# One Acre, big dreams, new fence, questions...



## NachoFarm (Mar 26, 2012)

We measured for our fence this week and it looks like the pasture area will be just over one acre;
We want to keep one horse, two dairy goats, and a small flock of sheep.  We already have the two goats although they're only kids right now.  The horse probably won't be until next year because I don't want to get in over my head.  

1. We're planning on putting up five strand electric fence, will this keep everyone in?
2. The area was used by a farmer for a previous number of years to grow alfalfa for his dairy cows.  It appears to have grass and clover growing as well, do we need to add anything else or is this sufficient pasture?
3. We want to use rotational grazing but is one acre too small to divide up into four areas?  Would three be better?  Or two?

Any tips, idea, thoughts on fencing and/or pasture management of small areas would be greatly appreciated!


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## DonnaBelle (Mar 26, 2012)

DH has electric fencing to hold in our goats.  He uses three strands, with 7,000 volts.  We've got about 10 acres fenced in for the goats, but because we have the land...

We have a friend that uses electric fencing to keep his cows in.  They know the electric is there, and they don't even think about getting out.

However, if you leave an electric gate open, the animals will go through it.  Somehow they can sense it is there.

I would start small with the number of animals.  It's easy to add some more, and you will figure out which ones you do or don't want.

We keep our goats, chickens, horses, quail and bird dogs in separate pens and areas.  In other words, we don't use Old McDonald's methods.

I must also add that we are retired, DH was a building contractor (hands on kind) and can build anything and do any trade so he does all barns, electrical, etc. himself.

We got 9 guinea hens about 2 years ago, and had the brilliant idea to let them stay in the barn with the goats, nope THAT DIDN'T WORK!  Guinea hens poop everywhere, and it smells bad.  So we gifted the guineas to a friend who had a separate area for them.
Thats the only animal  we have gotten and wish we hadn't. LOL....

Anyway, good luck and stay on this website, you'll learn lots and folks are really knowledgable and nice.

DonnaBelle


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## goodhors (Mar 26, 2012)

You will want to divide the pasture, do some sort of rotational grazing with the animals.  
You may want to reduce sheep from "flock" to "a couple" unless you have some special
goals for them.  Horse, even a small one, eats a lot.

Not sure if your acre is ALL available, or you have the house and buildings on part of it, 
which will reduce your grazing further.  Any gardens need to be fenced away from animals,
possible the birds, so you can get the food or flowers you want.

Cut down to horse/large pony, plus 4 to 6 smaller animals, you can probably manage fair
grazing for all of them IF you have good weather with rain when needed and YOU take 
the time and effort needed to produce a good crop of grass.

Good pasture is not an accident, takes time and effort to keep it producing consistantly 
over the warm seasons.  Kind of a tradeoff, in buying hay or spending money for mowing and 
fertilizer, so the animals have grass.  I firmly believe grazing is better for them, but hay
feeding is not going to harm them either.  Real easy to get over crowded on small acreages.
If you fail to get timely rain, your grass quits.  You still have to feed, so you spend on buying
hay.  Best not to count on weather behaving, so you stay prepared with hay on hand.

Heck, that is part of Farming!  Weather not cooperating!

This is what I was told from Michigan State University, site of experts in grass production for 
many purposes, lawns, grazing, hay, so they know what they are talking about.

Mow grass high and mow often, for best production.  Grass is a seasonal plant that LIVES to 
set it's seed.  If you keep it mowed then seed is prevented, grass keeps on TRYING to grow
tall enough to set the seed.  Once seed is set, grass quits for the rest of the YEAR!  His job is 
done now.  You mow taller in pasture, no shorter than 5inches, which allows leaves to keep 
feeding the plant, shades the roots from sun and slows rainfall to prevent washing the roots bare.
Cutting often prevents setting the seed, removing shorter leaf lengths won't "shock" the plant by
removing the food production parts, helps promote EXTENSIVE root growth for a better plant.
They said that grass cutting should happen when leaves are 8-10inches tall, not cut on a time 
schedule.  This can mean you may need to cut weekly or more often in spring.  Might mean no 
cutting in the heat of July with no rain.  You cut the grass when it gets to that height.  Cutting 
often will keep the weeds down, for more productive plants to succeed in growing.  I do a lot of
walking and weed killing them individually by popping them out before reseeding, maybe spraying 
the worst ones and along under fence lines to keep it really HOT.

Grass fields will need fertilizing.  You SHOULD get soil samples so you can buy EXACTLY the 
kind of fertilizer needed for YOUR fields.  No generic mixes or stuff on sale, fertilizers.  You won't
always be helping your soil to feed the grass if you use the generic mixes.  I had a Nitrogen
problem in my fields, soil test showed PLENTY of Nitrogen in the dirt, but needed Lime to "free up"
the Nitrogen for plants to use.  Would have been wasted money to apply Nitrogen or other
fertilizers, because without the lime the plants couldn't absorb ANY Nitrogen.  The plants didn't 
NEED Potassiam, Phosphorus, so would have been MORE wasted money buying them, having 
excesses wash away.  So almost straight lime was applied the last couple years, pasture 
was excellent!

