# Could Someone Steal Your LGD?



## Southern by choice (Jun 12, 2015)

I  started this thread based on some of the comments from another thread
http://www.backyardherds.com/threads/stolen-texas-lgds-turn-up-in-arkansas-rescue.31372/

Curious as to how many people think this could happen to them.

None of our dogs can be bribed with food. If you are non escorted you cannot come in and the dogs will clearly let you know.  Several dogs do not want anyone in their field escorted or not. Those same dogs can be brought out and are fine. Some are not ok with that but if they are in the house and you are in my house they may climb in your lap. Some will love you, love you , love you at the gate or in their field IF either I, or a family member is with you. None are aggressive or vicious. They do take their job very serious though. 

Our almost 23 week old pups were in their field last night. NO adult dogs were with them. 
Back story-
Just past our house the county set a "check-point" up. I hate it when they do this as we are on a country highway and it is a pain. They check everyones "papers"  so all cars are stopped both ways. IF a car turns into a drive before the checkpoint you would think they were going after a mass murderer they will fly up the road and the deputy will go right up in the drive. I guess they forget people actually live in the houses on the road. They are assuming it is someone trying to avoid the checkpoint. 

My neighbor came down  their drive (it is a long drive) and got to the road and started back up his drive... deputies saw this and come flying up. It was pitch black out. I knew all this was going on because the pups were going NUTS! I went out .. the lead pups were on the fence hackles up and standing their ground, non- leads were farther back, goats in the barn/loafing area tightly together.

I went in to get my phone to try and get an audio. The deputy left all was calm but still so dark out I could see nothing... the driveway (neighbors) has heavy trees and brush that lines it. The dogs stayed on the line for 20 minutes.... they were quiet but didn't take their eyes off it. The 2nd dogs stayed back by the barn.

These are pups, sweet and friendly and do love people but they are developing into LGD's. They did what they should be doing. No adult dog led them.

I am perplexed when I hear others say anyone can go in etc. 
Our dogs prevented a possible livestock theft attempt some months back at 3am
If a dog could be taken so easily then where is the protection for the herd or flock? Aren't they suppose to be protecting them? 

We test for these things in started dogs. We start at 5-6 months and continue til around 8-9 months. We watch their confidence levels, guarding abilities, response, and role. 

So... would someone be able to steal your dog?


----------



## frustratedearthmother (Jun 12, 2015)

I seriously doubt it.

When Maddie was younger she loved everyone.  I had teenagers who came and worked for me and the first summer they could 'play' with her and she loved it and fully participated in play.  She was about 4 - 5 months old at that time.   But, almost every month that went by she 'grew up' a little more and spent less time playing and more time just staying between the teenagers and her goats.

Then she went through a stage where if we escorted guests into the pasture she would come up and give them the sniff test and then go back to her herd.  Now she even skips the sniff test with strangers and just stands back and watches.

She's ok with seeing our neighbors close to the fence line - but if they have guests and they walk over to see the animals - she has a problem with that!  She comes roaring towards the fence, stiff-legged,hackles up and even though there are two fences between them - without exception the folks will back up!

So, my answer is that I don't think anyone could steal her....and no intelligent person would try!


