How many are currently raising hair breeds of sheep?

[TexasShepherdess]

thank you!
She is the hair ewe my son will be showing at the county show next week..hope she does the hairs proud!

 

[aggieterpkatie]

This is what I like to see..a good looking, stocky lamb.
http://coyotecreekranch.weebly.com/uploads/7/4/0/5/7405615/8024009.jpeg?367

Good looking lamb! I swear, if I ever switch to a hair breed it'll be Dorper. There are some build like brick....well, I won't finish that, but you get my drift.

 

[TexasShepherdess]

she was called by the ag teacher a "meat truck"..LOL..I love a stocky meaty sheep..

 

[Beekissed]

. . . The Dorper winning reserve champion is great news! I'm so glad that some areas are catching the hair sheep vibe and incorporating them into agricultural and 4-H type shows, as they do seem to be more popular at this time.

x2

About that Dorper...was wondering if they had docked the tail like they do the woolly breeds or did they judge on hair sheep standards of undocked tails?

I looked up a few hair sheep in shows and was disappointed to see the Royal Whites with docked tails but was gratified to learn that St. Croix standards disqualified if the body showed any signs of clipping or docking and the Katahdin Associations seem to discourage raising the sheep for show...anyone else have any info on this?

 

[ShadyAcres]

I am not a show person, my sheep are raised for production. Kids are grown and gone so don't see the 4-H shows anymore. Have been to a few sheep shows and the only hair sheep seen were Dorpers, and have been to Dorper show / sales. They were all docked. And shaved. A friends kids shows Dorpers in 4-H shows and they (show string) are all docked and shaved as well.

At first with my lambs I only docked animals that were to be retained as breeding stock. If a long tailed lamb wound up looking like breeding quality it would be the last one picked. If a short taied lamb did not grow like I expected and moved to market group it usually went first. Lambs sent to sale barn do not sell any differently here if tails or not, or if rams or wethers.

I had 4 ram lambs left averaging around 100 lbs. A Mexican came Christmas eve looking for Christmas dinner. He picked the one that had no tail even though he was the smallest of the group - only by about 10 lbs. This man is a repeat customer and usually wants the biggest, no matter the age. The short tailed lamb just looked heavier muscled.

 

[Beekissed]

Does this customer usually only pick docked sheep? If so, could it be that he is used to buying meat sheep that have been docked and associates docking with better, meatier sheep as opposed to those with tails?

Do you think the kids who show Dorper in meat classes at 4-H dock and shave because they know they have no way of winning anything if their lambs aren't looking like the rest of the meat breeds? Or do they have different judging standards for hair breeds that encourages leaving the tails and natural hair growth but the kids still dock and shave because they feel they can't really compete with the other breeds in the market class due to being judged against a field of docked and clipped lambs?

I'd really like to know and I'd like to see if hair sheep will finally nudge their way into the meat classes on their own merits, judged solely for their meat quality and build and not their hair and tails.

I know my sister found out real quick and in a hurry that her Highland beef wouldn't bring the same price at auction as Angus or similar beef breeds, even though they are comprised of beef, look beefy and meaty~ but have hairy hides and horns. The old farmers there told her they won't sell because they LOOK different, not because they ARE different.

 

[aggieterpkatie]

I know my sister found out real quick and in a hurry that her Highland beef wouldn't bring the same price at auction as Angus or similar beef breeds, even though they are comprised of beef, look beefy and meaty~ but have hairy hides and horns. The old farmers there told her they won't sell because they LOOK different, not because they ARE different.

Could be a huge difference in handling though, with those horns. Many people just don't like horns period.

 

[Beekissed]

These would be sold for meat and not for herd replacement purposes. The younger steers don't have much in the horn department that would discourage handling and transport to the butcher.

They told her that even a shaggy Angus brings less at market, so breeding her Highland bull over Angus cows, yielding a polled black cow with shaggy, thick fur~which is perfect for her windy and cold mountain farm~ would yield her less at market.

I would have to agree with the older farmers....even a Hereford brings less than an Angus in that area. Angus cattle are king and Hampshire sheep and their crosses rule the shows and markets.

I've always wondered if that is purely a regional thing in WV or if that is the norm in other places also?

 

[ShadyAcres]

Does this customer usually only pick docked sheep? If so, could it be that he is used to buying meat sheep that have been docked and associates docking with better, meatier sheep as opposed to those with tails?

This guy just typically wants the biggest. Sex age etc has no importance to him. Loves cull ewes. And when he calls, he asks if I have any Goats available.... The tail on the lambs just makes the rump look longer - narrower? No tails, rumps look rounder. Wish I took pictures before they were gone.

Do you think the kids who show Dorper in meat classes at 4-H dock and shave because they know they have no way of winning anything if their lambs aren't looking like the rest of the meat breeds? Or do they have different judging standards for hair breeds that encourages leaving the tails and natural hair growth but the kids still dock and shave because they feel they can't really compete with the other breeds in the market class due to being judged against a field of docked and clipped lambs?

A lot of the fairs here (TN) now have classes for Dorpers. Some Dorpers are still shown in Hair class. I assume since all in the class were Dorper and all were shaved / docked it is a requirement, but don't know for sure.

 

[TexasShepherdess]

regarding cattle-the "angus angus angus" mindset of some is partyly due to that angus IS considered by many to be a very good breed in terms of what commerical cattlemen consider "ideal"..and partly due to the intense marketing done by the Angus assoc..

I like a mix of Angus with some Brahma influence in there for our hot summers..my cows will be out grazing when others are panting in the shade..plus I do love the look of brahma blood..

regarding docking and such. I know alot of hair sheep people..some dock, some don't..the "Extreme docking" I think is done mainly by people who breed alot of purebred stock or show their stock. My ram came from a show program..he just never got tall enough for his breeder's liking..(hence my getting him)..but he has NO tail. I had always been taught to dock the tail where the "skin crosses"..which leaves a tiny "nub".

I have two ewes now with undocked tails, bought them that way..while the "health benefit" of tail docking is not a big deal with hair sheep..I still dock mine to leave a nub..I was told undocked tails can be counted off if showing (not sure why)..

Regarding the clipping..I actually have NO problem with that..my biggest peeve with showing cattle is how hair can be manipulated to "Fix" things on the cattle..with slick shearing, there is NO hiding..what you see is what you get..and I feel its a more honest type of showing. So while it's a pain to have to clip our hair ewe..I am OK with it..it will showcase my lamb's TRUE conformation.

Our stockshow requires ALL sheep, unless its a finewool breeding ewe, to be slick sheared...so many shows require the slick shearing..

I know with Dorpers, traditionaly in Africa, they are allowed to be shown with about 2 inches of hair..but not here in the states.