Asking for ideas on how to "manage" coyotes

[frustratedearthmother]

Well, I don't know about the you @Padre23 - but if I have a choice between having my dogs protect my chickens or my goats - goats win hands down!

 

[Padre23]

Well, I don't know about the you @Padre23 - but if I have a choice between having my dogs protect my chickens or my goats - goats win hands down!

All right. I guess I don't understand the situation you're dealing with.

It sounded like you, or whoever was having this problem, was dealing with 1, maybe 2, coyotes going after chickens. If that's the case, 3 LGD's with the goats, and 1 with the Chickens (assuming there are 4 LGD's total) would seem like a reasonable solution.

 

[frustratedearthmother]

It wasn't me that had the problem - what I stated was hypothetical - but exactly what I would do under the same circumstances. Coyotes are notorious for baiting dogs. One LGD would likely triumph over one coyote - but if there are several more waiting then the LGD would probably end up on the wrong end of the fight. LGD's do their best work when there are several of them.

Most of the people on this forum know their situation and what works best for them.

 

[samssimonsays]

I agree with FEM. LGD's do better in teams and the goat herd is substantial at a dairy so they come first.

 

[Padre23]

It wasn't me that had the problem - what I stated was hypothetical - but exactly what I would do under the same circumstances. Coyotes are notorious for baiting dogs. One LGD would likely triumph over one coyote - but if there are several more waiting then the LGD would probably end up on the wrong end of the fight. LGD's do their best work when there are several of them.

Most of the people on this forum know their situation and what works best for them.

All right. Then the OP should put 2 LGD's with the goats and 2 with the chickens. My initial point was that with 4 LGD's (at least that was listed in the OP's signature), the OP has some options and flexibility in dealing with the coyotes.

And yeah, coyotes can gang up on dogs, but that's more of a worst case scenario. Most of the time they're on the prowl as singles or in pairs. I've know of a sheep farmer in my area who runs 1 single LGD (an Akbash I believe) with a herd of 100-200 sheep with no problems. And we live in a coyote-heavy area.

 

[frustratedearthmother]

As I recall the ages of the GP's aren't listed. Most of us who have been here and have had conversations with the OP know that she has two very young dogs. Neither she nor anyone else who knows anything is not about to send a pup to it's death against a coyote.

Have you ever owned an LGD - or a goat? Where is your level of "expertise" coming from?

 

[samssimonsays]

So, do you have personal experience with LGD's, how they work with and bond as a team and livestock?

 

[Padre23]

As I recall the ages of the GP's aren't listed. Most of us who have been here and have had conversations with the OP know that she has two very young dogs. Neither she nor anyone else who knows anything is not about to send a pup to it's death against a coyote.

Have you ever owned an LGD - or a goat? Where is your level of "expertise" coming from?

Spent a little time on some sheep farms.

I don't know anything about the OP's farm or her dogs. That's why I asked my original question.

The farms in my area, some of which run good-sized flocks, run 1, maybe 2, dogs and that seems to work with few if any issues. The coyotes in this area also get a lot of pressure from local hunters, so the instinct to stay away from human civilization is fairly strong. Not proclaiming that is "expertise" by any stretch. But I've spent enough time in coyote country to know a bit about their tendencies.

 

[samssimonsays]

I don't know anything about the OP's farm or her dogs. That's why I asked my original question.

I believe it was HOW the question was asked, not why it was.

You have 4 LGD's but a coyote is still giving you problems?

Doesn't exactly come off as a "question" but more of a poke to stir up the embers of a post that was from November.

 

[Goat Whisperer]

You have 4 LGD's but a coyote is still giving you problems?

Then it would seem appropriate to leave at least 1 of those LGD's with the chickens. And yes, I'm quite familiar with how gutsy coyotes can be...I've dealt with them quite a bit where I live.

All right. I guess I don't understand the situation you're dealing with.

It sounded like you, or whoever was having this problem, was dealing with 1, maybe 2, coyotes going after chickens. If that's the case, 3 LGD's with the goats, and 1 with the Chickens (assuming there are 4 LGD's total) would seem like a reasonable solution.

All right. Then the OP should put 2 LGD's with the goats and 2 with the chickens. My initial point was that with 4 LGD's (at least that was listed in the OP's signature), the OP has some options and flexibility in dealing with the coyotes.

And yeah, coyotes can gang up on dogs, but that's more of a worst case scenario. Most of the time they're on the prowl as singles or in pairs. I've know of a sheep farmer in my area who runs 1 single LGD (an Akbash I believe) with a herd of 100-200 sheep with no problems. And we live in a coyote-heavy area.

Spent a little time on some sheep farms.

I don't know anything about the OP's farm or her dogs. That's why I asked my original question.

The farms in my area, some of which run good-sized flocks, run 1, maybe 2, dogs and that seems to work with few if any issues. The coyotes in this area also get a lot of pressure from local hunters, so the instinct to stay away from human civilization is fairly strong. Not proclaiming that is "expertise" by any stretch. But I've spent enough time in coyote country to know a bit about their tendencies.

I will start off with what works for one farm may not work for another.
If the coyotes are as bad as you say they are (where your friend is located) you (they) either have a seriously overworked dog or you are exaggerating about the coyote population. I'm thinking it's the later

Several members on here have had their LGdogs chewed up by coyotes. It does happen.

If it were as easy as putting "1 with the Chickens" don't you think the owner would have done so? If it were that simple it would have already been done.
Some dogs do not work well alone and need another canine companion. Others do well alone, but still need to be with actual livestock that have some bonding ability, not just a pen of chickens. A young dog might not cope very well when she is still a learning puppy. You need to look at the individual dog.
If you have ever seen the beauty of these dog working, if you have the right dogs paired together, that they work in harmony and work well together. I've seen it myself and it is a sight to behold. Taking a vital member of the "team" has consequences.

The amount of land is another thing. You do not know the amount of land these dogs are on.
If the chickens are in a small lot you will not have a happy dog, simply not enough for the dog.

We have dogs in every field. We still have coyotes get pretty close, but at least they aren't getting into the goat fields. In our part of the country, anyone who doesn't have LGD's lose animals. Our neighbor had 2 small dogs snatched (different occasions) off their porch by coyotes, the Rottweiler wasn't even enough to keep the coyotes off their porch...

This was found in between some of our goat fields, that all have LGD's. This area is/was walked daily. The coyotes got this deer and and ate it, the next day vultures came and got the little that was left over.

Friends of our a few miles away had coyotes up by their house, on their drive way, and close to their goats/chickens. They didn't have any loss as they have 4 LGDs in the area, however the owner had to go out several times in one night to go scare the coyotes off.

That is what I call a heavy coyote area.