Is it normal for male ram sheep to violently headbutt the walls?

[alsea1]

I think it is a "I'm tough and powerfull"thing

 

[soarwitheagles]

Well, I thought I would give a quick update!

I spent an entire half day building a "corral" around the manger to stop the ram from breaking the walls [see pic].

Male ram continued to violently head butt the manger day and night, over and over, and over again.

It got real irritating. Local rancher offered to take him and traded a much younger, more respectful ram for this headbuttin' meanie...

New ram is so much better...yep, a real gentleman with the ladies. And no headbutting at all.

The headbutter ram, got his butt kicked. The very first day, he broke my friend's fence. Second day, he was head butting many of the other rams. Third day, he very suddenly turned into a very delicious mouth watering finger licking' barbecue.

Never a dull moment on these ranches...that's for sure!

 

[Baymule]

There is no reason to keep a mean animal, even a chicken. You did the right thing in trading for a nicer ram. We bought a Dorper ram in June and he was 8 months old then. Now he is a year old and is still very well behaved. I keep an eye on him, but all he does is come up every so often, wanting under his chin scratched.

 

[soarwitheagles]

There is no reason to keep a mean animal, even a chicken. You did the right thing in trading for a nicer ram. We bought a Dorper ram in June and he was 8 months old then. Now he is a year old and is still very well behaved. I keep an eye on him, but all he does is come up every so often, wanting under his chin scratched.

Yes, I totally agree with you Baymule. Two years ago, we had super mean roosters. They kept attacking me. One day, they made deep scratches on the front of both legs. I shot one. Next one, I kicked...but too hard [forgot we were not playing soccer]. He died the next day. Third rooster, simply broke its neck and had him for dinner. We no longer keep roosters...only laying hens.

We just now starting to have a challenge with our rams fighting. Several of the ewes have been going into heat. The new ram is head butting our California Red ram as well as the younger 8-9 month old rams. Each of the rams appears to be competing for who gets the most boom boom times with each ewe. Today, I saw three different rams impregnate the same ewe over and over again. I am not so sure that is a good idea...

I think it is time to separate the rams before they injure or kill each other.

So today, I worked on finishing a new paddock with a nice gate. I hope to have it completed tomorrow, then separate 5 rams from the flock, then let the large ram have all the fun.

Please let me know if this is a good decision.

Thank you,

Soar

 

[Baymule]

You have a lot of rams.....how many ewes do you have?

 

[Bossroo]

The time honored ewe to ram ratio is 32 to 1. Any more rams and your holding costs totaly outway any perceived benefits that dig deep into profits .

 

[soarwitheagles]

You have a lot of rams.....how many ewes do you have?

I believe we have 15 ewes and 9 rams.

The time honored ewe to ram ratio is 32 to 1. Any more rams and your holding costs totaly outway any perceived benefits that dig deep into profits .

Bossroo,

Wow, I never realized that! Thank you for sharing your insights. To be honest with you, we were a little disappointed this year...for every lamb born, we had a ratio of 4:1. 4 ram lambs for every ewe lamb. That was kinda disappointing because we wanted all females for breeding purposes. I tried to sell the ram lambs during the Ramadan holiday [best prices here], but no one bought any due to being too small. Now I am hoping to let these ram lambs fatten up another 6 months, then sell around the Easter holiday.

As a side note, I have learned that raising American Blackbellies for meat is not very cost effective [I have invested well over $6000 in initial livestock purchases, hay, grain, fencing, gates, medicine, etc.]. The only income we have received is we traded 3 lambs for 50 hours of outside labor.

I hope to sell the entire flock next year for $4000. So this equates to a large business loss, especially when you include my own personal labor of over 500 hours.

My plan is to sell off the entire flock of American Blackbellies, then purchase 30-50 very young Dorpers at the local auction. The Dorpers achieve selling weight at 3-5 months, whereas the American Blackbellies require 18 months before reaching selling weight.

Wow, what a painful fiscal adventure and learning experience!

