norseofcourse's journal - spring and show update

[bonbean01]

YAY!!!! And what a cutie!!! Congrats

 

[norseofcourse]

Things are going fairly well. The sheep have been getting time in the horses pasture nearly every day, eating a lot and helping clear the pasture at the same time. The lambs are growing fast! The adults still aren't completely shedded out - Elding nearly is, but the others are far behind him. I may take the scissors to some of them soon.

Brosa's lamb will be two weeks old tomorrow, and he's growing well. Brosa doesn't let him play with the other lambs very much! I think she just wants to keep her little guy safe. I want to get pictures of him with the other lambs to show the size difference (and the incredible cuteness), but it's either too dark, raining, or Brosa is keeping the other lambs away. I'll get good pics eventually.

Thursday evening, I took a small plastic cup out to the barn to try milking Brosa - it was 9 days after her lamb was born, so I figured any colostrum was long gone. After they ate, I knelt beside her and got some milk, maybe a teaspoon. It looked ok... now what do I do with it? I decided if a teaspoon of milk was gonna kill me, I may as well get it over with, so I drank it! It was slightly sweet, and very rich tasting.

That got me excited about finishing the milk stand, so I got that done Saturday, and set it up in the run-in area of the barn with a small fence panel around it. It's just basically a platform a foot high. Part of the front is there, but not the crosspiece to put a feed tub on - I wasn't sure what height would work. So for now I'm just putting a feed pan on the platform.

I decided to work with both Brosa and Gracie. First was the fun of getting just ONE of them in the little pen, especially once all the sheep realized there was food involved! They sorta know their names, which helped a little. Some quick maneuvering got Gracie in, and with the food I was able to tempt her into getting at least her front feet on the stand. I handled her udder as she ate, and she kicked some but not too bad. Then it was Brosa's turn. I got her in, and she got up on the stand once, but didn't seem comfortable there, so she got down. I finally got her partly on again with the grain, and handled her udder a little, too, but didn't get any actual milk. This was Saturday evening.

Sunday we had two sessions, morning and evening. Gracie got all the way on the stand both times, although she kicked as I handled her udder. Brosa still wasn't happy about getting on the stand, and kicked but less than Gracie. Still haven't gotten a drop out of either of them...

I am not a morning person, so through the week it's likely to be just evening sessions. So, this evening Gracie came in first and hopped right up on the stand, even before I'd put the grain down! I put her pellets in, and spend a few minutes handling her teats and getting kicked. I think she slowed down the kicks near the end

Next was Brosa, and this time I got her standing all the way on the milk stand, without much hesitation, so I was happy for her progress! However, Brosa proceeded to show me that she could kick nearly as well as her mom... sigh. I am hoping that in time, all the handling I've done with her will help.

So, the Great Milking Experiment is coming along slowly. Maybe someday I'll get some actual milk!

 

[norseofcourse]

Two more days of attempted sheep milking, and not much progress. They're both jumping right up onto the milk stand well, but they're both still kicking when I handle their udders. I tried putting my fingers gently around one teat and hold still, and tonight Gracie paused in her kicking a couple of times, but kicked again when I moved my hand. Brosa was about the same. I still haven't managed to get a single drop of milk, except for that one time earlier when I milked Brosa a bit, before I had the milk stand finished and set up. I have to be either more stubborn than the sheep, or smarter, and I'm not sure which.... lol

 

[purplequeenvt]

In my experience with milking sheep (I was milking 3 at least once a day for a while this spring), you have to jump in and take charge. Don't let them dictate how things are run. The 3 sheep that I was milking are not milk sheep and had never been milked before. They either lost their lamb/s or rejected them and, since we had so many bottle babies and needed extra milk, they got milked. The first few milkings were hard and it took 2 of us to do it - I milked and my sister held a back leg. They got the idea pretty quickly and I was able to milk by myself without much fighting. Still a little stomping, but not as much.

We do not give them any grain on the stand. This goes for our milk goats and the cow as well. They behave so much better if we take the grain out of the picture. When we first started, they'd get a little treat while still on the stand AFTER we were done milking, but after a while they'd just hop off and get their normal grain ration later with the rest of the flock.

