Red's Kidding Thread - Penelope

[Goat Whisperer]

Just looked back at the pic
Is she loosing the hair on it?
It looks like it is about to burst.
You need to separate her, lance & collect ASAP

If it bursts in the same pen your other goats are, it is very likely for them to contract it too. Especially with all the rain NC is getting- they are all going to be in the shelter together.

 

[nstone630]

Just looked back at the pic
Is she loosing the hair on it?
It looks like it is about to burst.
You need to separate her, lance & collect ASAP

If it bursts in the same pen your other goats are, it is very likely for them to contract it too. Especially with all the rain NC is getting- they are all going to be in the shelter together.

She is losing the hair on it. I have no where to separate her that the other goats will never go. The only place we have to separate goats right now is the kidding stall. Which the current resident is Miracle. And obviously we don't want her in there if it is something like CL. DH and I will have to figure something out...

I purchased her in December, tested last month.

 

[Southern by choice]

Either a dog kennel or some cattle panels to make a small pen up by the house or something to that effect with a tarp over it for shelter will suffice.
lance(scalpel or exacto knife blade) over a tarp gather contents, flush with iodine - burn tarp and everything used in treatment

Wear gloves as CL is zoonotic

Wait for results.
Personally I would not want a CL goat in my herd. Having said that I think it is a decision for the herd owner to weigh carefully.

Even if it is CL I would not necessarily cull her. Retest and see what the titers are after she heals up. She may never get a lump again and if titers are low then just watch. If she ever has another lump then cull. If you are simply raising for market and the doe is good otherwise ( meaning- kids well, feeds kids adequately etc) why cull.

I say this because so few are testing their goats for CL - meat goat breeders don't care and apparently it is just something that many have but don't speak about it and they are not going to test... just as many dairy goat breeders don't test either and go by "I have never had a lump"----- until they do.

 

[nstone630]

I do have some cattle fencing. I'l see what DH can come up with. *sigh*

A decision will be made on her once testing is back. I'm discussing it with DH now about how we will proceed. I need to contact my vet as well, I'm assuming I can just drop off a nice cup full of puss to them and they can send it off for me. If she wasn't very pregnant, I'd probably cull.

I'd prefer not to have CL or any of that in my herd. With speaking to my vet when she came out there are only 2 people locally who test. And only 1 of those is a meat farm. Even the vet said "everyone around here just trades goats, and they wonder why there is a problem". Ethically I don't want to sell animals that I know have CL without notifying the buyer. But, meat goats are a terminal animal, not many I guess are concerned with it.

 

[Southern by choice]

I do have some cattle fencing. I'l see what DH can come up with. *sigh*

A decision will be made on her once testing is back. I'm discussing it with DH now about how we will proceed. I need to contact my vet as well, I'm assuming I can just drop off a nice cup full of puss to them and they can send it off for me. If she wasn't very pregnant, I'd probably cull.

I'd prefer not to have CL or any of that in my herd. With speaking to my vet when she came out there are only 2 people locally who test. And only 1 of those is a meat farm. Even the vet said "everyone around here just trades goats, and they wonder why there is a problem". Ethically I don't want to sell animals that I know have CL without notifying the buyer. But, meat goats are a terminal animal, not many I guess are concerned with it.

I do think part of it is because they are terminal, part is because it is so bad there isn't alot people can do UNLESS more people start testing and eliminating this, and the biggest part IMO is people are just simply to cheap to test.

All kinds of excuses from "not accurate", my vet says "don't bother", "I have never had a lump", too expensive... blah blah blah.
I use UC Davis and I am out of state , it is one of the more expensive labs when it comes to CL testing. But when you look at numbers...
If you sell a goat for lets just say $300... and for many especially in the dairy goat world the kids can be significantly higher it they (parents) have "ribbons" ...
UC Davis is $14.50 a test.
You can test 20 goats for the price of ONE kid.
If a person has 20 goats to test then they have more than likely a considerable number of kids!
People spend all kinds of crazy money on their goats, proper hay, proper feed, normal yearly care and then add money for milk testing (every month) will spend money every year on Linear Appraisals, show fees, hotels, travel etc but won't test for CL or Johnes which are both zoonotic. I don't get it.

My "neighbor" who raises meat goats (show stock breeding stock) sells his kids for a MINIMUM of $750! Tests for nothing.

Sometimes I do feel like why bother ... no else seems to care why should I? Yet I always come back to the same thing... I can only do what I can do and try my best to keep my herd clean so the goats I sell at least I can feel that I have done all I can do for the buyer. There are no guarantees in goats but monitoring herd health IMO is beneficial.

When we move we will be bringing in a herd from Washington (kikos) all tested for CAE, CL, Johnes, and TB of course... to add to our Kikos here. Really looking forward to it!

