# Breeding Q/help



## secuono (Sep 9, 2011)

I've got a couple Qs I need you guys to help me out with. I've looked things up about this and that and now need you guys to confirm in a way. 
How old should the buck be before he can breed? My Silver Fox pair is 6mo, 7mo in a week or so. Both are new to it all. I've brought her to him a few times, she's never really into it much. Even with waiting a few days and all. 
How do you check to see if it took? I've read you hold her head facing you, fingers under the belly up to either side of the spine for little balls in a row. Nothing there, not sure if I'm even checking correctly. :/
Any help would be great. Do you think either or may be too young? Should I just wait another week and re-test, put in the nest just in-case in 2 weeks? 
She is 2lbs larger than him, actually larger, not just fat.


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## oneacrefarm (Sep 9, 2011)

secuono said:
			
		

> I've got a couple Qs I need you guys to help me out with. I've looked things up about this and that and now need you guys to confirm in a way.
> How old should the buck be before he can breed? My Silver Fox pair is 6mo, 7mo in a week or so. Both are new to it all. I've brought her to him a few times, she's never really into it much. Even with waiting a few days and all.
> How do you check to see if it took? I've read you hold her head facing you, fingers under the belly up to either side of the spine for little balls in a row. Nothing there, not sure if I'm even checking correctly. :/
> Any help would be great. Do you think either or may be too young? Should I just wait another week and re-test, put in the nest just in-case in 2 weeks?
> She is 2lbs larger than him, actually larger, not just fat.


When you put her in with the buck, did he actually finish? ie. grunt, fall off or to the side, etc.? If not, then he likely did not succeed. Your buck is plenty old enough. How much does the doe weigh and did you check her "parts" for readiness? ie. dark pink to purple=ready to go, pink to dark pink=maybe, white to lite pink=not ready


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## secuono (Sep 9, 2011)

What makes the color change? Just the presence of the buck, certain age? Not sure what color range she's at now. I can check later in the day. 
Yea, he definitely does that, such a guy, lol. He does that every time. He's missed the 1st or 2nd time, but then again she's never really up for it.


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## Ms. Research (Sep 10, 2011)

secuono said:
			
		

> What makes the color change? Just the presence of the buck, certain age? Not sure what color range she's at now. I can check later in the day.
> Yea, he definitely does that, such a guy, lol. He does that every time. He's missed the 1st or 2nd time, but then again she's never really up for it.


Can tell your a guy.   It's hormone levels that make the vulva change colors as oneacrefarm stated.  The darker the vulva, the hormone levels are high, and your doe is ready.  Like a guy, the buck is ALWAYS ready.  Please stop giving him a complex and just check the doe before you start.  Both of your frustrations will slip away and she will do what she is made to do, be a good mom and give you plenty of kits.  Plus a good grunt for your buck.


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## secuono (Sep 10, 2011)

Ms. Research said:
			
		

> secuono said:
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I'm a woman, I just know how guys are and how b*tchy us ladies can be, lol. What I meant by that is, what will get her in the mood? She lives in the same hutch as him, separate sides, though. Should I just check her everyday until she likes him or let them have playdates, switch sides, feed her something special, etc.


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## oneacrefarm (Sep 10, 2011)

Things I have heard to try are:

1) Apple Cider Vinegar in the water for a week or so. 1Tblsp to 1Gal

2) Switch their cages for a while

3) Up the fat in her diet, ie. BOSS 1tsp daily

Never had to use any of these, so I am just repeating what I have heard from others....

Also, it could be time of day related. Try her at different times, ie. early morning, late afternoon, evening. Some rabbits have times that they prefer to breed.

Hope it helps!

Shannon


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## Ms. Research (Sep 11, 2011)

secuono said:
			
		

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Sorry! 

Yes us females can get a little b*tchy plus make everything about us.  Does are like that and it's all on her time.  Good suggestion from oneacrefarm is possible switch cages.  Just a new view can help a doe.  I would watch her fat intake because does can collect fat around their fallopian tubes which will also stop conception.  Once she's in the new location, let her settle a few days and then check her "lady" parts to see if a change of color.  Then put her in with the buck.    Also I read that rabbits pick up on our anxiety.  She might feel how frustrated you are.  I would be too.  We all want healthy kits.   That's what I would do.


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## doubled (Sep 11, 2011)

secuono said:
			
		

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IN the MOOD? Bottle of nice wine, soft music, box chocolates........

Yes I'm a guy !!!!!


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## secuono (Sep 12, 2011)

I think me and the doe are similar, we both just rather not..lol. 
Eh, ok, I switched cages. Gave them an alfalfa horse cube, buck went right for it, what a pig. Doe is watching her weight, lol, not really, idk, she sniffed it over and went to her pellets instead.


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## crazyturkeydesigns (Sep 12, 2011)

secuono said:
			
		

> *I think me and the doe are similar, we both just rather not..lol. *
> Eh, ok, I switched cages. Gave them an alfalfa horse cube, buck went right for it, what a pig. Doe is watching her weight, lol, not really, idk, she sniffed it over and went to her pellets instead.


LOL, ditto! 
Anywhooo 
Someone mentioned time of day too, and imo it's better to breed in the morning/night. I've had some success breeding in the morning before I feed, but it tends to work better with the sables than the mini rex. They just want to get to the food 
Good luck and let us know how it goes! It can be frustrating but it'll be worth when you have some fat little babies in the nest box.


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## secuono (Sep 12, 2011)

Haha.

I've been trying around 6pm usually. I guess I could try at night, like now in the dark. Only time it's actually cool/cold. In the morning I'm too busy running to work.


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## secuono (Sep 18, 2011)

She is still as white as paper. I've tried everything and she is just telling me she is a lesbian or something I'm sure. 
Ugh, what do I do now?