Milking will be painfully slow if you just pinch the teat. Here's a video that shows the process better than I can explain it.....

Good luck!

 

[norseofcourse]

@purplequeenvt - thanks, that was great! I don't have someone else to help me, but I will do my best this evening to take charge! I also had the thought today to put a large plastic bucket under their udder, to help block their kicks. I had just been trying to milk into a smaller cup, guess I was thinking since I wasn't going to get much, I only needed a small container.

One of the things the guy in the video said concerns me: "when the teats are small it's almost impossible to get the milk out without mastitis setting in" - my sheep's teats are small compared to his sheep. In your experience, did you have any trouble with mastitis? Are there ways to help make mastitis less likely? I wasn't planning on a teat dip afterwards, as the lambs go to nurse mom not long after the milking sessions, and I've read when the lambs are still on the mom, don't use a teat dip.

Also, the guy in the video milked both teats at the same time. The few other times I've seen people milk goats or cows, they alternated left, right, left, right (a regular rhythm, so there's always milk hissing into the bucket, hope I'm explaining it right). Does it matter?

 

[norseofcourse]

Well - some success... I went out tonight with my bucket and more determined attitude! Gracie came into the pen first, I got her to hop up on the milk stand with a small amount of pellets. I quickly rearranged the pen's fencing so she was fenced in on three sides, with the back open and just enough room for me to stand behind her and milk - I figured without a helper, this arrangement might help keep them in place. I had the plastic bucket ready and put it behind her, slightly between her back legs, and started.

Gracie wasn't happy. She kept turning around, and I'd turn her back. I'd take ahold of her udder above a teat, and she'd kick, fidget, and turn around again. The bucket kept moving, so I finally took it down off the stand. The empty feed pan was getting kicked around all over the stand, so I set that down beside me, too. I hated to milk right on the stand, but that's what I ended up doing, because eventually, finally, I got some milk!!! It squirted onto the milk stand, down into the feed pan by my feet, onto the ground, and probably onto me... lol. I got at least a few squirts out of each side (one side at a time, the other hand was busy holding onto Gracie to try and keep her from moving as much). I started at her udder a little above each teat, and her teats fit quite comfortably in my hand. By this time she was not resisting quite as much, so I stopped, and fed her a few pellets out of my hand in the hopes of giving her something good to end on. She left the pen quite readily when I opened the door though!

Next was Brosa - it wasn't too hard to get her into the pen, but she didn't want to jump up on the stand. I didn't notice where she was while I was milking Gracie, but she was probably watching. I finally boosted her up onto the stand, and got her to stay there with some pellets long enough to fasten the panels in place. I put the bucket up behind her, and I really hoped this would go easier - I was wrong. If anything, Brosa was worse than her mom. She's smaller, so it was easier for her to turn around and face me. I had to keep turning her back around. I'd hold her with one hand, and with the other attempt to milk. As with Gracie, the bucket and feed pan soon hit the floor. Then Brosa pooped all over the stand... She eventually stopped turning around as much, but then she kept kicking, and stomping, and twisting her body, thoroughly mad at me. Luckily she didn't try to go straight up and over the fence panel in front of her, because I'm not sure I could have held her if she'd tried that. Her teats were smaller than Gracie's, but not too bad, and by her second freshening they should be better. I kept at it, and finally in my hand I felt the warmth and wetness of some milk! By now I didn't care where it went, and I was able to get a little bit of milk from each side, with her finally, slightly, less un-cooperative. I put some pellets in the feed pan and let her eat before I let her out of the pen, in hopes she also might think it ended on a good note.

It seemed like forever, but I probably only spent about five minutes with Gracie, and not much more with Brosa. I know it was stressful for them, so I considered a few successful squirts from each side enough to stop. I was really worried I'd destroyed any trust they had in me, but as I was feeding everyone and filling water buckets, I walked right by Gracie and she didn't take off. And Brosa came up to me to have her head scratched after everyone ate. Tomorrow's session may be the real test though, if I can even get them into the pen... wish me luck!

