farmerjan
Herd Master
- Joined
- Aug 16, 2016
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- Shenandoah Valley Virginia
There are contracts that farmers sign with the companies they sell their milk to and it can , and HAS, gotten into some difficult situations for the farmers to "sell their milk" to someone else for less. Had a dairy here that was making some cheese. They had a contract to sell the fluid milk to a milk co-op. They had to divert the milk BEFORE it went into the bulk tank, in order to comply with the contract to the milk company, and still make cheese. There are too many gray areas that can get a commercial farmer shut down, and if he loses his milk contract, then now a days he will not find another company to pick him up like it used to be. All it takes is someone innocently saying oh, I buy my milk from so and so for xxx amount to feed my calves/pigs/whatever.... and it gets to the wrong person and a farmer that is certified to sell raw grade A milk for pasteurization can lose his milk permit. And then if nothing ever goes wrong, the person buying the milk is again putting out money for feeding a calf.
You say that a person can take a calf, a source of milk, and then some feed and grass and get them to say 18 months and have some good beef, for a reasonable price. Have you ever sat and actually figured out the true cost of raising an animal to slaughter size? A source of milk, say another cow, or some goats, still costs money. You have to feed the animal producing the milk. Grain for a calf isn't cheap, and the value of the pasture grass is still a cost. Maybe not exactly an "out of the pocket" direct cost.... but the value of it. There is hay cost for at least one winter.
I raised bottle calves for years. As many as 100 a year. Got my holstein bull calves off farms because I learned early on that sale barn calves were a 50/50 at best, chance of survival. Mostly because the farmers would be getting them shipped off as soon as possible. Many do not get the colostrum they need. Some farmers are very good about taking care of all their calves.... bulls and heifers until the bulls are sold. I have gone every route there is. Milk replacer, milking my own cows, grafting them on nurse cows. Every way there is but goats, and no matter the source of milk, it costs money to get the milk.
There used to be a market for holstein beef, but it is dwindling. They take longer to finish, and they eat a greater amount and for longer to get them to slaughter size. They do grade out nicely so the meat is good.
If you took every cost into consideration, and I mean just the actual out of pocket costs, and were totally honest with yourself about it, it would cost you more than you realize to get that animal to slaughter weight.
A person can raise a calf up for meat and still get good beef for less than maybe he can buy it for. But, you are not putting a value on their time. Ask anyone on here what they sell their lambs for, and they are making a little bit. But it is not enough to make a living off of. And none of them have put a value on their time because they enjoy doing it. But a person that has a normal, busy life, can find that raising an animal is sometimes too time consuming, or demanding, or just too costly for the return. And a farmer has to put some value on his time because he is expending his own time and energy to do the work.
Our figures of costing and average of 1.50 /day to keep a beef cow is low by most state standards. And those beef cows do not get grain to make them produce milk. That is figuring in the value of the land and the grass and the hay.
I am not saying not to raise these calves. But there is more money tied up in them than most people realize. It is because you are putting the money out in small increments.....$20 for a bag or two of grain here, $40 for a roll of hay there, $25 for a bag of mineral, $6-7 for a block of salt, and then next thing you know you have a couple hundred dollars spent and you didn't feel it because it was all not out of the pocket in one big glug. Let one get sick, even gatorade and kaopectate costs money.
Not putting a value on the grass they eat, true out of pocket expenses will creep up fast. And holsteins do not do well on straight grass until they are well over 600 lbs. The body physiology requires a diet with more protein, higher concentrates because they have been bred that way. They don't grow on just grass and hay. They need more to grow or they just don't do good. I have seen way too many "hay belly" calves from people that think they can raise them cheap. They are not thrifty, and they never grow right after that.
So say someone would get some calves to use the "surplus milk" that their goats are making. It costs money for that milk through the cost of what grain the goats get fed. Time to milk the goat. But if you truly discounted that, then raising a calf for a few months would be a good return on the milk. Again, there is some grain for the calf, plus some good quality hay. Good pasture will not sustain a younger calf, but by the time they hit 5-600 lbs, it can supply most of their nutritional needs. GOOD PASTURE..... to keep them gaining and growing. For how many months do you have that good pasture? To keep pasture growing and vegetative, it has to be grazed then given a rest, to regrow, then to be grazed again. The weather will play a big part too. If the grass is not enough then there is hay costs. Time/money to go get it or costs to get it delivered. There are all these little things.
