# Silver Fox kits born last night! Need to fatten momma back up!



## For the Love of Dirt (Nov 13, 2019)

My doe had her (and my) first litter last night, and of course she had to have them on the night of our first hard freeze! I came home from work at 4 this morning (I work nights) and saw the squirming mass of fur in her nest box, so they were born sometime between 10 last night and probably around 3, as they were good and dry, the little I saw of them. and they were thankfully all in the nest box.  When I got up this evening I counted them, and she had at least nine, possibly 10, they were so squirmy and hard to count. I didn't expect them to be so speedy so young! They were all alive, so that I am thankful for, I just hope it stays that way! I didn't take any pictures, because it is so cold right now I don't feel comfortable removing them from the nest for too long. Maybe this weekend I can use the generator and temporarily run a heater in the shed so I can get a better look at them. My mom said that momma rabbit tried to bite her this morning, but the few times I've gone in her cage she's been fine with me.

What I am concerned about is the litter size and that my doe seems to have lost a lot of weight while pregnant. Her backbone and ribs are more prominent than they were before, you can't see them, but when you run you hand down her back you can easily feel them. She had drastically slowed down eating almost a week before giving birth, had pretty much completely gone off pellets, and occasionally munched on hay. Is there anything that I can give her besides pellets and hay to help bulk her back up? Unfortunately I was never able to find a second doe to breed at the same time, so I can't graft any to another doe, and I'm concerned that the size of litter, which if I recall correctly is on the large side, and her weight loss may not make a good combo.

Edit: Her pellets are New Country Organics, and she is fed mostly Timothy hay, but also currently has access to orchard grass, which I gave her for her nesting material because usually she won't eat orchard hay, and I couldn't find any good straw near me.


----------



## Baymule (Nov 13, 2019)

If you are offering her unlimited feed, she should be fine. I used to give mine whole oats in another feeder or a bowl. A small can such as a tuna fish can wired to the cage also works. Congratulations on the new litter. She sounds like a good momma, keeping them covered in fur. It probably isn’t necessary for a heater.


----------



## For the Love of Dirt (Nov 14, 2019)

It is officially 9. Used a hot pad and a mobile battery my mom had to keep them warm while out of the nest. No still borns and no dead! The two adults are mom and dad the day we bred them!


----------



## Beekissed (Nov 14, 2019)

Beautiful!!!! Nice, plump, uniform in size....great litter!   I think the does produce so much better when not too fat.  I agree with Bay...plenty of feed and fresh water, the whole oats for added fiber, good hay like you've been giving and I think she'll do just fine. 

Some people use a little calf manna to fatten market rabbits but you have to go really low on that or it can burn out a rabbit's bowels, producing the opposite of the desired effect.  I'd stick with the slow and steady approach, though.


----------



## AmberLops (Nov 15, 2019)

Congratulations on the beautiful kits!!
I have a couple of does who lose a lot of weight after kindling. With free-choice feeding she should gain weight back just fine. Like Bay said, oats are always a good thing for putting some weight on too 
And it's normal for does to go off pellets a few days before having kits


----------



## For the Love of Dirt (Nov 19, 2019)

Took some individual pictures today. Does that second one look thin or am I being paranoid? If they are, would it be safe to supplement them with formula, or will that throw momma off? I need to go get a new scale... I have one, but it is packed up somewhere, lost in our move.


----------



## Baymule (Nov 19, 2019)

they all look healthy to me!


----------



## AmberLops (Nov 19, 2019)

They adorable!
They all look fine to me too. It's normal to have weight variations in litters. Some of my does will have 5 kits, 3 will be huge and fat and 2 will be scrawny and thin for a few weeks until they catch up. I never worry too much about it


----------



## messybun (Nov 20, 2019)

Congratulations on your first litter! 
   I always give mama pumpkin seeds after birth, they help fight worms and fattening up. I’m always careful with oats because the kits can choke to death on them.
   Most rabbits are fine with big litters, but if one is consistently thin and nuzzles or chirps  a lot, or just isn’t getting heavier... supplement. I use powdered goat milk and probiotics and have been extremely successful. NEVER give cows milk they can’t digest it. You can wait til after mama feeds and then offer a little more, but by the time they’re furred everything is pretty much settled and working well. Good luck to ya.


