Animals to acreage question

[greybeard]

That's a good point. Maybe I can find somebody close that raises them ' right' and healthy.

What is the definition of 'right'?

 

[Lereg]

I still honestly believe that you would do fine if you were to buy a couple of steers in the 600 lb range, keep them for 6-10 months then sell one and put the other in the freezer. You could advertise the one you wanted to sell as being pasture raised, and all the things you want your own to be....

But, once you find the place you want to be and get a bit settled, then find the local sale/auction barn, go spend a little time there, just to see how things are doing; then see if the feed stores/local co-ops have a bulletin board and you may very well find someone with something to sell. Also, find the local butcher/slaughter house and talk to them. They often know of someone who has a 1/2 to sell or may have an extra animal they want to get rid of. I had 2 extra jersey steers (sold a total of 6) and finally they went to the sale. Not 2 weeks later had 3 different people call me looking for one....Get yourself one in the freezer and then give yourself some time to figure out if you want to raise one down the road. Most people who raise one or a few up for themselves will raise it humanely, and some will be grass fed and others will included grain in their diets. But they usually aren't in a feed lot type setting but out in a pasture where they are not confined and restricted.

This is something we've been considering as well!! We're just trying to make the most of our space, when we actually get it. Just not totally sure how we will go about it yet, but these posts on here are really helping us along. So, thank you all!!

We have 8 acres, partially wooded. We opted for sheep and the occasional feeder pig. Right now we have 3 feeder pigs, 1 for us and 2 for neighbors. We'll split the expense and we all get a pig for the freezer. We have 5 ewes and a ram, we wether the ram lambs and sell them at slaughter weight. We have chickens and sell the eggs, they pay for themselves. We get eggs and meat.

We have a neighbor with cows. We'll probably buy a steer from him and take it to slaughter. We don't have room for cows. if I get to wanting a milk animal, I'll get a couple of goats. Goats are smaller and easier to work with.

We will be getting a trio of Muscovy ducks. They are the ultimate farm duck. The drakes get up to 9 pounds, the hens up to 7 pounds. They brood and raise their own young. I would recommend them to you.

And a LGD! If you have small livestock, you need guardian dogs. We have a great Livestock Guard Dog forum here, read all you can. Right now, my male Great Pyrenees is guarding a ewe and brand new lamb, I can hear his booming BOOF! that warns predators away. Coyotes are terrible here, but we have had no losses.

That's another goal of ours is to raise some to sell, or to barter with!!
With the ducks, I'm considering the, but dont like dark meat much, but I hear the eggs are delicious!!
I'm all on the chickens! I plan on starting with a lot, 25-30 maybe. They are cheap enough, and can make money back!! I just have some rooster questions I need answered first, before I can decide what breeds I want. I do know that I want dual purpose hens though, good egg providers and tasty!! Right now, thinking about rirs, orps, lorps, bsls, and at least one more breed, maybe ee's?

What is the definition of 'right'?

Just one that has been pastured and not had any gmo's put in it. I'd like an organic one preferably, but is long as it was raised the way that would have a heal

 

[farmerjan]

I do feed some grain but I cannot begin to afford non-gmo organic feed. At twice to 3 x the cost of average feed you will find the cost of meat in the $15. lb for just ground beef. Strictly grass fed will eliminate the grain/gmo but even hay will seldom be available for feed that is not raised conventionally. We do very little chemicals, but even using poultry litter from turkey and chicken operations that are strictly confinement housed has "contaminants" if you are going by organic standards. We use as much litter as is practical for the added organic matter that it puts back into the soil. Unless you raise all the feed/grain yourself, it is very hard to find any grain that is not gmo. Unless you can go the organic route.

Can't figure out the bsls in your list of breeds of chickens. One of the best for laying are the sex-links. They also gain quite a bit of weight and make good birds for killing. The black sex-links are the biggest of the many different crosses that are used. Unless you are going to raise them in separate pens, to keep the breeding pure, then most any rooster will do. The plymouth rock breed is a very good dual purpose breed and most males are not aggressive. Won't need more than 2 roosters for 25 hens.
If you start with chicks, they will cost you a fair amount to get them to 24 weeks which is about when most of the heavier breeds start to lay. So not as cheap as you think. You will have between $7 and $10 in each to get them to laying size. And believe me, if you don't have a market for the eggs, they will pile up real quick. If they start laying in the fall, then you will have to supplement with lights in order to keep them laying since they will need about 12 hours of light a day for decent egg production. Otherwise they will dwindle down and then start to pick up in say feb/mar.

 

[Lereg]

I should have clarified some of my statements last night, but there was a lot going on around here. I know that totally organic will be too expensive for us, but we will still try and get the closest we can to it without going broke in the process.
The bsls, are in fact the black sex links. I had forgotten about the plymouth rocks, so they could be an option too!
As for the cheap aspect, I was just saying that they would be cheaper to buy than the other livestock that we will be planing to get. Sorry for the mix-up.
Any ideas on what type of rooster(s) we should get, if we do get the hens I was talking about?

