# Goats AT Auctions!!!:)



## muscovy94 (Jun 8, 2009)

HEy everyone I have  a question.  I'm going to texas this summer and will be going to first monday trade days.  They are supposed to have a TON of animals, including goats.  we are looking for a very young baby goat so we can bottle feed it (a bottle baby).  What i'm asking here is, do auctions usually sale bottle babies?  Or do they sale babies that are big enough to eat on thier own?

We are wanting to buy a very young goat so we can bottle feed it.  We want to buy a bottle baby.

Thanks.


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## Dorothy1324 (Jun 8, 2009)

i think it depends on the day the auction we have here had bottle babies some times other times not.


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## ksalvagno (Jun 8, 2009)

You may also want to consider visiting local farms and see if they offer bottle baby goats. With buying from a local farm, you could also get the support you may need if you are new to goats. It is amazing all the little things you need to learn and don't learn it all from books.


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## nightshade (Jun 8, 2009)

Here they normally sell the babies separate from the mothers at the sales.  They would have to come in with the seller saying that they must be sold together for them to be.


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## Roll farms (Jun 9, 2009)

When you buy at auction, you're usually not able to ask if the kids' have been vaccinated, if the parents are healthy, etc.  If it's really young and didn't get colostrum, it can die w/in days or hours and break your heart.
You can probably find a local breeder who sells bottle babies and be safer knowing the kid's background.
JMHO...


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## mekasmom (Jun 9, 2009)

I go to goat sales (auctions) dozens of times a year. You rarely see very young goats there, and they are usually sold with the nanny. Your best bet would be to get a pregnant nanny and take the kid off her to bottlefeed right after birth.  I even milk out the colostrum rather then letting the nanny feed the kid. You can then decide whether the nanny is tame enough for you to handle or whether she should be resold. You do see a lot of 2-3mo old billys at auctions, but it is to late to bottle feed them.  They are usually very wild because they were kept on the nanny until she was ready to be milked or rebred.  I have seen them sold for as little as five dollars a piece in a group. They usually go to a meat dealer.
Auctions are a good place to find good prices if you know very much about goats.  The downside is that not all the goats are healthy, so you have to be able to pick out a decent animal that is fairly healthy with a good temperament. Some goats do have issues that make them more suitable as a meat animal rather than a herd member. I just pass those up to go to the next person. Remember you want good temperament.  Some health issues are easily fixed (worms, lice, etc), but you cannot fix poor temperament and social skills.  If a goat never learned any human imprinting as a young kid, you can't change that when they are older. They will always be more fearful and wild then a kid who learned early to like humans.


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## muscovy94 (Jun 9, 2009)

What is this colostrum I keep hearing about?


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## lilhill (Jun 9, 2009)

It is the thick, yellowish, first milk produced by the female after she gives birth (parturition). Colostrum is rich in energy, protein, vitamins and minerals. Most importantly, it contains maternal antibodies that help protect the newborn from disease pathogens during the early part of its life. Ewes and does only produce colostrum for about 24 hours (plus or minus a few hours) after delivering their offspring.


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## Scout (Jun 9, 2009)

It'd be best to buy from a local farm. One of my friends around here just give's the bummers away IF ya let him know ahead of time ya want one, if ya dont act fast he'll put 'em down, he says he's to old to deal with 'em like he used to. So the point is, put an ad in the paper your interested in a PAIR of bummers (dont get just one, they really dont do well on there own, and if ya only get one and it does live, it'll be a down right PEST!!! Trust me...) Get out to the farm and look at how they care for there stock, make sure ya ask how old the babie's are (very important, if they dont get colostrum within a half hour or sooner after birth they will die, no way around it, and that powdered colostrum's a huge joke, its absolutely worthless. It'd be best to get one that's about 5 days old, if they wouldn't have got enough colostrum they usually wouldn't have made it to that old, from then on its smooth sailin... Oh, and also that powdered milk usually aint no good either, I've had some luck with it, but unpasterized goat's millk's the best, if not, just get the whole cow's milk from the store, it aint the best but it sure beats that powdered nightmare... and it's a lot easier on the wallet. 

That bein said, I'll tell ya what I'd do if I was you... I'd purchase a TAME (very important, not only would it be so much easier to catch her and milk her, but the kids'll watch how she acts around you, they'll pick up on fear awful quick) preggy doe, wait til she kids, pull the kids off her, milk her, and bottle feed 'em that way, that way they'd have the colostrum they need and you'd know exactly how much they got, and then the good milk after that, and you can drink the extra milk, aint nothin wrong with that LOL. Now when the kids are weaned, you could either keep the nanny, sale her or butcher her, dependin.