I am a big proponent of raising your own beef/meat. Haven't bought beef in probably 40 years. The biggest cost for me is the slaughter/processing costs because that is what I see directly. BUT you don't raise them for nothing. If you have goats making more milk than you can use, a great way to utilize the surplus. If you have pasture that doesn't get grazed down, and you have to bush hog off, then a more economical way to get it "cut" and go into an animal for gain rather than just filling a gas/diesel tank to mow it off..... The taste of home raised beef is the best and the satisfaction of knowing that you gave the animal a good life is something you cannot measure. Just realize that it is not cheap meat.
You say that a person can take a calf, a source of milk, and then some feed and grass and get them to say 18 months and have some good beef, for a reasonable price. Have you ever sat and actually figured out the true cost of raising an animal to slaughter size? A source of milk, say another cow, or some goats, still costs money. You have to feed the animal producing the milk. Grain for a calf isn't cheap, and the value of the pasture grass is still a cost. Maybe not exactly an "out of the pocket" direct cost.... but the value of it. There is hay cost for at least one winter.
I raised bottle calves for years. As many as 100 a year. Got my holstein bull calves off farms because I learned early on that sale barn calves were a 50/50 at best, chance of survival. Mostly because the farmers would be getting them shipped off as soon as possible. Many do not get the colostrum they need. Some farmers are very good about taking care of all their calves.... bulls and heifers until the bulls are sold. I have gone every route there is. Milk replacer, milking my own cows, grafting them on nurse cows. Every way there is but goats, and no matter the source of milk, it costs money to get the milk.
There used to be a market for holstein beef, but it is dwindling. They take longer to finish, and they eat a greater amount and for longer to get them to slaughter size. They do grade out nicely so the meat is good.
If you took every cost into consideration, and I mean just the actual out of pocket costs, and were totally honest with yourself about it, it would cost you more than you realize to get that animal to slaughter weight.
A person can raise a calf up for meat and still get good beef for less than maybe he can buy it for. But, you are not putting a value on their time. Ask anyone on here what they sell their lambs for, and they are making a little bit. But it is not enough to make a living off of. And none of them have put a value on their time because they enjoy doing it. But a person that has a normal, busy life, can find that raising an animal is sometimes too time consuming, or demanding, or just too costly for the return. And a farmer has to put some value on his time because he is expending his own time and energy to do the work.
Our figures of costing and average of 1.50 /day to keep a beef cow is low by most state standards. And those beef cows do not get grain to make them produce milk. That is figuring in the value of the land and the grass and the hay.
I am not saying not to raise these calves. But there is more money tied up in them than most people realize. It is because you are putting the money out in small increments.....$20 for a bag or two of grain here, $40 for a roll of hay there, $25 for a bag of mineral, $6-7 for a block of salt, and then next thing you know you have a couple hundred dollars spent and you didn't feel it because it was all not out of the pocket in one big glug. Let one get sick, even gatorade and kaopectate costs money.
Not putting a value on the grass they eat, true out of pocket expenses will creep up fast. And holsteins do not do well on straight grass until they are well over 600 lbs. The body physiology requires a diet with more protein, higher concentrates because they have been bred that way. They don't grow on just grass and hay. They need more to grow or they just don't do good. I have seen way too many "hay belly" calves from people that think they can raise them cheap. They are not thrifty, and they never grow right after that.
So say someone would get some calves to use the "surplus milk" that their goats are making. It costs money for that milk through the cost of what grain the goats get fed. Time to milk the goat. But if you truly discounted that, then raising a calf for a few months would be a good return on the milk. Again, there is some grain for the calf, plus some good quality hay. Good pasture will not sustain a younger calf, but by the time they hit 5-600 lbs, it can supply most of their nutritional needs. GOOD PASTURE..... to keep them gaining and growing. For how many months do you have that good pasture? To keep pasture growing and vegetative, it has to be grazed then given a rest, to regrow, then to be grazed again. The weather will play a big part too. If the grass is not enough then there is hay costs. Time/money to go get it or costs to get it delivered. There are all these little things.
I am a big proponent of raising your own beef/meat. Haven't bought beef in probably 40 years. The biggest cost for me is the slaughter/processing costs because that is what I see directly. BUT you don't raise them for nothing. If you have goats making more milk than you can use, a great way to utilize the surplus. If you have pasture that doesn't get grazed down, and you have to bush hog off, then a more economical way to get it "cut" and go into an animal for gain rather than just filling a gas/diesel tank to mow it off..... The taste of home raised beef is the best and the satisfaction of knowing that you gave the animal a good life is something you cannot measure. Just realize that it is not cheap meat.
