk changes as the calf gets older and starts eating other foods. We as people just have to adjust the amount of milk replacer we use in the water as the eat more grains and/or grass.


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## GrassFarmerGalloway (Feb 22, 2009)

I see.    I told you I'm not experienced.

And by the way, I think you should just call me GFG, because my username is so long and cumbersome.

Sorry 'bout the grain thing.  I think I should just learn to keep my big mouth shut.


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## wynedot55 (Feb 22, 2009)

no you are learming about the differamt ways cattle are raisesd.as well fed an handled.an thats a good thing.so keep asking qs.


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## Imissmygirls (Feb 22, 2009)

IMHO, in a perfect world where cows calved as spring grass starts growing and babies nursed freely with moms, you wouldn't need grain fed to calves.  Spring grass is very high in protein and if given free choice, I know Jersey calves prefer grazing fresh spring grass to grain. 
But the world of farming is not perfect, so we give calves grain for their protein needs when we just can't provide enough fresh spring grass for them.  Like when their moms calve when there isn't any spring grass. Or they live where there is no grass at all. Or it's under  a foot of snow.


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## WildRoseBeef (Feb 22, 2009)

GrassFarmerGalloway said:
			
		

> Why is everyone feeding calves grain?  Calves get along just fine without it, most of the time (there are obviously going to be exceptions, especially when a whole line of cattle have been fed grain)  Maybe the grain is too rich a feed for your cows.


From an Animal Scientists' perspective (at least an undergrad An Sci's perspective), grain is best for developing the calf's rumen.  In comparing milk, grass (or hay) and grain, grain is the feedstuff to use because of its energy and protein content which aid in developing rumen microflora and the lining of the inside. Ever seen the inside of a rumen? It looks like shag rug, with these papilleae (not cillia, like that found in the small intestine) for absorption of nutrients and other functions.  Grain is also more coarse than grass or hay or milk, which also helps in getting the rumen to really start working, contracting and building in size as the calf grows.

So its not that the grain is too rich a feed for the animals, like Kitty said, it's one of those things that help in growth of the calf both in his digestive system and his other extremeties, and to help in slowly wean the calf from the milk a little at a time.

Hope that explains things...


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## Farmer Kitty (Feb 22, 2009)

WRB-What a great explanation!


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## GrassFarmerGalloway (Feb 22, 2009)

WildRoseBeef said:
			
		

> GrassFarmerGalloway said:
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WOW!  I never knew that!

Not questioning grain anymore!


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