If the eyelids are white looking, does that mean they need wormed???

[ksalvagno]

How does doing a fecal hurt anything? Why not find out what you have. If you have a vet that is good at doing fecals, you find out the same day what you have. If they send it out, you usually find out within a few days.

If you want to start treating for barberpole go ahead but I would still have a fecal done before you treat and find out. Sometimes you can be surprised with what you have. It may be the typical thing but it doesn't hurt to find out for sure.

Get some red cell into them like CM said.

I had a case this spring with my alpacas. Typical coccidia time of year. I treated for coccidia but still had loose stool. Turned out to be strongyle. So, even though it was the typical time in my area for coccidia and that would have been everyone's guess as to my problem, it turned out that strongyle was my problem. Treated with appropriate wormer and problem solved.

I'm not saying barberpole isn't your problem. It may very well be. I'm just saying to find out for sure.

 

[Speedy94c]

I WENT TO THE CO-OP AT LUNCH AND GOT THE STUFF TO DRENCH THEM THIS EVENING. I ALREADY HAVE IVERMEC SO THAT IS WHAT IM GOING TO DO. I DONT HAVE A VET THAT WILL DO FECALS AROUND HERE THAT I KNOW OF. NOT A GOOD GOAT VET HERE ALL SEEM TO JUST DO DOGS AND CATS. WHERE CAN YOU SEND IT OFF TO GET DONE AND WHAT SHOULD THE COST BE?
THANKS AGAIN
STEVE

 

[cmjust0]

How does doing a fecal hurt anything? Why not find out what you have. If you have a vet that is good at doing fecals, you find out the same day what you have. If they send it out, you usually find out within a few days.

Ya know I love ya, but I really think you're SERIOUSLY underestimating the gravity of the situation here.

:/

had a case this spring with my alpacas. Typical coccidia time of year. I treated for coccidia but still had loose stool. Turned out to be strongyle. So, even though it was the typical time in my area for coccidia and that would have been everyone's guess as to my problem, it turned out that strongyle was my problem. Treated with appropriate wormer and problem solved.

So, I have a question....

Why did you treat for coccidia when you knew you actually had strongyloides?

That doesn't make any sense.

(btw...answer carefully, because when you tell me you treated based on the season and clinical symptoms without first running a fecal, I'm going to ride you incessantly from this point forward every..single..time you suggest someone else run a fecal while their animals are in crisis.)

I DONT HAVE A VET THAT WILL DO FECALS AROUND HERE THAT I KNOW OF. NOT A GOOD GOAT VET HERE ALL SEEM TO JUST DO DOGS AND CATS. WHERE CAN YOU SEND IT OFF TO GET DONE AND WHAT SHOULD THE COST BE?

Excellent question, speedy.

Ksal? Where can Speedy send his bags of poop, and how much will it cost? And when can he expect them back?

 

[cmjust0]

I WENT TO THE CO-OP AT LUNCH AND GOT THE STUFF TO DRENCH THEM THIS EVENING. I ALREADY HAVE IVERMEC SO THAT IS WHAT IM GOING TO DO.

You already have the ivermectin, so what "stuff" did you get? Another additional dewormer? A drench gun? Syringes?

I'm a little confuzled.

 

[ksalvagno]

Actually, I didn't know they had strongyle. I'm like everyone else who has owned livestock for a while, since it was early spring and coccidia is the typical culprit, I treated for coccidia. When the loose stool didn't go away, then I had a fecal done. The fecal showed strongyle.

I actually have been running fecals on the goats since I don't know their patterns yet. So there!

I don't know where you live but in Ohio, we can send them to state lab. They actually do an excellent job on fecals. You get the results back in a few days. Cost is about $40 per fecal. You could call your state lab or see if there is a vet lab in your area that runs fecals and find out cost from them.

My one vet does run fecals and they run about $20 per sample. One of these days I will start doing my own. But for now I just pay it.

I suggest fecals a lot because so many people on here are new to goats. Then you can find out what is on your own property and learn the patterns of those parasites as to when they tend to rear their ugly heads and then you can treat on your own once you figure that out. May be expensive initially but you sure do learn a lot. Getting on the computer and asking for suggestions is fine and can be very helpful but no one is physically standing on your particular land and no one knows which parasites are typical for your particular land. What is typical on my property may not even be typical for someone a few miles away from me.

 

[cmjust0]

Actually, I didn't know they had strongyle. I'm like everyone else who has owned livestock for a while, since it was early spring and coccidia is the typical culprit, I treated for coccidia.

Ok, well, prepare to be ridden incessantly for not practisething what thou preachesetheses.



(oh, alright...I'll let it slide -- THIS TIME. )

When the loose stool didn't go away, then I had a fecal done. The fecal showed strongyle.

See, to me, that's logical; pick the low hanging fruit first...if that's not enough, then you go get a ladder.

