# Baling hay with horses



## Kotori (Mar 7, 2012)

How do you go about it? I know alot of people use New Holland 66's or 68's, but I don't know how long one would last or where to get one. I know the Amish hook up a car engine to a baler and have a horse tow it, but why do they do that? Does the baler need more horsepower or just more Pto? How many horses would I need to pull a baler?

I'm planning on getting between 20 and 40 acres, and want to harvest and bale the hay without a tractor, preferably without any fuel spent. 

I have looked online and keep getting New Holland 66/68 hits, but I can't find a source for them, and don't think they'd be around when I get land.

And what is the difference between '3 point PTO' and 'Trailing PTO'?


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## goodhors (Mar 7, 2012)

Not a lot of help here, but I can touch a few things for you.  

Horses pulling the machinery are doing that ONLY.  They provide no power 
to run the baler, which is why balers have motors.  Amish use Pairs of horses
on their Forecart, so consider the Pair and Forecart as the "tractor" which 
gets the various equipment to where is will be used and across the fields.

Forecarts have no PTO.  Power to run the attached machine comes from
machine being ground driven, with a series of gears from the axle to the 
moving parts.  Manure spreaders are often ground driven.

Other equipment like balers, will have a motor to power the moving parts.
Same with combining with horses.  Machine has the motor for cutting corn 
or grain being harvested.

"And what is the difference between '3 point PTO' and 'Trailing PTO'?"

I am going to say the 3point PTO is part of the 3point hitch system on smaller
tractors and equipment.  The Tractor provides a point to connect the PTO shaft
so the tractor powers the attached eqipment behind.  Could be a brush hog, 
spreader, seeder, all attached with a 3point hitch.

I have not heard the term "Trailing PTO".  Could be a local term, or specific
way of powering a machine.

Do you drive horses that work machinery now?  Do you have experience working
horses to bring in crops?  I am asking because if you have little experience, 
the learning curve could be severe.  If you expect to make money using the
horses you can't make mistakes or the crops will be lost.  Horses are not as fast
at getting things done as tractors, walk slower.  This means you get less production
in your allotted work day.  Is the baler you are looking at for small round bales or small
squares?  I have seen horses pulling both types, so it is possible.  40 acres is a LOT
of ground to hay off by yourself.  Would you only be getting a single cutting or multiple cuttings?

There are some Working Horse things coming along, that you might consider attending before
jumping into haying with horses.  Learning from others can shorten the learning curve, 
perhaps save you expensive mistakes.  I am in Michigan, heard about these two.  

http://www.tillersinternational.org/tillers/classes.html

is a Educational place that does draft animal teaching.  There is a  gathering of people 
showing new equipment, ideas, which will be in Michigan this year called Horse Progress
Days.  The search I found is for Clare MI, in June.  Schedule is not updated yet.  Maybe you 
could call and ask.

http://horseprogressdays.com/maps-and-directions.asp

Doing a Search with Horse Progress brings up a lot of sites in various locations.  Maybe another
one is closer to you.  This link is for the Lancaster PA Horse Progress Days.  Good information.
Shows Forecarts with Pairs, lots of equipment being demonstrated with horses moving it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ah3glfEqROA

Could be there are some Amish nearby that would aid you in learning to hay with horse


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## Kotori (Mar 7, 2012)

So I wouldn't need to have a car motor hooked into the baler because it has a motor of it's own?

I'm just testing the waters now, to see if what I want to do is possible. I wouldn't be looking at haying the entire 40 acres, more like 10-15. 

The small square baler I'm looking at is 2,700 pounds. how many Draft horses would it take to pull it?

Again, this is on a theoretical level for now because I have alot more to learn before putting my dream in motion.


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## goodhors (Mar 7, 2012)

No idea what sized motor you need to power the baler.  The motors I have seen 
are not small like a push lawnmower, but I don't know what kind they are or the 
HP they put out.  

Amount of horses needed to pull your "train of equipment" will depend on the ground
you are going over, hills, flat, soft, what the baler and motor weigh, what kind of wheels
are under the equipment.  And you need more than just a baler to get your hay prepared
to be baled.  So you need to check on those other weights for the horses to pull.  These would
be mower, maybe a conditioner to get hay dried faster, some kind of rake/tedder to get it
in fluffy rows to dry quicker, before you ever get to the baler choice you need to finish the job.

I saw 5 horses pulling the small round baler with a motor as they drove down the road.  3 in front, 
with 2 behind, kept the rig narrower but still had plenty of power.  Lot of draft sized horseflesh going
right along.

You may want to consider doing small round bales, they might be faster to get done if you are 
hurrying for the weather.  They are larger to have to deal with later though, can't just toss 
them around like the small squares.

You should REALLY plan to visit some of those Farm Days, Horse Progress gatherings, to learn 
what is possible.  Rural Heritage Magazine had a lot of coverage for the Ohio Progress Days
last year, with horse treadmills powering batteries for the home, elevators to put hay in the loft, along
with a number of other uses.  Also demonstrated were the various new ideas for powering the machines
for use in farm life with horses.  Those folks have the "cutting edge" in developments to show 
others that modified machinery can still get the work done.

The Rural Heritage site itself might be very helpful to you with many of these kinds of questions.

http://www.ruralheritage.com/


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