My newest soil test shows that I need equal amounts of Nitrogen, Phosphorus, Potassiam applied
this year, soil has changed THAT MUCH in 3 years.  I get the soil tests done every 3 years.  We 
spread horse bedding on fields year around, so what we use for stall bedding can affect the grass
and minerals, how the grass uses the nutrients in the soil.

Cutting the grass, leaving the cuttings lay on the field, returns nutrients to the soil.  It is almost 
like getting a free fertilizer treament each year, from the benefits of cut grass tops back into the 
soil.

I find that smaller paddocks, rotated often, cut often, keeps my grass production way up.  We are 
in a good area for regular rain over the summer and that helps a LOT.  We have about 12 acres
in pasture, graze between 6-8 horses, usually have a couple lambs, and they have plenty of grass
all the time.  They don't get hay unless we are going to a show, so that is pretty intensive 
grazing and production.  These are large horses, they eat a LOT of grass to stay good looking, 
able to work hard for us.  But even over our usual July-Aug. drought time, that grass keeps coming
because of strong root systems that go deep, to produce growth.

So having your field divided several ways and perhaps limiting the grazing time on it, will let you stretch the
production of grass to feed everyone pretty well.  Our horses are on grazing about 12 hours a day,
DO NOT NEED to be eating 24 hours a day.  They would be blimps!  Goats and sheep could be out
for lesser time grazing as well, still get enough to eat in that time.  Poke your fingers in their sides, 
check the covering of meat over ribs.  No Ribs?  They are TOO FAT.  And having sheep on one paddock,
horse on another, goats in another, doesn't mean that animal ate ALL the grass in the paddock.  Each 
species may like different things, so plenty of grazing if you just rotate the animals.  You will have to 
see how that works for you.  Don't let them graze everything to dust, takes a LONG time to recover
from that to graze it again.  If the grazing is sparse, you may want to shorten their time on it, feed 
hay for extra supplementing to give them enough to eat.

The above idea will require you to have a "sacrafice area" or dry lot where you can enclose them
away from the grazing.  It will need GOOD fence to keep them inside when the grass is calling!
You may need to have a couple dry lot areas, goats can be rough on sheep, horse may not like the little 
animals around his legs and kick at them.  Kind of protect them from themselves, because they need
to be able to get away from the agressive or bully animals of another species.

So I hope these ideas will help you in your planning and thinking of animal quanties to purchase as 
you develop the property.

Good pasture is work, but needs to be part of your effort to own animals and keep them.  If you don't 
work on your pastures, you will have little or no grazing to feed the animals with.  Small paddocks and 
rotating will prevent them overgrazing their favorite plants to make a home for weeds and dust bowls.
Walk your pasture, see if the "green" is edible or just ground cover.   I learned that color in the field
doesn't mean they can eat it.  Husband STILL doesn't understand that horses don't eat stuff just because
it is GREEN from the fenceline!!  If I need to seed an area, I tear up the soil somehow, rake or disc, rough it 
up spread seed, then I can cover the grass seed with the drag or rake from the birds to allow rooting.  
I have ZERO luck overseeding established pasture, trying to thicken the growth of plants.  That is an 
expensive lesson because GOOD seed is expensive.  Seeding in the roughed dirt, seems to be lots more
 successful to get grasses going into plants.

I read seed labels, get PERRENNIAL grass and plants, NOT annual seed for my area.  Annual only is 
good for THIS YEAR, doesn't return next season.  Money wasted for me unless I need quick cover 
for area with no growth to prevent erosion.  Buy seed LOCALLY, they have the types that work in YOUR 
area.  I get mine from the Elevator, not at the Box Stores who sell National Brands that may not work
here or in your area.

Keep us posted on how things are going on the acre.  I am hustling now to get the field work done before
Spring is done here.  Probably the same in your area or you are ahead of us, so do your work now, enjoy
it over the summer.


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## NachoFarm (Mar 26, 2012)

We have the whole acre, it's approximately 225 feet by 225 feet square.  

So would I be dividing up the acre into four sections or less?

I don't know exactly what you mean by "dry lot"...?  And it would seem to be hard to have "a couple of dry lot areas", when all I have is an acre to work with.

Would the fact that the field has had alfalfa growing in it for the last few years mean that the soil is good?

How long would I let animals stay on one section before moving them?


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## BrownSheep (Mar 26, 2012)

Dry lots are basically a Pen with just dirt. They're good for lambing, winter feeding, finishing animals off with grain.


