# First timer with Lionheads!



## Bucking Adoeable Fainters (Oct 29, 2014)

Hi everyone! We have had our Lionhead does since Valentines Day, and decided to breed our first doe last month, due Monday Nov4th. (30days)
Because we are first timers, and our does are first timers, we decided to do one at a time so I wasnt overwhelmed with either loss or bunnies. I also was not mentally prepared to breed our top doe! I love her and am a little scared! So I am obviously open to any and all advice and help from you lovely seasoned veterans!

First off we have Dulce'. She is a blue torte, double-mane, lil fiesty pants!!! She was the sweetest little bunny, and just became a bit more dominant and independent as she matured. She would actually mount our other doe! Then we separated them...lol. She did okay being bred to our buck McQueen, but the very next day SHE BIT ME! Like chunk of skin out of my finger, bit me! Couldn't even believe it! She calmed down after 3days and is back to normal now. But i have been EXTREMELY reluctant to handle her while she is pregnant and hormonal.

Dulce' is currently in our big hutch,  it is 4ft long, 2ft wide, and has an enclosed area. Do i need to get a box as well? I have no idea if she will become "angry" again, or if that was just a backlash to the breeding, but i do not want to be bit again especially if handling a baby! And i am pretty terrified she wont be a good mom and I'm headed for tragedy.

On a positive note, Blue Cotton Candy (aka Fluffy) is the sweetest ever, our little champion! And her breeder said her mother did excellent with her first kit and is an amazing mommy! Dulce' didn't come from the same super high end breeder and frankly didn't take care of her bunnies, and i bought Dulce' because i was broken hearted over her situation 

Anywho onto pics!!!!!
First is Dulce in her hutch enclosure
2nd is McQueen-Vienna Marked, Frosted Torte BEW
(Sorry hes hard to see, FLUFFY!) Lol
3rd is Ms Fluffy-champion bloodline blue!
Last is Dulce' out in cage part of hutch


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## Hens and Roos (Oct 29, 2014)

Welcome!  Nice group of bunnies you have.

We give our bunnies nest boxes about 1 week before they are due so they can build a nest. Given that your doe has an enclosed area, you can watch her and see if she builds a nest there- just provide her with extra hay.  You may see her starting to carry hay around under her chin and taking it into her area.  

We find that the does get moody as they mature....once we breed a doe we tried not to handle her but provide pets as such as she allows.  We have Californian and French Angora so bigger rabbits.  We have 2 does who are very protective mothers so we respect their space- we do check the babies just to make sure they are alright but keep it to a minimum (we give the doe some sunflower seeds to distract her).  We have 2 does that have no problems with us checking and just stand there and watch(they get sunflower seeds as well). 

Not sure if it makes a difference but we have found that the does we have kept from kit on seem more friendly with us compared to does we have brought in from someone else.

Good luck and keep us posted!


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## secuono (Oct 29, 2014)

Better to breed does at the same time, even if they are all first timers, sometimes, you get lucky and a first timer will do excellent and can care for other kits as well. 

Also, HUGE thanks for spelling Lionhead Correctly!!! Massive pet-peeve when people spell that as two words!! 

Give them a nest 1wk before, if they do nothing or potty in it, take it out and wait for the day before. If they potty in it the day before, clean it out, move the nest to a new corner and then give them another pan with hay for them to nap in. Rabbits love a soft napping area, they don't care that YOU say it's a nest. 
What kind of nest are you using, any cold weather coming? I have metal/plastic nests, wood/cardboard bottoms. I use hay, tons of hay, then add more hay in the cage for the does to gather and stuff into their nests. If the doe does not pull fur, add some. Since they are first timers, add fur or laundry lint into the hay, make a claw of 5 fingers and spin the lint and hay in a circle to help mix and start a nest hole. 

Don't bother them when they start or the days surrounding their due date, feed/water and leave them be. Many does will stop eating or eat less the day before they are about to kindle, some eat like hogs and surprise you. Can be very random.

Check late at night the night before due date, early morning of due date, late at night of due day, ext. If any are found out of the nest, move them into the nest and check often that she doesn't move the hay and freeze the kits! 
If any are found cold and hardly moving or not moving, stuff them in your shirt next to your skin and warm them up! 20-30min later you'll know if they are gone or will revive. 
Sometimes they keep pottying in the nest, bring the nest into the house, only taking it to the mom 2x a day to feed. STAY and watch until she feeds them. 
If she refuses to feed them, stretch her over the nest gently. If you don't hold on tight to the legs, she can very easily scratch or gut a kit with her hind feet!! 
But even with all the care in the world, she may have zero instinct, no milk, etc. Accept the loss and rebreed her a few days later. Some people say to rebreed right away, that has always failed me. I wait at least a week for her to settle, then rebreed.