----------



## samssimonsays (Jun 12, 2015)

Rumely most likely... he is our half bernard half pyrenees. He is the only pup out of his litter who had no motivation, he is SLOW. he would never be an amazing LGD but he sounds the alarm and is BIG... That alone helps a ton. He has never been "tested" and he is very slow in learning and has just started to figure out how to bark in general... (LONG story on that)  We also didn't have any livestock for him to grow up with, he started as a house pet and will most likely never sleep a night outside... My Collie however, even though she LOVES and I do mean *LOVES * people, she will defend us to the death. She knows what she is supposed to bark at. Someone on our property, someone close to the driveway, someone walking by, driving slowly and cars on the property. She also has chased large animals such as bears off of our property. She patrols our small 6 acre plot, only the yard portion of it mostly. BUT the catch is, she had a very good LGD as a trainer until she was 7 months old which was sadly when he passed away. He was a natural with hardly any training. Since it took 4.5 months to potty train Rumely alone, it is no wonder that it is taking SOOOO long for him to learn the rest. To us, the important part is that we know our home is safe and we are safe even if it is only because of one dog. I fully believe if something went down he would join her in protecting against whatever it was she was. He is FINALLY starting to learn how to patrol with her now as well. Our two LOVE car rides though... that is my concern. Stella will stay arms reach away from anyone she doesn't know until I tell her it's ok. When she was 12 weeks old she had the UPS driver cornered on a stump barking and jumping towards him then away. She never got within 20ft of him but it was enough to make him worry. She also has three very distinct "growls" she does in her very large vocabulary. She has her "I am so happy to see you pay attention to me" growl noise. The "I am frustrated" growl noise. and the "I don't know you and I don't know if it is ok to know you" growl noise. The average person would assume she is being aggressive but she is not. We know them all apart. She will push her nose into you and PINCH with her front little teeth if she disagrees for any reason as well. Again nothing aggressive just a quirk we have slowly been training her out of. Rumely will attempt mimic Stella when it comes to situations where he is not sure what to do. 

Now that I look at it, I feel fairly confident that if my dogs did not know the person they would not be stolen. We have left the dogs out free in the house while we run to town or do things that take less than 5 hours and All is fine. BUT we noticed after one time one of our windows was cracked. The big one right in the front of our house that overlooks the driveway. So we are not sure if they were playing and did it, if they got excited when we pulled in and did it or if Someone was there and they were going bonkers on them.


----------



## Wisher1000 (Jun 12, 2015)

I think anyone could take mine!  He has never shown any concern for people that have arrived at our farm.  He even accepted a friend's dog when they brought it, unannounced, and when we were not home.That dog was a female, leashed, but was barking at the chickens and trying to get at them.  Biscuit just sniffed her, and greeted the couple he had never met.  

I guess it is a trade off.  I am glad that I do not have to worry about my son's teenage friends, my critter sitters, or my grand children getting bitten.  There is a huge amount of liability involved in having a large dog, especially when it can be aggressive.  I wouldn't mind mine being a bit more protective of the property, but as long as he keep the varmints away, I'll let him stay.  

If your dog won't accept strangers, how do you ever get anyone to take care of your animals when you are away?


----------



## HoneyDreameMomma (Jun 12, 2015)

Probably depends on what the person is doing.  I've seen the occasional neighbor 'sweet talk' Miller and pet him when he is at the fence line patrolling, but he is much more careful when the person is anywhere near the goats.  

Clyde - good luck!  He even occasionally barks at people he knows, and he won't let anyone besides family and close friends touch him.  If we introduce someone to the dogs, Miller is usually ok with them, but Clyde is still cautious and extremely selective on who he is friendly with (he HATES guys with beards-not sure why ).  I think anyone that tried to take him would have to work for it big time, and would likely get themselves hurt.


----------



## babsbag (Jun 12, 2015)

I think that mine could be sweet talked into going with anyone that had a treat. The only people they dislike are the ones that visit my neighbors.


----------



## bonbean01 (Jun 12, 2015)

I think mine would be easy too....hate that....but if there is a treat, yes....she would be easy to take....BUT...good luck getting her into a vehicle and good luck parking that vehicle near her with Crazy Maizey....she would put up the alarm...gotta love a part crazy watch dog   And our other dog Jax would be howling like something alien...no missing that!


----------



## goats&moregoats (Jun 12, 2015)

I have not had Tahoe & Yukon quite a year yet, but would bet a large amount of money that no one but a select few are going in that goat pen. Those few are family. 4 to be exact. Only these for people, myself being one, take care of the farm animals and the two dogs. All other family and friends who have been introduced can safely do whatever outside the fence, but they are not going in. Not without one of the four. Also two of my older grandchildren can go in, but they only do so when one of the four are around as they are only 7 & 9.  No stranger is getting anywhere near the fence, so I know they aren't opening it or going in. Food will not persuade them either, not with strangers. Some of our family and friends are not readily accepted either...The two dogs will allow people in with us, but usually keep a safe distance and watch carefully their goats.