 

[nstone630]

I do think part of it is because they are terminal, part is because it is so bad there isn't alot people can do UNLESS more people start testing and eliminating this, and the biggest part IMO is people are just simply to cheap to test.

All kinds of excuses from "not accurate", my vet says "don't bother", "I have never had a lump", too expensive... blah blah blah.
I use UC Davis and I am out of state , it is one of the more expensive labs when it comes to CL testing. But when you look at numbers...
If you sell a goat for lets just say $300... and for many especially in the dairy goat world the kids can be significantly higher it they (parents) have "ribbons" ...
UC Davis is $14.50 a test.
You can test 20 goats for the price of ONE kid.
If a person has 20 goats to test then they have more than likely a considerable number of kids!
People spend all kinds of crazy money on their goats, proper hay, proper feed, normal yearly care and then add money for milk testing (every month) will spend money every year on Linear Appraisals, show fees, hotels, travel etc but won't test for CL or Johnes which are both zoonotic. I don't get it.

My "neighbor" who raises meat goats (show stock breeding stock) sells his kids for a MINIMUM of $750! Tests for nothing.

Sometimes I do feel like why bother ... no else seems to care why should I? Yet I always come back to the same thing... I can only do what I can do and try my best to keep my herd clean so the goats I sell at least I can feel that I have done all I can do for the buyer. There are no guarantees in goats but monitoring herd health IMO is beneficial.

When we move we will be bringing in a herd from Washington (kikos) all tested for CAE, CL, Johnes, and TB of course... to add to our Kikos here. Really looking forward to it!

"Sometimes I do feel like why bother"...I hear ya. When the vet told me that only 1 other meat farmer anywhere near me tests, what am I even doing it for? But, like you said, personally I want to be able to tell the buyer they are negative. When I've looked into goats I've purchased and asked if they are tested every single time, I get told no. And most tell me they never test. It's frustrating when I'm in the negative with these things, have made no profit off them due to the vet bills, a lot of that from testing. And no one else gives a rats ass about it.

Sorry for the rant. But it's frustrating and tiring. DH says an old friend of his who also raises meat goats in the area says just lance it, I never test and all my goats are fine. Wouldn't even separate her from the herd while it heals. I get how that is the easy answer...I don't want to deal with this either. But, not sure morally I can just let it go.

 

[Southern by choice]

Yeah, and that is why all these herds are infected. That is just stupid! The ground is contaminated at that point and all the goats will end up with it-

I really think many in the goat world just don't realize that if people don't do what they can now, before it is too late, then long term what advantage is it to have goats over cattle?

Abscesses in meat herds cause a lot of carcasses to be condemned... that is a money loser right there.

Starting out with good quality goats from the start is beneficial. They don't have to be registered but quality and tested is worth it.

 

[OneFineAcre]

I test for CAE and Johnnes and recently TB and Brucellosis
I don't test for CL.
Not accurate.
2 Vets have said not necessary. I know a 3rd vet who owns goats that doesn't test for CL
Never had a lump.
Cost isn't a factor.
You just got to do what you think is best.

 

[Southern by choice]

I test for CAE and Johnnes and recently TB and Brucelleosis
I don't test for CL.
Not accurate.
2 Vets have said not necessary. I know a 3rd vet who owns goats that doesn't test for CL
Never had a lump.
Cost isn't a factor.
You just got to do what you think is best.

Many vets don't test for it just like many people don't test for it... in the end it isn't the vets herd, the vet loses nothing by someone elses goats getting it, it isn't the vets financial loss, or responsibility... not their investment. Many vets feel the same about Johnes yet many vets are not up to date on the testing capabilities. IMO it doesn't mean the vet is a bad vet... matter of fact they can be a great vet but not always agree on a matter. Many vets do test for CL, the ones we work with do test and recommend it although they leave the decision up to the client.

With testing I personally think it is something the goat owner has the responsibility to research and gather info and decide what is in the best interest of the herd owner and herd.

Again... yearly consecutive testing is not going to give you a false positive or negative year after year on the same goat. Watching titers is also important because if it is internal you may not have a lump ever show up...

 

[nstone630]

I test for CAE and Johnnes and recently TB and Brucellosis
I don't test for CL.
Not accurate.
2 Vets have said not necessary. I know a 3rd vet who owns goats that doesn't test for CL
Never had a lump.
Cost isn't a factor.
You just got to do what you think is best.

Just for your opinion, if you had a goat that presented with t lump, would you test it?

And please know I'm not trying to make this into a battle over testing. We are all allowed to have opinions. I'm just learning, and don't have any other opinions to listen to except everyone on here. And I think everyone's opinion is respected.