How to find the right buck for my does....time is now!
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ohiofarmgirl
Overrun with beasties
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$50 is pretty standard fee around here too. no guns required. it goes like this:
regular goat person: hello breeder - do you have a stud available?
breeder not overly concerned with dictating others breeding needs: why yes. please come right over. that will be $50. we'll be very happy to keep your doe for 2 weeks.
RGP: thank you very much
breeder: no problem i'm happy to help you.
isnt that just shocking. and it works.
()relics
Overrun with beasties
....6 months later....
RGP's vet: the test results are in and she has tested positive for CAE/CL/Johnnes/foot rot/insert any of the other horribles.
RGP: that is impossible I have a closed herd and my goats never leave my farm....Except that one time I took them to Breeder X.
RGP's Vet: Breeder X....you are kidding Breeder X...Why were you looking for a good deal??
Somewhere the Title of this post must have changed from "the Right Buck for my Does" to "the Right Now Buck for my Does"...The Right Buck would, I assume, improve your present line....I may be wrong...and generally if you wanted to improve your line by "Finding The Right Buck" You would need to have a herd plan in mind and look at several bcuks to find just the right one..... then when you found that "Right Buck" there is a good chance he wouldn't also be the Cheapest buck...
RGP's vet: the test results are in and she has tested positive for CAE/CL/Johnnes/foot rot/insert any of the other horribles.
RGP: that is impossible I have a closed herd and my goats never leave my farm....Except that one time I took them to Breeder X.
RGP's Vet: Breeder X....you are kidding Breeder X...Why were you looking for a good deal??
Somewhere the Title of this post must have changed from "the Right Buck for my Does" to "the Right Now Buck for my Does"...The Right Buck would, I assume, improve your present line....I may be wrong...and generally if you wanted to improve your line by "Finding The Right Buck" You would need to have a herd plan in mind and look at several bcuks to find just the right one..... then when you found that "Right Buck" there is a good chance he wouldn't also be the Cheapest buck...
ohiofarmgirl
Overrun with beasties
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golly relics, i havent had any of those problems. i'm sorry that your breeding program has gone so badly - if thats your experience.
my mutt goats milk like demons, must be parasite resistant because we dont have a problem, they are even tempered, and (looks out in the yard) are doing just fine. actually they are doing great. we have one papered show girl - and when i take her back to the breeder he tells me that she looks better than when he had her.
but maybe i'm just lucky.
or maybe its just not that complicated and we're talking about goats.
as far as the herd plan goes, folks should have one. here's mine:
* keep milkers we have now
* breed them as it makes sense for us
* if i cant sell the babies on craigslist or to the local 4h kids - we butcher them
* dont give a hoot about improving my "line" or creating the perfect goat.
ohmigosh. i just realized that i'm one of those people who, according to you, doesnt have any business breeding goats!
well, we'll just have to keep muddling along.....
my mutt goats milk like demons, must be parasite resistant because we dont have a problem, they are even tempered, and (looks out in the yard) are doing just fine. actually they are doing great. we have one papered show girl - and when i take her back to the breeder he tells me that she looks better than when he had her.
but maybe i'm just lucky.
or maybe its just not that complicated and we're talking about goats.
as far as the herd plan goes, folks should have one. here's mine:
* keep milkers we have now
* breed them as it makes sense for us
* if i cant sell the babies on craigslist or to the local 4h kids - we butcher them
* dont give a hoot about improving my "line" or creating the perfect goat.
ohmigosh. i just realized that i'm one of those people who, according to you, doesnt have any business breeding goats!
well, we'll just have to keep muddling along.....
()relics
Overrun with beasties
Ha can't resist this...Just one more. First this bit of fluff most recently posted: What exactly would that have to do with the OP ? I'll answer this one...Nothing Second if you are aware of a breeder that offers a stud service, would that service be only for you or would Anyone that cannot afford a buck be able to take advantcge of this offer? Rhetorical...Anyone. So said breeder offers his buck's services to anyone and everyone with $50 and an open doe? Again rhetorical...Now would you guess that some of the people that use this service may have "issues" in their herd that you wouldn't want in yours? Rhetoical again for anyone with common sense. Would you say your chances of contracting something "unwanted" at this guys house are better or worse than if you left your goat at home? I hate this but its again rhetorical...So you in your vast knowledge feel obligated to tell the OP, who may not know, that there is nothing to worry about using a Cheap breeder and that you do it all the time...But yet is anyone sure that you, in fact, don't already carry some unwanted in your herd? You sell goat kids, even to 4Her's...Have you been certified clean? And Why would a 4H kid want to try to show a
Just saying, what works for you isn't probably the best thing for everyone else...I run a closed herd that is Certified Clean...I don't have to guess...I post only Common knowledge ,to experienced goat people. ...FYI you are welcome to stop by anytime, Others that post here have, to see for yourself.
