# Descented Bucks



## Genipher (Jun 18, 2018)

I've wanted goats for years. My family and I live in town and if the city approves our animal permit, I'd like to get 2-3 goats.

I've never thought of getting a buck, even though I want to breed for kids and milk, because of the Bucky smell. However, I just found a Craigslist ad for a DESCENTED buck!

I didn't realize that was possible. 

Now I'm wondering if any here have had descented bucks? Does it really make them smell better? Any cons to this?


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## Fullhousefarm (Jun 18, 2018)

Hmmmmm. Sounds a little fishy. 

I'm guessing maybe they mean a wether, or castrated male. They don't smell- but of coarse they don't make babies either.

I'd suggest buying goats from a local breeder who is willing to offer stud service as long as you don't add goats from other farms. This is something I do for those who want a few goats and aren't able or don't want to have a buck.


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## Latestarter (Jun 18, 2018)

Gotta agree with FullHouse... Not sure how you "de-scent" a buck when most of the smell comes from him urinating all over himself, specifically his face and beard. Evidently the goat ladies go wild for those stink faces.  The stink is really only for a 3-4 month period in the fall/winter when they go into rut. But all that aside, if you'll only want to have a few animals, try to buy from a local breeder who will allow you to bring your girls back to receive stud service. That way all you need is 3-4 does and you'll have less tension, no bucks to worry about, no smell to deal with, can still have goat kids and milk... Life will be GOOD!


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## Goat Whisperer (Jun 19, 2018)

Some, when disbudding burn the bud, and do another burn right behind the bud to get the musk gland.
We don't do this, but I know others do. Some say it helps, other say it doesn't.
Yes, your buck will still pee on himself.

I did a quick search to see if I could find a diagram.
This goat has swollen musk glands. This pic shows where the gland is located.


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## Genipher (Jun 19, 2018)

I appreciate the responses, y'all. Thank you!

I looked it up online and it seems to be a thing, like Goat Whisperer showed. Somewhere it said that it's not the urine that makes the bucks stink, but that gland. Of course, I have no clue as I've never had goats before. Seems the urine would smell bad, too!

I figured if this was a real thing and it really helped, there would be folks here who did it. Just like disbudding. Since nobody seems to...

Part of me (the wannabe prepper ) wants to have a buck of my own. The more sensible part of me, however, is screaming to only keep does and find a breeder!

At any rate, I still have time to decide. I'm saving money and trying to get our backyard in order and reading, reading, _reading!!_ to learn all I can before jumping into this. Though, honestly, when I see all the pictures of cute kids, handsome bucks, and beautiful does, I just want to ditch responsibility and dive in headfirst!

If anyone has descented bucks, please share your experiences. I'd love to hear if it actually helps with the stink.


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## Latestarter (Jun 19, 2018)

You know, you CAN do this like chickens, they're just a little larger... And there's a bright side! You don't need to keep them inside in your spare bedroom in a brooder!  But you will still need to have fencing to keep them home and some sort of shelter as they are typically little divas that abhor getting wet... But like a coop and run, you can get that done real fast, any time! Go get you some goats!


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## Goat Whisperer (Jun 19, 2018)

We have several bucks that are de scented (just the way the head was burned during disbudding) and I honestly can’t tell much of a difference.


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## Genipher (Jun 19, 2018)

Latestarter — We have a 10' x 20' shed in the backyard. Its split into 2 rooms, so the "goat side" would be 10' x 15'. It needs siding (it's currently wrapped in plastic)  but other than that, it would be perfect for goats.



Our backyard fence is wooden. There are 2 spots we'd have to "goat proof".

This area, where the fence and stone wall meet...the fence is only 3' tall. I'm assuming it would be easy for a goat to hop over and get into the woods.


And here, where the gate gives potential foot holds:


Any ideas on how to secure these areas would be much appreciated!


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## Genipher (Jun 19, 2018)

Goat Whisperer— Nuts! I was hoping there would be a difference in smell.


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## Latestarter (Jun 20, 2018)

From the pics, I'm not sure which side of those steps the goats would be on... up top, or down bottom. Either way, you are absolutely right, they can (and will) easily jump over a 3' height. Not knowing the exact "lay of your land", I can't really make any worthwhile suggestions. I'm sure you can figure it out though pretty easily. I mean, a 4' fence is generally speaking sufficient to keep the goats in and keep most bad things out. Attach it to (or make some way for them to get from) the shelter into a fenced area and you've got the basics. Most will tell you don't skimp on your fencing. Don't waste your money on welded wire unless that's all you can afford. The woven fencing is best.  They will lean into it and walk along it for side rubs. They will climb up on it to reach for tree limbs/leaves. They will stick their heads through it if they can fit, and babies can go straight through 6" field fence, even though it's woven wire. They'll put their hooves up on the cross supports of the wooden fence, but that shouldn't cause an issue. Unless they aren't nailed securely to the posts, in which case they might push the nails out and knock the fence panels off...