 

[Baymule]

@soarwitheagles I had the advantage of living in town and wanting. Wanting sheep, but nowhere to have them, so I studied. I studied for several years and @Bossroo was elemental in my decision to go with Dorpers. To be sure, we bought 4 Katahdin/Dorper cross ewes, bred to a Katahdin ram. It was a starting point. We kept 2 of the ewe lambs and sold 2 1/2 lambs for $6 a pound, hanging weight, plus processing. The other half of the lamb is in OUR freezer. LOL We bought a Dorper ram and put him with the flock in July. I will gradually buy up, buy better ewes that are Dorpers and improve my flock.

Cultivate customers for your lambs. Tell people that you are raising lambs for sale. If they invoke and interest, ask if they want to be put on your "lamb list". I enter their name, number and information in my cell phone on the spot. I think telling people I have a waiting list for my lamb makes them eager to be added to the list. haha My sales are small, but so is my flock. I hope to grow my customer base as my flock grows.

I would like to get registered Dorpers so I could sell the best as breeding stock and the rest for meat. That is in the future, right now I need to learn more about keeping sheep.

You and I both are in the right place to learn what is best for us and our sheep. We will go down the learning path together!

Bossroo, thank you so much for your advice on this forum. I learn something every time you post. I didn't know the ram to ewe ratio and now, knowing that, I am more knowledgeable than I was 10 minutes ago.

 

[norseofcourse]

I have 1 ram and 4 ewes - but I'm sure Elding would be happier with 28 more ewes to chase and court and keep watch over

There are a few reasons to keep more than one ram for a small flock, such as having two different breeds, or keeping unrelated rams so you can 'outcross' offspring and keep from inbreeding too closely. But it's proportionately a larger expense, especially for animals you only need for a brief amount of time per year.

I have kept one of Elding's offspring so far, and I may keep another from this year's lambs. I won't inbreed more than one generation, though, so I know I will eventually have to replace Elding, as the daughters of his that I've kept get older. He gets stupid during the breeding season, but he's manageable, and luckily he does not get destructive.

@soarwitheagles - I wanted boys this year, for the faster growth rate - and I got 6 girls and 1 boy! The law of averages works in mysterious ways sometimes.

If you are marketing for Ramadan or any of the other holidays, check the calendar for the next few years. Those holidays move around, you may need to breed earlier and earlier to have lambs the right age/weight for them. Some breeds will breed 'out of season' easier than others. Not sure where you are, but there may be some months of the year you might not want to be lambing, if you're too far north and aren't set up for it. Good luck!

 

[soarwitheagles]

@soarwitheagles I had the advantage of living in town and wanting. Wanting sheep, but nowhere to have them, so I studied. I studied for several years and @Bossroo was elemental in my decision to go with Dorpers. To be sure, we bought 4 Katahdin/Dorper cross ewes, bred to a Katahdin ram. It was a starting point. We kept 2 of the ewe lambs and sold 2 1/2 lambs for $6 a pound, hanging weight, plus processing. The other half of the lamb is in OUR freezer. LOL We bought a Dorper ram and put him with the flock in July. I will gradually buy up, buy better ewes that are Dorpers and improve my flock.

Cultivate customers for your lambs. Tell people that you are raising lambs for sale. If they invoke and interest, ask if they want to be put on your "lamb list". I enter their name, number and information in my cell phone on the spot. I think telling people I have a waiting list for my lamb makes them eager to be added to the list. haha My sales are small, but so is my flock. I hope to grow my customer base as my flock grows.

I would like to get registered Dorpers so I could sell the best as breeding stock and the rest for meat. That is in the future, right now I need to learn more about keeping sheep.

You and I both are in the right place to learn what is best for us and our sheep. We will go down the learning path together!

Bossroo, thank you so much for your advice on this forum. I learn something every time you post. I didn't know the ram to ewe ratio and now, knowing that, I am more knowledgeable than I was 10 minutes ago.

Baymule,

Very nice story! And your patience finally paid off! $6 a pound sure is nice. I am happy to hear it is going well with you there. Keep up the good job! You have a small flock and that is ok. For 5 months of the year, we have enough green grass, hay, clover, etc. to feed 50-100 head of sheep with no costs except the initial seed costs. So that is why we are looking to populate with larger numbers.

Originally, I purchased the AB's simply because they are considered by many to be the lowest maintenance sheep on the planet. Being a total rookie and also a full time school teacher, that is why I purchased them. Oh, also, a good neighbor took me under his wings and he is the rancher that sold me the AB's. Spending quality time over and over with him for the last 9 months has been a treasure, so I have no regrets. Now he is a good friend and good friends are very hard to find these days. So for me, he is a precious person and I love to hang out with him and he is worth more to me than all the sheep in the world.

