Higher hay prices ?????

[animalfarm]

Hi ourflockof4
Bleeding hearts - I dont think so. The point I was making is that it is wrong to tell customers you have no hay available now and hord it to sell in Feb / March for even more dollars. Thankfully some out there are honest but others who spot an opportunity to clean your clock are suddenly buying up hay from everywhere putting it in the barn and rubbing their grubby little hands waiting for animals to reach starving point and their owners begging for hay - they are now on a boycott list for future years.

Agreed. It is what it is, supply and demand, but when they do exactly as you said then its game over. I too have a boycott list for future years. It also bugs the heck out of me when its first come first serve you pick it out of the field. Aside from the fact that there is no way to bring a tractor to fetch it, who in their right mind wants to drive for hours to find out 6 others got there before you and now the guy wants you to get in a bidding war for it. NO common decency at all.

 

[kstaven]

There is talk of higher hay prices this year around the Southern Ontario area -$4.50 to $5 small and $40 to 45 for rounds whats the price for small squares and round bales going to be in your patch ???????

This depends on if you want general grass or a top end high protein mix. As always you pay for what you get.

So with that said. General low end horse hay. $3.50 per bale. A top end dairy mix would work out to $6.75 Breaking prices down for those who buy 70 pounders.

 

[kstaven]

If you think it's expensive now, just wait. It needs to be in the $250-400/ton range to compete with current grain prices.
The average animal owner probably doesn't understand what it takes.

I agree whole heartedly. What many people do not understand is that mixed in the equation is there are those who farm for a living and those who have outside jobs that subsidize the farm. Makes me sad when I see the former moving into the minority because they can't compete with the pricing of the later. Those that actually do it for a living have no safety net and need to get the prices. It is no surprise considering this that younger generations do not want to farm for a living. They know the sad truth of it all. Every year we lose more farm land to housing developments. What happens when the scales tip far enough that we are totally dependent on import food stocks? At that point the days of cheap food will really be over because other countries will have a real strangle hold on us all and out of greed be able to get what they demand.

 

[ourflockof4]

Just to clarify though, I wasn't trying to call anybody out with my post. I was more just trying to show people the other side of the coin.

Cheap hay can be good, you just have to know what you have and how to utilize it properly. A lot of the people that sell hay for $1-2/bale have never spread any fertalizer on any of their fields. That may sound like a good thing to some people, but it actually isn't. Just like anything else plant's need certain chemicals and minerals to be healthy. On average the following nutrients with be removed per ton of hay on a dry matter basis, Nitogen#40, Phosphate #13, Potasium #60, and Sulfur #5, along with a lot of other micro nutrients. If you don't replentish your soil then it will not have enough of the mineral to make a healthy plant. If your plants are not healthy they will lack a good mineral content. Your plants lack mineral content when you cut them to make hay and guess what, your hay lacks the proper mineral content also. You feed the hay to your animals so they can get the nurishment they need, but it just isn't there. So how do you tell if the hay you are getting has the right mineral makeup? You can't just look at hay and tell whats all in it, unless your looking at a complete hay test report, and how any of us actually get them or would even know how to read one. You can ask the guy your buying it from how long it's been since he spread potash. If he gives you a look like "spread what" then he hasn't put fert. on in a while (unless his soil has a very high natural accurance of potasium)

Believe it or not though, cows don't really need all that great of hay as long as you have a good mineral program. The mineral blocks from the farm store don't really count as a good mineral program. There are lots of guys that feed nothing but corn stalks to bred cows and do just fine as long as they have a protien suppliment. Ther are quite a few variables, but for the most part cows only need 10-12% protein hay. Anything more then that just goes out the back.

I'll shut up now because I'm getting way off topic here. I'm sure there are people on here with way more knowledge of all of this then me anyhow.

Back on topic though, there was an add the other day I noticed for $100 for a 4x5 (800lbs) mixed grass second cutting. Thats $250/ton which is on the low end of the local auctions. Last week they averaged $320-480/ton at 3 different auctions.

 

[Royd Wood]

Great post ourflock
I'm still short for this winter but at least I made 180 round bales first cut - our first time at doing our own hay out here. I cut with a 1980s mower and row with a 1950s rake using a 1966 David Brown tractor then local guy came in and roundbailed it for me at $8 a bale - just a shame I had to start feeding hay from July. I have a bailer for small bales which I was going to use for second and third cut but it never grew

 

[bonbean01]

Our regular local hay guy did not charge more this year for hay, but with higher fuel costs we expected it would be higher. Nothing like a good hay guy, and he really likes that we don't mind picking them up off the field as his baler spits them out. He's getting older and not in the best of health and this is something he is able to do...super nice guy! This year we tried a few round bales too and will see how that works out...easier on our backs! Not sure if the round bales are easier for him too to bale, but he does both.