Just one last item for the OP. Recently I was approached with a "potential" proposition. I would use 1 of my FB bucks to breed an FB doe. The stud fee would be negotiable depending on the outcome of the breeding but would probably include a "kid back" from the does owner....Now a little math: FB boer doeling= $150-500...Sound like alot more than $50. I declined the offer reason given: Too Much Risk....that is 1 FB breeder to another. Not Breeder X to anyone that answers his Clist ad.
your words, anyway and potentially a carrier Mutt goat...
Just saying, what works for you isn't probably the best thing for everyone else...I run a closed herd that is Certified Clean...I don't have to guess...I post only Common knowledge ,to experienced goat people. ...FYI you are welcome to stop by anytime, Others that post here have, to see for yourself.
Just one last item for the OP. Recently I was approached with a "potential" proposition. I would use 1 of my FB bucks to breed an FB doe. The stud fee would be negotiable depending on the outcome of the breeding but would probably include a "kid back" from the does owner....Now a little math: FB boer doeling= $150-500...Sound like alot more than $50. I declined the offer reason given: Too Much Risk....that is 1 FB breeder to another. Not Breeder X to anyone that answers his Clist ad.
ohiofarmgirl
Overrun with beasties
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* looks up at title of site, sees BACKYARDHERDS not Self Righteous Goat Breeders *
golly. you really got me there.
but i post common sense to folks who have backyard herds...served without a side of derision and a helping of contempt for new folks starting out.
glenolam
Loving the herd life
Been watching this thread, and felt the need to jump in, even though I proabably should just
FWIW - I think that sometimes we create our own problems because we are afraid of what could happen.
Near me is a registered herd with a champion nigerian buck who has earned a dairy star....my mutt goats are allowed over anytime for breeding or playtime. And breeding is free.....
That same breeder, who BTW does test for everything under the sun*, just mentioned that she has to keep her own bucks because other breeders she knows close and far away are too scared to have 'shot gun weddings' let alone allow a doe to stay/buck to leave for any period of time.
*She tests for two reasons - 1: She shows her goats and wants to have the highest return by breeding proven winners (mind you I know little of show quality, registered goats) 2: She must have all that testing done if she ever wants to use another buck. If other breeders were less concerned of what could happen, it'd save a lot of time and money. JMO.... Then again, I'm not an experienced goat person, therefore I have no common knowledge to share....
Relics() is employing a discussion tactic I commonly use...I like to call it "terrible ways to make excellent points." It's not a very good strategy because it invariably opens the door for the person holding the opposing viewpoint to begin openly launching character attacks instead of forcing them to address the points being made, but....well, when you're really passionate about something, it can be a satisfying tactic to indulge.
Anyway.. :/
The points Relics() makes are valid; there's only one way providing a $50 stud buck is a worthwhile venture for the stud owner, and biosecurity almost certainly isn't part of the plan. Top-notch biosecurity would require health papers from both parties, plus a quarantine period for the buck after the doe leaves the premises.. Once the quarantine period is up, he can service another/more doe(s), and be quarantined again..
At $50/whack, that's not happening.
In fact, I *personally witnessed* a CL+ doe running with a very, very expensive stud buck one day as I was watching goats for someone. Classic site...front of chest...and the hair had already slipped off of it. I called the owner, made him aware of the situation, and was asked to isolate the doe into a stall by herself.
I reluctantly agreed and made a mental note that I should probably buy more bleach. :/
He then asked me if any of the other does in the pen seemed to be in heat.. Yep...ol' number 42 (or whatever)...I described her to him and he says "Good!" and goes on to tell me she's someone else's doe that's in for service, and this means he can send her home soon.
Now...imagine that was your doe...and imagine I hadn't seen that hairless lump, or hadn't cared enough to jump into the fray and get her isolated in time...
And this guy charges WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY more than $50.
Anyway.. :/
The points Relics() makes are valid; there's only one way providing a $50 stud buck is a worthwhile venture for the stud owner, and biosecurity almost certainly isn't part of the plan. Top-notch biosecurity would require health papers from both parties, plus a quarantine period for the buck after the doe leaves the premises.. Once the quarantine period is up, he can service another/more doe(s), and be quarantined again..
At $50/whack, that's not happening.
In fact, I *personally witnessed* a CL+ doe running with a very, very expensive stud buck one day as I was watching goats for someone. Classic site...front of chest...and the hair had already slipped off of it. I called the owner, made him aware of the situation, and was asked to isolate the doe into a stall by herself.
I reluctantly agreed and made a mental note that I should probably buy more bleach. :/
He then asked me if any of the other does in the pen seemed to be in heat.. Yep...ol' number 42 (or whatever)...I described her to him and he says "Good!" and goes on to tell me she's someone else's doe that's in for service, and this means he can send her home soon.