I sure hope I do not sound mean, cold, cruel and greedy, but waiting 18 months for a sheep to obtain selling weight is simply way too long for us. I originally purchased the sheep because I was tired of mowing the fields every year, spending upwards of 5+ hours a week doing the mowing. So I was looking for good lawn mowing sheep at first. Then, summer kicked in...I have had to purchase so much darn hay and clover and alfalfa and these slow growing sheep keep eating more and more and more! We are presently over $1000 for the year in hay and feed costs. There goes my profits. Keeping these sheep is beginning to be more expensive than the lawn mower maintenance and the gas to run the lawn mower! So I feel as if we are defeating one of the main purposes of keeping sheep.

So, here is my plan. I hope to cut down another acre of Eucalyptus trees, and make it into the tenth paddock. The local UC Davis extension professor is coming over next Monday to give me some irrigated pasture growing tips. I think I may try to grow half of the paddocks with annual rye and clover, the other half of the paddocks with a mix of orchard grass, tall fescue, trefoil, and perennial rye.

I will experiment this fall [next week] with a much larger fava bean planting and then try my hand at making silage in April with the fava beans. Finally, in April, I may try to plant an acre or so of corn and try my hand with the making of silage again.

Somewhere in all this plan, I hope to sell the entire flock of AB's and with the proceeds, purchase 30, 50, 100 baby Dorper lambs.

Finally, after I become very rich from selling the fat Dorpers, perhaps I can move to the Bahama's, retire early, buy a hammock, and drink lots of coconut juice.

Ok, just joking about the Bahama's part, but for real with the rest of the plan. Please let me know if you have any suggestions!

I have 1 ram and 4 ewes - but I'm sure Elding would be happier with 28 more ewes to chase and court and keep watch over

There are a few reasons to keep more than one ram for a small flock, such as having two different breeds, or keeping unrelated rams so you can 'outcross' offspring and keep from inbreeding too closely. But it's proportionately a larger expense, especially for animals you only need for a brief amount of time per year.

I have kept one of Elding's offspring so far, and I may keep another from this year's lambs. I won't inbreed more than one generation, though, so I know I will eventually have to replace Elding, as the daughters of his that I've kept get older. He gets stupid during the breeding season, but he's manageable, and luckily he does not get destructive.

@soarwitheagles - I wanted boys this year, for the faster growth rate - and I got 6 girls and 1 boy! The law of averages works in mysterious ways sometimes.

If you are marketing for Ramadan or any of the other holidays, check the calendar for the next few years. Those holidays move around, you may need to breed earlier and earlier to have lambs the right age/weight for them. Some breeds will breed 'out of season' easier than others. Not sure where you are, but there may be some months of the year you might not want to be lambing, if you're too far north and aren't set up for it. Good luck!

Norse,

I kept the rams because most people would only pay $50-$75 for such small animals, and that isn't worth the time we put into them. We did have a surprise California Red ram born here, and we may keep him. He is a monster, very handsome, incredibly big and incredibly strong. I think he impregnated a couple of the AB ewe's in the last couple of months, so it will be nice to see what type of animal arrives from this unusual union.

Both AB's and Dorpers will breed all year round [we are having new lambs nearly every month since January]. The weather here is such that it rarely goes below freezing, so I think the sheep will be ok dropping lambs year round. The greatest problem we had was when a ewe gave birth to twins in July when the temps were 105F+. Almost lost both of them. I had to run to TS for hydration fluids, drips, etc. Both of these lambs made it, but they each required extra special care for the first week of their life [as in put them in a cooler for hours at a time]!

Yes, I hear you on cross breeding. We brought in a new AB ram from different stock a few months ago and he is doing his job well.

The nice thing about the Dorpers, supposedly, they reach selling weight 3-5 months after birth, but you can also sell them right up to one year of age without having to worry about the "mutton" taste. So that makes this breed of sheep very attractive to us. Our rancher friend tells us the best selling times are Ramadan, Christmas and Easter.

Finally, sure wish we had gotten your nice ratio of girls to boys!

Hopefully we will do better next year!

Have a great day everyone!