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## haviris (Jun 9, 2009)

I'd find the closest goat dairy I could and buy from them, they are usually fairly cheap and they haven't been exposed to the bad things auctions goats may have.


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## muscovy94 (Jun 9, 2009)

haviris said:
			
		

> I'd find the closest goat dairy I could and buy from them, they are usually fairly cheap and they haven't been exposed to the bad things auctions goats may have.


I've tried to find them locally, but they only people I could find that sold goats only had mixed breed goats.  I'm looking for some pygmy babies.


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## haviris (Jun 9, 2009)

I thought you were just looking at bottle babies, didn't know you wanted a specific breed. Pygmies aren't milk goats, so goat dairies won't have them. I'd keep an eye on craigslist, and possibly post a wanted ad. Pygmies are pretty plentiful so I'm sure you'll find one (although be sure you are getting a pygmy, lots of people think of any small goat as pygmy when they are usually mixed, study the breed standard). 

I've seen a few pygmy bottle babies on Craigslist near TX the last few months, but it's getting late in the baby season, they may start getting harder to find.


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## KareyABohr (Jun 9, 2009)

I buy bottle billies every year at auction.
They sell them seprately and you need to keep a CLOSE eye out. If they wont suck on your finger, then they won't suck a bottle.

They need their CD&T shots, they need to be kept clean, warm, and dry.

Other than that an ability to feed them twice a day at the SAME TIME every day, is all you need to really enjoy having bottle billies.

Good luck!


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## nightshade (Jun 11, 2009)

I am a really big advocate for buying goats at auctions or taking in unwanted ones from people that can no longer care for or have them. Over half of my goats are market rescues or ones given to me by people that nolonger wanted them for what ever reason. 

But you have to be careful buying bottle babies at sales more so then ones that are a little older they are more likely to die and leave you heart broken. I try to stick to ones that are old enough top be weined and rarely buy anything that is not almost knee high on me.I Keep antibiotics, syringes, CD&T meds and plenty of wormer in stock at all times.I worm them as soon as they come home as well as give them a penicillin and tetanus shot.

  KareyABohr gave some great advise though if you do decide to buy a bottle baby from a sale.


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## mully (Jun 11, 2009)

Makes one wonder why a bottle baby would be at auction...is it sick and did the people who gave it up to be auctioned care for parents. I would find a good goat from someone local.


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## haviris (Jun 11, 2009)

The most common reason for a bottle baby to end up at the auction is because many people just don't want to take the time to raise them or find them private homes. Most will be dairy bucklings.

Unfortunately there are alot of bugs they pick up at the auctions, a kid that was healthy before going to the auction, may not be healthy leaving.

I have no problem rescueing auction bottle babies, but I would recommend it for a newbie or first timer. They can be very difficult to raise and heartbreaking when they don't make it.


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## haviris (Jun 11, 2009)

Make sure you are truely commited to the responsiblity of a bottle baby, depending on how young you get one, you need to be prepared for 3 months of bottles. 

Here is my bottle feeding schedule (aprrox. it can vary by kids)
1-2 weeks five bottles a day 4 hours apart
2-5 or 6 weeks, four bottles a day 5 hours apart
5 or 6-12 weeks, three bottles a day,
If they are being sold they will start weaning at this point, if it's a keeper, I will either cut them to two bottles, or continue w/ three until they are ready to start weaning.

One thing I've noticed about newbies, no matter how excited and committed they think they will be, they seem to start getting bottle burnout at about 6 weeks, it almost never fails.

I sell bottle babies sometimes, but rarely anything under 2 weeks, and generally closer to 4 weeks. This way I can be sure the kid is doing well, the buyer gets plenty of "bottle time" and hopefully the kid will be about ready to wean by the time the buyer starts getting bottle burnout.


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## Scout (Jun 11, 2009)

haviris said:
			
		

> Make sure you are truely commited to the responsiblity of a bottle baby, depending on how young you get one, you need to be prepared for 3 months of bottles.
> 
> Here is my bottle feeding schedule (aprrox. it can vary by kids)
> 1-2 weeks five bottles a day 4 hours apart
> ...