 

[Bruce]

Continuing on @farmerjan's comment:
Depending on where you live you may have a really hard time selling eggs. Ask @CntryBoy777. When most everyone around is raising chickens (because they ARE relatively cheap to buy and feed), they won't need your eggs at any price including free. If you get your first chicks from a hatchery in April - early June all the pullets will lay the next winter but they will likely shut down in fall through winter (quite variable) from then on. Your options for winter eggs then are to have new chicks each spring or force them with light (*). And how many eggs will you be needing to send off the farm? Even "so-so" layers will lay 3 a week. 25 hens will produce 6.25 dozen per week. Now toss in the BSLs which will likely lay twice that many.

Also, you can breed sex links together but their offspring won't be sex linked, you have to wait until they show their gender same as non sexlinked or autosexing chickens. If you want to know the gender of the chicks at hatch, you will have to make your own sex links by having the breeds which when crossed create sexlinks. I think one of them has to be barred like a BPR, I don't remember if that should be the male or female, nor what the other half should be.

Unless you are only selling a few dozen to people you know, you will need to do serious "clean handling" of the eggs including washing and refrigerating. You might be able to find a small market that will carry your eggs if you can be a reliable supplier but then you will need to have insurance because the store isn't going to take on the liability.

* and 14 hours is more likely needed than 12. I had 12 hours of light not this past year but 2015-2016 starting in Sept thinking it would keep the older girls working longer until the pullets started in Nov/Dec. Nope, not in the slightest but the pullets were laying so I left the 12 hours of light so I wouldn't maybe screw them up.

 

[Mini Horses]

Here's the deal at my place. I have a few constant customers. It's enough to pay for most the normal chicken feed. I and my 2 kids/family get free eggs. Sometimes friends get free ones, especially if new pullets are starting & I have small/extra eggs. Some are bartered for things I'd like -- fresh figs, 5 gallon food grade buckets, extra produce from a garden, etc. And @ times they are re-fed to chickens, pigs, dogs, cats, etc. Works for me!

When I have hens broody, I put fertile eggs from those I have penned for that purpose. Those chicks are sold or grown out for replacement layers, sold as started hens, butchered as extra roos. I have as much fun & interaction as I want, mostly offset expense.

Similar with goats. Need kids to get milk. Sell kids. Use milk, make cheese, butter, yogurt, ice cream, caramel sauce, soap. Extra can feed pigs, cats, dogs & chickens. Some cheeses shared with friends, or frozen for winter use, etc. Greater feed expense BUT, working at raising more winter feed -- the time when I need to buy more of it as lesser forage grows.


Enjoyment can be part of your payback, along with excellent food. Say "hobby farm". I can cut back/slow down when I want. Not quite ready but, did reduce some numbers of late. You have waited a long time for this farm, try to enjoy it once there.

 

[Baymule]

You can breed your RIR rooster to Australorps and get black sex links.
This is Robin, a black sex link that shows a lot of red. She managed to get past the butcher (me) at her 2nd molt by her sheer bad attitude personality. I had to admire a chicken like her, so she's a pet, she'll be 6 years old in March. She's the old lady of the roost and while chickens come and go, none of them challenge her. LOL

 

[lcertuche]

DH and I plan on trying to get a loan to buy a place soon but like so many have mentioned there are sooo many factors involved if you plan on raising critters. Work, expense, fencing, shelters, feed and/or hay, Rx and worming, and of course there would be veterinary fees. I raise a few chickens so I can't really see spending money on vet fees but there are people who do. If mine get severely injured or sick then I just dispatch them but with larger animals it's another thing altogether. I know I would not want a large acreage if I had to build fences. I would just steer away from those type of animals. For pigs, poultry and such cattle panels can be used for a simple shelter but if you are building barns it will cost. Tennessee looked very lush when I drove through it many years ago so an acre or so might support a single cow but the next problem is like mentioned earlier is parasitic problems from not changing up the grazing areas. Another thing to consider is certain animals should never be grazed on the same land.

 

[Lereg]

Continuing on @farmerjan's comment:
Depending on where you live you may have a really hard time selling eggs. Ask @CntryBoy777. When most everyone around is raising chickens (because they ARE relatively cheap to buy and feed), they won't need your eggs at any price including free. If you get your first chicks from a hatchery in April - early June all the pullets will lay the next winter but they will likely shut down in fall through winter (quite variable) from then on. Your options for winter eggs then are to have new chicks each spring or force them with light (*). And how many eggs will you be needing to send off the farm? Even "so-so" layers will lay 3 a week. 25 hens will produce 6.25 dozen per week. Now toss in the BSLs which will likely lay twice that many.

Also, you can breed sex links together but their offspring won't be sex linked, you have to wait until they show their gender same as non sexlinked or autosexing chickens. If you want to know the gender of the chicks at hatch, you will have to make your own sex links by having the breeds which when crossed create sexlinks. I think one of them has to be barred like a BPR, I don't remember if that should be the male or female, nor what the other half should be.

Unless you are only selling a few dozen to people you know, you will need to do serious "clean handling" of the eggs including washing and refrigerating. You might be able to find a small market that will carry your eggs if you can be a reliable supplier but then you will need to have insurance because the store isn't going to take on the liability.