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## nomad (Mar 26, 2012)

NachoFarm said:
			
		

> We measured for our fence this week and it looks like the pasture area will be just over one acre;
> We want to keep one horse, two dairy goats, and a small flock of sheep.  We already have the two goats although they're only kids right now.  The horse probably won't be until next year because I don't want to get in over my head.
> 
> 1. We're planning on putting up five strand electric fence, will this keep everyone in?
> ...


I will piggyback a little on what goodhors has already written.  First I will quickly answer your questions.

1.  Five strand electric will keep your livestock in once you have them trained to it (it usually only takes 1 episode on the nose to make the lesson well learned).  We live along a 4 lane major highway and use 5 strand electric to contain cattle, sheep, and goats with no issues.

2.  What you are after in any pasture is diversity.  Nature hates monoculture so if you have a variety of grasses and some legumes mixed in you are already in the right direction.

3.  "Rotational grazing" which is a somewhat ambiguous term absolutely should be used in any operation for optimum pasture maintenance.  Some examples of rotational grazing include MIG (management intensive grazing), mob grazing, high density grazing, ultra high density grazing, etc.).

I have adopted Holistic Management as my management system.  It has worked very well for me in both a large operation (250 Boer goats, 200 hair sheep, small herd of cattle) and a small operation (30 hair sheep, 15 dairy goats, 1 milk cow).  This management system is meant to be used for all producers big and small because the principles follow the dictates of nature (and we all know that nature always wins in the end).  I do not use "oil and steel" on my farms meaning that no farm equipment is necessary.   The fundamental concept to understand is that you are actually not a livestock farmer, you are a microbe and grass farmer.  When the microbes can do their jobs, the grass will flourish, and your animals will be the beneficiaries.  Your animals are the tools that you use to manage for the microbes and grass.

I do not vaccinate, use medications, or deworm.  Our animals possess great health and we are now nearing 100% survival rate in our lamb and kid crops.  Years ago when we were grain and medication farmers, we often had illnesses and disease to contend with and a sizeable mortality rate.   Since our shift to Holistic Management, we have greatly reduced our stress levels and increased profitability.  

Holistic Management is geared towards pasture management as being a small part in a much larger whole (ecosystem).  Chemical dewormers and petroleum based fertilizers kill the microbes in the soil which will ultimately destroy the quality of your pastures.  

This system is very cheap to operate (no fertilizers, lime,  or farm equipment are necessary).  I specifically use high density grazing to achieve the proper "animal impact" upon the soil which gives me an increased return year after year.  Here is how it works.  I use portable electric netting to contain the sheep (the goats run in a larger more general paddock since they are browsers) and cattle.  The idea is to give your animals a small area to graze so as to create a competitive environment.  Research shows that competitive grazing reduces selective grazing (only eat the choicest grasses), increases fouling (urine and waste) per unit area, and allows for more effective trampling down of uneaten vegetation to be broken down by microbial action.   The best approach is multi species grazing so I would recommend running all animals in the same paddock.  I have found that horses are hard on pastures, however, since they have 2 sets of teeth they can clip grass very tight.   By running all animals in 1 paddock, you are also increasing recovery time for the grasses in the paddocks already grazed.  The longer the recovery time, the more fully your grasses will recover.  

I do not mow any of my pastures ( I even use the animals to mow my yard as well) because my goal is to have the grass grow as tall as possible.  Tall grass will shade the shorter grasses during the hot summer which allows them to stay green even during moderate drought conditions and protects them from frost entering into winter.   Well maintained pastures are also thick with grass which is very effective in water retention during rain events so you are able to hold more water in your soil.  

I have at times overseeded pastures that were in poor condition, but I have also not had to add any seed to most pastures when I have purchased a farm (we rehabilitate farms for a living).   Most pastures appear to already hold a significant variety of seeds in their seedbanks simply waiting for ideal conditions to germinate.  With high density grazing, you will see increased yields year after year without off-the-farm inputs.  

There is much more detail that can be discussed, but this should give you a general idea of what system I use.  

Wishing you much success in your venture.


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## NachoFarm (Mar 27, 2012)

Keep the information coming guys!  

So if we divide up the acre into three rectangles with the centre rectangle being slightly smaller to allow space for a dry lot, is that small enough areas to achieve this competitive grazing situation?  

The horse is probably two years away so with just sheep and goats, should we use portable electric to make the areas even smaller?  Say maybe half of each rectangle?

Side note; anyone use Electra-Lock fencing system?  Thoughts?


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## KinderKorner (Mar 27, 2012)

Goodhors did a very good, long informative post.

Just to add onto that.

Yes I would split your area into 4 sections. With one being smaller and used as a dry lot.

I would keep the animals in the dry lot most of the day and let them out into a pasture only for a few hours in the morning and evening.

1 acre is not really enough to support a horse, and goats, and sheep.

