Why does my Nigerian Dwarf goat faint?

[MiniSilkys]

Who has to be registered as a dairy goat anyway. A goat is still a goat. It mainly has to do with money anyway. Does anyone realize that every breed of goat has ancestry that is a mix? I say she is a great looking goat. If you have a chance at breeding her to a good buck like Spice, I would do it. Kids are like sunshine when its been raining all winter.

 

[Goat Whisperer]

Nothing wrong with breeding her.
But, if she truly has the myotonic trait, then her offspring are disqualified from ADGA registration.
It's not a matter of choice. When you sign the paperwork and present the animal for registration you are certifying that the animal is eligible for registration.

Thanks for posting this OFA. My last post got cut short, I agree 100%. If the goat is bred, offspring should not be registered with the ADGA

 

[Goat Whisperer]

Who has to be registered as a dairy goat anyway. A goat is still a goat. It mainly has to do with money anyway.

Not to cause an argument, but raising registered dairy goats has not been about the money We show, participate in DHIR milktest and will be doing Linear appraisals next year. Registered goats are more than the price you sell them for
That being said, we still have a few unregistered ladies in our pastures that will live their life here.

 

[MiniSilkys]

Not to cause an argument, but raising registered dairy goats has not been about the money We show, participate in DHIR milktest and will be doing Linear appraisals next year. Registered goats are more than the price you sell them for
That being said, we still have a few unregistered ladies in our pastures that will live their life here.

I understand that GW. But y'all are involved in a long chain of shows, ribbons, and things such as that. And there is nothing wrong with that. It's great. But I personally don't have the money to be involved in that kind of area. And where I live most people don't. Some are lucky to castrate their bucks and sell them for $35. The only way I would be able to buy a purebred would be if their is something wrong with it. I can not afford $600 for one.

 

[Southern by choice]

I understand that GW. But y'all are involved in a long chain of shows, ribbons, and things such as that. And there is nothing wrong with that. It's great. But I personally don't have the money to be involved in that kind of area. And where I live most people don't. Some are lucky to castrate their bucks and sell them for $35. The only way I would be able to buy a purebred would be if their is something wrong with it. I can not afford $600 for one.

Actually we have only been showing the past 2 years, but we originally started out purely as homestead. We still are too.
Yes we have changed a lot of things but we still have several unregistered goats and we also breed the ultimate homesteader goat... the minis! Miniature lamanchas jn our case.
We have grades and experimentals.

IOW I agree, goats are goats and have purpose! Whether it be for meat, milk, both, or even just companions that also clear brush. Goats are amazing.

The issue for the poster comes down to the registration. Let's say the poster had wanted to show etc, breed for that, they really can't do that and they have a responsibility as well as the breeder to rectify the situation.

You are right in one sense about $. For example- I have several Grade mini's because they are grade even though they are registered grades I cannot charge the same price as an experimental or f-1 or so on. Even though my grades may be my best producers. Boggles the mind sometimes. For those of us that also do a little more with the goats - well, that is costly... on our part.
Every month I have a tester come out and do our milktest. It is 2x (each test being 12 hours apart) So , travel & time expense plus my monthly fee to Dairy one for the data, plus shipping the samples, plus my yearly fee to ADGA adds up. We also test all our goats for CAE, CL, Johnes. This year my test fees will run just shy of $1000 for disease testing. Add to that some shows require you to be there on Fri and you show thru Sun. Fri is a day off work. Then entry fees per goat, travel etc, food. This year we didn't do linear appraisals but that would have been approximately over $400. Of course then add in vet care, feed, hay , all the normal stuff all goat owners have. And of course my yearly membership dues for 2 registries, 2 membership fees for the clubs we are members of and each goat registered. Doelings 9.50-10.50 Each and bucklings 15.50-16.50 each. We had 42 kids this year. Some went for meat, some wethered, some retained, some sold. Springs shows are costly at least fall fair shows pay out if you do well.

All these programs are our choices but there is value to us so we participate. When we sell a registered doe our range (depending on breed, registration status, and breeding behind that goat) is generally starting at $300 and go up from there. Personally I don't think that is too much. We don't make a dime of selling our goats but we want to make sure any goat going off the farm is free of defects etc, unless otherwise stated and then papers would not accompany the goat. I have sold registered grades for as low as $150.
We want every goat that leaves our farm be a blessing to those that get them, that is very important to us. Money isn't the goal of what we do, if that were the case we wouldn't have goats.


I love my unregistered goats every bit as much as my others, the others that have papers allow us to do more with our goats. I will say you can have great unregistered and registered and mediocre of both as well. Not a registered goat snob in any way it boils down to what is and isn't registerable under the rules, and if you paid for registered animals then you should have animals that meet the registries requirements.

