# Fun genetic puzzles



## GypsyG (Nov 25, 2018)

I have a small herd of meat mutt rabbits that I have accumulated to provide my family with meat and myself with pelts for sewing and craft projects.  They are quite a colorful lot!  Now, I know horse, cattle, and Icelandic sheep color genetics backwards, forwards, up and down... But I'm still working on learning rabbits.  I'm hoping maybe there are a few of you here who love breaking down code on rabbits as much as I do for horses who would have fun puzzling some of it out, and perhaps I might be able to learn a thing or two in the process. 

Here's what I have:

Hosta - doe - 7 1/2 month Blue Flemish x Broken Black NZ. (14.2 lbs!!!) aaB_C_ddE_



 

Brownie - doe - 6 1/2 months Broken Black NZ X REW NZ
I inquired about her last night and it was suggested that she was probably a gold tipped black.  She is a litter mate to Roanie, below. 
A_B_C_D_Es_ 




Roanie - Doe - 6 1/2 months Broken Black NZ X REW NZ. She is a litter mate to Brownie, above. I suspect she is also A_B_C_D_Es_, but broken.




Wendy - 2 1/2 years old - Flemish Giant
A_B_C_D_E_  




Munchkin - 1 1/2 years old -  French Angora X mini lop (my niece's pet) I suspect she is aabbC_ddEe (I'll post pics of her current litter in a bit.) 



Posey - 2 years old - Flemish/REW NZ X French Lop/broken Red NZ.  
A_ _ _ _ _ _ _Ee I'll post pics of her litter in a bit. 

 

Coco - 2 years old - Rex/Satin X Rex/Satin at_BbC_DdE_ I'll post pics of her litter in a little bit.  




Helena - 11 months old - Rex - 
aaB_C_D_E_  



Zelda - 3 years old - Rex/Flemish X Rex/Satin.  Mother to my buck, Barry. 
AaBbC_Ddej_


 

Ok, now onto the bucks!

Peter - 5 years old - French Lop X broken Red NZ. (My sweet teddy bear)  I'll post pictures of his litters with Posey and Munchkin in a bit.  A_B_C_Ddee


 

Oops..  just reached the maximum files in a post.  I'll continue in the next one!


----------



## GypsyG (Nov 25, 2018)

Roscoe - 1 1/2 years old - Rex/Satin X Rex-Satin/Black NZ-Satin
???Sable???Tort???Gold-Tipped Steel???
I'll post pics of his litter with Coco in a bit.




Barry - 8 month old - Zelda X Satin/Flemish
aaB_C_ddE_





Now for litters.

Coco X Rosco


 buck - tort? Sable? Gold tipped steel?



buck - blue otter



 buck - black otter



 buck - Chestnut or blue agouti with Rex like coat



 doe - blue otter



 doe - ???lilac tort???



 doe - Chestnut


----------



## GypsyG (Nov 25, 2018)

Now for Posey and Munchkin's litters with Peter.

Poseys litter-


 

 Bad pics, I know.  Two are red colored with dark bellies and dark inside of their ears.  The broken one has dark inside of ears and what appears to be a blue spot on it's nose.  The other one is red with a white belly and white inside the ears.


Munchkin's litter


 

 terrible pics, I know... But one appears to be a broken red, and the other is pinkish grey (lilac?)

So, that's all of them!  What do you guys think some of the blanks in the genotypes are?  What crosses do you think would be most beneficial to filling in some of the blanks?

I know some of the pics are horrible, they are just all I had on my phone.  I'll take more when I get home.  If there are any specifically that you would like to see more pics of, let me know.

Thanks y'all!  I look forward to hearing what y'all think, correcting any of my mistakes, and expanding my limited knowledge of rabbit genetics!


----------



## Bunnylady (Nov 26, 2018)

It looks to me like this rabbit has ear lacing, eye circles and possibly lacing around the nose, which with the black spots on the body would make her a Broken Black Otter - so maybe one of her parents wasn't what you think it was (since you can't get a tan pattern from two selfs)?





Roscoe is a Tort (or Black Tortoiseshell, if you prefer) aaB_C_Ddee (since he produced dilutes with Coco, you know he has to be carrying dilute [d])





Tort





I'm going with a Torted Otter on this one (ataB_C_D_ee)





Blue Tort. Because Lilac is the dilute form of Chocolate, it isn't just a lighter shade of blue-gray, but more of a pinkish, dove-gray. Maybe it's just my monitor, but I'm not seeing pinkish on the points here.





This is some of your Satin genetics showing.  I think it is genetically closer to the Satin color Copper than a straightforward Chestnut.


