# Toli and Bandit are killing my chickens



## Robbin (Sep 8, 2014)

The chickens fly out of the coop run. 6 foot fence with a 2 foot L at the top to stop critters from climbing in.  Then they have trouble getting back in because they wait too long and it starts getting dark.  So they roost outside, usually low enough the dogs can reach them.  One has been killed, another badly injured.  Toli is so big and strong he shrugs off the beating (I use the dead chicken).
Bandit runs and hides and hates to even be scolded.  But I'm sure he's the instigator. I’m broken hearted,  finally put the electric fence up between them and the coop.  So the coop is unprotected but the chickens are protected from the dogs.  The dogs are more dangerous than the possums right now.  I tried letting the dogs in the coop when the chicks were little, they’ve never shown any aggression in my presence. The only thing they ever did was eat chick food. They are way too smart to attack while I’m there.  I took the live chicken out of Bandits mouth and the dead one out of Tolis mouth about 4 days apart.  After the first attack I put some roosts out front in case they got out and I wasn’t there to check on them at dark.  But they obviously didn’t use it..  Not sure what else I can try at this point.  They are going free range next week from a completely enclosed coop with an automatic door.  They’ve never hurt one out running around,  but they sure have when they are roosting.  Hopefully the new coop with the auto door will keep them safe.  The door is way too small for either dog.


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## Baymule (Sep 8, 2014)

Can you cut feathers from one wing to keep them from flying out?


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## Robbin (Sep 9, 2014)

I haven't tried that,  I've only got 5 old enough to fly out, thou the other 17 are rapidly approaching their size.  My goal has always been to free range them.  I've got 80 acres surrounded by woods and farm land.  That plan never considered that my own dogs would be a threat.  I'm going to try free rangining some of the roosters. They are larger and faster and hopefully I can be there to scold the dogs if they chase them.  The dog fence is electric and keeps them in about 4 acres around the house.  However the front 40 is already wired to give them access as I wanted them to have more range to protect the chickens when they free range.  Boy that idea has blown up in my face.


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## secuono (Sep 10, 2014)

Are they LGDs?
They aren't made for birds and water fowl, they were bred to protect sheep and goats. So getting them to accept birds can be hard and impossible for some dogs.


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## WhiteMountainsRanch (Sep 10, 2014)

I agree with the above posters. Cut the primary wing feathers on one side of all the chickens so they can't get out. That will solve the problem for now. If you want to eventually have them protecting the chickens you need to start back at step one with only supervised visits with the chickens and only while your present and can watch/ supervise, and possibly scold right when it happens as necessary.


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## babsbag (Sep 10, 2014)

My  LGDs killed chickens until they were about 2 years old and then it finally stopped. Now I have another LGD that is 20 months old and I am still losing birds on occasion. Not daily, but often. And it is in the evenings when the birds start to head to the coop and he sees a game afoot and that is that. Chickens die easily.

I used an e-collar on all of my dogs when they were pups for the sole purpose of making chickens painful. I would work without the collar for a few weeks and the dogs knew NO as long as I was there. But they would never remember that if I wasn't in the field. So after I thought that the dogs did know what I wanted I would put the collar on.  I don't give a NO command, I don't say anything, I simply watch and wait and when they even look at a chicken I give them the strongest shock it has. I am sure many are thinking this is cruel but think of it from the chickens view point.

My chickens, goats and dogs live together so they have to learn. I have to introduce new birds to all the dogs in a pen where they can't reach them for a few days and then I can let them out. If I just toss them in the field they will kill them if they catch them. Also chicks with broodies are at risk no matter what I do.

My male just killed a guinea chick tonight so I guess it is back to collar time for him, he seems to have forgotten his lessons. I do believe they can learn, they are just a little slow to grow up sometimes. But it does take work on your part, and time, lots of time.


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## Southern by choice (Sep 10, 2014)

I know there are a few that the collars worked for but I'd say the majority it doesn't.  
Training them to poultry sure does take time and commitment that is for sure. If you are home full time it is easier than working all day and getting little actual time to work with them.
Raising the dogs from pups straight through is  best. Often people will keep them penned or cooped and then let them out here and there. This process takes far longer. 
We correct verbally and scold, shame. The Anatolians are harder and generally seem to take longer. They are also less tolerant of "new" birds or birds that ae in one area and then "suddenly" come into their area.
We had a poultry farm before we ever had goats and lost lots to predators. Got goats got the LGD's. Lost a few birds but out of our 4 adult LGD's and 2 litters of pups I'd say maybe a total of <10 birds. Of course that doesn't include day old chicks getting stepped on. Callie our Toli has been the worst. If it isn't her bird that belongs in her field she thinks it is fair game.
Letting the dogs know they are your BIRDS your babies goes a long way. Developing relationship and human/dog bond as you have is the greatest advantage as these dogs when they have that bond really do not want to disappoint you.
Currently we have 3  - 21 week old pups (pyr) and 1 25 week old pup (Toli) they have chased we correct we did lose 1 bird from shock, not a puncture wound anywhere just picking the hen up and carrying her around and playing "no my turn". We put the bird down. Of course I shoved the bird in their faces and scolded them "what did you do to "mommy's baby" HUH?" They were so shamed. They live sleep eat with our poultry 24/7. 
Don't be too discouraged it does take time but you can get Toli through it. You love that boy and he loves you and these dogs that have that strong bond will want to do the right thing. It would have been easier to raise him with them. Much harder when they are older, but it is possible!


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## WhiteMountainsRanch (Sep 12, 2014)

I'd love to see updated pictures of him, if you have them!


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## goatgurl (Sep 12, 2014)

i have seen so many good lgd's gotten rid of for just that reason.  they do fine with the chickens for a while then bam its a feather fight.  i have had Anatolians for over 15 years and almost every one of them went thru a chicken killing spell.  the worst was when i went from penned birds to free range and the dogs didn't think they belonged.  had one male who would pick them up by the tail feathers and carry them around.  never mean or aggressive but he liked squeaky toys and as babsbag said chickens die easy.  i started setting out in the pasture with the chickens all around me and corrected anytime the dogs looked cross eyed at a chicken (cracked corn is a great bribe to keep the chickens close).   took time and patience to break them but finally my stubbornness won out over theirs.  keep working with them, they are worth it.


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