But if you only let them out for a few hours a day (which is plenty of time to get enough to eat) and you mow it like goodhors said you may be able to stretch it to last longer.

You will have to feed hay over winter, and probably over really hot summers.

My pasture looks terrible. It's 2 acres and only supports goats. It has more than enough growth on it for them to eat. But if you get up close and look at it, the grass is sparse and it has lots of weeds and bare spots. We don't mow it as often as we should and you can really tell the difference. In the places I mowed more often, like around the outer edges the grass it much thicker and greener.


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## nomad (Mar 27, 2012)

NachoFarm said:
			
		

> Keep the information coming guys!
> 
> So if we divide up the acre into three rectangles with the centre rectangle being slightly smaller to allow space for a dry lot, is that small enough areas to achieve this competitive grazing situation?
> 
> ...


In my operation, I do not use a dry lot.  In my opinion this is taking an area that should be growing grass and turning it into a parking lot.   My lambs and kids have been much healthier being born on fresh grass since a dry lot will contain a large amount of fresh manure.  When a newborn lays on this ground, she is very susceptible to taking in bacterial infection via the umbilical cord.  Many of us have different approaches to our farming and that should be respected since there are many different variables to consider (what animals do I like, how much time do I want to spend tending to them, etc)

My animals only run on pasture and that is 24/7 every single day of the year with no supplements given (other than minerals and salt given free choice).  As I stated earlier, I have run big and small operations and no matter the size, grass always needs to be treated in a particular manner in order to thrive.  Mowing (and I did my fair share of brushhogging in years past) does appear to be more beneficial than grazing at a quick glance, however, we need to look a little deeper.  When you are mowing a pasture, it is because you are not using the animals to manage it.  When animals are run through a paddock for a short time and then removed to allow for a recovery period before regrazing, the grass will really respond.  This is also in the context of using your animals to achieve "animal impact" as mentioned in my last post.  This is not opinion, but science and years of experience.  

Here are some other things to consider.  Do you have grass within a right-of-way along a road that can be grazed using the portable electric nets?  We live between a state highway and a private road.  We obviously cannot graze along the state route, but we can graze right up to the edge of the private road.  I have 2 acres of grass outside of my fence that would go to waste if I did not graze it.  At my last farm, the county allowed me to graze along the county road as well.  Glean as much from the land as possible.  

The key to success is to NOT continuous graze a pasture as so many people do today.  That is the main reason why pastures are overgrazed (animal returning to a select grass before it can sufficiently regrow) and sickly looking.    

I buy all of my portable fencing from Premier Fencing (http://www.premier1supplies.com/) and have been very pleased with them.  The portable netting has given me great flexibility and efficiency in my operation.

As far as size of paddock.  A quick way to judge paddock size is to estimate how much grass will fill all of your animals rumens.  This will become much easier with experience.  If there is an inverted triangle on the left side of the animal, it is not eating enough.  Ruminants were designed to eat large amounts of forage for optimum health.  As far as eating habits, ruminants also need to have access to forage most of the day because they will consume forage, lay down and ruminate, then get back up and forage again.   I use high density grazing as my tool for getting sufficient animal impact on my pastures (that is figured as 500,000 lbs of animal per acre calculated as a stocking density).  

What is your water situation (pond, stream, from a well)?.  Have you considered adding a few free range chickens to the mix?  They will serve as great predators on any nuisance bugs, provide great tasting eggs, and will add healthy nitrogen (via their ammonia waste) to your soil.

I will copy and paste a previous posting.  I apologize for any redundancy in the postings, but I believe that armed with the right knowledge, we can be very successful in life.  

If you would like to hear more stories about others that are using this system and being very successful at it you can search Green Pasture Farms (Greg Judy), Polyface Farms (Joel Salatin), Allan Savory (biologist who started Holistic Management) Ian Mitchel Ines (large rancher in Africa).  

"We started using Holistic Management as our management tool several years ago.  The results have been great to say the least.  If I get too much into the science, I apologize (I have loved the natural sciences since childhood).  We use "high density grazing"  under the Holistic Management scheme.  A little background first.  Nature is tremendously symbiotic - nothing exists in a vacuum and all parts of the whole need to be functioning properly in order for the entire ecosystem to be working at optimum level.  Most farmers believe that we are managing animals, however, that is not true.  We are actually managing microbes in the soil - you must start at the basic foundation of everything in order to have a sound system (just like a solid foundation under your house).  The microbes in the soil (or lack thereof) will dictate how well your grasses will grow, repair, and propagate.  If  we fertilize a pasture with petroleum based fertilizers, we are killing the microbes because they can not tolerate a hostile environment like that.  This then makes your fields dependent upon the fertilizer every successive year because the microbes are not doing the work for you.  When you fertilize your fields with the waste from animals themselves, the microbes that are cast onto the field with the waste will do the work of breaking down the waste material into simple carbohydrates to be used by the plants.  The animals eat the plants, generating more waste, thereby creating more food for the microbes which break it down for the plants.  It is a vicious cycle that is both simple and very effective.  Okay, now for the actual Holistic approach.