Now...imagine that was your doe...and imagine I hadn't seen that hairless lump, or hadn't cared enough to jump into the fray and get her isolated in time...
And this guy charges WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY more than $50.
ksalvagno
Alpaca Master
Only you can decide what risks are worth taking. I also have alpacas and I have alpaca breeders who bring their late term pregnant girls here for birthing. I can't afford to take even the slightest risk of CAE or CL or Johnes for this reason (alpacas can get those diseases from the goats). I would be owing someone a lot of money if their alpaca came up positive for any of those diseases, not to mention that I would lose other birthing business. So testing and making sure to have a clean herd is imperative for me.
There are plenty of people with goat herds who aren't as particular about those diseases being in their herds. But they probably don't have as much to lose as I do. I could lose my farm business and I'm not willing to do that after I have put 13 years into it.
Like I said, everyone has to decide what risks are worth taking and for each person it is different. A lot of people wouldn't want the pregnant alpacas coming and going from their farm like I have. I do risk having serious parasite problems. But so far it has worked out for me. In general, people who are willing to pay to have someone else birth their alpaca are people who regularly worm and take good care of their alpacas.
There are plenty of people with goat herds who aren't as particular about those diseases being in their herds. But they probably don't have as much to lose as I do. I could lose my farm business and I'm not willing to do that after I have put 13 years into it.
Like I said, everyone has to decide what risks are worth taking and for each person it is different. A lot of people wouldn't want the pregnant alpacas coming and going from their farm like I have. I do risk having serious parasite problems. But so far it has worked out for me. In general, people who are willing to pay to have someone else birth their alpaca are people who regularly worm and take good care of their alpacas.
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savingdogs
Overrun with beasties
Gosh didn't mean for this to become contentious! I welcome all advice, as I realize that things may be different from place to place as far as price and practice. I guess I'm getting a range of opinions which I would say was good, except I'm a person who likes to promote harmony and perhaps my questions just have more than one answer. Can't we all get along, since everyone has a different "herd plan"? But my goats are already "mutt goats". Nothing will make their babies purebreds.
Relics I have the feeling goats are your business whereas for me I've just got pets I'd like to spend as little as possible on, who are going to give me little benefits later. I only want to build my herd to maybe five or seven total goats, givng me some milk now and again, selling off babies except once in a great while.
But note here that I'm savingdogs.....I've done dog rescue for the last 12 years recycling dogs thrown away in the backyard breeder business for the most part. So I want to be careful here.
I want to do things right but also don't want to overdo or spend too much as my goal here is just a little milk, a little fun and some self sufficiency. I work for a large animal vet but we are kinda the most expensive/highest quality around here so not necessarily in my budget as far as advice goes and y'all on here have not always agreed with him either (does not recommend Bose for goats).
I can see now that SOME breeders are going to ask for that paperwork and some won't give a hoot. But you guys have given me some ideas on leads.
One thing we do not currently have is a trailer (old one in accident) so transporting them means they go into the back of an SUV to either vet or breeder....no drive-by breeding can happen for Molly.
Calliopia thank you for the suggestion, we cull extra ducks and chickens but goats are not on that list for us. Lucky for the goats of Clark County.....the Himalayan blackberry rules all fields here and goats are popular, even common.
While our woods would support lotsa wethers three seasons a year, we cannot afford to feed a lot of wethers through the winter when blackberry and alder are bare. So perhaps for us, less is more! I see I will be asking at work what that test costs....sigh.
Thank you all for your advice.
Relics I have the feeling goats are your business whereas for me I've just got pets I'd like to spend as little as possible on, who are going to give me little benefits later. I only want to build my herd to maybe five or seven total goats, givng me some milk now and again, selling off babies except once in a great while.
But note here that I'm savingdogs.....I've done dog rescue for the last 12 years recycling dogs thrown away in the backyard breeder business for the most part. So I want to be careful here.
I want to do things right but also don't want to overdo or spend too much as my goal here is just a little milk, a little fun and some self sufficiency. I work for a large animal vet but we are kinda the most expensive/highest quality around here so not necessarily in my budget as far as advice goes and y'all on here have not always agreed with him either (does not recommend Bose for goats).
I can see now that SOME breeders are going to ask for that paperwork and some won't give a hoot. But you guys have given me some ideas on leads.
One thing we do not currently have is a trailer (old one in accident) so transporting them means they go into the back of an SUV to either vet or breeder....no drive-by breeding can happen for Molly.
Calliopia thank you for the suggestion, we cull extra ducks and chickens but goats are not on that list for us. Lucky for the goats of Clark County.....the Himalayan blackberry rules all fields here and goats are popular, even common.
While our woods would support lotsa wethers three seasons a year, we cannot afford to feed a lot of wethers through the winter when blackberry and alder are bare. So perhaps for us, less is more! I see I will be asking at work what that test costs....sigh.
Thank you all for your advice.