* and 14 hours is more likely needed than 12. I had 12 hours of light not this past year but 2015-2016 starting in Sept thinking it would keep the older girls working longer until the pullets started in Nov/Dec. Nope, not in the slightest but the pullets were laying so I left the 12 hours of light so I wouldn't maybe screw them up.

For the selling aspect on the eggs, I was thinking that maybe a flea market or something like that. Of course many others in the area might be doing that too. I do want to raise them, but I haven't really done enough research to see how it is actually done, especially if some of my breeds aren't broody. I guess we could just get an incubator though and possibly sell the chicks as well, but then comes the problem of knowing what sex they are.

I understand about the lighting, and will try to have something set up to where they will be able to get the 14 hours of needed 'sun'. Another thing I have still got to research. I am a member of backyardchickens, but cant seem to get off this site long enough to look, because you guys are so awesome and informative. The time is getting a lot closer now, and I really need to get on the ball and find out everything I can within the next 6 mos.

Here's the deal at my place. I have a few constant customers. It's enough to pay for most the normal chicken feed. I and my 2 kids/family get free eggs. Sometimes friends get free ones, especially if new pullets are starting & I have small/extra eggs. Some are bartered for things I'd like -- fresh figs, 5 gallon food grade buckets, extra produce from a garden, etc. And @ times they are re-fed to chickens, pigs, dogs, cats, etc. Works for me!

When I have hens broody, I put fertile eggs from those I have penned for that purpose. Those chicks are sold or grown out for replacement layers, sold as started hens, butchered as extra roos. I have as much fun & interaction as I want, mostly offset expense.

Similar with goats. Need kids to get milk. Sell kids. Use milk, make cheese, butter, yogurt, ice cream, caramel sauce, soap. Extra can feed pigs, cats, dogs & chickens. Some cheeses shared with friends, or frozen for winter use, etc. Greater feed expense BUT, working at raising more winter feed -- the time when I need to buy more of it as lesser forage grows.


Enjoyment can be part of your payback, along with excellent food. Say "hobby farm". I can cut back/slow down when I want. Not quite ready but, did reduce some numbers of late. You have waited a long time for this farm, try to enjoy it once there.

That's a good point too, about giving the excess to the other livestock, if I cant sell them. The reason I want milk goats is specifically for how you're going about it. Still debating on keeping a buck though. As I would like to, I just dont know if it would be worth it in the long run.
I will definitely be enjoying it, although I'm not much of a morning person, but the DW is!!!

You can breed your RIR rooster to Australorps and get black sex links.
This is Robin, a black sex link that shows a lot of red. She managed to get past the butcher (me) at her 2nd molt by her sheer bad attitude personality. I had to admire a chicken like her, so she's a pet, she'll be 6 years old in March. She's the old lady of the roost and while chickens come and go, none of them challenge her. LOL

View attachment 28366

I though it was a rir rooster, but wasn't sure. If she's mean, how did she get by the butcher? I get the admiring, but wow. Does she still lay?

DH and I plan on trying to get a loan to buy a place soon but like so many have mentioned there are sooo many factors involved if you plan on raising critters. Work, expense, fencing, shelters, feed and/or hay, Rx and worming, and of course there would be veterinary fees. I raise a few chickens so I can't really see spending money on vet fees but there are people who do. If mine get severely injured or sick then I just dispatch them but with larger animals it's another thing altogether. I know I would not want a large acreage if I had to build fences. I would just steer away from those type of animals. For pigs, poultry and such cattle panels can be used for a simple shelter but if you are building barns it will cost. Tennessee looked very lush when I drove through it many years ago so an acre or so might support a single cow but the next problem is like mentioned earlier is parasitic problems from not changing up the grazing areas. Another thing to consider is certain animals should never be grazed on the same land.

Well, we're trying to find a place with fencing already in place. I can cross fence them if need be, but, like everybody, I'd like for it to be all set up for when we get there. I know there will be extra cost in vet bills and rx, so we have that in the plans. I believe with some training that we could administer the majority of the wormers/ meds ourselves, hopefully! For the pigs, the plan is to have them next to our major garden, which would be fenced too, and rotate the pigs and the garden area each year. Hoping it will save on the cultivating, somewhat. I just plan on building some lean-to's for there shelter, so hopefully it wont break the bank for us.

 

[CntryBoy777]

Before ya get to ordering some chickens, ya need to investigate your state laws that covers the selling of eggs. I kinda thought the way you are doing and found out that there is much more to it than I ever imagined. If you sell at a flea mkt, farmer's mkt, or advertise you are bound by state laws which means ya can't sell in used cartons with another company's name on them, and unless your farm is inspected and your practices observed, you can't claim anything other than Cage Free eggs. Also, it has been my experience, that ya would best be served by finding your market, then supply it and target it. Here, there isn't much market for eggs, just as @Bruce referred to, we have trouble finding people to Give them to for Free....we get 20 eggs a day from our chickens and ducks, so they collect and take up fridge space very quickly. We mainly got them for bug eating around here, and having had 2 heart attacks I can't eat like I use to so, it does become a bit of a challenge sometimes. Just google "Egg Laws in Tn" and you'll begin to see what I mean...