Bruce
Herd Master
Wow, amazing the bees made it through!
When you get the hook and eye catches, get the kind with spring latches, they won't rattle loose.
Quick and easy cattle panel hoola-hoop house
- Thread starter soarwitheagles
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Wow, amazing the bees made it through!
When you get the hook and eye catches, get the kind with spring latches, they won't rattle loose.
Beekissed
Herd Master
I never stated one should just put the sheep out there and let them live or die....I was commenting on the wisdom of putting them and yourself in needless stress by having lambs dropping in the worst weather of the year. There's a huge difference.
And, no, I'm not the grim reaper
I love sheep...but, yes, I do not mind culling hard to achieve a stronger, healthier flock. That's called farming in years and not in seasons. If all you do is plan for the next season and how your flock will do in that next season, your goals are all short term and won't actually develop your flock. A healthy, strong flock produces better and more lambs that make it to market....that's pretty much a fact. Vet bills, medicines, milk replacer...all these things cost money and often more than that lamb will bring at market.
I don't think it's too harsh at all to cull ewes that prolapse after lambing, have repeated difficulty with lambing, have other continued health problems, or have stillborn lambs. Or even to cull lambs that had a general failure to thrive under optimal conditions. It's just good business and it builds a better flock.
From my reading, if you use the lemongrass oil, a little dab will do ya. Just a drop spread on the tops of a couple of frames. The bees will smell it and have to go completely through the hive to get to the source of the smell. Too much is not a good thing. Everything I've read also says 10' height for the capture boxes.
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- #74
soarwitheagles
True BYH Addict
Bruce, thanks for the heads up on those hook and eye items with the spring latches. Will do! And I agree...I am amazed the hives made it through that type of storm. As mentioned before, the lids were off during the largest storm for 1.5 days. I have no idea how they made it. I will call and ask a master beekeeper later this week.
Beekissed, I apologize! I was only trying to be funny by using the term Grim Reaper. Is it ok if I use the term Happy and Grinning Ear-to-Ear Reaper?
Just messin' with you and I hope I did not offend you.
I like your idea of culling, and to be honest with you, I would like to begin culling...but not until our flock becomes significantly larger! Here is a list of the sheep I would like to cull and I do not mind if you call me the Grim Reaper:
1. Sniveler sheep [we have a couple of adult ewe sheep that snivel and cry baby way too much and it is so irritating. The other sheep are super quiet].
2. Ewes that have been giving single births for two years in a row [we would like twins and triples please].
3. Smaller framed ewes [we have some larger AB ewes, some smaller. The smaller ones keep giving birth to smaller lambs that overall become smaller animals when they grow up and mature].
4. Rams and ewes that do not measure up to the AB standards [http://www.blackbellysheep.org/about-the-sheep/american-blackbelly/]
5. Mean spirited and ornery rams that head butt too much [we already sold him and he became roasted mutton for the buyers].
Here is our problem with culling according to my above mentioned categories: We would lose half our flock or more! So we would like to build up quite a bit more before I can happily fulfill the role of the Grim Reaper! I would hate to fall into the category called, "No more left to reap because you culled too many too soon."
Beekissed, I must confess, I felt a little like a "Grim Reaper" every time I sold a lamb at Christmas time. No, I did not actually slit its throat and watch it bleed out, but I knew full well each lamb had less than 24 hours to live after leaving our ranch. Each one of those lambs were incredibly well behaved and super nice and I could not have asked for better sheep. So in a way, I am guilty of slaughtering innocent lambs...
I hope you do not see me as hard-hearted, but it sure would be nice to have enough sheep to be able to cull and thereby improve the integrity of the flock!
Latestarter, we grow lemon grass here [it is super easy to grow], so we simply yank some off the plant, tie it in a knot, then wipe the entire inside of the box with the actual live lemon grass.
I hope we can post many pictures this year of captured swarms. To the best of my knowledge, the Africanized Bees have not made it this far north, so we should be fairly safe...but I will continue to exercise caution with captured swarms...
