# Great Pyrenees killing baby goats



## Rhonda the goat lady

Great Pyrenees killing baby goats I just purchased a great Pyrenees She is three years old. She has never been with goats but has been with cows.  She killed two of my baby goats. I have removed her from the goat herd and I plan to find a pet home for her.  She is pregnant and I was planning to wait until after she gives birth and weans  her puppies to rehome her. I just went out to check on her a few minutes ago. I have a mama Havananese and her four puppies housed close to the great pyrenees.  One of my puppies had gotten out of her cage and got into the cage with the Great Pyrenees.  When I got there the Great Pyrenees had already killed the puppy and was eating it.  I am now concerned about her own puppies.   They are due in about three weeks. I am wondering if she will eat them as well. Any insight or suggestions comments etc. would be greatly appreciated thank you so much


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## NH homesteader

Going to tag @Southern by choice the LGD's expert on this one!


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## babsbag

Yikes,  so sorry you are dealing with this. Ditto what @NH homesteader said.  Why was the dog being sold?  I am sure that @Southern by choice will have some more questions for you.  My LGD puppy would probably "play" a baby goat to death but as an adult, no way. That is really really out of character for a Pyr.


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## Hens and Roos

sorry to hear this


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## frustratedearthmother

I'm so sorry to hear your problems with your GP!  I don't have answers for you - but I've got a .


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## Southern by choice

Hi Rhonda, 
I see you found the public forum. Pm'ing was fine too.

As far as your situation there are so many factors here.

I am greatly concerned about the Pyrenees. I am very sorry for your loss with not just the goats but the pup as well.

When is the Pyr due? 
What was she bred to? 
How long have you had her?
What are you feeding her and how much? 
Last vet check?

She needs to be secured and best to secure other animals from her.

I know lots of questions.... but there is not just "one" thing going on here.


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## TAH




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## samssimonsays

I am so sorry for your loss in all areas.


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## Rhonda the goat lady

Southern by choice said:


> Hi Rhonda,
> I see you found the public forum. Pm'ing was fine too.
> 
> As far as your situation there are so many factors here.
> 
> I am greatly concerned about the Pyrenees. I am very sorry for your loss with not just the goats but the pup as well.
> 
> When is the Pyr due?
> What was she bred to?
> How long have you had her?
> What are you feeding her and how much?
> Last vet check?
> 
> She needs to be secured and best to secure other animals from her.
> 
> I know lots of questions.... but there is not just "one" thing going on here.


Yes. Thank you for all of your help.She is due in about three weeks.  I have only had her for about three Weeks.   The previous owner could not keep her the pen while she was in heat she would constantly break out and one of the neighbors had threatened to kill her. While she was out she had multiple partners .   I am feeding her Kirkland dry food. It is grain free and the Costco brand. This is a change from what she was previously on. I usually feed her once a day sometimes twice.  She has not been to the vet since I have had her again only a couple weeks.  She was up-to-date on everything


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## samssimonsays

Can you try upping her food intake? Was she on a food with grain before? Did the people have issues with her before?


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## Southern by choice

Often LGD's do eat what they kill unless trained otherwise. They do this because dead anything will attract more predators. This includes stillborn goats, lambs. The puppy that made it's way to the pyr is viewed as "something that should not be here" no different than a possum, coon, squirrel etc. 



Rhonda the goat lady said:


> She is due in about three weeks. I have only had her for about three Weeks.



You have several considerations here. 
One she is pregnant and hormones are at play as well as self preservation. 
Two- She has been uprooted, rehomed, pregnant and in with livestock she has never been in with. 

*This is beyond overwhelming for this dog.  
*
I am just as sad for this dog as I am for the loss of your goats and pup. The entire situation is setting this dog up for complete failure and she may very well be an awesome dog. 

I am so thankful you are seeking some help, and that you would be willing to take on a pregnant dog and all the other stuff with this. Big hug to you! 

Now- to get to what I think and potential outcome.

I will be back. This will take some time to formulate so I will do it in word then post it.


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## babsbag

@Southern by choice  Just wanted to say "thank you" from everyone that will benefit now and in the future from your words of wisdom in this situation. You are awesome to take the time to try and help.


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## NH homesteader

X2


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## Southern by choice

Sorry, I was typing in word when I realized there are a few more questions.

Was she good with the cattle? 
Was she chasing other's animals when she was out? 
Aggressive? etc...

When you brought her home what was your integration method. Can you describe the best you can.

@babsbag thank you.

@Rhonda the goat lady - bare with me... and PLEASE as I ask, know there is no right/wrong answer.. it will help me to help you.

Since I read this I have truly been heartbroken. This has particularly touched me.


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## TAH

x3


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## luvmypets

I agree, you're awesome Southern!
I hope you can help your girl, reading about this makes me so sad.]

Why would someone rehome a heavily pregnant dog?


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## Southern by choice

I want to go backwards so that there is some understanding of what caused these issues.
I also want to discuss what may be possible and what may not be and a better understanding of time involved here as well as what to expect.

No info was provided for why the dog was rehomed.* Unless *it was the part where she was getting out while in heat and a neighbor threatened to kill her.
Without knowing anything else, as in, was she good with the cattle? Was she chasing other's animals when she was out? Aggressive? etc...
More than likely (guessing here) no one knew she was bred at the time of transfer. If that was known, that was the worst time to rehome the dog, but threat of death gives little to no option. 

