# Training NEW LGD question



## Bedste (Jul 19, 2011)

I know that the older ones train the younger ones, but how do you train your LGDs to begin with....??


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## savingdogs (Jul 19, 2011)




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## carolinagirl (Jul 19, 2011)

I don't have my dog yet.....but I will soon.  From what I understand though, you don't really "train" them because what they do comes naturally.  You do, however, supervise them and correct undesirable behavior which is how an adult LGD would teach the younger ones.  Don't allow rough play or chasing.  when you can't supervise, pen the pup next to the livestock so he is still with them but can't hurt them.  As he gets older and more trustworthy, allow him to be unsupervised with older stock (not young lambs or kids).  I'll let you know how this method works for me.  My pups are due to arrive in a week!


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## Roll farms (Jul 19, 2011)

I have a doe who helps train the pups.  She will still plow Gus if she doesn't like what he's doing....he's about 140# (ASD x Pyr) at 1.5 yrs old, and she's around 110#.

My 'new to lgd's mantra' - NEVER leave an unproven young LGD around kids, even if the mamas are there to 'protect' them.  It's a recipe for disaster.


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## crazyland (Jul 19, 2011)

My new pup grew up with goats and sheep. Now that I have him he is tethered inside the pasture with the goats. This way the goats can stay away from him if they want and he can't chase them. He tried the first day and hasn't done that since. The goats are not as fearful of him any more. 
Daily we let him off the tether to roam around the pasture and play with the other dogs. 
I have two goat houses and I made it so he can go inside one of them. So far this is working out. Let you know when he gets bigger. He is only 30lbs right now. lol We have many more months to go through till he is not a puppy any more.


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## watchdogps (Jul 21, 2011)

Roll farms said:
			
		

> My 'new to lgd's mantra' - NEVER leave an unproven young LGD around kids, even if the mamas are there to 'protect' them.  It's a recipe for disaster.


Good mantra, but I would change "kids" to "stock" - make sure the dog shows consistently good behavior when supervised before allowing any unsupervised interactions. Also, be ready for any regressions that may occur as adolescence hits - many LGDs go through a play phase at 8-12 mos old. This seems to be worse if there are multiple LGDs. For safety's sake, I dont suggest leaving more than one dog alone with stock until they are at least a year old, more depending on the dogs. If it's an older dog and a pup, it may be fine IF the older dog is serious and will correct the pup.


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## watchdogps (Jul 21, 2011)

crazyland said:
			
		

> My new pup grew up with goats and sheep. Now that I have him he is tethered inside the pasture with the goats. This way the goats can stay away from him if they want and he can't chase them. He tried the first day and hasn't done that since. The goats are not as fearful of him any more.
> Daily we let him off the tether to roam around the pasture and play with the other dogs.
> I have two goat houses and I made it so he can go inside one of them. So far this is working out. Let you know when he gets bigger. He is only 30lbs right now. lol We have many more months to go through till he is not a puppy any more.


A note of caution, I know many an LGD who has been made aggressive towards stock by using this method when there is an aggressive goat in the pen. I'm not addressing you in particular, just letting people know in case they consider doing this. It's fine if your animals are placid, but if there is a goat who will torment the pup, an LGD will eventually defend itself and then the dog gets blamed.


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## cmjust0 (Jul 21, 2011)

Bedste said:
			
		

> I know that the older ones train the younger ones, but how do you train your LGDs to begin with....??


Not training -- correction.  When it comes to LGDs, all the software is pre-installed; you just have to monitor the system and do a little debugging from time to time.  

The dog will almost certainly do stupid things until it's at least 18mos old.  The first summer, it'll be increasingly disconcerting for the dog to romp around with the goats like a moron because the dog will just keep getting bigger and bigger, and more and more able to do damage, and you'll worry.  When Fall rolls around and the temperature starts dropping, the dog will be huge and wild as a buck because, to a big furry LGD, cold weather = GAME ON IT'S PLAYTIME WOOHOO LETS DO THIS!  You'll have considered selling the dog, neutering/spaying, tying it out, putting it in a pen, etc., and you'll basically want to pull your hair out by Spring.  When it starts to heat up again, your young dog will undergo a seemingly miraculous change from 'worst LGD ever' to 'best LGD ever' and you'll think you've got it all whooped -- but you still have a young dog and another cold season coming.  When the dog's 2nd Fall rolls around, you'll wonder why your dog's being a turkey again all of a sudden..  Fear not, it's just because it's finally cool enough to be an idiot again and the dog's not quite a 2yo yet..