I actually had a fecal run at the vet's office...once. The vet tech came back and said she found 'hookworm eggs and coccidia'...and then proceeded to tell me that my goats were dying of coccidiosis.

:/

The actual DVM laid the smackdown on her pretty much immediately. Basically said she didn't know what she was talking about on the hookworm thing, and that he didn't either. Pretty much, he said it would take a parasitologist to really nail it all down...and he's not a parasitologist (...this is about when she walks away... )

And he blew the coccidiosis diagnosis off immediately, based on the fact that they were fat, slick, healthy adults on deccox-medicated grain.

Aaaaaaaand then he promptly agreed with my suspicion that it was probably bacterial and gave me Naxcel -- without so much as laying a hand on the actual goat herself.

Too little, too late...she still died.

Anyway...

I actually have been running fecals on the goats since I don't know their patterns yet. So there!

I do...know the patterns, that is.

The patterns of the ones that matter, anyway. Or, rather, the ONE that matters most -- barberpole.

And trust me when I tell you that this is primetime barberpole season.

So there!

I don't know where you live but in Ohio, we can send them to state lab. They actually do an excellent job on fecals. You get the results back in a few days. Cost is about $40 per fecal. You could call your state lab or see if there is a vet lab in your area that runs fecals and find out cost from them.

$40 x 60...$2400?

My one vet does run fecals and they run about $20 per sample. One of these days I will start doing my own. But for now I just pay it.

That's cheap..

I think I paid like $35 for the coccidiosis/hookworm diagnosis that was dead wrong and proved to be of ZERO diagnostic value.

FWIW....I actually took another sample in to the university disease and diagnostic laboratory and had it cultured for pathogenic bacteria after the vets drew a blank.

It was clean, according to them.

Yet...a few ml's of oral spectinomycin -- literally pennies worth of Scour Halt -- saved several more that eventually came down with the same illness.

:/

I suggest fecals a lot because so many people on here are new to goats. Then you can find out what is on your own property and learn the patterns of those parasites as to when they tend to rear their ugly heads and then you can treat on your own once you figure that out. May be expensive initially but you sure do learn a lot. Getting on the computer and asking for suggestions is fine and can be very helpful but no one is physically standing on your particular land and no one knows which parasites are typical for your particular land. What is typical on my property may not even be typical for someone a few miles away from me.

Barberpole worms are on everyone's land -- even yours. That guy a few miles from you?...he has them on his land, too, if he has goats. If you have goats, you have barberpole. They're like potato bugs...they come with the potato.

And the pattern is "dog days of summer," pretty much.


In all seriousness...barberpoles are very, very serious. Like, deadly serious. When a goat goes white, you're out of time to ponder and consider and run tests. You gotta do something, right now. It only takes a few dozen worms to bleed a goat of up to 50ml/day, and when it gets to the point where they don't have enough iron and other...blood building stuff (that's totally the proper scientific term -- look it up)...in reserve to make more blood, they spiral out and can die in a heartbeat.

In severe cases -- like full-blown hyperacute haemonchosis -- the goat can be drained of up to 500ml/day.

So, needless to say, barberpole aren't to be trifled with.

 

[Speedy94c]

I WENT TO THE CO-OP AT LUNCH AND GOT THE STUFF TO DRENCH THEM THIS EVENING. I ALREADY HAVE IVERMEC SO THAT IS WHAT IM GOING TO DO.

You already have the ivermectin, so what "stuff" did you get? Another additional dewormer? A drench gun? Syringes?

I'm a little confuzled.

A good drench gun and syringes.

When I got home most of the ones I checked had good looking pink eyelids. I did have a few that were light and a couple that where white. I dosed them with the ivermectin and hope for the best. I will be putting them all in the barn this weekend and check them all one at a time and do what I think needs to be done. I just didnt have the time and my barn isnt set up yet, but this weekend ill get the barn done and be ready.
The one small goat that I was so worried about had already expiered when I got home so I was too late for him. Hopefully
I got the rest in time.
Thanks again for all you guys help.
Steve

 

[Hillsvale]

so what dosage of injectible ivomac is every one using orally becuase I have gotten so many different amounts its insane! Same with the sheep dosage...

 

[Livinwright Farm]

Have your vet run a fecal, and get some RedCell into the pale ones.

 

[cmjust0]

Ivomec is very safe to use on mammals, and when given orally to goats, so little of it actually gets into their bloodstream that I personally believe it would be *really, really* difficult (read that, virtually impossible) to overdose one. And I say that having once 'accidentally' injected a goat with about 5-6x the label dosage, all of which went straight into the bloodstream. No harm done. Well, except to the mites, which were **OBLITERATED**.

What I'm getting at is that you can pretty much give as much as it takes (and/or as much as you can afford to use) in order to get the job done. Within reason, of course. If you're not in dire straights, you might consider starting at about 3ml/100lbs and move upward from there. I've dumped entire 6ml syringes of injectable ivomec into stubborn kids before, which easily translates to 1ml/10lbs.