# Fencing -- size, type?  Gates?  Also, goats & chickens?



## Bosky (Jan 6, 2011)

Wannabe newb goat owner here, again.  First question: everything I've read so far suggests goats and chickens can be penned together without problems, so long as the goats don't have access to the chicken feed.  Is this true in real life as well as on paper?   It would make my life simpler!

Second, the actual pen.  We were up at TSC earlier pricing various options.  Stock panels seem pretty reasonable for the smallish pen we're planning.  Four panels would get me a pen 16' square, or actually a couple feet larger with a couple gates.  Is this going to be a good size for two small (probably Nigerian dwarf) does, plus kids?  How about umm... four does?  (Just throwing that number out there, should I decide to keep a doeling or two down the line.)  Plus a few chickens!

I might go bigger than that.  I don't have access to my future yard right now to measure and see what will "fit" and what won't.  I'm positive 16' square is quite doable so let me start there.

Are stock panels the right way to go, here?  They seem to be what all the books recommend, that or electric fencing.  I could go electric but it seems like more trouble than it's worth for such a small pen.

Okay, and maybe this is a dumb question, but I'm a newb here remember -- what about gates?  TSC sells them but they're ugly and expensive.  It seems like we could built something out of scrap lumber and not only would it be cheaper, but better looking.  But is it going to keep goats in?  What do you use?


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## Our7Wonders (Jan 6, 2011)

I can't tell you about what's best for fencing or for space, as I'm new myself - I've only had my goats for a little more than a month but I CAN tell you that both my gates are made of wood and keep my two full size Nubian does in just fine.

There are opinions on both sides of the chicken fence - I don't have an opinion either way yet, but I'm sure you'll get the pros and cons from some more experienced members soon.

BTW, Welcome!!!


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## iamcuriositycat (Jan 6, 2011)

I'm nowhere near an expert here, but I have a couple nigerian dwarf wethers, so I'll tell you what I do.

I have chain link panels (purchased second hand very inexpensively) that form a 10' x 10' pen attached to a 12' x 8' metal shed as the pen they sleep in and sometimes spend a day or two in if I'm out of town.

But to give them opportunities for forage (and to help clear weeds & brush), I also have a portable electric net fence for daytime use--I plonk a plastic dogloo in the middle in case it rains (mostly they use it as a play gym for "king of the mountain" games), and it works great. It's super simple to set up--takes about 15 minutes to take it down, move it to a new location, and set it up again.  And as long as it's plugged in and not sagging (I have to check every couple days and sometimes tighten a corner by pulling up the stake & stretching it out a bit further), it keeps them in really well.

The chain link & metal shed were super cheap because the panels were second hand (maybe $20 each & I only needed three since one side is the shed) and the shed was already there. The electric set-up cost about $200, but I wish I had spent another $100 and gotten the solar charged energizer instead of the sort that has to plug in in the house--I can't reach all of my property with it, and it's a pain having to turn it on from inside the house. The dogloo was about $40 on craigslist.

Have fun. I adore my boys. They're like sweet puppies, funny and smart and affectionate.


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## iamcuriositycat (Jan 6, 2011)

Oh, I forgot to add. I don't have chickens, but I have ducks, and my recommendation is to let them pasture together during the day if you like, but give them separate sleeping and feeding accommodations. It's easier to keep the goats out of the chicken feed that way, but also it keeps the chicken poop out of the goat food, curious goats out of the nesting area (they will step on eggs if they happen to be in their way while trying to scale the walls), and generally makes upkeep easier, in my opinion.

I sometimes will keep a few extra drakes (or drakes being disciplined) in with my goats overnight without any trouble, but I wouldn't do it long term.


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## ksalvagno (Jan 7, 2011)

If you make your own gates, just be sure that the goats can't stick their head through anything or go under or over it.

I used woven wire horse fencing and gates from TSC because it was easier for me and I wanted to be sure that no one could stick their head through anything and get stuck. I also put fencing overtop of the gates to be extra sure the kids couldn't stick their head through.


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## Bosky (Jan 8, 2011)

The plan is that the chickens will have their own coop that the goats won't be able to get into, but they'd share an outdoor pen.  So that should keep the goats out of the chicken feed and away from the eggs.  I think maybe I'll try it -- worst case, I find it doesn't work and move the chickens elsewhere, it shouldn't be too much of a problem.

And thank you for the advice on gates!  We've got access to all sorts of scrap lumber so making them will cost next to nothing, probably just the cost of the hinges and latch.  I'll be sure to either build them solid enough, or add fencing so the goats can't get their heads through.

curiositycat, I appreciate your advice because it sounds like your set-up will be similar to mine.  The property came with three metal sheds about the same size as yours and I plan to use one for the goats' shelter.  And it's neat you added the portable electric fencing.  I might do the same -- we've got a lot more yard they could forage in, I just can't give them full-time access to it.  I think I'll wait till I've got everything else set up before investing in that, but it's a great idea and I'm glad to hear it works for you!  I'll keep your tip about the solar charger in mind -- I was wondering about that.  Our yard goes way back from the house so it would probably be worth the investment.


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## iamcuriositycat (Jan 8, 2011)

Sounds like you've got great plans! I didn't buy the portable fencing at first either, but very quickly realized how badly I needed it. 

Your set-up sounds perfect. In a natural setting, ruminants and land-birds are a natural fit. A lot of permacultural farms use them together, because they complement each other well. The goats will provide a level of predator protection to the birds, and the birds provide a variety of insect- and parasite-control and clean-up services to the goats. Works nice.

Good luck and have fun. By the way, there's a goat dairy around here called Bosky Acres.


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## savingdogs (Jan 8, 2011)

We have goats, ducks and chickens. We found that they can co mingle fine, but it is easiest if they each have their own designated area. Chickens and ducks in the goat area make the ground more wet than I think is healthy for goats, although the chicken scratching can help work the nanny berries into the soil when it is dry out. I did not like the chickens jumping to stand on the goat hay. 

We have resorted now to letting the chickens only into the goat pen area occasionally to scratch the berries in (no ducks) and the animals meet up only in the mutual barnyard area.


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