----------



## Duckfarmerpa1 (Nov 27, 2019)

Congratulations just like everyone else has said!  I breed rabbits on my hobby farm.. purely for pleasure and we hope to sell some this spring. Anyway, I have not had trouble with my does getting too thin, but I am friends with the man who judges at the county fair and he plumps his bunnies up with dry oatmeal.  Worth a try.  Perhaps a few bananas.  Just a few. But a few sugarery or carbohydrates might help too.     If she really doesn’t gain you might need to resort to kitten replacement milk. But I’ve never heard of a doe needing it. She’ll bounce back. Remember, she just went through a lot. But she did an awesome job. As are you !!


----------



## Duckfarmerpa1 (Nov 27, 2019)

No. You won’t need to 


Sammbalina said:


> Took some individual pictures today. Does that second one look thin or am I being paranoid? If they are, would it be safe to supplement them with formula, or will that throw momma off? I need to go get a new scale... I have one, but it is packed up somewhere, lost in our move.


supplement unless one gets ill, and you’ll know it. Let her do it. That’s what nature intended. She’s fully capable. She may look thin but her mamorry glands are good. The more they nurse. The more she’ll eat. Etc.


----------



## For the Love of Dirt (Dec 12, 2019)

All nine still going strong. I removed the nest box a couple days ago because they were no longer using it, and the little turds are wasting a ton of food. They dig it out of the feeder in order to find the perfect piece, and all the rest falls into the poop catcher! they even managed to upturn the feeder and starved themselves for a few hours because they dumped a FULL feeder out! I have tied it to the side of the cage better, but the little fluff balls still dig it out... Will try to remember to post some update pictures.


----------



## Duckfarmerpa1 (Dec 12, 2019)

Sammbalina said:


> It is officially 9. Used a hot pad and a mobile battery my mom had to keep them warm while out of the nest. No still borns and no dead! The two adults are mom and dad the day we bred them!


Adorable!!  Try not to keep them out of the nest box for long, or away from mom long...she’ll leave them alone..so that predato don’t come near...but she’ll pounce at danger signs.  But keeping them in the hay nest and hair nest she made is really the best thing for them.


Sammbalina said:


> Took some individual pictures today. Does that second one look thin or am I being paranoid? If they are, would it be safe to supplement them with formula, or will that throw momma off? I need to go get a new scale... I have one, but it is packed up somewhere, lost in our move.


you only need to use kitten formula if the kit still seems to be gett smaller...otherwise, some have growth spurts.  Watch them, but try not to obsess.  Is that baby rolling over, active enough?  When they are lethargic, etc..bottle syringe.


----------



## Duckfarmerpa1 (Dec 12, 2019)

messybun said:


> Congratulations on your first litter!
> I always give mama pumpkin seeds after birth, they help fight worms and fattening up. I’m always careful with oats because the kits can choke to death on them.
> Most rabbits are fine with big litters, but if one is consistently thin and nuzzles or chirps  a lot, or just isn’t getting heavier... supplement. I use powdered goat milk and probiotics and have been extremely successful. NEVER give cows milk they can’t digest it. You can wait til after mama feeds and then offer a little more, but by the time they’re furred everything is pretty much settled and working well. Good luck to ya.


Yeah..don’t let kits anywhere near food...I’ve heard that a tiny bit of ostmeal..I guess uncooked..sprinkles on food can add weight.  Perhaps add a little sugar to the water. Most of my does bounce back really fast.  Once their milk comes in..they eat and eat..and they feel great!


----------



## For the Love of Dirt (Dec 16, 2019)

At this point they are over 4 weeks old. I weighed and sexed them yesterday. 5 does and 4 bucks, and they are all a pound or more, the largest being 1 lb 4oz. However I am now having a problem with keeping food in their feeder. The babies dig all of it out, and the feeder is constantly empty. They have more food in the poo bins than poo!


----------



## Duckfarmerpa1 (Dec 16, 2019)

Sammbalina said:


> At this point they are over 4 weeks old. I weighed and sexed them yesterday. 5 does and 4 bucks, and they are all a pound or more, the largest being 1 lb 4oz. However I am now having a problem with keeping food in their feeder. The babies dig all of it out, and the feeder is constantly empty. They have more food in the poo bins than poo!


I usually put some kind of container under it...a lid for ice cream...some long plastic food thing..it catches the waste..and the fine ground stuff.  If you have other animals..they love that..or, heaven forbid..if you need to syringe feed, you don’t have to grind pelets.  But, that’s how I try to at least catch the pellets.  They are beautiful!!


----------