----------



## OneFineAcre (Jun 12, 2015)

No
Mikey barks at any stranger but is ok if you come in with us
He stands off and continues to bark but eventually comes over to check them out and after a while will decide it is ok
We have to spend some time getting him used to goat sitters but that has just been a couple of people
Angel on the other hand doesn't like strangers at all but it's more like she is afraid of strangers
Im not too worried about theft with our set up but would be more worried she would let someone steal a goat
She's young and we are working on that
She hates the neighbors dog which is probably my biggest threat


----------



## Baymule (Jun 12, 2015)

We have 4 dogs. Trip, 7 month old Pyrenees/Maremma, Paris a 5 year old Pyr, Parker a 3 year old black Lab/Great Dane and Polly a 10 year old Aussie. Trip loves everyone. Stolen. Paris hates everyone. Would probably bite. Parker has a deep, serious bark that strikes terror in the person it is aimed at, Polly barks the alarm, then greets whoever. Three are posessive and protective. The puppy barks alarm, he's learning.


----------



## purplequeenvt (Jun 16, 2015)

Mira - possibly. She loves people and will go up to anyone for attention. I don't know how she would react to a stranger going into her pasture/pen without one of her people though. 

Murphy - never. He will let people in with one of us, but he is extremely stranger-wary. Not aggressive, but won't go up to them or take anything  from them. 

Misha - not sure. As a little puppy, definitely, now that he's older, I don't think he'd let anyone in. He's gotten much more "guardy" of late.


----------



## jodief100 (Jun 17, 2015)

Snowy- No way.  If she doesn't know you AND love you she won't come near you.  She will bark and charge at you, but not come near you.  You might be able to get to the goats, but only if you are willing to risk it.  Doubtful anyone will.  The list of people she knows and loves is small, only two.  Me and my stepson.  She is terrified of men.  She never has gotten used to my husband.  She will let him get close only when feeding her and then she is very tentative.  We are pretty sure her former owner was abusive.  She was severely underweight when we got her. She accepts my stepson because he was a little guy when we got her and he grew up with her.  

Jack- no way, never.  He will stand his ground and bark if he doesn't know you and love you.  His list of those he loves includes my husband, me and his boy but no one else.  He will place  himself between you and HIS goats.  You can't near them either if he won't let you.  

Peron and Zorya- not sure.  They will come up to people they know.  They will come up to strangers if me or my hubby are there.  They are not as aggressive or intimidating.  They do not like to be led or ride in cars so they will fight you if you tried to load them.  They might be able to be stolen if someone was willing to pick up 70+ lbs of squirming, fighting dog and load them in their car.  I am not sure if they would be more aggressive if we aren't there but I don't want to find out.  When they get to their full size of 100 lbs or so, it would be a challenge.  

FYI- the way the farm sitter feeds them is to set down the bowl where they can see it and leave.  We have to have a female farm sitter or Snowy will go ballistic and not eat.


----------



## Pearce Pastures (Jun 17, 2015)

Even reading this post made me uneasy.  Last week in the local news a warning was issued for people to be on alert---LARGE dogs are being taken from people's yard.  Then, my neighbor had a creepy incident with some folks on motorcycles peeling down her driveway, and then realized her garage had been opened.

I have been worrying about this this week.  Would my dogs allow themselves to go with a stranger?  They love their herd but I watch how they react to people who stop by.  We did quite a bit of work to socialize them early on, fearing they would be people aggressive.  For the most part, they like people and I do not think they would actually harm anyone---the only case in which I could see that happen is if someone were harming their babies/goats/

Case in point---my vet comes by sometimes and when he does, I either have to bring goats out of the pen or put the dogs up because they growl at him. They do see him as being a threat because he makes the goats cry.  No biggie and I am glad they care that much.