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## Bucking Adoeable Fainters (Oct 29, 2014)

Thank you so very much!!! Also, thank you for your helpful hints. Idk if you can see, but i have filled the enclosed part of the hutch with Orchard Grass. She loves it and has been super happy. I didnt know if i should throw some shavings in there as well??? Secuono-thank you for that tip on the laundry lint! Genious! I did notice she has been going potty all over the place. When she is usually very good about using her litter pan. I just try to keep the hutch clean.
Just counting down the days and hoping she does come through being a good mom naturally. I will definitely make note of the warming tactics!!! I agree of breeding at the same time, but i do not have enough room/cages at this time. I'd rather be prepared for everyone to be happy then have to be overcrowded. ..if i was that lucky with that many!

No, no cold weather here. We are in So. Cal and its been HOT. My rabbits live in the house in the a/c lol. All of my animals are a bit spoiled. 

I will be looking for a little nest this weekend. I have looked everywhere, and have yet to find a simple wood box. I got her this plastic igloo thing and she HATES it! So i took it out. Any ideas on where i can find a simple box??? I know it sounds simple, but things are a bit fancy schmancy and commercial around here!


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## secuono (Oct 29, 2014)

A shoebox, plastic, will work fine, or other similar sized rectangle. Many prefer something like a tunnel, so a plastic cat crate or those yellow/blue cat litter box bins, take the big half of the blue lid off, leave the narrow strip along the bottom, wire it to the wall and stuff it full of hay. My past Lionheads loved the litter bins, preferred it to all other boxes.


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## Bucking Adoeable Fainters (Oct 29, 2014)

THAAAAAANK YOUUUUUUUUUU!!!!!!! I will get both tomorrow to see if they make little miss happy!!!! Yaaay!!!


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## Bucking Adoeable Fainters (Nov 2, 2014)

Alright everyone,  tomorrow is day 30! We have NOT been successful at getting a nest ready AT ALL. Would this suggest she is not bred? She has been running around her hutch like a crazy woman as well. 

No hair, no nest. I put in the plastic shoebox idea with hay, no. She attacked it like it was the buck coming back for another round. Put shavings then hay on top, no. Nothing but a huge mess for me to clean up. The litter box idea doesn't fit in my hutch enclosure.  

Any advice or tips or what i could do, besides prepare for disaster? 

Many many thanks.


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## Hens and Roos (Nov 2, 2014)

maybe just leave her be and see what happens- we have had does build her nest after having babies.

Good Luck


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## Bucking Adoeable Fainters (Nov 2, 2014)

REALLY?!!!! Oh thank you thank you!! There's hope yet!!! Hopefully tonight or tomorrow ill be able to post pics of our first Lionhead kits yaaaay!!!!!


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## Bucking Adoeable Fainters (Nov 3, 2014)

Okay soooooo Dulce and Fluffy are romping around and acting absolutely bananas all of a sudden. So i go out to the living room to check, everything looks okay. I open up the hutch enclosure and there was a few little drops of blood/mucusy discharge. I'm hoping this is normal and means little bun buns are on the way?!!!!! It was in a corner were there was a pile of hay. No actual nest or hair pulling yet. But I'm hoping and excited!!!!!


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## Becca'sBunnyBarn (Nov 12, 2014)

I have Lionheads and yes they can be wierd about their nesting. I use wood nestboxes with wire bottoms ( scraps from building my cages ) with lots of hay. I usally have to replace the hay once before she actully builds the nest because she uses it like a litterbox.


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## Becca'sBunnyBarn (Nov 12, 2014)

Also, really cute Lionheads. let us know if you get kits!


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## Bucking Adoeable Fainters (Nov 12, 2014)

Thank you so very much for your experience and advice! Unfortunately no kits this round. With a newbie me, First timers doe and buck, to be expected. I'm really hoping its just that, and not a bad breeder on either end. Dulce' has been okay, but i am a little leary still since she bit me =/ 

I have 3 doe goats due this week and into next, so that will keep me busy. Will re-breed both of my does as soon as my kidding is done


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## Bucking Adoeable Fainters (Jan 14, 2015)

Okay here we are 2 months later and we are FINALLY expecting kits this weekend!!!!! I bred both girls as suggested. 
Dulce built her nest yesterday. 
Fluffy is attempting to make hers. 

We made a huge hutch for the kits/ Dulce'. Fluffy is in the hutch (still inside) but the hutch is outside. We moved Dulce in almost 2 weeks ago now, and she DOES NOT seem happy . little food consumption, and today i noticed she has runs =/ i am extremely concerned. I pulled her out this morning. When i touched her stomach she did squeak (i felt horrible! ) so i held her toosh and back while i cleaned her tail area. Advice?  I'm hoping its just from the change, but i am worried. I do NOT want to stress her, or lose her! He cage in the house was just WAY too small. 

Pics from last weekend.
We have the ramp removed from the 1st to 2nd level so McQueen can romp during the day. Ramp from 2nd to 3rd level in, but she has no interest in heading up to enclosed area (i thought for sure she would love that). Her nest is directly behind where she sits in this pic. About 10inches off her food/water. So close to the door for me!


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## amyandkids (Jan 25, 2015)

Any babies????


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## Bucking Adoeable Fainters (Jan 25, 2015)

Yes @amyandkids!
We have another thread with their updates 

http://www.backyardherds.com/threads/help-with-kits-kid-progress.30533/


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