Holistic Management was started by a biologist (Allan Savory) who observed how nature is very self sustaining if left alone from our intrusions.  A quick example to think about is the vast herds of Bison that were reported in the diaries of explorers when venturing out west.  The bison are migratory and in order to sustain such tremendous numbers of very large animals, a lot of food would have had to be available.  We do our best to mimic the action of these migrating bison to increase our fields to their fullest potential.  Here is how it works:

Plants require "animal impact" in order to have healthy, sustained growth.   Animal impact includes things like - hooves breaking up capped (hard surfaced) ground so new plants can poke through, broadcasting of waste material, stomping down of some plant material, and  consuming vegetation.  It was discovered that when animals are run in large numbers or in high densities, their grazing behavior changes.  They are in competition mode due to the close proximity of their neighbor and will be more likely to eat less desirable plants, stomp down some vegetation which gets broken down into food for the plants in that area, and spread a heavier dose of waste material on the ground (called fouling).  The key to success is to remember that once the plants are grazed, you need to provide a recovery period for the grass to repair itself (grow).    This recovery period changes depending on environmental conditions such as time of year, moisture level, height of grass after being grazed, and ultimately how much ground you have to feed your animals prior to running them over the same paddock again. 

When we speak of 500,000 lbs per acre, we are talking about stocking density - not the stocking rate.  The stocking density merely indicates a level of pounds per designated area of pasture.  The stocking rate refers to total number of animals on your property.  If I have 50 ewes weighing approx. 150 lbs each (total weight of 7500 lbs), I can calculate what size area I need to put them in to arrive at a stocking density of 500,000 lbs per acre.  Divide 7500 by 500,000 and you get  .015 (or 1.5%).  An acre is 43,560 square feet so I calculate 1.5% of an acre ( .015 x 43560 = 654 square feet).  I now know that I need to set up a paddock that encompasses 654 square feet.  The square root of 654 = roughly 25.  This means that a paddock that is 25' x 25' would fit the bill, however, I do not want to move my animals 5 times a day in order to provide them enough food any more than you do.  What I just calculated in size of paddock had nothing to do with meeting the animals total energy requirements for the day - it merely provides me with sufficient animal impact upon the soil and microbes (remember we are managing microbes first and foremost).  What I will do is expand the 25' x 25' to a size that allows the animals to have sufficient forage for the entire day and only move them once in a day.  While they are contained within that paddock for the day, they will have the impact upon the soil that I am after which is specifically 80% of the grass consumed, the remaining 20% either stomped into the ground or even left standing.  During the spring, however, I do move them 2 or 3 times per day and therefore keep the paddocks smaller to ensure proper impact on the soil.  The animals are used as a tool for management - they are not the end-all of the operation. 

This stocking density is not meant to be a rigid "do not digress from the number" kind of tool.  It helps you to decide where to start with paddock sizing.  If you have an "eye" for guesstimating, you could look over a piece of ground and try to determine how much grass it would take to feed all of your animals for the day and fence of that area.  If you plan on moving them twice in a day, then only give them half of your estimation in each move.  The key to success then is to move your animals on from this paddock and give it a recovery period (meaning no grazing at all).  Once again this depends on how fast your grass is growing and how low it was grazed.  Generally, the faster the grass is growing (spring and early summer) the shorter your recovery period can be.  I try not to return to a paddock before 45 days.  Also, if you keep the same animals from a particular piece of your pasture for more than 21 days, it tends to break the parasite cycle and will help greatly with parasite resistance. 

Continuous grazing (the preferred method today and yes, I was there myself at one time) is destructive because animals are allowed to spread out over large areas leaving the more undesirable plants ungrazed, way too much overgrazing on the good desirable plants, and not enough concentration of waste material.  Holistic Management can be employed by someone with 3 sheep on 2 acres or 1000 cattle on 500 acres.  It is a very simple and effective management method and is intended to be adapted to your specific likes or dislikes and how involved you want to be in your farming venture.

The great bonuses to this method are:  we do not deworm animals at all anymore due to greatly reduced parasite loads, our grass (and legumes) increase in density every year which allows for even more animals to be carried on our property (increased stocking rate), and increased animal vitality.  By allowing nature to do its thing, we gain a greater diversity of plant species in our fields which provides a wider range of nutrients to our animals and reduces the need for supplemental minerals (we do still provide free choice minerals to make sure they are getting what they need)."

Again, wishing you great success in your venture.  The information that I provide is from years of study (biology graduate with an emphasis on ecological studies) and experience.  I have learned that the more we think outside the box, the more successful we will tend to be.  As Warren Buffet once said "If you see the herd running in one direction, head in the other direction".