 

[Ridgetop]

There are lots of opinions here. I agree with GW, OFA and Southern. We all love our animals whether they are breed champions, elite or star milkers, ribbon winners, or back yard pets. Some people like to dismiss show animals as just beauty pageant winners. Those people think breeders show in order to get super high prices for their animals. The return is not as high as the output. In fact, most of us who do all that ether barely break even, or have another source of income! LOL

BUT the point here is that Wendybear paid for registered Nigerian Dwarf goats. She wethered the little buckling and if he were fainting it might be ok although she still would have to notify the breeder since this is a disqualification in the breed. However it is the doeling that is showing the fainting gene. In this case, Wendybear wants to use her as a milker. To do that she has to be bred and produce kids. What will Wendybear do with the kids? With the myotonic trait Wendybear cannot legitimately and honestly sell them as registered NDs. They are ineligible because their mother is ineligible to be registered since she has the myotonic trait. This is the main problem. Wendybear paid for registered kids. The doeling cannot be registered. Therefore she needs to notify the breeder immediately of the situation. If she decides to keep the doe as a pet, that is her choice, but she now has an unregistered goat that she paid a registered price for. This is a monetary loss for her.

When the breeder signs the registration papers he or she is verifying that the animal is eligible for registration as a purebred representative of the breed, and that the parents listed on the registrations papers and all the generations before are what is shown in the papers. Registered animals bring a higher price because of all the expense that goes into producing a true representative of the breed. Misrepresentation of the ability of the animal to be registered with the appropriate organization is fraud. It seriously calls the breeder's reputation into question if the breeder deliberately registered an animal that was ineligible. If the breeder is unaware that the animal is showing the signs that would disqualify it for registration she needs to be immediately notified so she can rectify the situation. Otherwise, if the breeder is unaware and continues to sell registered animals that run the risk of having their papers recalled, she could lose her good reputation and in extreme cases she could be censured and forbidden to register any more animals with ADGA.

Now, on to Southern's other points about showing, health and milk tests - I absolutely agree with Southern, OFA and GW. There are reasons why there are conformation and other requirements that you have to conform to in registering animals. All these things cost money. It is the owner's choice to spend the money and take the considerable time to show. DHIR milk testing and Linear Appraisals are expensive. It costs a lot of money to run CAE, CL, Johnnes, etc. tests to make sure you have a clean herd. It costs money to do annual health vaccinations, spend time clipping hooves, etc. It costs money to make sure you are feeding properly and that your animals are healthy, free from parasites, etc. But when a breeder who does all these things, has the records to show the buyer, and offers an animal for sale you can be pretty sure you are getting what you are paying for. Just because the place is pretty doesn't mean that the animals are healthy, purebred, or what they are advertised to be.

There are reasons that the responsible breeder does all these things. It is not just about showing for money. When you show an animal you are trying to get a specimen that conforms to the standard. There are reasons for the standard of perfection in all breeds and species. There is a reason why ADGA requires breeders to swear that the registration information they are submitting is true and correct. Conformation and body structure - Milking animals are built differently from meat producing animals. If you want mill production you buy an animal from a breeder who keeps milk records, does DHIR milk test to know what each individual animal produces in quantity, quality and butterfat content of her milk. If you want a meat breed, you do not buy a milker, you buy a meat producing animal with the appropriate body and bone structure. Species breed shows are important to keep the breed as a whole on track in type and conformation. This is what produces animals that are good breeders and reproduce their own type.

If you want to cross breed different breeds of milk animals, you will still get milking animals. Some of the highest recorded milkers on DHIR test have been grades (not purebred). Cross breed different breeds of meat animals you will still get meat producing animals (done a lot for show lambs in market classes - most county fair grand champion market lambs are not registered and are cross bred - same with hogs). BUT it is only by keeping track by blood testing and vaccinations that we can continue producing good animals that will do what you expect from them. Herd records are not just for us to gloat over they are an important part of the herdsman job - and it takes a lot of time to do it.

I hope I don't sound preachy and I don't want to offend anyone. There is nothing wrong with unregistered animals. The problem is that Wendybear wanted registered NDs. If she got something that cannot be registered then the breeder needs to make it right. I don't show any more, but I do choose replacement stock from flocks or herds that have test evaluation numbers for whatever traits I want in my flock or herd. The few dollars extra in purchase price is worth getting the genetics and production I want in my flock or herd for the long term.

Wendybear: Get on the phone and call the breeder asap. If she is an honest breeder she will either offer to take the doe back or replace her with a properly registered kid. She might offer to pay for a vet check to make sure it s not a health issue. Like GW says, if you wait too long any health guarantee the breeder offers will no longer be good.

One last thought, if the doe is startled on the milking stand and faints she could conceivably break her neck. At the very least, she will spill the milk pail. Maybe a myotonic milker is not a good idea? Just thinking . . . .

 

[OneFineAcre]

By the way, I'm getting rich breeding show goats.
Do you know how to become a millionaire breeding goats?
Start with $2 million

 

[Ridgetop]

So right! Do the rest of you notice that when we buy replacement stock, prices are high, but when we sell stock, prices have just dropped to an all time low?

 

[MiniSilkys]

Is there anyway to tell for sure what kind of goat you have? I still don't know. Are they pygmy, pygmy/ND, or ND.

 

[Ridgetop]

Do you have the registration papers on the goats? Can you post a photo of them?