 

[greybeard]

Yes its a post from last year which at the time $45 bucks a round bale (5 x 4) sounded like a tough winter ahead but move on to 2012 and its $100 a round and worse still nobody will sell because they know everyone in Feb / March will be running out so they are hording to get 130 bucks a bale ( asoles all of em) We are trying to get a truck load in from out west which will cost about the same but its the princaple eh. I'm over to an old soldiers place tomorrow as he has a barn full of 4 year old hay. Last year he was on about dragging it out and burning it so it would be cool if a few of us go round and buy the hay and clean up the barn for him. My Galloways will either eat it or bed down on it and a good few bucks in the bank for the old boy- win win

This time last year Royd, we saw those same prices-$15 sm sq bales, and $100-$140 round bales--all from out of state--and by Feb, saw some from Canada. Baled rice straw from Louisiana was being fed and it wasn't cheap either.
Ya know what? This year, there's good local hay everywhere down here, and tho the prices did drop, they did not go back to pre-drought levels.
Why not?
Cause they are also shipping lots of local hay northward and getting big bucks for it--just like people from the north demanded high prices from us for their hay last year.
It will be a long time before we see $3/sm sq bale here again--maybe never if there is a drought anywhere.

But, I don't blame the hay producers either. Hard enough to make a $ on hay when fertilize is still sky high, and after any drought, weeds are a big problem which means weed control costs as well. Army worms=insect control costs too.
Believe me--ain't nobody gettin rich in the hay business--it all evens out in the end to an average.
And I was lucky last winter was very very mild and I got a good bit of ryegrass up, so I didn't need a lot of hay and didn't have to sell off stock, but would have paid the high prices and been glad to get any hay at all if Feb had been a bitterly cold and dry month.
Hording?
C'mon. Do you folks sell your cattle by which month it is or according to what the prices are? If you've ever waited a few weeks or a couple months till steer or replacement prices went up, then I guess you were hording too.
Think about it.

 

[Southern by choice]

Hording?
C'mon. Do you folks sell your cattle by which month it is or according to what the prices are? If you've ever waited a few weeks or a couple months till steer or replacement prices went up, then I guess you were hording too.
Think about it.

Hmmmm. Good point

 

[Royd Wood]

Yes its a post from last year which at the time $45 bucks a round bale (5 x 4) sounded like a tough winter ahead but move on to 2012 and its $100 a round and worse still nobody will sell because they know everyone in Feb / March will be running out so they are hording to get 130 bucks a bale ( asoles all of em) We are trying to get a truck load in from out west which will cost about the same but its the princaple eh. I'm over to an old soldiers place tomorrow as he has a barn full of 4 year old hay. Last year he was on about dragging it out and burning it so it would be cool if a few of us go round and buy the hay and clean up the barn for him. My Galloways will either eat it or bed down on it and a good few bucks in the bank for the old boy- win win

This time last year Royd, we saw those same prices-$15 sm sq bales, and $100-$140 round bales--all from out of state--and by Feb, saw some from Canada. Baled rice straw from Louisiana was being fed and it wasn't cheap either.
Ya know what? This year, there's good local hay everywhere down here, and tho the prices did drop, they did not go back to pre-drought levels.
Why not?
Cause they are also shipping lots of local hay northward and getting big bucks for it--just like people from the north demanded high prices from us for their hay last year.
It will be a long time before we see $3/sm sq bale here again--maybe never if there is a drought anywhere.

But, I don't blame the hay producers either. Hard enough to make a $ on hay when fertilize is still sky high, and after any drought, weeds are a big problem which means weed control costs as well. Army worms=insect control costs too.
Believe me--ain't nobody gettin rich in the hay business--it all evens out in the end to an average.
And I was lucky last winter was very very mild and I got a good bit of ryegrass up, so I didn't need a lot of hay and didn't have to sell off stock, but would have paid the high prices and been glad to get any hay at all if Feb had been a bitterly cold and dry month.
Hording?
C'mon. Do you folks sell your cattle by which month it is or according to what the prices are? If you've ever waited a few weeks or a couple months till steer or replacement prices went up, then I guess you were hording too.
Think about it.

You make some good points here Greybeard and just to make matters worse there is a shortage of grass seed for 2013 with some types not even available and the prices have soared. We need to at least overseed some fields and I have a 30 acre crop field that needs sowing to pasture.
The point I was trying to make was it is unfair to have hay dealers NOT hay makers buying up everything then hoarding the hay. Anyone with animals has to prepair for winter and if we dont make enough of our own hay then we need to purchase before winter comes - we cant keep animals and hope that maybe somewhere in Feb we might be able to get some.
The auctions and slaughter houses are doing brisk business, lets hope everyone everywhere has a good year in 2013 but unlikely

 

[greybeard]

Aghh--hay brokers.
Some are good and fair--some are like stock brokers--price manipulators.
You guys must have been in drought this year--we went thru the same thing on seed last spring after 2011's drought. Some distributors didn't bother ordering certain seed claiming they didn't think their customers would pay the higher prices for it. We had a fairly mild summer here with rain adequate, so our usual winter forages seed is plentiful and fairly priced. I've seen winter wheat/ryegrass mix advertised for $38//cwt. I have ryegrass already down 3 weeks, but till today, didn't get a drop of rain on it. We'll see if today's rain was too late or not.

I want to buy some more cows or heifers, but prices right now are just too high around here--unlike last winter when everyone was downsizing due to a hay shortage. If I'd known then what I know now...............