 

[norseofcourse]

Session two of more-determined milking! I was somewhat surprised, but happy, that I didn't have much trouble getting them into the pen. The sight of that feed pan must cause some memory loss for sheep . Brosa came into the pen first, and she was still reluctant to hop up onto the stand, but with some pellets and a little bit of boosting, I got her up. I got the fence panel secured, then held her the same as yesterday and started trying to milk. Again she struggled, turned around, stomped and kicked, but not quite as badly as yesterday. And again she pooped, but only a small amount. It only took a few minutes before I was able to get a few squirts out of each teat . I stopped when she allowed me to do that without moving around quite as much, then I put a bit more pellets in the dish and let her eat them, then let her out of the pen.

Then it wasn't hard to tempt Gracie in, and she hopped right up on the stand and ate the few pellets in the dish as I fastened the panel shut. I went to hold onto her at her neck, but youch! she had a thorny branch in her neck wool, so I had to disentangle that first. Got ahold again, and like Brosa, she still struggled and turned around and kicked, but not quite as much as yesterday. It wasn't long before I got a few squirts out of each teat, and when she stood still as I milked, I stopped and gave her a few more pellets before I let her out. And she didn't run out of the pen like she had the day before! She actually stopped at the pen's gate, and I talked to her and scratched her head .

The lambs are really growing well. I'm giving everyone some pellets and corn twice a day, and about a week ago one of the twins got curious about what all the big sheep were so interested in, and he now pushes in for a bit of whatever he can get. Yesterday, Rose's lamb pushed her way in, too, and got a little taste. The other twin was hanging back today behind everyone, but it looks like he's wondering what he's missing out on! And Brosa's little one is too small yet to try pushing his way in.

I think at least one of the twins is moorit grey, which is a brown outer coat, with a white or cream undercoat. The other one might be, also. That means Gracie carries the pattern gene for grey. Hmmm, that means her other lamb must be grey, since it can only be one of the patterns its parents carry - Elding carries only solid pattern, Gracie has white and grey - so it can't be solid, since solid is recessive and it would need a solid gene from each parent to be that; it's not white; so it must be moorit grey also. The genetics are fun to puzzle out!

 

[norseofcourse]

Day three - mixed results. Gracie came right into the pen for pellets and got up onto the stand. She was slightly better than yesterday, and it didn't take very long to get a few squirts of milk out of her. She either didn't have much, or wasn't letting it down, but I was happy with how she did so I ended there.

Brosa came into the pen fairly easily for pellets too, and I was able to get her onto the stand with some coaxing. But her behavior was just as bad as the first time... if not a bit worse. It was about all I could do to keep hold of her and try to keep her in place, as I kept the other hand on her udder and tried to milk when I could. She wasn't scared of me afterwards though, so it's not me, it must be that I'm trying to take milk away from her lamb. On the plus side, when she did pause long enough for me to milk, it was fairly easy to get a nice squirt of milk going.

I think since it's just me, I need to rig something up to help. Tomorrow I'm going to put a short tether by the stand, that I can attach a collar to.

 

[norseofcourse]

I rigged up a cotton rope at the milking stand today, with a neckrope ring so I could just snap it around their neck, and it won't tighten down. I tied it to the round pen panel that goes along that side of the pen - it's not going anywhere, no matter how much they pull.

Brosa actually came in the pen first - after yesterday I'd figured she wouldn't want to come in that pen at all! But she got on the milk stand with just a little coaxing and a little grain in the feed pan. I snapped the rope around her neck as she ate the pellets. Once she ate them all and she realized she was tied, she wasn't happy - but she didn't throw nearly the hissyfit that I thought she would. She did poop once... will that stop? How do you teach them to 'go' before they get on the milkstand? lol

Gracie came in next and also hopped up on the stand for a few pellets as I put the neckrope on her. She also wasn't happy to be tied, but she seemed to accept it fairly well after awhile.

For each of them, once they stood fairly quietly as I got a bit of milk out of each teat, I stopped. I put a few more pellets in the feed pan, then unhooked the neckrope.

I haven't got enough milk yet to keep and try to do anything with, but now that I think I've got the physical setup working better, that's my next goal

 

[frustratedearthmother]

Sounds like you're making progress... sometimes baby steps are the way to go. I'll bet they come around soon enough.