P.S.  I currently support 30 hair sheep, 15 dairy goats, 1 milk cow, and 30 laying hens on 7 acres of pasture.  I began my pasture rotations 3 weeks ago when I stopped feeding hay.  I can support hundreds of animals on just 75 acres (my last farm).


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## NachoFarm (Mar 27, 2012)

Ok, that's a lot to take in...I'm confused though;

We already have free ranging hens (5 Barred Rocks) and we would like to get ducks but we don't have a pond and the thought of all that watery mess has made us pause.  We do have water running to the barn from our well, although the barn is a bit on the "rustic" side and leaves something to be desired as far as space and proper use of space.  Things that will be corrected as we learn on the job.  We do have more land (another acre and a half approx.) that consists of backyard space for the kids, future mini-orchard, vegetable garden, bee/butterfly haven, and compost area, and the front yard.  The goats could make use of some of it but I think we'd have a hard time putting larger animals to pasture on the front lawn...although maybe not...LOL! 

If I have to leave a pasture untouched for 45 days and they eat through one section of pasture per day, and I only have three (or four) sections...how does that work?  

How do I know (since I'm new to farm animals in general) how much they'll eat in one day?  

Can you give me an idea of how this would work with the number of animals we plan on having, or a plan staggered to the animals we have now with the idea of improving the pature for the animals of the future?  

The "plan" is 2-ish dairy goats (with necessary keeping of new does for replacement purposes), a "flock" of Gotland sheep (what constitutes a flock? ) Five, six maybe?  Potentially a "livestock guardian" such as a llama or donkey, and one "hay burner" for me, a horse in the next two years.

Thanks again for all the info thus far!!


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## nomad (Mar 27, 2012)

NachoFarm said:
			
		

> Ok, that's a lot to take in...I'm confused though;
> 
> We already have free ranging hens (5 Barred Rocks) and we would like to get ducks but we don't have a pond and the thought of all that watery mess has made us pause.  We do have water running to the barn from our well, although the barn is a bit on the "rustic" side and leaves something to be desired as far as space and proper use of space.  Things that will be corrected as we learn on the job.  We do have more land (another acre and a half approx.) that consists of backyard space for the kids, future mini-orchard, vegetable garden, bee/butterfly haven, and compost area, and the front yard.  The goats could make use of some of it but I think we'd have a hard time putting larger animals to pasture on the front lawn...although maybe not...LOL!
> 
> ...


You actually do not have to leave each paddock untouched for 45 days if this is not feasible for your operation.  I am able to accomplish 45 days recovery due to the size of my 2 pastures.  Some guys shoot for 3 months, others 5 months, and still others only graze a paddock once a year (but they have large farms and, therefore, have the space to do so).  To use your example, we will run some numbers and see where it takes us.  Assuming 2 adult does and 5 ewes at 150 lbs per head and a llama at 400 lbs, you would have a total animal weight of 1450 lbs.  You could start out running a stocking density of  100,000 lbs per acre since you are just learning this system.   If you divide 1450 lbs by 100,000 lbs you get .015 (or 1.5%).   An acre is 43,560 square feet so multiply 43,560 by .015 ( 653 square feet) and this tells you how much area you need to graze at a time in order to accomplish a 100,000lb/ acre "animal impact" on the soil.  [The square root of 653 is approx. 25 so a paddock measuring 25' by 25' would do.]  Now this was using some math to give you an idea of where to start with your setup.  As in any business, observation and reaction is key to success.  Your paddock moves will change in daily frequency depending on how fast your grass is growing, how much grass is in the paddock,  and time of year.  Generally, the faster the grass is growing (spring and fall), the faster you can move your animals (and therefore the less recovery time your grass will need).  When the grass slows down in summer and late fall, then you can slow down the frequency of moves to allow for more recovery time.  

Since you don't want to move your animals more than is necessary, you could expand the paddock a little and only move them twice a day (this is generalized since I do not know the condition of your pastures).  If you end up running them in 40' x 40' paddocks, it will allow you to have 36 paddocks in that one acre and if you only move them twice per day then each paddock will have 18 days of recovery before being regrazed.  If you can support them on 1 move per day, then your paddocks would receive 35 days of recovery before being regrazed.   You will have to observe your animals to see if they are filling their rumens appropriately when in a paddock.  This will determine how many moves need to happen in a day.  You are using your animals to increase your pasture yields, but you must be mindful of their health obviously so watching their rumens is an easy way to judge appropriate intake of nutrients.  

Each year your pastures will increase in density and diversity which will increase your carrying capacity.  Some people want to drop out after the first year because they are dealing with poor pastures and having to move animals often (sometimes in really bad pastures a lot of hay supplementation is also necessary in that first year).  But as we know, nothing comes for free in life.  I always notice an increase in my pastures in the second year and definitely every year thereafter.  It is definitely worth the effort, especially if you plan on staying at your present location for a number of years.