----------



## GypsyG (Nov 26, 2018)

Bunnylady said:


> It looks to me like this rabbit has ear lacing, eye circles and possibly lacing around the nose, which with the black spots on the body would make her a Broken Black Otter - so maybe one of her parents wasn't what you think it was (since you can't get a tan pattern from two selfs)?
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Thank you very much for your input, I greatly appreciate it!  

I could have sworn that Hosta was by my cousins broken black... I have the notes she gave me that have the bucks tattoo number, I'll call her tomorrow and and try to confirm who her sire was.  I know the doe is her pedigreed blue Flemish, she test bred her to one of her other bucks because she did not concieve three times in a row with her Flemish buck.  She conceived on the test breeding and had 13 kits.   The Flemish buck failed his test breeding to two NZ does and got himself culled... A real shame because he'd done pretty good in the show ring.

If Rosco is a tort, does that mean I'd have just as good of a chance at getting ej babies breeding him to Zelda as I would have if I breed her to Peter, without running the risk of Charlies will digestive issues?


----------



## Carla D (Nov 26, 2018)

GypsyG said:


> Now for Posey and Munchkin's litters with Peter.
> 
> Poseys litter-
> View attachment 55137 View attachment 55138 Bad pics, I know.  Two are red colored with dark bellies and dark inside of their ears.  The broken one has dark inside of ears and what appears to be a blue spot on it's nose.  The other one is red with a white belly and white inside the ears.
> ...


Is this what you are looking for? http://www.thenaturetrail.com/rabbit-genetics/rabbit-color-genotypes-chart/. You do have a very colorful group of rabbits. That quite a bit of meat too.


----------



## GypsyG (Nov 26, 2018)

Carla D said:


> Is this what you are looking for? http://www.thenaturetrail.com/rabbit-genetics/rabbit-color-genotypes-chart/. You do have a very colorful group of rabbits. That quite a bit of meat too.



I made a lot of my guesses bases on that chart!  A few of my guesses were probably off base because the chart does not have pictures.  


They are producing a lot of meat!  If I just keep practicing I may eventually get good at cooking it!  My rabbit and dumplings and crockpot rabbit curry turn out pretty good, but I have had several misses that my family has voted out of my rabbit repertoire.


----------



## Carla D (Nov 26, 2018)

I have never eaten rabbit before. I have had a few to this date and time. I have heard from a couple of people that cooking rabbit can be a little tough. Do different breeds of rabbits taste different than others?


----------



## GypsyG (Nov 26, 2018)

I don't know about different breeds tasting any better, but I do know the ones that eat a bigger percentage of fresh food taste better.

I bought 1/4 of my rabbits from a lady who colony raises them with access to natural forage, I bought 1/4 of my rabbits from my cousin who feeds out her litters in rabbit tractors, and most recently, I bought 1/2 my rabbits from a guy who fed nothing but commercial pellets.  I am still trying to slowly transition my newest additions over to a more diversified diet.  

I am going to cull and sellect keepers based on ability to finish out on fresh fodder and hay, with a few whole grains... I'd like to transition to a pellet free system.


----------



## GypsyG (Nov 27, 2018)

Bunnylady said:


> It looks to me like this rabbit has ear lacing, eye circles and possibly lacing around the nose, which with the black spots on the body would make her a Broken Black Otter - so maybe one of her parents wasn't what you think it was (since you can't get a tan pattern from two selfs)?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Ok, I was wrong about Hosta.  Her sire was a White Flemish x NZ, so a REW.  I suppose that explaind her enormous size. I'd never heard or read of Flemish or NZs hiding otter though.


----------



## Bunnylady (Nov 27, 2018)

GypsyG said:


> I'd never heard or read of Flemish or NZs hiding otter though.



Obviously, somebody did an outcross somewhere in the past, possibly to a Silver Marten, though Rex and Satin come in Otter, as do several non-commercial-type breeds. It's amazing what can lurk unseen for generations. I had REW's pop up in my pedigreed Harlequins at one point; there must have been a NZW several generations back (probably why that line had such good type!) I've also had Fuzzy Lops turn up in Holland Lop litters; unless you get the right two rabbits together, you may never know just what is in your gene pool.


----------



## GypsyG (Nov 27, 2018)

I know quite a few years back my cousin had four REW Rex that she had integrated into her Pelfreeze herd of commercial NZs trying to improve fur quality... Perhaps she reserved some of their decendants when she sold out her big commercial herd.   I'll have to ask her.


----------



## GypsyG (Dec 13, 2018)

@Bunnylady ,

I picked up a new puzzle today!
Is she a chocolate agouti? 


 

 



Also, what gene gives her her white feet?  Both of her parents are solid.  She is supposedly 3/4 NZ and 1/4 Flemmish... But I got her from the same lady that I got Hosta from (the broken blue with otter that's supposed to be Flemmish/NZ).  This little girl is Hosta's niece by one of Hosta's litter brothers.  I am calling her Mittens!


----------

