Worming lambs and moms

[kfacres]

It's not just the dosage that would concern me it would be the fact that of what you would be eating in the end product! The only animals we worm here are the piglets at 8 weeks old (weaning) & mostly because they are headed out to other farms. Other than that we do not worm any of our other livestock routinely - it is not necessary. In fact I was just reading today & I quote:

"Rule of thumb regarding parasites.... 20% of the herd will carry 80% of the parasite load. No one seems to know why this is... just some pigs are more susceptible to infestation."

Now this quote was admittedly for pigs but I suspect it is applicable for other livestock also & would explain why some die once in a while. Most of us panic & think they had some hideous disease when in fact it could just be nature's way of getting rid of the weak ones.

Raising livestock to be hardy without chemicals in this 'chemical laden world' is a big plus in my opinion because no matter what others may say what goes in does come out & all that wormer/chemical is going into your pastures leaving a residue, killing off all the good bugs etc.

Liz

since you're getting all organic on me:

How do you intend to sanitize your garden produce- can't use soap and common everyday cleaning supplies. You realize that almost every E-coli (or other contaminated produce) outbreak comes from "organic' produce? Why-- b/c they can't do a good enough job to clean these things off. Why is E-Coli such a big deal in organics? Manure-- being directly applied to the plants and veg we humans eat... and then they can't be washed with anything but water... so how do we get them clean enough to eat?

how do you clean your house, wash your clothes, or your dishes, can't use those soaps and chemical rich things-- they have bad things in them.

Do you not realize that even certified organic farms- can get gifted the gift of using non-organic ingredients? At the one I worked at while in college, we used spoiled corn gluton feed from the barge, we used GMO fed hog manure, and we used organic pesticides/ herbicides... Get real? Organic roundup??

I find it extremely unbelievable that these products being used for a specific reason-- dewormers, feed additives, etc... are released. Do you realize that chemical companies have products that are safer to use, eat, and be around-- than driving cars?

 

[Southdown]

It's not just the dosage that would concern me it would be the fact that of what you would be eating in the end product! The only animals we worm here are the piglets at 8 weeks old (weaning) & mostly because they are headed out to other farms. Other than that we do not worm any of our other livestock routinely - it is not necessary. In fact I was just reading today & I quote:

"Rule of thumb regarding parasites.... 20% of the herd will carry 80% of the parasite load. No one seems to know why this is... just some pigs are more susceptible to infestation."

Now this quote was admittedly for pigs but I suspect it is applicable for other livestock also & would explain why some die once in a while. Most of us panic & think they had some hideous disease when in fact it could just be nature's way of getting rid of the weak ones.

Raising livestock to be hardy without chemicals in this 'chemical laden world' is a big plus in my opinion because no matter what others may say what goes in does come out & all that wormer/chemical is going into your pastures leaving a residue, killing off all the good bugs etc.

Liz

Good reminder! Yes, it is a good point to be breeding for improved genetics. The strong, resistant ones will persist and the weak ones will die off. Indeed, nature does have a way sometimes. I also agree when it comes to breeding plants. I save seeds of open pollinated plants and select for the best traits. Over time, you are improving the variety and can have something good in the end that is specific for an environment. I agree with the "what goes in, comes out onto the soil" statement. All things in moderation, I guess. Yet another reason I think I should be doing the fecal monitoring. It could be thought of as comparable to "integrated pest management" practices. Test for specific organisms in the stool sample and only use the class of wormer when indicated by need.

 

[bonbean01]

That's how we feel too Cornish...one of the reasons we like to grow our own food. The organic wormer preventative for our meat sheep is the same thing we put on our salads...garlic and apple cider vinegar. We had a hard time in the beginning when we got chickens to find feed that was NOT medicated...have found the Co-op in a nearby city that sells non medicated feeds. If I wanted chemicals in my food, why would I bother with chickens and eggs at home?

We keep things pretty clean around here and so far, no problems going without chemicals for our meat sheep, chickens and garden...yes, we do share some cabbage in the garden with bugs, but we plant enough for us and the bugs. Didn't work out though for the plums and peaches...beetles are very greedy and I won't get any this year. Grapes and apples are looking very good though Will do more research about the plums and peaches for next year.

We grow extra yellow crook squash...some for us and more for the sheep. Besides being packed with vitamins, if you let the sheep squash grow large the seeds are also good for a natural wormer...here the biggest problem is Barberpole worms and they like to attach themselves to the seeds, and pass through the sheep in their feces...they don't last long exposed to the sun and air. Bonus is that some of the seeds will replant themselves and the sheep get an extra treat. Our sheep love squash and we picked a kind that has the most nutrients in it.

As for soap, laundry detergent, etc...yes, we use them...read the labels and do the best you can...going completely organic is a challenge, but going as organic as you can within reason...I'm all for it!