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## Genipher (Jun 21, 2018)

Thanks for the advice/information, Latestarter.  

I'm currently trying to figure out how to fence off the stone wall area. Maybe use that section for compost...

At any rate, thanks everyone for the info on stinky bucks.


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## Ridgetop (Jun 27, 2018)

Descenting bucks is really not a great idea.  Bucks have scent glands on their heads _and_ also behind their knees.  You would have to burn 4 sets of glands out, very painful for the buck, and they would still pee on themselves.  Anyone who thinks that urine of any kind doesn't have an odor has no sense of smell.  Bucks are usually only stinky during rut.  I used to bathe our bucks with a deodorizing shampoo and shave them after rut season.  This really helped until rut started again.  Of course, we kept them on the other side of the house from the does and down the hill on a planet far, far away . . . .  Not really that far, but not close to the house.  It sounds like you do not have enough space to keep a buck and while you may get used to the stink, neighbor complaints will be the quickest way to get your animal special use permit revoked.

Do what Latestarter recommends and buy your 2 does from a breeder who will breed your does back.  Do not get more than 2 because 2 goats quickly become 4, then become 8 .  Goats are like Lays potato chips, nobody can have just one!  We were able to do that with our first 2 milkers.  In addition, your breeder will be a wonderful mentor with kidding, milking, hoof trimming and al other aspects of goats.

I love goats.  We have sheep now because no one wants to milk, but our favorites were our dairy goats!  LaManchas and Nubians - the LaManchas used to bite the Nubians ears - naughty girls!  LOL


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## Genipher (Jun 28, 2018)

I can just imagine the LaManchas thinking, "If I can't have ears, neither can you!" 

Yeah, I measured our backyard the other day. We have a tiered yard. Top tier is 65' x 34' and the bottom is 65' x 40'. There would be no way to get a buck far enough away from the house.  I'm sure our neighbors would hate us if I tried to keep a stinky buck.

I figure we'll be allowed at least 2 does. Maaaaybe 3. (I'm thinking we should get Nigerian Dwarves...there are a lot of N.D.s in my area—though I would LOVE to have LaManchas!) I also know that when the time comes my kids will argue against selling any goat kids. But unless we move to acreage, it just won't be possible to keep any. We'd just be breeding for milk and meat.

I didn't know bucks had scent glands behind their knees! I love learning new things about goats!


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## Donna R. Raybon (Jun 28, 2018)

Yeah, but the Munchies do have TAILS and the Nubians quickly figure that out.


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## Genipher (Jun 28, 2018)




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## Donna R. Raybon (Jun 28, 2018)

We'd just be breeding for milk and meat.

[/QUOTE]
 Make sure you sit down your own self and test milkers for your being able to comfortably milk.  Some, even the standard sized breed of does have really short teats or small teat orifice.  I have seen some ND with nice long teats and others that are like milking a mouse.  If you machine milk, it is not such a big deal.  

If you want meat, then standard sized breed will give you more and quicker than ND.  Who is going to neuter buck kids and disbud kids?  Best to get someone to hands on teach you and to hold your hand the first few times.  I don't mind banding, but hate to cut.  Dh does not mind cutting, but leaves the place when I plug in the disbudding iron... he hates the smell.  If we cut buck kids we try to do it within first four or five days of life.  They don't bleed and not so  hard on them.  

Goats are addictive!  I started out with four does and within five years had over sixty.  Without adding any more outside purchases!!!


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## Genipher (Jun 28, 2018)

And they say rabbits breed fast! That's alotta goats in 5 years!

It's true I have zero experience with milking, banding, disbudding... Currently I'm learning by watching YouTube videos and reading here. I need to look into some hands-on experience over the course of the next year...Wish my goat friends were in the area...ahem! I'm talking about you, @TAH !

Banding looks easy (though everything always LOOKS easier than it actually is!) but disbudding looks down-right scary! I watched a few videos and thought, "Can I just have polled goat kids?"

And then I read polled + polled = bad, so that's right out!

EDIT to add: Would 2 LaManchas do okay in, roughly, a 5,000 sq. ft. backyard? I was leaning towards Nigerians because they're smaller and seemed to fit city living better...but I'd prefer LaManchas. I also have little kids that would be out with the goats. Would smaller goats be better around children? I'm so torn! Wish I had enough space for both breeds!


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## Ridgetop (Jun 28, 2018)

How old are your children?  When we first started, we only let the kids name the goats with names like potroast, etc. and constantly reminded them that the goats were tasty! 