Very good advice. I've had countless folks bring me the bottle lambs back or kill them cuz it was "to much work." So I stopped sellin bummers cuz it was gettin ridiculous. So ya lose a few hours of sleep, big flippin deal, but I guess some folks just dont like spending time with their "pets."


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## nightshade (Jun 11, 2009)

mully said:
			
		

> Makes one wonder why a bottle baby would be at auction...is it sick and did the people who gave it up to be auctioned care for parents. I would find a good goat from someone local.


Around here they usually end up at sales because they are considered a by product of freshening a dairy goat.  They usually are bills but sometimes you will see nans. They are normally smaller then what the breeder wants to have or not the desired color.


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## username taken (Jun 12, 2009)

Scout said:
			
		

> It'd be best to buy from a local farm. One of my friends around here just give's the bummers away IF ya let him know ahead of time ya want one, if ya dont act fast he'll put 'em down, he says he's to old to deal with 'em like he used to. So the point is, put an ad in the paper your interested in a PAIR of bummers (dont get just one, they really dont do well on there own, and if ya only get one and it does live, it'll be a down right PEST!!! Trust me...) Get out to the farm and look at how they care for there stock, make sure ya ask how old the babie's are (very important, if they dont get colostrum within a half hour or sooner after birth they will die, no way around it, and that powdered colostrum's a huge joke, its absolutely worthless. It'd be best to get one that's about 5 days old, if they wouldn't have got enough colostrum they usually wouldn't have made it to that old, from then on its smooth sailin... Oh, and also that powdered milk usually aint no good either, I've had some luck with it, but unpasterized goat's millk's the best, if not, just get the whole cow's milk from the store, it aint the best but it sure beats that powdered nightmare... and it's a lot easier on the wallet.
> 
> That bein said, I'll tell ya what I'd do if I was you... I'd purchase a TAME (very important, not only would it be so much easier to catch her and milk her, but the kids'll watch how she acts around you, they'll pick up on fear awful quick) preggy doe, wait til she kids, pull the kids off her, milk her, and bottle feed 'em that way, that way they'd have the colostrum they need and you'd know exactly how much they got, and then the good milk after that, and you can drink the extra milk, aint nothin wrong with that LOL. Now when the kids are weaned, you could either keep the nanny, sale her or butcher her, dependin.


So much misinformation here I had to register and post. 

Colostrum DOESNT need to be within half an hour or they die  

It is best to get it into them within 6 hrs, during this period there is 100% absorption of antibodies; within 6 - 12 hrs there is about 50% absorption; 12 - 24 hrs about 25% absorption and this tails off to 0% absorption at 48hrs. 

Now, if they dont get colostrum, they DONT immediately die, I have raised many many animals that are still alive and thriving and I KNOW they didnt get ANY colostrum. 

If they dont get colostrum, the danger period is actually 5 weeks, that is when they will succumb to infection, if you can get them through 5 weeks you are home free. 

Now if they dont get colostrum from their mum, next best thing is colostrum from another doe or even a cow (lots of people keep some in the freezer). After that the next best thing is the powdered colostrum - it is fine and does work, no problems. Next best thing after that is a mixture of milk (or replacer), cod liver oil, sugar and egg, this mimics all the other protein, fat, vit/min etc in colostrum but doesnt have the antibodies. 

If you dont get antibodies into them within 24 hrs either by fresh, frozen or powdered colostrum, best to go to a vet, they can give you injectable antibodies. 

If you choose to use milk replacer get one that is ALL MILK, no soy, and at the very least 20% protein, 20% fat. If I was in the US this is the one I would use:

http://www.mannapro.com/nurseall.htm

I personally use a 28% protein 21% fat replacer, and have raised hundreds of babies of all species on it with no problems. 

Now muscovy:

you know what you want, a pair of pygmy babies to bottle feed. The best way to get this is find a breeder of pygmy goats, place a reservation for two wethers, or two does, whatever you like, for when they are kidding down next. Place your order for bottle babies, put down a deposit, then wait till they kid down. The breeder will probably be able to establish them on a bottle for you and make your job easier.


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## jojo@rolling acres farm (Jun 12, 2009)

Agree 100% with - username taken!

That lastest posting by 'username taken' - just saved the lives of untold  goat kids AND prevented heartache for the owners/keepers. Read it, print it off - heck, MEMORIZE IT! Great information. Great Advice to Muscovy.