Beekissed, I apologize! I was only trying to be funny by using the term Grim Reaper. Is it ok if I use the term Happy and Grinning Ear-to-Ear Reaper?
Just messin' with you and I hope I did not offend you.
I like your idea of culling, and to be honest with you, I would like to begin culling...but not until our flock becomes significantly larger! Here is a list of the sheep I would like to cull and I do not mind if you call me the Grim Reaper:
1. Sniveler sheep [we have a couple of adult ewe sheep that snivel and cry baby way too much and it is so irritating. The other sheep are super quiet].
2. Ewes that have been giving single births for two years in a row [we would like twins and triples please].
3. Smaller framed ewes [we have some larger AB ewes, some smaller. The smaller ones keep giving birth to smaller lambs that overall become smaller animals when they grow up and mature].
4. Rams and ewes that do not measure up to the AB standards [http://www.blackbellysheep.org/about-the-sheep/american-blackbelly/]
5. Mean spirited and ornery rams that head butt too much [we already sold him and he became roasted mutton for the buyers].
Here is our problem with culling according to my above mentioned categories: We would lose half our flock or more! So we would like to build up quite a bit more before I can happily fulfill the role of the Grim Reaper! I would hate to fall into the category called, "No more left to reap because you culled too many too soon."
Beekissed, I must confess, I felt a little like a "Grim Reaper" every time I sold a lamb at Christmas time. No, I did not actually slit its throat and watch it bleed out, but I knew full well each lamb had less than 24 hours to live after leaving our ranch. Each one of those lambs were incredibly well behaved and super nice and I could not have asked for better sheep. So in a way, I am guilty of slaughtering innocent lambs...
I hope you do not see me as hard-hearted, but it sure would be nice to have enough sheep to be able to cull and thereby improve the integrity of the flock!
Latestarter, we grow lemon grass here [it is super easy to grow], so we simply yank some off the plant, tie it in a knot, then wipe the entire inside of the box with the actual live lemon grass.
I hope we can post many pictures this year of captured swarms. To the best of my knowledge, the Africanized Bees have not made it this far north, so we should be fairly safe...but I will continue to exercise caution with captured swarms...
Bruce
Herd Master
I don't have a breeding flock of anything so I'm talking through my hat here but:
Is there much value in continuing to breed with the ones you wish you could cull for the stated reasons??
#1 I don't know if sniveling has a gene attached to it. If not, those would be worth keeping if they are throwing good lambs and at least twins. Ear plugs are cheap
#2 My Dad and step mother raised sheep for some years and like you (and everyone else I'm sure) bred for twins.
#3 Um, sounds like you are running in reverse with these girls.
I don't know how you improve a closed flock with those girls as the basis.
Would it be worth your time and money to sell the ones you want to cull and buy a few better girls? Might be a small step backward before great strides forward?
Is there much value in continuing to breed with the ones you wish you could cull for the stated reasons??
#1 I don't know if sniveling has a gene attached to it. If not, those would be worth keeping if they are throwing good lambs and at least twins. Ear plugs are cheap
#2 My Dad and step mother raised sheep for some years and like you (and everyone else I'm sure) bred for twins.
#3 Um, sounds like you are running in reverse with these girls.
I don't know how you improve a closed flock with those girls as the basis.
Would it be worth your time and money to sell the ones you want to cull and buy a few better girls? Might be a small step backward before great strides forward?
Beekissed
Herd Master
Bruce, I agree. I don't see the benefit in breeding culls as you may merely get even more culls and pretty soon you have a whole herd of culls, so you are right back where you started, having to take the herd down to the bare minimum to weed out the culls.
Culling doesn't mean you have to thin the herd down to nothing...it merely means you thin out the bad, breed the good and even buy some to replace the culls if you feel they would benefit the overall breeding program. One good sheep is worth two culls, so sell two and use the combined money to buy one better one...if she's any good at all, she'll have two more just like herself the next time she lambs, so you are ahead by one at that point. You can make some pretty fast gains with hair sheep.
Even if you have to cull the whole herd down to one ram and two ewes, you are starting out with something better than you had and those good sheep can multiply fast. It's just as easy to feed a good sheep as a bad one, I heard one old farmer say.