You really need someone to show you _hands on_ how to use a disbudding iron.  I learned from an older goat guy and he taught me to make sure I got all the horn bud.  18 years - no scurs!  BUT you have to be able to handle the smell, the screams (not in pain but they hate being put into the disbudding box!  LOL) and steel yourself to do the job properly.  Most people who end up with scurs chicken out on the time it take to do a proper job.  I taught my middle boy how and he did most of them after he turned 14.  He also did disbudding for lots of other people - he charged $5 a head.  No scurs from him either. 

The really important thing with using the elastrator is not to catch the urethra in the band.  The urethra is the tube the pee comes through.  It feels like a thick piece of cord under the skin.  We would give a bottle to the kids or put the lambs in with mom or nurse then watch to make sure they peed.  If they don't, cut off the band and try again.  Again, hands on so you can feel is the best.

*IMPORTANT:  *Give a shot of Tetanus Antitoxin when disbudding kids or banding tails in lambs.  You usually disbud and band tails before giving CDT to I like to give the Antitoxin to make sure their antibodies are active.  You can give it at same time as CDT.  CDT has Tetanus Toxoi, but will not take effect for about a week so the Antitoxin is imperative to avoid Tetanus when banding.


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## Genipher (Jul 1, 2018)

Ouch! They didn't mention anything about the urethra while banding, in the YouTube vids! 

My kids range in age from 13 to 1. In the past we had meat rabbits. One was named Dinner. 

At that time my oldest was around 7. She said her favorite animals were rabbits because, "They're cute and tasty!"

Hey, that's pretty cool that your son got paid to disbud kids. I would totally pay $5 a head to have that part done!


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## Ridgetop (Jul 1, 2018)

Now he would charge more - that was about 15 years ago.  But still worth it for just a couple of goats.  We practiced on a couple of early buck kids first, then did around 50-60- doe kids in kidding season.

The urethra feels like a piece of thin (1/8-3/8") plastic tubing.  It runs between the testicles and the penis.  Familiarize yourself with the feel several times when petting those adorable goat kids and you will recognize the feel when you band.   Oops, that doesn't sound very nice. . . .    Anyway, watch the kid carefully afterwards and you should see him pee.  If he can't pee and his belly starts to swell in 24 hours, cut the band, massage the tube to get the blood flow back into the urethra.   Then reband.  If in doubt while banding, cut the band off and start over - bands are cheap.  Once you get the hang of it you will automatically feel for the tube and no problem.  And remember it is only once a year because you can band all the buck kids at once - as long as you do them by 2 months.  

I would check to see if you have a livestock auction anywhere near, call and ask if the goat kids go to ethnic buyers for slaughter.  If they do, save yourself time and trouble and dump the bucks at the auction at 2 months old without banding or disbudding.  I banded and disbudded before taking the kids for years until I found out that the ethnic buyers did not want disbudded and banded.  They actually paid more for them without disbdg and banding, and wanted them at 2 months!  Yay!  Saved me time trouble and milk which I needed, and brought a bigger check. 

I prefer selling for meat instead of pets.  A lot of pet owners buy "cute", lose interest in full grown, don't trim feet, etc., and often call you up a year or 2 later and want you to buy the goat back.  (We all have stories about that.)  Meat buyers are *repeat* buyers.


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## Genipher (Jul 1, 2018)

Familiarize myself! Haha!  I know what you meant but it does come out a little funny!

I like the idea of selling bucklings to the auction...I'll have to add that to my "list of things to research" and find out what's in my area. Though I'd probably sell doelings, which means I'd still need to disbud. Though I read females are easier to disbudding and are less likely to get scurs...?


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## Ridgetop (Jul 1, 2018)

Depending on what goats you have, breed, registered, showing, bloodlines, etc, you can sell the doelings for breeding so yes, you want to disbud them, and they are worth a lot more.  Remember in the dairy industry (and even one milker counts) females are good while males are pretty much a liability.  Females produce milk and are valuable, males are only good for meat.  Good dairy animals do not put a lot of meat on their frame in ratio to the feed they must consume, that is why you want to sell the buck kids early at the auction without putting a lot of feed into them.  That gives you more milk for raising the doe kids which are worth more.  Of course, doelings will BBQ as well as bucklings.

While your goats will be mostly pets, always try to look at your operation in a cost effective way.  The bottom line counts.  That is why I recommend you weigh your milk each time (8 lbs. = 1 ga.)  Keep a record of how much is produced.  At the end of the year figure out how much your milk costs you per gallon.  Whether it is more expensive to keep the goat or buy the milk doesn't really matter if you want fresh natural milk for your family BUT it is so great to add up the columns at the end of the year and see how many 100s of gallons your herd produces.  Goat milk at the natural food store is expensive so don't figure the standard store cow milk price, use the natural goat milk price.  like vs like


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