 

[Royd Wood]

It's not just the dosage that would concern me it would be the fact that of what you would be eating in the end product! The only animals we worm here are the piglets at 8 weeks old (weaning) & mostly because they are headed out to other farms. Other than that we do not worm any of our other livestock routinely - it is not necessary. In fact I was just reading today & I quote:

"Rule of thumb regarding parasites.... 20% of the herd will carry 80% of the parasite load. No one seems to know why this is... just some pigs are more susceptible to infestation."

Now this quote was admittedly for pigs but I suspect it is applicable for other livestock also & would explain why some die once in a while. Most of us panic & think they had some hideous disease when in fact it could just be nature's way of getting rid of the weak ones.

Raising livestock to be hardy without chemicals in this 'chemical laden world' is a big plus in my opinion because no matter what others may say what goes in does come out & all that wormer/chemical is going into your pastures leaving a residue, killing off all the good bugs etc.

Liz

since you're getting all organic on me:

How do you intend to sanitize your garden produce- can't use soap and common everyday cleaning supplies. You realize that almost every E-coli (or other contaminated produce) outbreak comes from "organic' produce? Why-- b/c they can't do a good enough job to clean these things off. Why is E-Coli such a big deal in organics? Manure-- being directly applied to the plants and veg we humans eat... and then they can't be washed with anything but water... so how do we get them clean enough to eat?

how do you clean your house, wash your clothes, or your dishes, can't use those soaps and chemical rich things-- they have bad things in them.

Do you not realize that even certified organic farms- can get gifted the gift of using non-organic ingredients? At the one I worked at while in college, we used spoiled corn gluton feed from the barge, we used GMO fed hog manure, and we used organic pesticides/ herbicides... Get real? Organic roundup??

I find it extremely unbelievable that these products being used for a specific reason-- dewormers, feed additives, etc... are released. Do you realize that chemical companies have products that are safer to use, eat, and be around-- than driving cars?

 

[kfacres]

That's how we feel too Cornish...one of the reasons we like to grow our own food. The organic wormer preventative for our meat sheep is the same thing we put on our salads...garlic and apple cider vinegar. We had a hard time in the beginning when we got chickens to find feed that was NOT medicated...have found the Co-op in a nearby city that sells non medicated feeds. If I wanted chemicals in my food, why would I bother with chickens and eggs at home?

We keep things pretty clean around here and so far, no problems going without chemicals for our meat sheep, chickens and garden...yes, we do share some cabbage in the garden with bugs, but we plant enough for us and the bugs. Didn't work out though for the plums and peaches...beetles are very greedy and I won't get any this year. Grapes and apples are looking very good though Will do more research about the plums and peaches for next year.

We grow extra yellow crook squash...some for us and more for the sheep. Besides being packed with vitamins, if you let the sheep squash grow large the seeds are also good for a natural wormer...here the biggest problem is Barberpole worms and they like to attach themselves to the seeds, and pass through the sheep in their feces...they don't last long exposed to the sun and air. Bonus is that some of the seeds will replant themselves and the sheep get an extra treat. Our sheep love squash and we picked a kind that has the most nutrients in it.

As for soap, laundry detergent, etc...yes, we use them...read the labels and do the best you can...going completely organic is a challenge, but going as organic as you can within reason...I'm all for it!

what do you do about squash bugs... even the chemical dependent folk- struggle with them.

ROYD WOOD: huh, Well, I'll be dern... Seems to be that poster did everything but mention the word "organic"

 

[aggieterpkatie]

And just a note, you CAN overdose dewormer. Levasol is the main one I can think of right now that warns DO NOT overdose it.

 

[bonbean01]

kfacres...lots of great info on this on the garden forum...squash bugs/beetles, etc.

 

[Southdown]

I'm going to feed my sheep some summer squash this year now! They do like the Winter squash and I feed that to them in the Winter. Some of the sheep like it more than others. Our ram and his suffolk friend especially like Blue Hubbards. Our ram also has a particular flavor for our Honeygold apples. We have an orchard and he will intentionally go eat those apples. It's kind of cute. The summer squash seed idea...it reminds me of how you can feed chickens diatomecous earth and that's supposed to be a natural wormer too. I haven't tried it yet because my chickens are quite young.

 

[Southdown]

And just a note, you CAN overdose dewormer. Levasol is the main one I can think of right now that warns DO NOT overdose it.

Also, you are not supposed to use Valbazen for pregnant ewes or breeding season for rams. It makes me too nervous to go over the dosage. My sheep are friendly little things.

 

[kfacres]

I'm going to feed my sheep some summer squash this year now! They do like the Winter squash and I feed that to them in the Winter. Some of the sheep like it more than others. Our ram and his suffolk friend especially like Blue Hubbards. Our ram also has a particular flavor for our Honeygold apples. We have an orchard and he will intentionally go eat those apples. It's kind of cute. The summer squash seed idea...it reminds me of how you can feed chickens diatomecous earth and that's supposed to be a natural wormer too. I haven't tried it yet because my chickens are quite young.

best dewormer in the world is a cup full of apple seeds-- course you'll kill the animal from the arsenic found within... but atleast it's an organic dewormer.