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## Ms. Research (Sep 18, 2011)

secuono said:
			
		

> She is still as white as paper. I've tried everything and she is just telling me she is a lesbian or something I'm sure.
> Ugh, what do I do now?


A Lesbian Rabbit?  Never heard of such thing.   I think she's just not ready but that's just my opinion.  It's amazing what heat will do with rabbits or any animal for that fact.  If you are tired of trying with her, then I would cull her.  Maybe she isn't the breeder you thought?   Or wait till the cooler weather is here.   Other than patience with her, I just don't know what else to say.  But never have I heard of a lesbian rabbit.


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## secuono (Sep 18, 2011)

But that's just it, it* is* cooler now. All week it's been cool, last 3 days 60-69F. Nights even colder, need 2 blankets at least to sleep. 
Guess I will keep trying. Wanted to have rabbit for my brother's birthday or new years. Now it's a goal for my fiance and I's 3yr anniversary. Crazy animals, never cooperate when you need them to.


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## Ms. Research (Sep 18, 2011)

secuono said:
			
		

> But that's just it, it* is* cooler now. All week it's been cool, last 3 days 60-69F. Nights even colder, need 2 blankets at least to sleep.
> Guess I will keep trying. Wanted to have rabbit for my brother's birthday or new years. Now it's a goal for my fiance and I's 3yr anniversary. Crazy animals, never cooperate when you need them to.


Believe me, understand your frustration.  I wanted my holland lops by mid-October but that's not happening because of the heat.  Now I'm looking at November/December or even waiting until next April.  FYI, it takes some "summer sterile" bucks a month to get back it's sperm production.  Could be it takes does that long as well.  Crazy animals or not, sometimes there's a reason rabbits don't want to have kits in hot weather.   Hot weather can also affect unborn kits.  Nature's strange that way.


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## oneacrefarm (Sep 19, 2011)

secuono said:
			
		

> She is still as white as paper. I've tried everything and she is just telling me she is a lesbian or something I'm sure.
> Ugh, what do I do now?


How much does she weigh? If she has not hit 8lbs yet, then she is likely just not physically ready to breed.


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## secuono (Sep 19, 2011)

I know the buck was around 6lbs, doe was around 2lbs heavier than him. I'll have to buy a scale to see where they are now. Benn meaning to buy one.


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## secuono (Sep 22, 2011)

Well, her bum goes up if you rub either side of her tail, but she's still not cool with the rest of it.


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## hoodat (Sep 23, 2011)

Put the buck and doe in seperate cages but close enough so they can see , and more importantly, smell one another. Watch the doe and she'll start scratching at the side of the cage close to him when she gets the message. Don't worry if he sprays her cage and possibly even gives her a shot. The scent glands near a bucks penis will mix with the urine when he sprays and breeding is what that's all about.
She may also need a bit more time. She's just now on the edge of being ready to breed. My best doe was almost ten months before she took the buck the first time but she's been ready and eager ever since.


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## secuono (Sep 23, 2011)

She lives next to him. 6ft by 3ft hutch.


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## secuono (Sep 28, 2011)

Doe is 10 lbs on the dot. Buck is 7.5 lbs. 


So weight is not her issue.
Q! When you are checking the doe for readiness color, are you doing it like you do when you sex them? As in pushing the sides to get the genitals to come out to show themselves? If so, she's red/purple for sure. Still grunts and does not lift or anything. 
Also noticed the buck usually tries a little too far north, sometimes he will correct himself and slide back down to her tail area. He's a very sweet bun and I'm always cuddling him, doe is a total nutcase. He also stops if I reach out or he notices my hand/arm near or under the doe. He isn't all that motivated about it all, lol.
I asked the breeder I got them from if she had any adult meat breed does or any already bred, but she only has kits. Sigh. 

I'm so not getting anywhere...

Also, what is the size for the large breed nest box? I found one at the store and bought it, not sure if it's big enough.


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## oneacrefarm (Sep 29, 2011)

secuono said:
			
		

> Doe is 10 lbs on the dot. Buck is 7.5 lbs.
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Well, I don't push the sides. I pull back the tail with one hand and grasp the fur at the top of the genitals with the other and pull it back towards her stomach. This seems to work better for me than pushing in on the sides. But yes, red/purple is what you are looking for. Some does just don't like some bucks, for whatever reason. I have never tried it, but others have mentioned "stimulating" the vent area and then trying again. Like I said, never tried it myself...:/
Shannon


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## secuono (Sep 29, 2011)

I've tried everything I could think of. She is just so not ok with it. Grunts anytime he moves...*sigh*


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## doubled (Sep 30, 2011)

Forgive me if I missed it but you are taking the Doe to the Buck in his pen ,right?


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## secuono (Sep 30, 2011)

Yes, doe into bucks cage. But even if I move him to hers[I did that when I was switching cages for a few days to see if it would help, it didn't] doe didn't care and she is never aggressive towards the buck.


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## Ms. Research (Oct 1, 2011)

Sounds like you have an incompatible pair.  I've heard that rabbits, if they don't like another, will have nothing to do with one another.  Maybe it's time to get a new doe?


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## bluemini (Oct 1, 2011)

Ms. Research said:
			
		

> Sounds like you have an incompatible pair.  I've heard that rabbits, if they don't like another, will have nothing to do with one another.  Maybe it's time to get a new doe?


I agree , maybe get a new one and try .  Then try her later on or something,  or at least thats what I would do . Hope it works out for ya . :/


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## secuono (Oct 2, 2011)

Breeder doesn't have any adult or breeding age does. And rather not mix with other breeds. Guess I will just keep trying w/her.


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