If you can also utilize some of the other areas you spoke of, it will help your pasture even more.  I am currently running my 30 dorper ewes in a paddock that is approx. 60' x 60' and am moving them 3 times per day since the grass is growing fast, but still short.  In about 1 month, I will only move once per day on a slightly larger paddock.

As far as water is concerned you could set up a water tank in the middle of your pasture with your paddocks being setup in a wagon wheel configuration around the tank so that you wouldn't have to move the tank at all.  The tank could be filled with garden hose ( or buried pipes if you care to install them) since you would only need to provide several gallons per day.  My ewes drink approx. 1 gallon of water per day depending on time of year and whether they are lactating.  

My 4 acre pasture is only perimeter fenced - I do not have permanent cross fencing.  I use the portable nets to section off all paddocks.  I like to leave the pasture wide open so I can easily get my truck around when cutting firewood without having to go through gates or around fencing.  It is a personal choice whether you want to install permanent paddocks as well.

Another thing you will observe in animal behavior with paddock moves is their mental state.  A grazing animal looks at a fresh new paddock of grass the way a child looks at a Christmas present.  They will line up at the net when you are ready to move them and eagerly charge through when opened up.  This stimulates the competitive grazing that I spoke about.  Animals that are run continuously in the same field lack excitement and tend to get bored.  Boredom is not healthy for humans or animals.

Another reason I like this system is due to the fact that I am forced to observe them on a daily basis (sometimes 2 or 3 times per day) and will quickly notice if something is wrong (which fortunately rarely happens).  The constant interaction with them also makes them feel at ease when I have to handle them since they are used to me being around.   

You spoke of adding a horse (horses can be really fun if you are an avid rider) - I have only managed 3 horses over the years (for wife and daughter) and I have found them to be hard on pastures due to being very selective in what they will eat as well as nipping plants close to the ground.  I could be wrong and end up incurring the wrath of horse lovers - I will graciously accept it.  In my estimation, the horse will add a load to your operation that will require some adjustment.  My best advice is to watch your animals at that point and see what needs to be adjusted (horse kept in separate area and fed hay or maybe he will do well with the others and fit right in with your pasture rotations - your specific experience will dictate your reaction).

I have never heard of the Gotland sheep.  What made you want to start up a flock with them?  Are you planning on using the wool?  What kind of dairy goats?

Enjoy.


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## KFaye (Mar 27, 2012)

I am also looking to expand my critter family with 2 Angora goats. We have 20 acres with some grazing but much of it is wooded. I was hoping to create roving pasture of 1/2 acre of electic/solar fencing to keep goats in and coyotes out. Also have them eat buckthorn and other bushes as well as the grass. When the area seems "tapped" I was going to move them to another area. Keep moving the pasture. Again I have about 10 acres of wooded, 7 acres of grass. This does not count the house area. 

I have no problem supplementing with grain or alfalfa. 

Also, we are in wisconsin. I am thinking also of building a hutch for warmth in the winter to keep also their water and feed .

Does this sound like a viable situation?


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## goodhors (Mar 27, 2012)

You might want to think about various arrangements of "grazing spaces" on your acre, instead of just dividing it into quarters.
I thought of making it more versitile, using a sort of a comb arrangement.  Long narrow grazing pieces off a lane up one side.
If you think of a comb, the spine is the lane along one line fence, with the grazing paddocks off the lane as the teeth.  You 
could put in 4 or 5 "teeth paddocks" that open off the lane.  When one is done for grazing, you close it and open the gate/wires
 across the spine, to another.  Animals  travel up and down the lane to the barn, water trough, so you only need one trough.  
Animals can only access the open paddock to graze.  So you have 3-4 paddocks resting and regrowing, while the other is being grazed.

Small portable paddocks with your electric netting, mixing sheep and goats into a flock, will allow a lot of grazing flexability in your 
small acreage.  Down side is having to physically move it around often.  I would absolutely consider grazing the future orchard space,
yard if not in use, garden space not yet in production this year.  Portable net fence will be a big help there.

With my horses, the two acre paddocks usually get grazed about 5 days, while I leave them in the big field of 6 acres about 7-8 days, 
before moving them to another field.  The big field actually has less than six usable acres because the swale hole pond and big wet spot with trees
are both fenced off.  They trim the grass down pretty well, but not into dirt, before getting moved.  Then I mow that field.  In non-rainy
times, they are on each field shorter times, rotated more often to prevent overgrazing during slower growth time and no rain.  I 
could never manage if I had to leave horses off any acreage for such long times as you named!  30 days is about one-fifth of the season here!!