By the 2nd Spring, the dog will be pretty mature..  That 2nd Summer will more or less see the dog become 'best LGD ever' and pretty much stay that way just because, at 2, these giant breed dogs are sorta middle aged and have little time or energy for youthful foolishness..  And as crazy as it sounds, you'll kinda start to miss the days when they were super active and playful all the time, and that's when the thoughts about how short their lives usually are - around 8 years is pretty good - will start to creep into your mind and cause you to wonder what in the world you're ever going to do when they go.

And that's life with an LGD, in a nutshell.


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## lgdnevada (Jul 21, 2011)

crazyland said:
			
		

> My new pup grew up with goats and sheep. Now that I have him he is tethered inside the pasture with the goats. This way the goats can stay away from him if they want and he can't chase them. He tried the first day and hasn't done that since. The goats are not as fearful of him any more.
> Daily we let him off the tether to roam around the pasture and play with the other dogs.
> I have two goat houses and I made it so he can go inside one of them. So far this is working out. Let you know when he gets bigger. He is only 30lbs right now. lol We have many more months to go through till he is not a puppy any more.


My .02 cents for what it is worth:  Tethering = ticking time bomb.....

Your goats may decide to get a hair up their 'gentle' tail and suddenly go to butting your tethered pup.  And he has nowhere to go to defend himself.  I never, ever would tether, tie or chain up an LGD.  Only  time I have done it is to teach a pup to collar and respect a lead, and I am right there, it lasts maybe five minutes.  Then off the chain or tie.  But to tie out a dog in stock or out of stock: recipe for disaster.  Tied up dogs can become aggressive then you will really have a problem.  Please consider untethering as soon as you can.  I think what you need to do is monitor him more, don't leave him in there full time yet if he is too young.  30 pds is tiny.  He can't defend himself yet.  You should hang out with him, then bring him in when you need to go in.  If you have older LGDs - you say dogs but don't say if they are LGD's or just pets? - will he go with them and follow their lead?  That is what my pups do, run with the older dogs.


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## Ms. Research (Jul 21, 2011)

cmjust0 said:
			
		

> Bedste said:
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I had the pleasure to have this life with an LGD, a Kuvacz.  At the time, I had no idea what this big ball of white fluff was all about.  My Better Half did because he had one before.  I got to meet Marque in his senior years and he passed at 11.  My full experience was with Ice.  You described my experience with this incredible animal to a tee.    He passed  16 years ago and I still miss him.  He taught me so much and made me truly feel safe that I will always be eternally grateful.


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## crazyland (Jul 21, 2011)

Tethering is temporary. The goats do not bother him. 
I have shepherds and do not want them to teach him any of their behaviors. I actually use my oldest gsd to herd the goats back towards their pasture when I let them loose. 
Playtime is different from work.


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## watchdogps (Jul 21, 2011)

crazyland said:
			
		

> Tethering is temporary. The goats do not bother him.
> I have shepherds and do not want them to teach him any of their behaviors. I actually use my oldest gsd to herd the goats back towards their pasture when I let them loose.
> Playtime is different from work.


I figured you had it right, I was just putting the warning out for anyone who had the wrong idea. I have had people come to me basically bragging that their rams were beating the crap out of the puppy. I have also had people turn 4 mos old pups over to me for attacking stock and they tell me their breeder told them to put the pups in with their meanest goats. 

I prefer a pen inside the stock area to a tether though.


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## lgdnevada (Jul 22, 2011)

Oh whew, thanks crazyland for clarifying.  
Yes watchdogps I too have heard horror stories of what some people do for 'training' their LGD.  I about go ballistic.


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## watchdogps (Jul 22, 2011)

BTW, lgdNevada- LOVE your mastines! They are on my list of "maybe someday" I knew a lovely one a friend of a friend had imported from Spain.


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## crazyland (Jul 22, 2011)

Sorry, I have that tendency to not always be clear.


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## lgdnevada (Jul 22, 2011)

watchdogps said:
			
		

> BTW, lgdNevada- LOVE your mastines! They are on my list of "maybe someday" I knew a lovely one a friend of a friend had imported from Spain.


Thank you, I'm enjoying the heck out of them!


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## Bedste (Jul 23, 2011)

Ms. Research said:
			
		

> cmjust0 said:
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I am so encouraged by BOTH of these posts.....  Thank you.... My Slovensky Cuvac is 10 months old.  google it and you will see a small version of a Great Pyranese...  he is wonderful and accidently does a lot of damage because he is so so playful and rambuntious.  My one and only goat is afraid of him..... and I can not leave them both loose ever.  But now I have hope....


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