Ideally it would have been best to have her acclimate in a penned area (escape proof) adjacent to the goats. Not in with goats, for about a week. This way she can see her new charges, see your interaction with them, and adapt to your affection and attention. A week is a general time frame. Following that, a lead on her while moving to the pasture with the goats and see her interaction. Over time extending to a long lead (lunge lead) interactive supervision only. Then moving to low-level interactive supervision. Meaning supervision off lead and not immediately by her but working in barn etc. and close by to monitor. Then onto indirect supervision... meaning outside of pasture but with an eye open.
Of course each step requires her to be offering promise of ability to accept her new charges.
Being with cattle she may have no idea what these creatures are and what she is to be doing.

Having said all that... the fact that she is pregnant and hormonal and must look at her own self-preservation this has made for a real difficult situation. 

Without being around goats or goat kids there is always the possibility she sees the baby goats as something to eradicate. Animals that cry, bleat, scream etc often sound like a wounded or dying animal. A dog not trained for goats may not know these are not wounded/dying animals that need to be finished off. The other aspect is she will at this time care about herself first. Any threat to her is very real.

As far as her having puppies in a few weeks. You will have a whole other issue. She will protect her puppies from everything and anything. She will not be trustworthy to take in and start acclimating to goats with her pups. You could have considerable loss if you try. If a goat comes close to her pup she may well attack.

Do I think she will eat her own pups? NO, I do think if she has still born, or “something” wrong pups(may not be visible to your eye) she may. Nutritionally she needs an increase of feed. She should be switched to puppy feed to give her the calories and calcium she needs. Feeding should be 2x day not once.

You may end up having an awesome dog, unfortunately with all the circumstances this will take time to know.

I am not sure where you are located but there is a possibility of being able to place her with a pyr rescue group with her pups.

If you have the time to stick it out with her for 3 months she may be a fantastic dog. With as many changes as this girl has gone through and now she is pregnant... I just think she has got to under extreme stress. I will be surprised if she has a healthy litter.
Giving her attention and comfort will build the bond she needs, and quite possibly build the trust and partnership relationship all LGD's need with their humans.

Please do not sell or advertise the pups as LGD pups. Since the cross is a guess it would not be wise to place them on farms as LGD's.

I do hope to hear what you do and how things work out, you are welcome to pm me as well. 

I know you haven't come here with the best circumstances but this community is wonderful. Lots of great goat people ( and non - goat people as well  ) that love to hear about other's herds! Welcome to the community and we hope you will be a part of it regardless of how this situation works out.


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## Southern by choice

luvmypets said:


> I agree, you're awesome Southern!
> I hope you can help your girl, reading about this makes me so sad.]
> 
> Why would someone rehome a heavily pregnant dog?



From the time frame I suspect they may not have quite known for sure but the poster did say the dog was getting out and the neighbor threatened to kill her. 

It sounds like everyone was really trying to do right by the dog.


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## luvmypets

Southern by choice said:


> From the time frame I suspect they may not have quite known for sure but the poster did say the dog was getting out and the neighbor threatened to kill her.
> 
> It sounds like everyone was really trying to do right by the dog.


Ah, thank you!


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## Rhonda the goat lady

Southern by choice said:


> Sorry, I was typing in word when I realized there are a few more questions.
> 
> Was she good with the cattle?
> Was she chasing other's animals when she was out?
> Aggressive? etc...
> 
> When you brought her home what was your integration method. Can you describe the best you can.
> 
> @babsbag thank you.
> 
> @Rhonda the goat lady - bare with me... and PLEASE as I ask, know there is no right/wrong answer.. it will help me to help you.
> 
> Since I read this I have truly been heartbroken. This has particularly touched me.


Unfortunately  I don't have all the answers when I purchased her I could tell she was very much loved and they said she had no problems other than she liked to escape.   Her owners were fearful for her life because one of the neighbors said if she came back on his property again he would kill her. This is the only reason they were willing to part with her.   When we first came home I put her in with the goats. I watched for several hours and she was wonderful with them. She was not aggressive at all. She is also not  aggressive with people or other dogs or cats or chickens. I did not have any problems at all until the first baby was born. She actually took it from Mama before Mama could get it cleaned up


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## Latestarter

Sorry for the reason that brought you here, but welcome none the less and I hope that you can get the answers you need so you can help your Pyr. What a shame that you and the dog have been placed in this situation. Sorry for your losses as well. I hope this can get sorted out and fixed, but it's not going to be an overnight occurrence. Hope you'll stay here with us and let us know how things progress.


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## goats&moregoats

Just read this thread and all I can say is WOW!  Southernbychoice is your best information point. She helped me greatly witha couple of issues I had as while as integrating my new pups last year. Good luck..please keep us informed. Hoping all turns out well for you and the dog.


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## frustratedearthmother

Yep - SBC is the LGD Guru Extraordinaire!  If anybody can help - she can. 

I'm curious about something though ... is this a PURE Pyr - or could some other breed be in the mix adding to the confusion?

I've seen dogs that folks think/say are pure Pyr and I wonder if their female had an unknown midnight visitor?????

Hope ya'll get this all sorted out!


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## Blue Sky

Late reply. Occasionally lgds do kill. In my experience it has been animals  (in the flock) with a problem and sometimes you really have to Sherlock Holmes to figure out what happened. Southern is a good resource as are others here.  Good luck.


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