But I have had SEVERAL visitors in the past few weeks and while my older LGD (Charlie) backs away and does not offer his affection, my one year old Louie flops his big doofy self on the wall for pats.  

With either of them, I do worry that some stranger could walk right in and take them, Louie wanting some loving and Charlie not associating the person with any kind of harm to the herd.  



What to do though?  I wouldn't really want a people aggressive dog, but gosh I would die if someone took them.


----------



## Robbin (Jul 16, 2015)

When Toli was young, about a year, I thought he was too friendly and decided to test him....  DUMB idea....  So he's on the back porch, I go out the front door so he doesn't know I'm out.  Flashlight to keep him from seeing me and I come around the back.  The idea was to provoke him and see if he would chase me if I ran.  OMG  it was all I could do to get him stopped before he reached me.  He was roaring like a lion and coming like a freight train...  I surprised him at close quarters in the dark when he KNEW everyone was inside.  Don't EVER do that.... My knees where shaking when I got him stopped.

He's about 2.5 now, about 140lb.  When people are coming and we aren't outside, he stands ridged at the end of the drive and barks.  Once one of us is outside and speaks to however it is, they go on the whitelist and he backs down and if they are nice to him he'll want to play and love on them.  He tolerates their dogs and cats, but won't tolerate a stray.   If they drive up, in broad daylight and act like they know what they are doing he just watches them.  IE: Meter readers and LP gas trucks.  He doesn't like it when people walk up, because that rarely happens, and he REALLY doesn't like it if you are walking and it's dark.  He gets very serious when the sun goes down.

If you wanted to steal him, even if he was willing, it would take two to pick him up.  He won't jump in a vehicle for me, much less a stranger. Vehicles lead to VETS and that is never good....
Robbin


----------



## terrilhb (Oct 16, 2017)

How would you test to see what would happen?


----------



## Baymule (Oct 16, 2017)

terrilhb said:


> How would you test to see what would happen?


Ask a friend that is either very brave or very stupid to steal your dog?


----------



## greybeard (Oct 16, 2017)

Ya know what they say.....
"_If you think you're in charge, just try bossin another man's dog around_"


----------



## BrendaMNgri (Oct 17, 2017)

No, because:

1. Gates always locked both when I am here and gone. Anyone who doesn't fence their place, or does not set up boundaries to prevent trespassers, is IMHO, asking for what they get. You may as well throw up a "come and take all you want" sign at the entrance to your property.
2. When I am here, my dogs, who are fabulous judges of character, base their response to people on my body language, the person's body language, and how I am interacting with the people. If I am okay with folks, they are okay with them (there have been a couple of exceptions, but only two - both very suspicious dogs I owned in the past who trusted no one - but me.) Recent visit to my ranch by film crew great example. I greeted and welcomed them in. All relaxed. Guys were cool with the dogs - the dogs soon were cool with them.
3. When I am gone to my part time job, it's a whole different story. No one has to date, or probably is, going to try to get over my fence or gate with 11 huge frothing barking and very protective LGDs meeting them in the dark. I've had friends tell me they drove up to my gate when I was gone and the reception was not friendly. "No way would I go in there!"

I raise my dogs here handled from birth and socialized, totally respecting their innate capacity to judge and make sound decisions. Because I trust my dogs, they know it, and they rarely if ever have let me down in terms of sizing up people.


----------



## OneFineAcre (Oct 17, 2017)

I kind of find the idea of stealing someone's guard dog amusing.
Why would you want him/or her if they let themselves get stolen?
Not a very good guard dog that let's themselves be stolen.


----------



## babsbag (Oct 17, 2017)

My dogs are great with people when I am around, no idea what they would do if I wasn't home and someone came around. I can have people do chores for me but the dogs know them already.  My oldest girl loves people and usually comes around for a belly rub. But twice she has met someone and turned and walked away and went out to the field and just watched them. It is a very eerie feeling to know that your dog doesn't trust the person, especially when you don't know them and they are just here responding to a CL ad. I was very happy when they decided not to buy a goat, and happier when they left.


----------