My paddocks are thick growth in most places, with mixed plantings that produce food in all seasons.  Might be more grazing production 
than most pastures have, so I can be a heavier user without problems that other folks might have.  With us spreading the daily stall
cleaning onto the fields, it is like mulching a garden.  Grass grows right thru the bedding, but roots are protected, bedding keeps the 
moisture in the soil for longer use by plants in our hot weather.  Bedding slows any water runoff, so more soaks into the clay soil
to be used later.  That spreading of bedding is a big part of my success, puts organic matter onto the field, then nature takes over and 
uses it in many ways, all helpful to grass growth.  Bedding is spread in the last used paddock, which is rested for a time before getting 
any animals back on.  Horses are wormed regularly, so no problems there.  In other years we alternated the 2 calves and 2 sheep together,
with the horses' time on the grazing.  It seemed quite helpful to the fields and animals did eat different plants.  Calves kept the fences 
cleaned out nicely!

Sorry, I couldn't manage nearly as well without my tractor and mower, fertilizers.  Things might be different with more acreage to move 
around on.  And horses are not small animals, though both are livestock.  They have different needs to be managed in your planning.  With 
such small amounts of land, you have to be planning and working to get your best production from it.  I know that with only two lambs I hardly
noticed them grazing.  But when I added in two growing calves, it made a difference.  Turned out well, calves liked plants the horses ignored, 
gained weight very well on grazing.  But there are only so many plants you can fit into one acre, to keep numerous animals fed well, so that
takes good planning and work to keep that production up.

Interesting to read about the Holistic Method.  Guess I am not dedicated enough to go that route because I prefer my horses.  Thanks for 
detailing it though.


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## NachoFarm (Mar 28, 2012)

Interesting to read about the Holistic Method.You're right, I feel in these situations it's best to gather as much information as possible and then throw yourself into a plan that you think will work for your personal circumstances, making adjustments and improvements as you go.   Who knew I would find grass exciting?  

As for the horse...I used to be an avid rider before I got married and had a swath of children who consume almost every waking (and some sleeping) minute of my day.  So once my youngest is in school, (countdown...29 months to go!) is when we think it would make sense to get a horse.  No sense paying to feed an animal that I can't enjoy.  Plus it gives us time to get this "farm life" thing downpat as we moved here from the city only six months ago.

As for the Gotland sheep, we decided that besides my horse we wanted to enjoy animals that provide us with something in return.  So since I love sheep and them being cute doesn't count as a return in my husbands eyes, I talked to a friend of mine who spins her own yarn about what kind of wool or fleece would be sought after by her circle of crafty friends.  The Gotland is rare and the breeding program sounds interesting to get involved in, plus I have people I can sell fleece to right away.  Now if I could just find some... 

My husband thought about making the sheep shelter and water source, as you suggested, in the centre of the paddock and running portable fences in a wheel pattern around the shelter.  The only permanent fence will be the perimiter fence.


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## nomad (Mar 28, 2012)

NachoFarm said:
			
		

> Interesting to read about the Holistic Method.You're right, I feel in these situations it's best to gather as much information as possible and then throw yourself into a plan that you think will work for your personal circumstances, making adjustments and improvements as you go.   Who knew I would find grass exciting?
> 
> As for the horse...I used to be an avid rider before I got married and had a *swath of children* who consume almost every waking (and some sleeping) minute of my day.  So once my youngest is in school, (countdown...29 months to go!)


I have never heard of a "swath of children".  I am picturing the Duggar's lineup on TLC.  That was funny.

Enjoy.


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## nomad (Mar 28, 2012)

KFaye said:
			
		

> I am also looking to expand my critter family with 2 Angora goats. We have 20 acres with some grazing but much of it is wooded. I was hoping to create roving pasture of 1/2 acre of electic/solar fencing to keep goats in and coyotes out. Also have them eat buckthorn and other bushes as well as the grass. When the area seems "tapped" I was going to move them to another area. Keep moving the pasture. Again I have about 10 acres of wooded, 7 acres of grass. This does not count the house area.
> 
> I have no problem supplementing with grain or alfalfa.
> 
> ...


Viable?  Yes.  How much undergrowth does your woods have?  Other brushy areas?  Goats are voracious browsers and will do an excellent job of cleaning up difficult to reach areas on any farm.  l ran 250 Boer does on my last farm (75 acres) for 2 years and they cleaned up brush, thorns, and under growth so well in some of my woods that the grass came in thick enough that I could run sheep and cattle in those areas from there on out.  If you would like more information on the system I use on my farms, refer to some of my previous posts pertaining to setting up for pasture rotations (Holistic Management).  

Best wishes in your venture.


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## NachoFarm (Mar 30, 2012)

LOL, in our house the *swath* refers to only four kids, but that's enough for us.  

The equation for kids goes something like "number of childrenXtheir ages+1000=" is the actually number of hours in a day you would need to manage them all.  

Or something like that...or I need a nap.


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