Culling doesn't mean you have to thin the herd down to nothing...it merely means you thin out the bad, breed the good and even buy some to replace the culls if you feel they would benefit the overall breeding program. One good sheep is worth two culls, so sell two and use the combined money to buy one better one...if she's any good at all, she'll have two more just like herself the next time she lambs, so you are ahead by one at that point. You can make some pretty fast gains with hair sheep.
Even if you have to cull the whole herd down to one ram and two ewes, you are starting out with something better than you had and those good sheep can multiply fast. It's just as easy to feed a good sheep as a bad one, I heard one old farmer say.
babsbag
Herd Master
I asked about the lemongrass oil as that I have since I use it in some of my lotions that I make, I don't have any lemongrass itself. I will put a few drops in and see what happens. Now to find a tree with easy access...meaning growing in a level enough area to get a ladder up to it easily. At my place I should just buy ladders with one legs longer than the other.
Most people I know that raise sheep don't want triplets as the ewe often can't raise 3 and if they do try they are smaller to start and don't grow as well.
Most people I know that raise sheep don't want triplets as the ewe often can't raise 3 and if they do try they are smaller to start and don't grow as well.
- Thread starter
- #78
soarwitheagles
True BYH Addict
I don't have a breeding flock of anything so I'm talking through my hat here but:
Is there much value in continuing to breed with the ones you wish you could cull for the stated reasons??
#1 I don't know if sniveling has a gene attached to it. If not, those would be worth keeping if they are throwing good lambs and at least twins. Ear plugs are cheap
#2 My Dad and step mother raised sheep for some years and like you (and everyone else I'm sure) bred for twins.
#3 Um, sounds like you are running in reverse with these girls.
I don't know how you improve a closed flock with those girls as the basis.
Would it be worth your time and money to sell the ones you want to cull and buy a few better girls? Might be a small step backward before great strides forward?
Well said Bruce! I am so thankful for the people here at BYH. Once again, you have helped me think things through and discover there is a much better way to manage our flock.
So, here are the recent decisions we made:
1. Cull all animals that do not meet our criteria.
2. Ask our local ranchers to keep their eyes out for AB's that do meet our criteria.
3. Purchase AB's that do meet our criteria.
4. Live happily every after with a higher quality flock of sheep!
Beekissed,
If only we had asked you one year ago when we began this adventure! After reading your post several times, it made total sense. So we have decided to follow your good advice [see our updated plan above please].
Thanks again for sharing and enriching our lives as well as the life of our flock!
UPDATE #1 ON THE HOOP HOUSE:
I leveled the floor, and made it ready. Tonight we are suppose to see the beginning of another winter storm. So we look forward to seeing if any of the sheep go into this shelter. I think I know one way of making it appear more appealing...simply add a bed of hay?
UPDATE #2 New additions [see pic].
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babsbag
Herd Master
Those are adorable lambs, I can see the attraction; at least for me there would be as I like eye candy.
I thought that you were going to get rid of the AB sheep and get Dorpers? (or was it Kathadins?) Weren't you wanting sheep that get to market weight faster?
I am hoping that this storm is "normal", a little rain, a little wind, and then gone.
I thought that you were going to get rid of the AB sheep and get Dorpers? (or was it Kathadins?) Weren't you wanting sheep that get to market weight faster?
I am hoping that this storm is "normal", a little rain, a little wind, and then gone.
- Thread starter
- #80
soarwitheagles
True BYH Addict
Babs,
I was planning on getting rid of the AB flock...selling the entire flock, then switch over to the Dorpers. But the problem is...I really like AB's a lot and can't at this time find the strength and desire to sell off the entire flock. There is something about them that I really like...and I think it is their similarity to deer. I am finding them such a beautiful animal, whereas [and I hope I do not offend anyone], the Dorpers to me are not as attractive. So as you can see, I am in a bit of a dilemma.
For me, it is a battle between beauty and money...that plain and simple. The Dorpers are a very nice sheep, but they always appear super dirty and the mama's do not care for their lambs like the AB's. Also, I now have a clientele that thrives on the AB's. They tell me the AB has little to no fat [but do have marble], whereas the Dorper meat is full of fat.
