# Double teats?



## freechicken (Jun 13, 2014)

We just discovered that our 8 week old alpine doeling has double teats. I'm not sure how we missed this when she was born but we did. Now what? There is no possibility of breeding her, correct?


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## goatboy1973 (Jun 14, 2014)

Oops! I know from raising Boer and Boer X goats years ago that this is called "Fish Teats". This is a serious fault in the Boer industry. I suspect that if your Alp doeling is not 100% (experimental somewhere in its pedigree), this common trait in Boers has popped up. As far as functionality is concerned, it is a gamble. I have seen fish teats that are functional and I have seen nonfunctional. I definitely wouldn't register her and probably not breed her. I would try my hardest to sell or keep her as a pet or sell her as a packing goat. Alpines make excellent hiking partners and have seen some carry 30-40% of their weight on a hike. As a breeder you always want to strive to produce offspring that exceeds their parents and mirrors the breed standard as close as possible. I hate this for you. She looks like a good little doeling though. I have 1 Alpine doe and 2 of her daughters and 3 of her grandkids. They are such a good natured breed.


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## OneFineAcre (Jun 14, 2014)

This is a major fault in a dairy goat.  Nothing says you can't breed, but would be best if you don't pass the trait.  Definitely don't register.
Even if her offspring did not have the trait, it could pop up further down.
If you do breed, absolutely positively wether all buckling offspring, they could spread the trait even further.
We had a doe who did not have the trait herself, but it showed up in a buck kid on her 3rd freshening.  At the same time, her daughter from her first freshening threw a kid with it.  We gave her away without registration papers and disclosed the problem to the new owner.  The people who had bought the daughter who threw the kid with the extra teat loved the goat, but we felt bad about it.  So, we gave them another doe kid later.


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## goatboy1973 (Jun 14, 2014)

OneFineAcre said:


> This is a major fault in a dairy goat.  Nothing says you can't breed, but would be best if you don't pass the trait.  Definitely don't register.
> Even if her offspring did not have the trait, it could pop up further down.
> If you do breed, absolutely positively wether all buckling offspring, they could spread the trait even further.
> We had a doe who did not have the trait herself, but it showed up in a buck kid on her 3rd freshening.  At the same time, her daughter from her first freshening threw a kid with it.  We gave her away without registration papers and disclosed the problem to the new owner.  The people who had bought the daughter who threw the kid with the extra teat loved the goat, but we felt bad about it.  So, we gave them another doe kid later.


The reason I said not to breed her was partially because of passing the gene on to another generation whether it be registered goat or not, you will be adding this horrible trait that directly affects the offspring she has in that if these teats are not functional, and if a producer does not bottle feed them, they will die of starvation. Why would a person pass on such a horrible trait? You must think of goats as a species. I personally think it would be irresponsible to breed her. Just my opinion.


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## OneFineAcre (Jun 15, 2014)

goatboy1973 said:


> The reason I said not to breed her was partially because of passing the gene on to another generation whether it be registered goat or not, you will be adding this horrible trait that directly affects the offspring she has in that if these teats are not functional, and if a producer does not bottle feed them, they will die of starvation. Why would a person pass on such a horrible trait? You must think of goats as a species. I personally think it would be irresponsible to breed her. Just my opinion.



I agree with you  That's why I said "it would be best if you don't pass the trait"

Not only should that animal not be bred, but the dam shouldn't be bred again unless all future kids are going to be used for meat.  I would also disclose to anyone who had purchased a previous kid in that they should not be used as breeding stock.

That's what I would do.


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## goatboy1973 (Jun 15, 2014)

OneFineAcre said:


> I agree with you  That's why I said "it would be best if you don't pass the trait"
> 
> Not only should that animal not be bred, but the dam shouldn't be bred again unless all future kids are going to be used for meat.  I would also disclose to anyone who had purchased a previous kid in that they should not be used as breeding stock.
> 
> That's what I would do.


Well said. I didn't read your post completely before replying. Plus, my ipad was acting up and wouldn't allow me to see all of your post. Sorry. I do wholeheartedly agree with you.


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## freechicken (Jun 15, 2014)

Oh goodness! I didn't realize that it meant I shouldn't breed the dam either! Is it not possible that the trait came from the sire?


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## OneFineAcre (Jun 16, 2014)

freechicken said:


> Oh goodness! I didn't realize that it meant I shouldn't breed the dam either! Is it not possible that the trait came from the sire?



Actually, you are correct.  It could have come from the sire.  I wasn't thinking


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## FreyasMom (Jun 16, 2014)

My mixed Alpine doe has double teats and she nurses her kid just fine... Though this is the first I've read about it since I didn't realize it wasn't normal.

this isnt an amazing picture, but it shows the double teat on one side. That is what your talking about yes?


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## OneFineAcre (Jun 16, 2014)

SonjaCavin said:


> My mixed Alpine doe has double teats and she nurses her kid just fine... Though this is the first I've read about it since I didn't realize it wasn't normal.View attachment 3924this isnt an amazing picture, but it shows the double teat on one side. That is what your talking about yes?



Hard to tell from the picture.


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## goatboy1973 (Jun 16, 2014)

Yeah, I can just see it. This would be classified as a multiple teat. The fish teat I was referring to actually is a teat that looks like a fish's tail. One teat with 2 different smaller teats at the lower end.


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## freechicken (Jun 16, 2014)

We have spoken to both breeders - those we got our original does from and the breeders that own the sire. Our does' line appears to be completely clear. The owners of the sire were going to check and see if any of his other kids had the trait (this was his first year so there aren't that many to compare to). They are willing to refund our money or offer a free stud service this fall with a different buck. I'm glad that they are trying to make it right. It's just incredibly disappointing on several levels. We had hoped to keep her to replace one of our milking does. And unfortunately because we didn't notice the issue right away, we have allowed ourselves to become attached to her, making slaughtering her that much more difficult. 

(Sigh).


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