Muscovy - good luck in your search...you'll find them! If they turn out to be a boy and girl. "Band"(casterate) the boy so he can live out the rest of his life with his twin sister. If both turn out to be bucklings...band them both. You won't regret it! Have fun with the twins!


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## Scout (Jun 12, 2009)

username taken said:
			
		

> Scout said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This post wouldn't have bugged me at all if it wouldn't have been directed totally at me, but since it was, I'm gonna tell ya somethin...
I'm just doin what I grew up doin, never had a problem with it. I dont know why you think your so high and mighty as to act like your way is the only way and rule out everyone elses stuff, heck, there's a lot of people who I dont fully agree with on some things, but I dont say "this person's full of bull, listen to me cuz I know all," if it works for you, by all means dont fix what aint broke. But I also expect the same out of others, dont call people out and act like there the biggest idiots on the face of the planet to promote yourself, everyone has a differant way of doin things and a differant understandin of how things work. I was always taught by my parents, grandparents, local farmers, etc certain things and it aint never failed me yet. I peronally think the powdered stuff's junk, and in my experience (and that's a whole heck of a lot) bummers usually are alright after the first 5 days, I've also noticed they tend to do best if they've had colostrum in the first half hour, after that some seem to go downhill pretty fast. All the farmers around my place agree with me on that. So in the future, kindly state what works for you, and dont act like folks who do things or believe things differant than you  are morons not wothy of the bullet it would take to kill them, if you would please.


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## username taken (Jun 12, 2009)

Scout, apologies as I didnt mean to offend but reading my post back now I can see why it did offend you. 

I just wanted to post the correct information, which has arisen because of scientific research. Like you, I was brought up thinking that if they didnt get colostrum they would fade and die in the first few days, but research has proven that isnt the case, and they are more likely to show colostrum deficiency and illness at the 5 week mark. 

About getting colostrum in the first half hour, it is not so much that they need COLOSTRUM in the first half hour or they will die, it is plain and simple that they've had a feed, they've got something in their bellies to keep them warm and give them energy, without that yes they will start to fade, but I've had plenty of babies that havent had a drink for 12 - 24 hrs, they havent had colostrum till then, and it is a lot more difficult to raise them, but I raised them successfully. I've also had babies that have only had normal milk to start them off for the first 12 hrs, after that I've given them colostrum, they have been fine. 

Likewise I have raised countless lambs that I KNOW have never received colostrum and they are doing just fine. Having babies of their own, some of them. 

Colostrum is important, but its not the end of the world if they dont get it.


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## Scout (Jun 12, 2009)

Oh ok! Sorry if I was rude in that last post, aint had a very good day (not that thats an excuse for my behavior...) I enjoy learnin new things, really, I just get my underbritches in a bunch sometimes, and sometimes over dumb things LOL. So thanks for apoligizing and I hope you'll accept mine.

P.S. I'll remember about the colostrum, it got to the point I'd just give up on them, but if there's a chance they'll live and do well I'll try it next time.


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## username taken (Jun 13, 2009)

we all get our underbritches in a bunch sometimes lol I've done it plenty of times and ended up redfaced

sorry I just realised I accidently put some of your post in my last post (thats a bit confusing lol) without quoting, I'll go edit it. didnt mean for it to be there

definitely dont give up on them while there is still a chance; I've saved lambs that were so weak they couldnt stand, kids that hadnt got a drink 24 hrs and longer after birth. its a lot of work but the majority can be saved.


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## ksalvagno (Jun 13, 2009)

As far as the goat kids getting weak, is it due to hypoglycemia? We have that problem in alpacas. If they don't nurse within about 4 hours (and sometimes less or more), they can get hypoglycemic and then get too weak to nurse.

I keep frozen goat colostrum on hand. It is good for one year. Also, as far as keeping something else on hand, why not the canned goat milk from the store? That would keep longer than some of the powders.

If the kids are really weak, do you use karo syrup to give them some sugar and energy? I also keep karo syrup on hand for crias that are hypoglycemic.


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## username taken (Jun 13, 2009)

I have US friends that use a mix of karo syrup, coffee and alcohol

I myself use 3 ml glycerine and 5ml whisky/brandy/rum for a chilled and/or hypoglycaemic kid or lamb, they then get wrapped on heat pads and/or hot water bottles, in front of a heater, bout 2 hrs after that they usually take some warm milk and are good to go back out with mum


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