What to do? One idea I have is to purchase a small flock of Dorpers from the auction [I know, most people say it is a very unwise idea], and keep them separate from the AB's, and simply see how they do in comparison to the AB's. We only have 4-5 months left of incredibly luscious and free grass, legumes and forbs. So I was thinking I may try to pick up some Dorpers this week, fatten them up, then sell em' come summer time. My neighbor just asked me last week if I would put some of my sheep on his 10 acres of forest to clean it up...so that is a bit of a game changer...
I am now thinking of simply taking the risk.
Also, the second Dorper that I purchased from the auction 15 months ago as a baby lamb is so fat she can barely walk. Her utter is huge and I am thinking she will give birth in the next day or so. And here is an amazing fact: the Dorper/American Blackbelly crossed lambs are huge...yes, nearly double the size as the purebred AB's. My rancher friend has resorted to cross breeding the AB with the Dorper for the last two years and now he is getting $200-$250 per one year old ram...and these rams are humongous. I am only getting $160-$165 per ram lamb. So, as you can see, I have a lot to think about right now...
Finally, as for this storm...our weather report is showing rain for the next 7 days and large amounts of snow in the Sierra's again. Wanna know what I find both amazing and funny?
We are an hour or so away from Kirkwood. Their season total for snow is over 32 feet! Presently, they ONLY have 12 feet of snow! And there are mountains in the Sierra's that are taller than Kirkwood! Wow! What an incredibly blessing!
Your Mount Shasta presently has 80 inches of snow. In January of 2012 Mount Shasta had barely an inch of snow for most of that month...wow, wow, wow! Drought is over!
I was planning on getting rid of the AB flock...selling the entire flock, then switch over to the Dorpers. But the problem is...I really like AB's a lot and can't at this time find the strength and desire to sell off the entire flock. There is something about them that I really like...and I think it is their similarity to deer. I am finding them such a beautiful animal, whereas [and I hope I do not offend anyone], the Dorpers to me are not as attractive. So as you can see, I am in a bit of a dilemma.
For me, it is a battle between beauty and money...that plain and simple. The Dorpers are a very nice sheep, but they always appear super dirty and the mama's do not care for their lambs like the AB's. Also, I now have a clientele that thrives on the AB's. They tell me the AB has little to no fat [but do have marble], whereas the Dorper meat is full of fat.
What to do? One idea I have is to purchase a small flock of Dorpers from the auction [I know, most people say it is a very unwise idea], and keep them separate from the AB's, and simply see how they do in comparison to the AB's. We only have 4-5 months left of incredibly luscious and free grass, legumes and forbs. So I was thinking I may try to pick up some Dorpers this week, fatten them up, then sell em' come summer time. My neighbor just asked me last week if I would put some of my sheep on his 10 acres of forest to clean it up...so that is a bit of a game changer...
I am now thinking of simply taking the risk.
Also, the second Dorper that I purchased from the auction 15 months ago as a baby lamb is so fat she can barely walk. Her utter is huge and I am thinking she will give birth in the next day or so. And here is an amazing fact: the Dorper/American Blackbelly crossed lambs are huge...yes, nearly double the size as the purebred AB's. My rancher friend has resorted to cross breeding the AB with the Dorper for the last two years and now he is getting $200-$250 per one year old ram...and these rams are humongous. I am only getting $160-$165 per ram lamb. So, as you can see, I have a lot to think about right now...
Finally, as for this storm...our weather report is showing rain for the next 7 days and large amounts of snow in the Sierra's again. Wanna know what I find both amazing and funny?
We are an hour or so away from Kirkwood. Their season total for snow is over 32 feet! Presently, they ONLY have 12 feet of snow! And there are mountains in the Sierra's that are taller than Kirkwood! Wow! What an incredibly blessing!
Your Mount Shasta presently has 80 inches of snow. In January of 2012 Mount Shasta had barely an inch of snow for most of that month...wow, wow, wow! Drought is over!
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